Blackmagic URSA Mini G2 vs ARRI Amira
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- Опубліковано 24 лип 2024
- Today we are taking a look at the Blackmagic URSA Mini Pro G2 vs the ARRI Amira. Can the URSA Mini at $6,000 take on the Amira at $45,000?! Let's find out!
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Jay P. Morgan has been working as a Commercial Photographer and Film Director in the Los Angeles area for more than 20 years developing an impressive list of clients from Paramount to McDonald's. Jay P.'s experience with elaborate set design and extensive lighting are key to the success of his illustrative work.
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You can't compare the DR without pulling down the highlights in post otherwise you are compare their default curve not the DR of the sensor. Also the LUT is going to mess it up as well. You should use the resolve color management to transform the data instead.
Exactly! I used a 6k poket in raw.. one shot was accidentally blown out.. I was able to change the iso in resolve from 800 to 100 and have everything back! That’s where I would been curious to see how they compared...
Please upload in 4K, there's nothing we can see here with UA-cam crushing the IQ with the 1080 compression... That makes no sense comparing that kind of cameras in HD :(
its not about the high definition details, its about color science.
@@SyedOsama1 youtube still compresses that data more in 1080p. They reserve a higher bitrate for higher resolutions ._.
In the final skin tone test, the color charts have different tints, as if you forgot to match it on the NLE. I'm a bit dubitative, then.
On the garden and concrete wall test, the shadows show it was taken as different times of the day. This affects totall the texture renditions of the concrete wall, and the contrasts.
Can you guys do a comparison with the Kinefinity Mavo LF vs. Alexa? Those cameras don't get a lot of exposure.
Did you have the G2 shoot BRAW and adjust within Resolve?
It would be interesting to give this material to color grading pro. I’m curious if he could match ursa to amira and get the famous arri look.
It is pretty easy to do actually. If you shoot the same color chart under the same lighting conditions with the same settings and lenses etc... all you need to do is to match the tone curve first and then the colors. You can then save it as a powergrade or as a lut to use it on your projects. I actually learned that on Dado Valentic's course last week. We just matched Arri Alexa to D50 film negative. Pretty cool.
Hi, can you share the files? Thank you.
As a multiple amira owner, I'm impressed with the G2. Mixed the cameras this week on a project and now considering adding a G2 to the inventory. Great test thank you.
Oh amazing! So gear to hear your perspective. Yes it's truly impressive how the G2 held up beside the Amira! Thanks for watching and commenting. :)
Did you use any form of IR cut on the blackmagic? Because the warmth you are talking about looks a lot like IR contamination, which Blackmagic camera's are quite sensitive to. This is probably also why the greens look a bit muddy.
No we did not. Thanks for watching.
Surely you should have uploaded this test in 4k?! Everyone knows how bad youtubes compression is especially in HD!
is it me are are the highlights a little blown out on the Ursa G2? (comparisons at the top of the video)
They may be a little blown out, but grading makes a huge difference.
Great video JP, what lenses did you use for this comparison? In the G2 image, the model had a slimmer look and I bet it was due to the lens that you used. I also like the warmth of the colors in the G2 and the price tag was much better as well. Great comparison.
Leica R lenses. I believe our focal lengths were 35mm and 50mm?
what camera was used in the the video from 0:00 to 1:11 to record you 3 talking
I would guess that is was the Canon C200.
Used the G2 on the feature Redwood massacre : Annihilation . low light is impressive .
that's cool man! Glad to here that people are using the Ursa for feature films. Were you guys shooting in raw?
@@ericellsworth9852 Braw ! Yes
The Dark Within (2019) (Ursa) from the same guys from Redwood.
Stand! (2019) Ursa + BMPCC 4K
@@mirosilv0 I worked on the Dark within as well . I'll check out Stand! bmp4k for a feature is interesting to me personally .
GREAT JOB!!!!!! FANTASTIC! THANK YOU!!!
Thank you so much! :)
what camera did you use to shoot this video?
They used a gopro hero 3
What about a comparison with these two cameras and the 'new' Canon C300 mkII? Just wondering. Hi JP.
Hi Ed! Hmmmm now there's an idea! Thanks so much.
I owned a C300 II for about 2 years. It's a nice enough camera, but I feel like the C200 shooting raw has a much nicer image with better colors and less noise. It's also a lot more user-friendly with the interface.
Clipping the blacks in this video.
I love the ursa for its quality and price
BMPCC4K was so yesterday. It's all about that sweet BMPCC6KEF now. But the 4K with Speedboosters would actually add some interest.😁
Dammit you're so right.
chris monk ursa 12k now 💪🏾
Amazing comparation!
Soy Albert thanks!
What lenses were used?
Good question. That is a questions for Kenneth.
I don't think people quite understand how important dynamic range is. If you don't have a budget to reshoot go with the Arri!
I don't really get the importance of the vast dynamic range. You should know how to set the camera settings. I think if you over/under expose by so many stops, you should really stop...
Great video! Arri is just the best
Thanks Dan! It's an incredible camera for sure!
Blackmagic just announced a new 6K pocket camera. No prisoner!
12K. Still no prisoner!
why do'nt u guys go 4K?
I want to see this comparison between the Blackmagic 12K and the Amira.
Nice idea! I have added that to our list. Thanks!
Straight forward. Well done guys.
Unreal that you guys didn't shoot the same scene with both Cameras at the same time... Must of been a huge oversight. Also, I'd love to see more details on lens, camera settings, etc.
Plus the raw footage would be nice to see... No one knows what you did in post with these clips...
On the underexposed test, the depth of field is completely different on both Cameras... You guys didn't keep a constant f-stop on both Cameras? Did you use the internal NDs, why is the DOF so wide on the Ursa and on the Amira it never changed?
I know these test aren't easy to do, I appreciate your video just some thoughts I'd love to see more details and trying to keep things as controlled as possible in this kind of environment is key to really comparing images under the exact same conditions.
The color of ursa mini pro g2 is the main issues, green is so warm and blue is a bit light.
How i wish this video was uploaded in 4k.
on the subject, the Amira have better colors but the price tag, hard choice.
Quetzalcoalt how do you think the other Blackmagic models will do in the coming videos?
@@TheSlantedLens The Amira will have better colors and dynamic range than the BMPCC4k but one costs like 10 times lower.
The C200 will be crushed by the ursa mini pro g2. The C200 will have the best AF but if you are going to shoot mostly cinema lenses the AF goes out. Dunno about the color science, but that might go out if the Ursa mini has a LUT to match it.
Can't wait to see if i'm right :P
Love those guys but why they forgot to give some details about, used codecs, and work flows. Did you use BRAW or prores? I suppose that it was ProREs. What about the (ACES? or LOG to log transitions? / space transitions? IT really matter). I got G2 for two months and BRAW is just another world compering to ProRes this is like 2d/3d change. ISO on G2 using BRAW is just metadata that you can easly change in raw tab in resolve. Any way Overexpose test shows the price point difrences 6K vs 45K rest is subjective and color grading dependent, Thanks for test! Guys!
I believe we did talk about it, but it was probably cut from the video for length. We shot raw on all the cameras except the Amira, which we shot in ProRes 4444XQ.
I'm surprised you shot two separate sequences, one for each camera, rather than running both cameras on the same scene. At 4:40, for example, looking at the shadow on the ground, we can see that a fair amount of time has passed from one setup to the next. The sun has moved, which changes the lighting on the back wall. But the reviewers were comparing the lighting as though the cameras shot the same scene. They did not.
I'm also surprised that they're discussing the colour saturation of the images -- they are using some form of colour mapping, perhaps slog, and each camera will have their own setup. You need a LUT to translate that to a standard colour set. Comparing the raw camera colour saturation is a meaningless comparison since those colour spaces make all the difference.
Good video, long overdue...Mostly subjective, with some notable picture/sensor nods to the Amira, BUT the cost difference cannot justify.
Thank you Phil! Glad you enjoyed the video. How do you think the other Blackmagic models will do in the coming videos?
How can it not justify the price. ? If you shoot commercial movie with high budget, the color rendition and tonal curve in over expose area in very important and i see there is a difference that is noticeable. I would never made use of that difference since i shoot mostly small project.... so blackmagic for me.
That extra bump in image quality the Amira has certainly makes it worth it for most high end productions, but the BIGGEST thing you’re paying for with Arri products is the reliability, consistency, and ease of use for DP’s that have an established workflow with Arri cameras. That’s worth it’s weight in gold when you’re dealing with big budget projects.
For everyone else, it probably doesn’t make sense.
@@kennethcmerrill Do people still use Avid workstations for editing? When I worked in post, that is what we used. But its been years. Maybe in the hardware there is something that keeps Arri chipping away, but I would think by now there would be at least a few options. Technology and price is only suppressed by those that control the tech and the market, so once that bubble bursts you will have things be more available like the Blackmagic and other makes...But it maybe a contracting market?...Or at least less US based? I am speculating, but tech in a open market only gets cheaper, and faster. Some elements of production can cost more in resources, but this too is often replaced with other materials as tech grows.
@@joelgermain1988 This is true. If the budget is there. There was a study made that if you are recording at 120 to 300(it was around this speed) the brain is more likely to register this as a reality. So I think there will be more tech going towards this in marketing use to convince people of footage to be reality for more sales. I can see camera tech go towards faster speeds and higher frames.
Around minute 10 the Ursa Mini Pro G2 turns out to be at least the funnier camera of both. ;)
Get the Ursa Mini 2 and save yourself $33k. Image quality is extremely similar, both have pros and cons, but the biggest con is $33k price difference. Ursa Mini wins here by a mile. Thank you Blackmagic for giving us an amazing camera.
Yes, that is a lot of difference in price.
You gotta make a third video for the new pocket 6k now too!
Pcoket 6k?
Yeah, Black Magic just announced it.
Same body ish (Lens mount)
S35
Dual Iso
50fps raw
EF mount
$2400
@@NeverlandProductions damn thats crazy! Kinda like the z cam s6
Man, it's hard to keep up! Maybe we'll do a Pocket 6K vs Red Gemini test.
@@kennethcmerrill YES! That seems like what their target was too.
G2 for me! they both are fire little more definition on bm
A great video:)
Thank you so much!
They mentioned that at 400 ASA because it’s under the 800ASA native of both cameras you lose dynamic range but that isn’t true. The dynamic range is consistent across the whole EI range, though the amount of overexposure above/below middle gray is shifted down or up depending on the ASA rating.
That is a great observation. I should test that.
Appreciate it. You two are good duo.
Thanks so much! It was a fun video to make. More coming soon! :)
@@TheSlantedLensHello, If I were to use the Black Magic and had approximately $10,000 to spend on lenses....what would your thoughts be. I was looking at using an 85mm and a 50mm and/or potentially going with a telephoto lens. Wasn't sure if I would be better off going with the telephoto lens or buying multiple lenses. Could I pair the Sony FE telephoto lens (Sony FE 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 GM) with this Black Magic Mini? Or, what do you guys think? What would be a good lens option(s) to pair with the Black Magic? I really value your expertise. Thanks for any input you can give me.
@@cvg9142 No Sony mirrorless lenses will fit this camera, as the flange is too deep, and I don't think they'll adapt. For glass you have two options: stay with the M4/3 format or adapt S35/FF glass using a Metabones speed booster. If you want to keep it small and compact, M4/3 is the way to go, and I think the best option out there are the Veydra Mini Primes. If you want to future-proof your lenses a bit because you're not going to shoot M4/3 forever, then for under $10K I recommend Leica R lenses or Zeiss Contax lenses. They're vintage glass, but you can't beat the quality, and I see Cinemoded sets floating around all the time.
@@kennethcmerrill thanks a lot. I'll research these.
Very similar, most of the difference can be sorted With a good grade
Very true. That is why Blackmagic has done so well.
Great video, butt the Blackmagic grading looks desaturated to me by about 10%...
The arri just had more punch to the color.
That first comparison of image quality really makes you understand the appeal of Arri cameras. The colors just are on a completely other level, stunningly beautiful.
Yes, the color is amazing. Thanks for your comment!
I thought Arri Amira was the girl's name. Hahahhahahahhahahahha!
Haha! Hilarious! :D
@@TheSlantedLens Hey guys great video! I'm a colorist out in LA and am trying to match the g2 to the arri and was wondering if you could send me screenshots of the g2 log if you still had it from that day. If you end up reading this please send the screenshot to bozduke@gmail.com and I will send you the conversion in return :)
WOW.
Arri is another world ..
it's a pity what you tube posting does to your tests when we view them the colour shifts are there but the noise and other artefacts ,at least om my screens, are not as obvious as ,I think, what you guys are seeing.
Alistair Barclay yeah UA-cam compression makes presenting these tests somewhat difficult, especially when it comes to noise.
The Amira put out a better image overall, but not so much so to justify the higher (much higher,) cost. Also given the fact the Bm G2 has better frame rates, I think renders the choice as academic... for most.
Sensor Readout is impressively faster on the Amira, as color separation, making VFX workflow far easier, giving the image more 3 dimensionality. But this test doesn't really shows the strengths of the Amira.
ursa looks like it has a slight green tinge throughout the image, but pretty good for the money
Arri noise looks like Film Grain, That's there secret... But how can we Trick our Affordable cameras into having Film Grain noise?
Apply it is post. Thanks for watching!
I don't think the color grade gave the camera's a very fair comparison. Grade on the Ursa looks pretty muddied and makes the camera look crunchy and overly contrasty.
Maybe that is what the camera is compared to the Amira?
such a cute model!
Thanks for watching and keep on clickin!
In the intro when one was announced as $6k and the other $45k the girl just keep looking at the $45k camera and pays little attention to the $6k.
LOL. Maybe she was trying to figure out why it cost so much!
G2 is worth every penny! Thanks guys!!
Totally agree! It's an incredible camera. What do you typically use it for/shoot?
@@TheSlantedLens C300MII & C100MII, been big Canon fan for a long time until G2 came out. Color beats Canon in my opinion.
Arri always wins these comparisons.
Uploaded in HD, wtf?
Sorry we do everything in 4K now.
I don't understand why people still talk about Native ISOs with these cameras. Changing the ISO on both these cameras is just digitally setting the middle grey point higher and lower in the same way you would do in a grade. It doesn't actually effect dynamic range.
That being said, when you do a test where you increase the ISO and stop down the lens to compensate or lower the ISO and open the lens, you'll see the image getting noisier in the former and clipped highlights in the latter. That has nothing to do with the ISO though and everything to do with the fact that you're just underexposing the sensor in the former and overexposing in the latter.
With these cameras, the best way to make the best use of the dynamic range is to expose so that the highlights are just below clipping and then either lower the "ISO" in camera or bring down the exposure in post.
Thanks for commenting Mark. You're absolutely right, though if you're not shooting a raw format, then the ISO setting on your camera matters a lot more--the image on the Amira at 3200 ISO should be cleaner than the one that is pushed from 800 to 3200.
But yes, for the cleanest imagery, best practice is to let as much light onto your sensor as possible and ISO-down when you can.
@@kennethcmerrill Ah I think I might have missed any mention that you were shooting ProRes and just assumed RAW. My bad.
@@myownfriend23 The Amira CAN shoot raw as of last year, but I don't feel like forking out $5000 to do it! (Arri charges stupid money for their licenses)
if these videos were not placed side by side....no one would ever, say...well just look at that wash, or...well you see the green is more green on that one
the price difference alone is reason enough why the Ursa Mini Pro is more than enough
Good point. Thanks for sharing your thoughts!
That should be Blackmagic's motto: "We aint the best but we're good enough!"
German Engineering for the win
Yep, they are pretty great engineers.
cameras are 4k and you guys uploaded 1080 lol
Thanks for watching and keep on clickin!
The colors are too saturated on the blackmagic and edges are sharper. Everything is too defined. I prefer the softer image of the Arri. Ursa has a more sepia tone to the skin as well. Also the model looks like one of my exes.
LOL. Then maybe you are a bit biased!
So your doing a UMP G2 without it's major selling point BRAW.
BRAW is a lighter codec than ProRes 4444 XQ (I hope you used this?????) and gives atleast 1/2 a stop extra and with highlight recovery in DR you can get an extra 1/2 a stop, I suspect you used FCPX instead of DR to process the pictures. Convert both pictures to Full-HD and you will see that the UMP G2 (with BRAW Q0)has more dynamic range than the AMIRA at it's best settings.
When you don't see the difference in sharpness between UHD from the UMP G2 and the AMIRA, it might be time to buy a new monitor or have a visit to the oculist.
With both camera's having about the same sensor size I noticed a rather large different DoF between them, did you use the same lense with the same settings on both camera's (otherwise the test is kind of useless).
Would love to see that you provide more info on how you test in the description below the video.
@Andrew Wang ARRI AMIRA has 13.1 stops at a SNR=2 at 2k/Full-HD
UMP G1 has 12.6 stops at a SNR=2 at 4k/UHD > ~13.6 stops at 2k/UHD (see note*)
UMP G1 has 13 stops at a SNR=2 at 4k/UHD with highlight recovery in Resolve > ~14 stops at a SNR=2 at 2k/Full-HD.
Measured values are form Cinema5D measured under the same conditions by the same people.
Note*:
By downscaling (or averaging) four pixels of an 3840×2160 image to 1 pixel of an 1920×1080 image the signal value should stay very much the same, but the noise value will reduce because noise is random (uncorrelated), hence averaging (or in mathematical terms the root mean square value of noise which is measured in the recorded image) scales with the inverse square root of the number of samples that we average.
Hence 4 pixels into 1 gives a factor of two (sqrt(4)=2) higher signal to noise (SNR) ratio. Higher signal to noise ratio for a given luminance = higher dynamic range.
So downscaling from 4k to 2k gives you 1 stop of dynamic range (dynamic range/lattitude = Signal to noise ratio).
Hey Misha. We DID shoot BRAW on the Blackmagic camera. We DID use the same exact lens on each camera with the same aperture settings for each shot. The difference in FOV is actually more than I expected between the two cameras, and so there was some adjustment for distance in order to get roughly the same frame, which accounts for the change in DOF.
I have never seen an example of any model of Ursa Mini outperforming the Alexa/Amira cameras in dynamic range, but if you can show me a test to prove it, I will happily capitulate!
Oh, also we DID use Resolve to grade the images.
@@kennethcmerrill Cinema5D
ARRI AMIRA has 13.1 stops at a SNR=2 at 2k/Full-HD
UMP G1 has 12.6 stops at a SNR=2 at 4k/UHD > ~13.6 stops at 2k/UHD (see note*)
UMP G1 has 13 stops at a SNR=2 at 4k/UHD with highlight recovery in Resolve > ~14 stops at a SNR=2 at 2k/Full-HD.
This was with the G1, I don't know if the G2 is better in measurements, but what I've seen so far, it's seems a bit better.
AMIRA(3200 x 1800) sensor is smaller than the ALEXA(3424 x 2202) sensor
Misha Engel calm down dude. They shot in raw and amira in pro res. The pictures don’t lie. The Amira did a better job in DR.
That chick just looks at these guys like tf u talkin about xd
ARRI looks far better. URSA looks digital. I have an URSA it’s fantastic for the price but the morie and magenta cast is sickly. It needs a nice buttery OLPF like ARRI use.
The whole time I was saying "WHY DIDN'T YOU ADD A ROLL OFF!"
Should have done the highlight roll off, which is what the ARRI is known for.
That was the +EV tests, and the Arri was excellent
It's visible in the over exposure test.. and the Amira destroys. But the Ursa does in general do quite well in a controlled environment.
I mean straight away you can see why the Amria is £35k more but with some creative lighting and make up to deal with the way the Ursa renders skin tones and the specular highlights, add in some sensor tweaking and then into Resolve to fix any issues and you are absolutely in the ball park for a shit load less money. I'm using a G2 for everything atm and I'm very happy with it. Funny as this comparison looks more like the G1 and G2 compared. The G2 is very much more forgiving on skin and highlights but clearly not as much as the Amira.
There’s like more depth in the amira
Yeah, the colors are richer. Thanks for your comment!
Commentary sounds like the photographer's description rather cinematographer's. There is a huge difference between Arri Amira and Blackmagic's footage as a cinematographer. There is no comparison. I see the huge difference in light, color and image rendering by both cameras. Arri Amira image looks beautiful, soft and even on the face that's what we look from a cinema camera though we can produce a similar image from URSA by adjusting light and using some filters, without that , Amira wins any day.
girl from "Tomiris"
Not sure. You will have to check the credits.
@@TheSlantedLens Aizhan Lighg
girl from movie "The Legend of Tomiris"
this test is so DUMB presented in 1080 (with UA-cam Compression) only !!! ...
I thought he was joking when he said JP morgan ......
Nope, I guess my parents have a sense of humor.
I'll stick with the URSA Mini Pro...
Thanks for sharing your opinion!
@@TheSlantedLens It is not an opinion though... it is a fact. :-)
i dont care cameras cause that girl :-)
Depressing. The Amira looks so much better.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts!
Hahahaahhaha.
I think that says it all ....😂
So, there is a lot of grief in the comments section for this video... I think that the reason has more to do with the approach than the actual utility.
Most reviews get the best image possible or at least a solid image out of the nicer camera and try to emulate it on the lesser camera. It’s a negotiation... and it’s easy on the eyes.
This comparison is an INTERROGATION of both cameras; how they perform in poor conditions... The very first exterior shot(yellow top/blue pants) looked good on the Amira, otherwise there’s not a truly pleasing image for the rest of the video in my opinion. There’s poor exposure, harsh lighting(over-exposed sunlight or studio lights on her forehead), video-esque contrast, poor white balance...
This is useful content for critique but our lizard brain just screams “Thanks. I hate it.”
It was a highly informative video on the subject of what these cameras AREN’T capable of, rather than show what they ARE capable of.
I think the reception of this video would have been extremely positive if at some point they had shown some great looking footage from both cameras... to show how great they can look too, rather than only how easily one can break the image.
I’m still greatly appreciative. If I worked for blackmagic however, I would probably be jumping up and down, screaming at the computer monitor 😂
Lots of good points. Thanks for sharing your viewpoint.
black magic's color is much more beautiful
Yellows on Amira look desaturated.
Or, Yellows on the Blackmagic look oversaturated.
Yes, it was really interesting seeing the side by side of these two comparing how each prefers certain colors.
@@TheSlantedLens I wonder why the yellows are so different. The other colors look similar.
Not a very scientific test.
More based on a good eye and art.
Please don't compare ..Lion with rabbit...Arri is good enough...
Broadcasted and payed by ARRI - for sure!! Obviously ARRI employees. Anyway, of course Amira is a little better. No wonder - it costs 3x or even more than G2
Cope
Too expensive both.
Yep. Photography is an expensive career or hobby!