I've always found the arguments or pros for a voiced protag so interesting bc most ppl will say it gives better immersion. For me it's very much the opposite (with most of these points discussed in your vid) Whenever I play a rpg I want to be able to play as me (except now I'm a cool knight or mage and 10 cm taller lmao) so having them speak with a different voice than the one I play out in my head, and not to mention they can have vastly different line delivery than me, just disrupts that immersion for me Idk if it's because whenever I read books I play stuff out in my mind like a film a lot, and I can hear the characters voices in my head clearly so I apply that when playing a silent protag. I think the protag from Origins is my fav due to the lines you could pick for them, it's essentially like reading a book and I read their lines out loud in my head and then I get to hear the npc's reply to that. I just like a blank slate I can insert myself into
That's fair! I used to always play characters as myself, though nowadays I also really enjoy making a whole new character. I do usually give them a personality that's similar to mine, or pick choices that are similar to what I would pick, but they do have their own motivations for things. Plus I love making backstories for them haha. I do the same thing as you when reading books and playing a silent protag so even though I prefer voiced, I totally see where you're coming from!
@Lisa plays Games I can relate to that too! I think I just mostly prefer to play as myself on a first run and then I'll play around more on a second one now that I went through most of the emotional impact of the plot etc. It's fun to come up with characters esp. within the "confines" of a fantasy setting you really enjoy and find interesting, and then I think I wouldn't mind a voiced character that much. :) I love these kinda discussions you bring up and love to see more of these sort of conversation starters for DA/Bioware content (or other content if that's what you'd like to do ^^ )
@@vampyren13 I noticed that my first runs in a game are also pretty close to what I would do even if I'm not necessarily playing as myself, but I think that's because, while I still try to keep my choices in-character, I kinda go with whatever feels right in the moment. It's a lot of fun to make characters with a stronger/more defined personality for playthroughs after that, I've been doing that for the Dragon Age games and I've been having a lot of fun with it! Planning on doing a semi-evil run at some point, let's see if I manage to do so without feeling bad for hurting fictional characters feelings xD (I hate being mean to my companions haha) Glad to hear that! I'm definitely planning on making more of these when I find another interesting topic 😄
@Lisa plays Games Gah yeah that's a tough one :c I once tried to do that too where my chara was trying to think of things as "logical" as possible and do some terrible things "for the greater good" sort of, it's easier that way instead of just going with "evil" bc that can get a bit boring eventually because it's not as engaging I guess? Good luck xD
I voiced the warden in my DAO playthrough. it was fun and gave me a lot more confidence speaking in my videos, it also improved my skills reading aloud.
I'd like to add a point to Immersion-breaking for voiced protagonist: emotional inconsistency. If you have multiple dialog options in a conversation, some of them might have an emotional delivery. But then, the conversation will loop back into the main tree and the delivery will be neutral again. It's not a very widespread problem in my experience and they tend to save the really emotional things that would stand out for conversation enders but it is something I've noticed before. I prefer voiced protagonists because it's less reading with my poor eyesight. However, in Dragon Age specifically, I am most attached to my canon Warden because I was able to project a lot more of what I wanted into him. Not to say that I don't like the other two but my attachment to them is somewhat less. These discussions are a good idea. Always nice to see how other people come to their conclusions.
That's a good point, yeah! And thank you, I really enjoy talking about topics like this one and I love reading the comments and seeing what everyone else thinks
i just finished dragon age origins and loved it so much. silent protagonist (in rpgs only) will always be better because of having more dialogue options. with voice its more immersive but you are more limited. my favorite rpgs are dragon age vampire bloodlines fallout elder scrolls because of this. i hope this troupe never dies out. voices work for games like witcher and cyberpunk because they are more action than role playing.
I want to mold my character. I came from your lenear vs open world video and I love sandboxes. By that I mean "here is the game, here are the rules and here are your tools, go nuts". By default I love open world games, but that also applies to some linear games like old school shooters, Star Wars Jedi Knight series, Dark Messiah of Might and Magic and 90% of strategy genre. Voiced characters can be tolerated on two conditions: 1. Character was always voiced and had personality 2. Doesn't interfere with my perception of character. I don't mind Hawke, Shepard or Geralt having a voice because I had influence on them and it was made clear that those are not 100% my characters from the very start or Prince from Prince of Persia, BJ Blazko or Ezio that was made clear that those are not my characters and I am here to to see what they will do and I am just here to help. but I hated Issac Clarck and Corvo Attano (if I choose to play as him) speaking. In Dead Space 2 multiple times I got annoyed and wanted to say something along the line "what part of silent protagonist you don't understand", but I will admit that I loved his mind battle with Nicole and those scenes were possible because Issac had a voice so I assume that is a price I am forced to pay. That said, I also remember in KotOR1 that I was annoyed how in the end you were railroaded into "do you want to go light side and accept new identity or go to the dark side and return to Revan identity". My charcter was still silent protagonist, but I could feel control getting slipped out of my grasp and almost hear his voice comming out of his motionless mouths. Same thing also happened in Jade Empire. KotOR2 is even worse, but in this specific case protagonist is ment to have certain opinions and act in certain way. You are allowed to alter slightly your background in meaningless way, but in the end your character is so railroaded and have his own mind it may as well be voiced protagonist. To be fair I would probably use KotOR2 as an example how not to write a video game. There is also a game called Raji: An Epic Tale. It is a beautiful and fun platformer with Hindu Mythology at its focus. This is a good example where to use voice acting and where not. Raji is established character with her own personality. But she never says anything interesting and sometimes it is annoying when she breaks the moment by speaking for no reason. The problem is that despite camera always being distant, her animations speak everything that needs to be said without uttering a single word. Meanwhile two Gods that are guiding her say everything that needs to be said and it is entertaining how they are watching. They are doubting her, encouraging her, debating, it's like they are watching a movie. So in other words if player character needs to be voiced, that character also needs to have something interesting to say and not be voiced for the sake of being voiced. Personally I just love silent protagonist. You said you are not attached to your character, but I beg to differ. I am far more attached to my characters from The Elder Scrolls to the point when you say Nerevarine, I always remember my Orc Warrior. Same thing applies in World of Warcraft where you are one of many and ocatiotally tagging along with actual main characters witnessing key events. My Night Elf Druid who I made canon in my head found her true calling in Nature and abondened the Priesthood at first opportunity was far better then that annoying brat John Walker from Spec Ops the Line or whatever the hell protagonist from Dark Messiah of Might and Magic was sopouse to be. And don't get me started on Strelok who is whatever you want him to be and the only time he is voiced is at the very end and it always reflects what you truly are.
I loved the way The Secret World/Secret World Legends implemented their silent main character, with NPCs constantly commenting/joking about it and even sometimes breaking 4th wall to joke about the silent protagonist.
I loved Origins and the silent protagonist because I was used to that from games like Baldur's Gate. But once I got a voiced protagonist I think it added to the story immersion for me, especially if you have a stellar voice actor who can put so much emotion behind the voice (looking at you Jennifer Hale!). Going forward I also think it best to have a voiced protagonist, but do like how Inquisition did it with at least 2 options for male and female characters.
Yeah Jennifer Hale is such a good voice actor. I agree, I'm hoping they'll have different voice options for Dreadwolf, though I wouldn't mind if they didn't.
personally, I rarely tend to project myself into my characters, at least not very far past sharing my views / morals. So when i play a game with a silent character, I dont find myself stepping into their shoes, I just see them as a quiet person. which i mean, I am. but its not the same lol. I definitely prefer stories where they make a more defined protagonist that i am simply imparting part of myself, because i believe its a good medium space that still gives me agency, but enables the devs to craft the experience around me better. I feel we havent really seen anything of the warden since the first games because it would be too hard to implement them in a way that isnt generic and distant enough that it can encapsulate all different wardens. I'm glad hawke showed up in DAI, and that we can customize an inky for DATV, though I wish they would lean into returning characters more than they have. but yeah, i enjoy listening to a voiced performance vs a quiet gap in dialogue haha
Cool Intro btw. I'll try to not just repeat good reasons you mentioned for choosing either as a preference. It's gonna be difficult, you listed pretty much all I could think of. The deciding factor for me is wealth of choice: Companies are more likely to give me more and more nuanced options if they don't need to pay both the writers and a VA for all the lines. It does really depend on how much the character is supposed to stand on their own though. As you said, some, like Geralt or Adam Jensen, have their own "core" personality no matter how you play them, and if that is the intention, a voice adds much to that. But if the aim is for the player to have many (different) options in how they roleplay, it seems no voice has more advantages. The "empty shell" is actually one of those, as long as options are given, with which the player can fill it. Maybe, if devs were willing to spend a fortune giving me 5+ completely different types of voices, where one of them could really fit the fantasy of my character, I'd change my mind in such a case, but that is just unlikely to happen. Also, two observations: In the case of Dragon Age, I barely remember any specific line the protagonist spoke in DA2 or DA:I. All the memorable moments for me related to voice acting come from other characters. Choices and their reactions matter to me, not the voiceline expressing the choice. As you described, I usually vaguely imagine the tone and delivery of a particular interesting or cool line before I choose it too, so at best it fits with that, at worst I am disappointed. The latter is worse than the former is positive. Secondly, it seems to me sometimes the lack of a voice adds to the gravitas of the situation or the characters answering you. It becomes more about them, I guess. My mind immediately went to Kreia from Kotor 2, whose lessons and lectures would have been less impactful or mysterious, if disrupted by a voice and not just text. I suppose it might be the other way around in a particularly emotional scene, but again, that has a danger of failing to live up to what the player imagines it to be. Do I want the characters to talk to me, with my character only being a proxy for that, or do I want them to be someone else entirely?
Thank you! 😃 Yeah the silent protagonist definitely has a lot of advantages when it comes to roleplaying a character, the more/more nuanced options are an example of that. And as you said, as long as there are options for the player a complete blank slate is good. I didn't mention it in my video, but what I had in mind when I said ''empty shell'' are characters like Link from the Legend of Zelda, or the pokemon trainer you play in any of the pokemon games. NPCs talk to them all the time, though they never reply apart from the occasional ''Yes/No'', which can cause someone to feel disconnected from the character, cause they don't really feel like a character. They're just... there. (Then again to be fair, you could argue that in Pokemon it's not really about the character anyway, and more about the gameplay (x ) The voiced dialogue option being different from what was presented to you on the dialogue wheel happened a lot in DAI. I didn't mind it as much but it could be annoying sometimes. I hope this is something they change/improve on for the next game.
@@LisaLynnsTavern Now that you mentions that idea of the "empty shell", there is another series of popular RPGs that do that, and it's TES. As much as I liked the world building, lore and exploration in those games, they have barely any choices for roleplaying. Somehow my Skyrim character is the leader of all the guilds and has served all the daedra, yet it was always just "YES/NO", if anything. That would be a good example where at least I struggled to get attached to my characters.
@@DeutscherDummer Hahah yeah, Skyrim is good at some things, and not so good at others. Skyrim was the first big open world rpg that I ever played so I used to love it. ..And then I started playing Dragon Age (': I still like Skyrim, I just think Dragon Age does a lot of things better in terms of narrative and characters. (specifically the characters) It's been a while since I played it, but I think I would probably also feel less attached to my character as compared to some other games.
The big advantage with the voiced protagonist is that the main character is apart of the story rather than a voiceless character. Because the developers can make the mechanics and choices around a curated character. It makes it more meaningful.
@@flunkyballs4610 I would argue those stories would have been better if they had been voiced. If they are so their own then it doesn't make sense for them to be silent.
Great video! I feel like you laid out the pros and cons very well. Also, this got featured in my home recommended, and I'm happy it did. I seriously have no preference either way, but there are some games I've played before that I feel could also not be changed at all. Origins would not be Origins with a voiced protagonist, DA2 would not be the same with Hawke being silent. Mass Effect would also not be the same if Shepard wasn't voiced. Inquisition is more debatable, but I like it the way it is personally. Honestly, the decision of whether or not a protagonist being voiced should be based around the design of the gameplay and world. For example, if the writers want there to be a lot of dialogue for the player to choose from and focus heavily on the RPG elements, then the main character probably shouldn't be voiced. However, I would absolutely love to see some game developer implement the best of both worlds despite how expensive it may be. My biggest problem with silent protagonists honestly come from how they're used in games over in Japan. They'll just do a silent protagonist for literally any character, even if the game isn't an RPG but still story based. While these games can be really really good, the lack of voice acting for characters the player barely gets to control (at least in terms of dialogue), is kinda annoying.
Thank you, I appreciate that! 😄 About the best of both worlds, I'm kind of hoping Larian will do that for Baldur's Gate 3. As of right now in the Early Access, the character is silent for dialogue options with occasional voice lines when you click on them, or when specific things happen. They are silent in cutscenes, for the most part. There is one cutscene in particular where they actually have a few fully voiced lines. Not dialogue options though, it's more like they're thinking out loud or making a comment on what they just saw. One of the senior writers at Larian said that custom protagonists would be fully voiced in an AMA a few years ago. We haven't heard anything about it since, so idk if this is actually the case, but one can dream xD
@@LisaLynnsTavern I desperately hope BG3 will have a voiced protagonist. It just feels so weird with how cinematic the cutscenes are with a voiceless protagonist.
Depends for me. Since if I pick something that sounds like it's the way I want it to go but then they say something completely not the way I meant it to be....
Interesting intro and nice topic for a video. Well done! I personally prefer a voiced protagonist, because the character does not only have a stronger personality but i think it is also easier to remember certain dialuoges. For example the dialoge option where FemHawke says "I have been stung by a bee." is one of the funniest in the game and this scene would have never been that good with a silent Hawke.
Thank you! Happy that you pointed out my intro, it took some time but I enjoyed working on it a lot and I love how it turned out haha. Oh yeah that's definitely true, if the delivery of the voice line is well done it can have a great impact. The ''stung by a bee'' line is hilarious, love how dramatic Hawke is there xD
If the voice is well done, I enjoy voice acted protagonists, I definitely agree on the investment point, maybe biased cause of how well the story is done in da that I get real invested lol but good video, all these points are very good Always call him a royal bastard with the best intentions, because he deserves to get a bit of sarcasm to match his own
I would like to add one think you missed. When characters are voiced there are less substantive conversations. Because of cost except in situations of critical exposition conversation and with important personages tends to be short affirmations or abundant one liners, quips limited the ability to explore side characters and express important questions that aren't relevant to the direction the games is leading you. Because of desire to reduce cost the world can feel like a place where everyone exists to service you because every fluff question you ask represents more expense. People exist to give you quests and reward you but have little existence outside of that creating less realistic universes. I find I can explore the world better through a silent protagonist which makes the experience more exciting.
to me its pretty simple. if the character im playing is premade in the story then i prefer the character to be voiced. if the character is someone im creating in character creation, i prefer the character to be silent so im voicing him/her.
Thank you! I didn't use any mods or anything, so everything about her is all from the vanilla game. Anything specific you want to know? (Like Vallaslin, armor, etc)
@@konstantinchufistov1828 Yeah, only the Dalish get Vallaslin! Though, it would be possible to see a city Elf with Vallaslin if they used to be Dalish, but chose to live with the city Elves instead. (Like Merrill!)
I personaly usually dont like voiced protagonists in my RPG"s (depending on the game of course). In game where you have a lot of control over dialogue and actions i prefer unvoiced, i have a strong imagination and like to imagine how my character would sound. When i hear a voice or dont have the option to choose a fitting voice it cam take me out sometimes. (You actually talked about this lul). However if a game is less choice heavy i prefer a fully voiced character. If theres less room to RP and make your own story why not make them fully voiced.
It was reaaaaaaly hard for me to get used to the silent protagonist in DA:O along with the fact that everyone keep calling you "warden" which felt super dehumanizing to me. It was theese two things that made my Warden feel like some alien and not a human so im really glad that is likely never to return.
Honestly- since I'm playing an RPG. I want to "role play" as a another character. Since I have no interest in playing as myself- I love a voice protagonist. They have so much more personality and weight in a story. Being silent just makes it feel like you're just.... There.
I prefer voiced protagonists, especially in a games like Mass Effect or Dragon Age. But in games like The Elder Scrolls I’m good with having silent ones. Maybe it’s because there aren’t cutscenes in Elder Scrolls games that the pacing and immersion isn’t affected too much for me.
If they are going to do a remake of DA:O, I'd love a voiced Hero of Ferelden. Imo in narrative-based games is more immersive to have voiced protagonists. I'm sorry but listening to Alistair's/ecc.. rants for 20 minutes was so tedious for me, even in my first playthrough. I also started skipping dialogues, because of the slow pacing. I got used to it after a while, but still, I'm not a fan of some DA:O mechanics, especially since I played it in 2020 and not just after the first release.
It's immersion breaking for me for the camera to pan on my character when they are supposed to be talking yet nothing comes out. There's also the lack of expression themselves. I don't mind mute protagonists for Skyrim or games where it doesn't zoom so much on the character (tho Far Cry 5 actually made me mad with how they handled the protagonist). It's why I'm fine with both Fallout NV and Fallout 4 protagonist. And yes, it's my main issue with the Warden and why I put the Warden behind Hawke and Inquisitor. I hated those blank looks ugh. I know that 'silent' means more text dialogue but man, don't make me look at those stoney expressions! Give me the first person instead!! This will be again my main issue with Baldur's Gate 3, I really hoped they would add both voiced and silent option during the beta :(
Nice video! I don't mind either protagonists if it's done well and suits with the game, but I prefer voiced one a bit more. IMO silent protagonists should be there only if the number. of dialogue options are many like in DAO. In some games where there are only 2-3 at most then it should be voiced. I found this an issue in Fire Emblem Three Houses where the dialogue options are very minimal and the conversations were very one sided.
I think if you're going to have a voice protag you need a good amount of cohesion between he/ she/ they and the writing team. Nothing breaks immersion more than having to reload a save because what you read in your head either isn't what came out of the VA or the blip dialogue didn't match what the snippet said. I think some games like the new dead space remake could've used a voice as Issac felt so weirdly disconnected. Whereas in big CRPGs I'll read out what's being said so I stay engaged and because the whole line is there in getting the full picture.
persona 4 annoyed me with a silent protag because instead of just letting the protag have a dialogue option or a voice, Yosuke speaks on your behalf a lot. so they didn't even save money on voice actors, they just doubled the amount of lines someone had to be paid to say. I would rather have a voice cuz then the character can at least speak for themselves instead of having other people say things for them that they don't have a choice in saying. even if they're saying things that I feel in the moment, it feels like the game is deciding for me. it made me feel like the protag being there didn't matter if everyone can do everything on their own without them. if they don't have a voice, do they even matter to the plot? why am I here? silent protags feel very...mannequin or robot like. standing there, not saying anything, staring blank at who ever is talking to them. never emoting either weirdly enough.
Personally I did not find much issue in Persona 4 (granted it was annoying when a certain incident happens to the protagonist's family member) since the character emotes occasionally but yes I agree with your points and it would be much better with a voiced one. I guess it depends on the execution and the game as I did not feel that way with DAO but I was annoyed with the silent protagonist in Fire Emblem Three Houses. Overall I think the protagonists should be voiced if they are already molded to have a somewhat defined character and have minimal dialogue options. IMO in games like Elder scrolls and DAO for example, you can be from goody two shoes to absolute evil and it works well with a silent protagonist. But in games like Persona and Fire Emblem where the character is expected to act in certain ways (the game will force you) then the character should be voiced no matter what.
Also voice acting is really done well in DA2,lipsync is still better then in some games from 2020-2023,dont believe me check it,and im one of the few people that really love DA2,it has flaws for sure,but imo its far from being bad game,or deserving so much hate.
Silent protag 100% theres almost always inconsistencies with voiced to the point where i cant even play games in my same language anymore without getting annoyed at the voice acting
There was a pretty large backlash over the weird "internal monologue" from BG3. I agree that it should've been removed but it would've been nice if the player character participated in conversation.
I don't think this will be something that everyone can ever come to agreement on. I like the protagonist of origins, I like the protagonist of Inquisition, but I don't like Hawke All that much. But I know some people LOVE them.
I don't think so either, but that's why this topic makes for an interesting discussion. I love reading/hearing other people's opinions on this kind of stuff 😄
Ultimately, whether the protagonist speaks or not, they're never really your character. They're the programmer's creation. And particularly with Dragon Age, no matter what option you choose, you never quite know what they're going to sound like.
I prefer a voiced protagonist and I think that if a studio has budget voices are better. I think what could really elevate voiced protags more that would be cheap is a tone indicator on your reactions You Bastard! [Angry] You Bastard! [Joyful] You Bastard! [Distressed] stuff like that can be a good way to let you know what that line read is. In a more expensive effort allowing you to choice between a few options of how to feel about things, not just picking how you react but being able to mark feelings and lines changing to those feelings would be an amazing way to effect voice lines. Or picking a personality tied to a voice instead of picking just a voice could also lower dissonance. Obviously for most indie games I don't expect VA and it can be fun to voice act and fun to imagine but when I want to imagine a game, I go and play a TTRPG with my friends and partners.
I've always found the arguments or pros for a voiced protag so interesting bc most ppl will say it gives better immersion. For me it's very much the opposite (with most of these points discussed in your vid)
Whenever I play a rpg I want to be able to play as me (except now I'm a cool knight or mage and 10 cm taller lmao) so having them speak with a different voice than the one I play out in my head, and not to mention they can have vastly different line delivery than me, just disrupts that immersion for me
Idk if it's because whenever I read books I play stuff out in my mind like a film a lot, and I can hear the characters voices in my head clearly so I apply that when playing a silent protag.
I think the protag from Origins is my fav due to the lines you could pick for them, it's essentially like reading a book and I read their lines out loud in my head and then I get to hear the npc's reply to that.
I just like a blank slate I can insert myself into
That's fair!
I used to always play characters as myself, though nowadays I also really enjoy making a whole new character. I do usually give them a personality that's similar to mine, or pick choices that are similar to what I would pick, but they do have their own motivations for things. Plus I love making backstories for them haha.
I do the same thing as you when reading books and playing a silent protag so even though I prefer voiced, I totally see where you're coming from!
@Lisa plays Games I can relate to that too! I think I just mostly prefer to play as myself on a first run and then I'll play around more on a second one now that I went through most of the emotional impact of the plot etc. It's fun to come up with characters esp. within the "confines" of a fantasy setting you really enjoy and find interesting, and then I think I wouldn't mind a voiced character that much. :)
I love these kinda discussions you bring up and love to see more of these sort of conversation starters for DA/Bioware content (or other content if that's what you'd like to do ^^ )
@@vampyren13 I noticed that my first runs in a game are also pretty close to what I would do even if I'm not necessarily playing as myself, but I think that's because, while I still try to keep my choices in-character, I kinda go with whatever feels right in the moment. It's a lot of fun to make characters with a stronger/more defined personality for playthroughs after that, I've been doing that for the Dragon Age games and I've been having a lot of fun with it! Planning on doing a semi-evil run at some point, let's see if I manage to do so without feeling bad for hurting fictional characters feelings xD (I hate being mean to my companions haha)
Glad to hear that! I'm definitely planning on making more of these when I find another interesting topic 😄
@Lisa plays Games Gah yeah that's a tough one :c I once tried to do that too where my chara was trying to think of things as "logical" as possible and do some terrible things "for the greater good" sort of, it's easier that way instead of just going with "evil" bc that can get a bit boring eventually because it's not as engaging I guess? Good luck xD
@@vampyren13 Thank you, haha xD
I voiced the warden in my DAO playthrough. it was fun and gave me a lot more confidence speaking in my videos, it also improved my skills reading aloud.
Nice! I imagine that was a lot of fun to do, too 😄
@@LisaLynnsTavern it was
I'd like to add a point to Immersion-breaking for voiced protagonist: emotional inconsistency. If you have multiple dialog options in a conversation, some of them might have an emotional delivery. But then, the conversation will loop back into the main tree and the delivery will be neutral again. It's not a very widespread problem in my experience and they tend to save the really emotional things that would stand out for conversation enders but it is something I've noticed before.
I prefer voiced protagonists because it's less reading with my poor eyesight. However, in Dragon Age specifically, I am most attached to my canon Warden because I was able to project a lot more of what I wanted into him. Not to say that I don't like the other two but my attachment to them is somewhat less.
These discussions are a good idea. Always nice to see how other people come to their conclusions.
That's a good point, yeah!
And thank you, I really enjoy talking about topics like this one and I love reading the comments and seeing what everyone else thinks
i just finished dragon age origins and loved it so much. silent protagonist (in rpgs only) will always be better because of having more dialogue options. with voice its more immersive but you are more limited. my favorite rpgs are dragon age vampire bloodlines fallout elder scrolls because of this. i hope this troupe never dies out. voices work for games like witcher and cyberpunk because they are more action than role playing.
I want to mold my character. I came from your lenear vs open world video and I love sandboxes. By that I mean "here is the game, here are the rules and here are your tools, go nuts". By default I love open world games, but that also applies to some linear games like old school shooters, Star Wars Jedi Knight series, Dark Messiah of Might and Magic and 90% of strategy genre. Voiced characters can be tolerated on two conditions:
1. Character was always voiced and had personality
2. Doesn't interfere with my perception of character.
I don't mind Hawke, Shepard or Geralt having a voice because I had influence on them and it was made clear that those are not 100% my characters from the very start or Prince from Prince of Persia, BJ Blazko or Ezio that was made clear that those are not my characters and I am here to to see what they will do and I am just here to help. but I hated Issac Clarck and Corvo Attano (if I choose to play as him) speaking. In Dead Space 2 multiple times I got annoyed and wanted to say something along the line "what part of silent protagonist you don't understand", but I will admit that I loved his mind battle with Nicole and those scenes were possible because Issac had a voice so I assume that is a price I am forced to pay. That said, I also remember in KotOR1 that I was annoyed how in the end you were railroaded into "do you want to go light side and accept new identity or go to the dark side and return to Revan identity". My charcter was still silent protagonist, but I could feel control getting slipped out of my grasp and almost hear his voice comming out of his motionless mouths. Same thing also happened in Jade Empire. KotOR2 is even worse, but in this specific case protagonist is ment to have certain opinions and act in certain way. You are allowed to alter slightly your background in meaningless way, but in the end your character is so railroaded and have his own mind it may as well be voiced protagonist. To be fair I would probably use KotOR2 as an example how not to write a video game.
There is also a game called Raji: An Epic Tale. It is a beautiful and fun platformer with Hindu Mythology at its focus. This is a good example where to use voice acting and where not. Raji is established character with her own personality. But she never says anything interesting and sometimes it is annoying when she breaks the moment by speaking for no reason. The problem is that despite camera always being distant, her animations speak everything that needs to be said without uttering a single word. Meanwhile two Gods that are guiding her say everything that needs to be said and it is entertaining how they are watching. They are doubting her, encouraging her, debating, it's like they are watching a movie. So in other words if player character needs to be voiced, that character also needs to have something interesting to say and not be voiced for the sake of being voiced.
Personally I just love silent protagonist. You said you are not attached to your character, but I beg to differ. I am far more attached to my characters from The Elder Scrolls to the point when you say Nerevarine, I always remember my Orc Warrior. Same thing applies in World of Warcraft where you are one of many and ocatiotally tagging along with actual main characters witnessing key events. My Night Elf Druid who I made canon in my head found her true calling in Nature and abondened the Priesthood at first opportunity was far better then that annoying brat John Walker from Spec Ops the Line or whatever the hell protagonist from Dark Messiah of Might and Magic was sopouse to be. And don't get me started on Strelok who is whatever you want him to be and the only time he is voiced is at the very end and it always reflects what you truly are.
I loved the way The Secret World/Secret World Legends implemented their silent main character, with NPCs constantly commenting/joking about it and even sometimes breaking 4th wall to joke about the silent protagonist.
I would rather have a voiced character. Voiced characters seem to have more of a personality, imagine Mass Effect with a silent protagonist.
Yeah Mass Effect would've been very different for sure
Maybe we could play as another species. With more options. And no dialogue wheel.
I thought i liked voiced protagonists untill i played origins skyrim fallout 3 and oblivion last year
Ahh I should really play the older Fallout games some time, I heard they're pretty good
I loved Origins and the silent protagonist because I was used to that from games like Baldur's Gate. But once I got a voiced protagonist I think it added to the story immersion for me, especially if you have a stellar voice actor who can put so much emotion behind the voice (looking at you Jennifer Hale!). Going forward I also think it best to have a voiced protagonist, but do like how Inquisition did it with at least 2 options for male and female characters.
Yeah Jennifer Hale is such a good voice actor.
I agree, I'm hoping they'll have different voice options for Dreadwolf, though I wouldn't mind if they didn't.
It's just a mattert of time until we record our voive and have it synthasized in the gamre. I CAN'T WAIT
That would be pretty cool haha
personally, I rarely tend to project myself into my characters, at least not very far past sharing my views / morals. So when i play a game with a silent character, I dont find myself stepping into their shoes, I just see them as a quiet person. which i mean, I am. but its not the same lol. I definitely prefer stories where they make a more defined protagonist that i am simply imparting part of myself, because i believe its a good medium space that still gives me agency, but enables the devs to craft the experience around me better. I feel we havent really seen anything of the warden since the first games because it would be too hard to implement them in a way that isnt generic and distant enough that it can encapsulate all different wardens. I'm glad hawke showed up in DAI, and that we can customize an inky for DATV, though I wish they would lean into returning characters more than they have. but yeah, i enjoy listening to a voiced performance vs a quiet gap in dialogue haha
Cool Intro btw.
I'll try to not just repeat good reasons you mentioned for choosing either as a preference. It's gonna be difficult, you listed pretty much all I could think of. The deciding factor for me is wealth of choice: Companies are more likely to give me more and more nuanced options if they don't need to pay both the writers and a VA for all the lines. It does really depend on how much the character is supposed to stand on their own though. As you said, some, like Geralt or Adam Jensen, have their own "core" personality no matter how you play them, and if that is the intention, a voice adds much to that. But if the aim is for the player to have many (different) options in how they roleplay, it seems no voice has more advantages. The "empty shell" is actually one of those, as long as options are given, with which the player can fill it. Maybe, if devs were willing to spend a fortune giving me 5+ completely different types of voices, where one of them could really fit the fantasy of my character, I'd change my mind in such a case, but that is just unlikely to happen.
Also, two observations: In the case of Dragon Age, I barely remember any specific line the protagonist spoke in DA2 or DA:I. All the memorable moments for me related to voice acting come from other characters. Choices and their reactions matter to me, not the voiceline expressing the choice. As you described, I usually vaguely imagine the tone and delivery of a particular interesting or cool line before I choose it too, so at best it fits with that, at worst I am disappointed. The latter is worse than the former is positive.
Secondly, it seems to me sometimes the lack of a voice adds to the gravitas of the situation or the characters answering you. It becomes more about them, I guess. My mind immediately went to Kreia from Kotor 2, whose lessons and lectures would have been less impactful or mysterious, if disrupted by a voice and not just text. I suppose it might be the other way around in a particularly emotional scene, but again, that has a danger of failing to live up to what the player imagines it to be. Do I want the characters to talk to me, with my character only being a proxy for that, or do I want them to be someone else entirely?
Thank you! 😃
Yeah the silent protagonist definitely has a lot of advantages when it comes to roleplaying a character, the more/more nuanced options are an example of that. And as you said, as long as there are options for the player a complete blank slate is good. I didn't mention it in my video, but what I had in mind when I said ''empty shell'' are characters like Link from the Legend of Zelda, or the pokemon trainer you play in any of the pokemon games. NPCs talk to them all the time, though they never reply apart from the occasional ''Yes/No'', which can cause someone to feel disconnected from the character, cause they don't really feel like a character. They're just... there. (Then again to be fair, you could argue that in Pokemon it's not really about the character anyway, and more about the gameplay (x )
The voiced dialogue option being different from what was presented to you on the dialogue wheel happened a lot in DAI. I didn't mind it as much but it could be annoying sometimes. I hope this is something they change/improve on for the next game.
@@LisaLynnsTavern Now that you mentions that idea of the "empty shell", there is another series of popular RPGs that do that, and it's TES. As much as I liked the world building, lore and exploration in those games, they have barely any choices for roleplaying. Somehow my Skyrim character is the leader of all the guilds and has served all the daedra, yet it was always just "YES/NO", if anything. That would be a good example where at least I struggled to get attached to my characters.
@@DeutscherDummer Hahah yeah, Skyrim is good at some things, and not so good at others. Skyrim was the first big open world rpg that I ever played so I used to love it. ..And then I started playing Dragon Age (': I still like Skyrim, I just think Dragon Age does a lot of things better in terms of narrative and characters. (specifically the characters) It's been a while since I played it, but I think I would probably also feel less attached to my character as compared to some other games.
The big advantage with the voiced protagonist is that the main character is apart of the story rather than a voiceless character. Because the developers can make the mechanics and choices around a curated character. It makes it more meaningful.
That doesn't matter if the protagonist is voiced or not. Play Planescape Torment or Disco Elysium for example.
@@flunkyballs4610 I would argue those stories would have been better if they had been voiced. If they are so their own then it doesn't make sense for them to be silent.
Great video! I feel like you laid out the pros and cons very well. Also, this got featured in my home recommended, and I'm happy it did.
I seriously have no preference either way, but there are some games I've played before that I feel could also not be changed at all. Origins would not be Origins with a voiced protagonist, DA2 would not be the same with Hawke being silent. Mass Effect would also not be the same if Shepard wasn't voiced. Inquisition is more debatable, but I like it the way it is personally.
Honestly, the decision of whether or not a protagonist being voiced should be based around the design of the gameplay and world. For example, if the writers want there to be a lot of dialogue for the player to choose from and focus heavily on the RPG elements, then the main character probably shouldn't be voiced. However, I would absolutely love to see some game developer implement the best of both worlds despite how expensive it may be.
My biggest problem with silent protagonists honestly come from how they're used in games over in Japan. They'll just do a silent protagonist for literally any character, even if the game isn't an RPG but still story based. While these games can be really really good, the lack of voice acting for characters the player barely gets to control (at least in terms of dialogue), is kinda annoying.
Thank you, I appreciate that! 😄
About the best of both worlds, I'm kind of hoping Larian will do that for Baldur's Gate 3. As of right now in the Early Access, the character is silent for dialogue options with occasional voice lines when you click on them, or when specific things happen. They are silent in cutscenes, for the most part. There is one cutscene in particular where they actually have a few fully voiced lines. Not dialogue options though, it's more like they're thinking out loud or making a comment on what they just saw. One of the senior writers at Larian said that custom protagonists would be fully voiced in an AMA a few years ago. We haven't heard anything about it since, so idk if this is actually the case, but one can dream xD
@@LisaLynnsTavern I desperately hope BG3 will have a voiced protagonist. It just feels so weird with how cinematic the cutscenes are with a voiceless protagonist.
Depends for me. Since if I pick something that sounds like it's the way I want it to go but then they say something completely not the way I meant it to be....
Yep, that happened in Dragon Age Inquisition a lot. I didn't mind it that much but it could be annoying sometimes
Interesting intro and nice topic for a video. Well done!
I personally prefer a voiced protagonist, because the character does not only have a stronger personality but i think it is also easier to remember certain dialuoges. For example the dialoge option where FemHawke says "I have been stung by a bee." is one of the funniest in the game and this scene would have never been that good with a silent Hawke.
Thank you! Happy that you pointed out my intro, it took some time but I enjoyed working on it a lot and I love how it turned out haha.
Oh yeah that's definitely true, if the delivery of the voice line is well done it can have a great impact. The ''stung by a bee'' line is hilarious, love how dramatic Hawke is there xD
If the voice is well done, I enjoy voice acted protagonists, I definitely agree on the investment point, maybe biased cause of how well the story is done in da that I get real invested lol but good video, all these points are very good
Always call him a royal bastard with the best intentions, because he deserves to get a bit of sarcasm to match his own
Thank you!
And yeahhh true hahaha
I would like to add one think you missed. When characters are voiced there are less substantive conversations. Because of cost except in situations of critical exposition conversation and with important personages tends to be short affirmations or abundant one liners, quips limited the ability to explore side characters and express important questions that aren't relevant to the direction the games is leading you. Because of desire to reduce cost the world can feel like a place where everyone exists to service you because every fluff question you ask represents more expense. People exist to give you quests and reward you but have little existence outside of that creating less realistic universes.
I find I can explore the world better through a silent protagonist which makes the experience more exciting.
I prefer silent prot for the versatility, but I'm not really bothered by a voiced protagonist
to me its pretty simple.
if the character im playing is premade in the story then i prefer the character to be voiced.
if the character is someone im creating in character creation, i prefer the character to be silent so im voicing him/her.
Voiced protagonist for sure ! Your Lavellan looks so cool, how did you make her ?
Thank you! I didn't use any mods or anything, so everything about her is all from the vanilla game. Anything specific you want to know? (Like Vallaslin, armor, etc)
@@LisaLynnsTavern character creation video would be great, if it's possible of course)
@@LisaLynnsTavern also what do you think about Vallaslin and city elf , I mean that it's only for Dalish right ?
@@konstantinchufistov1828 Maybe one day! Might do that if I'm ever doing a Let's play or a playthrough on stream
@@konstantinchufistov1828 Yeah, only the Dalish get Vallaslin! Though, it would be possible to see a city Elf with Vallaslin if they used to be Dalish, but chose to live with the city Elves instead. (Like Merrill!)
I personaly usually dont like voiced protagonists in my RPG"s (depending on the game of course). In game where you have a lot of control over dialogue and actions i prefer unvoiced, i have a strong imagination and like to imagine how my character would sound. When i hear a voice or dont have the option to choose a fitting voice it cam take me out sometimes. (You actually talked about this lul). However if a game is less choice heavy i prefer a fully voiced character. If theres less room to RP and make your own story why not make them fully voiced.
It was reaaaaaaly hard for me to get used to the silent protagonist in DA:O along with the fact that everyone keep calling you "warden" which felt super dehumanizing to me. It was theese two things that made my Warden feel like some alien and not a human so im really glad that is likely never to return.
Honestly- since I'm playing an RPG. I want to "role play" as a another character. Since I have no interest in playing as myself- I love a voice protagonist. They have so much more personality and weight in a story. Being silent just makes it feel like you're just.... There.
I prefer voiced protagonists, especially in a games like Mass Effect or Dragon Age. But in games like The Elder Scrolls I’m good with having silent ones.
Maybe it’s because there aren’t cutscenes in Elder Scrolls games that the pacing and immersion isn’t affected too much for me.
That's a good point actually!
If they are going to do a remake of DA:O, I'd love a voiced Hero of Ferelden. Imo in narrative-based games is more immersive to have voiced protagonists.
I'm sorry but listening to Alistair's/ecc.. rants for 20 minutes was so tedious for me, even in my first playthrough. I also started skipping dialogues, because of the slow pacing. I got used to it after a while, but still, I'm not a fan of some DA:O mechanics, especially since I played it in 2020 and not just after the first release.
It's immersion breaking for me for the camera to pan on my character when they are supposed to be talking yet nothing comes out. There's also the lack of expression themselves. I don't mind mute protagonists for Skyrim or games where it doesn't zoom so much on the character (tho Far Cry 5 actually made me mad with how they handled the protagonist). It's why I'm fine with both Fallout NV and Fallout 4 protagonist. And yes, it's my main issue with the Warden and why I put the Warden behind Hawke and Inquisitor. I hated those blank looks ugh. I know that 'silent' means more text dialogue but man, don't make me look at those stoney expressions! Give me the first person instead!!
This will be again my main issue with Baldur's Gate 3, I really hoped they would add both voiced and silent option during the beta :(
Both are great
Silent is old school. But I prefer a voiced character. As long as there’s more than 2 voice options 😂
Nice video! I don't mind either protagonists if it's done well and suits with the game, but I prefer voiced one a bit more.
IMO silent protagonists should be there only if the number. of dialogue options are many like in DAO. In some games where there are only 2-3 at most then it should be voiced. I found this an issue in Fire Emblem Three Houses where the dialogue options are very minimal and the conversations were very one sided.
Thank you!
And yeah, I agree.
I think if you're going to have a voice protag you need a good amount of cohesion between he/ she/ they and the writing team. Nothing breaks immersion more than having to reload a save because what you read in your head either isn't what came out of the VA or the blip dialogue didn't match what the snippet said. I think some games like the new dead space remake could've used a voice as Issac felt so weirdly disconnected. Whereas in big CRPGs I'll read out what's being said so I stay engaged and because the whole line is there in getting the full picture.
persona 4 annoyed me with a silent protag because instead of just letting the protag have a dialogue option or a voice, Yosuke speaks on your behalf a lot.
so they didn't even save money on voice actors, they just doubled the amount of lines someone had to be paid to say.
I would rather have a voice cuz then the character can at least speak for themselves instead of having other people say things for them that they don't have a choice in saying.
even if they're saying things that I feel in the moment, it feels like the game is deciding for me.
it made me feel like the protag being there didn't matter if everyone can do everything on their own without them.
if they don't have a voice, do they even matter to the plot? why am I here?
silent protags feel very...mannequin or robot like. standing there, not saying anything, staring blank at who ever is talking to them. never emoting either weirdly enough.
Personally I did not find much issue in Persona 4 (granted it was annoying when a certain incident happens to the protagonist's family member) since the character emotes occasionally but yes I agree with your points and it would be much better with a voiced one.
I guess it depends on the execution and the game as I did not feel that way with DAO but I was annoyed with the silent protagonist in Fire Emblem Three Houses.
Overall I think the protagonists should be voiced if they are already molded to have a somewhat defined character and have minimal dialogue options.
IMO in games like Elder scrolls and DAO for example, you can be from goody two shoes to absolute evil and it works well with a silent protagonist. But in games like Persona and Fire Emblem where the character is expected to act in certain ways (the game will force you) then the character should be voiced no matter what.
I preffer voice acting, like in DA2 where picking dialogues molded the characters personality.
Also voice acting is really done well in DA2,lipsync is still better then in some games from 2020-2023,dont believe me check it,and im one of the few people that really love DA2,it has flaws for sure,but imo its far from being bad game,or deserving so much hate.
That's a great way to do it yeah
Silent protag 100% theres almost always inconsistencies with voiced to the point where i cant even play games in my same language anymore without getting annoyed at the voice acting
There was a pretty large backlash over the weird "internal monologue" from BG3. I agree that it should've been removed but it would've been nice if the player character participated in conversation.
Silent protagonist is traditionally speaking a low-skill developer cope that holds little water in the age of voice synthesization.
I don't think this will be something that everyone can ever come to agreement on. I like the protagonist of origins, I like the protagonist of Inquisition, but I don't like Hawke All that much. But I know some people LOVE them.
I don't think so either, but that's why this topic makes for an interesting discussion. I love reading/hearing other people's opinions on this kind of stuff 😄
So you romanced steph in LiS
Yep! 😁
A voiced protagonist delivers emotional depth and immersive story telling to the average gamer.
Ultimately, whether the protagonist speaks or not, they're never really your character. They're the programmer's creation. And particularly with Dragon Age, no matter what option you choose, you never quite know what they're going to sound like.
Except for Origin ;)
Yeah if DAO had voices protagonist it would have been 10/10.
I prefer a voiced protagonist and I think that if a studio has budget voices are better. I think what could really elevate voiced protags more that would be cheap is a tone indicator on your reactions
You Bastard! [Angry]
You Bastard! [Joyful]
You Bastard! [Distressed]
stuff like that can be a good way to let you know what that line read is. In a more expensive effort allowing you to choice between a few options of how to feel about things, not just picking how you react but being able to mark feelings and lines changing to those feelings would be an amazing way to effect voice lines. Or picking a personality tied to a voice instead of picking just a voice could also lower dissonance.
Obviously for most indie games I don't expect VA and it can be fun to voice act and fun to imagine but when I want to imagine a game, I go and play a TTRPG with my friends and partners.