The Enneagram: The Discernment of Spirits (Types 1 2 3 4)
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
- Spoken and Written by Richard Rohr. All credit, respect, and my thanks goes to him and his team
Disclaimer: I didn't make this nor do I inherently agree with everything spoken. (Additional Disclaimer in comment section)
This series is made years ago back when DVD's were a thing and so I've spent weeks trying to hunt down the video files until I found them on Vimeo.
Disclaimer #2: I am not a Christian so don't take me upload this as some sort of endorsement of Christianity or any religion.
The Enneagram is one of those useful analysis tools that exists and was locked away in a vault stolen from mankind in the same vein as the Vatican "can't find" all of Epicurus' writings. It's a valuable tool that allows for a good MATERIAL ANALYSIS and spiritual analysis of the human race and how it operates on a personality level.
I encourage you to watch this series start to finish and reflect. I also encourage you to not take the Christian elements too seriously and employ rationality to it.
Ultimately though I don't care what you do with this information.
No you do not have the right to comment. I will delete if it suits me.
No I don't give a damn who "found" or "discovered" the Enneagram first. I'm stripping it of religious connotations to make it more efficient.
If you have any more significant questions on the Enneagram on a material, personal, or literature level my a friends and I are happy to start a conversation.
Thank you for your comment. Good you say, that conotations, to the religions are too strong. Im writing my diplom work about
enneagram, and there is only little connection between the religion, but on philosophical level.
All human kind should know enneagram, to work better, more peacefull and more efficiently. Thank for video!
Sounds like a erogant head person ilmao
Enneagram is a Sufi creation ...
I am not a Christian either, I studied enneagram 20 years ago, and it is not even that popular. It is just these days Christians have promoted this
L'affreux Jojo probably from the Christian desert fathers actually
To all my fellow 4's out there ...stay the course my melancholic friend; one exact half of all enlightening things only grow in the dark.
🙌🏽
💟
🤩
I say something so similar to myself. Beauty grows out of darkness. Crazy!
❤🙌
For any future viewers, here are time stamps
13:12 - Type 1
34:30 - Type 2
1:00:00 - Type 3
1:29:43 - Type 4
I guess we know who the 3 is 😀
@@drdaver who me? Nope. I'm a 1 through and through 😄
Oh. Dang i suck at this. Lol
Thank you so much for doing this for us! :-)
How is one classified as to type? Isn’t there a questionnaire? Where can I find it and who could diagnose me?
I literally unthinkingly groaned and put my hands over my face when he started talking about 4s and how the get energy from tragedy and being depressed. When he says you’ll be embarrassed when you hear your type described he’s not kidding wow.
I'm a 2 and so so appreciate that about healthy 4s and am often very empowered/invigorated by 4s. So, thank you 😊
He doesn’t like 4’s. Someone here in he comments said some deep and v interesting things about 4’s. Sorry don’t remember name, but he mentioned ‘4’s HOLD the emotions others can’t or won’t… ‘ at the beginning of his comment.
“If you don’t cast them out they will cast themselves out.” I died. 😃 so true!
"What is unique, breaks."
~ Holderlin
I’d rather be cast out than unoriginal!😂😬🤷♀️
I'm a 9. My mother was a badly wounded 4. I'm not blaming her for my mistakes, but finally in my old age I just now realized that her insistence that I learn to "make polite conversation" (starting about a week after my first word 😁) didn’t work out as she had hoped. Conversation, polite or otherwise, is such a struggle that it's never long before I'm invisible. Best part: I can stop beating up on myself for being a "failure". Thank you Fr. Rohr!! 👍
I laughed so much about the 4 spending an hour to make it look like they just threw something on. I do that ALL the time (I am 5w4 or 4w5)! Lol
Me too 😂
SAME 😂 I’m a 4w5
It appears to me that I was a 4w5 as a teenager, but now I am fully a 5w4. Is this possible?
@@t.k.-s.4212 Some think it is not possible to change. I disagree. Who we are is a combination of what comes naturally to us and what we respond to over time.
@@BurgundyandBlue1111 Yes, I would almost argue that a lot of people during their puberty phase probably feel and act like a 4. Well. Thanks for your feedback.
That was a very pleasant and informative lecture. 4's however, HOLD the emotions that others in a group or family don't or CAN'T handle - it's too complex to go into here - They also are able to "size-up" what is MISSING in any given situation (like this one) which can be an invaluable asset.
4's were the shamans and medicine men and HEALERS in olden times and can be today also.
We have a "radar" for the bandwith of human dynamics that completely escape other types.
I enjoyed this excellent lecture - but it was very obvious that it was from a 1's perspective!😊
OH MY GOD YES!!!!
I HAD TO SWITCH ACCOUNTS JUST TO COMMENT! THAT'S EXACTLY HOW I FELT!
I'm a 4w5 by the way.
He was a little biased against 4s.
How could it not be from the lens view of 1, Richard cannot be or do anything other than who how he is
ua-cam.com/video/ednXVJ_DX20/v-deo.html
Bravo for your assessment on 4! You added much to my basic understanding of 4. We are the scapegoats for the family. We are often envied and not always envious of others.
Now I know I’m a 4, not a 6.
I think he’s right about USA being a 3, but I see no 6 as universal in us all since I feel this realm was created to produce fear. And to me, religion is fear-based.
That’s my two cents worth.
New to enneagrams, this system really helped me understand who I am. I was close to believing that the traditional systems of mental illnesses would help me clarify. It actually gave me a little more hope and understanding to accept and work on myself.
Type: 4
Im a 4 and Im literally sitting here mind blown dressed in all black
I feel seen and attacked at the same time, a 4 here myself :)
Jacqueline F. Same hahah it’s so funny
Same! Solid 4🤦🏽♀️😭🤷🏽♀️
So we were born as our integrated type?
1s were born as 7s in joy and their wounds created resentment
2s were born as 4s in equanimity and their wounds created pride
3s were born as 6s in courage and their wounds created deceit
4s were born as 1s in serenity and their wounds created envy
5s were born as 8s in passion and their wounds created avarice
6s were born as 9s in right action and their wounds created fear
7s were born as 5s in healthy detachment and their wounds created gluttony
8s were born as 2s in humility and their wounds created lüst
9s were born as 3s in integrity and their wounds created sloth
This is an interesting idea! Thank you! Sincerely, a 2 whose second highest score is 4. I’m 65, and in the last 10 years or so, have come to know that as a small child I knew my own splendidness. It took several years of continual wounding to quit knowing it, so I’d completely forgotten it by age 10.
I like that. It works!
I don’t feel I’m just one number though. Haha, an authority on the enneagram told me I’m a 6. But after 21 year’s studying, I feel I’m a 4 as well.
This makes me understand myself and family so much better! I’m a 4 with a 3 father and 9 mother.....it’s so interesting how this explains our family dynamics.
I am Italian, so I can tell you that we are more like the Type 7: Joy, Fun, Mental Narcisism (Giotto, Leonardo Da Vinci, Ferrari, Lamborghini, Vivaldi, Michelangelo, Sun&Bath with DanceFloors on the beaches..)
I'm a 4 - and found that lecture quite interesting.
Oh my gosh. I’m pretty sure I’m 4 - studied casualness, and SONNET 29 WHICH I SPECIALLY PICKED OUT TO MEMORIZE JUST FOR FUN. ITS THE ONLY SHAKESPEARE IVE MEMORIZED FOR FUN
Thank you for posting this! It's so helpful, as Richard Rohr says, to hear this explained, rather than to just read about it!
This is a great post. I was like you once. Zen set me free. You need not predefine spiritual development based on rules. The universe is so ready to set you free
Thanks so much for uploading. Really interesting. I really like the enneagram for what it is psychologically but I haven’t seen one with a christian platform before. I like it when religion and psychology can share concepts. Adds another layer of value. And he explains really well.
I hate how fours are inclined to be narcissistic. This is the one thing I've always struggled with and the one thing that makes me afraid to interact with people.
Isn’t every type? Just looks different in each type. That’s what I hear and think.
How I feel with 3’s so many people call them sociopathic.
All the numbers have narcissistic tendencies imo. Plus this teacher has obvious bias against 4’s lol.
when he started talking about 3s from the begging to the end i just felt exposed. I'm shocked.
I’m a INFJ who is a 1w2! Thanks so much for this video I’ve learned a lot!
This man is CLEARLY fawning over 1’s and 3’s (he is a 1-3-8 himself). Punctuated within his grandiose descriptions of 1 and 3 are the less complimentary descriptions of 1 and 3 but then quickly finds a grandiose complimentary notion to follow up with. He is sooooo much harsher to 2’s! I loved his 1.5 hours introduction on another video and have had a 360 degree turnaround about him since hearing this
I think Beatrice Chestnut has a MUCH more accurate overview of the personalities
When he’s asked about 2’s positives he says done half hearted remarks that sound unconvincing quickly followed by the negative. Yet he dwells lengthily on 1 and 3’s positives!- the numbers he identifies with !!
I noticed this right away as well.
Yup! He’s so obviously a 1 , lol
4s are developed when they retain their creativity without needing to force it on people.
Thank you for teaching so well everyone should have this opportunity to to see this better! I don’t want you to think I don’t have love for all I was raised Baptist, but my dad taught me I can learn something from any denomination and we both believe all Christians will make it together in the end
I'm sure I (and many of us) could make remarks about all the numbers/types but this one struck me in the heart. I have to say something because I get so tired of people being demonized (I know he's just giving the perspective of the number, not saying he believes this way). Regarding his remarks on Ones not respecting people who "don't work hard", there should be some clarity here that those remarks refer to the One's narrow definition of hard work rather than an objective definition of hard work. My comment is for the Ones who are not yet flipped to their more enlightened side.
Frankly, many of the people being looked down upon by all the self-proclaimed "hard workers" actually work much harder than what they are given credit for. I've never seen a more hard-working group of people than Mexicans who routinely are demonized as lazy. It's just wrong. If you don't think a person on food stamps works hard, then you have never watched them in their low-paying work that you certainly would not do. You have never sat down to have a soul to soul talk with them to understand how hard it feels for them. Telling someone they "don't work hard" often arrogantly and erroneously negates the very real and legitimate emotional, mental and physical hard work they are doing every day that you Ones refuse to acknowledge.
God bless this man. He’s saved so many people in distress with their faith
Just wanted to give a heads up to everyone about typing yourself. In this video Richard says that if you don't know your type at the end you are either a 6 or a 9. That wasn't the case for me. At first I typed as a 6. Later realized only bits of that described me. Then with suggestions of others I tried 4. That didn't work because I was too bitter and cynical towards others, so then I tried 8. I am a lot like an 8 cynical, bitter, defensive, but alas, I am not an 8. I am just a really unhealthy 2 that looks like an 8 on the outside but I have the core fear of a 2. I just couldn't admit it until I was put into a situation that shone a light on my 2ness. I cried for a long time after I found out I was a 2. I am pretty convinced. So just keep in mind you may mistype a few times so don't quickly attach onto one type as it may be a bodyguard for your real core type. For 2s when they are unhealthy or stress they basically become 8s. Each type has a type that they mimic when they are healthy and unhealthy. Please keep that in mind
I wonder if they appear like their opposite type when they’re unhealthy, like with MBTI? I’m not sure if 2 and 8 are opposites or not
Thank you this is helping me because I feel discouraged
@@Kayla-me3ct When unhealthy they will appear like the type they disintegrate into. For 2s that would be 8. You can look up disintegration and integration online it is a common part of the theory. Personally, I, and other enthusiasts also believe that you integrate and disintegrate into two types rather than one, and as far as I know this is not conventional knowledge to the theory but it seems to be a theme I am noticing in people and characters I have typed.
Another theme I've noticed is that the wing (or wings if balanced) are like a mask for the core type since it is what fulfill the main type you will be seeing traits of the wings more than the type itself. (So for me I am a 2w1 and I come across more 1-ish, but I also have 1 in my tritype)
Lastly, I don't think Richard Rohr went into this in the lecture but we have 3 fixes or "types". And one core type. Each fix has to be taken from 3 sections. First section is gut which would be 8, 9, or 1. Second is heart 2, 3, or 4 and third is head 5, 6, or 7. They also have wings and they are often more noticeable than the core type as well which can cause confusion
@@kurichanmichele584 It is extremely complex. It has been about 6 months and I am still trying to understand it but I understand it much better than I did before. If you are having trouble I suggest joining the free social media app/site called the personality database. It is a small community where we debate and vote on types using various systems (such as enneagram and mbti among a few others) the site is also amazingly well organized and updated with new feature about weekly. It is run by an ISTJ 9w1, super honest chill guy. And volunteer mods. Would have given up by now if it wasn't for this community
@@ThoughtProvokingVlogswow, this is deep waters and rather Scorpio esoteric and complex ! Appreciate the sm app you recommended.
I’m an astrologer and use the cards of destiny and know about mbti somewhat. Thank you.
This is just unbelievable insight 🥺
This is all so interesting! I do recognize myself and others. Thank you so much for posting such fascinating teaching.
He was very soft on the 3s 😄 but i love this talk, Richard is a very deep thinker, even when he seems to dislike 4s a lot.
Also, i believe i'm the only 4 who really doesn't care about his looks. I wasted to much time and money on those things that are just superficial. As long as my art expresses, what i feel, i'm fine
As a 4 I love fashion, always have. My expression of art is how I dress/look. My fav look is the 40’s.
Wonderful. This is SO real and helpful. I would love to go on a live Workshop / Retreat. Thank you.
I'm a Type 2! An interesting take on these Enneagram types! Thanks for sharing to inspire my MBTI channel. Randomly discovered your channel through the UA-cam algorithm! 🤟🤟🤟
FJ sent me here
Jenneration Zee yes same
Wow your beautiful 😍
C'mon, thumbs down for this? Must be part of the group of people who, whenever they see anything Rohr on youtube click and do their business.
Lol, agree..
this vid popped up on my feed as I had been looking at a vid about Gurdjieff and his enneagram model. He (G) was the originator, and was not religious or using it for personality assessment.
Just a 5 here, listening to nearly 7 hours of talks just to hoard the information for later. 🤣
Actually 4’s are most attracted to the color celadon.
WTF HOW DID YOU KNOW THIS?! except i call it "SEAFOAM blue" lmao
both that and mauve for sure!!
Tertiary colors are the most complex, makes sense that 4’s love the variety there!
That too !!
My favourite colour is indigo and I'm a four.
Enjoyed every minute. Thanks for posting .
4w5 and I adore many aspects of Japan X'D, I've spent some time in France.
Thankfully I've got tragedy in check and I love to blend in. It's just that the moment I open my mouth I'll end myself up in the center of attention, silently cursing, because it's nice to be useful but hard to not quickly become overwhelmed and start missing seclusion 😂 And yes it's definitely hard to be productive "out there". If anyone asked and worked some magic for me, I'd gladly have someone "in here" to carry outside what I distill. And/or who is available "out there" so that I could comfortably get some things moving with others while being able to withdraw to portable safe spaces/people for recharging. Well, I love my life this way, too, though. With all the things that don't work out "to their best possible way" yet. 😁
I have a hard time with type 1s. Not an easy type to be friends with if they are unhealthy. I run away from type 1s and if I can’t physically distance I will emotionally distance.
100% if they are unhealthy
So, to sum up a 4 in a feeling, seems like bittersweet might cover it? Thoughts?
I attest to that
Pretty much✨
I felt this in my SOUL. A lot of what he described about the 4 really just didn't sit with me at all. Eccentric, showy, all that... not me. Started feeling like I didn't _have_ a type (bc 4 is by far the closest). But the bittersweet, the longing, the love of tragedy and death - absolutely.
@@RenneAtha same! Like, I don’t like to stand out honestly - I prefer to blend in. Not that I want to be like everyone else though, I just want my uniqueness to be subtle
@@RenneAtha same! Like, I don’t like to stand out honestly - I prefer to blend in. Not that I want to be like everyone else though, I just want my uniqueness to be subtle
I’m a 3 married to a 1 who loves me even when I fail
And I am a 1, who desperately loves a 3 and am waiting for her to realize exactly the same thing ...
Thank you
I am a 1 married to a 3. We have just arrived at this place where she gets that I love her win or lose and I get that she loves me right or wrong.
Thats beautiful. I'm a three so I know how much we need that from someone
I really appreciate the quantity of “Dammits” in this lecture. 😆
Interesting. Not all 4’a are into visual arts, fashion, and eccentricity. Or are androgynous. This was new.
my whole life start to make more sense after watching this :D
...as a suspected 5, I have been waiting for hours watching these to get to the part about MEEEEEEEEE!
I'm not sure about other types but that was a good description for type 4, but it's missing an important part which is similar to what he said about the 5s "they feel a hole in them that will never be filled" fives will try to fill it with information from people, fours will try to fill it with peoples reactions and their feelings about this four person, and will try to fix that missing part (or flaw) in themselves that gives people this reaction, and this missing part (or you can call it flaw) is what make them feel different from other people, and noticing it make them feel a deep felling of shame, they are trying to fix it to look like everybody else, and you can call that a healthy four. and a four will notice this flaw or missing part of himself by watching peoples reaction to him, and he will try to fix this missing part to look the way he wants people to see him, a healthy person will try to make people see him as normal, unhealthy or immature four will make people see the person he wants to be and it's anything but a normal person, and he do that just to make people feel he is different from them.
There is even more depth to it but that is the limitation of my capability of expression.
This whole "1s are usually worn out by 9" thing explains so much about my ex boyfriend
He'd have to vent about his job first & maybe see a movie to unwind, the dumber the movie the better
Me going full art critic on his one patch of brainless entertainment cannot have helped
i do hope he has since found someone else to console him when he comes home all frustrated
4s are NOT always androgynous. Many, myself included, are not. Pretty much accurate otherwise.
I don't think he meant that literally.. more as a general rule leaning, lol. 4s look how they want. (2 here)
I took it as more of an intellectual androgyny...I'm a 4 - no mistaking my physical gender, but I do identify the strong feminine qualities of my thinking.
Omg 😳 my son is a seven and absolutely love him. But I always check in on him. So he knows he’s loved and important. Wow 😳
When he talked about the 2. the biggest Image in my mind was Christa/Historia from Aot
I'm a four and I have had a number of people suspect I might be lesbian lol, which I am not...quite interesting. Great lecture, thanks for sharing!
I'm glad I stumbled upon this.. ( thanks for posting them ) a lot of interesting thoughts to ponder discard or agree with.. 👍
Thank you so much for your insightful lecture!
I find it amusing being type 1 with a name that means 'grace'. My parents were originally going to name me something else, but it's as if they received divine inspiration to change my name. Something to live up to. :)
I'm very angry because my well-researched and carefully packaged teachings and advice have been ignored for decades. My example doesn't seem to make a difference. I just don't know what to live for anymore...
Like to know more IYDM.
Type 2, Tied Type 1/4. I am a nurse. I am a Mom. I am a musician by training as well. NAILED IT.
prior to the catch phrase "co-dependent" the condition was referred to as internalized oppression
Oh god he had me at mauve 🙈
I adore Richard. He's just so nice! Lady Havisham was a Four (Dickens character.) LOL
Absolutely riveting!!! 🎉😁✨
Is it possible that threes can be a result of a child realizing very early on that they had a way with words. So they were able to talk their way into or out of anything?
Thats a cool observation
This is wonderful!
I prefer Beatrice Chestnut explanation in that she allows for the knowledge that people can transform their flaws by studying the enneagram.
Did this get cut off or did I miss the section about the four's virtue and core sin? Is that section in another video?
Sin is envy
I'm not familiar with Shakespeare's personal life. But if read some of his stuff & both Romeo and Hamlet strike me as definite 4s.
& often when the protags in an author's various works are samey across different genre's, that's the author's own personality showing through
I think what people are mistaking when he says “4’s are androgynous(even though I am a 4 and physically present androgynous as well) is that we are morally gray and are able to see from multiple perspectives. We don’t go by gender norms because we don’t want to fit it. Unless a 4 wants to express themselves in a certain way, you can’t force us to fit inside “the blue for boys, pink for girls,” stereotypes.
His mentions about gay people are interesting
18:34 you tend to not others with your same number
1:40:47 Four break through; they’re still creative but don’t force it
I am glad to be 7 😂😂😂, but i am sad to say i always want more of everything. And most of people are too boring for me.
The hindu philosophy of advaita vedanta particularly the BMI chart explanation complements it as before introduction explanation Swami Chinmayananda got a good explanation Dr David daniels got the interpersonal neurobiology as a biological perspective instincts and stuffs
for real, richard rohr
i love this
It's pretty cool
If the 9 is who we all once were then the 6 is who we all are now. Lol.
You would think that if Giorgivanic -Mr. Gurdjieff had thought that anything about types could be extracted from the engram, or the law governing he-line-of-the-flow-of-forces-constantly-deflectingaccording-to-law-and-uniting-again-at-its-ends, " he would have said so but he does *Not*
Please check out Midwest Christian Outreach as well as Fr Mitch Pacwa regarding the origins and history of the enneagram. If you are a Christian, please research the enneagram origins as well as how Rohr’s theology do not line up with Biblical/historical Christianity
I think my type is 1 with 9...I"m a real barrel of laughs.
2's are Yandere's, I love em
Me 2.
If you'd like some additional content that is highly detailed:
TYPE ONE: ua-cam.com/video/PNTi3KfNZUE/v-deo.html
TYPE TWO: ua-cam.com/video/vGfrzzvWebE/v-deo.html
TYPE THREE: ua-cam.com/video/IwAHPR6wcmo/v-deo.html
TYPE FOUR: ua-cam.com/video/V8H22OLdWwQ/v-deo.html
I am 1 and all he says is totally me. Being an only child who is 1 makes you 1 to the nth degree.
Yes thank you!! I'm a one and I've been trying to find my wing. Even my husband (type 9) agrees with me, I'm a 1w1 but I'm also an only child so now it makes sense 😂
@@Zimoria You know, it is a hard life. Always being secretly critical, yet very loyal to significant others. Still, it is what it is.
The dream of most Threes is to become a One.
Great :))) thank you soooooo much!
I am to a T.....a 1😅💜🪞⚖️
And these symbols 💜🪞⚖️ are my daily symbols 🤭😆
"we're just terrible, really"...
Yep😂💜
Wale is an example of an unhealthy 4 I feel
4 starts at 1:29
Enneagram can be a powerful (and dangerous) device in order to manipulate people? I mean, if you use the “right” words speaking with different types (for example he mentioned the word need with the type 2) you can open a lot of doors?
Brazil is sure a mix of 2s and 7s
Is this the 2nd video? It seems to start in the middle of a session.
Yes this is part 2 of 4. Part 1 is called: The Discernment of Spirits (Introduction)
It appears to me that I was a 4w5 as a teenager, but now I am fully a 5w4. Is this possible?
Yes. We grow.
2Tim4:3-4 :
"For the time will come when people will not tolerate sound doctrine
but, following their own desires and insatiable curiosity,
will accumulate teachers and will stop listening to the truth
and will be diverted to myths."
😃♥️🎶
This the best scripture share I may have heard 😆 THANK YOU
Can 4s be falsely be diagnosed as bipolar?
I wonder that too
wondering
My mother tried to make me a 2. It took years to recognize that I’m not.
Did they really need to bass boost this nigga drinking water
My dog is a 2
And codependent people
His description of the artist type borders on caricature or parody. A shallow view indeed.
so this is what he actually looks like
I’m a six and I love 7s they are highly attractive to me.
What’s the virtue of the nine?
I'm a sloth but I don't look like one LOL vanity.. I have been a sinner for as long as I can remember. Repenting in the name of Yeshua is a great idea.
Functional Fanatics
The Father calls you a son, and a saint, don’t perpetuate and justify your thinking and actions by that identity! You are a son, a slave to righteousness, and amazing. You are never called that by the Father, just by religion. I used to think that way and so I remained that way, it’s liberating to be free from it! You should ask the father who and what you are! It’s amazing door to freedom and the kingdom. You’re a saint and your presence is powerful and peaceful to others
naranjo admitted he got the types from automatic writing. wake up!
I can see the opposite (or virtue) side of eight of the nine sins as Richard explains it, but how is “decisive action” a virtue (for 9s) when so many cruel, harmful (sinful) actions can be done decisively?
There is good and bad decisive action.
Good decisive action is for example when you decide to Read the Bible every day for 30min and you end up reading it, no matter if you are tired, sleepy or there are more fun things to do. In short - it's the virtue of making good and thought trough decisions and being constant in them.
Thanks!
How many are left in this neonatzi world that attest to know; or can even identify with the greatest of all Spirits?