Ford Fiesta, Ka, Puma heater control valve - failure of pattern-part HCV
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- Опубліковано 1 жов 2012
- This is an in-depth analysis of why a cheap pattern-part Heater Control Valve failed after a few months normal use.
I've returned to the subject of Ford heater control valves (HCV) because it's an important topic and one that affects several Ford models sold in the UK, Europe and in the US. Earlier this year I made several 'how to' videos on how to replace your Fiesta, Ka, or Puma heater control valve which are well known to fail in the closed position so no cabin heat or open position (full heat). There have been incidents where HCV failure has also been put down to fragments of the unit breaking up and clogging the cooling system but the common reason for HCV faults is seal failure which causes either coolant leak from unit 'tell-tale' hole or simple reluctance to work due to coolant leaking past seals into the solenoid and either corroding it solid or affecting ability for the coil to provide the magnetic field needed to move the plunger open or shut. Older HCV's were sealed so even if it failed the coolant would stay in the system. Later units have a small hole which allows coolant to flow out if the seals have let go - which is what happened to my Fiesta a few months ago. This was the second HCV (bought from an online auction site for £14). In hindsight I should have bought a Ford or equivilent OEM part as the pattern-part was cheaply made. As you will see from this video the quality of the materials for the seals is dubious and the design is such that the main circular gasket or diaphragm incorporates a very thin extruded seal which wraps around the plunger stem. This almost paper-thin rubber has torn thus allowing pressurised hot coolant to flow into the solenoid body and out the drain hole. This hole is large enough to almost empty the car's coolant tank in less than 3 miles. I only discovered it after suddenly smelling hot coolant inside the car while driving. Luckily I managed to top it up and limp home. The basic Fiesta doesn't have a temperature gauge but it does have an engine overheat warning light. Luckily this didn't come on as I spotted the leak in time. Incidentally this HCV is also used in the Mk I Ford Ka, the Puma and certain Fiesta models. My Fiesta was a 1999 1.3 Endura-E OHV unit.
Several Ford based forums including the Honest John forum mention the HCV causing overheating. This is either down to the leaking problem I just described or it's due to pieces of the valve or unit breaking off and clogging up the narrow radiator, matrix, or cylinder head coolant passages. In normal operation when the HCV is closed such as during the summer months, coolant doesn't flow around the heater matrix. Because the system is in parallel the flow around the engine and radiator isn't affected.
When some owners have reported their heater has failed and the car has overheated, there are usually other issues with the cooling system such as;
1)Too low a coolant level caused by bad maintenance, or leak from HCV or other component of the cooling system.
2)Incorrect antifreeze concentration or system being filled with normal water,
3)Severe rust and limescale build up - especially in the iron block/head OHV Endura- E engine
4)Thermostat failure.
5)Hose collapse on low pressure side of the pump caused by old soft hoses.
6)Engine cooling fan failure. Normally spotted when stuck in traffic
7)Pump falt - impeller worn out due to cavitation, plasic impeller separating from shaft, pump drive belt snapping or slipping.
When my car's original HCV failed in the closed position, the car operated normally but the heater didn't work. There was no overheating because the rest of the system was in good condition. Don't underestimate how little it takes to clog up a cooling system. Think of it a bit like your kettle at home. Even a thin layer of limescale will reduce heat transfer from head and block to the water. Add some rust and and low antifreeze concentration and you can see why engines can overheat.
Antifreeze not only protects against freezing but also from boiling. If coolant boils it produces air bubbles and vapour which leads to airlocks, lack of heat transfer and localised thermal stress - especially around cylinder head. Antifreeze also inhibits corrosion, helps lube the water pump seals. If you mix your own coolant, use de-ionised or soft water - never tap water except in an emergency - and aim for a 50:50 ratio of antifreeze to water. You can buy de-ionised water from retailers that sell car batteries. Halfords sell five litre containers of de-ionised water. They also sell ready mixed antifreeze/summercoolant so check your car handbook to see what type your's needs. Most Fords need the long life red coolant. Dont mix red with the old blue or green antifreeze. It will gel up and cause flow and cooling problems.
Anyway, thanks for watching and reading this, drop me a message or a comment, rate, and subscribe for more car related videos. - Авто та транспорт
Just exchanged mine. HCV control coil was completely waterlogged and gunked up. Thanks for the information. :)
I don't usually comment on UA-cam videos, but we bought a Ford Fiesta couple of weeks ago with a stuck heater. Thanks to your video and getting an understanding of the valve i was able to lock the valve in the cold position placing some M3 rings inside the metal casing above the piston. This way i didn't need to bypass the hoses and it's cooling nice and cold. I put 4 rings in there for maximum cooling(taking one out to increase heat bit by bit ), the rubber was still intact and there are no leaks when running. I didn't want to buy a new one since the car won't be with us a long time :) . Thnx again, great video.
Rik Dol Glad it helped. 😊
Great explanatory video Thanks for sharing,much appreciated.
Good video and very informative. I know what to look for when I replace the sticky one on my 2005 Ford Ka.Keep up the good work sharing knowledge. Franko.
Thanks mate! that's really helpful!!
very informative, thanks!, i was gonna buy one from ebay but after watching this i think i'll shell out the £36 for a ford one.
Good video cheers
thanks for making this video, just needed to change the hcv on my x reg ford puma and surprise surprise the old one was rusted and full of coolant in the motor housing. I've just bought a new one but the heater is still jammed on full (supposed genuine ford part) so I was wondering if you had any ideas on what may be causing this since I can't imagine within a day or so of use that the O-ring has gone
Great video. I have a similar problem.(2002 Fiesta Endura 1.3. Car has only covered 48K) I was getting 'Just warm' air from the heater when on FULL.! I tested the voltage at the HCV connector and that was perfect and consistent with the heater control knob.
I removed the HCV and found that water had got in.! I then removed the heater Matrix and flushed it out, it took about 10 minutes to get it clear, it was absolutely FULL of crap but otherwise in good condition
I replaced the Matrix and then decided to 'Fix' the HCV in the OPEN position and give it a try.
On inspection the RIGHT hand pipe - going INTO the Matrix was getting hot, but the Pipe on the LEFT was still cold !!!
There were NO blockages in the HCV and the Matrix was flushed for a good 10 minutes until it ran clear.
The coolant level is constant and the engine doesn't overheat,so i'm guessing the thermostat is ok.
All hoses are ok. Lower and Upper all seem good.
What does this point to?...Water pump perhaps or a blockage somewhere else in the cooling system?
Cheers.
If your car isn't overheating or running cold, then the thermostat and pump must be ok. It could be that there's still an airlock in the matrix or debris got dislodged from elsewhere in the cooling system and then found its way back into the matrix or HCV. Worth checking to see if the coolant pipes to the HCV are on the right way round. Original Ford pipes should have an arrow marking showing direction of flow. Aftermarket pipes can sometimes be unmarked and/or different lengths so easier to accidentally mix up the flow and return.
@@TK42138 Thanks for your reply. I've checked all the hoses and they are all ok and fitted correctly.
What i'm going to do when i get the chance is completely flush the cooling system and re-new the antifreeze.
See if that cures the problem...I'll let you know.!
Just another note to add. When I flush the system out completely I will Disconnect the Matrix completely. As in, I will remove the 2 Pipes going INTO the Matrix and place a U bend Copper pipe between the 2 INLET pipes. Thus completing the system WITHOUT fouling up the matrix.
Seem a good idea?
Hi, have you got a how to video for changing coil pack & HT leads on a KA 1.3 Endura?
Hi TK42138,
Have recently bought a 1.7 puma where the heating matrix hoses have been by-passed by the previous owner (no engine over heating issues as of yet) = I don`t have any cabin heater for the winter - but I ve bought a brand new after market replacement Heater Control Valve from ebay (£12.50) to fit myself, but after watching your informative video on the subject, I am wondering if its worth fitting the new part given or perhaps buy a ceramic 12 v plug-in heater instead?
Hi, I have a similar problem and was wondering if you could help me out please? I had my HCV & resistor changed as the valve was stuck closed (no heat) and the fan speed only worked on 4 (hence the new resistor). However since then, although the fan speeds are now fine, the heater is constantly on maximum heat. I've checked the two pin connector that plugs into the HCV and this is showing 0 volts regardless of where the temperature dial is turned, so I assume this is the problem?
Hi wonder if you could help me, Im not sure if its the valve thats causing the problems but worth a shot to see if u can help.
When driving my puma, now and then the heater will randomly blow hot air,at the same time the lights will go really bright on the dash board and the head lights / main beam. Do you think that valve could cause this?
Potentially it could also be a broken connection to the dial itself, it may need clipping back in (sometimes they can push out)
Thanks TK42138, usefull review on the cheaper parts. Do you think it would be possible to wedge the sprung loaded bar on the solenoid open by infilling the inner cap which shrouds the solenoid coil?
Thanks
Nat
Hi TK42138, your video is very intresting infact i have a problem regarding the heater, but i don't know if the problem is the same. I have a ford fiesta 2009, and the problem is that tha air flow came out only from frontal position, and no from the bottom position (foot) or upper (the frontal glass), regardless the outup you want. Is the component you show in video the one that control the air flow direction?
My coolant level is okay, although the temperature dial doesn't seem to be reaching the middle of the normal zone like it was....
mite use some rubber grease on that bit rubber extended collar bit,
its worth noting this is the most common cause of either constant heat, or constant cold but it is known that the heater control panel can fail which is basically the variable resistor (hot/cold dial) stops working so the valve only stays in one position.
Thank
We've fitted 2 of these that we got from scrap yard. But still getting hot air. So would you think it was the control panel in the car? Thank you in advance Darren
Darren Parker Could be but before condemning the control panel, check its fuse supply as it's an ignition live supply to controller and the HCV. To test feed to HCV, a test meter will show varying voltage as heat/cold control switch is turned. Now, to test HCV is reacting to a supply, disconnect wires at connector and use some wire to power it from battery. It should click and you will feel it move - although a duff one can click but not fully open or close.
Thank you replaced today withe a brand new heater control valve. All working now!! 2 blooming duff ones from scrapyard. Just buy new.....
hi all, İ bought new valve ass same ass u shown. but i have still some problem. i thing i have also problem with panel. so i need to know please tell me how to work from panel. i thing its all about change voltage like when valve get 12 volt open heat and no voltage gives cold. i teset it my valve when its cold it show 8,5 volt and when its hot 13,5 volt. i need to be sure fix paneel or get some more solution. Thanx and sorry for poor english
Hi, our 1.6 sportka duratec 2003 is on hot air all the time. just swapped for new heater control valve. not solved . swapped heater control unit, still trickling hot air at same time. would this be rear stat to chance next or thermostat?
Kind regards
Warren
Need to check the voltage at the cable connector that feeds the heater control valve. If there's is voltage present when the ignition is ON, and that voltage varies when the cabin control is turned then the power feed to the HCV should be good. If however there is no voltage present at the connector when ignition is on, then there's either a break in one of the wires or a fuse has blown or there's a fault with the controller itself. I only ever saw two faulty controllers but many bad HCV units. To test if there's power going to the HCV, you will need a digital test meter and an assistant to turn the heater selector control while you see what the volts reading is on the test meter . Check the simplest thing first which is the fuses since the HCV only works when ignition is on. Check manual to see what fuse protects the control panel and HCV. Also worth noting that the default setting of the HCV is 'OPEN' in other words until power is fed to it, the valve stays open thus there's hot coolant being fed to the heater matrix. When current is applied, the solenoid actuated valve closes against spring pressure and thus the cabin gets colder.
these types of solenoids use low frequency pwm to operate the valve around 1hz. the duty cycle is varied such that at 50% heat , a square wave signal is sent and at 1hz the valve opens for half a second and then closes for half a second and this repeats. if 25% heat is needed then the valve is unenergized for .25 seconds and then energized for .75 seconds. etc. it is not held at a certain position by current. its constantly opening and closing at different duty cycles.
Good info. 👍
You should make a video on this subject because I don't have the test equipment to show this.
I have a 2011 KA. Air con temperature does whatever it wants on any setting you put it on. Could it have this problem?
Worth checking the basics first such as function of the HCV and general condition of the cooling system, then check pollen filter because if it's old and clogged up, airflow and thus system's ability to supply warm or cold air or even fresh air will suffer. If all the above is good, then you will need services of an aircon specialist to check for low gas, leaks or failing aircon parts - which will also affect temperature control.
Sir i have ford car, this valve sticks one side after leaving it's for couple of months on same location hot Or cold, I think the plunger rubbers got sticked and the magnetic can't pull it out, solution plz
These valves can be taken apart to check for blockages but if it's an old valve, the process of taking it apart can cause damage to the main rubber seal or diaphragm that separates the solenoid and the valve.
I am about to change this valve for the third time. Previously independent brand, this time it has to be an original Ford one. Never bother with a second hand one, that would be an absolute waste of all the time it takes to replace this part. All the second hand ones would be knackered anyway. It is not an expensive part relatively anyway. What mine is doing now, it blows cold ok, if I switch the car off , such as at the petrol station, then switch it back on again to move on, it will be blowing hot for the rest of the trip ! Why does it do that after switching on and off ? I thpought it might be the panel, I've had the panel off and the heat knob pot seems to work fine when connected to a meter, 0 ressitance one end , 10 ohms at the other, 5 in the middle, no issue there. So what goes on with these things ? Beware though, blowing hot or cold might not be life threatening situation, but, if the valves are really dodgy and they leak water while on the motorway, that is not a pleasent situation to be in, thats why not worth messing about with second hand ones or trying to repair seals etc, just replace the whole thing. The other thing that apperently leaks on these Ka's, the thermostat housing, replace complete with the thermostat if you suspect it.
I think the overall design is the problem. Ford should have left it as a cable operated valve.
Can we see plunger moving if we connect tr directly to the car battery?
Yes. Even if the HCV is intact, you will certainly feel the solenoid click as it opens and shuts when voltage is applied to the terminals.
Hello and great video!
Do you happen to know what is the diameter of those plastic nozzles?
My valve is stuck on heat mode so on summer time I want to connect the two hoses going from and to the engine directly through a small piece of pipe.
Thanks!
Scutarovik When I had to bypass the HCV when I first got the car, I used plastic hose joiners bought from Halfords. The longest joiner enables the original pipes to be used. I'll have to check on the diameter once I find the spare HCV to measure it.
Scutarovik When I had to bypass the HCV when I first got the car, I used plastic hose joiners bought from Halfords. The longest joiner enables the original pipes to be used. I'll have to check on the diameter once I find the spare HCV to measure it.
Thanks for the quick respose, I'm from Romania though so Halfords does not quite ring the bell :))
would be great if you could measure that diameter, when you've got the time, of course
Scutarovik I will try and find it and let you know as soon as I can.
Scutarovik Just found the HCV as seen in the video.
All four pipes on the HCV are the same external diameter: External = 16mm as measured from main part of the inlet/outlet. The pipe ends are naturally wider in order to retain the hose and spring clip or jubilee (wormdrive) clips.
I have broke that nozzles Will it be glued with any adhesive or plastic weld ?
Risky since the engine compartment is a harsh environment where the plastic is under attack from antifreeze, hot coolant, vibration and various engine fumes. Plastic welding might work but be aware if it fails during use, it has the potential for dumping most of the engine coolant in a short space of time.
I wonder...if I cut off the plunger...will I get constant heat into my car....I would be happy with that.
Nick.
Yes - that would work but just make sure you don't damage the main plunger to casing seal/diaphragm otherwise coolant leaks into solenoid housing and straight out the little tell-tale hole at the bottom of the solenoid metal case. Older original HCV's never had the hole but later ones and pattern parts do and believe me - this little hole will drain down the coolant expansion tank in a few miles of driving.
Do the 161 vans have these in them
Hi, 161 Citroen Berlingo van has a different design of heater valve but essentially any electrically powered heater control valve all tend to work on similar principle of 'pulse wave modulated' (PWM) control of the solenoid or a stepper motor that controls a mechanical valve.
hi
I have a ford ka 53 plate. it always blows hot air it car even if control is on cold. I've changed hcv and test control panal in car. all fine. can any one help??
Hi, to double check that the control panel is varying the voltage to the HCV, you put a test meter set to 12 volts DC and with ignition on, turn the heater control from cold to hot while looking what the digimeter shows. If controller is working, the voltage will change. The default position of the HCV is open (heat) due to the valve being spring loaded biased to open UNTIL current makes it shut i.e when control is turned to cold position. At cold setting, maximum current via controller board energises the solenoid coil inside the HCV which pulls the valve shut.
Forgot to add, when using a test meter, you put the probes in the two pin connector that feeds the HCV. Worth also checking the condition of the HCV supply loom and connector as the area can get damp or full of old leaves and debris. Any corrosion of the connector pins either on the HCV or supply will affect operation.
I've checked alway that and it fine. Even changed hcv and still blows hot alway
+aisha kiani Sounds like HCV has failed. Was it a Ford quality part or aftermarket/Pattern-part?
hi
I got it from a auto tech store. I paid around 25 pounds for it
o brill …..what year ? where can it be found in the car ? ……...
The car was a 1999 Ford Fiesta 1.3 with the OHV Endura-E engine. The HCV is found in the bulkhead/plenum area below the base of the windscreen and wipers. There is a removable plastic bulkhead trim panel which allows more access. The Ford Puma and Ka of the same era is basically the same setup with slight differences due to the different body shape.
Just fitted a new heater valve to my Fiesta, typically the old Ford unit had failed shut, however the new unit makes a clicking sound but the piston does not move, I tried the unit before actually plumbing it into car, should you be able to see the piston moving when a helper turns the dial inside the car from hot to cold? Thanks for any advice
Yes. The controller circuit uses PWM to vary the current flow to the solenoid in the HCV. It should move when the heater control is turned.
@@TK42138 Hey, thanks for the quick reply, I have taken the new unit apart and it would seem that loosening off the 4 Phillips screws slightly allows the piston to move freely but I'm not sure if doing this will cause a coolant leak, any suggestions?
Because coolant will be under pressure, very likely the HCV will leak if the screws are loosened because they clamp together the metal solenoid cover and the plastic parts that retain the main seal that surrounds the valve stem. Was it an aftermarket part?
@@TK42138 I have to admit it is a pattern part and after owning Capri's for 30 odd years (most parts for them have been obsolete for years) I should know better than to trust pattern parts to be honest
When I owned the Fiesta both pattern part HCV's failed within months. The second part leaked internally and pure luck I noticed the leak as it was flowing out through the valve solenoid cover fast enough to empty most of coolant expansion tank in couple of miles. Ended up getting a Ford part before selling the car.
Is there anyway to make it come out with hot air all the time as mine has broke and I'm pretty far off pay day and it's freezing in my car thanks
Yes - you need to partially drain cooling system so coolant level is below the HCV. You then need to remove HCV but leave the two hoses from engine to HCV and the two stubby hoses from the heater matrix. It's simply a case then of using two plastic hose joiners and securing them with jubilee clips so hot coolant from engine flows straight around matrix to return back to the cooling circuit. I used some from halfords. White plastic type - heat and anti-freeze/coolant proof. They sell a box with various diameters of pipe/hose connector. It means you will have constant warm air but as winter is almost here - that's not a bad thing. Please note: r/h hose from engine goes to right hand hose on matrix and left hand hose goes to left hand matrix hose. If you need a diagram let me know via youtube message thing.
I did this and the air is still coming out cold dose this mean the thermostat is broke ?
Tyler Tierney
Does sound like maybe your thermostat is stuck open. With the engine fully warmed up, does the matrix inlet pipe feel hot and the matrix return feel cooler to the touch? Loads of trapped air bubbles can stop heat output in its tracks and so can a furred up matrix (with limescale from using tap water in coolant and rust particles if your car has the Endura E engine) which tends to insulate the channels thus preventing heat transfer from hot coolant to the airflow over the matrix. Did you do remove matrix and flush it through or check flow rate? Also worth checking heater distribution flaps for operation. You should be able to hear the internal flap move as the distribution control is moved from screen, feet or face level.
All of the pipes feel hot? I'm so lost
Tyler Tierney
So the pipes to and from the matrix are hot. That would indicate heated coolant is flowing around the matrix. Only way to be sure is to unscrew the matrix retaining screw and carefully lift it up just enough to check if there's heat being produced. Go careful as the hoses will also be hot. Switch the engine off to do this but make sure it's been fully warmed up first. If the matrix is cold or luke warm despite the feed and return hoses being hot then either massive airlock is affecting heat transfer or internal silting or partial blockages in some of the matrix channels is reducing heat transfer. If the matrix is hot then the issue is with airflow over the matrix within its housing. No airflow either means distribution flap problem, blocked pollen filter, misaligned pollen filter (if fitted) or ventilation fan issue or blockage of the channel which sucks in air from outside into the car interior. Has your car had any recent work on the dashboard or ventilation parts? On one occassion I had a fan that was loose on the motor shaft so the motor turned but the fan didn't so it sounded a tad fast but there was no airflow. It's a long-shot but it needs checking. One more question; when the fan is turned up and the distribution selector is set to to face level position, can you feel airflow through the vents? Likewise can you feel air flow from the windscreen setting and feet/footwell setting?
thermostsat £ 40 quid ? and a bugger to remove !!!
very poor demo. moving the object vigorously .very poor
sanjay agrawal It's a vlog post, not a cinema release. However I appreciate your observations and will take them onboard. Thanks for watching.