Italian Witchcraft: Open or Closed Practice?
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- Опубліковано 30 тра 2024
- #streghe #stregoneria #strega
Can anyone practise Italian witchcraft or the Tradition of Segnature? Strega, stregheria, streghe, segnatori, segnatrici and open and closed practises.
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REFERENCES 📚
Bartolucci, A. (2016) Le streghe buone. I simboli, i gesti, le parole. Come muta la medicina tradizionale nell’era di Internet, Reggio Emilia, Compagnia Editoriale Aliberti.
De Bernardi, M. (2015) ‘Segnare la guarigione: etnosemiotica di un atto magico : lettura semiotica della pratica delle “segnature” nella prospettiva tranculturale relativa alla zona degli Appennini della regione italiana dell’Emilia Romagna’, Phd thesis, Université Toulouse le Mirail - Toulouse II [Online]. Available at tel.archives-ouvertes.fr/tel-....
De Martino, E. (2007) Il mondo magico: prolegomeni a una storia del magismo, Bollati Boringhieri.
Magliocco, S. (2012). Beyond Belief: Context, Rationality and Participatory Consciousness. Western Folklore. 71(1), pp.5-24.
Magliocco, S. (2009). Italian Cunning Craft: Some Preliminary Observations. Journal of the Academic Study of Magic. (5), pp.103-133.
Magliocco, S. (2004). Witchcraft, healing and vernacular magic in Italy In: W. de Blecourt and O. Davies, eds. Witchcraft Continued: Popular Magic in Modern Europe. Manchester, New York: Manchester University Press, pp.151-173.
Puca, A. (Forthcoming 2024) Italian Witchcraft and Shamanism. Leiden: Brill.
Puca A. (2021) La Tradizione delle Segnature. Guaritori (non più) di campagna, Civiltà e Religioni, no. 7, pp. 187-211.
Puca, A. (2020) The impact of Social Media on Italian Shamanism and Folk Magic. Journal of the British Association for the Study of Religion (JBASR), 22, pp. 55-70.
doi.org/10.18792/jbasr.v22i0.47
Puca, A. (2020) ‘Witch and shaman: discourse analysis of the use of indigenizing terms in Italy’, in Harvey, G. (ed), Indigenizing Movements in Europe, Sheffield, London, Equinox Publishing, pp. 107-120.
Puca, A. (2019) ‘The Tradition of Segnature: Underground Indigenous Practices in Italy’, The Journal of the Irish Society for the Academic Study of Religions, no. 7, pp. 104-123.
jisasr.files.wordpress.com/20...
Puca, A. (2018). ‘Witch’ and ‘shaman’: discourse analysis of the use of indigenizing terms in Italy. International Journal for the Study of New Religions, 9(2), pp. 271-284
doi.org/10.1558/ijsnr.37624
Turchi, D. (2017) Lo sciamanesimo in Sardegna, Newton Compton.
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00:00 Introduction Closed vs Open practices
01:18 Support Angela’s Symposium
02:10 Lack of academic research - definitions
07:33 Practices that are neither open or closed
11:05 The Tradition of Segnature
18:30 DNA vs Culture
22:41 Can you become an Italian Witch?
24:14 Conclusion
26:35 Support Angela’s Symposium
⚠️ Copyright of Dr Angela Puca, in all of its parts ⚠️
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Thank you for all of the Italian videos. My grandfather was Italian and I enjoy learning about magic in Italian culture. 😊
Thank you so much for doing this research. My grandmother who immigrated from Italy to the USA practiced her old world magic/rituals. She did not have a name for it and she did not speak of it much. Now and then if it was brought up you would hear my grandfather or my father muttering “strèga”, basically calling her a witch. If she heard anyone joke about it she would not reply or make remark. Always gave the same passive dirty look though. It was not a topic she spoke to my father about. She would however sometimes show my aunt (her daughter) what she was doing. She says she was never interested and thought it was silly and something that made her seem “uneducated” which is sad. I don’t remember much about what was involved other than seeing her pray, mixing herbs/oils etc. What sticks in my mind the strongest is that the family thought she could effect properties of weather. If she was mad about a pairing and it rained on the wedding day people would whisper that it was my grandma’s doing (or one of her 3 sisters). She also did things with photographs, cutting faces out and changing them. I had seen her put the face back in upside down or replace it with someone else. If she ever cut our hair or trimmed our nails she burnt the cuttings. She was culturally Catholic and sent my aunt and father to Catholic school but voiced mixed feelings in old age about what she felt God was. She wanted a cross with her when she was buried tho. I have her mortar and pestle. She left it to me.
One thing I want to add that is related/interesting to me is that the only time I heard her openly acknowledge that she was doing something intentional was sitting among other women from another culture all together. My grandmother worked as seamstress for a taylor in a Puerto Rican neighborhood. She was the only Italian worker. She taught herself Spanish because she “wanted to understand the gossip better” and these women spoke little English. One day her car was not working. My mother and I went to pick her up from work but she was not finished. My mother left me with her while she ran some errands and I sat with my grandmother while she finished up her work. One of the women was complaining about something she was very upset about. She and the other ladies (all from PR) started talking about what she should do and it all seemed as if they were speaking about something specific she wanted to stop or maybe make happen (im not sure). My grandmother interjected and told them, this is what I do and described something involving a saint and a candle and some other things. She seemed willing to talk to these other unrelated older women of another culture about their similar practice more than she was willing to openly speak to most people in our family about it. Perhaps if my aunt had been more receptive she would have shared more with us granddaughters but it seems like she felt it was unwanted. 🇮🇹
🇮🇹🇧🇷 Occultism here in Brazil has a lot of Portuguese and Italian heritage. An example is the evil work we do to each other, the jetatura, also called "fat eye". This is a degree of evil above simple envy.
Congratulations on your work Doctor Puca!
"Published by Brill"
Mortgaging my house as we speak😂
😅🤣🤣
thank Gods for libraries
The shipping will be horrific to where I live 🤣😂🤣
Haha! A long time ago I bought two books that proported that they were of the Italian witch craft.. This episode clearly showed that to be False!..😏 As to the state of Closed or Open, I would add "Tentative & Conditional." Because you often have groups and organizations that Will teach a portion of the curriculum to all but then keep the rest of their teaching for only those they Choose. 🇨🇮Once again, very informative.🖖🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾
I think this is an important distinction! Honestly, most of the practices I've seen labeled "closed" have some things they are willing to share generally, while other things are intended for insiders only.
Lemme guess. Grimassi??
Thank you, Dr. Puca for this topic. My father was Italian and though I was adopted I felt a deep affinity with that line of my family through imagination sparked by his storytelling and devotional personality. I wholeheartedly appreciate your comments about DNA. 🇮🇹
❤🇮🇹❤ Thank you for this video @Drangelapuca!
I'm Italian and lived in Italy for most of my life. What I just learned from this video resonates with some strange stories I heard about my grandmother. I don't know if they were true, but let's say that no one in my family was surprised when I got interested into the topic as well 😊
As usual, the curated transcript was sent to members of the Inner Symposium and now is being made available here to all Symposiasts at this link www.innersymposium.study/?p=4891 Also, there is a quiz to see what you remember of the video at www.innersymposium.study/?page_id=4830 🇮🇹
I think it's amazing that your the only people who is an expert on Italian witchcraft. And I wish I could speak Italian, I have such a hard time reading and writing in English. Also, for open and close practice, I'm part of a goth conclave that preforms blessings all the time. I uselly photograph it for the internet, however once, when. Burning a Christmas Goat, we had it for just members and no pictures to keep it personal. It's probably not the same as the video, but sometimes people just want to keep things close to there harts. 🇮🇹
Seeing in the background the four books of "magia pratica" by Sabellicus is so strange: I've never seen them in any bookshelfs other than italian ones and then I fully realize that you said you are in Italy now 😅
🇮🇹 - Thank you Angela, I'm only 1/4 Italian.. =) . What I'm worried about right now is the destruction of all culture and art. all ancient and modern storytelling and 'who we are' is 'under attack'. good to see some traditions are still alive and kicking.
As a 100% Italian: let's leave the fascism at the door. Muslim immigrants won't bring about the end of our culture.
The preservation of old witchcraft practices is under threat mainly because Italy has no money to fund researchers interested in the topic and thus it will all be lost to time. As someone who's dearly interested in witchcraft in my own region but has to pursue other avenues to make ends meet, I'm glad that people like Prof. Puca are still trying to do research in this regard and hope to see her talk of "janare" in the future.
Who’s under attack?
Italian culture is pretty alive and being embraced by Italians so I don’t know what is under attack?
I guess you never heard of the culture wars.@@nmomayezan
Dearest Dr. Puca - 🇮🇹 Also 🦃'cause it's Thanksgiving weekend here in Canada!
🇮🇹 very interesting. Figures you gotta learn the language to get the knowledge 😏 that must be so interesting, having been initiated into different practices from an academic standpoint. As always, I appreciate your work 😊
🇮🇹 🇧🇷 Brazilian Kimbanda is also a closed practice, as it needs an initiation, when the novice is introduced to the spirits which govern that practice. But there's also a familiar way of transmission, where grandparents or parents teach the young who is manifesting the mediumship their arts and knowledge. Self-initiation is said to be not possible and individuals who claim to have been so are usually not taken seriously and called "cabbage" (sprout out of nothing in the bushes).
Omg! I am sooo hexcited 😊! I love that you did this! Hopefully, you can make a stop in Seattle, WA if you ever make it to the USA. I am certain the locals, as well as myself, would welcome you with open arms!🎉❤
Many times race is an issue. I've seen MANY people being told they can't practice one of the African traditions because they are white, which is perfectly acceptable in today's world. However, if a black person is told they must be white to practice Asatru (for example) they are labeled bigots and nazis. Though I am not one of either of those schools of thought, it's impossible to miss the stunning level of double standard.
My 2nd great-grandparents came to America from Basilicata and Abruzzo I know each region is different especially with folk traditions. I never grew up in Italian culture or spoke the language, but I want to reconnect to my Italian roots by learning Italian along with the culture. I would love in the future visit Italy especially where my Italian ancestors came from especially when it comes to folk magic.
no italian flag that i could find, but really enlightening video, it must be such an adventure to have dived into this practice in the unique way that you have. Thanks for sharing!
Thanks!
I miss listening to Dr Evelyn Paglini rip 🇮🇹
Love your vídeos!!!!!!!! ❤
🇮🇹 great video! Thank you so much!
Wonderful as always thank you so much for opening this world up to us.
Interesting video 🇮🇹
🇮🇪 Awesome video! Thanks! ✨😉
A culture cannot be owned, it can only be shared.
I love your tattoos!!!
Thanks you for your Work. And all the fun!🇨🇮🖖🏾😛
🇮🇹 Grazie, Dottoressa. I learn so much from you.
This was really interesting. 🇮🇹
Thanks for sharing!
Thanks for watching!
😃 Happy to watch this new video, Dr. Puca! Glad to be one of your yt channel and newsletter subscribers!
Thank you for sharing your academic views on such interesting subjects!
I wish you success in all your projects! See you next time! 😃
🇮🇹 I love your content. And I'm looking foreword to your book. Chao bella
Thank you so much for such an informative and enlightening video!
Glad it was helpful!
🇮🇹 Grazie. One can hope that more folks will begin to listen...
infatti 😌
🇮🇹 Thank you for sharing, blessed be!
Same to you!
Poetry is the Practitioner ( the philosopher!🤟🙏😊 🧡🎃🧡Happy Halloween Dr.Angl Jula Puca thanks 🙏 ❤
I’am glad that I have found your video on UA-cam and it is well worth it ✔️
Welcome aboard!
Your spirit spoke Enochian angel to me. That is what I imagine you said.
I'm glad you mentioned that bloodline/DNA alone doesn't claim your right to a tradition. Ethnic ties or no, it takes work to show your willingness to learn any tradition. The amount of (usually white) people in the USA that are stingy and toxic about that is quite alarming, honestly. It's part of the reason why it's better to let people who have been practicing traditions have a voice and spread that knowledge instead of policing ethnicity... culture is more likely to determine a lot honestly.
My Italian is pretty shoddy, but grazie per tutto quello che fai. I love learning from your videos.
Informative as always. Would love to learn language I am going to start with Welsh as I feel closer but the verity of Italian looks fun too. no Italians flag
Dear Dr Puca, let's forget about Exarp, Hcoma, Nanta, Bitom.
I always think of Penne Alla Vongoli. Great videos. Molto grazie i OLTRE LA MORTE Bella Donna.
There are traditions that have been passed down from my Nonna to my mom and then to my sisters and me. ❤
Thanks for this great video, Angela. I have shared it with a few of the groups (of practitioners) that I’m a member of on Facebook.
I have a question about your thoughts on a grimoire recently published by Joseph Peterson called the “secrets of Solomon.”
It’s a Handbook of ‘witchcraft’ and sorcery, Translated from Latin into English according to Venetian trial records from the Venetian Inquisition. Many of the spells in this grimoire have got a very folkloric vibe to them, and I’m wondering what your thoughts are on the similarities and differences between the things in this grimoire, compared to your own research in the field.
Then having obtained a pilgrim’s dress, she traveled far and wide, teaching and preaching the religion of old times, the religion of Diana, the Queen of the Fairies and of the Moon, the goddess of the poor and the oppressed. And the fame of her wisdom and beauty went forth over all the land, and people worshipped her, calling her La Bella Pelegrín’s ( the beautiful pilgrim)
Then the celebrants can the put themselves totally into the ritual moment, power can be generated and magick is created naturally.!
❤ brujo/Bruja means Brewer
I was born and raised in Italy for the first 20 years of my life. I grew up in a village of 600 people where having your "cartomante di fiducia" was a standard thing for every family, and it was just considered "catholicism on steroids" basically? The cult of the saints that I read about in witchcraft now is again something I saw every day, and I remember how often with a stomachache I would be brough to "segnare I vermi" and so many other things though I can't remember any of these people being called "segnatori", thought you would go to them to get something "segnato" indeed. I am trying to reconnect with that but I now live abroad (in the UK as well) and because I am of mixed heritage I actually don't go back to Italy as racism is really the reason I had to emigrate when I could. It's hard to have survived the culture and want to connect with the things I had around me when growing up whilst still having so much anger for the way I was mistreated because of my heritage. 🇮🇹
Dr, New to your channel. Love ❤️. My family originated from Abruzzo Italy. Some research of mine uncovered a Germanic culture living with my ancestors after a battle a friendship made. Stated many Germanic traditions intermixed with traditional Italian only in Abruzzo. Could you elaborate on any Occult traditions from Abruzzo including any coming from the Germanic friendship that turned into intermixed marriages, families after 100s of years of Germanic settlement in Abruzzo after the battle? Thank you . Brian DeJohn Kirkville NY United States
Dr. Puca,
There is a book called Italian Witchcraft: Old Religion of Southern Europe by Raven Grimassi. I have it in my storage, and so I am not sure if it might hold up to academic scrutiny, but if you have not ran across this book, I just wanted to mention it. 🇮🇹
that's not Italian witchcraft, it's an American tradition. I have a video on Stregheria where I discuss that
@@drangelapuca Thank you! I appreciate your feedback, and will know the difference going forward. Thanks for your work on this interesting subject!
I have said this before the idea of closed practices being closed based on say bloodline or even "race" is innately a racist concept. Once more if your gods are only partial to certain peoples and certain races and only work through them than your Gods are not Gods but are merely racial Djinns/Nymphs etc not universal Deities as The Gods are universal and created the entire world and appear to all peoples in various forms, names, and yes even races. The actual Gods predate all races and created them all. If your gods are only partial and only move through people of a certain race and blood than when that race dies off as all mortal things die than just as a Dryad dies when her tree is cut down than so too if your race dies than the racial Djinn who are only partial to your blood will go with you.
None the less I do like this video and found it very informative.
You're so cool blessed be ❤️⭐
Thank you Dr. Angela Puca for your knowledge of Italian witchcraft. Pleased that it is called Stegoneria and vecchia religione. As of closed practices, better because too many people are superficial in their mentality and will take it as a joke. Thank you for mentioning Segnature. Segnatori don't need profane people and narrow minded theocrats.🇮🇹 Where some of are born🇪🇺We may call ourselves this . We are citizens of the world.
Are you of Italian background, or did you pick up the language and interest in its witchcraft along your journey through studies? 🇮🇹
Wow! Dr Puca is going to love that as a compliment on her English ability. As a native Neopolitan, she started learning English so she could study for her PhD in England, starting about 5-6 years ago.
You can't look at her and tell....😅
❤🙌
Regarding academic research into Italian Witchcraft, what about Carlo Ginzburg?
As for "it deepends" with open &/or closed Segnature, why can't the same criteria apply to academic scholarship vs practice? After all, there is such a discipline as Phenomenological Anthropology?
🇮🇹 ❤
Could you do something on sahelian (mali, Senegal, Mauritania, northern Nigeria) or maghrebi (Morocco, Algeria, Libya, Tunisia) witchcraft that is normally suppressed by abrahamic religions?
Mia nonna materna non mi poteva insegnare le segnature prima che morriva e purtroppo non ho ne anche la mia nonna paterna e mia bisnonna paterna che me lo potevano insegnare. Fortunatamente c’è ancora la zia di mio padre che me lo potrebbe insegnare però e difficile di farlo perché vivo al estero e non passo mai per natale.. spero do poterlo imparare!
🇮🇹 e i libri in italiano quali sarebbero? Grazie del video!❤
In my experience, (not that anyone here asked for my opinion) when anything gets "westernized," and in particular, "Americanized," it gets lost in translation. It becomes part of the consumer-driven, repulsive greed inherent in the USA. (But that is not to say that nothing of value spiritually comes out of the USA, because there is plenty.) Perhaps these people's practices should stay where they are before they get thrown into the deep fryer of superficiality.
The children gather wood, and the fathers kindle the fire, and the women knead their dough, to make cakes to the Queen of Heaven… TOTJ 7,18
And when I visited the villa of the mysteries at Pompeii I realized the great resemblances to the cult. Apparently these people were using the witches’ processes ..I showed a picture of these frescoes to an English witch, who looked at it very attentively before saying: “So they new the secret in those days” GGwitchcrafttoday
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🇮🇹 🙏🙏👉💐
I think that in a certain sense there are moreso careful and careless practices rather than closed and open, and that the careful practices want to put care into magical, esoteric, occult and mystical pedagogy, whereas other practices don't involve any more care than what an individual puts into reading digital and physical text sources and interpreting for themselves without the care of instruction or initiation. The degree to which the careful practices are "closed" is just a demonstration of how their care expresses itself and absolutely can be on a spectrum, as it isn't just care for the initiate but care for the transmission and practice itself such that simply reading a source is not sufficient to them, and what requirements are placed on initiation are going to vary kind of obviously to me. All of the practices with care involved are open to some and closed to others, so labeling them either open or closed seems silly to me.
I think maybe there's a case to be made for distinguishing between the "careful-careless" and "closed-open" scales. Segnature as described by Dr Puca would be careful but open.
I have a post elsewhere in this comment section about what closed practices means within the context of the BIPOC community. In short, those were traditions of people who were oppressed for reasons beyond the tradition, who had their traditions taken away, watered down, and sold back to them as plastic trinkets by people who won't truly condemn that tragic history (and certainly won't make amends for it as it's not profitable). The closure of those practices is to protect historical traditions from commercial exploitation by the same sort of people who would have persecuted it and from appropriation by eclectics who don't care about the broader culture the practices come from.
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The younger generation doesn’t have as much memory or fear of persecution by the Church.
I always imagine Italian magic is rooted through catholic beliefs
Hi lady thanks for your video who ever you are but I want to tell you something my sister it's bad doing so stop it
Something needs to be emphasized for people who don't know what closed practices are (henceforth "you"): closed practices often come from communities that suffered undeniable and intense persecution up until fairly recently, for reasons above and beyond those practices, and often with those practices being simultaneously degraded, appropriated, and commercialized by their oppressors.
Before anyone says "never again the burning times" or "we're descended from the witches they didn't burn," your ancestors weren't locked in a boat and dragged to the other side of the world just because of their skin color. Your ancestors didn't have their land stolen from them to have their sacred places turned into parking lots. Your ancestors weren't denied housing and schooling just because of the color of their skin. Your ancestor's sacred practices aren't sold as ringtones and keychains. Your practices aren't being sold back to you in a watered-down and inauthentic form by people who won't condemn the lynch mobs their parents and grandparents supported.
If a BIPOC from the Americas (not just the US but North and South America) says a practice is closed, that's why. If you had nothing to do with those historical tragedies -- and would have had nothing to do with them were you there at the time -- me pointing this out as a white protestant South Carolinian should *not* come across as an attack on you. If it does, you need to think about why you feel entitled to their culture. You can appreciate it without participating, so that's not an excuse; there's other stuff you need to unpack.
And yeah, you could go on to find "a black friend" who says "oh, no, they don't know what they're talking about, that practice isn't closed, I learned it from a white guy." The black community has long since been a name ("Uncle Tom") for that "black friend" who garners social credit among white folk by making them feel better about themselves and their history. Yes, some practices in Hoodoo, Louisiana Voodoo, etc, are influenced by European practices that are Open (e.g. spells from the Petit Albert) -- but you can just practice those in a European context instead if you do your research.
That is your personal interpretation of “closed practice”… First Google result: “Closed practices are spiritual ways enclosed with a certain ethnic or racial background. In order to practice it, you must be part of it, either by birth or through initiation.”
You got to understand that there’s a whole world outside of the USA, and white guilt is specific to your country.
Speaking of “practices being sold watered-down and inauthentic” it’s literally what a few people in the American occult community have done in the last 40 years with the Italian tradition, here’s why Angela’s work is extremely important.
@@jonny_disorderThe interpretation I gave is based on listening to living members of the Black community, instead of listening to an unthinking corporate algorithm. And if you don't see how the specifications I give fit within the general definition you found, you're not trying to understand things but putting that effort towards maintaining a static worldview instead.
And yes, there is a whole world, and BIPOC people are a part of it. As far as I can find, the phrase "closed practice" started with Hoodoo (i.e. with BIPOC people).
I've not criticized Dr Puca's work on behalf of the Segnature in the slightest, so don't try to act like this is an "us vs them" matter. I'm highlighting the context for "closed practices" that's missing from this.
Uh isnt this just abehrametic bible stuff. Todays italy like other euroepan countries has non abhetmtic praatices?
There's an angel in your throat...
I guess Americans having no right to their heritage expunges us from the blame of European colonialism, imperialism, the genocide of two entire continents, and rests it solely in the hands of current European citizens. How nice for us Americans... Curious as to why you don't name any other settler colonial states such as Canada, Australia, New Zealand, or nearly all of Latin America. Also, culture is just a European concept originating in Germany to specify a class of "other," and is now used to exploit and commodify marginalized societies and individuals. The concept of culture is a colonial one itself. Finally, there's no such thing as objectivity, no matter how much academia wants to pretend their is. It's just a way for individuals who payed institutions for credentials and titles to create a separate, higher class or hierarchy. The mere fact that you're an academic creates a bias. The fact that you are Italian, a made up political identity, makes you biased. The fact that you went to school in the UK makes you biased. You cannot participate in practice and be outside, or have some kind of higher, objective perspective than practitioners. You are a practitioner.
Are you in Rome?
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