@@RDR911 Most of her shorts are indeed pretty meh and Pat definitely shines the brightest but I do think both Clayton and Simone put out inspired, interesting stuff.
This gets me thinking. What the hell was he supposed to do then? Push Ali around? Try to toss a 100+ kilogram peak human being to the other side of the ring? With those rules, he was kind of destined to lose
It's been years since I first watched Pat's "How to get started with fighting games and have a nice time". I'm now watching this video with countless hours in Street Fighter, Guilty Gear, and now over 100 in Tekken 8 since its release in January, and I can confidently say that I am having a Nice Time with fighting games. Thanks, Pat!
Pat's insight into any random thing is always what I want. It's not just that he's a nerd who can't shut up about punch and kick, he has a particularly stark talent for finding important perspectives to consider things through.
Tekken is also positively weird in it's gameplay and game mechanics. It's unfair, inconsistent, untraditional, and bold in many ways, but in a fun and intelligent way. Tekken is a prime example why having a game director who actually invented and cares about the game is so important. He knows what's good.
harada repeatedly has stated that the kind of rollback netcode 2d fighting games have is impossible for 3d fighting games. meanwhile, u can play tekken online on fightcade. also harada is supposedly the reason why the women in tekken's playable cast all have a identical bodytype (compared to street fighter having characters like Marisa)
@@AuntBibby who cares about body type in a video game any way? especially in a video game where everyone is roided out of their mind in the first place.
@@FGCfoof really? maybe I haven't played enough to make the distinction but it doesn't seem to bother me at least for now, I'll definitely keep it in mind. And yea King especially this time around beefed even more so then others up lmao his physique is godly.
Inoki's iconic performance would go on to inspire Tekken 8's Xiaoyu and her too low almost non existent hitbox, way to show your inspiration, Harada and team
Dont forget the parry. Forward parry like reina did and the low parry that straight up flip the enemy with one of the best sound effect that just trigger kreygasm easily and chained into combo
This had me thinking about all the times in Elden Ring when a boss laid me out on my ass with a heavy attack and it occurred to me that it would be safer to stay on the ground while they whiffed a long, sweeping attack instead of trying to early-dodge out off the ground and back into their sword.
Patrick is so so good. I legit picked up tekken 3 because I was a taekwondo practitioner when I was young and hwoawrang made it look so cool. Brings a tear to me wee little eye to hear Pat describe it so concisely. Not to mention the yoshimitsus and bears on the roster. Lol.
I kept wondering throughout the video "where is he going with this" but now I understand, Tekken is a beautiful game to watch in motion with all it's mixed fighting styles
Man, the first 30 seconds have me HOOKED, Pat. I'm still a sucker for style vs. style competitions even though it's kinda bogus. The thing that has always been neatest about MMA is when unique discernable styles clash and we get to see the fun interactions. The unique real fighters who remain like Kyoji Horiguchi are true treasures.
That lying down technique kinda reminds me of how weird it was fighting Nishitani Homare in Yakuza 0. He would pretend to fall over, and then slither around on the ground trying to stab you in the ankles and just generally try to psyche you out by making really horny gestures.
As a fighting game non-fan, Tekken has consistently been the only fighting game that I love to watch. I'm not even interested in Street Fighter matches, pro or no. But I'll ravenously watch ANY video of people playing Tekken. It's the only one that looks like a fight, with all the chaos & weird hit box fuckery that makes two flailing bodies fun to watch.
surprisingly, ufc nowadays still has fighters that specialise in a certain discipline stephen 'wonderboy' thompson somehow manages to win fights doing pure karate, and it looks like how it would in a movie same with israel adesanya, he basically does kickboxing only max holloway essentially does boxing
pat i started to play fighting games right when ur video on how to play them and have a nice time came out. I don't know if i would have stuck with them without ur video but now they are basically all i play thank u for that
I can't get enough of your fighting game videos, Pat! You bring such a passionate energy to the FGC, and each video has opened my heart to more reasons to love fighting games. I can definitively say "How to get started with Fighting Games and have a Nice Time" reignited my love for a genre I may not have returned to. Now I understand there is a bond of brotherhood that can only be understood by two Potemkin mains that both just whiffed a HPB. I hope you stream Tekken 8 soon, I would love to download your King Ghost!
Lovely video. I think SoulCalibur does a similar job at attending to our teenage fantasy scenarios: "Who would win, a Samurai or a Knight? Or a guy with a long stick?"
Funny story: An MMA had a guy with no limbs (well, just elbows and knees) fight a full-bodied opponent. The opponent couldn't get to him because he was way too low, was really fast, and none of his grabs could work. He just stood up and tried hitting him by punching downwards like Ali did with Aoki but now, instead of a guy just laying on the ground kicking you, poor dude had someone who was hypermobile on the floor. Most people chalked it up to dude having to hesitate because he didn't want to beat up a guy with no arms or legs but, if you ask me, it just showed how MMA has never really addressed any of the weaknesses of the arts that it's founded on but rather just used one martial art to bandaid the flaws of another. Which makes me think that games like Tekken should have characters with disabilities based off of real life disabled fighters as often their disabilities not only allow them to (rather paradoxically) circumvent the weaknesses of the arts they practice but expose weaknesses in other arts simply by virtue of them not being accounted for.
Always love a Pat video, especially on fighting games. Tekken's not only incredible for its homages to real martial arts, but is equally fascinating with its game systems compared to other fighting games. The Rock-paper-scissors with side-stepping, ducking, backdashing, and using evasive manoeuvres in general is so different from the much cleaner and calculated precise spacing and frame data of Street Fighter, while at the same time offering some of the most difficult but incredibly satisfying execution out of any fighting game. I love street fighter for its simple to understand, extremely hard to master formulas, but it doesn't outshine Tekken when it comes to how expressive a player is able to be.
Tekken will always be the game where I feel like Jet Li in Kiss of the Dragon. Specifically the scene where he fights some twins and one of them is a really good kickboxer. Jet adjusts mid fight to make the kickboxer only box him. It’s a fun movie! Great job with this video!
Polygon, this is an awesome breakdown of why Tekken reigns supreme!" The historical context you provided was truly insightful. And that "I am always sliding" quote from Segal? Pure gold! 😃
Thank you pat for another great fighting game video! I actually just got back into trying out FG since playing Soul Caliber and Tekken on my PSP back in my high school days. I love to see breakdowns like this and this was a wonderful insight into the mechanics and history of sport and games.
This video put my thoughts into beautiful, beautiful words. Id like to add one thing, growing up, I saw traditional martial arts as a cultural icon that represented different regions. Every nation has a flag, some variation of a dumpling, and a martial art. Which made me all the more excited to see Azucena announced because id get to see Peru represented not only by name but through the Rumi Maki inspirations in her fighting.
Street fighter player here: tekken is currently the most technically sophisticated fighting game out there. It takes more skill to win a tekken match against a high level player than is required by any other game & by a long shot.
Pat never change, love we got people like you in these big companies. Your passion is inspiring and you’re an excellent representative for the FGC to casuals
Tekken 7 and 8 also lean into the hype of those wierd interactions with the slowdown that happens sometimes when two moves approach each other when one or both players are near to a ko
I'm not even joking when I tell you that I've gotten people to whiff entire strings because I just stayed on the ground. All the way from 1st Dan to Tekken King the 1st Dan will think you're gonna get up immediately because that's what they've been doing and it usually works for them because low ranks are aggressive on wakeup and the Tekken King will underestimate you, thinking that you're a low rank that's aggressive on wakeup kinda funny how that works out lol Sometimes just doing *nothing* can completely throw off your opponent's timing
12:06 - tell about Smash Bros what you want: it IS the best fighting game out there and it HAS the best hitboxes, even if they feel weird sometimes... They're WAY more accurate than what's shown here...
Tekken is a game that 18 years old me can play with a Grizzly bear who knows mishima style karate againt his 48 years old uncle who plays the bruce lee character and having a blast with it
MMA has its specific context and circumstances which, in a competitive environment, impose selection pressures upon the participants that inevitably result in fair bit of convergent evolution. Back when people trained and fought to kill or die, though, you actually had a remarkable degree of variety within the practical boundaries imposed by human biomechanics and the available tools of offence and defence. ("Breaking fists on helmets is dumb" for ex.) People had some pretty pressing reasons to try and find ways to go about things better than the other guy, after all, and there were generally many ways to go about skinning any particular tactical cat when the only rule that actually applied was "do unto others before they do unto you".
This was really interesting, thanks Pat. I've always considered the more martial arts-y fighting games to be a bit uninteresting compared to the character variety in Soul Calibur & Smash Bros, but this really opened my eyes to what makes them special.
Patrick glad to see you're still enjoying Tekken and sad to see you're still a King main (derogatory). I hope I never run into you online and you have a great day! :)
I was disappointed that Pat didn't show Bryan or Devil Jin's soccer kicks in the segment where he talks about getting folks off the ground. That shit is brutal hahaha.
This is a fantastic piece. You might be among the very last people getting paid by a media outlet to do real work related to MMA journalism, actually. It's a field that's been almost entirely gutted at this point. All of those writers I followed for their excellent work (None of which still hold a position for a media outlet) would love this video.
I've got some thoughts I wanna share here, as a martial arts nerd and someone who really wants to like Tekken. This is gonna be a long comment, so read on at your peril. The shorter part first: I really, really wish I liked Tekken, and if anyone can give me some advice on how to start, I'd love to hear it. My problem is the long combos. In IRL martial arts as well as action and fighting games, the thing that really appeals to me is the back-and-forth nature of things, with short exchanges where each person has a chance to get their shots in, but there's usually a clear winner in a given exchange. In most fighting games, though, the fact that juggling and combos exist means that a poorly executed exchange can mean spending the next few seconds just getting combo'd into oblivion and losing a big chunk of your health bar, and nowhere is that more the case than in Tekken. The fact that being a good Tekken player means getting good at finding your moment to completely lock your opponent out of the game for a few seconds just doesn't sit right to me. Am I looking at this wrong, or is Tekken just not the game for me? And, secondly: as a martial arts nerd, I think it's really important to recognise the two things, in my mind, that the early UFC really taught us. First, there's no Japanese, English or Thai fighting, same as how there's no Canadian geometry. Different cultures have developed different approaches, but fundamentally, fighting is fighting, wherever you are. Lots of people, myself included until recently, want to find the Secret Fighting Techniques that traditional martial arts hold, but recently, I've come to believe that traditional martial arts, in the cases where they arise from genuine fighting traditions, are just different ways of teaching the overarching skill of fighting. Some place more emphasis on different aspects of fighting, but in the end, physics is physics and biomechanics are biomechanics. Take taiji, for instance: lots of practitioners and fans want it to be a revolutionary fighting style that teaches the art of striking and throwing with no strength required. In reality, I subscribe to the notion that the motions in taiji forms are mostly a way to use oral tradition to pass down fairly basic wrestling techniques, with some striking thrown in there for good measure. You still need strength and conditioning to make taiji work. Fighting is fighting. The second thing that the UFC taught us is that if you don't fight, you can't fight. A lot of people took from the early UFC days the lesson that traditional martial arts Don't Work, but I think what it really showed is that some traditional martial arts in the modern day tend to produce people who can't fight because the schools of that art don't generally spar or otherwise use their techniques against resisting opponents, they just practice their forms and do compliant drilling and assume that their training will come to the fore when push comes to shove. What we saw from the people who fell apart under the pressure of UFC 1 was what happens when people who've never had the experience of fighting against real resistance are suddenly thrust into a no-holds-barred tournament. I think we're starting to see a point in the combat sports world where some traditional martial arts are waking up, rediscovering the actual fighting applications of the forms that they've passed down and returning to the combat sports scene. Lyoto Machida and Stephen Thompson are doing it with karate, a few South East Asian fighters seem to be doing it with wushu in ONE Championship, and I for one really hope that we're gonna see it with a few kung fu styles really soon. Qi La La is doing interesting things with wing chun, and who knows, maybe I'll find someone who's doing it with my beloved xingyi sometime soon.
As far as combos go in tekken they are only a factor in higher levels of play. In low to intermediate levels combos aren't that long. Scoring a combo in tekken is the equivalent of scoring a knockdown in MMA. Your opponent has made a big mistake and now it's your turn to wail on them for a bit. When they get up from the combo it's their turn to flip the script or you can continue to use your momentum to go at them further. Ultimately you won't know unless you try, Tekken 8 has a free demo so try it for yourself if the core gameplay is something you like
@@shaghilathar3588 thanks for replying! I played some Tekken 7, so my opinion doesn't come from complete inexperience, though I admit combos weren't as long as I was worried they'd be. Maybe I'll give that demo a try :)
I think this is partially why Tekken has such a wide casual appeal. The sandbox-y nature and the what-if fights make it fun for everyone. Like playing a Dragonball game to settle your debate about which character is stronger when we were kids
As much as I appreciate having the answer to anything available all the time, I do sometimes miss that golden age of schoolyard ignorance. That's where myths gestate, the maybe-space between a hard fact someone heard somewhere and the sixth or seventh retelling. And when those myths prove true - when you *do* meet Missingno and wind up with infinite rare candies, when that guy *did* shoot his father in the head with a crossbow at the public library - that just lends credence to the entire dreamy affair, bedazzling that infinite uncertainty with sparks of possibility; making imagination, if but for a second, touchable, actual.
I'm really surprised you didn't bring up DOA at all. Especially since harada openly talked about how they were more direct competitors over Street fighter and other fighters
Thank You for voicing out one of the reasons I like Tekken! Laying on the ground for as long as you want! Never in my wildest thoughts I thought that some other soul loves this about Tekken let alone a content creator. Apart from the martial arts aspect, I've loved the input scheme of Tekken, the default of which is the most intuitive of all fighting games in my opinion. 2D fighters have fighters switch limbs when they change sides, & Virtua Fighter has open & closed stances which changes limbs. But Tekken? No matter which side of the screen a character is, the move comes out with the same limb & the attacks are readable in both cases. The default input scheme of Tekken makes it intuitive to figure out a substantial number of moves. For instance if a character has a string of down 1,2; most probably that character will bend down & then hit his left & right punches respectively. For me, Tekken is the ultimate martial arts fantasy !!!
I know this is kind of beside the point, but the reason Tekken is my favourite fighting game is that, in my opinion, it strikes the best balance between intuitiveness and complexity. Low skill floor, high ceiling.
I always find myself in that thumbnail situation when playing vs King as Steve lol. Takes me a while till I remember I can just stomp him or knuckle plow
I've tried so many fighting games and always have been bugged by the inability to choose how, or if, I want my character to stand up. It feels like such a simple thing coming from Tekken as my main game, but I use it in such ways that I can't train myself not to. Street Fighter and I think Mortal Kombat allow you to delay wake ups, but you can't just lay there. Tekken 8 has changed the system a bit to encourage player to get to back to neutral, but I'm still able to shut down my opponents offense with a toe kick, or even just laying there. It's always great to see someone whiffing moves cause they don't know their characters ground hitting attacks.
As a kid i played alot of traditional fighting games but they were kinda hard and complicated, but tekken was very simple and my child brain could understand that 'keep guy floating = good' also mashing buttons felt like bullets and it was so satisfying to just rob someone's turn using what sounded like a shotgun shot😂
Tekken is the reason I now believe I can take on a bear with my triangle hands.
Isn't this a bot that copied another comment?
"Joined 20 Feb 2024", 20 random subscribers without videos, 'Videos' linked to another website in the about...
Yeah, idk, must be real human
Polygon is crazy for liking a butt bot comment.
@@niklasw.1297 Hey, a robot fighting a bear is very Tekken
This is basically exactly what I want from a fighting game video
Hey I know you
omg king
Do a video on why tekken slaps hard right in the dick and balls area.
*Video-Essay master has entered the chat* @JacobGeller
*Nodding* Pat Gill.😊
Seeing the title: oh yeah, that's a Pat video for sure.
Only videos worth watching on the channel anymore. They’re trying too hard to make that tiktok UA-cam shorts chick BDG again.
so glad this is a universal experience
@@RDR911 Most of her shorts are indeed pretty meh and Pat definitely shines the brightest but I do think both Clayton and Simone put out inspired, interesting stuff.
@@Goatmaster-ek8rq I too have a fondness for britalist architecture so I always enjoy a Simone video
Inoki did that, because he wasn't allowed tackle and throw Ali.
So since that was out of the picture, he resorted to laying on the fucking ground lol.
Probably couldn't do leg and ankle locks either, otherwise that fight would be over pretty fast.
This gets me thinking. What the hell was he supposed to do then? Push Ali around? Try to toss a 100+ kilogram peak human being to the other side of the ring? With those rules, he was kind of destined to lose
@@m0j026 apparently lose then
One of my favourite Tekken facts is that Minoru Suzuki, a pro wrestling legend and super scary tough guy, did the mocap for King in the early games.
He also choked Harada
I think I learned that from a Pat video…
Whoa that is crazy I had no idea . Thank you for sharing this 🙏🏾
KAZE NI NARE
Pat will consistently get me to go. "Hmm, I wanna play that" with a game or genre I have never touched.
You should
It's been years since I first watched Pat's "How to get started with fighting games and have a nice time". I'm now watching this video with countless hours in Street Fighter, Guilty Gear, and now over 100 in Tekken 8 since its release in January, and I can confidently say that I am having a Nice Time with fighting games. Thanks, Pat!
You did this Pat, you opened the door to this fulfilling art form for so many new people looking this. You should be proud
it's already been years*?! how time flies
didn't the video come out like last year?
Pat's insight into any random thing is always what I want. It's not just that he's a nerd who can't shut up about punch and kick, he has a particularly stark talent for finding important perspectives to consider things through.
Tekken is also positively weird in it's gameplay and game mechanics. It's unfair, inconsistent, untraditional, and bold in many ways, but in a fun and intelligent way.
Tekken is a prime example why having a game director who actually invented and cares about the game is so important. He knows what's good.
harada repeatedly has stated that the kind of rollback netcode 2d fighting games have is impossible for 3d fighting games. meanwhile, u can play tekken online on fightcade.
also harada is supposedly the reason why the women in tekken's playable cast all have a identical bodytype (compared to street fighter having characters like Marisa)
@@AuntBibby who cares about body type in a video game any way? especially in a video game where everyone is roided out of their mind in the first place.
@@FGCfoof really? maybe I haven't played enough to make the distinction but it doesn't seem to bother me at least for now, I'll definitely keep it in mind. And yea King especially this time around beefed even more so then others up lmao his physique is godly.
Struggling imagine a male character besides, like, jack with a unique body type, either
@@AuntBibby Doesn't fightcade use save states which Tekken 8 doesn't have the luxury of using?
Inoki's iconic performance would go on to inspire Tekken 8's Xiaoyu and her too low almost non existent hitbox, way to show your inspiration, Harada and team
One thing Tekken does better than any other fighting game is making it feel like your individual punches and hits have a big impact.
that slamming sound when you can swap characters mid combo from TTT came to mind when i read this.
Movement combined creating and punishing whiffs
Dont forget the parry. Forward parry like reina did and the low parry that straight up flip the enemy with one of the best sound effect that just trigger kreygasm easily and chained into combo
This had me thinking about all the times in Elden Ring when a boss laid me out on my ass with a heavy attack and it occurred to me that it would be safer to stay on the ground while they whiffed a long, sweeping attack instead of trying to early-dodge out off the ground and back into their sword.
You're right, Fromsoft games really illustrate that "what looks cool" vs "what's actually optimal" kinda tension
Patrick is so so good. I legit picked up tekken 3 because I was a taekwondo practitioner when I was young and hwoawrang made it look so cool. Brings a tear to me wee little eye to hear Pat describe it so concisely.
Not to mention the yoshimitsus and bears on the roster. Lol.
Video about fighting games that mostly talks about the history of martial arts in the 90's? Now THIS is what a real video should be
I kept wondering throughout the video "where is he going with this" but now I understand, Tekken is a beautiful game to watch in motion with all it's mixed fighting styles
Man, the first 30 seconds have me HOOKED, Pat. I'm still a sucker for style vs. style competitions even though it's kinda bogus. The thing that has always been neatest about MMA is when unique discernable styles clash and we get to see the fun interactions. The unique real fighters who remain like Kyoji Horiguchi are true treasures.
That lying down technique kinda reminds me of how weird it was fighting Nishitani Homare in Yakuza 0. He would pretend to fall over, and then slither around on the ground trying to stab you in the ankles and just generally try to psyche you out by making really horny gestures.
As a fighting game non-fan, Tekken has consistently been the only fighting game that I love to watch.
I'm not even interested in Street Fighter matches, pro or no. But I'll ravenously watch ANY video of people playing Tekken. It's the only one that looks like a fight, with all the chaos & weird hit box fuckery that makes two flailing bodies fun to watch.
surprisingly, ufc nowadays still has fighters that specialise in a certain discipline
stephen 'wonderboy' thompson somehow manages to win fights doing pure karate, and it looks like how it would in a movie
same with israel adesanya, he basically does kickboxing only
max holloway essentially does boxing
The laying on the ground part is kinda funny considering King is also the only one in Tekken that has grapples for opponents on the ground.
some characters can lay on top of a character and punch, i just dont know how to trigger that consistently and panda can dance over a fallen enemy
pat i started to play fighting games right when ur video on how to play them and have a nice time came out. I don't know if i would have stuck with them without ur video but now they are basically all i play thank u for that
pat was part of successfully getting me into fighting games and i think he's on his way to getting me into martial arts movies and television next lol
I think it is exactly that confrontation between different styles that drew me to Tekken too, although of course there is a strong dose of habit
My hands are a triangle and I'm always sliding into these comments
I can't get enough of your fighting game videos, Pat! You bring such a passionate energy to the FGC, and each video has opened my heart to more reasons to love fighting games. I can definitively say "How to get started with Fighting Games and have a Nice Time" reignited my love for a genre I may not have returned to. Now I understand there is a bond of brotherhood that can only be understood by two Potemkin mains that both just whiffed a HPB. I hope you stream Tekken 8 soon, I would love to download your King Ghost!
Lovely video. I think SoulCalibur does a similar job at attending to our teenage fantasy scenarios: "Who would win, a Samurai or a Knight? Or a guy with a long stick?"
Funny story: An MMA had a guy with no limbs (well, just elbows and knees) fight a full-bodied opponent. The opponent couldn't get to him because he was way too low, was really fast, and none of his grabs could work. He just stood up and tried hitting him by punching downwards like Ali did with Aoki but now, instead of a guy just laying on the ground kicking you, poor dude had someone who was hypermobile on the floor. Most people chalked it up to dude having to hesitate because he didn't want to beat up a guy with no arms or legs but, if you ask me, it just showed how MMA has never really addressed any of the weaknesses of the arts that it's founded on but rather just used one martial art to bandaid the flaws of another.
Which makes me think that games like Tekken should have characters with disabilities based off of real life disabled fighters as often their disabilities not only allow them to (rather paradoxically) circumvent the weaknesses of the arts they practice but expose weaknesses in other arts simply by virtue of them not being accounted for.
I absolutely screamed when I saw this. Dude thank you for posting. I love your work
Always love a Pat video, especially on fighting games. Tekken's not only incredible for its homages to real martial arts, but is equally fascinating with its game systems compared to other fighting games. The Rock-paper-scissors with side-stepping, ducking, backdashing, and using evasive manoeuvres in general is so different from the much cleaner and calculated precise spacing and frame data of Street Fighter, while at the same time offering some of the most difficult but incredibly satisfying execution out of any fighting game. I love street fighter for its simple to understand, extremely hard to master formulas, but it doesn't outshine Tekken when it comes to how expressive a player is able to be.
Tekken will always be the game where I feel like Jet Li in Kiss of the Dragon. Specifically the scene where he fights some twins and one of them is a really good kickboxer. Jet adjusts mid fight to make the kickboxer only box him. It’s a fun movie! Great job with this video!
Polygon, this is an awesome breakdown of why Tekken reigns supreme!"
The historical context you provided was truly insightful.
And that "I am always sliding" quote from Segal? Pure gold! 😃
Thank you pat for another great fighting game video! I actually just got back into trying out FG since playing Soul Caliber and Tekken on my PSP back in my high school days. I love to see breakdowns like this and this was a wonderful insight into the mechanics and history of sport and games.
i missed this guy. need more content from him
This video put my thoughts into beautiful, beautiful words.
Id like to add one thing, growing up, I saw traditional martial arts as a cultural icon that represented different regions. Every nation has a flag, some variation of a dumpling, and a martial art. Which made me all the more excited to see Azucena announced because id get to see Peru represented not only by name but through the Rumi Maki inspirations in her fighting.
Street fighter player here: tekken is currently the most technically sophisticated fighting game out there. It takes more skill to win a tekken match against a high level player than is required by any other game & by a long shot.
Pat never change, love we got people like you in these big companies. Your passion is inspiring and you’re an excellent representative for the FGC to casuals
I love these videos so much. Fighting games aren't really my thing for a variety of reasons, but your videos on them are reliably fascinating
These videos hit real hard. Keep up the great work Pat!
Tekken 7 and 8 also lean into the hype of those wierd interactions with the slowdown that happens sometimes when two moves approach each other when one or both players are near to a ko
Pat, I appreciate your videos on fighting/martial arts/wrestling so much. Thank you for making them.
Always a good day when we get more Pat talking about fighting games
I'm not even joking when I tell you that I've gotten people to whiff entire strings because I just stayed on the ground.
All the way from 1st Dan to Tekken King
the 1st Dan will think you're gonna get up immediately because that's what they've been doing and it usually works for them because low ranks are aggressive on wakeup
and the Tekken King will underestimate you, thinking that you're a low rank that's aggressive on wakeup
kinda funny how that works out lol
Sometimes just doing *nothing* can completely throw off your opponent's timing
And suddenly Dunkey's "Lazy Bear" fighting style makes more sense...
This is such a wonderful video. Such pleasing storytelling and delivery and context.
I love it when Pat talks about Tekken and fighting games in general! :D
I would honestly buy a DVD collection of Pat's videos, Homestar Runner-style
For me 2d fighters just can't cut it in terms if being able to freely move and control a character.
Pat why do we only get one of these per year man
12:06 - tell about Smash Bros what you want: it IS the best fighting game out there and it HAS the best hitboxes, even if they feel weird sometimes... They're WAY more accurate than what's shown here...
love the shoutout to CheeseYoni
their choreography vids are sooooo good
What a great vid. I never thought about fighting games this way! I only played MK but will play Tekken now.
Tekken is a game that 18 years old me can play with a Grizzly bear who knows mishima style karate againt his 48 years old uncle who plays the bruce lee character and having a blast with it
Yoshimitsu and zafina have entered the chat
Always love a Pat Gill video. You can almost always tell from the title when its a Pat video and you can be damn sure its gonna be great!
This is an excellent video - very well put together and a compelling discussion!
Fun fact Ali almost lost his leg as a result of that fight.
All the Polygon essayists are fantastic, but there's something about Pat's delivery and topics that are just so whimsical
This progression from distinctive styles to a less distinctive hybrid is seen also in Avatar the Last Airbender to Korra.
MMA has its specific context and circumstances which, in a competitive environment, impose selection pressures upon the participants that inevitably result in fair bit of convergent evolution.
Back when people trained and fought to kill or die, though, you actually had a remarkable degree of variety within the practical boundaries imposed by human biomechanics and the available tools of offence and defence. ("Breaking fists on helmets is dumb" for ex.) People had some pretty pressing reasons to try and find ways to go about things better than the other guy, after all, and there were generally many ways to go about skinning any particular tactical cat when the only rule that actually applied was "do unto others before they do unto you".
I can watch Pat talk fighting games whilst crying of pure joy and comfort forever. Bless you Pat ❤u are my fgc.
This was really interesting, thanks Pat. I've always considered the more martial arts-y fighting games to be a bit uninteresting compared to the character variety in Soul Calibur & Smash Bros, but this really opened my eyes to what makes them special.
Weirdness is not something Tekken for granted.
Aikido not!
oh you, lol
Patrick glad to see you're still enjoying Tekken and sad to see you're still a King main (derogatory). I hope I never run into you online and you have a great day! :)
oo hoo hoo let's see some martial art presentation analysis
Never get enough of Pat talking about fighting games
love how lost Ali looked fighting Inoki. cause yeah, he realized and exploited a major weakness in Ali's abilities
I was disappointed that Pat didn't show Bryan or Devil Jin's soccer kicks in the segment where he talks about getting folks off the ground. That shit is brutal hahaha.
Or Julia’s ff3. When I hit the 5th one in a row I start to feel bad
-Pat
Leaving a like on this video isn't enough. I need to add it to my favorites playlist
2:50 This is beautiful, what movie is this?
Patrick Tekken Gill does it again.
Pat's got a real way with words when it comes to why digital kick-punching is so great.
Tekken allows us to finally settle the ancient schoolyard debate of who would win between a kung fu guy and a dinosaur with boxing gloves.
This is a fantastic piece. You might be among the very last people getting paid by a media outlet to do real work related to MMA journalism, actually. It's a field that's been almost entirely gutted at this point. All of those writers I followed for their excellent work (None of which still hold a position for a media outlet) would love this video.
I've got some thoughts I wanna share here, as a martial arts nerd and someone who really wants to like Tekken. This is gonna be a long comment, so read on at your peril.
The shorter part first: I really, really wish I liked Tekken, and if anyone can give me some advice on how to start, I'd love to hear it. My problem is the long combos. In IRL martial arts as well as action and fighting games, the thing that really appeals to me is the back-and-forth nature of things, with short exchanges where each person has a chance to get their shots in, but there's usually a clear winner in a given exchange. In most fighting games, though, the fact that juggling and combos exist means that a poorly executed exchange can mean spending the next few seconds just getting combo'd into oblivion and losing a big chunk of your health bar, and nowhere is that more the case than in Tekken. The fact that being a good Tekken player means getting good at finding your moment to completely lock your opponent out of the game for a few seconds just doesn't sit right to me. Am I looking at this wrong, or is Tekken just not the game for me?
And, secondly: as a martial arts nerd, I think it's really important to recognise the two things, in my mind, that the early UFC really taught us. First, there's no Japanese, English or Thai fighting, same as how there's no Canadian geometry. Different cultures have developed different approaches, but fundamentally, fighting is fighting, wherever you are. Lots of people, myself included until recently, want to find the Secret Fighting Techniques that traditional martial arts hold, but recently, I've come to believe that traditional martial arts, in the cases where they arise from genuine fighting traditions, are just different ways of teaching the overarching skill of fighting. Some place more emphasis on different aspects of fighting, but in the end, physics is physics and biomechanics are biomechanics. Take taiji, for instance: lots of practitioners and fans want it to be a revolutionary fighting style that teaches the art of striking and throwing with no strength required. In reality, I subscribe to the notion that the motions in taiji forms are mostly a way to use oral tradition to pass down fairly basic wrestling techniques, with some striking thrown in there for good measure. You still need strength and conditioning to make taiji work. Fighting is fighting.
The second thing that the UFC taught us is that if you don't fight, you can't fight. A lot of people took from the early UFC days the lesson that traditional martial arts Don't Work, but I think what it really showed is that some traditional martial arts in the modern day tend to produce people who can't fight because the schools of that art don't generally spar or otherwise use their techniques against resisting opponents, they just practice their forms and do compliant drilling and assume that their training will come to the fore when push comes to shove. What we saw from the people who fell apart under the pressure of UFC 1 was what happens when people who've never had the experience of fighting against real resistance are suddenly thrust into a no-holds-barred tournament. I think we're starting to see a point in the combat sports world where some traditional martial arts are waking up, rediscovering the actual fighting applications of the forms that they've passed down and returning to the combat sports scene. Lyoto Machida and Stephen Thompson are doing it with karate, a few South East Asian fighters seem to be doing it with wushu in ONE Championship, and I for one really hope that we're gonna see it with a few kung fu styles really soon. Qi La La is doing interesting things with wing chun, and who knows, maybe I'll find someone who's doing it with my beloved xingyi sometime soon.
As far as combos go in tekken they are only a factor in higher levels of play.
In low to intermediate levels combos aren't that long. Scoring a combo in tekken is the equivalent of scoring a knockdown in MMA. Your opponent has made a big mistake and now it's your turn to wail on them for a bit.
When they get up from the combo it's their turn to flip the script or you can continue to use your momentum to go at them further.
Ultimately you won't know unless you try, Tekken 8 has a free demo so try it for yourself if the core gameplay is something you like
@@shaghilathar3588 thanks for replying! I played some Tekken 7, so my opinion doesn't come from complete inexperience, though I admit combos weren't as long as I was worried they'd be. Maybe I'll give that demo a try :)
I mean, they invited the "You'd actually just die if you trained and fought like this" guy to the matchup too. Looking at you, Miguel!
this is fantastic stuff, nice work!
I can't believe Carly used Inoki's strategy towards Ali when she was fighting Shelby Marx
I think this is partially why Tekken has such a wide casual appeal. The sandbox-y nature and the what-if fights make it fun for everyone. Like playing a Dragonball game to settle your debate about which character is stronger when we were kids
Pat's FGC videos fill the Core-A-Gaming hole in my heart
as a lei main, this entire thing just made me miss my boy 😭
As much as I appreciate having the answer to anything available all the time, I do sometimes miss that golden age of schoolyard ignorance. That's where myths gestate, the maybe-space between a hard fact someone heard somewhere and the sixth or seventh retelling. And when those myths prove true - when you *do* meet Missingno and wind up with infinite rare candies, when that guy *did* shoot his father in the head with a crossbow at the public library - that just lends credence to the entire dreamy affair, bedazzling that infinite uncertainty with sparks of possibility; making imagination, if but for a second, touchable, actual.
I'm really surprised you didn't bring up DOA at all. Especially since harada openly talked about how they were more direct competitors over Street fighter and other fighters
Thank You for voicing out one of the reasons I like Tekken! Laying on the ground for as long as you want! Never in my wildest thoughts I thought that some other soul loves this about Tekken let alone a content creator. Apart from the martial arts aspect, I've loved the input scheme of Tekken, the default of which is the most intuitive of all fighting games in my opinion. 2D fighters have fighters switch limbs when they change sides, & Virtua Fighter has open & closed stances which changes limbs. But Tekken? No matter which side of the screen a character is, the move comes out with the same limb & the attacks are readable in both cases. The default input scheme of Tekken makes it intuitive to figure out a substantial number of moves. For instance if a character has a string of down 1,2; most probably that character will bend down & then hit his left & right punches respectively. For me, Tekken is the ultimate martial arts fantasy !!!
I will watch Patrick talk about fighting games all the time. Give me more.
“In TEKKEN they can lay down forever and you might not know how to hit them”
Kazuya has entered the ring
I know this is kind of beside the point, but the reason Tekken is my favourite fighting game is that, in my opinion, it strikes the best balance between intuitiveness and complexity. Low skill floor, high ceiling.
I always find myself in that thumbnail situation when playing vs King as Steve lol. Takes me a while till I remember I can just stomp him or knuckle plow
It clicked, the rhythm was in me all along
Pat you better do more fighting game content or else I’ll be sad
pat gill talking about fighting games again? i will be there no matter what
The guy who created Baki is the father of the girl who created Beastars.
I've tried so many fighting games and always have been bugged by the inability to choose how, or if, I want my character to stand up. It feels like such a simple thing coming from Tekken as my main game, but I use it in such ways that I can't train myself not to. Street Fighter and I think Mortal Kombat allow you to delay wake ups, but you can't just lay there. Tekken 8 has changed the system a bit to encourage player to get to back to neutral, but I'm still able to shut down my opponents offense with a toe kick, or even just laying there. It's always great to see someone whiffing moves cause they don't know their characters ground hitting attacks.
the realest thing in this video is the tekken display with both steam and in game fps counter
"Tekken is my favourite fighting game series ever" I knew you were a real one Pat
As a kid i played alot of traditional fighting games but they were kinda hard and complicated, but tekken was very simple and my child brain could understand that 'keep guy floating = good' also mashing buttons felt like bullets and it was so satisfying to just rob someone's turn using what sounded like a shotgun shot😂
This is likely the most loving homage to King’s alley kicks that we’ll ever see
This video would make Core-A Gaming proud! Very well done
what a great vid, reminds me of the Voldo one, which was also amazing
The main takeaway: Muhammad Ali should have practiced his low parry.
TBF it's not something boxers normally need to worry about...
Pat, do a video on Virtua Fighter.
Lei Wulong is my main since T2. The greatest fighting character created imo.