They Are Wrong About The 6.5 PRC
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- Опубліковано 25 чер 2024
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In the mid 1990s people would laugh at my 6.5-284. pushing 140 grain Sierra match King @3000fps. I couldn't convince anybody about the 6.5, now it's "the new thing"
Takes years to become an overnight success.
264 win mag. Has been doing a 140@ 3000 a loooooong time! Nobody liked it either.
@@EricChmelarsky-vh7eq yes, would love a model 70 in 264 win mag but haven't found that pot o' gold yet
Late 90's into the mid 2000's we shot the CRAP out of 6.5-284 in club matches...
In Sweden we have been using the 6.5x55 since 1894, it is still our most common rifle competition ammo.
I'm in the U K and use a 270 WSM with 110 Barns ttsx at 3520 fps. It is a laser out to 500. Love It.
I use a 270 WSM and also love it. I wish it was used more often in these types of cartridge comparison videos.
I have called the 6.5 PRC a 6.5 Creedmoor magnum since I first read about it. And there is about as much ballistic difference between those two as between 6.5 Creedmoor and 6.5 Grendel: roughly 10% more velocity with similar bullet weights from the larger round. Barrel length can exacerbate or even eliminate those ~10% differences. The deer doesn't care if that 6.5mm 129gr projectile is coming from a 6.5 Grendel/Creedmoor/PRC, 6.5x55, 6.5x284, 6.5 SAUM, 6.5-300, 6.5 RPM, 264 Win Mag, or a 26 Nosler. Ultimately the only differences betwwen all of thes 6.5 cartidges are the effective range (based on velocity/bullet performance limits), and the ability of the shooter to hit the target. The latter has more to do with recoil than either bullet drop or wind drift.
A 300 Win Mag or PRC provides ~10% more MV than a 30-06. Which is like adding yardage to the effective range of a 30-06. The real-world improvement in yardage evaporates from diminishing returns because more recoil means less accurate shooting. Every shooter at every level typically shoots more accurately with less felt recoil. But people can't accept that. So they buy a whatever magnum to shoot whitetails at 200 yards, and consistently make bad shots or outright miss. They can kill a deer at 600 yards though because they have a whatever PRC or magnum.
I’m not experienced with magnums but I have a suspicion that they are harder to get as accurate even aside from recoil stress on shooter and system. Slower powders, lower raw repeatability. Just a hunch. But I agree with you wholeheartedly, depending on load, barrel length, etc the prc is just a creedmoor but you get like 20-60 steps closer. 7rm vs 7-08, maybe 100 yards difference at MOST in a hunting rifle. But we have lost track of the real nature if magnum advantages. They’re great at throwing a heavier bullet with high KE a moderate distance or , more importantly, shooting a lighter bullet much flatter and increasing the distance of no-guess holds by 15-25 percent. Thisnis typified by the twin release of the 338wm and the 264 wm. If you’re talking about lobbing the same high bc bullet you’re looking often at a difference of 25-40 yards max effective distance, and this is happening hundreds of yards past the ethical hunting ability of 99.5 percent of shooters.
What you don't understand is that even 10% velocity massively decreases drop, because it compounds. So 10% velocity gives around 20-25% less drop
@tedarcher9120 oh I understand that. I also understand ballistics calculators help me compensate for all of that, so it's really not a big deal at all.
@@sethwinn4061true, but 25% less drop means that the error is also 25% lower, you can be less precise and use simpler calculations. 6.5 grendel is only 10% lower muzzle velocity than 6.5 creed, but almost 50% more drop
Another way to think about is that mighty 7.62x39 AK cartridge is only about 10% more muzzle velocity than a puny 30 carbine bullet than can't even penetrate a denim shirt
Backfire, Finally someone mentioned the 3.14r2 reasoning the apparently small bullet diameter differences between calibers result in big frontal area differences. Thank you!
I calculate this stuff by instinct. It's important if you don't have sectional density numbers in front of you, to for example know that a 139 grain .284 bullet is equivalent to a 165 grain .308 bullet, not 150.
264WM, underappreciated but slaying for the last 65 years.
H1000 is awesome in the 264 WM
Good job Jim as always,,I’ve shot them all many times ,26 nosler , 264 win mag ,,6.5 rem mag ,,260 Remington,,6.5 creedmoor ,,any of these wonderful cartridges are limited by barrel length and that also includes new cartridges,,point well established Jim.
You shouldn’t have had to explain yourself. There are some smooth brains out there
I just have the 6.5x55.
But i keep watching content like this 🤔
Same here.
Same! I have the ackley as well does the same work.
I wish I had a 6.5x55
A while back this guy put a video and said he liked the 6.5 creedmoor way more than the prc and he said the creed delivered more terminal preformance than the prc. I can't finish this video I just don't believe anything this guy says
Just letting you know. That gun room/wall is 🔥🔥🔥🔥
Great vid! I was one of the people commenting on barrel lengths and I'm glad you cleared some things up - I have a 20" AR-10 6.5 Creedmoor and a 24" Bergara HMR Pro. I haven't had time to chrono them (4 year old is making suspicious noises in the house as I type this from the garage), but I'm looking forward to it. I confess to occasionally getting mad at the things you say in your vids, but really I wish I could get more range and hunting time. Thank you for the fun and informative content!
In a 20" PRC, the only powder that I could get a 143 gr ELD X to 2900 was RL-26 with a mag primer.
The 6.5 PRC is one of the most accurate hunting cartridges I've ever used. After hunting with nearly every bullet diameter from 243 up to 375 I can say that for big game 6.5 is the smallest bore diameter that I consider myself to be well equipped, simply because there's enough bullet weight and sectional density for adequate penetration. If you want a fast, flat, high performance hunting cartridge that is extremely accurate, has enough bullet weight for penetration, has mild recoil, is not ridiculously overbore, and is widely available in both rifles and ammunition, the 6.5 PRC is my top recommendation. A 140 grain Accubond at 3000 fps would do most anything necessary.
A 6.5 creedmoor with 147 eldmurders is a much better setup. A third less recoil and you can actually spot shots while still getting 700+ yards. Nobody is shooting a third more recoil better
@@pizzahunter808 I love the 6.5 Creedmoor - it is one of my favorite cartridges to shoot because of the lighter recoil and it is, if anything, even more accurate than the 6.5 PRC in my experience. But my recommendation above is for a fast, flat, high performance hunting cartridge for big game. I have used the 6.5 Creedmoor and the 260 Remington both for hunting and I've never had an animal get away from either one, but for big game hunting the 6.5 PRC has a bit more velocity and energy and in my experience anchors big game better than either of the other two. And the 6.5PRC is more than accurate enough for any big game hunting anywhere, and it is quite easy to shoot and handle. I don't feel that anyone has any business shooting 700+ yards away at any animal, period. But if you did, the 6.5 PRC would have more energy at that distance than the Creedmoor. To each his own.
@@8MM.PRC.HUNTER huh energy is meaningless. You pick the right bullet, put it in the right spot, keep it above the minimum expansion velocity and stuff dies. Could be a bobcat or a moose, doesn't matter. Listen to the shoot2hunt podcast bullet energy is irrelevant it's very insightful
@@pizzahunter808 I've been a hunter for some 40 years now and I've shot game with a bunch of different calibers and bullets over the years and while a hit with a marginal caliber is far better than a bad shot or a miss with a stronger one, a good hit with a stronger one is better than a good hit with a marginal one. There are many hunters who are able to shoot more powerful cartridges than the 6.5 Creedmoor accurately, myself included. So you continue with your Creedmoor, I will continue killing game with my cartridge of choice. But I suggest you get a lot closer than 700 yards.
For what little difference exists, I'm just going to stay with my 270win.
That’s exactly what I did.
Inside a few hundred yards there’s almost no difference between them. Past that the PRC runs away from the 270 with the higher BC bullets.
@@robobiss444 I want to call out a little bullshit on this. The numbers do not run away as you say. The Backfire channel has data on this. I load my 270 with a 145 grain ELD-X, at 3,015 ft/sec. I hit 12” plates at 800 yards with 1,020 ft/lbs of energy.
The 6.5 PRC advantage is small, but most rifles will have a more precisely cut chamber. That’s the real advantage.
@@falba1492 Yeah but your .277 145 ELDX despite being an awesome bullet for a .270 win (I am actually loading some now for a 6.8 western so we can keep the MPBR at 300 yards) has much lower B.C.’s than a 147 eld-m in .264 or a 156 Berger in .264.
They leave the muzzle at close to the same velocity but the .277 bullet of similar weight but lower B.C’s will lose velocity faster, the PRC will run away from it. The 6.5 will also buck the wind better. The less of a wind adjustment you have to make the less accurate your windcall needs to be.
With factory ammo, the PRC drops a foot less at 1k yards, and needs .3 less mils of wind hold with a 10MPH wind, that’s about a foot less of windhold at 1000 yards, that is NOT insignificant.
Sure, the differences aren’t as stark at 600 yards, but in factory configuration the PRC is the better cartridge, ballistically. The .270 needs a longer throat, a fast twist barrel, and to be built on a magnum action to be able to load long bullets that fit in the magazine and chamber, some higher BC .270 bullets would be cool too, Hornady hating on the 6.8 western has them not making heavy .277 bullets, unfortunately. They don’t even publish 6.8 western load data for the bullets they make, shame.
This is all coming from someone that owns a .270 win mountain rifle that I love to pieces and have knocked a ton of shit over with,
@@robobiss444 If that mountain rifle is a Rem 700 LSS, that is one of my all-time faves as well!
For the average guy, 1,000yds isn't a common situation. Since the bulk of my shooting is hunting dense woods of 50yds or less, or fields of 200yds or less, you can better understand my lack of enthusiasm for a new configuration that only mirrors a .270win. That said, I still appreciate your comments because it touches on knowledge I don't have/need.
Surface area discussion, picture and chart is GOLD!
Don't need either of them when you have a 6.5x55SwedishMauser(vintage 1894), in a modern CZ bolt action, a Remington 700 in 260 Rem(vintage 1996), or a Winchester Model 70 in 264 Win Mag(vintage 1958). Talk about reinventing the wheel!
If you reload you can really liven up the Swedish Mauser just like my 30/06 has a lot of punch with my handloads and new rifles that can handle the higher power. A lot of ammo for the older cartridges is loaded weak because of the old weaker rifles not being able to safely handle the max load rounds. Same goes for 45/70 my Ruger 1 can be loaded very hot compared to the commercial loads you get from ammo manufacturers.
I think you touched on some failures of the firearms industry on barrel lengths. Seems like they are pushing lightweight hunting rifles and to achieve this, I see many custom manufacturers (Gunwerks, Bergara, etc..) listing 6.5 PRC rifles with 20” barrel lengths. These short barrel lengths will never achieve the potential of that cartridge. I feel the 6.5 PRC needs a minimum of a 24” barrel, and the larger magnum rifles (7mm Rem Mag & up) need a minimum of a 26”. Why are these manufacturers misleading consumers by touting these hot new cartridges, then chambering the 6.5 PRC in 20” barrel lengths, or the 7 PRC in 22” barrel lengths ?
Because fireball size is everything.😂
They are designed to be used with a suppressor. Put a suppressor on a 26” barrel and see how ridiculous it is.
Yeah, use with a suppressor is the answer. I personally like a shorter, handier rifle, regardless of suppressor use. So a hotter round with a shorter barrel (6.5prc) is certainly still better than a milder round (6.5cm) with a shorter barrel. I personally would prefer the 6.8 western to either if we’re talking elk.
Becasuse so few consumers actually understand what they need.. and short guns look sexy/market well... so it sells...
Cartridges like the 7 saum, 7ss, 300 saum, 300 wsm, 308, 6.8 western, 6.5 cm are pretty efficient Cartridges in an 18 to 20 inch barrel with a suppressor. A 6.5 prc loses a higher percentage of velociy with a short barrel than the above mentioned Cartridges but it's not bad in a 20 to 22 inch barrel. I agree that if there is no intention to shoot suppressed, a 23 to 24 inch barrel is a more logical choice if velocity is paramount.
The biggest issue i see with most youtube vids are that cartridges are not compared to each other in an apples to apples way. And the bullets and rifle features like barrel length, barrel device (suppressed, brakes, no device), action length, rifle weight, recoil, etc are more important than the cartidge. Different cartridges do things differently and its about creating an efficient platform for the intended job and to match the shooter's needs and abilities. Overall this video was pretty good. I've had a 6.5-06 before it was cool to shoof a 6.5. The 6.5-284 has been around for years and is basically a 6.5 prc in a medium length action. Neither are faster than a 6.5-06 if all use 24 inch barrels with reloads. The 6.5 prc is the more useful of the 3 as it can be shot in either a short or medium action, its slightly better with a sub 20 inch suppressed barrel, its well supported with reloading components and has tons of factory ammo options.
In order to compare a 6.5 prc to a 6.5 cm, then we must use similar barrel lengths and bullets. Once a person starts to reload, there are even more options. Generally a 6.5 prc will extend the effective range of a 6.5 cm by 200 to 300 yards due to the higher velocity. Most 6.5 cm are not ideal for hunting with 140 to 147 lead core target bullets which have been adapted to hunting. The 130 to 140 grain bullets are a bit more efficient in a 6.5 cm. The 120 to 130 copper bullets out to 400 yards are legit hunting rounds in either a 6.5 cm or prc. Bullets over 140 grain in the prc start to take up case capacity in a standard throat or short action 6.5 prc. A medium length action is better for shooters wanting to shoot the 144, 147, 153 and 156 match bullets but these are better target bullets than hunting bullets in my opinion. In summary, the 6.5 cm is a better training round and the 6.5 prc is better for hunting. Both are excellent cartridges but with different strengths. Recoil us relatively light on both of them compared to the 7mm and 30 cal magnums.
Two days ago i was helping a friend load his custom 22 inch 6.5 prc. He had bought a box of vortex 127 lrx and they shot well. We chronographed 15 shots with an averaged 2975 fps with an es of 34. The rifle has about 500 rounds through the barrel, so it's very broken in We worked up loads with h4831sd from 56.5 to 60 grain using lapua brass and federal 210 primers. The best shooting and a very safe load is in the 58 to 58.5 grain range; velocities were 3140 to 3160 fps. The 60 grain load was near 3240 fps but hotter than i would recommend, even though there were no real pressure signs. This is just an example of what good reloads can do in a great caliber like the 6.5 prc. In theory and using reloads in a long barreled 6.5 cm compared to a short barreled 6.5 prc with factory loads, velocities could be similar but it's an apples to oranges comparison. Hornady has done a great job of launching new calibers. The 6.8 western is probably capable of replacing both a 6.5 and 7 prc but it's not well supported yet. In a custom rifle for a reloader, it's impressive. Thanks for the extra details on the 6.5 prc.
The most important thing you said is the 6.5 06 is faster than the 6.5 PissRC !….. The 6.5 06 has been around for ever and we didn’t ( NEED ) a new cartridge ! Its all about selling new rifles ! New is not always better it’s just different !…….
I have a 300prc, 6.5prc and a 7mm prc, as well as other calibers like 270, 300wm, 7mag 30/30, 30/06,308 and many more they all serve a purpose for different roles in hunting like terrain or even weather
If you can only have one? which one? :)
Don't back down!! You're absolutely right. I had a Creed, then sold it and bought a PRC. Shot deer with both, sold the PRC and went back to the Creed. Why waste 20 more grains of powder, have way more muzzle blast and recoil, have less room in the mag, less accuracy, and more meat damage.
Hard to beat the Creed for the perfect lightweight mountain rifle..... And if you get the long barrel, it makes fun shooting at 1000 easy!!!
I sold my Sweds and bought prc so I can be the one that shows up to hunt camp and rub it in the creedmoor manbun boys faces. The guys that never heard of 6.5mm until the creedmoor. Thats literaly why I got my Bergara 6.5 prc and I love it.
You nailed it Jim. If someone is looking for a 1 rifle do it all with moderate recoil 280 ackley, or 7 saum.
I agree, not to mention I already have a short action magnum bolt awaiting an action.👍
I happen to really like your videos you give us honest and really good information thank you for doing what you do
My daughter punched through a shoulder, breaking the femur, obliterated the heart, and passed through the other side of a mature cow at 400 yds last year. Rifle is a Weatherby Vanguard First Lite with 143gr ELD-X Precision Hunter ammo and it showed itself as good elk medicine.
The hart is way below the shoulder , how did that happen ?…….
@@thomasdaum1927 That is real magic there or an extreme angle downward shot that is virtually unrepeatable. All my hart shots never came close to doing any shoulder damage just a couple busted ribs.
@@bobmatley Yea me too , my shoulder shots usually double lung them and do not touch the heart . A high shoulder shot can sever th spinal cord and they drop in there tracks .
its fun when jim nerds out on this stuff!
300PRC hits harder than 6.5 prc 😂
love you channel. keep them coming... still want to see the Mtn reaper review and the 1895 drk on your channel
i saw !!!! it you keep teasing me with the mtn reaper i want.. i know its decent would love your input why is the new sako better
Winchester has the best product in the 6.8 Western, but their marketing department needs to be fired! Like yesterday already! The fact that Hornady claimed the top spot with a very good, yet slightly inferior cartridge should be a crime against gun buyers. We need all gun and ammo manufacturers to get behind the 6.8 Western. It's what we all want and need. Now we are left with buying a 6.5 PRC, but in the back of our minds there is a voice that nags... What if I had bought a 6.8 Western instead? What if there were plenty guns chambered in it? What if ammo was readily available? What if I could find a wide range of barrels and reloading equipment for it? What if? What if? What if? Winchester has charmed us, seduced us with their sexy 6.8, brought us to the the brink of orgasm and then got up and left us with a stiffy.
I was going to buy in order of choice a 6.8, 270 wsm, or 6.5 prc last. I got the 6.5 prc because of one thing...Ammo avalibilty. If their own manufacturers don't give us good choices and availability, we won't buy it. It's not marketing that failed. I look at it like this. Hornady went all in and could have lost a lot, but they play texas hold em and go all in. Winchester doesn't play all in, just texas hold em and they are worried, what if. That's why the 6.8 will go into obscruity.
Yes
Sad but true. How can winchester/browning expect other gunmakers and Ammo manufacturers get behind the 6.8 when their offerings have been so anemic. They had a good head start over the 7 prc but squandered it.
I have a 6.5 creedmoor and I’ve thought about adding the 6.8 western to the lineup. I’m torn between the 6.8 western and a 30-06
@@mr.caceres305 If you're only ever going to own two hunting rifles, I'd go with the 30-06, but the very next cartridge would be the 6.8Western and that would be to the exclusion of the 6.5/7PRCs, both of which it beats out. 6 cartridges cover a huge margin; 30-06, 300winmag, 308win, 7remmag, 243win and 270win.
I agree with your assessment of a 6.5prc I am from Europe and load a 6.5x55 with a long barrel to within 100fps of a prc so they all work
Great video.! I totally understood the first video. Lol. 6.5 PRC is a good new caliber. With that in mind, I shoot 6.5 Creedmoor and 6.5x284 Norma. I handload for both calibers. I can get close to same ballistics with the Creedmoor, out a 24 inch barrel and I can surpass ballistics with the Norma out of a 24 inch barrel. I see no need to add the PRC to the gun cabinet. Thanks for the great video's. ✌
I have a 6.5 creedmoor built with a long 28” Bartlein. With 45gr of RL26, I can get a 147 ELD to hit 2900fps. It’s more pressure than I’d prefer to run but the long barrel and RL26 lets me essentially get what most people use the PRC to get. Only with a lot less powder and recoil.
I thought about the 6.5 PRC but I already have a 270 Win, and it doesn't offer anything over that until past 400 yards, so I bought a 7mm PRC
Same here, I looked at 6.5 PRC, but I already have a .270 Win that shoots handloads 145 ELD-X bullets lights out. I want a Fierce Carbon Rival XP 22" Carbon fiber barrel in 7PRC. I do plan on eventually buying a suppressor and already have acquired reloading components for it. Just need to find the rifle in the color I want, or pay MSRP by ordering it directly and waiting a few months.
Thanks to this channel I have better understanding of cartridges
6:44 quick correction:
The entire cartridge length on a 6.5 PRC is 2.955" - as stated correctly. The image however shows only the case being measured, which should be 2.030". Otherwise it would have a case length comparable to a .375H&H Magnum (2.850") or similar
Just wanted to let you know, keep up the great work 👍🏼
In my 6.5 PRC, I am running the 153gr A-Tip Match loaded over 65.0 gr Ramshot LRT at 3015 fps (27" barrel) it has plenty of power and the legs to get to 2000 yards if you want it to.
Would love for you to do a video on the Ruger .204 for us varmiteers!
It's basically the 270 Win. but more expensive.
Actually, the 6.8 western is the souped up .270. Hornady and other ammo manufacturers are trying to kill this caliber by not producing the ammo. Not sure why.
If you have a .270 stick with it. If you want a hunting rifle to actually hunt ethical ranges with get a .270
Good video….shows that barrel length matters a lot in all magnum calibers
Jim I really like your videos and research commentary. The 6.5 “clarification “ video was another good one . Just one mistake on the overall cartridge length you presented twice in the video, the 2.955” is case base to bullet tip not the case length itself. This the SAMMI spec . That’s to fit in the magazine and feed without interference. Some manufacturers use extended clearance magazines, such as Sako, to accommodate the seating depth of the longer bullets when hand loading. I can seat 147gr bullets well over 3.00” with room to spare. And yes, the 6-5 is a fantastic cartridge. And uses much more powder than the 6.5 Creedmore to get that 200 fps advantage .
People always forgot to put the 6.55x55 in this sort of comparison
The old 6.5 sweed, will do anything the Creedmoor will do with a 1-8 barrel. Tikka makes a rifle, 24" 1-8 twist. Modern loaded, almost identical.
And only 120 years later.
6.8 western is just a monster. That 50% smaller wind drift. Just the best
Jim, good information that can hep the hunter select the appropriate cartridge. Also, you have reaffirmed the wisdom of Jack O'connor and his promotion of the .270 Winchester, the one he referred to as the Queen of the Mountain Rifles. Technology advances, new cartridges come along, but the .270 Winchester is still a valid choice.
I just bought the ruger go wild in 6.5 prc it has been shooting norma whitetail hunting ammo 140 gr at 100 yards .45 inch five different times on different days, needless to say I was pleasantly surprised!
Any 6.5 mm cartridge with case capacity equal to or greater than 6.5-284 Norma needs a 26 inch barrel minimum to achieve the velocity.
You explained what you meant. Not to hard to understand unless your a Fanboy of the PRC. I never buy short barrels for exactly what your describing. Keep up the good work. Very helpful.
CW
It watched that video and got your point.
You could make the same arguement with a 24 inch barrel 6.5 grendal and a 18inch 6.5 crd.
Or with a 24inch 308 and a 20inch 3006.
I cut a 308 to 16inch for a bush gun and suppressed it. But when i tried shooting past 300yards it was like lobbing a morter round out there. For ease of carrying it bush i lost my velocity and ablity to take game at longer ranges.
Well done. Even if folk dislike the intense report from a muzzle brake, it is still absolutely a viable and effective option for effective recoil reduction. This option puts heavier recoiling loads back down in the lower recoil range. I am not personally a big proponent for myself but a muzzle brake has offered my youth a better ballistic option for hunting until they get more size to handle heavier recoil.
Seems like an ideal hybrid hunting-precision round.
The 6.5 PRC is a decent cartridge but .270 Winchester has been doing essentially the same thing since 1925. Yes the drop of the 6.5 PRC is better for long range stuff but I mean if your hunting past 400 yards most are using a 7mm or a 30cal
The 30-06 was doing what the 308 is doing. Just think if no one ever thought to make the 308.
@@Halcyon1861 not knocking the 6.5 PRC it’s an excellent cartridge. I have a 300 PRC but I have a .270win so no need to buy a 6.5 PRC it doesn’t fill any role I need filled. The .270 has a larger frontal diameter and about the same drop and drift with around the same powder capacity
@@EasternMountainHunters The point of the 6.5 prc isn't for people that have a 270 and already don't need a 6.5 prc, or want to get rid of the 270 to get one. Nor is that the purpose of almost all 6.5 prc videos.
@@Halcyon1861 i understand why most people are doing videos about 6.5 PRC I just don’t believe in all the hype that it’s the best next thing to sliced bread like everyone is selling it as. Is it a good design yes and I like the design. I like the 6.8 western design better to me it’s a larger diameter and beats the 7 PRC in drop and drift in some instances. I look at these things from a utility reason. If I’m buying a whitetail or mule deer cartridge then sure 6.5 PRC but for elk and larger I’ll stick with .270cal or larger
The sextion addressing surface area is very important to look at. The smaller cals will never be able to match the mechanical wounding of the 30's and up.
Best regards from Brazil
Hammer Bullets force multiply any cartridge in terminal performance with lighter than standard bullets.
Living in the southeast I prefer a bigger hole and don’t care so much about longer range performance.
Awesome review! Best regards from Sweden. I realy likes the 6,5 PRC, my family have hunt Moose, for many decades with 6,5X55 Swede. So i like the 6,5 calibers wery much
I’ve run all brands of bullets and laugh if you will settled on these loads. 125 grain partitions @ 3318 fps anything under 300 with a 200 zero it’s game over for whitetail also 140 Berger elite 2905 fps. 130 SGK @2930 for big holes. Have a 142 ABLR @ 2900 for elk. Low recoil and loaded with love and its lights out. Great hunting round
I have a 26” 6.5cm and it drives a 140gr to 2900 pretty easily. In soft nosler brass, without giving up case life. It seems that most prc’s come in short barrels and end up in the same place.
That said the prc will always be a touch more than a cm all things being equal. But 150ish fps faster with the exact same bullet won’t be noticed on game at normal sub300m distances.
My target rifle was a 26” barrel howa in 6.5 CM. With Peterson SRP brass and only 41.5 grains of RL16 ran 2804 fps. It had room to go more but was shooting 1/4” groups so I saw no need to push it further.
What about the 6.5-300 weatherby mag I’ve never heard you talk about it
So I have a 270 that I cut the barrel down to 20" to suppress it. From what you said about 6.5 prc shooting a little over 2700fps with a 20" barrel, I'll stick with my 270. My 270 is shooting the barnes 130gr TTSX factory loads at 3022fps with box posted at 3140fps and 130gr federal fusions at 2923fps with box posted velocity at 3050 and hornady 145gr eldx at 2821fps with box posted at 2960. Seems to me 270 maybe just hair more efficient just lacks the higher bc bullets.
James, I understand that you kinda had to make this video, however the original point still remains true. The prc with a short barrel IS virtually the same as the Creed with a longer barrel! I can't see purchasing a prc in a 20" barrel and not just buying a Creed for lower recoil. I've been seriously considering a 6.5 prc 24" gun to do everything for me in a lightweight sheep//goat style gun - perhaps a Kimber84 action with a pencil thin 25" barrel like the mtn ascent or Tikka t3x superlight
You should seriously consider the Bergara Wilderness Ridge Carbon. Lightweight and extremely accurate especially in 6.5 PRC. Love mine!
@@jonbaniak9097 I will check it out
If you're a sheep hunter then you don't have a budget. Have GA build you one, no one knows it better!
@@jmed7097 why stop there? Fork out $12K to Gunwerks and take all the guesswork out. They put the scope on and develop custom loads for your particular gun. Perfect for the rich guy who doesn’t have the time or the skill to do it himself.
@@jmed7097 I think the bergara would be a good option to going full custom. If I'm not mistaken, the bergaras were 1st to put the sub moa guarantee on their rifles
Wounds are a combination of things. What many ignore is the cavitation wound, or the temporary wound track. Tissue is damaged through that temporary wound track, especially in spongy tissues like lungs. I use a 6.5 Creedmoor, arthritic shoulder, and this round has put venison in the freezer no problem. I have the most versatile tupe of rifle, an AR 10 in 6.5 Creedmoor, if I want to go big like moose; a quick barrel change and I have a .308 with only having to do a quick sight in and I'm good to go. Bottom line is shoot what one can shoot accurately to put the animal down in one clean quick humane shot.
As a new gun owner and hunter i was considering 6.5 cm or prc. I wanted something to start in long range target shooting while being able to hunt with it, mostly deer but if a moose or a bear shows up i want to be sure that it's fine too. Keep in mind i hunt in a blind and sub 50 yards, at least for now. I'm sure the cm would be fine at that range even for moose. But the additional power of the prc give me that more security plus i can shoot flatter and further at the range.
Bought a tikka t3x 6.5 prc, slapped an mdt muzzle break on it which made a huge difference. Recoil is still too big but my shoulder doesn't hurt anymore. Looking into a getting an mdt chassis.
Now my problem is that the my local range stop at 200 yards.. but one thing at a time
Good point but if you spend lots of $ on a nice rifle, you may want to shoot it often, the PRC is hard on your barrel and shoulder after some time on the range. A great cartridge but with tradeoffs like everything else. I went 6.5 CM, 308 and 7 PRC.
It sounds like everyone is trying to get .264 Winchester performance.
You left out the F-class open shooters are necking the 6.5 PRC up to 7mm calling it the PRC-W for Wheeler. They are dominating 600 and 1000 yard competitions with it. Shooting a 180 Berger hybrid out of it at 2950 fps, it's an impressive, and versatile cartridge
Sorry, I know I'm old and quite probably behind the curve on all this this new stuff but, I prefer to hunt elk with something bigger than any of the 6mm's. Shooting past 400yds seems foolish.
He’s not talking about 6mms old timer
@@APACHE529CREWCHIEF What's he talking about?
6.5 WSM but with a better advertising dept.
The .260 Rem fell into the same hole.
6.5 HSM 😂
Great video 👍👍
Nice calculations!
But, how big a needle do you need to pop a balloon? If the bullet penetrates the vitals and at least does some damage, the job is done. Over here in Sweden one of the most common moose cartridges is the 6,5x55. Then again, Sweden is covered in dense forest so the average range is ~70 yards. And the average flight distance before the moose drops is also ~70 yards.
The bigger calibers have one big advantage, you get a better blood trail from a wounded animal if you miss the vitals. For that reason I use the 6,5 when I stalk, and the 9,3x62 for driven game.
Very nice video. The most important thing is barrel length in performance. Some people love short barrels. I myself want a barrel that gets the most out of the cartridge and think that too many manufacturers sell rifles with barrels that are too short and not giving the performance they should be getting. Lots of unburned powder with large calibers being shot out of short barrels. You even have people wondering why they are not getting the velocity out of their cartridges when Dah you have no barrel length. Nice video. I am sure you lost a lot of people that just can't grasp reality. You did have so much other stuff that matters as well but the real deal is if you want a bullet to perform whatever bullet it is you should have a minimum optimal length barrel. Obviously, you can get even more performance out of a barrel by making it longer, but you can carry only so much. One needs a 26-inch barrel minimum for a magnum cartridge. Everything less than that would do well with a 24-inch barrel even all those they are selling in 22 inch and below barrels. I guess that doesn't work for those running suppressors, but that is a tradeoff getting reduced performance.
The 308 is great for short barrels, mine is 20" and suppressed.
@@jimellison8965 That's nice. It would be a good set up for my farm where I have a field that is only 155 yards and I do have another field that is 250 yards that I do think it would be OK for as well but not my choice for that field. Nothing wrong with wanting suppressed especially for less than long range shots. I hate holdover and like point blank sighting when hunting. Sometimes there is not much of a window for the shot on a big buck.
12:09
Almost gonna need to start including Rifle Barrel lengths, in these statblock comparisons.
Because you just mentioned that the Creedmoor and the PRC, balance out, if the barrels are not similar.
Yes, a t/c encore in.219 donaldson wasp, at one in 2 rem 700's, one 8mm rem mag, one in.22-250😊
If a 6.5 PRC is the equivalent of a 270, why is the 6.5 such a hot commodity when it already exists in a 270?
Long bullets and fast twist barrels
Jim, you mentioned the recoil in the 7 PRC being more than the 6.5 PRC. I recently purchased your new recoil pad for my new 7 PRC. Will you pad and suppressor or muscle break reduce recoil to more shootable levels?
Please review the 375 Ruger! almost nobody talks about it!
You should do a long barrel project showing how much fps you can get with a longer barrel 30 + inch
I like a 25" bbl when I order customs. Longer barrels are free velocity. A lot of guys I know go the other way, and prefer a larger case in a shorter barrel.
Very happy with my 300 PRC :D
More bigger, more better. Oh, the 300 prc has too much recoil, say the guys with flowers on the boxers.
@@EricChmelarsky-vh7eqman put a brake or suppressor on and it’s like someone pushing a pillow into your shoulder.
hey not related to 6.5 prc lol but are you going to make a backstop pad for a remington 700? do you have one already?
Do you have experience with the 6 mm max. What do you think about it.
What do you think is the best rifle for 6.5 PRC in 24 inch barrel? I keep searching but all I can find are 20 inch! I was going to buy a Bergara Crest, but that one is also 20 inch barrel!
you were right!
Have you redone all your articles with the lower velocity of the 7mm PRC from your previous "Lies" video? Just wondering about the comparisons after the adjustments. Maybe I missed something in the articles but are those based on real data or manufacturer stats?
Lower velocities are only coming from Hornady factory ammo the multiple other companies loading 7 prc are achieving correct velocities.
Seen a feller put numbers up from .22-.257ackley and man they were impressive
Thanks for the clarification: The 6.5 PRC world must of thought they came across the .308 Win. Ron Spomer for the 6.5 PRC. LOL! The greatest advantage of the 6.5 PRC over the .300 Win.; 6.8 Western; 7 PRC is the recoil. This is one of the BIGGEST reasons I built my custom Western Rifle in the 26" 6.5 PRC. I can get the rifle light and my OCD for accuracy is stayed with recoil that I can mentally manage and the terminal performance with the Nosler ABLR both in 142 and 150 grains has the best of all worlds in the bullet conversation: Expansion, Energy dump, and Penetration. My Antelope/Mule Deer Wyoming hunt last fall was fantastic in performance even in a 10-15 mph crosswind that I didn't know was crossing the open valley plain because I was prone between to large prairie hills with nothing but a light breeze. At 481 yards my shot shifted @5-6" and I still made contact and I harvested the animal thanks, in part, to the higher B.C. of this particular bullet. This is a caliber my children can handle as well.
What optic model do you have on yours sig cross?
Ok I shoot from .22 through 470 Nitro Express and in between! I fell for the hype of the 6.5 PRC especially being a .284 fan ! I didn’t buy the 7PRC cause my 280 AI will do anything it does and has proven itself in harvesting of game. I also have noticed that every You Tube channel that shoots the 6.5 PRC gets the same type of groups two tight one a bit off! These have been shot with every type of powder from VV565-Retumbo and I hate to say it the accuracy is not there as it should be!? So most are coming with a 1:8 twist for the heavier for caliber bullets. I have the Savage Ultralite with the carbon proof barrel . While a very nice rifle the accuracy so far with Hornady 143 ELDX, Nosler 142 ABLR and factory hunting and match loads it’s acceptable for most but not for the % of shooters that expect accuracy especially when you are paying the prices they are asking today for the rifles. I may have made a mistake in my purchase of the 6.5 PRC but then I have not been able to find the bullets I wanted to shoot in this caliber and that is the Berger 156 hunting VLD! Berger however is only producing their match bullets right now and will start the hunting line up in early fall too late for most to get a load worked up for hunting! Last point while Hornady /Ruger developed the parent cartridges for the PRC it doesn’t mean that the vulmetric pressure the cartridges achieve are optimum and could actually be falling short of the goal they have on paper! One last note if you have a 270 WSM and could swing a barrel change in a 1:8 twist instead of the 1:10 the 6.8 Western wouldn’t have a chance! I finish with one last thing remember the .264 Winchester Mag. Seems like the 6,5 PRC is the modern day version!
Yep. Put a 1-8 barrel, 26 inches, on a 264, bet you it would speed along a bit faster than the prc.
I have a 6.5PRC and wish I had a 6.8W.
Buy the 6.8 to enjoy both of them.
@@tammyfuller8827 I am going to sell the 6.5PRC Tikka and buy an X Bolt. I really don't like the real world velocities I am getting with my Tikka despite a 24" barrel..
Try reloading with hammer bullets. I have a 21” Prc and getting 3200fps with 125gr hammer hht. It hits pressure at just above that… eldm in the same weight class maxed out at 2800. With 24” barrel, guys are getting 3400 with the hht.
The 6.5mm Bullet has been around for over 100+ years, all that’s changed is the case dimensions and powder. The entire total noise makers against it are just uninformed and so dedicated to a particular round the refuse to accept facts.
The 6.5 Creedmoor is a great cartridge, but more importantly, it started a craze and opened the door for more 6.5 cartridge options.
The 6.5-284 Norma started the 6.5 craze in the late 90’s when comp shooters started setting 1000 yard records with it and it wildcat variants. The 6.5 CM was just an attempt at following that same path in a short action cartridge.
jim, i love the detail you go to in your reviews. i'm a data guy, so i get it. in my experience; 100-400 is the true kill zone for 90% of the hunters out there. if i'm interested in just ringing steel, i get the argument you present at long distances....and the barrel length comparison is another relevant discussion at the moment, but to drop something based upon rotation and the expansion, i'll stick with my trusty .308. keep up the great content.
I’ve always felt that your reticence towards the 6.5 PRC was from your negative experience with your Wildebeest in Africa. I’m assuming that it was shot with an ELD-X bullet, which in my opinion, flies well but is fragile on impact. I’m loading my 20 inch barrel Christensen Ridgeline 6.5 PRC with 140 grain bonded Speer Impact bullets and getting just over 2900 feet per second. I’m intending to use this on elk and feel with good shot placement, it should be adequate. Thanks for your great channel!
I took a Bergara hmr in 6.5 prc to a 8" plate on my first day at 250 yards. It was great. But what was better was 2 weeks later hitting a 10" plate at 1030 yards on my cold bore shot. I'm forever sold. For the record I went 6-10.
Shooting a Tikka T3X 6.5 CM 24.3” barrel length, 140 gr Speer Hot-Core flat-base over Superformance Powder, Win. Lg Primer at 2840fps at 10’ for Avg of 5 shots. No pressure issues temp was 89° F @ 1200’ elevation. 73% humidity. I was not able to get the listed 2900 fps as per Sierra Manual but close. I am 110 fps slower then the listed 2950 fps for the 140-143 high BC boat tail Hornady and a 24” barrel length.
The only question now is what new cartridge will Hornady create for those wanting to say they own what they believe everyone else wants?
Well said my friend 👏
Interesting. I recently got a Tikka Veil in 6.5 PRC and love it. It seemed to be the logical step up from my Creedmore. Currently, my best load is a Sierra 130 Grain Tipped "Gamechanger" that averages about .45 MOA. It's on 58.3 grains of H-1000 and clocks in at 2930. I would like to think it would be OK in this configuration for an Elk out to say, 500. My Strelok program indicates it retains 1,700 Joules at that distance. Any thoughts? Also the discussion on surface area/bullet diameter is interesting. I think cavitation shock plays a big role too with the smaller bullets that are moving faster and I wonder how much of a compensating effect this has.
Should handle elk just fine. I chose the 156 Berger and dropped a 6x6 bull at 360. Knowing your bullet construction will dictate your shot placement. Copper = high shoulder; Lead/Jacketed = Lungs.
@@sick7six1 I tried the 143 ELD-X and it just wasn't doin' it for me in that rifle. It's fine in the Crudmore, however. I used to love Accubonds, maybe that's the answer if I want to go to a 140 in the PRC. But, I would not mind trying a Tipped TSX. The Sierra's just shoot so well and they are cheap. But as the old adage goes: Your get what you pay for - LOL!!
@@yz8096 my buddy has great accuracy using 127g lrx in his 6.5prc. Trial and error. Good luck!
@@sick7six1 Yeah, I run a 120 Barnes Tipped TSX in my light creedmore (6.5 Creedmore Weatherby Altitude) for woods hunting and it's only for thick stuff but man, does it put a white tail down. I can imagine it would be quite effective at higher velocities and longer ranges. I will definetely consider it.
Seems from my limited experience on this subject the 6.5 prc and the 270 are about the same. Yet I can find ammo for the 270 just about anywhere; and for a more affordable price. so why is the 6.5 prc getting so much love?
Would you feel the same about 7mm PRC? That a 20 in barrel 7mm PRC is pretty much the same as a 24 inch 7mm mag?
Finding the hunting ammo can still be tough. Hornady ammo is the main supplier. I sometimes see some Nosler ammo. I scored a deal on a Tikka T3X 270 Win , cloud veil, cerekote, NIB for $825. Shelves are FULL of 270 ammo from many companies. We seem to be swallowing all the Hornady marketing Koolaid. 😂 Not bashing 6.5, just not impressed by it. That 6.8 western looked great, but the ammo was never available
Have you heard of the internet? Yes there's a website called "gunbroker" go to your google and type in "gunbroker" and then in the search bar type in "6.5 prc in ammunition" and then come back and tell me how much ammo there is.
.270 💪
I thought your chart comparing the 6.5, 6.5 PRC, 6.8 Western, .270 & 7 PRC was very interesting and very telling. The 6.8 Western really stands out in the list especially the wind deflation at 400 yards. This doesn’t surprise me in the least. What does surprise me is how little press and recognition the 6.8 Western comparitively receives. And it appears to me with Hornady refusing to make available reloading or selling a 6.8 Western cartridge is an attempt to squash the competition and it drives me crazy with the success Hornady has had in the industry that they feel so intimidated to the point they would like to see it die on the vine. So I’m hoping you and other media outlets will contribute to keeping the 6.8 Western alive and thriving. Just as the .270 WSM never got its due, let’s make sure that doesn’t happen to the 6.8 Western. Just my 2 cents.
A lot of interesting 6.5's out there. If I were 30 years younger I would probably get the prc but I don't see anything about it that would convince me to get rid of or replace my 270 Win. Lots of hype over nothing.
Just think if no one ever thought to make a 30 caliber shorter than a 30-06.
It's not nothing. Maybe if you don't know how to shoot further than 200 yards. Does wonders for 500 yards and out
@@Halcyon1861Only one of any consequence. 300 WSM.
@@HazardousRobYou obviously have no idea what a 270 Win can do? The gentleman is absolutely correct in his assumption.
@falba1492 very well aware. I've only been hunting with them for about 30 years now.