Use code PILOT50 to get 50% OFF your first Factor box plus 20% off your next month of orders at bit.ly/47Mi8Vv This was a very disturbing story but it offered a lot of very important lessons. Here's another deadly crash in Hawaii 👉ua-cam.com/video/aVJCH9v-X50/v-deo.html
I live in South Africa, near where I live there is sky diving activity. About two years ago the same thing happened with a King Air, loaded with Jumpers and just before they left the aircraft the pilot accidentally stalled it and entered entered a spin! The Jumpers vacated the aircraft and the pilot managed a recovery and landed. I think with only a damaged ego! I don’t know but the C of G could easily have been out of limits.
Agreed. It's not a mistake or neglected detail. It's intentional malice and it only serves as a chance for them to make sure they don't get cought next time
@@bobbysenterprises3220 I agree that falsifying documents is usually intentional... but I don't agree with saying that people do so, with malicious intent.
Bobby needs to be in jail for life, not just a revoked license. The owner should be in there with him. He was probably employing Bobby and paying him under the table because he knew Bobby couldn't legally do the maintenance, which meant he could pay less to have Bobby do the work. There is no way to avoid using the word "shocking" repeatedly in this video! The only word that was missing but should have been frequently mentioned was the word "criminal"!
I am a retired CFIA&I 68 years on Earth. I know enough about the kinds of people with an agenda and no ethics. The securities sales game is not the career for building sound ethical habits in the short term. It also isn't a job where wrong doing will end in death by your own hands on activity. This fellow busting 3 check rides in a row indicates a bad instructor.
One of the passengers on this plane was a friend of mine. As an aircraft mechanic I’ve wondered what happened. You’ve made sense of it all.. I appreciate your knowledge and explanation of all these accidents. Your videos have taught me to take my job much more seriously.
My skydiving instructor, Daniel, was on this flight. Every time I watch one of your videos, he comes to my mind and i wonder when you'd do a video over this. I still get that sinking feeling in my stomache and I shed tears for him, his new wife of just a few months, his daughter, and the rest of his family when I look at my pictures and videos from when I jumped with him. He was truly a remarkable individual, and he was filled with excitement whenever someone expressed an interest in going beyond tandem skydiving. Daniel is deeply missed at his home drop zone, Airtight in Skiatook, Oklahoma. Daniel and Casey we're the 2 that got on at the last minute. This was actually then last flight of day which was why they got on at the last minute.
I will never understand people who voluntarily jump out of a plane while in flight. And they even pay for the privilege…Thrill? Excitment? I get excited when I do crossword puzzel.
I got a 100 on my Private Pilot written exam. I almost failed my check ride because my check pilot told me to execute a power off stall and recovery and I executed a power on stall recovery that developed into an incipient spin. The check pilot grabbed the controls because he was startled, and didn’t think I had control of the plane. He was expecting an uneventful power off stall, and instead got a nose high full break. Neither of us were completely clear if he had asked for a power on, or power off… so he gave me the benefit of the doubt and passed me. A few months later, I was asked by the tower, while on a southerly heading to make a left turn to 270. This was to provide spacing for a commuter airline entering the airspace ahead of me, instead, I turned right to a heading of 270 and came face to face with a Saab about a mile away at the same altitude converging rapidly. A few more times, I bumbled similar requests from the tower. Apparently I have a hard time with transposition of numbers and directions… I don’t fly anymore… for the safety of others.
I so sympathize with you. My confusion with numbers and letters is one reason I'm having 2nd thoughts about going for my private pilot's license. I can't hear fast enough to get all those tower-aircraft comms. People laugh when I say "turn left" and point the other way. And just letters and numbers. I might get the right numbers or letters down when I'm taking notes or transcriping things, but they will be in no particular order. To me, they make sense, but to others, they haven't a clue. It's real. If it weren't for spell check, I'm not sure anything I write would make sense to others.
As a single engine private pilot, I never deviate from normal protocols, including pre-flight, proper weight, weather conditions, and hot dogging it (showing off). So many things CAN go awry. I never want to be a contributing factor to a disaster. I was taught that disaster occurs most often when SEVERAL factors are simultaneously askew.
I took 12 lessons in my 20s. Whilst I was fine for theory, I soon realised that I was NOT a natural pilot, so I gave up. There is no guarantee that we all can be experts at everything we attempt.
Me too. I knew I wasn't the cool headed disciplined stuff that makes pilots. I still love aviation and fly competition F3A in RC. I'm pretty good, too.
I'm also a 73 yr old pilot that started jumping in Oklahoma. Here's what everyone needs to understand: this pilot was a poster child for Dunning-Kruger Syndrome. If you don't know what that is, LOOK IT UP. He was overconfident, thought he knew enough to operate in the manner he did, and he DIDN'T. This is happening at an increasing rate because no one pays their dues anymore. No one crashes model airplanes to see what an aft CG really causes; no one understands hidden structural damage; no one cultivates that voice in their ear that says "hey...this is how people bust their asses." NO ONE READS AND PONDERS ACCIDENT REPORTS RELIGIOUSLY. I'n done. This why I quit jumping.
I totally agree. I was a pilot and made 350 jumps. I quit bc I hit the ground w/o a parachute 🪂 and took it as a sign from God, ha! I can’t believe they didn’t crash sooner, but so sad. Many yrs ago there was a skydiving accident that killed many over Lake Ontario. They were doing a water jump, in overcast conditions and there tower identified a different aircraft, that was closer, as the jump plane. It’s just heartbreaking. ✌️
@@Lunalas4123 I just Googled the incident and the sixteen jumpers that drowned jumping through cloud was over Lake Erie. They were flying out of Huron, Ohio. There might be an incident over Lake Ont. that I am not aware of but the Lake Erie one has been in the news a lot. ( I was born in Niagara Falls, Ont. so I know where the lakes are btw)- not being snarky . Cheers
As a CFI, it's absolutely unbelievable to me that the DPE(s) who signed the pilot off never questioned the fact that a pre-solo student pilot logged 40+ hours of multi PIC time in a King Air. Any of our local examiners would have laughed him out of the room and probably reported him to the FSDO. They were either in on whatever racket the flight school owner was running or did not even check his logbook.
My sentiments. Every DPE I’ve known would’ve probably reported me, all my instructors, and had a full ass investigation initiated into my logbook and actual flight records.
Before I took my private pilot check ride, the examiner spent at least 15 minutes reading my log book. I am sure that if it did not show every required activity and endorsement, the exam would have ended right there.
@@erintyres3609 100%. that was my experience for every checkride, as is the case for MOST pilot’s I’d like to think. Any DPE worth the rate they charge will pore over the logbook and verify/ask questions about any discrepancies before anything else happens.
I’m an A&P and can’t believe there was zero 337 ,s for the major alteration. That an the fotos of the spinner and wrinkles were terrifying. They got these people killed.
I don't understand why so many pilots do not know basic spin recovery. My instructors in the 90s wouldn't solo me until I understood spin recovery. The aft CG loading in this case would make it harder to push the nose down, But he did not follow procedure.
Daniel was my roommate and friend when I worked for the same skydive company as he did, before he moved to Oahu. He was so nice and loved what he did. He took me my on my first tandem dive and was a great instructor. He also used to tell me he was scared he was going to die in a plane crash. Then he did about a year later. RIP friend.
@@ronjones-6977 I usually don't feel sorry for the dead, as I believe they're in a much better place. I feel sorry for the kids & families they left behind. They're the real victims.
That’s the wildest debrief I’ve ever seen. Rules and regulations - many of them written in blood - intentionally ignored and broken left and right, leading to more bloodshed. I’m speechless.
That’s what I learned in my junior college based ground school… almost Every rule in aviation is written in blood. And in many other areas too like medicine and construction. Yet business owners treat the rules so often as mere annoyances.
@@SpectrumRob A bold claim. Have you checked the accident report, because if that was the case then it would be detailed in there in the autopsy report.
Hey Hoover - this isn’t really a comment on this video in particular, just general appreciation for your hard work on this channel. I’m a commercial Helicopter pilot on the Pacific coast, and so many of the factors you bring up in all your videos ring true in some aspect of my aviation experience. You make everything more personal and accessible than NTSB reports, and it’s greatly appreciated by your viewers- whether they’re in the industry or not. Keep doing what you’re doing; you’re making the air a safer place.
The day before I got married in April of 2019, I was on that plane with my in-laws who wanted to jump. I met Jerone and told him that I had just got my Multi and wanted to go on that flight. I remember him telling me after dropping the pax that the owner doesn't like him doing more than 3k fpm descent but he was about 5k and then on short final he was still 2k feet ended up using all the runway. Thank you for doing this story and hope people within aviation grasp how important doing the right thing is when it comes to safety.
I will never, ever understand why people do thrill-seeking activities in the week right before wedding day (and sometimes while the wife is pregnant, too). I've seen too many headlines of people killed in accidents (skydiving included) during the week before what should be the happiest day of their life. It's just so, so, so tragic. If I had a dependant or two then thrillseeking would be the last thing on my mind. I know you're not going to like me saying this, but in my opinion it's just downright selfish behavior. Put the adrenaline-seeking behind you and be the father/husband/wife/mother you need to be.
@@Elk300so your take from all this is to put your faith in make believe stories about fatherless pregnancies and blind devotion to a religious text riddled with inconsistencies and atrocities towards mankind rather than consider how your proclivity for dangerous activities might effect other people that depend on you so you can make intelligent decisions to best protect yourself and them? Holy sh!t you bible thumpers will use your religion to rationalize anything even abandoning your kids so you can jump out of a plane to get your yayas 😬.
@@daminoxeither to share high emotions together, or because once married you can't have fun anymore mindset. I used to do extreme hikes all weekends and almost never did anymore once I got my kids. Priority changes.
As a skydiver this has reopened a fragile wound that hasn't fully healed. I knew one of the 10 jumpers on that plane. Just like I know the owner/operator of Byron. I know many pilots that fly jumpers and are also working elsewhere commercially. Sincerely, Thank You for producing this video. I have tears running down my face as I type. I will be sharing this with all of my local drop zones, and requesting they disseminate the video far and wide. I also know multiple people that were at the aforementioned skydiving accident. April 16, 1992... 16 of the 22 souls didn't survive. Those that did, were both physically and emotionally damaged... This emotionally shattered one of the people running the drop zone. He carried his grief for nearly 30 years before he took his own life. His sisters are some of my closest skydiving family. Many aviators see skydiving as a bastard child of the community. I can honestly say, safety briefings at my dz are done with totalitarian authority. When something happens, we use it as a learning tool and a way of positively moving forward. It fosters incredible closeness, logical preparation, structured discipline, clearly communicated expectations, and above all we look out for each other on every single jump... Again, thank you for this video.
3 years before this happened, I did a tandem jump with Daniel Herndon at Skiatook airport in Oklahoma. He was a great guy, made me feel at ease and did an awesome job of handling my jump. I was heartbroken to learn he was among the group who died that day. Terrible loss for all of the families involved.
@@kenfern3365 my dad worked at Skiatook airport on Sundays back in the early 80s to pay for lessons. My first flight ever was out of Skiatook. My condolences to you.
A broken King Air C90, operated by a low time pilot with questionable training and maintained poorly by a mechanic who kept no records... what could go wrong. 😢
@@pipelineaudio If they paid what it should cost for trained, licensed, and experienced pilots and mechanics as well as the rest of the skydivers and jump masters based on cost of living in Hawaii that would require the to quadruple the cost per jump for tandem skydivers (where all the money is). Then they wouldn't get enough customers to cover those expenses. How do you expect the owners of these operations to make a living? Get a job? I mean maybe, but not from Oct-Apr when the surf is good on the NS. He made a point to say that the employees of this fly by night jumping operation were all hired as independent contractors as a way to cut costs. That is true, but he failed to mention that the other two (more well established) skydive businesses at at that little airfield also do all their staff hiring this way. They really are being exploited because the owners expect them to be at the DZ all day even when the weather does not permit jumping. if it's really bad they may call it and people go home, but if there is a possibility of a small window of clear skies they need everyone there so they can hurry up and get as many loads in the sky as possible during the break in the weather (as you know the weather here changes on a on a minute by minute basis. The forecast the day before is so useless that Guy Hagi just makes that shit up on the fly each evening) and must sit around, sometimes all day, waiting for something that may never happen. And while that's happening they aren't getting paid because they get paid by the jump. Not only that, a large portion of their income comes from tips. And they expect customers to tip everyone that was responsible for your jump (not only your tandem master, but the pilot, mechanic parachute packers, etc. Even if most of them live a 5 minute drive down the rd they aren't allowed to spend the time not being paid and at home and on call. There's other examples of how they are getting the worst of the deal. But when times are good and they get a long stretch of blue skys for weeks and lots of tourists shuttled up from town they can bang through the loads and be making bank. With those employment practices and no regulations it's easy to find some other skydiver at any DZ around the word that would be on a plane next thing to fill a spot for 6 months or longer working in Hawai even it it meant shitty pay. It's like getting to go on a paid vacation
Unfortunately if the government had shut them down *before* anyone was killed there would be a lot of people complaining about unnecessary government interference etc, they're just trying to make a living, etc etc.
As a pilot all I can say in addition to there's never one Factor it's always a handful of BS moves on a plane being used for commercial service while training training for my initial private I also worked as an apprentice A&P under an IA at a commercial School the behavior and practices in the shop causing constant physical damage was more than I could take many times I would say if I was your boss you would be fired right now and every one of you should be required to be a pilot add fly these planes after you are done possibly you wouldn't be so abusive to cowling and other craft components one day while watching an overly aggressive mechanic yanking and yanking at a cowl I hustled over and said let me give hand you looked at me like I was an alien ripped it off and threw it across the shop again I said if I was your boss you would be fired right now on the spot furthermore how would you like that cowl to come up and hit you in the face if you had to fly this out of here when you were done working on it many times during work on private customer planes numerous times I would hear nobody's going to want to pay for that problem is in these sectors these mechanics get paid crap and they get treated that way as well so with those two things working against you there is your maintenance problem finally on a private plane annual for a broker selling a particular plane I noted remarkable corrosion above a spar that would require disassembly and inspection of a wing again told he's not going to want to pay for that as usual we would always take an annual inspection for the typical $50 hamburger as the Ia believed in it on return the pilot who performed paintwork was ticked off bye correction from Tower due to an incorrect approach communication can you put us all into one of Jerome's Banks over all of our hangers and yanked on it hard enough enough that the IA punched his shoulder and yelled that's enough so loud I can hear it over the engine later that same plane came back with a paint request from a prospective buyer the painter started running down the top of the Spar line removing some corrosion around the rivets and they started popping off like buttons he called me over to the airport to look at it and I just looked at him and said I will never get into a plane with you again I walked away unfortunately the Ia passed soon after replacing all those rivets the angry pilot dreaming of a commercial wandered away after much angry trouble with his neighbors and arrests fortunately I am still around and if he ever tries to use me as a reference or if I am interviewed I will inform the FAA of his Reckless disregard for safety we could have all bought it on that $50 hamburger run unfortunately unknowing passengers never know the full background of their pic my written was better than all of my cfis I picked the nation's hardest checkride examiner that never passed anyone and he had to pass me the first time none of those cfis would sign me for my check ride the owner of the school had to with career dreams they didn't want my failure on their record I don't fly much anymore loved it and actually grooved Landings more than anything else as I found them to be a test every time when I fly commercial I certainly can't grade the crew but if it's an exceptional Landing I slide my hands across each other and say sweet thank you which is usually met with a big smile from each of them a few of my instructors are captains and first officers now working regularly someday I hope to see them while I disembark because I am going to remind them who got the better written
I am an Aussie bush pilot (retired now) and early in my commercial career path I flew para drops. The aircraft were all a little battered from the use case for them but mechanically they were all in superb condition. It was NEVER an issue to stop flying if something looked amiss and everyone in the organisations that I flew for were "safety first". With piston a/c the main issue was shock cooling in the descent which throttled the operations a little, but no one ever said anything about speeding things up to me. Most of the pilots (at least in Queensland Aus in the 1980s) were young guys building hours like me. We all treated it professionally as a commercial operation, so it pains me to see this video. The accident was almost inevitable. Thank you for caring enough to make this content .
The first time I went sky diving… I was the last group to go up.. the company then told my group that the plane is having issues and we can’t go. We were all disappointed but I think back at what as blessing that was after learning that more ppl die in the plane up or going down via a skydiving trip vs ACTUALLY skydiving .. ended up skydiving 4 years later in Sedona
Scary as hell. I'm a pilot and I also skydive. I have worried, at times, about whether my chute would open, lol, but never about who is flying the aircraft, or the maintenance of the aircraft. Going forward, I will look into this, before I leave the ground. My heart hurts for the lives lost. So many links in this accident chain broken. Unforgivable.
If this debrief was an actual block of Swiss cheese, there's no way that it would be able to hold itself together. This is truly one of the most horrific and emotionally frustrating cases that I have ever heard...just unreal. Thank you for all of your hard work in bringing this heartbreaking debrief, you certainly couldn't have had any pleasure or enjoyment in doing so.
I've packed parachutes for OPC. I've known George for a long time and even shared over a hundred skydives with him. I never met Jerome though because he started flying for OPC about a year and half after I started working elsewhere. To this day, I will stop by the memorial site often when in the area to give respect to the lives lost. Thanks for the informative video
You don't know or you would not say this but the narrator in this video makes incessant, hyperbole-filled assessments supported only inference and speculation, all perfectly designed to give a dull person a perception of validity to what is being said, but entirely meaningless, useless, manipulative, and arrogant...I would elaborate but you will never care, having gone down this road to receive your bit of YT income. Stated opinions about rationales and reasons are completely invalid and there are no demonstrated qualifications to imagine the cause and effects of anything stated about mechanical issues, business decisions, or pilot qualifications.
As a 77 year old former skydiver and glider pilot I'm amazed that this back to back screw up could have been allowed to happen. May those who lost their lives RIP. Very sad.
Thanks for your presentation. I’m an FAA ATP/CFI who has about 400 skydives at Dillingham. I use to jump with George, and flew Part 121 with Rick. (I immigrated to New Zealand several years ago and had limited knowledge of this accident, and no knowledge of Rick’s passing.) During my time at Dillingham I had constant trouble “fitting in” over my inability to remain quiet when I saw safety issues in the operators or up-jumpers there. Eventually I just quit skydiving for fun and pleasure, because well, it wasn’t fun and pleasurable at Dillingham anymore. I am so sorry for the families of the accident victims. Again, thank you for your presentation on this accident.
Thanks for adding something significant to the conversation. I think the investigators would have liked to talk to you before finalizing their report. Such a preventable tragic event. Aloha 🤙🏽🤙🏽
well if you would have stayed remaining silent you could certainly be one of the victims. but you should have reported those issues, maybe you would have saved many lives. But it’s not your responsibility.
@@doom9603 skydivers are basically customers. Up-jumpers aren’t employees. They come each with their own equipment, training backgrounds, standards and habits - which can vary widely. Skydiving operators usually operate on a minimum budget and it is up to each individual jumper to insure they, and their equipment, are current and prepared for each jump. It can be difficult to establish and maintain a culture of good habits because of all these variables…Just saying… (I got lucky and started at a drop zone in Arizona that really emphasized training, and setting goals and standards while having a good time.) Anyhow, all the factors leading to this accident were wholly within the control of the operator, and not the up-jumpers.
@@vancetilley7942 I agree to all you said and I am glad you were not one of the unlucky victims. But especially for the varying backgrounds and that environment’s complexity that applies to aviation even more than most other industries, it's the job of the company to ensure safety above all. The grave violations of aviation security principles and industry standards is wild. You are absolutely right that neither the jumpers, nor the pilot (operator? or do you mean the business?) had full control of these circumstances led to the lined up holes in the Swiss cheese model
saving money, cutting corners, ego/show-off-ness = tragedy. So sad as it was so preventable. Thanks for all of your many hours of research that went into this episode.
agree, hoover is thoughtful, insightful, not dramatic, factual, and to the point, (no silly dramatic music) that's why his videos are so good, hope he continues to thrive
Daniel Herndon was a friend of mine who I did tandems with whenever he took a break from his instructor gig at Oahu. This video is much appreciated. I always thought it was a VMC rollover that caused this crash….which has happened before on King Airs. So hearing about the real reasons is infuriating. On another note, the King Air 90 is not an ideal jump platform. The CG parameters are not conducive to skydiving where it’s common for jumpers to crowd near the rear of the aircraft during jump runs. There have been MANY instances of King Airs stalling on jump run. Also, the door is too small and the horizontal stabilizer is too low. There have been several “tail strikes” over the years by exiting skydivers. Drop zone owners buy old King Airs 90s because they’re a cheap way to get into a turbine platform, however, DZ owners are notoriously cheap when it comes to aircraft maintenance and these K90s are expensive to maintain. As a result, most of us old skydivers are terrified of King Airs 90s and try to avoid them. Anyway, thanks again for the video and I plan to pass it along to everyone who knew Daniel.
Very sad story. Jerome‘s hotdogging antics remind me of the old saying in aviation that goes “there are old pilots and there are bold pilots but there are no old bold pilots!”
@yvetteandjorgenlarsen9753 the only crazy thing about check lists is the one i see was a plane that landed and was on fire. The pilots couldn't leave till they did the shutdown check list. I feel like in that situation they should be able to just do a fuel cut and get out.
@@jamesclark4 That’s where experience comes in my friend. I would much rather have an older pilot with a few wrinkles on his face and a couple of gray hairs than some young kid fresh out of flight school. There is no substitute for it and sadly people learned that the hard way.
I live on the North Shore of Oahu, and for over 20 years, I worked as an Air Traffic Controller. I have firsthand knowledge that the skydiving company had a history of being cited and fined regularly for reckless behaviour. (I've been on-site and inspected their operation for the Army) Some of the skydivers lived on-site, and there were times when they would be drunk or high before taking people up. The airfield is owned by the Department of the Army and leased to the state, which in turn rents it to the skydiving company. The state is responsible for regulating them and has issued multiple citations over the years. Even the Army has fined the state for failing to enforce regulations against the company. Despite this, the state has continued to neglect enforcing its own rules. The entire situation was avoidable. The skydiving instructors were reckless, arrogant, and fully aware of the risks. I’ve jumped with them, and they would joke about the safety of the aircraft, which was concerning even then. Those instructors chose to jump, but the married couple had no idea they were putting their lives in danger. Tragically, this could have been prevented. Despite everything, the skydiving company remains in business, likely still violating regulations at every turn.
Great videos, Hoover! As a retired airline captain (UAL, 19,500 hours) I appreciate your direct, “right to the point” debriefings and your constant emphasis on avoiding “carelessness, incapacity, and neglect.”
Every time I fly, usually American, I hope that the pilots are at the doorway as we disembark so I can thank them for getting us there safely. We appreciate you!
As a former Air Force aircraft maintainer , the lack of documentation and absence of an inspection process is astounding. We had 5-skill level techs doing the work, 7 level inspectors, then a 9 level final inspection and review of maintenance forms before signing off for flight. They couldn't afford to do the basics, very sad.
They should have never gotten away with this .Any 43151 skill level crew chief in the air force would have grounded that airplane just off the visual of the wing buckling ,and the panels being all out of wack .l cant believe an A&P signed off on this airplane..
Same here (but in a different country). We’d have the technician(s) doing the repair work, overseen by a supervisor, then independently inspected, then the head engineer certifying the aircraft as serviceable. Then another mechanic performing a before flight servicing (inspection). That’s at at least 5 different people in the Swiss cheese model. With absolutely everything documented and signed for.. every removal, every install, every part serial number documented, every function test (with independent inspection) and even the tool control is strictly documented. As soon as the aircraft in this video crashed, we would have quarantined the paperwork and nobody’s going home. To our standard of engineering, fitting the wrong elevator and ignoring the wing damage would be unthinkable unless it was signed off by someone very very high ranking and above my paygrade.
Wow-bad mechanic, damaged wing, fraud, shaky daredevil pilot, over loaded plane, unbelted passengers-these accidents were inevitable! This is one of the more reckless examples I've heard.
@@jamesogden7756 I am making light of the pilots daredevil reputation. He did ultimately do a steep bank angle turn. One should never give their passengers a thrill ride.
Yep. If Jerome didn't crash the plane on that takeoff then by that time the week following he'd have been trying to do barrel rolls on takeoffs before he even crossed the opposite threshold of the runway. It was only a matter of time before he crashed.
What I often gather from debriefs is how frequently I hear phrases like 'he initially failed to be certified but succeeded on a second attempt two days later' or 'his license was temporarily revoked and reinstated after a follow-up inspection.' This pattern leads me to believe that trainees and other professionals in the aviation industry are, in many cases, not allowed to fail out completely. I’ve noticed a similar trend in my own field, where difficult decisions about excluding individuals who are incompetent or potentially dangerous are often avoided.
Very true. As a medical professional, I see these situations occur more frequently than one might think. In my younger years, I was very involved with navy nuclear power. The culture there is that if you do not demonstrate consistent and sustained superior performance, you are shown the door. The US Navy has never had a nuclear accident.
This is so far from the truth its unreal. You cannot just sweepingly disqualify people from their job the second they fail one thing if they come back and prove they can do it. People have bad days, people make simple mistakes on tests or in artificial conditions. If they weren’t deemed safe on that second test they wouldn’t pass. All that repeatedly talking like this does is place a massive amount of pressure and stress on pilots before a test and leads to far more fails, thus causing a vicious cyle.
@smokingspitfire1197 you absolutely misunderstood what's being said. None is saying that you should have only one shot to pass a test, and you are gone forever if you fail. Everyone deserves a second chance. But why allow people to retake the same exam 2 days later? You had absolutely no time to learn anything new, or train again. And "surprisingly" these incompetent pilots systematically pass on their second try, leading me to think the expert showed some kind of indulgence. In my country, if you fail a driving test, you have to retrain at least some amount of hours. Who should it be different for pilots?
@@Donald-ky2fg Having to resit a test isn’t a lower standard, you still have to be at the same standard to pass, you just don’t get the boot the second you make a mistake.
I never thought I’d get into flying videos, but you, man, totally changed that for me. You’ve got an awesome way of telling stories that just pulls me in. Your insight and judgment are next level-I’ve learned so much from you, and it’s stuff I can actually use in my own life. The way you break things down is super relatable and inspiring. Seriously, keep doing what you’re doing-it’s such a joy to watch and learn from you!
One summer season back in the 90's, I flew the same vintage King Air A90's (N105K, N98B) out of drop zones in NCAL, in particular Byron and Hollister. I soon learned to dislike skydivers and DZ operators as they were always pushing the limits of safe flight ops. I felt I was risking my life and future aviator career for their jump addiction. For example, solo jumpers would sneak on the flight after we were loaded up and duck under the last row to avoid me counting them, thus throwing off my CG. Or, the Solo would sit up against the rear baggage compartment bulkhead just after takeoff. They were always trying to get me to slow way down on jump run or jumping over solid overcast. I could go on and on but, I'm so lucky to have survived that memorable jump season.
Wow! I have a little over 2500 jumps and have never heard of or ever seen any jumpers sneak onto a jump plane. That is crazy! I can't imagine why the DZ ownership would allow that. That's a good reason to quit that job.
That’s absolutely nuts. Was it SOP to brief jumpers before they boarded? If so, after experiencing that type of shit, I would’ve stressed the point of what happens when the CG shifts out of the acceptable fore and aft ranges and for them to tell me if anything like that happened. “Assuming you all want to go home alive today…say this if you see this”
@@14Mustacheman88 A jumper brief generally happens in the training to get an A license. Rule is that all jumpers are to be secured by a seatbelt till 1,000 feet. All the planes I have ever jumped had only enough seat belts for the capacity of the plane. Most of the time the planes are full and there isn't enough room to move around to change the CG.
@@robertvillalobos7083 I mean that makes sense. I’m more asking if it’s a common practice for pilots taking jumpers up to brief them prior to boarding since jumpers sneaking on or whatever seems to be an issue in some places?
Maybe, but not necessarily. There are some honest investment bankers. You never hear about the honest guys unless they really hit it big or are really big crooks. There's more crooks than those that hit it really big so it seems that way. But many just are honest and do OK and you just never know anything about them.
Maybe they should have INTERPOL send someone after the guy who left the country. On a more serious note, the repeated violation of local regulations combined with their refusal to comply with authorities clearly indicates nefarious intent; this should be enough to have a warrant for their arrest issued.
@@JFJD Devils advocate here. On what charges? For being ,”Bad guys?” Fact is once an individual looses their certificate, there’s little else the FAA can do to them. In south Florida we had a character straight from Central Casting by the name of,”Lefty.” (ISYN) Convicted of forging airworthiness certificates among other things. He lost his pilot and mechanic’s licenses but kept on trucking, selling aircraft with false records and flying charters. FAA knew but couldn’t touch him. After several years his reputation preceded him to the point he couldn’t do any more business so he moved on.
Eh you laugh, but it’s classic get-there-itis. He was likely paid a lot, had the adrenaline flowing, made personal adjustments to his schedule and regular job, had a hotel and arrangements already made, etc etc. If he took off and got the wing within trim (even if it’s way more than he’s used to) it wouldn’t be enough for most pilots to cancel the flight and blow up all those previous arrangements I mentioned. I’m not saying it’s right, just that it’s easy to do and that guy probably had the least bad intentions of all the crazy people mentioned in this video. FWIW the flight went fine, so… I doubt the damage to the aircraft had much of anything to do with this crash honestly. The people the plane was perpetually flown around / with and maintained by absolutely did. In a normal commercial flight regime where a King Air pilot is basically graded by passengers for how GENTLE w flight is, this plane would have been flying for another couple decades.
I got a cessna 406 back from painting and they crossed the aileron cable so both ailerons where cracked a notch out of alignment. That planes has flown from north Eu to Namibia and back. It baffled me that the pilots and company accept that stupid rigging as normal. Also the gear didn’t lock up but hun on to on hydraulic pressure. But well I can make list of about 100 stupid problems missed by mechanics that could have been killing items.
When I explain how to operate something to my son and he says "Yeah I know, you told me before." I mention that even a 767 pilot with thousands of flying hours starts every flight with a checklist. Normalization of deviation, the cause of so much grief.
Pretty sad. Almost every aviation incident or accident is a chain of misstep events. This story exemplifies the importance of the aviation safety system. What you’re doing is great work by sharing the results of what happens when it’s not adhered to. Thank you for this quality debrief.
Another great debrief Hoover. I came up in general aviation in the 60's & 70's, flight instructor, 135 charter pilot, and went on to the corporate world. We all saw a lot of people that had no business being in aviation, pilots, maintainers, and owners. But I have to tell you, the people involved in the evolution of this tragedy were some of the worst. Starting with that instructor that let Jerome ride right seat in that King Air when he was pre-solo and log it as multiengine PIC, the people that "repaired" the King Air and falsified the documents after the first incident, and the FAA folks that let these things slip through the cracks. I also have to question the quality of instruction and certification that Jerome got along the way, that is a lot of failed checkrides. Last but not least are the owner of that jump school, Bobby the "maintainer" and the jump school pilot that "checked him out" in the King Air when Jerome was in a rear facing seat. What a mess, and the worst thing is that this all could have been avoided, those parachutists were essentially murdered by these people due to their negligence and criminality.
As a skydiver with 4,500 jumps over a 25 year period, the least suitable aircraft I jumped from were kingairs and queenairs. Both were business aircraft entirely unsuited to skydiving operations and were usually only used by drop zones because old ones could be acquired cheaply. They were too sensitive to CG shifts, the doors were too small, their stall speed was too high and they were too complicated to maintain. They are meant for nice ramps, hangars and fussy corporate owners. Anyone who has hung around a drop zone knows their airplanes lead a rough life. They need Jeeps, not Jags.
I am a Kingair mechanic. I work on C90's, 200's & 300's. The maintenance issues that got left unchecked is crazy to me. The wrinkling of the skin is specifically called out by Beechcraft on a recurrent wing spar inspection, with good clear example pictures of what to look for. The inspection takes 15 minutes max, so there is no reason you would ever not do it. This aircraft would have been through several of these specific inspections since the time of the first accident. Throughout my career I have seen some things and made my share of mistakes. They all pale in comparison to this level of incompetence/criminal behavior shown by the mechanics signing off on this aircraft when in reality, it should have been grounded and scrapped. (Repairing the wing would far exceed the cost of buying another used aircraft). All that said, the pilot side of this is just as screwed up. These are not aerobatic aircraft. The guy was performing these maneuvers on a 60 year old aircraft that was not meant for it. Even if the maintenance was spotless, you still wouldn't do this. This whole thing is just a garbage dump of errors, incompetence, and criminal behavior that is hard to fathom in 2024 aviation This isn't the wild west anymore...
"This isn't the wild west anymore..." It's worse. It's the age of Tik-Tok, Instagram, and "hold my beer, watch this" stupidity, lack of accountability, and laziness.
You think this crash story is bad. You should read about that Beech 18 crash in Hinckley I’ll full of jumpers, Yet another glorified ball of death and glory From known use of shady parts and uncertified mechanics using shitty parts, were unairworthy
As a ATP rated pilot, with over 45 years of flying fixed and rotor wing, I am indeed angered over this and many other accidents that offer no other excuse than criminal negligence. Whether it’s A/P mechanics that sign off on substandard repairs or lack there of, or pilots that perform these hideous stunts, the end result remains the same.. I for one caution my acquaintances on taking for granted that the charter airplane they are in is safe, that their pilot is safe. This advice has registered feedback where one or both proved true and avoided tragedy. The most recent was a friend avoiding a Lear 35 trip to Vegas where the airplane had obvious hydraulic leaks and the pilot claimed they were normal. Days later the jet suffered a gear up landing, the landing gear failed to extend due to a complete hydraulic failure. Thank you Hoover for your considerate review of these accidents. I only hope the situation grows better with awareness and correction.
2 companies that I would trust their aircraft if chartered are Harbour Air and Kenmore Air, both operating float-planes in the Pacific North West and both having major aircraft service / rebuild operations. Kenmore actually rebuilt Harrison Fords DHC2 Beaver for him. Both do have charter services as well as regular flights in the region.
Reminds me of the book Death in the ( Grand) Canyon . Many deaths involved sight seeing planes versus helicopters and not sticking to their assigned altitude ranges.
When I was nine years old, Metro Airlines crashed a twin otter in Galveston. The crash killed about ten people although I think there were one or two survivors. The wreckage was stored in my fathers hanger there on Scholes Field. I remember the first time I saw the charred wreckage. The metal gust-lock was still stuck through the control column. The yellow and red "REMOVE BEFORE FLIGHT" words on the big metal flag, which was part of the pin, were charred and blistered. The smell from wreckage was something I will never forget. Neither was the stupidity which caused the tragedy. Nine years old, I immediately knew what caused the crash.
I grew up in Galveston in the 80's. What year did the crash occur? Do you recall the B-25 that was parked on the ramp and left to rot? Or the guy who had the Texan painted up as a Zero?
@@hubriswonk Metro crashed at Scholes Field in 1974. The B25 that rotted away, was owned by Jim Hazlitt(?) The Zero was owned by Michael Burke. Mike's father Eddie was pilot or co-pilot the the B17 that was at my fathers hanger for a while. I got to fly right seat in that one when I was a kid. It was The Texas Raiders that crashed a couple years ago.
@greghavens7679 When I was a kid I played inside that B25 very often. I heard the guy just parked it and walked away?????? And I used to help Micheal Burke around his shop occasionally. My dad helped work on Texas Raiders while it was there. Did you happen to know a guy named Walt who was part of the CAF and Texas Raiders crew? He was rather round around the waist and was into photography. He introduced me to photography. And sadly an alcoholic.
@greghavens7679 On a side note.....do you know of or recall a Corsair that crashed in Houston after taking off from a small airport in west Houston in about 84? I was in my garage when it flew over my house at about 50 feet and crashed in a field. Me and a couple other guys pulled the pilot out before it burned.
I’m shocked that so many actors contributed to this tragedy. I’ve been in aviation for 44 years as a mechanic and pilot. The fact that a turboprop with stress damage to the wing was allowed to be flown... and for hire boggles the mind. Thank you for bringing this tragedy to the fore. They need to teach this statutory neglect at aviation schools so that successive generations learn about the consequences for blatant disregard of operational norms.
This one hits close to home for me... One of the Skydiving Instructors on this flight was a good friend of mine... Larry was a great Skydiving Instructor and an amazing friend.
Hoover, excellent job on this very sad incident. Thorough and concise. You are excellent at these videos. Thanks for helping us laymen "kind of" understand the jargon and situations on these.
I was a Jump Pilot 20 years ago, logged about 500 Loads. Done correctly, it is the absolutely best way any pilot can learn to really know of your aircraft, and have the skills to land your aircraft safely anywhere. As Hoover noted, you cannot short-circuit this training. UA-cam videos does not do it.
The pilot you want is not the one that spent his entire career making sure nobody spilled thier drink. If anything goes wrong you want somebody that can actually fly, like a bush pilot or a skydive pilot. Skydivers know its safish, hopefully that lawsuit goes nowhere if its just a money grab by families hoping for a payday. Skydivers always seat belt for takeoff, they played a role in it too.
Hoover, You are a role model for aviation. You are a master at debrief presentations which includes respecting the families and friends involved. Nice paraglide videos.......
Excellent presentation! When I was an active private pilot from 1975 to 1996, I learned a lot from other's mistakes and that's probably why I'm still here. The lack of oversight leading up to this crash is horrendous. I hope others will learn from this tragedy.
This is one of the scariest parts of skydiving - the reliance on the pilot and plane to get you up. You dive at a lot of small DZs and a lot of the pilots there are just there to get their hours for something else. You can get all the training, buy the best gear, pack your own chute but you're a helpless passenger. And having been one, after hearing Jerome was an investment banker, I knew where this was going.
Hoover, this was NOT a long Debrief, you hit all points and there are many points to highlight., THANK YOU, the Victims Family would want to know all the details. How anyone in this Industry can " get away " with the level of Incompetence is wild, may the Families have their day in Court and may the Perpetrators have many years to reflect on their Greed & Incompetence while sitting in a 5 x 10 jail cell. What your DETAILED REPORT tells anyone boarding a plane or diving is to CHECK the BACKGROUND of both Pilot and Plane. Near leading Lambs to Slaughter is what transpired. RIP everyone.
Wow, just wow. I'm a lowly Cessna TR182 owner/pilot but I'm stunned about this whole story. You're right, if we hadn't trusted that you poured through the NTSB report it would have been unbelievable. I'd like to think that most of us are anal regarding maintenance of our aircraft, but I know there are many aircraft owners who skimp on maintenance or kick the proverbial can down the road with issues they feel are minor. I never push the envelope, particularly with pax on board, but I know pilots who do. I have fun just flying normally and while maybe that's boring for some, it keeps us out of the trick bag. Thank you for this story and let's hope that by posting this it may be read by someone who observes reckless activity at some other flight school or jumper operation and has the motivation to report it.
IF you know of unsafe behaviours, perhaps you have to consider whether you should say something to someone. Be it a quiet diplomatic word directly with the person whose behaviour concerned you; or a word with their chief pilot or someone else more senior in their operation; down to making use of the FAA's anonymous whiteblower reporting system. Aviation is only safe if the professionals within it hold each other to account (and, to that end, are open to receiving honest criticism).
It truly seems bizarre that an owner/pilot would not be consistent with maintenance. I keep up the maintenance on a car and the worst that can happen is I might have to pull to the side of a road, skipping maintenance on the vehicle keeping you alive ??? Crazy
I lucked out, both finding this channel and with not too many ads. Your description of this incident was both compassionate and informative - the term normalization of deviance and the swiss cheese model have stuck in my head, and can apply to other things besides aviation. Thanks for that....
Thank you for the video. I have now written down 0.5 hours as PIC in a King Air. The worst kind of people - those who think rules are there just to inconvenience you and are there to be bypassed with trickery.
Hoover: I'm admittedly nowhere near being a pilot... nor am I ever going to be (late 60's and a mainframe computer career). I am troubled by what I seem to notice more of lately: flat falsifications/lies amongst "air people". I guess I never took off my "rose-colored glasses" to see any of it; but this is sincerely depressing..... all of it based upon lies and misrepresentations. Just another reminder of the day the former Boeing CEO stood at that podium and "in front of the world" blamed those 737 pilots when it has been long-ago proven that he KNEW BETTER. Just incredibly unfortunate...the whole 'picture'. I am so glad that you're back on YT; and *please* continue your efforts. If ANY "air person" listens, you are clearly "making a difference". Sincere respectful appreciation to you.
The Boeing 737 saga was typical of complex problems, a lot of people had a hand in creating the disaster. In the end, the pilots should have known what they were flying and should have known how to deal with a known feature of the 737.
@@karlbmiles Nope, I blame it on the corporate beancounter management at Boeing. The so-called takeover/merger of McDonnell Douglas was a disaster for Boeing.
@@karlbmiles So you are writing this and placing blame on the pilots because you are type-rated in the B-737, including the "Dash-8" series and, therefore, qualified to speak on the subject, correct? Yeah... that's what I thought. 🙄
As a long time skydiver and skydiving instructor I will say this. If you want to see some of the craziest, most suspicious histories of pilots, planes and owners, look at dropzones. The FAA regs are cheated and multiple logs kept, the USPA only cares about dropzone owners, and skydivers are safety-third. You will rarely see more unworthy aircraft, fewer qualified pilots, or more violations of safety standards than in skydiving.
I jumped out of that aircraft like most local jumpers, and was on the ground photographing it during the spin incident in California. Learning about the chain of events that led into this Hawaii fiasco is shocking.
@@shable1436 That Aircraft operated safely for years prior to the damage from that spin incident. The FAA will always list every contributing factor they discover but I suspect the incident pilot in Hawaii would have power stalled a perfectly good King Air into the ground. I've seen this a lot in aerosports. People pushing their limits thinking they're "building skill" util they exceed those limits, then the consequences are severe. Roger Ramjet wanted to impress the tourists with his mad skills instead of giving them the safest ride to altitude he could, which was his real job.
Hoover - I don't know if it happened too long ago for you to debrief it, but have you considered breaking down the crash that took the life of Samatha Smith back on August 25, 1985? She was the young girl who wrote to Soviet leader Yuri Andropov when she was 10, worried about nuclear war between the USSR and USA. She received a personal reply from him along with an invitation to come to the USSR, which she accepted. She was embraced and lauded as a courageous little girl in both countries, but sadly died (along with 7 others, including her father) when the Beechcraft 99 commuter plane she was in crashed in Auburn, ME.
The NTSB report attributes pilot error. Scheduled commuter flight into IMC, failed to intercept localiser but continued unstable approach with a 300ft ceiling. Callsign HENSON 1571 if anyone else curious.
Jerome’s rapid pilot career and fail/pas/fail/pass history could be out of the new MSFS2024 career mode … they even got sky diving. That is, minus the crash.
Hoov, I really enjoy your calm, factual straight to the point approach. Love watching all your videos. FYI, I’m an ex F4 WSO with the 335th Chiefs and would have enjoyed flying with you.
@@kobragangbit I probably shouldnt. I'm retired military and a disabled Vet (8 spine surgeries and no use of my left leg). I jumped 20+ times in the early 90s. She loves it now so I absolutely encourage her. Plus, I have a really great insurance policy on her.
Does she watch Hoover's videos? If she did, it might help her to ask questions and research a bit more. Since I started watching, I will never fly privately again.
I am not a pilot but was a skydiver. Back in the middle 90's there was a former Navy F18 Pilot who was a King Air 200 Skydiving Pilot. He would routinely dive the aircraft and race the skydivers to the ground. I paid for a Jump Ticket and Rode the plane down with him. I was zero G in the cabin. Being Young and Dumb, I didn't even think of the structural integrity of the aircraft, nor the maintenance records of the aircraft. Looking back on that event and hearing about this event caused me some angst. Thank you for the debrief.
@@ib1ray No, I stopped skydiving for a couple of reasons. 1. I started having ear issues from the RAPID change in altitude. 2 I gave my fiance a Tandem Skydive and a few weeks later her Tandem Instructor died in a Free Fall Accident. After that every time I left the house to go skydiving my then fiance, now wife thought I wasn't coming home.
Damn! That sucks..... Nobody wants to be that close to a death. Totally understandable though. I quit because I didn't want to rent gear and I'm waiting until I can afford my own to start going again lol I know how I treated that gear which was pretty decent but I'm sure other people didn't care as much as I did....
@ I bought a used rig as soon as I finished the AFF program. Then moved into new gear after 100 jumps. Stopped at 187 and sold everything to a buddy I was jumping with.
Hoover, another Hawaii story for you... I got my Private there in Hawaii and used to go to one of the flight schools there at Honolulu airport. While working my instrument, we pre-flighted the 150 and were taxiing to takeoff when one of the rudder cables broke. We got back to the tie down area all good but I never flew one of their airplanes again. The school ended up being shutdown for forging their 100 hour and most of their other maintenance records. Shaka doesn't work well with aircraft!
Thank you for doing what you do! This was a hard episode to watch but I'm very glad you've increased awareness on how so many mistakes cost so many lives. Thanks Hoover.
How the hell was the pilot of that first plane able to first of all get out of a spin - and then land a plane with a half-missing horizontal stabilizer?
That was my 1st thought as well. Also, there was an Israeli pilot who managed to fly and land his F-15 missing 90% of the right wing, so sometimes people just get lucky!
Another educational debrief, Hoover. Having been a car hauler a long, long time ago, I was responsible for checking out the vehicles before I loaded them on my truck so I was pretty good at spotting any deformities in the sheet metal. When there are wrinkles in the wing covering, I would think a mechanic would see that and think to him/herself that can't be right and investigate further. I know that sounds like Monday Morning Quaterbacking but you'd think they teach that in the A&P schools. Hearing your debrief is like following behind someone in my car and wondering what DMV official gave that person their license! I feel bad for everyone involved in this nightmare, but it all comes down to proper training, proper oversight and consequences for not following proper procedures.
Let's see, you're an aircraft mechanic who is not allowed to work on aircraft, being paid off the books to work on an aircraft, and you're going to tell your boss his plane is not airworthy.
Old CFI here. A little jaded by things I saw and encountered in the work, and I don't have a high opinion of many things I saw in GA including my own skills, in some situations, but even with that experience, I am flabbergasted by the sloppy and unsafe things going on in this story. Very depressing. (note: No longer flying, due to medical issues. But I still follow the things going in aviation closely and often miss it). Brilliant summary and presentation here. Side note, my impression of the skydiving "industry" is that a lot of corners are cut and rules fudged in this business and I never went near it. To be honest I think some people in that business are a bit crazy.
Having watched this channel general aviation is not a perfect system, but I suppose you've personally experienced failures yet still landed safely. It ultimately rests on the pilot. With jump pilots I think they have to be a little crazy flying with an open door and not knowing take off weight and not having people strapped in during takeoff. I'm no pilot but I wouldn't get on a plane with basically no left wing trim control...
One thing I learned from building flying toy fixed wing is that nose heavy makes for a sluggish airplane, and tail heavy makes you build another airplane.
As a military free fall jumper who jumped at over a dozen civilian skydive centers over my 20yr career, this is an example of what I always feared jumping there. It was mind blowing the safety standards that were required for military pilots, jumpers and aircraft to jump, yet we could go to a civilian airfield with far less safety standards and jump 5-10 times a day. As an instructor I would always access the pilots, aircraft forms and weather prior. But to be honest it was never even close (in most jumps) to the safety standards of the military.
Excellent analysis Hoover. Former jump pilot and current corporate pilot. I never left the ground without a thorough inspection of the airplane and never had an incident. When you add up all the information you presented in this accident, this is clearly criminal negligence on the owner's part as it was intentional. I agree that many others are at fault and bear some responsibility; such as other pilots who flew this airplane and didn't report it, instructors, examiners, and anyone else who touched or knew about this airplane. I have 48 hours in the industry and for the most part it is a good respected industry but there are the bad apples and this is the result. Totally avoidable and a major tragedy. Thank you for posting.
I fly out of KLVK which is 5 minutes from C83 (Byron) and I vividly remember the incident there. The local training airspace is just east of the jump area. A friend of mine and I had a chance to see the King Air not long after. My friend is an A&P and he was pointing out the wrinkles in the left wing saying there was substantial damage under the skin. Unbelievable someone would say it’s airworthy. Tragic. This debrief made the hair on the back of my neck stand up.
Another really great segment but heartfelt as you always have put together. It’s tough to get through these, but I’m really glad that you provide them.
Always appreciate your debriefs. I’m not a pilot, and am a nervous flyer, so these always hit me for the tragedies they are because they all seem preventable. I sincerely hope anyone watching these is a more astute renter of private places, or more cautious pilot. I’m in the medical field and anytime you have a near miss you are reminded to always always alway follow each safety measure and double triple check
Hoover like you say it's really hard to not to blow up watching this, so many faults involved, my thoughts and prayers are for the loved ones of all of the souls that were lost. Hoover you give this debrief a very professional presentation I know this must have been a hard one to get through, Thank you for all of your hard work!
@@pilot-debrief AS a cirrus pilot myself .. I cant imagine a pilot doing their walk around seeing all the defects that were obvious and then jumping in and flying that thing. Holy cow. all the other issues up to this of course are basically criminal negligence or intentional.. Your debriefs are just awesome by the way. Also sounds like Jerome had made a lot of money and could afford that kind of training.
This is wonderful investigation work. I am a licensed plumber and making investigations into residential gas leaking and repairs. Each house has the potencial for a possible explosion if the previous person was not licensed. I personally have witnessed such a result. The indiviual installing a dryer gas line failed to seal or tighten corretly. He left and during a period of time the enclosed laundry room then had accumulated space with natural gas. The the dryer was the ignition sourse. As the air in the small room; with out ventilation became condensed with natural gas, the hot flame set the compressed gas to ignite. The entire wall and wood stairway adjacent to the laundry room exploded into parts. I like your explaination when speaking so many things went wrong beforehand leading up to this terrible accident. Most of these avoidable gas explosion are human error. Thank you for pointing out how important proper maintenance and qualification, training and experience must be. Your presentations are clear, and important for anyone interested in safety to watch. GOOD JOB!
“So many!?” Wait wait, did you hear what just happened? A fully qualified pilot just took off in a plane completely and legally certified airworthy. And right after that another one landed safely at its destination.
I'm more inclined to think the Jerome was pushed to get his licence as fast as possible. Between the questionable training, the unserviceable aircraft, questionable maintenance, deviant pilot behaviour, and lack of proper permitting, I'm surprised no one is doing time.
lost allot of friends that day... look i've been a skydiver for 20 years. it is preached to skydivers that the sport is safer than driving. and if anything is wrong with the plane you can just jump out. when in reality drop zones have competed the cost of a tandem down to where it is now impossible to make money as a Drop Zone owner. literally every plane used in skydiving operations on the planet has pencil whipped logs. i just changed careers to a welder because of how bad the economy is and how dangerous the planes in the industry have have become. There is literally a joke in the skydiving industry " the way to become a millionaire as a Drop zone owner is to start with 10 million" if you think those people are spending 10's of thousands on aircraft maintenance. you're naive.
Thanks for the video ! I lived in Hawaii 1968 - 69 and flew with some contracted independent air operations. Once coming back from Kona to Oahu with a group we had an engine fire, landing at the international airport. The fire was extinguished and all was well... but I had had strange feelings about the pilot competency in the 403 Cessna. Excellent video, thanks again.
Wow, when your video notification popped up it immediately caught my attention, why? Of the skydivers, Casey Williamson was my nephew and my sister’s only son. Casey, was an exceptional Yukon, OK HS student and athlete earning an academic and sports scholarship to St. Olaf College in Minnesota. During his HS years during family Holiday gatherings he would often ask me about my career as a Navy Explosive Ordnance Technician, Diver and Parachutist. He was very interested in pursuing a similar path, but he had a medical condition that restricted this pursuit. However it did not stop him from pursuing an adventure lifestyle, he became an avid snowboarder, instructor, which led him into the skydiving world as a videographer recording special events, just like the married couple on this flight who were celebrating their first anniversary. Additionally, I’m very familiar with Dillingham Airfield. As a Navy & Marine Corps qualified parachutist I’ve made numerous parachute training jumps at this drop zone in the late 80’s and early 90’s. Before this tragedy happened, my Hawaiian bride and I planned to be in Hawaii that following September, at which time I planned to do a skydive with my nephew, instead we visited the memorial at the crash site. This tragedy should have never happened, however due to the colossal number of errors and failures on the part of both the state of Hawaii not following through with the cease and desist order against Oahu Parachute Center and aircraft maintenance and repair records falsifications the unnecessary loss of lives sadly did happen. Casey was only one of the 10 passengers who perished that fateful day, among those were 3 military servicemen and 6 others whose loss has impacted us all (family and friends). We are still waiting for those liable to be held accountable for this tragedy.
What is the current status of the Lawsuit? The only Defendant capable of paying 5-10 million per death is the State of Hawaii and they are only a fraction of the cause.
@@sanfranciscobay the lawsuit is still ongoing. The law firm who litigated the Germanwings Flight 9525 victims families settlement is representing the families of this tragedy.
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This was a very disturbing story but it offered a lot of very important lessons. Here's another deadly crash in Hawaii 👉ua-cam.com/video/aVJCH9v-X50/v-deo.html
Timeline: 13:10 If there is a 3D food printer I would have print that food. 🤣
Question. Would you fly on a commercial tour flight like an aerial tour of the islands and what would you do to ensure your safety?
I live in South Africa, near where I live there is sky diving activity. About two years ago the same thing happened with a King Air, loaded with Jumpers and just before they left the aircraft the pilot accidentally stalled it and entered entered a spin! The Jumpers vacated the aircraft and the pilot managed a recovery and landed. I think with only a damaged ego!
I don’t know but the C of G could easily have been out of limits.
I thought by now we would be eating like George Jetson. I'm still waiting. 🛸
Check out the sodium content on those factor meals.
Anyone who gets caught falsifying documents should NEVER be given a second chance!
Agreed. It's not a mistake or neglected detail. It's intentional malice and it only serves as a chance for them to make sure they don't get cought next time
@@bobbysenterprises3220 I agree that falsifying documents is usually intentional... but I don't agree with saying that people do so, with malicious intent.
agreed! yet the US is still letting Donald Trump run for a second term :/
Exactly, that’s why Trump needs to be in prison, not the White House. Convicted on 34 felonies for falsifying records!
@@shodancat1000 Diaper Don is also a rapist felon. 💩💩💩💩
Bobby needs to be in jail for life, not just a revoked license. The owner should be in there with him. He was probably employing Bobby and paying him under the table because he knew Bobby couldn't legally do the maintenance, which meant he could pay less to have Bobby do the work. There is no way to avoid using the word "shocking" repeatedly in this video! The only word that was missing but should have been frequently mentioned was the word "criminal"!
He should be in PRISON.
Bobby is probably working on aircraft as we speak.
This whole thing sounds like something that would occur in south Flori-Duh, where there are a ton of shady operators in the local aviation scene.
@@johnnunn8688 Naw, its worse, he's working on some unsuspecting persons car . . . not bothering to check to tighten the lug nuts or bleed the brakes.
I am a retired CFIA&I 68 years on Earth. I know enough about the kinds of people with an agenda and no ethics. The securities sales game is not the career for building sound ethical habits in the short term. It also isn't a job where wrong doing will end in death by your own hands on activity. This fellow busting 3 check rides in a row indicates a bad instructor.
One of the passengers on this plane was a friend of mine. As an aircraft mechanic I’ve wondered what happened. You’ve made sense of it all.. I appreciate your knowledge and explanation of all these accidents. Your videos have taught me to take my job much more seriously.
My skydiving instructor, Daniel, was on this flight. Every time I watch one of your videos, he comes to my mind and i wonder when you'd do a video over this. I still get that sinking feeling in my stomache and I shed tears for him, his new wife of just a few months, his daughter, and the rest of his family when I look at my pictures and videos from when I jumped with him. He was truly a remarkable individual, and he was filled with excitement whenever someone expressed an interest in going beyond tandem skydiving. Daniel is deeply missed at his home drop zone, Airtight in Skiatook, Oklahoma. Daniel and Casey we're the 2 that got on at the last minute. This was actually then last flight of day which was why they got on at the last minute.
Damn, sorry for your loss.
I will never understand people who voluntarily jump out of a plane while in flight.
And they even pay for the privilege…Thrill? Excitment? I get excited when I do crossword puzzel.
I got a 100 on my Private Pilot written exam. I almost failed my check ride because my check pilot told me to execute a power off stall and recovery and I executed a power on stall recovery that developed into an incipient spin. The check pilot grabbed the controls because he was startled, and didn’t think I had control of the plane. He was expecting an uneventful power off stall, and instead got a nose high full break. Neither of us were completely clear if he had asked for a power on, or power off… so he gave me the benefit of the doubt and passed me. A few months later, I was asked by the tower, while on a southerly heading to make a left turn to 270. This was to provide spacing for a commuter airline entering the airspace ahead of me, instead, I turned right to a heading of 270 and came face to face with a Saab about a mile away at the same altitude converging rapidly. A few more times, I bumbled similar requests from the tower. Apparently I have a hard time with transposition of numbers and directions… I don’t fly anymore… for the safety of others.
I so sympathize with you. My confusion with numbers and letters is one reason I'm having 2nd thoughts about going for my private pilot's license. I can't hear fast enough to get all those tower-aircraft comms. People laugh when I say "turn left" and point the other way. And just letters and numbers. I might get the right numbers or letters down when I'm taking notes or transcriping things, but they will be in no particular order. To me, they make sense, but to others, they haven't a clue. It's real.
If it weren't for spell check, I'm not sure anything I write would make sense to others.
@@rock-t3d2k 😢 It sounds like dyslexia.
@@rock-t3d2k Turn left. No, the other left!
Thank you (for not flying).
My instructor said big numbers to the right, little numbers to the left. 😂
As a former air controller and skydiver, and a private pilot of nearly 40 years, I am without words after watching this debrief.
As an occasional flight sim enjoyer, I feel the same. Even I know just how insane... just about every single step of this disaster was.
As a single engine private pilot, I never deviate from normal protocols, including pre-flight, proper weight, weather conditions, and hot dogging it (showing off). So many things CAN go awry. I never want to be a contributing factor to a disaster. I was taught that disaster occurs most often when SEVERAL factors are simultaneously askew.
i never thought something like this was even possible in reality.
That Plane Should Never Had Been Flying
I took 12 lessons in my 20s.
Whilst I was fine for theory, I soon realised that I was NOT a natural pilot, so I gave up.
There is no guarantee that we all can be experts at everything we attempt.
Not many natural pilots mate, I was terrible when I first started, far from a natural but I persevered, at 59 😂
As Dirty Harry said, "A man's gotta know his limitations." Glad you figured it out!
Me too. I knew I wasn't the cool headed disciplined stuff that makes pilots. I still love aviation and fly competition F3A in RC. I'm pretty good, too.
I know I would be a great pilot but I don't have the lots and lots of money required
@@SteveToes-b4f pants on fire ? You posted a fantastic comment and just want to say how impressed with it I am 👍🏻
I'm also a 73 yr old pilot that started jumping in Oklahoma. Here's what everyone needs to understand: this pilot was a poster child for Dunning-Kruger Syndrome. If you don't know what that is, LOOK IT UP. He was overconfident, thought he knew enough to operate in the manner he did, and he DIDN'T. This is happening at an increasing rate because no one pays their dues anymore. No one crashes model airplanes to see what an aft CG really causes; no one understands hidden structural damage; no one cultivates that voice in their ear that says "hey...this is how people bust their asses." NO ONE READS AND PONDERS ACCIDENT REPORTS RELIGIOUSLY.
I'n done. This why I quit jumping.
I totally agree. I was a pilot and made 350 jumps. I quit bc I hit the ground w/o a parachute 🪂 and took it as a sign from God, ha!
I can’t believe they didn’t crash sooner, but so sad.
Many yrs ago there was a skydiving accident that killed many over Lake Ontario. They were doing a water jump, in overcast conditions and there tower identified a different aircraft, that was closer, as the jump plane. It’s just heartbreaking. ✌️
@@Lunalas4123 When I clicked on this video, I wasn't sure if it was about the Lake Erie jumpers.
@@rickmoore3730 actually it was Lake Ontario, the one east of Erie, by Niagara Galls. Tragedy
@@Lunalas4123 I just Googled the incident and the sixteen jumpers that drowned jumping through cloud was over Lake Erie. They were flying out of Huron, Ohio. There might be an incident over Lake Ont. that I am not aware of but the Lake Erie one has been in the news a lot. ( I was born in Niagara Falls, Ont. so I know where the lakes are btw)- not being snarky . Cheers
That is why I quit doing a lot of things that involve moving machinery !
As a CFI, it's absolutely unbelievable to me that the DPE(s) who signed the pilot off never questioned the fact that a pre-solo student pilot logged 40+ hours of multi PIC time in a King Air. Any of our local examiners would have laughed him out of the room and probably reported him to the FSDO.
They were either in on whatever racket the flight school owner was running or did not even check his logbook.
My sentiments. Every DPE I’ve known would’ve probably reported me, all my instructors, and had a full ass investigation initiated into my logbook and actual flight records.
Before I took my private pilot check ride, the examiner spent at least 15 minutes reading my log book. I am sure that if it did not show every required activity and endorsement, the exam would have ended right there.
@@erintyres3609 100%. that was my experience for every checkride, as is the case for MOST pilot’s I’d like to think. Any DPE worth the rate they charge will pore over the logbook and verify/ask questions about any discrepancies before anything else happens.
I’m an A&P and can’t believe there was zero 337 ,s for the major alteration. That an the fotos of the spinner and wrinkles were terrifying.
They got these people killed.
I don't understand why so many pilots do not know basic spin recovery. My instructors in the 90s wouldn't solo me until I understood spin recovery. The aft CG loading in this case would make it harder to push the nose down, But he did not follow procedure.
Daniel was my roommate and friend when I worked for the same skydive company as he did, before he moved to Oahu. He was so nice and loved what he did. He took me my on my first tandem dive and was a great instructor. He also used to tell me he was scared he was going to die in a plane crash. Then he did about a year later. RIP friend.
I'm sorry for your loss.
@@barbarajeffries I bet Daniel is sorry he didn't listen to that little voice in his head. We FEAR things for a reason. It tends to keep us alive.
@@ronjones-6977 I usually don't feel sorry for the dead, as I believe they're in a much better place.
I feel sorry for the kids & families they left behind. They're the real victims.
@@ronjones-6977 we also overcome fear, my guy. would you tell everyone who has ever feared flying to never fly?
@@ronjones-6977 I mean, what an idiotic takeaway.
That’s the wildest debrief I’ve ever seen. Rules and regulations - many of them written in blood - intentionally ignored and broken left and right, leading to more bloodshed. I’m speechless.
That’s what I learned in my junior college based ground school… almost Every rule in aviation is written in blood. And in many other areas too like medicine and construction. Yet business owners treat the rules so often as mere annoyances.
Complete disregard for rules, regulations and just common sense! Pilot probably had intoxicants in his system on top of it all.
@@SpectrumRob A bold claim. Have you checked the accident report, because if that was the case then it would be detailed in there in the autopsy report.
people who had task permit or deny his licenc are same guilty
Having lived in Hawaii six years, none of this surprises me. A sad fact.
Hey Hoover - this isn’t really a comment on this video in particular, just general appreciation for your hard work on this channel.
I’m a commercial Helicopter pilot on the Pacific coast, and so many of the factors you bring up in all your videos ring true in some aspect of my aviation experience.
You make everything more personal and accessible than NTSB reports, and it’s greatly appreciated by your viewers- whether they’re in the industry or not.
Keep doing what you’re doing; you’re making the air a safer place.
Hoover, I'm a Sport Pilot, 73 years old, and I've watched a dozen or two of your videos. I think this may have been your best. Thank you
"73 years old" a ghost "sport pilot"?
@@truthadvocacy the ghost of kiev
Wow. Being a professional pilot and skydiver. Both for over 27 years. I’m absolutely disgusted with the negligence in this incident.
The day before I got married in April of 2019, I was on that plane with my in-laws who wanted to jump. I met Jerone and told him that I had just got my Multi and wanted to go on that flight. I remember him telling me after dropping the pax that the owner doesn't like him doing more than 3k fpm descent but he was about 5k and then on short final he was still 2k feet ended up using all the runway. Thank you for doing this story and hope people within aviation grasp how important doing the right thing is when it comes to safety.
@Jakes.... having not yet read your comment, I voiced essentially the same sentiments above.
I will never, ever understand why people do thrill-seeking activities in the week right before wedding day (and sometimes while the wife is pregnant, too). I've seen too many headlines of people killed in accidents (skydiving included) during the week before what should be the happiest day of their life. It's just so, so, so tragic. If I had a dependant or two then thrillseeking would be the last thing on my mind. I know you're not going to like me saying this, but in my opinion it's just downright selfish behavior. Put the adrenaline-seeking behind you and be the father/husband/wife/mother you need to be.
@@Elk300so your take from all this is to put your faith in make believe stories about fatherless pregnancies and blind devotion to a religious text riddled with inconsistencies and atrocities towards mankind rather than consider how your proclivity for dangerous activities might effect other people that depend on you so you can make intelligent decisions to best protect yourself and them? Holy sh!t you bible thumpers will use your religion to rationalize anything even abandoning your kids so you can jump out of a plane to get your yayas 😬.
@@Elk300 Well said! 🙏✝️Nonetheless, I understand the sentiment portrayed by @daminox.
@@daminoxeither to share high emotions together, or because once married you can't have fun anymore mindset. I used to do extreme hikes all weekends and almost never did anymore once I got my kids. Priority changes.
As a skydiver this has reopened a fragile wound that hasn't fully healed. I knew one of the 10 jumpers on that plane. Just like I know the owner/operator of Byron. I know many pilots that fly jumpers and are also working elsewhere commercially.
Sincerely, Thank You for producing this video.
I have tears running down my face as I type. I will be sharing this with all of my local drop zones, and requesting they disseminate the video far and wide. I also know multiple people that were at the aforementioned skydiving accident. April 16, 1992... 16 of the 22 souls didn't survive. Those that did, were both physically and emotionally damaged... This emotionally shattered one of the people running the drop zone. He carried his grief for nearly 30 years before he took his own life. His sisters are some of my closest skydiving family. Many aviators see skydiving as a bastard child of the community. I can honestly say, safety briefings at my dz are done with totalitarian authority. When something happens, we use it as a learning tool and a way of positively moving forward. It fosters incredible closeness, logical preparation, structured discipline, clearly communicated expectations, and above all we look out for each other on every single jump... Again, thank you for this video.
That sounds great! What drop zone do you go to?
3 years before this happened, I did a tandem jump with Daniel Herndon at Skiatook airport in Oklahoma. He was a great guy, made me feel at ease and did an awesome job of handling my jump. I was heartbroken to learn he was among the group who died that day. Terrible loss for all of the families involved.
Daniel had just gotten married before this accident and he was a great person....this was tragic
@@kenfern3365 my dad worked at Skiatook airport on Sundays back in the early 80s to pay for lessons. My first flight ever was out of Skiatook. My condolences to you.
me too I soloed in a 150 at skiatook back in 1971. I was a spartan student then and rented the plane at Harvey young field.
A broken King Air C90, operated by a low time pilot with questionable training and maintained poorly by a mechanic who kept no records... what could go wrong. 😢
Winner Winner Chicken Dinner!
Welcome to Hawaii
@@pipelineaudio If they paid what it should cost for trained, licensed, and experienced pilots and mechanics as well as the rest of the skydivers and jump masters based on cost of living in Hawaii that would require the to quadruple the cost per jump for tandem skydivers (where all the money is). Then they wouldn't get enough customers to cover those expenses. How do you expect the owners of these operations to make a living? Get a job? I mean maybe, but not from Oct-Apr when the surf is good on the NS.
He made a point to say that the employees of this fly by night jumping operation were all hired as independent contractors as a way to cut costs. That is true, but he failed to mention that the other two (more well established) skydive businesses at at that little airfield also do all their staff hiring this way. They really are being exploited because the owners expect them to be at the DZ all day even when the weather does not permit jumping. if it's really bad they may call it and people go home, but if there is a possibility of a small window of clear skies they need everyone there so they can hurry up and get as many loads in the sky as possible during the break in the weather (as you know the weather here changes on a on a minute by minute basis. The forecast the day before is so useless that Guy Hagi just makes that shit up on the fly each evening) and must sit around, sometimes all day, waiting for something that may never happen. And while that's happening they aren't getting paid because they get paid by the jump. Not only that, a large portion of their income comes from tips. And they expect customers to tip everyone that was responsible for your jump (not only your tandem master, but the pilot, mechanic parachute packers, etc. Even if most of them live a 5 minute drive down the rd they aren't allowed to spend the time not being paid and at home and on call. There's other examples of how they are getting the worst of the deal. But when times are good and they get a long stretch of blue skys for weeks and lots of tourists shuttled up from town they can bang through the loads and be making bank. With those employment practices and no regulations it's easy to find some other skydiver at any DZ around the word that would be on a plane next thing to fill a spot for 6 months or longer working in Hawai even it it meant shitty pay. It's like getting to go on a paid vacation
Unfortunately if the government had shut them down *before* anyone was killed there would be a lot of people complaining about unnecessary government interference etc, they're just trying to make a living, etc etc.
As a pilot all I can say in addition to there's never one Factor it's always a handful of BS moves on a plane being used for commercial service while training training for my initial private I also worked as an apprentice A&P under an IA at a commercial School the behavior and practices in the shop causing constant physical damage was more than I could take many times I would say if I was your boss you would be fired right now and every one of you should be required to be a pilot add fly these planes after you are done possibly you wouldn't be so abusive to cowling and other craft components one day while watching an overly aggressive mechanic yanking and yanking at a cowl I hustled over and said let me give hand you looked at me like I was an alien ripped it off and threw it across the shop again I said if I was your boss you would be fired right now on the spot furthermore how would you like that cowl to come up and hit you in the face if you had to fly this out of here when you were done working on it many times during work on private customer planes numerous times I would hear nobody's going to want to pay for that problem is in these sectors these mechanics get paid crap and they get treated that way as well so with those two things working against you there is your maintenance problem finally on a private plane annual for a broker selling a particular plane I noted remarkable corrosion above a spar that would require disassembly and inspection of a wing again told he's not going to want to pay for that as usual we would always take an annual inspection for the typical $50 hamburger as the Ia believed in it on return the pilot who performed paintwork was ticked off bye correction from Tower due to an incorrect approach communication can you put us all into one of Jerome's Banks over all of our hangers and yanked on it hard enough enough that the IA punched his shoulder and yelled that's enough so loud I can hear it over the engine later that same plane came back with a paint request from a prospective buyer the painter started running down the top of the Spar line removing some corrosion around the rivets and they started popping off like buttons he called me over to the airport to look at it and I just looked at him and said I will never get into a plane with you again I walked away unfortunately the Ia passed soon after replacing all those rivets the angry pilot dreaming of a commercial wandered away after much angry trouble with his neighbors and arrests fortunately I am still around and if he ever tries to use me as a reference or if I am interviewed I will inform the FAA of his Reckless disregard for safety we could have all bought it on that $50 hamburger run unfortunately unknowing passengers never know the full background of their pic my written was better than all of my cfis I picked the nation's hardest checkride examiner that never passed anyone and he had to pass me the first time none of those cfis would sign me for my check ride the owner of the school had to with career dreams they didn't want my failure on their record I don't fly much anymore loved it and actually grooved Landings more than anything else as I found them to be a test every time when I fly commercial I certainly can't grade the crew but if it's an exceptional Landing I slide my hands across each other and say sweet thank you which is usually met with a big smile from each of them a few of my instructors are captains and first officers now working regularly someday I hope to see them while I disembark because I am going to remind them who got the better written
I am an Aussie bush pilot (retired now) and early in my commercial career path I flew para drops. The aircraft were all a little battered from the use case for them but mechanically they were all in superb condition. It was NEVER an issue to stop flying if something looked amiss and everyone in the organisations that I flew for were "safety first". With piston a/c the main issue was shock cooling in the descent which throttled the operations a little, but no one ever said anything about speeding things up to me. Most of the pilots (at least in Queensland Aus in the 1980s) were young guys building hours like me. We all treated it professionally as a commercial operation, so it pains me to see this video. The accident was almost inevitable. Thank you for caring enough to make this content .
The first time I went sky diving… I was the last group to go up.. the company then told my group that the plane is having issues and we can’t go. We were all disappointed but I think back at what as blessing that was after learning that more ppl die in the plane up or going down via a skydiving trip vs ACTUALLY skydiving .. ended up skydiving 4 years later in Sedona
Scary as hell. I'm a pilot and I also skydive. I have worried, at times, about whether my chute would open, lol, but never about who is flying the aircraft, or the maintenance of the aircraft. Going forward, I will look into this, before I leave the ground. My heart hurts for the lives lost. So many links in this accident chain broken. Unforgivable.
If this debrief was an actual block of Swiss cheese, there's no way that it would be able to hold itself together. This is truly one of the most horrific and emotionally frustrating cases that I have ever heard...just unreal. Thank you for all of your hard work in bringing this heartbreaking debrief, you certainly couldn't have had any pleasure or enjoyment in doing so.
I am still in shock over how terrible this was. The complete disregard for safety and the recklessness displayed was awful!
@@pilot-debriefthis one contains almost all possible aspects, except for perhaps contraband replacement parts. 😮
I've packed parachutes for OPC. I've known George for a long time and even shared over a hundred skydives with him. I never met Jerome though because he started flying for OPC about a year and half after I started working elsewhere.
To this day, I will stop by the memorial site often when in the area to give respect to the lives lost.
Thanks for the informative video
I was going to say, this debrief could be sold in a store, the packaging labeled 'Swiss cheese' and it's just an empty package; all holes.
Take care of yourselves, and each other.
This was such a detailed, compassionate, fiercely professional, grim video, and I sincerely appreciate the tone and determination to share it with us.
Damn that was well said!!
You don't know or you would not say this but the narrator in this video makes incessant, hyperbole-filled assessments supported only inference and speculation, all perfectly designed to give a dull person a perception of validity to what is being said, but entirely meaningless, useless, manipulative, and arrogant...I would elaborate but you will never care, having gone down this road to receive your bit of YT income. Stated opinions about rationales and reasons are completely invalid and there are no demonstrated qualifications to imagine the cause and effects of anything stated about mechanical issues, business decisions, or pilot qualifications.
@@ASDasdSDsadASD-nc7lf For the definition of "Word Salad", see above.
As a 77 year old former skydiver and glider pilot I'm amazed that this
back to back screw up could have been allowed to happen. May those
who lost their lives RIP. Very sad.
Thanks for your presentation. I’m an FAA ATP/CFI who has about 400 skydives at Dillingham. I use to jump with George, and flew Part 121 with Rick. (I immigrated to New Zealand several years ago and had limited knowledge of this accident, and no knowledge of Rick’s passing.)
During my time at Dillingham I had constant trouble “fitting in” over my inability to remain quiet when I saw safety issues in the operators or up-jumpers there. Eventually I just quit skydiving for fun and pleasure, because well, it wasn’t fun and pleasurable at Dillingham anymore.
I am so sorry for the families of the accident victims.
Again, thank you for your presentation on this accident.
Thanks for adding something significant to the conversation. I think the investigators would have liked to talk to you before finalizing their report. Such a preventable tragic event. Aloha 🤙🏽🤙🏽
No one seemed to want to shut them down, even though it was appropriate
well if you would have stayed remaining silent you could certainly be one of the victims. but you should have reported those issues, maybe you would have saved many lives. But it’s not your responsibility.
@@doom9603 skydivers are basically customers. Up-jumpers aren’t employees. They come each with their own equipment, training backgrounds, standards and habits - which can vary widely. Skydiving operators usually operate on a minimum budget and it is up to each individual jumper to insure they, and their equipment, are current and prepared for each jump. It can be difficult to establish and maintain a culture of good habits because of all these variables…Just saying…
(I got lucky and started at a drop zone in Arizona that really emphasized training, and setting goals and standards while having a good time.)
Anyhow, all the factors leading to this accident were wholly within the control of the operator, and not the up-jumpers.
@@vancetilley7942 I agree to all you said and I am glad you were not one of the unlucky victims. But especially for the varying backgrounds and that environment’s complexity that applies to aviation even more than most other industries, it's the job of the company to ensure safety above all. The grave violations of aviation security principles and industry standards is wild. You are absolutely right that neither the jumpers, nor the pilot (operator? or do you mean the business?) had full control of these circumstances led to the lined up holes in the Swiss cheese model
saving money, cutting corners, ego/show-off-ness = tragedy. So sad as it was so preventable. Thanks for all of your many hours of research that went into this episode.
Yet another "Ocean Gate"
@@cynthiak3376omg! I just came to say this brings to mind Stockton Rush!
You are a great presenter - so clear, precise and accurate. The best!
Wow, thank you!
agree, hoover is thoughtful, insightful, not dramatic, factual, and to the point, (no silly dramatic music) that's why his videos are so good, hope he continues to thrive
😊😊😊😊😊
I don't even fly and somehow watch all his content. It really is well done.
@@alaudet same
Daniel Herndon was a friend of mine who I did tandems with whenever he took a break from his instructor gig at Oahu.
This video is much appreciated. I always thought it was a VMC rollover that caused this crash….which has happened before on King Airs. So hearing about the real reasons is infuriating.
On another note, the King Air 90 is not an ideal jump platform. The CG parameters are not conducive to skydiving where it’s common for jumpers to crowd near the rear of the aircraft during jump runs. There have been MANY instances of King Airs stalling on jump run. Also, the door is too small and the horizontal stabilizer is too low. There have been several “tail strikes” over the years by exiting skydivers.
Drop zone owners buy old King Airs 90s because they’re a cheap way to get into a turbine platform, however, DZ owners are notoriously cheap when it comes to aircraft maintenance and these K90s are expensive to maintain. As a result, most of us old skydivers are terrified of King Airs 90s and try to avoid them.
Anyway, thanks again for the video and I plan to pass it along to everyone who knew Daniel.
Very sad story. Jerome‘s hotdogging antics remind me of the old saying in aviation that goes “there are old pilots and there are bold pilots but there are no old bold pilots!”
And there are checklists for a reason-- people make mistakes
@@yvetteandjorgenlarsen9753 Exactly!
@yvetteandjorgenlarsen9753 the only crazy thing about check lists is the one i see was a plane that landed and was on fire. The pilots couldn't leave till they did the shutdown check list. I feel like in that situation they should be able to just do a fuel cut and get out.
@@jamesclark4 That’s where experience comes in my friend. I would much rather have an older pilot with a few wrinkles on his face and a couple of gray hairs than some young kid fresh out of flight school. There is no substitute for it and sadly people learned that the hard way.
I live on the North Shore of Oahu, and for over 20 years, I worked as an Air Traffic Controller. I have firsthand knowledge that the skydiving company had a history of being cited and fined regularly for reckless behaviour. (I've been on-site and inspected their operation for the Army) Some of the skydivers lived on-site, and there were times when they would be drunk or high before taking people up. The airfield is owned by the Department of the Army and leased to the state, which in turn rents it to the skydiving company. The state is responsible for regulating them and has issued multiple citations over the years. Even the Army has fined the state for failing to enforce regulations against the company. Despite this, the state has continued to neglect enforcing its own rules.
The entire situation was avoidable. The skydiving instructors were reckless, arrogant, and fully aware of the risks. I’ve jumped with them, and they would joke about the safety of the aircraft, which was concerning even then. Those instructors chose to jump, but the married couple had no idea they were putting their lives in danger. Tragically, this could have been prevented. Despite everything, the skydiving company remains in business, likely still violating regulations at every turn.
How is that possible, with all the blatant history of violations from the Army Dept. and state?
Did they get all their certs from the school of Point Break? What kind of cowboy industry is this?
Yet nothing ever happened to them..
I'm with you I find this guy almost a comedy channel.
@@markmcgoveran6811 what?
Great videos, Hoover! As a retired airline captain (UAL, 19,500 hours) I appreciate your direct, “right to the point” debriefings and your constant emphasis on avoiding “carelessness, incapacity, and neglect.”
Great comment Sir, I totally agree!
And I second that!
Every time I fly, usually American, I hope that the pilots are at the doorway as we disembark so I can thank them for getting us there safely. We appreciate you!
@@sojerz6092 I don't see that much anymore. I miss it.
Any pilot who regains control and lands safely after the rear horizontal stabiliser breaks off is awesome!
As a former Air Force aircraft maintainer , the lack of documentation and absence of an inspection process is astounding.
We had 5-skill level techs doing the work, 7 level inspectors, then a 9 level final inspection and review of maintenance forms before signing off for flight.
They couldn't afford to do the basics, very sad.
Wow that's incredible! Talk about SAFETY FIRST AND FOREMOST in the Airforce ! I love knowing that ! Very reassuring!
Sadly much of it is economic. Air Force can afford that. No private operator, even the airlines, would struggle to have that many eyes onboard.
They should have never gotten away with this .Any 43151 skill level crew chief in the air force would have grounded that airplane just off the visual of the wing buckling ,and the panels being all out of wack .l cant believe an A&P signed off on this airplane..
Welcome to Hawaii, brah.
Same here (but in a different country). We’d have the technician(s) doing the repair work, overseen by a supervisor, then independently inspected, then the head engineer certifying the aircraft as serviceable. Then another mechanic performing a before flight servicing (inspection). That’s at at least 5 different people in the Swiss cheese model. With absolutely everything documented and signed for.. every removal, every install, every part serial number documented, every function test (with independent inspection) and even the tool control is strictly documented.
As soon as the aircraft in this video crashed, we would have quarantined the paperwork and nobody’s going home.
To our standard of engineering, fitting the wrong elevator and ignoring the wing damage would be unthinkable unless it was signed off by someone very very high ranking and above my paygrade.
Wow-bad mechanic, damaged wing, fraud, shaky daredevil pilot, over loaded plane, unbelted passengers-these accidents were inevitable! This is one of the more reckless examples I've heard.
Add extreme flight maneuvers for a "thrill ride".
@@MrShobar 'We're verging a negative dive, it's too close for missiles, gotta switch to guns! Hwy to the danger zone!
@johndefalque5061 Missiles? You want these idiots to shoot themselves down faster?
This was horrible.
@@jamesogden7756 I am making light of the pilots daredevil reputation. He did ultimately do a steep bank angle turn. One should never give their passengers a thrill ride.
Yep. If Jerome didn't crash the plane on that takeoff then by that time the week following he'd have been trying to do barrel rolls on takeoffs before he even crossed the opposite threshold of the runway. It was only a matter of time before he crashed.
What I often gather from debriefs is how frequently I hear phrases like 'he initially failed to be certified but succeeded on a second attempt two days later' or 'his license was temporarily revoked and reinstated after a follow-up inspection.' This pattern leads me to believe that trainees and other professionals in the aviation industry are, in many cases, not allowed to fail out completely. I’ve noticed a similar trend in my own field, where difficult decisions about excluding individuals who are incompetent or potentially dangerous are often avoided.
Very true. As a medical professional, I see these situations occur more frequently than one might think. In my younger years, I was very involved with navy nuclear power. The culture there is that if you do not demonstrate consistent and sustained superior performance, you are shown the door. The US Navy has never had a nuclear accident.
This is so far from the truth its unreal. You cannot just sweepingly disqualify people from their job the second they fail one thing if they come back and prove they can do it. People have bad days, people make simple mistakes on tests or in artificial conditions. If they weren’t deemed safe on that second test they wouldn’t pass.
All that repeatedly talking like this does is place a massive amount of pressure and stress on pilots before a test and leads to far more fails, thus causing a vicious cyle.
@smokingspitfire1197 you absolutely misunderstood what's being said. None is saying that you should have only one shot to pass a test, and you are gone forever if you fail. Everyone deserves a second chance. But why allow people to retake the same exam 2 days later? You had absolutely no time to learn anything new, or train again. And "surprisingly" these incompetent pilots systematically pass on their second try, leading me to think the expert showed some kind of indulgence. In my country, if you fail a driving test, you have to retrain at least some amount of hours. Who should it be different for pilots?
Lowered standards are causal to a lowered expectation.
@@Donald-ky2fg Having to resit a test isn’t a lower standard, you still have to be at the same standard to pass, you just don’t get the boot the second you make a mistake.
I never thought I’d get into flying videos, but you, man, totally changed that for me. You’ve got an awesome way of telling stories that just pulls me in. Your insight and judgment are next level-I’ve learned so much from you, and it’s stuff I can actually use in my own life. The way you break things down is super relatable and inspiring. Seriously, keep doing what you’re doing-it’s such a joy to watch and learn from you!
One summer season back in the 90's, I flew the same vintage King Air A90's (N105K, N98B) out of drop zones in NCAL, in particular Byron and Hollister. I soon learned to dislike skydivers and DZ operators as they were always pushing the limits of safe flight ops. I felt I was risking my life and future aviator career for their jump addiction. For example, solo jumpers would sneak on the flight after we were loaded up and duck under the last row to avoid me counting them, thus throwing off my CG. Or, the Solo would sit up against the rear baggage compartment bulkhead just after takeoff. They were always trying to get me to slow way down on jump run or jumping over solid overcast. I could go on and on but, I'm so lucky to have survived that memorable jump season.
Wow! I have a little over 2500 jumps and have never heard of or ever seen any jumpers sneak onto a jump plane. That is crazy! I can't imagine why the DZ ownership would allow that. That's a good reason to quit that job.
That’s absolutely nuts. Was it SOP to brief jumpers before they boarded? If so, after experiencing that type of shit, I would’ve stressed the point of what happens when the CG shifts out of the acceptable fore and aft ranges and for them to tell me if anything like that happened. “Assuming you all want to go home alive today…say this if you see this”
@@robertvillalobos7083 It happens! Wait until the AI!
@@14Mustacheman88 A jumper brief generally happens in the training to get an A license. Rule is that all jumpers are to be secured by a seatbelt till 1,000 feet. All the planes I have ever jumped had only enough seat belts for the capacity of the plane. Most of the time the planes are full and there isn't enough room to move around to change the CG.
@@robertvillalobos7083 I mean that makes sense. I’m more asking if it’s a common practice for pilots taking jumpers up to brief them prior to boarding since jumpers sneaking on or whatever seems to be an issue in some places?
“Pilot was an investment banker” so basically he was an expert in fudging numbers?
Unfortunately some numbers can't be fudged, such as the old saying, "The Pk (probability of kill) of impact with the ground is 1.0".
YES!
Maybe, but not necessarily. There are some honest investment bankers. You never hear about the honest guys unless they really hit it big or are really big crooks. There's more crooks than those that hit it really big so it seems that way. But many just are honest and do OK and you just never know anything about them.
Explains why he was able to progress so quickly through his flight training. Money talks.
@@gabrielpowers766😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
The NTSB or FAA should arrest every single person who wouldn’t get back to them, including the guy who left the country. They knew, they all knew.
Nope
Neither of those agencies have any power to arrest.
Maybe they should have INTERPOL send someone after the guy who left the country.
On a more serious note, the repeated violation of local regulations combined with their refusal to comply with authorities clearly indicates nefarious intent; this should be enough to have a warrant for their arrest issued.
The NTSB is useless
@@JFJD Devils advocate here. On what charges? For being ,”Bad guys?” Fact is once an individual looses their certificate, there’s little else the FAA can do to them. In south Florida we had a character straight from Central Casting by the name of,”Lefty.” (ISYN) Convicted of forging airworthiness certificates among other things. He lost his pilot and mechanic’s licenses but kept on trucking, selling aircraft with false records and flying charters. FAA knew but couldn’t touch him. After several years his reputation preceded him to the point he couldn’t do any more business so he moved on.
Your dedication to detail is what keeps me coming back to this channel. Great job, keep it up!
Let’s start with the ferry pilot; who took off, noticed the trim condition, noticed the damaged wing then flew 2300 miles across open ocean.
Hahaha😂
Eh you laugh, but it’s classic get-there-itis. He was likely paid a lot, had the adrenaline flowing, made personal adjustments to his schedule and regular job, had a hotel and arrangements already made, etc etc. If he took off and got the wing within trim (even if it’s way more than he’s used to) it wouldn’t be enough for most pilots to cancel the flight and blow up all those previous arrangements I mentioned. I’m not saying it’s right, just that it’s easy to do and that guy probably had the least bad intentions of all the crazy people mentioned in this video. FWIW the flight went fine, so…
I doubt the damage to the aircraft had much of anything to do with this crash honestly. The people the plane was perpetually flown around / with and maintained by absolutely did.
In a normal commercial flight regime where a King Air pilot is basically graded by passengers for how GENTLE w flight is, this plane would have been flying for another couple decades.
@@EstorilEm “GENTLE *w flight is” What is “w?”
@@carpballet a typo for "a"
I got a cessna 406 back from painting and they crossed the aileron cable so both ailerons where cracked a notch out of alignment.
That planes has flown from north Eu to Namibia and back.
It baffled me that the pilots and company accept that stupid rigging as normal.
Also the gear didn’t lock up but hun on to on hydraulic pressure.
But well I can make list of about 100 stupid problems missed by mechanics that could have been killing items.
As a skydiver it gives me chills that so many people had a hand in this disaster and that it could have been prevented on so many occasions….
but they instead chose to normalize the deviance.
Including some of the skydivers not wearing seatbelts on take off. Looks like it was a strong year for the Darwin awards.
@@user-xu5vl5th9nyep
lots of jumpers at this drop zone knew this would end up in disaster. Some can ''smell'' dangerous aircraft and pilots. D-7516
Clearly you did a lot of research to present this video. Thanks for the time and effort you put in. Another great video.
When I explain how to operate something to my son and he says "Yeah I know, you told me before." I mention that even a 767 pilot with thousands of flying hours starts every flight with a checklist.
Normalization of deviation, the cause of so much grief.
Pretty sad. Almost every aviation incident or accident is a chain of misstep events. This story exemplifies the importance of the aviation safety system. What you’re doing is great work by sharing the results of what happens when it’s not adhered to. Thank you for this quality debrief.
Not just aviation, pretty much all "accidental" deaths could have been avoided. This is why the rare unavoidable ones are known as "freak accidents."
Another great debrief Hoover. I came up in general aviation in the 60's & 70's, flight instructor, 135 charter pilot, and went on to the corporate world. We all saw a lot of people that had no business being in aviation, pilots, maintainers, and owners. But I have to tell you, the people involved in the evolution of this tragedy were some of the worst. Starting with that instructor that let Jerome ride right seat in that King Air when he was pre-solo and log it as multiengine PIC, the people that "repaired" the King Air and falsified the documents after the first incident, and the FAA folks that let these things slip through the cracks. I also have to question the quality of instruction and certification that Jerome got along the way, that is a lot of failed checkrides. Last but not least are the owner of that jump school, Bobby the "maintainer" and the jump school pilot that "checked him out" in the King Air when Jerome was in a rear facing seat. What a mess, and the worst thing is that this all could have been avoided, those parachutists were essentially murdered by these people due to their negligence and criminality.
I agree. Criminal negligence. So many lives lost!
As a skydiver with 4,500 jumps over a 25 year period, the least suitable aircraft I jumped from were kingairs and queenairs. Both were business aircraft entirely unsuited to skydiving operations and were usually only used by drop zones because old ones could be acquired cheaply. They were too sensitive to CG shifts, the doors were too small, their stall speed was too high and they were too complicated to maintain. They are meant for nice ramps, hangars and fussy corporate owners. Anyone who has hung around a drop zone knows their airplanes lead a rough life. They need Jeeps, not Jags.
I suspect you've heard the stories concerning jump operations between all three of the companies on that DZ.
100% agree! Give us a C208 or a Twin Otter any day over the King Air!
@@glinleyt Pilatus PC-6 Porter and/or twin-engined Britten-Norman BN-2 Islander too!
My initial reaction: "they really use that plane for skydiving?"
@@pezkoreaddict Same here. I Didn't know they used C90's for that. Seems weird with the door right next to the elevator.
I am a Kingair mechanic. I work on C90's, 200's & 300's. The maintenance issues that got left unchecked is crazy to me. The wrinkling of the skin is specifically called out by Beechcraft on a recurrent wing spar inspection, with good clear example pictures of what to look for. The inspection takes 15 minutes max, so there is no reason you would ever not do it. This aircraft would have been through several of these specific inspections since the time of the first accident. Throughout my career I have seen some things and made my share of mistakes. They all pale in comparison to this level of incompetence/criminal behavior shown by the mechanics signing off on this aircraft when in reality, it should have been grounded and scrapped. (Repairing the wing would far exceed the cost of buying another used aircraft).
All that said, the pilot side of this is just as screwed up. These are not aerobatic aircraft. The guy was performing these maneuvers on a 60 year old aircraft that was not meant for it. Even if the maintenance was spotless, you still wouldn't do this. This whole thing is just a garbage dump of errors, incompetence, and criminal behavior that is hard to fathom in 2024 aviation This isn't the wild west anymore...
"This isn't the wild west anymore..." It's worse. It's the age of Tik-Tok, Instagram, and "hold my beer, watch this" stupidity, lack of accountability, and laziness.
If someone wrote a skydiving horror movie, the story of this crash would get rejected for being too over the top.
I agree, the producers would claim it to be too over the top…..which sadly in real life it was😢
You think this crash story is bad. You should read about that Beech 18 crash in Hinckley I’ll full of jumpers, Yet another glorified ball of death and glory From known use of shady parts and uncertified mechanics using shitty parts, were unairworthy
Well, they did green light Point Break...
As a ATP rated pilot, with over 45 years of flying fixed and rotor wing, I am indeed angered over this and many other accidents that offer no other excuse than criminal negligence. Whether it’s A/P mechanics that sign off on substandard repairs or lack there of, or pilots that perform these hideous stunts, the end result remains the same..
I for one caution my acquaintances on taking for granted that the charter airplane they are in is safe, that their pilot is safe. This advice has registered feedback where one or both proved true and avoided tragedy. The most recent was a friend avoiding a Lear 35 trip to Vegas where the airplane had obvious hydraulic leaks and the pilot claimed they were normal. Days later the jet suffered a gear up landing, the landing gear failed to extend due to a complete hydraulic failure.
Thank you Hoover for your considerate review of these accidents. I only hope the situation grows better with awareness and correction.
Will they charge the mechanic?
2 companies that I would trust their aircraft if chartered are Harbour Air and Kenmore Air, both operating float-planes in the Pacific North West and both having major aircraft service / rebuild operations. Kenmore actually rebuilt Harrison Fords DHC2 Beaver for him. Both do have charter services as well as regular flights in the region.
Reminds me of the book Death in the ( Grand) Canyon . Many deaths involved sight seeing planes versus helicopters and not sticking to their assigned altitude ranges.
When I was nine years old, Metro Airlines crashed a twin otter in Galveston. The crash killed about ten people although I think there were one or two survivors. The wreckage was stored in my fathers hanger there on Scholes Field. I remember the first time I saw the charred wreckage. The metal gust-lock was still stuck through the control column. The yellow and red "REMOVE BEFORE FLIGHT" words on the big metal flag, which was part of the pin, were charred and blistered. The smell from wreckage was something I will never forget. Neither was the stupidity which caused the tragedy. Nine years old, I immediately knew what caused the crash.
I grew up in Galveston in the 80's. What year did the crash occur? Do you recall the B-25 that was parked on the ramp and left to rot? Or the guy who had the Texan painted up as a Zero?
@@hubriswonk Metro crashed at Scholes Field in 1974. The B25 that rotted away, was owned by Jim Hazlitt(?) The Zero was owned by Michael Burke. Mike's father Eddie was pilot or co-pilot the the B17 that was at my fathers hanger for a while. I got to fly right seat in that one when I was a kid. It was The Texas Raiders that crashed a couple years ago.
@greghavens7679 When I was a kid I played inside that B25 very often. I heard the guy just parked it and walked away?????? And I used to help Micheal Burke around his shop occasionally. My dad helped work on Texas Raiders while it was there. Did you happen to know a guy named Walt who was part of the CAF and Texas Raiders crew? He was rather round around the waist and was into photography. He introduced me to photography. And sadly an alcoholic.
@greghavens7679 On a side note.....do you know of or recall a Corsair that crashed in Houston after taking off from a small airport in west Houston in about 84? I was in my garage when it flew over my house at about 50 feet and crashed in a field. Me and a couple other guys pulled the pilot out before it burned.
@@hubriswonk Nope, never even heard of it.
I’m shocked that so many actors contributed to this tragedy. I’ve been in aviation for 44 years as a mechanic and pilot. The fact that a turboprop with stress damage to the wing was allowed to be flown... and for hire boggles the mind. Thank you for bringing this tragedy to the fore. They need to teach this statutory neglect at aviation schools so that successive generations learn about the consequences for blatant disregard of operational norms.
This one hits close to home for me... One of the Skydiving Instructors on this flight was a good friend of mine... Larry was a great Skydiving Instructor and an amazing friend.
Thanks for sharing. God bless.
I worked with Larry in OH. Such a good fucking guy.
Hoover, excellent job on this very sad incident. Thorough and concise. You are excellent at these videos. Thanks for helping us laymen "kind of" understand the jargon and situations on these.
Jail time should be the outcome of this insanity.
I was a Jump Pilot 20 years ago, logged about 500 Loads. Done correctly, it is the absolutely best way any pilot can learn to really know of your aircraft, and have the skills to land your aircraft safely anywhere. As Hoover noted, you cannot short-circuit this training. UA-cam videos does not do it.
And King Air academy videos are lame af
The pilot you want is not the one that spent his entire career making sure nobody spilled thier drink. If anything goes wrong you want somebody that can actually fly, like a bush pilot or a skydive pilot.
Skydivers know its safish, hopefully that lawsuit goes nowhere if its just a money grab by families hoping for a payday. Skydivers always seat belt for takeoff, they played a role in it too.
Hoover, You are a role model for aviation. You are a master at debrief presentations which includes respecting the families and friends involved. Nice paraglide videos.......
Excellent presentation! When I was an active private pilot from 1975 to 1996, I learned a lot from other's mistakes and that's probably why I'm still here. The lack of oversight leading up to this crash is horrendous. I hope others will learn from this tragedy.
Why would they? Owners get their money and coked up bankster feel invincible.
This is one of the scariest parts of skydiving - the reliance on the pilot and plane to get you up. You dive at a lot of small DZs and a lot of the pilots there are just there to get their hours for something else. You can get all the training, buy the best gear, pack your own chute but you're a helpless passenger. And having been one, after hearing Jerome was an investment banker, I knew where this was going.
Hoover, this was NOT a long Debrief, you hit all points and there are many points to highlight., THANK YOU, the Victims Family would want to know all the details.
How anyone in this Industry can " get away " with the level of Incompetence is wild, may the Families have their day in Court and may the Perpetrators have many years to reflect on their Greed & Incompetence while sitting in a 5 x 10 jail cell.
What your DETAILED REPORT tells anyone boarding a plane or diving is to CHECK the BACKGROUND of both Pilot and Plane.
Near leading Lambs to Slaughter is what transpired.
RIP everyone.
Pete gets a well deserved TRUE STORY BROTHER on this one ❤️🇺🇲
Wow, just wow. I'm a lowly Cessna TR182 owner/pilot but I'm stunned about this whole story. You're right, if we hadn't trusted that you poured through the NTSB report it would have been unbelievable. I'd like to think that most of us are anal regarding maintenance of our aircraft, but I know there are many aircraft owners who skimp on maintenance or kick the proverbial can down the road with issues they feel are minor. I never push the envelope, particularly with pax on board, but I know pilots who do. I have fun just flying normally and while maybe that's boring for some, it keeps us out of the trick bag. Thank you for this story and let's hope that by posting this it may be read by someone who observes reckless activity at some other flight school or jumper operation and has the motivation to report it.
IF you know of unsafe behaviours, perhaps you have to consider whether you should say something to someone. Be it a quiet diplomatic word directly with the person whose behaviour concerned you; or a word with their chief pilot or someone else more senior in their operation; down to making use of the FAA's anonymous whiteblower reporting system.
Aviation is only safe if the professionals within it hold each other to account (and, to that end, are open to receiving honest criticism).
It truly seems bizarre that an owner/pilot would not be consistent with maintenance. I keep up the maintenance on a car and the worst that can happen is I might have to pull to the side of a road, skipping maintenance on the vehicle keeping you alive ??? Crazy
This will def make me think twice before booking another skydive sesh
I'm a retired AFF instructor who followed the BSRs and I saw sooooo much stupid stuff in my day.
Hoover, thanks for taking this on, it has to be difficult.
Any time!
@@pilot-debrief Too many ads, one lasting nearly 3 minutes!
@@isabellindlind W/ youTube premium, no adds !! (except, sometimes, content maker sponsors)
I lucked out, both finding this channel and with not too many ads.
Your description of this incident was both compassionate and informative - the term normalization of deviance and the swiss cheese model have stuck in my head, and can apply to other things besides aviation. Thanks for that....
@@isabellindlind youtubers don't control the ads, beyond the sponsor segment
Thank you for the video. I have now written down 0.5 hours as PIC in a King Air.
The worst kind of people - those who think rules are there just to inconvenience you and are there to be bypassed with trickery.
Well said....
Hoover: I'm admittedly nowhere near being a pilot... nor am I ever going to be (late 60's and a mainframe computer career). I am troubled by what I seem to notice more of lately: flat falsifications/lies amongst "air people". I guess I never took off my "rose-colored glasses" to see any of it; but this is sincerely depressing..... all of it based upon lies and misrepresentations. Just another reminder of the day the former Boeing CEO stood at that podium and "in front of the world" blamed those 737 pilots when it has been long-ago proven that he KNEW BETTER. Just incredibly unfortunate...the whole 'picture'. I am so glad that you're back on YT; and *please* continue your efforts. If ANY "air person" listens, you are clearly "making a difference". Sincere respectful appreciation to you.
The Boeing 737 saga was typical of complex problems, a lot of people had a hand in creating the disaster. In the end, the pilots should have known what they were flying and should have known how to deal with a known feature of the 737.
@@karlbmiles Nope, I blame it on the corporate beancounter management at Boeing. The so-called takeover/merger of McDonnell Douglas was a disaster for Boeing.
@@karlbmiles
So you are writing this and placing blame on the pilots because you are type-rated in the B-737, including the "Dash-8" series and, therefore, qualified to speak on the subject, correct? Yeah... that's what I thought. 🙄
Any reflection on FAA leadership ?Are these positions subject to DEI hiring ?
@@jackquillman7680stop with the DEI CRAP.
As a long time skydiver and skydiving instructor I will say this. If you want to see some of the craziest, most suspicious histories of pilots, planes and owners, look at dropzones. The FAA regs are cheated and multiple logs kept, the USPA only cares about dropzone owners, and skydivers are safety-third. You will rarely see more unworthy aircraft, fewer qualified pilots, or more violations of safety standards than in skydiving.
Thank you for a clear and unbiased breakdown of all of your debriefs. They are very informative and helpful. Blue skies to you.
I jumped out of that aircraft like most local jumpers, and was on the ground photographing it during the spin incident in California. Learning about the chain of events that led into this Hawaii fiasco is shocking.
Your lucky AF
@@shable1436 That Aircraft operated safely for years prior to the damage from that spin incident. The FAA will always list every contributing factor they discover but I suspect the incident pilot in Hawaii would have power stalled a perfectly good King Air into the ground. I've seen this a lot in aerosports. People pushing their limits thinking they're "building skill" util they exceed those limits, then the consequences are severe. Roger Ramjet wanted to impress the tourists with his mad skills instead of giving them the safest ride to altitude he could, which was his real job.
Hoover - I don't know if it happened too long ago for you to debrief it, but have you considered breaking down the crash that took the life of Samatha Smith back on August 25, 1985? She was the young girl who wrote to Soviet leader Yuri Andropov when she was 10, worried about nuclear war between the USSR and USA. She received a personal reply from him along with an invitation to come to the USSR, which she accepted. She was embraced and lauded as a courageous little girl in both countries, but sadly died (along with 7 others, including her father) when the Beechcraft 99 commuter plane she was in crashed in Auburn, ME.
I remember this story. It would be interesting to hear the details about jt.
The NTSB report attributes pilot error. Scheduled commuter flight into IMC, failed to intercept localiser but continued unstable approach with a 300ft ceiling. Callsign HENSON 1571 if anyone else curious.
I'd check Hiillary's alibi, for starters.
Themes of ALL these videos:
1- over confident
2- distracted
3- hurry up itis
Third world cultures
Jerome’s rapid pilot career and fail/pas/fail/pass history could be out of the new MSFS2024 career mode … they even got sky diving. That is, minus the crash.
Hoov, I really enjoy your calm, factual straight to the point approach. Love watching all your videos. FYI, I’m an ex F4 WSO with the 335th Chiefs and would have enjoyed flying with you.
Wampum!
My wife is an amateur skydiver. This kind of story makes me fear for her and her skydiving buddies.
U don't go with her?????
@@kobragangbit I probably shouldnt. I'm retired military and a disabled Vet (8 spine surgeries and no use of my left leg). I jumped 20+ times in the early 90s. She loves it now so I absolutely encourage her. Plus, I have a really great insurance policy on her.
Remember to always say "I love you" before every jump she does and live without regrets.
You both know the risks, but there's also great joy.
Does she watch Hoover's videos? If she did, it might help her to ask questions and research a bit more. Since I started watching, I will never fly privately again.
What's the bigger risk: the skydiving, or the drive to get to the airport?
I am not a pilot but was a skydiver. Back in the middle 90's there was a former Navy F18 Pilot who was a King Air 200 Skydiving Pilot. He would routinely dive the aircraft and race the skydivers to the ground. I paid for a Jump Ticket and Rode the plane down with him. I was zero G in the cabin. Being Young and Dumb, I didn't even think of the structural integrity of the aircraft, nor the maintenance records of the aircraft. Looking back on that event and hearing about this event caused me some angst. Thank you for the debrief.
Lol shit! Do you still skydive?
@@ib1ray No, I stopped skydiving for a couple of reasons. 1. I started having ear issues from the RAPID change in altitude. 2 I gave my fiance a Tandem Skydive and a few weeks later her Tandem Instructor died in a Free Fall Accident. After that every time I left the house to go skydiving my then fiance, now wife thought I wasn't coming home.
Damn! That sucks..... Nobody wants to be that close to a death. Totally understandable though. I quit because I didn't want to rent gear and I'm waiting until I can afford my own to start going again lol I know how I treated that gear which was pretty decent but I'm sure other people didn't care as much as I did....
@ I bought a used rig as soon as I finished the AFF program. Then moved into new gear after 100 jumps. Stopped at 187 and sold everything to a buddy I was jumping with.
Hoover, another Hawaii story for you...
I got my Private there in Hawaii and used to go to one of the flight schools there at Honolulu airport. While working my instrument, we pre-flighted the 150 and were taxiing to takeoff when one of the rudder cables broke. We got back to the tie down area all good but I never flew one of their airplanes again. The school ended up being shutdown for forging their 100 hour and most of their other maintenance records. Shaka doesn't work well with aircraft!
Thank you for doing what you do!
This was a hard episode to watch but I'm very glad you've increased awareness on how so many mistakes cost so many lives. Thanks Hoover.
How the hell was the pilot of that first plane able to first of all get out of a spin - and then land a plane with a half-missing horizontal stabilizer?
That was my 1st thought as well. Also, there was an Israeli pilot who managed to fly and land his F-15 missing 90% of the right wing, so sometimes people just get lucky!
Easily if you are a good enough pilot.
99 percent skill, 1 percent luck... or visa-versa
@@gravesclayton3604I think the Israeli pilot video was a photoshop job
It was probably somewhat easier to control once all the weight (the skydivers) had been removed.
Another educational debrief, Hoover. Having been a car hauler a long, long time ago, I was responsible for checking out the vehicles before I loaded them on my truck so I was pretty good at spotting any deformities in the sheet metal. When there are wrinkles in the wing covering, I would think a mechanic would see that and think to him/herself that can't be right and investigate further. I know that sounds like Monday Morning Quaterbacking but you'd think they teach that in the A&P schools. Hearing your debrief is like following behind someone in my car and wondering what DMV official gave that person their license! I feel bad for everyone involved in this nightmare, but it all comes down to proper training, proper oversight and consequences for not following proper procedures.
Let's see, you're an aircraft mechanic who is not allowed to work on aircraft, being paid off the books to work on an aircraft, and you're going to tell your boss his plane is not airworthy.
Old CFI here. A little jaded by things I saw and encountered in the work, and I don't have a high opinion of many things I saw in GA including my own skills, in some situations, but even with that experience, I am flabbergasted by the sloppy and unsafe things going on in this story. Very depressing. (note: No longer flying, due to medical issues. But I still follow the things going in aviation closely and often miss it). Brilliant summary and presentation here. Side note, my impression of the skydiving "industry" is that a lot of corners are cut and rules fudged in this business and I never went near it. To be honest I think some people in that business are a bit crazy.
Having watched this channel general aviation is not a perfect system, but I suppose you've personally experienced failures yet still landed safely. It ultimately rests on the pilot. With jump pilots I think they have to be a little crazy flying with an open door and not knowing take off weight and not having people strapped in during takeoff. I'm no pilot but I wouldn't get on a plane with basically no left wing trim control...
One thing I learned from building flying toy fixed wing is that nose heavy makes for a sluggish airplane, and tail heavy makes you build another airplane.
A nose heavy plane flies poorly.
A tail heavy plane flies once.
As a military free fall jumper who jumped at over a dozen civilian skydive centers over my 20yr career, this is an example of what I always feared jumping there. It was mind blowing the safety standards that were required for military pilots, jumpers and aircraft to jump, yet we could go to a civilian airfield with far less safety standards and jump 5-10 times a day. As an instructor I would always access the pilots, aircraft forms and weather prior. But to be honest it was never even close (in most jumps) to the safety standards of the military.
As always, great job on the debrief. We really appreciate your channel and your insight.
Excellent analysis Hoover. Former jump pilot and current corporate pilot. I never left the ground without a thorough inspection of the airplane and never had an incident. When you add up all the information you presented in this accident, this is clearly criminal negligence on the owner's part as it was intentional. I agree that many others are at fault and bear some responsibility; such as other pilots who flew this airplane and didn't report it, instructors, examiners, and anyone else who touched or knew about this airplane. I have 48 hours in the industry and for the most part it is a good respected industry but there are the bad apples and this is the result. Totally avoidable and a major tragedy. Thank you for posting.
I fly out of KLVK which is 5 minutes from C83 (Byron) and I vividly remember the incident there. The local training airspace is just east of the jump area. A friend of mine and I had a chance to see the King Air not long after. My friend is an A&P and he was pointing out the wrinkles in the left wing saying there was substantial damage under the skin. Unbelievable someone would say it’s airworthy. Tragic. This debrief made the hair on the back of my neck stand up.
Thanks!
Another really great segment but heartfelt as you always have put together. It’s tough to get through these, but I’m really glad that you provide them.
Always appreciate your debriefs. I’m not a pilot, and am a nervous flyer, so these always hit me for the tragedies they are because they all seem preventable. I sincerely hope anyone watching these is a more astute renter of private places, or more cautious pilot. I’m in the medical field and anytime you have a near miss you are reminded to always always alway follow each safety measure and double triple check
Hoover like you say it's really hard to not to blow up watching this, so many faults involved, my thoughts and prayers are for the loved ones of all of the souls that were lost. Hoover you give this debrief a very professional presentation I know this must have been a hard one to get through, Thank you for all of your hard work!
Absolutely! Thanks for your support!
For you and those around you I hoped that you do not explode
@@pilot-debrief AS a cirrus pilot myself .. I cant imagine a pilot doing their walk around seeing all the defects that were obvious and then jumping in and flying that thing. Holy cow. all the other issues up to this of course are basically criminal negligence or intentional.. Your debriefs are just awesome by the way. Also sounds like Jerome had made a lot of money and could afford that kind of training.
@@geofox9484 We're all safe, no explosion this time around!
This is wonderful investigation work. I am a licensed plumber and making investigations into residential gas leaking and repairs. Each house has the potencial for a possible explosion if the previous person was not licensed. I personally have witnessed such a result. The indiviual installing a dryer gas line failed to seal or tighten corretly. He left and during a period of time the enclosed laundry room then had accumulated space with natural gas. The the dryer was the ignition sourse. As the air in the small room; with out ventilation became condensed with natural gas, the hot flame set the compressed gas to ignite. The entire wall and wood stairway adjacent to the laundry room exploded into parts. I like your explaination when speaking so many things went wrong beforehand leading up to this terrible accident. Most of these avoidable gas explosion are human error. Thank you for pointing out how important proper maintenance and qualification, training and experience must be. Your presentations are clear, and important for anyone interested in safety to watch. GOOD JOB!
As a former skydiver and pilot myself, the word 'shocking' is nowhere near strong enough.
It am left with out words for the disregard and slipshod safety concerns in so many plane owners and operations. And pilots.
“So many!?” Wait wait, did you hear what just happened? A fully qualified pilot just took off in a plane completely and legally certified airworthy. And right after that another one landed safely at its destination.
I'm more inclined to think the Jerome was pushed to get his licence as fast as possible. Between the questionable training, the unserviceable aircraft, questionable maintenance, deviant pilot behaviour, and lack of proper permitting, I'm surprised no one is doing time.
And one man commented above that the skydiving company is still in business.
lost allot of friends that day... look i've been a skydiver for 20 years. it is preached to skydivers that the sport is safer than driving. and if anything is wrong with the plane you can just jump out. when in reality drop zones have competed the cost of a tandem down to where it is now impossible to make money as a Drop Zone owner. literally every plane used in skydiving operations on the planet has pencil whipped logs. i just changed careers to a welder because of how bad the economy is and how dangerous the planes in the industry have have become. There is literally a joke in the skydiving industry " the way to become a millionaire as a Drop zone owner is to start with 10 million" if you think those people are spending 10's of thousands on aircraft maintenance. you're naive.
Thanks for the video ! I lived in Hawaii 1968 - 69 and flew with some contracted independent air operations. Once coming back from Kona to Oahu with a group we had an engine fire, landing at the international airport. The fire was extinguished and all was well... but I had had strange feelings about the pilot competency in the 403 Cessna. Excellent video, thanks again.
Wow, when your video notification popped up it immediately caught my attention, why? Of the skydivers, Casey Williamson was my nephew and my sister’s only son. Casey, was an exceptional Yukon, OK HS student and athlete earning an academic and sports scholarship to St. Olaf College in Minnesota. During his HS years during family Holiday gatherings he would often ask me about my career as a Navy Explosive Ordnance Technician, Diver and Parachutist. He was very interested in pursuing a similar path, but he had a medical condition that restricted this pursuit. However it did not stop him from pursuing an adventure lifestyle, he became an avid snowboarder, instructor, which led him into the skydiving world as a videographer recording special events, just like the married couple on this flight who were celebrating their first anniversary. Additionally, I’m very familiar with Dillingham Airfield. As a Navy & Marine Corps qualified parachutist I’ve made numerous parachute training jumps at this drop zone in the late 80’s and early 90’s. Before this tragedy happened, my Hawaiian bride and I planned to be in Hawaii that following September, at which time I planned to do a skydive with my nephew, instead we visited the memorial at the crash site. This tragedy should have never happened, however due to the colossal number of errors and failures on the part of both the state of Hawaii not following through with the cease and desist order against Oahu Parachute Center and aircraft maintenance and repair records falsifications the unnecessary loss of lives sadly did happen. Casey was only one of the 10 passengers who perished that fateful day, among those were 3 military servicemen and 6 others whose loss has impacted us all (family and friends). We are still waiting for those liable to be held accountable for this tragedy.
What is the current status of the Lawsuit? The only Defendant capable of paying 5-10 million per death is the State of Hawaii and they are only a fraction of the cause.
@@sanfranciscobay the lawsuit is still ongoing. The law firm who litigated the Germanwings Flight 9525 victims families settlement is representing the families of this tragedy.
@sanfranciscobay no I didn't.
@@Rm0544 I tried calling and messaging you on Facebook but it doesn't seem to connect.
@sanfranciscobay my sister is up on all the details of this case. Thanks.
Insane how many preposterous things occurred throughout this video. It's like full unbridled recklessness all around. Amazing in the worst way.
Hoover. Always thorough and professional.
Thank you for covering this incident. Your honesty and candid approach are appreciated.