You are an Afrikaner. Afrikaner is just Afrikaans for African. We are many ethnicities within being Afrikaners. Having space and respect for one another to create ethnic spaces is the real battle. Because as soon as we think that way we are seen as being divisive rather than celebrating our ethnical differences.
Goeie more aan al ons kykers en ondersteuners. Again, my deepest gratitude to Joost Strydom, our host in Orania - and Mnr Carel Boshoff for this sitdown. Let's all learn from Orania. Kuningi esingakufunda kulabantu, esingakusebenzisa nathi emakhaya ethu. Kom ons leer saam. Kom ons bou saam. Let's get to work! 🙏🏽✊🏽
You know Mnr.pen I would like to thank you for your openness to us Afrikaans people. As a new generation of Afrikaans people I have deep shame and regret for the past and that in itself makes me turn away from the conversation. But maybe I have something to offer my community and I should approach service without shame or fear. Please keep talking to people with diverse perspectives and I will learn with you. May God bless and Keep you.
Black Pen. Siyabonga nomsebenzi omuhle okwenzayo. Ons is baie dankebaar vir U. And to@@stevenbellew6590, thank you for your honesty. I have had the privilege of studying Clinical Pastoral care and one of the massive unspoken guilt is the white guilt that many Afrikaaners carry due to their past. Hearing more vulnerable stories like yourself will allow us to heal and hopefully build a better country together.
Like what? Grouping ourselves along tribal lines?... Building brick houses (I thought I already built one)?... please let us know. Building black institutions will require leadership that is not afraid of these people. Sadly ours current leaders can be easily pushed back and pushed out by the Afrikaners elite. But we are only 30 years in... we will get there eventually. Without their help.
I appreciate this. Thank you🤝🏼 I would love to see a conversation about the idea of Coloureds as Brown Afrikaners, an idea advocated for by Afrikaans thinkers like N.P. van Wyk Louw, Jan Rabie, Adam Small, Breyten Breytenbach and so forth. This is the platform for such conversations
Penuel, the more one listens to Orania representatives speak the more I gain a new perspective. This Republic as we know it is very big for the current politicians to govern. They may claim to but the reality is they can't, owing to lack of vision, individual greediness that is so persistent leading to untold corruption. Unfortunately the current foundation under the current government has a bleak future. Current international policy adds more negativity for the success of a Republic for the future. This situation raise more anxiety to me personally. Prof. C.Boshoff and others in your camp, you are shedding light most needed!
I agree. If only all of us communities took our issues in our hands and made them better. We must be leaders and not look to especially the political class to lead us as they clearly don't have our interests at heart.
I could listen to Carel all day. He’s clearly a man who’s applied decades to developing his intellect and speaks with humility and grace. It’d be great to see him on again.
Baie dankie Penuel. I have learned a lot through this interview. You are doing groundbreaking reporting here. By doing this you are showing that for the most part the Afrikaner wants to co-exist. They want all people to succeed without giving up their identity. Community of communities.
Your identity is Holland and don’t be proud of your attitude towards black people. We were meant to forgive and forget but strangely you are openly opening old wounds. Nothing is great here.
Penuel, I truly hope you know how much you have to offer to this world. Guests aside, you have a quality that is rare in today's world, in that you have the ability to investigate, have conversations with listening In an unbiased manner and apply the data where relevant. Most importantly, you have a thirst for knowledge. One does not grow if one is not prepared to talk without listening and listen without speaking! Another brilliant interview. Thank you for your contributions to the conversations. We must engage in order to disempower the politicians who seek to divide us. ❤
I seriously couldn't have said it better. May you mostly have the wind on your back. Always remain strong in following your dreams and KNOW the energy you put into the world is what will be returned even if it may include some rough roads in-between 💖
God, I admire these people SO much! I can barely find the motivation to maintain or improve my home! They built a community from scratch. That’s really something.
Pen, I must say this interview is much appreciated. I think as community we need to get this level of conversations..there is a lot to learn from these Afrikaans guys.. if it was for me I would have decided to go back as government to learn from these guys translate their frameworks into our language Morden life.. I AM A NATIONALIST.
Wonderful interview, Penuel. It is great to sit and listen to intelligent people...even if you differ with them ideologically. This community knows no crime, knows no unemployment, knows no infrastructure collapse...no potholes. This community relies on subsistence economy...something Black people have thrown away...hence we live on social grants. When the rest of South Africa is experiencing load shedding ...this community has its lights on...24/7/365. This community gives its children quality education ...in their language. Yerrrrrrr!!!
I am the product of a boer mother and a Welsh/ Irish English Father ...I love both and will protect my culture and heretige and the good things we created from our culture .
Penuel You are doing stellar work and many of us admire and salute your passion wanting to uplift small communities It' is not fine to criticize this noble cause Poor people need hope dignity and skills So critics if you cannot help by rolling up your sleeves with your community Please be a Philanthropist and help him This is doable and much needed
A fair discussion without the usual one sided "angry black man pushing back onto a white guy answering questions" that become the norm these days whenever black and white people talk about history. Well done Penuel, a good discussion should not be about thinking who is right or wrong but to discuss ideas and solutions.
Very insightful. I'm a South African who now calls NZ home. I am impressed with the respectful interactions between the interviewer, Carl Boshoff, and Joos Stridom. I am very keen to gain firsthand experience about Orania when i next visit the country of my birth.
Agreed, besides universities are indoctrination camps these days to far left, radical Marxism and postmodernism. You can learn so much simply by reading.
Thanks Pen interesting Did not know much on the subject of Orania I have enjoyed all the topics you share and best of all I was born in Newcastle those years lived in Lennoxton and schooled in paradise was a coloured school Migrated to Australia in the 80’s Love your shows
The Penuel Show! Has always bought interesting discussions that are pregnant with lessons. The Orania discussion is one discourse. Mr Penuel, would you do a show or discussion on Bophuthatswana. Please do it so we learn 🙏🏽
I think the banking sector and money part are practical solutions to the greater vision of preserving freedom, faith and the Afrikaner culture. It is by no means the end goal, which my community thrives on. No Ideal, but rather Riches and mind you, exclusively so. Im super inspired to be part of a Vision, a dream, a shared dream at that. Amen
Adv's Kumalu & Tuli Mandonsela said the very same things that is expressed in this interview nl that the new SA HAS not and CANNOT work under the Anc goverment where a fiew fat cats benifits while millions of ALL racegroups suffer in poverty every day. The Anc must be voted out in order to bring change for a new SA. My vote goes to adv's Kumalo & Tuli Mandondsela as frontiers pioneers for a new SA that pres Mandela stood for. Thank you very much in standing up for what is right in the present destroyed corrupt SA and may God help the two off you push ahead for a better future.
Awesome interview from both Gentelmen. The only way we will succeed in this beautiful country of us is to talk and lister to each other. We do not need a government to succeed. ONS SAL SELF
The Ora and the idea of Local/Community Currencies: Unique vouchers that keep money circulating within communities. Impact of blockchain & cryptocurrencies.
That is the truth about Afrikaners willingness to help, mentor and be there for South Africa. However after endless attempts to be available and to help, after strings of insults like, "you had your time now it is our time" or "you just want to bring back apartheid", many of us just gave up on helping.
I love the idea of the world as a community of (strong) communities - it is far more difficult for big governments/ corporations to destroy us that way...
I agree, by far the majority of Afrikaners will be very proud to share their knowledge and train people, the also want the country to succeed, it is wrong to believe that Afrikaners hate the English and the blacks, it is not true at all. The are speechless on how the country are being run, and see how everything is falling apart, but the knowledge of the people who were part of the country when it was a success are dwindling fast, we are dying and once that knowledge is gone, it will be hard to get it back. I am a firm believer of community "government" communities know what they want and they should be able to do what they believe.
You've been in power, why didn't you start then to share this knowledge? Did you want to see the country falling apart before doing something? I am not attacking you but please ease my doubts, if you've always wished good for everyone in this country why wait until it starts falling apart while you could've helped avoid that?
@@thabilemboza2425 For the same reason we don't hang people on the court lawn anymore, even though we used to not so long ago. Societies change, people change. The Afrikaners of today are not those of yesterday. Many people within the NP thought apartheid was the only way to preserve a white voice in South Africa. They did not think it was possible that communities could co-exist without signs telling them where they belonged. Naturally, the Afrikaners placed themselves at the top of this system, because that is what humans do. It is not exclusive to Afrikaners or whites, it's one group exploiting another like every other case throughout history.
@@thabilemboza2425we also have Black people who have the skills that Afrikaners have, but are not in contributing because they are not politicians and don't belong to Governong party.
The success of Orania is because they didn't define themselves as white, but as Afrikaaners. A cultural identity that created a community. Racial defenitions don't speak to our togetherness, but to our differences. If we want identity, don't define it on how the 'other' sees you, but on how you see yourself.
Thanks Penuel for introducing and promoting the Orania model to me and others, I truly respect you Umfowethu in the message you bring across. God bless
Penuel my bro, Mr Boshoff mentioned names of our own Black people that we can also learn from, such as Kgosi Lucas Mangope, we can learn a lot from what he did and built. Pity he's no more but it's not only white people we can or should learn from.
Conversation like this are the future of our greatest nation. ❤ Makes me proud to be South African .We can do it . Our Rainbow nation can be the idol of the future once again .
Black people need to go back to 'Black Consciousness' how do praise and want to be part of something that excludes you on the basis of your race, culture and africanness?? A necessary step towards restoring dignity to Black people, involves elevating the heroes of African history and promoting African heritage, Black consciousness to extract the positive values within indigenous African cultures and to make it a standard with which Black people judge themselves. People can say what they like about Rutendo Matinyarare but there is no denying his Pan Africanist/Black Consciouness, the way he narrates history and puts his point forward is liberating and makes me proud to be African/South African
@@rogerdlamini its an innate inferior complexity within some Africans. We have given authenticity to artificial places and things, i've lived in London for 3years i met white South Africans there, i was taken aback to realize that when they are in Europe or any other place besides SA they are regular europeans not 'Afrikaner or Boer' just regular Europeans that happen to be born in Africa. Whilst in SA we Authenticate Orania and their 'currency' and we subconciously accepted that we cant go there yet we want to keep out our own Africans
@@NinohBrown you couldn't have said it any better.. the truth is white's and black and be or work together.. Black people need to start looking for their own.
20:30 I agree with you Pen, if in 1994 freedom of movement withing the country was allowed as well as freedom of speech, trade and interracial marriage, the Apartheid government would still be in power and we would all love it.
WOW this interview virtually brings tears to my eyes.......all it actually takes is mutual respect.......listen to hear and most importantly to understand. Would love to share a dinner table with you. Thanks for a wonderful interview..
Gives you a bit of hope if two people who is so different can find such common ground and have a conversation with respect , need more talks like this ! Good work with this podcast
Penuel if ever, if you can read this book. You will understand what Carel is referring to as the thinking of Verwoerd! - "Van Van Riebeeck Tot P.W. Botha by Van Jaarsveld, F.A."
Hearing people talk about life during apartheid always sounds to good to be true, but then you see the remnants of that time on the buildings of that time, you hear it from the people of that time as well, then you realise they’ve humbly underplayed the achievements
hi, thnx for a intelligent interview . The power grid is a high maintenance thing , if you neglect it , it will break down . Most of the maintenance was just ignored , so suddenly everything starts to blow'up and gets blocked .Its not the previous governments fault that the maintenance schedule was thrown out the window .
I would say the best place to start is to get in contact with as many people as you can and start build a list of knowledge so that who ever want to do what Orania is doing they will have all the right people by there side, a single investor can help start a business model that will work for a specific community. A good example will be to manufacture small Vehicles for the SA market, It can be as simple as the Tuk Tuk's they build in India and China, they are very simple to build and it is affordable for most South Africans. There are thousands of ideas that can be borrowed from 3rd world countries that can fit the SA profile very well, we are more fortunate than all the other African Countries, all we have to do is get the right education programs in place, very importantly we must retain the knowledge that is leaving SA and put them to work and start reversing the damage that has been done.
This is dope info sharing very sensitive to some extent. I pass this comment on behalf of Saliwa Community that was burned down by Matanzima in 1977 near the Groot Kei River in Keilands. We are told that his intention was to disposes them of Chief Saliwas Land(AmaGcaleka) and give it to his people abathembu. Most of the children that were born after this brutal attack were left living under a great poverty. Our Parents lost everything under the iron hand of this coward things like Cows, Goats and Horses were killed and Houses were burned down. The Apartheid keepers (ANC) haven't paid our claim until this day.
@@rafiqueismail5090 I got goosebumps as he was talking about the place and the leader. 😯😩 The actor Thato Molamu who grew up under that regime, talked about it and the place with David Mashabela. As someone who was born in Mafikeng, and moved at around 11. I was very jealous when he described what that place used to be, cause it definitely was not the Mafikeng that I was born in. The ANC did a sterling job of destroying such legacies 🤮 and repressing great leaders. Now we have to look up to white folks, doing what great Africans did before them 😯😐That guy should be taught as much as Mandela, and I remember they refused to give him a state funeral. 🤦🏽♂️Ae!
@@MentalFacility-u7o You need to read Mandela's biography, the part where he describes the area where he grew up nd beautiful it was. Now the Eastern Cape is starving and it's people are fleeing, abandoning, to other Provinces.
No...He will not bring on a Ndabeni. Have you not caught on to the pattern or the slow subconscious programming... The sly, backdoor programming is to get black South Africans to embrace separatists movements which ultimately benefits (NOT BLACK PEOPLE). The end goal is to have black people stupid enough to loose parts of the land and have parts of South Africa locked out from black Africans.
Emotions do not hold people back, people hold them self back and blame emotions or other things. I can say this because you have the exact opposite with people not allowing that same bad thing that happened to stop them.
Penuel, maybe you’d like to read Feast of the Uninvited by PG du Plessis. That book captures in a very visceral way the forces that shaped the Afrikaner.
I like how Penuels social experiment is exposing umona in some black people, building our own communities will lead to more peace , you cant go to a place where arent welcomed in or cant keep to their laws and hw they do things , but ke people like being the victim. Please do more social experiments
There was a time when the ANC was offered to do the same as Orania in Transkei and Ciskei. The government offered them independence with millions in backing, but they refused to accept. Just imagine they had taken the offer and created states like Orania South Africa would have been vastly different. Now unfortunately the ANC we have has distanced itself from their original Freedom Charter and the people suffer.
Great conversation. Perhaps the British arrogance stemmed from their achievements at the time and judged by the norms of the time. They broke out of their land and spread their wings and brought " advancement " to huge parts of the world. Today its called all sorts of names but at the time it was spectacular.
I'm sick of everyone using the British as a convenient boogeyman/scapegoat for the evil systems that have existed in this country. As if no other groups bought into and enforces those systems when it benefited them.
Buthelezi tried he started by investing in schools that would provide the required educational culture .If I remember the Zulu leadership admired the VhaVhenda leadership under Mphephu. But all and all the Bantustans were working together to better things than 1994 came we embraced democracy but at the same time the democracy is the enemy of the identity of the people that was achieved by Bantustan leaders by themselves. The KwaZulu Government founded KwaZulu Finance Company which gave birth to Ithala Bank came democracy killed all those .In the Limpopo the Bantustans founded VBS came democracy killed VBS. During babu Buthelezi as the leader of KZN black. People had savings account with Ithala their salaries went through those banks ,black businesses borrowed from KFC ( KwazuluFinanceCompany) now I hear ANC talking about a black bank but they destroyed black banks
The sense of community is there, the land is there, the leadership is there, the economic opportunities are there, the business sense is there. Although @Siyabongangubeni9042 is correct, let it not hold the nation back. Keep building.
Next interview I want to see Panuel interviewing a Jew, telling them is also their fault in history, where did they go wrong and what have they learnt form Hitler 😊
The Chinese government lifted +800 million of their people out of extreme poverty and into the middle class in less than 50 years! that's more than the entire population of the western europe as a whole and the US combined, how did they achieve such a feat? In my view their former condition as a collective was far more comparable to ours as Africans in general and South Africans in particular, im looking forward to the day Pen interviews a Chinese national who'll educate us about their country. Otherwise this too is an interesting conversation, there's always something good and constructive to learn from the leaders of the boer enclave
It baffles me how one can say that the Apartheid government was way better at governing and allocating resources and wealth, not taking into account how the Afrikaaners were a minority at the time. Of course most people will benefit if we're distributing only to a select few. I'm not defending the ANC government, I'm simply saying they are expected to govern a 80%+ majority of people of which come from being underserved in the first place. I don't feel that's a fair comparison
Penuel, thank you so much for your show and the brilliant interview you had with Mnr Carel Boshof. Firstly I must say I admired your humbleness throughout the interview which led Mrn Boshof to open up even more. I also liked the way you humbly asked him the meaning of RECIPROCITY. Which, of course comes from reciprocating, to return a good favor in good faith. Or to give and receive in return. Lastly, I am kindly and politely asking for your contact details, e.g email address. There are things I would like to interact with you on the same subject of Orania, not on this platform. Keep up the great show. It is a great one. Thank you so much. E. Siwela
Ingiphathisa ikhanda le episode why cant we accept that Boers have the keys and copy their models instead of going back and forth with them about anything this is like a tutorial to me which I will be applying soon
True,UAE about Dhabi. Korean built reactor, handles base load and took 5 years,the cost emissions is long term very beneficial,yet Europe,Germany have gone back to coal burning,makes one think.
I found myself wondering, how do we create communities of communities without isolating each other but also not making it about "this" community vs "that" community. If covered later on in the pod then dont mind this question .
First we need to decide to judge a man by his character first… when we drop the race thing and see each other as South Africans first, then we could become a world super power. We need to persue a free market solution and leave the outdated failed white mans ideas from the early twentieth century… communism. Communism doesn’t and will never work
@@siphomabuselathey are not isolating themselves, anyone can visit, they are just another South African community showing the rest of us the way. Doesn’t mean we have to seperate by race or whatever, it just means we need to devolve South African into state specific legislation, so Durban rules for Durbanites, cape rules and ways for Cape people, Jozi ways for JHB. Etc. . We can all still freely move and live anywhere we want in RSA. That’s the only way we will make it work, but first we must teach people to let the idea of communism go, they have been lied to by outside enemies trying to take advantage of South Africans during the transition to democracy. They were using the people to try enact a global soviet take over… they were trying to exploit South Africans who were trying to defeat Apartheid and they exploited them. The enemy of our enemies past IS NOT OUR FRIEND. NO TO COMMUNISM.
Such a humbling interview to watch, loved the mutual respect shown between two very different but thoughtful men invested in a shared vision of prosperity for our nation- thank you @godpeneul @konvo_za 🙏
A vision of a common South Africa for all, where all races see South Africa as one country with one people. Not a fractured broken family with toxic parents, fighting one another while the world hurtles ahead, looking for our resources and exploiting our divisions. Conversation with one another based on mutual respect is a good beginning.
Panuel, as much as i understand what you intent to achieve with these episodes about Orania, here is something that you need to remember, people of Orania, had a vision, were determined to do whatever it takes to make that vision come true. Their progress took time... We, as brown people lack vision, determination, willingness to create our own reality. You just cant copy and paste...
@@hanyanem3657 Another assumption, bro is a mind-reader. I'm all for peeps to take full advantage of the constitution & as a libertarian i love it. Ill ask again, what does Panuel intent to achieve with these episodes about Orania?
I do wish that people can take the absolute believe in God as provider,also the willingness of the founders,the willingness of there children to hand the baton over to the next generation which follows,may the continuous I am sure success is and will always be yours.The strong will of the people to better there society is admireable.
There is not a lack of willingness to help build back our country from both Afrikaans and English speaking South Africans. Mark Barnes was well on his way to turn the Post Office around. But he gave up in the end. So now I'm wondering about State capture 2.0. Is the government going to hand the SAA over to Viktor Vekselberg? A Russian oligarch in exchange for his support of the ANC? That is a rumour. Or is it?
THE PENUEL SHOW WITH CAREL BOSHOFF
00:00 - INTRO
04:30 - Prof Carel Boshoff
09:35 - Good Afrikaner leaders
12:15 - Advice for angry black South Africans
13:25 - Improper wealth & knowledge distribution
17:40 - Why the Afrikaans policy failed
20:25 - Freedom of choice
22:45 - Skills sharing
24:43 - Future of education
26:45 - Highlights of Orania's development
28:17 - Self doen, Orania's bank
31:40 - Communal involvement & trust
33:40 - Copying from others
35:20 - Collaboration
37:10 - Paul Kruger
41:15 - Succession planning
47:00 - Orania's misconceptions
49:25 - Private institutions
51:04 - Tax loopholes
53:23 - Going off grid
59:49 - ENDS
Compiled by Khwezi Ndlovu
IG: kzndlovu
Tt: khwezindlovu
If South African communities can not learn from this podcast, they'll never learn.
I am truly inspired by this interview, deep inside all of us is a little Afrikaner but we suppress it. Why, because we want to be politically correct.
Keep this comment to yourself houseboy🤣🤣🤣
You are an Afrikaner. Afrikaner is just Afrikaans for African. We are many ethnicities within being Afrikaners. Having space and respect for one another to create ethnic spaces is the real battle. Because as soon as we think that way we are seen as being divisive rather than celebrating our ethnical differences.
People fear what they don't understand even if it can save them from themselves.
Native, Deep inside of us are the psychological effects of oppression, part of it is the projection you are force feeding yourself not n Afrikaner 🤣🤣🤣
Mental slavery and good colonial education is a hell of a drug
Goeie more aan al ons kykers en ondersteuners. Again, my deepest gratitude to Joost Strydom, our host in Orania - and Mnr Carel Boshoff for this sitdown.
Let's all learn from Orania. Kuningi esingakufunda kulabantu, esingakusebenzisa nathi emakhaya ethu.
Kom ons leer saam. Kom ons bou saam. Let's get to work! 🙏🏽✊🏽
You know Mnr.pen I would like to thank you for your openness to us Afrikaans people. As a new generation of Afrikaans people I have deep shame and regret for the past and that in itself makes me turn away from the conversation. But maybe I have something to offer my community and I should approach service without shame or fear.
Please keep talking to people with diverse perspectives and I will learn with you.
May God bless and Keep you.
Black Pen. Siyabonga nomsebenzi omuhle okwenzayo. Ons is baie dankebaar vir U. And to@@stevenbellew6590, thank you for your honesty. I have had the privilege of studying Clinical Pastoral care and one of the massive unspoken guilt is the white guilt that many Afrikaaners carry due to their past. Hearing more vulnerable stories like yourself will allow us to heal and hopefully build a better country together.
Like what? Grouping ourselves along tribal lines?... Building brick houses (I thought I already built one)?... please let us know. Building black institutions will require leadership that is not afraid of these people. Sadly ours current leaders can be easily pushed back and pushed out by the Afrikaners elite.
But we are only 30 years in... we will get there eventually. Without their help.
Please look for more Afrikaaner historian to share about the thinking and systems of the past,we learn a lot
I appreciate this. Thank you🤝🏼 I would love to see a conversation about the idea of Coloureds as Brown Afrikaners, an idea advocated for by Afrikaans thinkers like N.P. van Wyk Louw, Jan Rabie, Adam Small, Breyten Breytenbach and so forth. This is the platform for such conversations
Penuel, the more one listens to Orania representatives speak the more I gain a new perspective.
This Republic as we know it is very big for the current politicians to govern.
They may claim to but the reality is they can't, owing to lack of vision, individual greediness that is so persistent leading to untold corruption.
Unfortunately the current foundation under the current government has a bleak future.
Current international policy adds more negativity for the success of a Republic for the future.
This situation raise more anxiety to me personally.
Prof. C.Boshoff and others in your camp, you are shedding light most needed!
👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
I agree. If only all of us communities took our issues in our hands and made them better. We must be leaders and not look to especially the political class to lead us as they clearly don't have our interests at heart.
I could listen to Carel all day. He’s clearly a man who’s applied decades to developing his intellect and speaks with humility and grace. It’d be great to see him on again.
Baie dankie Penuel. I have learned a lot through this interview. You are doing groundbreaking reporting here. By doing this you are showing that for the most part the Afrikaner wants to co-exist. They want all people to succeed without giving up their identity. Community of communities.
Your identity is Holland and don’t be proud of your attitude towards black people. We were meant to forgive and forget but strangely you are openly opening old wounds. Nothing is great here.
Penuel, I truly hope you know how much you have to offer to this world.
Guests aside, you have a quality that is rare in today's world, in that you have the ability to investigate, have conversations with listening
In an unbiased manner and apply the data where relevant. Most importantly, you have a thirst for knowledge.
One does not grow if one is not prepared to talk without listening and listen without speaking!
Another brilliant interview. Thank you for your contributions to the conversations.
We must engage in order to disempower the politicians who seek to divide us. ❤
Really kind, beautiful words. Thank you 🙏🏽
I seriously couldn't have said it better. May you mostly have the wind on your back. Always remain strong in following your dreams and KNOW the energy you put into the world is what will be returned even if it may include some rough roads in-between 💖
@@vonniecronje3914 The Irish Blessing 🙏🏽❤️
Another great discussion, thank you Penuel and Carel. I have certainly learnt a lot about Orania.
A great interview between two intelligent people. Thanks for sharing this. This need more sanity like this going forward.
God, I admire these people SO much!
I can barely find the motivation to maintain or improve my home!
They built a community from scratch. That’s really something.
Pen, I must say this interview is much appreciated. I think as community we need to get this level of conversations..there is a lot to learn from these Afrikaans guys.. if it was for me I would have decided to go back as government to learn from these guys translate their frameworks into our language Morden life.. I AM A NATIONALIST.
Wonderful interview, Penuel. It is great to sit and listen to intelligent people...even if you differ with them ideologically. This community knows no crime, knows no unemployment, knows no infrastructure collapse...no potholes. This community relies on subsistence economy...something Black people have thrown away...hence we live on social grants. When the rest of South Africa is experiencing load shedding ...this community has its lights on...24/7/365. This community gives its children quality education ...in their language. Yerrrrrrr!!!
I am the product of a boer mother and a Welsh/ Irish English Father ...I love both and will protect my culture and heretige and the good things we created from our culture .
For this model of Orania to work you need a coherent community. Community Coherence is a scarcity in South Africa.
Dankie vir die onderhoud. Verandering begin wanneer jy verander.
"Those who cannot change their minds cannot change anything." - George Bernard Shaw.
Penuel You are doing stellar work and many of us admire and salute your passion wanting to uplift small communities It' is not fine to criticize this noble cause Poor people need hope dignity and skills So critics if you cannot help by rolling up your sleeves with your community Please be a Philanthropist and help him This is doable and much needed
A fair discussion without the usual one sided "angry black man pushing back onto a white guy answering questions" that become the norm these days whenever black and white people talk about history. Well done Penuel, a good discussion should not be about thinking who is right or wrong but to discuss ideas and solutions.
Right on point, this is a world 🌎 we want. We need each other to discuss the way forward.
These interviews are so incredibly interesting, thank you!!!
Once again , HIT this out of the ballpark ! Welldone Pen !
Very insightful. I'm a South African who now calls NZ home. I am impressed with the respectful interactions between the interviewer, Carl Boshoff, and Joos Stridom.
I am very keen to gain firsthand experience about Orania when i next visit the country of my birth.
Thank you Pen, the government banks on us not understanding history, hence our current education system.
Never blame the system. You are responsible for your own education. Libraries don't charge fees. That's where I learn. I could go to university.
Agreed, besides universities are indoctrination camps these days to far left, radical Marxism and postmodernism. You can learn so much simply by reading.
Thanks Pen interesting Did not know much on the subject of Orania I have enjoyed all the topics you share and best of all I was born in Newcastle those years lived in Lennoxton and schooled in paradise was a coloured school Migrated to Australia in the 80’s Love your shows
So honoured to have a Newcastle citizen here. I hope you're enjoying Australia. Thank you for tuning in 🙏🏽❤
The Penuel Show! Has always bought interesting discussions that are pregnant with lessons. The Orania discussion is one discourse.
Mr Penuel, would you do a show or discussion on Bophuthatswana. Please do it so we learn 🙏🏽
The Zulu guy is so thoughtful, respectful and intelligent. People like him should be ruling South Africa.
I think the banking sector and money part are practical solutions to the greater vision of preserving freedom, faith and the Afrikaner culture. It is by no means the end goal, which my community thrives on. No Ideal, but rather Riches and mind you, exclusively so.
Im super inspired to be part of a Vision, a dream, a shared dream at that. Amen
Adv's Kumalu & Tuli Mandonsela said the very same things that is expressed in this interview nl that the new SA HAS not and CANNOT work under the Anc goverment where a fiew fat cats benifits while millions of ALL racegroups suffer in poverty every day. The Anc must be voted out in order to bring change for a new SA. My vote goes to adv's Kumalo & Tuli Mandondsela as frontiers pioneers for a new SA that pres Mandela stood for. Thank you very much in standing up for what is right in the present destroyed corrupt SA and may God help the two off you push ahead for a better future.
@Pen your shows are really an eye opener. Balanced. I would vote for you meneer.
Awesome interview from both Gentelmen. The only way we will succeed in this beautiful country of us is to talk and lister to each other. We do not need a government to succeed. ONS SAL SELF
The Ora and the idea of Local/Community Currencies: Unique vouchers that keep money circulating within communities. Impact of blockchain & cryptocurrencies.
Thats a powerful situation to be in. Strong independent family groups and communities. Govts wont like that.
@@cjtannerza Exactly!
Thanks!
Well gedaan Oom🙏🏼🇿🇦
Thank you so much for your generosity 🙏🏽❤️
That is the truth about Afrikaners willingness to help, mentor and be there for South Africa. However after endless attempts to be available and to help, after strings of insults like, "you had your time now it is our time" or "you just want to bring back apartheid", many of us just gave up on helping.
Penuel meneer you're so knowledgeable and informative...and is not rocket science, is through giving yourself to reading and researching.
I love the idea of the world as a community of (strong) communities - it is far more difficult for big governments/ corporations to destroy us that way...
Eish guys the quality of cam 3 (assumption) facing Pen it is too dope, this is beautiful. All the best in everything...
Amazing
I agree, by far the majority of Afrikaners will be very proud to share their knowledge and train people, the also want the country to succeed, it is wrong to believe that Afrikaners hate the English and the blacks, it is not true at all. The are speechless on how the country are being run, and see how everything is falling apart, but the knowledge of the people who were part of the country when it was a success are dwindling fast, we are dying and once that knowledge is gone, it will be hard to get it back. I am a firm believer of community "government" communities know what they want and they should be able to do what they believe.
You've been in power, why didn't you start then to share this knowledge? Did you want to see the country falling apart before doing something?
I am not attacking you but please ease my doubts, if you've always wished good for everyone in this country why wait until it starts falling apart while you could've helped avoid that?
@@thabilemboza2425 For the same reason we don't hang people on the court lawn anymore, even though we used to not so long ago. Societies change, people change. The Afrikaners of today are not those of yesterday. Many people within the NP thought apartheid was the only way to preserve a white voice in South Africa. They did not think it was possible that communities could co-exist without signs telling them where they belonged. Naturally, the Afrikaners placed themselves at the top of this system, because that is what humans do. It is not exclusive to Afrikaners or whites, it's one group exploiting another like every other case throughout history.
Help offered were rejected or refused.
@@thabilemboza2425we also have Black people who have the skills that Afrikaners have, but are not in contributing because they are not politicians and don't belong to Governong party.
Why would they share the knowledge to people how openly attack them, and people how support race-based laws to destroy them.
The success of Orania is because they didn't define themselves as white, but as Afrikaaners. A cultural identity that created a community. Racial defenitions don't speak to our togetherness, but to our differences. If we want identity, don't define it on how the 'other' sees you, but on how you see yourself.
👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
Thanks Penuel for introducing and promoting the Orania model to me and others, I truly respect you Umfowethu in the message you bring across. God bless
Penuel my bro, Mr Boshoff mentioned names of our own Black people that we can also learn from, such as Kgosi Lucas Mangope, we can learn a lot from what he did and built. Pity he's no more but it's not only white people we can or should learn from.
Conversation like this are the future of our greatest nation. ❤
Makes me proud to be South African .We can do it .
Our Rainbow nation can be the idol of the future once again .
Urania makes sense to me now…thanks
Orania not Urania
@@sizwemeyer6076 English lol
You doing amazing work black pen
Black people need to go back to 'Black Consciousness' how do praise and want to be part of something that excludes you on the basis of your race, culture and africanness?? A necessary step towards restoring dignity to Black people, involves elevating the heroes of African history and promoting African heritage, Black consciousness to extract the positive values within indigenous African cultures and to make it a standard with which Black people judge themselves.
People can say what they like about Rutendo Matinyarare but there is no denying his Pan Africanist/Black Consciouness, the way he narrates history and puts his point forward is liberating and makes me proud to be African/South African
Just What I thought...
The Need to be accepted by others, cant africans look within
@@rogerdlamini its an innate inferior complexity within some Africans. We have given authenticity to artificial places and things, i've lived in London for 3years i met white South Africans there, i was taken aback to realize that when they are in Europe or any other place besides SA they are regular europeans not 'Afrikaner or Boer' just regular Europeans that happen to be born in Africa. Whilst in SA we Authenticate Orania and their 'currency' and we subconciously accepted that we cant go there yet we want to keep out our own Africans
@@NinohBrown you couldn't have said it any better.. the truth is white's and black and be or work together.. Black people need to start looking for their own.
20:30 I agree with you Pen, if in 1994 freedom of movement withing the country was allowed as well as freedom of speech, trade and interracial marriage, the Apartheid government would still be in power and we would all love it.
Without Land?
Respect to your open mind, Pen
WOW this interview virtually brings tears to my eyes.......all it actually takes is mutual respect.......listen to hear and most importantly to understand. Would love to share a dinner table with you. Thanks for a wonderful interview..
Gives you a bit of hope if two people who is so different can find such common ground and have a conversation with respect , need more talks like this ! Good work with this podcast
Penuel if ever, if you can read this book. You will understand what Carel is referring to as the thinking of Verwoerd! - "Van Van Riebeeck Tot P.W. Botha by Van Jaarsveld, F.A."
Hearing people talk about life during apartheid always sounds to good to be true, but then you see the remnants of that time on the buildings of that time, you hear it from the people of that time as well, then you realise they’ve humbly underplayed the achievements
hi, thnx for a intelligent interview . The power grid is a high maintenance thing , if you neglect it , it will break down . Most of the maintenance was just ignored , so suddenly everything starts to blow'up and gets blocked .Its not the previous governments fault that the maintenance schedule was thrown out the window .
Very good interview, this. So many misconceptions addressed and explained. Loads that we can learn, too.
What a great interview
I would say the best place to start is to get in contact with as many people as you can and start build a list of knowledge so that who ever want to do what Orania is doing they will have all the right people by there side, a single investor can help start a business model that will work for a specific community. A good example will be to manufacture small Vehicles for the SA market, It can be as simple as the Tuk Tuk's they build in India and China, they are very simple to build and it is affordable for most South Africans. There are thousands of ideas that can be borrowed from 3rd world countries that can fit the SA profile very well, we are more fortunate than all the other African Countries, all we have to do is get the right education programs in place, very importantly we must retain the knowledge that is leaving SA and put them to work and start reversing the damage that has been done.
Bantustan Leaders worth researching:
Transkei (Kaiser Matanzima), Bophuthatswana (Lucas Mangope), Ciskei (Thandathu Mabandla), Venda (Patrick Mphephu).
This is dope info sharing very sensitive to some extent. I pass this comment on behalf of Saliwa Community that was burned down by Matanzima in 1977 near the Groot Kei River in Keilands. We are told that his intention was to disposes them of Chief Saliwas Land(AmaGcaleka) and give it to his people abathembu. Most of the children that were born after this brutal attack were left living under a great poverty. Our Parents lost everything under the iron hand of this coward things like Cows, Goats and Horses were killed and Houses were burned down. The Apartheid keepers (ANC) haven't paid our claim until this day.
Mphephu is my man...
@@jabulanisaliwa4898 Thank you for sharing. I hope you'll get justice soon. Please put in more work in this regard.
Gazankulu - Ntsanwisi
Mangope ✊🏼✊🏼✊🏼
Only you have the power to break yourself free from history and make your own or to live in the past and let it suppress your future.
Excellent interview
Which there were more sincere interviews like this
Another breath of fresh air for the mind, thank you, so insightful, perspectives are indeed making 180s. 🙏🙏
We must learn from others 🔥🔥
Please get Mr Vuyisile Charles Ndabeni to speak on Bophuthatswana..we could learn a lot from that..he was on Ntsiki Mazwai's podcast
His description of how Mr Mangope managed Bop left me speechless. Wow
Agreed!
@@rafiqueismail5090 I got goosebumps as he was talking about the place and the leader. 😯😩 The actor Thato Molamu who grew up under that regime, talked about it and the place with David Mashabela. As someone who was born in Mafikeng, and moved at around 11. I was very jealous when he described what that place used to be, cause it definitely was not the Mafikeng that I was born in. The ANC did a sterling job of destroying such legacies 🤮 and repressing great leaders. Now we have to look up to white folks, doing what great Africans did before them 😯😐That guy should be taught as much as Mandela, and I remember they refused to give him a state funeral. 🤦🏽♂️Ae!
@@MentalFacility-u7o You need to read Mandela's biography, the part where he describes the area where he grew up nd beautiful it was. Now the Eastern Cape is starving and it's people are fleeing, abandoning, to other Provinces.
No...He will not bring on a Ndabeni. Have you not caught on to the pattern or the slow subconscious programming...
The sly, backdoor programming is to get black South Africans to embrace separatists movements which ultimately benefits (NOT BLACK PEOPLE).
The end goal is to have black people stupid enough to loose parts of the land and have parts of South Africa locked out from black Africans.
Emotions do not hold people back, people hold them self back and blame emotions or other things. I can say this because you have the exact opposite with people not allowing that same bad thing that happened to stop them.
Penuel, maybe you’d like to read Feast of the Uninvited by PG du Plessis. That book captures in a very visceral way the forces that shaped the Afrikaner.
I like how Penuels social experiment is exposing umona in some black people, building our own communities will lead to more peace , you cant go to a place where arent welcomed in or cant keep to their laws and hw they do things , but ke people like being the victim.
Please do more social experiments
What an intro. Genius
We dont NEED government.
We NEED each-other.
We definitely need a government.
There was a time when the ANC was offered to do the same as Orania in Transkei and Ciskei. The government offered them independence with millions in backing, but they refused to accept. Just imagine they had taken the offer and created states like Orania South Africa would have been vastly different. Now unfortunately the ANC we have has distanced itself from their original Freedom Charter and the people suffer.
Great conversation.
Perhaps the British arrogance stemmed from their achievements at the time and judged by the norms of the time. They broke out of their land and spread their wings and brought " advancement " to huge parts of the world. Today its called all sorts of names but at the time it was spectacular.
Quite spectacular. We're still living in British Colonial systems today and speak English.
I'm sick of everyone using the British as a convenient boogeyman/scapegoat for the evil systems that have existed in this country.
As if no other groups bought into and enforces those systems when it benefited them.
How I wish My Zulu Nation would learn and copy this model
Buthelezi tried he started by investing in schools that would provide the required educational culture .If I remember the Zulu leadership admired the VhaVhenda leadership under Mphephu. But all and all the Bantustans were working together to better things than 1994 came we embraced democracy but at the same time the democracy is the enemy of the identity of the people that was achieved by Bantustan leaders by themselves. The KwaZulu Government founded KwaZulu Finance Company which gave birth to Ithala Bank came democracy killed all those .In the Limpopo the Bantustans founded VBS came democracy killed VBS. During babu Buthelezi as the leader of KZN black. People had savings account with Ithala their salaries went through those banks ,black businesses borrowed from KFC ( KwazuluFinanceCompany) now I hear ANC talking about a black bank but they destroyed black banks
Yo you guys would be unstoppable 💪🏼 probably my favourite culture besides my own (Afrikaans) and you have truly passionate people
From what I understand, they are willing to give you the “ blueprint”!
No?
Got to put in the work and keep up with the maintenance.
The sense of community is there, the land is there, the leadership is there, the economic opportunities are there, the business sense is there. Although @Siyabongangubeni9042 is correct, let it not hold the nation back. Keep building.
Great job pen. Love this
Next interview I want to see Panuel interviewing a Jew, telling them is also their fault in history, where did they go wrong and what have they learnt form Hitler 😊
Dankie. Eks trots op jou
Self-governance. I did an interview on Orania.
ua-cam.com/video/Eo0ROx-iDEE/v-deo.html
The Chinese government lifted +800 million of their people out of extreme poverty and into the middle class in less than 50 years! that's more than the entire population of the western europe as a whole and the US combined, how did they achieve such a feat? In my view their former condition as a collective was far more comparable to ours as Africans in general and South Africans in particular, im looking forward to the day Pen interviews a Chinese national who'll educate us about their country. Otherwise this too is an interesting conversation, there's always something good and constructive to learn from the leaders of the boer enclave
Sometimes and at the right time and with passion tell the truth it's a good thing and it's always a story
Wow a civil dialogue with mutual respect. Great!
Wow thanks Penuel.. I'm warm inside just listerning to this interview (I lacked words hence I used warm inside)
It baffles me how one can say that the Apartheid government was way better at governing and allocating resources and wealth, not taking into account how the Afrikaaners were a minority at the time. Of course most people will benefit if we're distributing only to a select few.
I'm not defending the ANC government, I'm simply saying they are expected to govern a 80%+ majority of people of which come from being underserved in the first place.
I don't feel that's a fair comparison
Life is not about 'distributing' in a zero sum game
Would you care to elaborate?... especially on how that has to do with my comment.
Let me give a simple example, take the rand to dollar pre anc...
Go on...
@thabobonile5252 to what? Thats the clear difference between the apartheid and anc governments. The one was able while the other isnt.
You are doing the lords work with these interviews. God bless the black pen!
The Bristol Pound is another example like the Ora Voucher/Currency. Used to stimulate the local economy.
Good interview and much to learn from history of Orania
Mlotshwa, uyasebenza impela ndoda. Siyabonga ngomsebenzi wakho mlisa.
Penuel, thank you so much for your show and the brilliant interview you had with Mnr Carel Boshof. Firstly I must say I admired your humbleness throughout the interview which led Mrn Boshof to open up even more. I also liked the way you humbly asked him the meaning of RECIPROCITY. Which, of course comes from reciprocating, to return a good favor in good faith. Or to give and receive in return.
Lastly, I am kindly and politely asking for your contact details, e.g email address. There are things I would like to interact with you on the same subject of Orania, not on this platform.
Keep up the great show. It is a great one.
Thank you so much.
E. Siwela
Ingiphathisa ikhanda le episode why cant we accept that Boers have the keys and copy their models instead of going back and forth with them about anything this is like a tutorial to me which I will be applying soon
The picture quality👌🏽
True,UAE about Dhabi. Korean built reactor, handles base load and took 5 years,the cost emissions is long term very beneficial,yet Europe,Germany have gone back to coal burning,makes one think.
"South Africa becoming a community of communities" - Mnr Carel Boshoff (Has me thinking of big Afrikaner school derbies)
I found myself wondering, how do we create communities of communities without isolating each other but also not making it about "this" community vs "that" community. If covered later on in the pod then dont mind this question .
First we need to decide to judge a man by his character first… when we drop the race thing and see each other as South Africans first, then we could become a world super power. We need to persue a free market solution and leave the outdated failed white mans ideas from the early twentieth century… communism. Communism doesn’t and will never work
@@siphomabuselathey are not isolating themselves, anyone can visit, they are just another South African community showing the rest of us the way. Doesn’t mean we have to seperate by race or whatever, it just means we need to devolve South African into state specific legislation, so Durban rules for Durbanites, cape rules and ways for Cape people, Jozi ways for JHB. Etc. . We can all still freely move and live anywhere we want in RSA. That’s the only way we will make it work, but first we must teach people to let the idea of communism go, they have been lied to by outside enemies trying to take advantage of South Africans during the transition to democracy. They were using the people to try enact a global soviet take over… they were trying to exploit South Africans who were trying to defeat Apartheid and they exploited them. The enemy of our enemies past IS NOT OUR FRIEND. NO TO COMMUNISM.
Wena penuel ufuna ukthandwa belungu
@@siphomabusela en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cantons_of_Switzerland
THANKS SO MUCH GUYS AN TAKE CARE
Such a humbling interview to watch, loved the mutual respect shown between two very different but thoughtful men invested in a shared vision of prosperity for our nation- thank you @godpeneul @konvo_za 🙏
Mr Boshoff is a humble Afrikaner leader in Orania
A vision of a common South Africa for all, where all races see South Africa as one country with one people. Not a fractured broken family with toxic parents, fighting one another while the world hurtles ahead, looking for our resources and exploiting our divisions. Conversation with one another based on mutual respect is a good beginning.
Panuel, as much as i understand what you intent to achieve with these episodes about Orania, here is something that you need to remember, people of Orania, had a vision, were determined to do whatever it takes to make that vision come true. Their progress took time...
We, as brown people lack vision, determination, willingness to create our own reality.
You just cant copy and paste...
What does Panuel intent to achieve with these episodes about Orania? I must've missed it, enlighten us.
@@Star-hg1kt learn how other communities are doing it for themselves...
@@hanyanem3657 Another assumption, bro is a mind-reader. I'm all for peeps to take full advantage of the constitution & as a libertarian i love it. Ill ask again, what does Panuel intent to achieve with these episodes about Orania?
@@Star-hg1kt what do you think his intentions are..?
@@hanyanem3657 You the one that knows so say it ' as much as i understand what you intent to achieve with these episodes about Orania '.
This guy would make a great municipal manager in one the Metros…and that’s about it!!!
We're here to learn.
😢GOOD CONVERSATION 😤❤
I do wish that people can take the absolute believe in God as provider,also the willingness of the founders,the willingness of there children to hand the baton over to the next generation which follows,may the continuous I am sure success is and will always be yours.The strong will of the people to better there society is admireable.
There is not a lack of willingness to help build back our country from both Afrikaans and English speaking South Africans. Mark Barnes was well on his way to turn the Post Office around. But he gave up in the end. So now I'm wondering about State capture 2.0. Is the government going to hand the SAA over to Viktor Vekselberg? A Russian oligarch in exchange for his support of the ANC? That is a rumour. Or is it?
Its time to work together now differences aside.
Amen 🙏🏼 kom ons doen dit!
@@stevenbellew6590 there we go. Soveel as wat 'n boer 'n plan maak, moet 'n Zoeloe ook 'n plan maak
Good Konvo
I am curious to know how their bank system works and how it differs from the banks we currently have...
It's a co-operative financial institution. The explanations of such are available on Google.
For one it only serves white people
This was a fantastic interview.
Thanks Pen❤