Excellent question about Skyler White. Even the great Gore needed to think about that one. This is why I prefer watching Gore on this channel over his own. Great guests, great interviewer. Love it.
Yyyeahhh right, that was the disneytized thanos who wasn't allowed to b without a thing, ppl can use as help to see him as "actually no bad dude ,just a victim of circumstances", like disneytized villains allways r done now. The real thanos killed half of all life to impress a woman which happened to b death incarnate. How redemable that would look, i wonder? Thanos as a powercrazy wannabygod with a fragile beta ego bedded in the most gigantic narcicism ever seen. But in change for the disneytized actually misunderstood victimillains, they also took away something else. Because their antagonists aren't "really" evil, u now of course, can't give him a redemption arc cuz u need to b a sinner to b redeemed. And u have to b aware of acting wrong to feel guilt, u can still lie about ur motives, even to ur self but as soon u write a villain to b truely convinced to act morally it takes away from whatever evil stuff is done. A part of true evilness is the hidden n selfish motiv in the insidious -, or the openly cruel monstrous evil. It can b a sin worth it for a selfish goal, or a sin because of having the power to do so. Power only really exists when it's used, n between ppl power can only used by one, against some one else, so the villain has to hurt others cuz his power is worth nothing iin theory n has to b shown to b acknowledged. I'm frankly a lil' biased cuz i'm a fan of darkseid n since i know that jack kirby himself said that thanos is a copy of him in design, i can't find anything good in him any longer, but if we start challenging their feeds n strip thanos of his gauntlet, their really is not even remote similarity - "Darkseid is !" ;) But seriously that is a constant thing about creating evil. U even see it in real live, if u r busted n convicted as comic thanos u go to jail as inmate. Do it n get convicted as movie thanos u will go into a clinic as patient, doing therapy instead simply ur time.
Actually, the theoretic possibility for a redemption arc is the best way to quickly find out if a villain was written well or not. If his whole story already goes out it's way to make him simpathic, not to others in the stories but the viewer, if he's created overly ambigious (quasi an "anti villain") then it's equally hard to create a real redemption. U can't b an actually not so bad guy cuz that would make a redemption which requires a personality change, into a thing that twists his actually good victimized core away from that or to make it really sharp - A POORLY WRITTEN VILLAIN CAN B EXPOSED WHEN A REDEMPTION WOULD ACTUALLY MEAN A CORRUPTION TO HIM. This kind of pseodo villain actually would belong into a 2nd act of an antagonists arc of an antihero in a tragedy. Starts as a guy who loses his moral compas on a noble cause n turns from anti hero to antivillain n then into really evil once nothing of his cause is left n he realizes to have sold his soul. Actually, pretty much the anakin, vader ark minus his redemption.
tbh, when it comes to female villains, Disney is top notch here. Ursula, Snow White's stepmother, Cinderella's stepmother, Cruella De Vil, Maleficent, Queen of Hearts, Mother Gothel, Yzma...
As George Lucas once said when he was asked why Vader was so successful, two words: Power and freedom, power to impress everyone and freedom to use that power. This applies to most villains ever invented, and it fascinates people.
partially true but liberals tend to make excuses for real villains by saying past trauma is the reason a person kills or rapes but that doesnt help the victims of society and many times because of shortened prison sentences they commit murder.rape again when released.
Vader walks into a room and scares the shit out of everyone without even raising his voice or directly threatening people. He doesn't even have to pose, strut, or run. That's power.
I never miss a video from this gentlemen. He absolutely knows what he’s talking about, and has great insight. I would love to sit down and talk movies with him.
We love villains because they're dark mirrors to ourselves: those who succumb to their weaknesses, those who are so swept up in the notion of self-righteousness they've disregarded how others have a say in the matter, those who think because they've been hurt they're entitled to hurt the world, those who are detestable, but also uncomfortably *human.*
Everybody once in their life desires to stare off into the abyss and consider jumping in. This is why we need moral warnings, to show what we could become and why we are stronger for not giving in to those temptations.
I think people love villains because their ability to feel so free in what they do is what makes them fun. Actors tend to say that it's more fun to play a villain rather than a hero. I feel that the greatest human desire is for their not to be consequences to our actions, giving us the ability to fulfill any want we can have.
Ever wondered what kind of situation could "turn you around", what would push you past that critical point of no return? What if, say, you had to wipe out a family to save your own? You know you'll be committing an act that will fundamentally forever alter your person, but at what point does that toll become tenable, at what point do the means justify the ends? It's not specifically simply settling a score and thinking you're justified, and "to hell with the rest of the world", you know it's a destructive path, you know it'll bring ruin to those around you, including yourself, but you still choose to walk it. Why? I think if you can answer that question you can probably find what would turn you, and by extension, anyone, into a villian.
Because they (1) don’t want to put forth the effort to do what he suggests, and (2) don’t want to give up one iota of wokeness in order to make better movies.
Peter Cushing as Grand Moff Tarkin was a good example of a great villain. Only a few minutes of screen time, but Peter made every second count...You May Fire When Ready.
Love this guy but huge props to the interviewer. Clear, concise questions and the patience and social grace to know when her interviewee is ready for the next question. Very refreshing.
The last 3rd of the Last Jedi comes to mind. No real threat from that whiny kid. No stakes. It's no wonder they thought they needed to resurrect an old villain for the last film. (Still a poor decision IMO.)
I remember watching Infinity War in theater for the first time and realizing how much I was enjoying the movie just because of Thanos alone, and how much of a good villain he was. Such presence, assertiveness, and composure. We haven't had a lot of "fantasy" villains of that caliber since Darth Vader imo. Plus, the fact that his motivations lived in a somewhat moral grey zone just made the whole thing even better. You understand his quest, from his perspective. That makes for the best villains. Say what you will about the bland copy/pasted Marvel movies, but some of them do stand out, and this one was just absolutely riveting in good part for its villain. I would argue the same for Winter Soldier, actually. The political thriller was pretty good, but Bucky was a damn Terminator in that movie. It's always great when our heroes meet a seemingly unstoppable force.
Jaws is the greatest movie villain of all time. He was totally justified in his actions and just wanted to eat. Trying to survive. Outside the rare times we saw Jaws on screen the characters were talking about him almost constantly. Hell, he's the title of the movie xD
Ricardo Montalban from ST2 was one of my favorite villains. The man absolutely chewed up the screen when he was on it with passion and vengeance. He’s one of the main reasons that Wrath of Khan is the best ST of all time.
"Khan Noonien Singh is the most dangerous adversary the Enterprise ever faced. He is brilliant, ruthless, and will not hesitate to kill every single one of you."
The One Ring is an excellent villain. It seems like just a ring, doesn't do anything on its own, but look at the influence it has on anyone who comes near it.
I may be completely wrong, but I always took the one ring as a metaphor for how people become when they become addicted to drugs. How they can't let go of it even when it is harming them, and they turn away help from a true friend.
Awesome video! One minor correction: it was Ralph McQuarrie and not Ralph Bakshi who designed the Star Wars characters and sets. Bakshi was the director of the animated Lord of the Rings film :)
I would be very curious to hear Chris's assessment of Hans Landa from Inglorious Basterds. Easily one of the coldest and must calculating villains who the audience couldn't really relate to, but you felt nothing but dread when he was on screen.
Senator Palpatine could be the smartest villain of all time. When you think of how he manipulated an entire galaxy to achieve his goals and how he was able to push other villains to the spotlight while operating from the shadows is just incredible. Maul, Dooku, Anakin/Vader... He is the villain maker.
Villains are almost always more interesting because they usually have a vision for how they want things to be and then work to make that vision happen. They are often ambitious, driven, and are able to gather others to their cause. The hero typically just reacts to what the villain is doing in the world.
This is why so many women want to date the bad guy. Media and society has brainwashed them that good guys are boring and lame. That’s troubling. Both heroes and villains can be interesting.
Greatest movie villain of all time: Hans Landa from Inglorious Basterds. Highly intelligent, highly motivated, totally amoral, absolutely ruthless, extremely dangerous. He steals every single scene he is in. You are always on the edge of your seat waiting to see what he will do next and how the heroes will react to it.
I think the top 5 Movie villains are Darth Vader, Hannibal Lecter, Anton Chigurh, Hans Landa and the Joker. Gruber is great too but these are I think the most resonant as dynamic and interesting villains of their respective films
Thanos wanted to wipe out half of all life in the universe to give the survivors access to more resources. What makes him a villain is that he never considered just doubling the amount of resources. Or to give knowledge of how to use existing resources much more efficiently. Or any number of other options that never occurred to him. His mind went straight to genocide.
This one is one of the best of this channel and Chris Gore. It explains everything what we love about stories and movies. Its about great human archetypes and legends. This is what made Star Wars so great. Something happened back then and it "simply" peaked through the 80s movies. I was quite young back then myself - naive, yes, but every time I hear the original soundtracks of those movies it touches me deeply with the same strength like the first time. Star Wars, Back To The Future, Ghostbusters, you name it. Even some TV shows. All made for commercial success, all mainstream. But great stuff nonetheless. And our entire world was a quite different one because of these, we had visions, we were excited. We were crazy. What happened ...
I've thought for many years that the Academy should have an award for Best Actor or Actress in the Role of an Antagonist. Villains never get the credit they deserve for literally carrying the films they're in as much as or sometimes even more than the hero does. Without a good antagonist, many forms of story structure don't work at all and their importance cannot be underestimated.
Some of my favorite villains are relatable and tragic. Even going back to Ancient Greek and Roman myths. I also love the unstoppable single minded monster type villain. Frankenstein, Dracula, T-100/T-1000, Dr. Hannibal Lector, Norman Bates, Biff Tannen, Jack Torrance, Annie Wilkes, Nurse Ratched, John Creese, Ivan Drago, HAL-9000, Sephiroth, Albert Wesker (games) are among my favorites.
@@x_demighoul_x Indeed. That's why I like him so much. He's been depicted many ways in movies and media in general but those characteristics are usually present. Call backs to the original as it were. The villains I listed aren't necessarily one or the other, just what I personally tend to like.
I really love the Spike Lee movie Inside Man, which sort of features multiple villains, some of whom could also be viewed as heroes based on their own perspective or motives. It’s a movie that really delves into the fine lines between hero and villain IMO.
We love villains because of our earliest memories of our parents. When you are a small child, your parents are larger than you, stronger than you, they know what you did, they know what you're thinking about doing, they swoop down and take what you value most (the cookie, or the three-inch screw that you are trying to swallow). They reduce us to helpless tears. And you spend your life trying to figure out how to finally overcome them. Doesn't that sound like a great movie villain? That story appeals to our deepest psyche, and our earliest understanding of the world. And who did Darth Vader turn out to be? Luke's father.
@@Lilliathi Spend an afternoon with any toddler and at least one of their parents. You will see the parent command and control the child over and over again. You must hold my hand. Do not chase that cat. Do not put that thumbtack in your mouth. And you will see the child weep and howl with rage at how hopelessly oppressed it is.
Most villains work best when we have some insight into their insecurities, delusions and motivations. The set-up for the next villain on Ted Lasso is a beautiful example.
The author Brandon Sanderson has an interesting technique/theory (his lectures are free on youtube). Your characters can be defined by three sliding scales. 1. Competency 2. Sympathy/relatable 3. Proactivity (makes the story move forward) To make the characters interesting they can't have those three maxed out. Sherlock Holmes for example is highly competent and proactive but not relatable. This is also a possible explanation as to why we "like" villains. They are often proactive (they initiate the conflict) and competent (to raise the stakes). Darth Vader is competent, proactive and at some point somewhat relatable (especially when he tries to redeem himself).
We love villains because they reflect the dark parts of ourselves that we can't let go in a civilized society. The villain does what we wish we could do but can't or don't because of the ramifications of doing so (fines, jail, beatings, death). The villain doesn't give a shit about any of that, and so we're fascinated by him/her. Edit to add: This is why the villain needs to get his comeuppance in the end, too, so the audience gets closure. "I couldn't get away with that shit, so why should s/he?"
Your timing is always perfect! My WIP has a villain who is very charming and likeable...until his deeds are unraveled at the end. And you're right: he directs the entire novel's plot even though he is only present in a limited number of scenes. Thanks so much for your gift of clarity.
Light is a anti hero and a villain he seen that criminals were getting a away with crimes. Then found a Death Note then tried to do right by punishing criminals. But then a God complex came into play. So he started off as a anti hero when he was killing criminals. Then he became villain when he started to kill innocent people. Because he was trying to stop Crime and punish criminals. But killing every criminal is kind of going too far hans anti hero. But it did make people stop and think about committing crime. The reason he did that is because criminals who were guilty with evidence to prove it. Whore getting away with their crimes so he was trying to help. But them he got a God complex then started to kill innocent people so he became a Villain at that point. Theirs a old saying The Road to Hell is full of good intentions. Light had good intentions in the beginning but then he crossed the line. When he started to kill innocent people.
If you want to talk about smart villains in general. Then I would say Beast Wars Megatron from Transformers Beast Wars. Small spoiler in case no one has seen it but if it wasn't for 2 things . He would have succeeded and wiped out autobots before they were even activated. Meaning the original Megatron and Decepticons would have won the War. Lets just say he would have an he actually did come close to wiping out Humanity before humans the evolved into humans. Then he came close to killing Optimus Prime before he was even discovered in present day. But in the one case someone unexpected stop him in the then one in the other case one of his own. Predacons stopped it to save themselves so if it was not for those two characters. Beast Wars Megatron would have won the war for Decepticons in the future. Because of brilliant and cunning planning.
Well said! It's the reason why Darth Vader is such a mythological figure in our psyche, because his journey towards the Dark Side is something we all can relate to.
I think that the reason villains so often fall to their deaths is symbolic. They have reached the "height" of power, prestige, knowledge, etc only to "fall"
True, it can be symbolic. But it also is, in a lot of stories where the writer doesn't want to dirty the hero's hands, a way of killing off the villain without having the heroic protagonist kill them.
Infinity War was so good. When Thanos won you could feel the despair in the theater...it felt like the air was thicker when the credits rolled and it was harder to breathe. Two of my favorite villains that many have forgotten..... Les Grossman, and The Shogun of Harlem...Sho Nuff!! Most people don't realize that Indiana Jones was not even necessary for the story in Raiders....he was just along for the ride and it was fun.
While I don't necessarily buy into the bandwagon thinking that villains are more relatable than the heroes, I do find myself defending not only Robocop's Clarence Boddicker, but Dick Jones as well. They're Earth's equivalent of Vader and Palpatine. Like Vader, Boddicker is the enforcer, the one who is on the ground committing the physical acts of evil and violence, yet he is highly intelligent. And just like Palpatine, Dick Jones is the one high above in his office (Deathstar), nearly untouchable, plotting and scheming. In the case of Boddicker, I feel he never gets enough credit for being a great villain, especially a villain of 80's cinema because he is always overshadowed by the likes of Hans Gruber or even Vader. While I like Hans Gruber and think he's a good villain, I don't he's as intimidating or effective as Boddicker. After all, Boddicker did what Gruber could never accomplish, he actually killed the hero. Oh, and as far as Die Hard villains go, I've always preferred Colonel Stewart (William Sadler) over Hans Gruber.
I like all of those villains, Corey. Good point about the mastermind and the thug. Hannibal Lecter and Buffalo Bill too, even though they were separate threats rather than cohorts.
@@AlmostEthical I do like Hannibal Lecture and not just Hopkins performance, but Brian Cox's take on the character as well. I own the Hannibal series on blu-ray but haven't watched it yet, so the verdict is still out for me on Mads Mikkelsen's performance, but given everything else he's ever done, I'm 99% sure I'm going to like his version. But the thing with Lecture (or Lekter, according to Manhunter) is much like Vader, Gruber, and the Joker, he's always brought up whenever great villains are talked about. Dick Jones and Clarence Boddicker are never discussed to the extent that the previously stated villains are. As a matter of fact, here are some other great villains that I believe are largely ignored. 1.) Commander Kruge. In the pantheon of Star Trek adversaries, Christopher Lloyd's Klingon baddie is always overshadowed by Ricardo Montalban's Khan Noonien Singh. 2.) Magua ( Wes Studi / The Last Of The Mohicans) 3.) Sho-Nuff ( Julius Carry / The Last Dragon) 4.) Thulsa Doom (James-Earl Jones / Conan The Barbarian) 5.) Conan Cochran (Daniel O'Herlihy / Halloween III: Season Of The Witch) 6.) The Tall Man (Angus Scrimm / Phantasm) 7.) Diana ( Jane Badler / V, the miniseries and regular series) 8.) Alexander Pierce ( Robert Redford / Captain America: The Winter Soldier) 9.) Lord Darkness ( Tim Curry / Legend) 10.) Peyton Flanders, a.k.a. Mrs. Mott ( Rebecca DeMornay / The Hand That Rocks The Cradle) 11.) The Baron Vladimir Harkonen (Kenneth McMillan / Dune-1984) 12.) Big Boy Caprice (Al Pacino / Dick Tracy) Okay, that's enough. I was only going to list 10 but I went for two more.
@@coreyc5982 I bow before your greater villain knowledge :) The only ones I've heard of are the Baron and Kruge. I think Clarence and Dick tend to miss out because they have appeared in one single movie, and nowhere else. I also enjoyed Clarence's gang of thugs, each of which had a distinct personality, which is not easy to pull off. The first Robocop was very good at the "show, don't tell" approach to exposition. I found Anton Chigurrgh and Frank Booth to be unforgettable villains.
In 1987 Boddicker was a terrifying, sociopath of a villain. Today I fear people who watch it for the first time will only see him as Red from That 70s Show. It makes him much less scary.
The villain from Seven is actually smart. They had no clue who he was till he turned himself in, and even after that he followed his plan to completion.
There was a direct social commentary to his motivations as well. So his methods were deplorable but his purpose had a level purity to it. It was malicious self-righteousness, but there was a point to it.
Most audience members do NOT want to see the villain be successful with their evil plan, they want to see the hero thwart, and punish the villain thoroughly and without TOO much trouble. That’s why Joker is kind of a unique villain, because it’s one of the few occasions where the audience wants to see the bad guy have his fun, and because he’s so fun to watch, we don’t really want to see him punished too much even though we do ultimately want to see him thwarted.
Probably one of the best villians I've seen recently is John Wick...I know, he's the protagonist, but if you look at the structure of the first movie he's really the villain. He's not reacting to what the bad guys do, they're reacting to him and trying to stop him. He's set up as the impossible to beat force that these guys are up against. So he's the villain in the structural sense but you root for him because of his motivations.
The “protagonist” Russians broke into his home, murdered his dog, stole his shit and then beat him nearly to death. Wick isn’t the villain. He’s bringing justice to evil and fighting fire with fire. Modern day ideologies want you to believe that evil men deserve forgiveness, hugs and teddy bears. Reality is not that. Wick is a protagonist in the oldest sense and you’ll find familiarity in westerns and older movies with conviction. The bad guys don’t get away, they do not pass go, they do not collect a free pass. A hero with balls is incredibly rare in Hollywood, so your confusion is somewhat understandable.
@@lucaschudleigh7193 I think you misunderstood what I was saying. I don't think the mobsters were the good guys by any stretch, and as I said John Wick IS the protagonist. What I was saying was that structurally the story sets up his character like the villain is usually set up. Typically in a story like this the hero would be facing a mysterious, seemingly unstoppable villain. The hero would spend the story trying and failing to overcome the villain. With John wick they reversed it and made him the mysterious, unstoppable boogyman that the bad guys are trying and failing to defeat. I liked how they turned it on its head.
Jaws was an amazing villain, he even had a full story arc. Some of the best actors play villains, Tim Curry, Alan Rickman, Christopher Walken, Gary Busey & who can forget Terry Thomas! Honourable mention to Raul Julia in Street Fighter, he mostly did not play villains but in street fighter he was amazing '"For you, the day Bison graced your village was the most important day in your life, but for me? It was Tuesday." O and as ever the god Christopher Lee!
Villains are appealing because sometimes they can exhibit traits that could be viewed as admirable, honorable, and/desirable. Being self driven and having the determination to achieve one's goals. Sometimes villains can be just as hard working at trying to push through their limits and overcome their own weaknesses like many of our heroes. I think when a villain can be liked or well received is whether or not they have redeemable qualities. But there are sometimes villains who have none what so ever, and are just plain cruel. But, they can still serve as a good set piece in a story.
Some Of The Greatest Movie Villains To Me In No Order: 1.Freddy Krueger:A force that makes us face our greatest fears. 2.Michael Myers:So great were his inner demons that he gave into evil and madness. 3.The Joker(1989):Despite his humor he sees chaos and death as funny. 4.Doc Ock:He only wanted to help mankind and sees his actions as justifiable. 5.Magneto:Gave up on mankind and became that which he hated. 6.General Zod(Man Of Steel):He only wanted to save Krypton. 7.Darth Vader:For what Gore said. 8.William "D-Fens"Foster(Falling Down):A guy who made valid points about how bad society had gone down despite the violent acts he did. 9.Jeanine Matthews(Divergent,Insurgent):She showed great intellect and her main goal was to keep the society of Chicago safe and in order,not for power. 10.Blofeld(On Her Majesty's Secret Service):Blofeld's plan of global bio warfare was genius and he only wanted a pardon not world domination. 11.Muriel(Hansel And Gretel:Witch Hunters):Clever,diabolical,gave the heroes a run for their money. 12.Dr No(Dr No):He was cunning,shrewd,brilliant,one of the few not afraid to fight Bond. 13.Franz Sanchez(License To Kill):Clever drug lord who didn't care about world conquest only making money and was one tough s.o.b. 14.The Shredder(TMNT 1990):Cold and cruel,this one almost killed the turtles. 15.Joanie(Cursed 2005):All she cared about was getting the man she wanted and didn't care about who she had to kill to do it. 16.Jason Voorhees:An unstoppable force of nature who makes you dread going camping. 17.Leatherface:Simple minded or not he can and will find you all just to please his crazy family. 18.Courtney Shayne(Jawbreaker):The kind of girl who you not only knew in high school but seemed like she could get anyone to crush you like a bug. 19.Billy Chapman(Silent Night Deadly Night):An early sympathetic villain a few years after Vader whose mind was shattered on Christmas Eve. 20.The Joker(Joker 2019):Arthur Fleck is quite sympathetic.He shows what happens to some of us when we fall down the rabbit hole. 21.The Lizad:Another scientist who only wanted to help mankind. 22.Hans Gruber:Diabolical and debonair at the same time. 23.Mystique:Swayed into villainy by man's intolerance for different people. 24.Angela Baker(Sleepaway Camp):A child whose mind was broken early in life and put back together though not properly by his crazed aunt. 25.Cheetah(Wonder Woman 1984):I know the movie stunk yet I found the character sympathetic regardless of the cliches they put on her.After all, haven't we all wanted to be special but some of us paid the price for it?.
I have spent my life saying you can't have a compelling story without a strong antagonist. If there is nothing terrible to overcome, what conflict is there, what risk, what victory to achieve? A strong villain embodies risk, conflict, challenge, the possibility of failure and the hope of victory. A strong villain is an avatar for anybody's own adversity and what it means to overcome it. And we ALL overcome adversity. A compelling villain gives that adversity a face and a voice...even if it's not a person.
I have watched The Lost Ark so many times, and this is the first time I thought that Indy actually lost at the end... Bravo Chris Gore for opening my mind.
I guess this is why I really liked and felt for Joaquin Phoenix's Joker. I could listen to Chris talk about movies for hours. If he had a podcast where he talked about 1 movie for 2+ hours, that would be awesome.
Great stuff, love Chris Gore's explanations and interpretation. I agree that too many villains get outsmarted but I like Hans Gruber and Moriarty from Sherlock Holmes.
Actors have the most fun playing villians and take a humorous approach, even if its dark humor. 'The driving force of drama is the dark side." Barbara Steele
Villains like Vader stand the tests of time because they have three things going for them 1: A design that makes them stand out 2: A presence that exudes "Big Bad" 3: Having the power to inflict change or force heroes in motion Maleficent of Disney's Sleeping Beauty is another iconic villain. Just from her first scene alone, you know she means business. Same can be said for other iconic Disney villains, like Ursula, Gaston, Scar, etc. Outside of the Disney bubble, even the Joker and Voldemort are iconic because they have the three things above. If a villain has all three, then you know you have a potential great villain on your hands.
Scorpius from Farscape, one of the best villains ever. Has a menacing look, extremely intelligent, very strong and hard to kill. From his point of view everything he does is completely justified because he does it to stop an even greater threat, that and his personal grudge against them. When you watch the show it's hard not to understand why he is doing the things that he does.
In general, villains know exactly what they want, and have no inner conflict about how to get it. Being ruthless in this way is admirable, a kind of power and purpose we never get to experience in normal life but wish we could, even if their actions or mindset are revolting. I think likability is really overrated. Characters we can *relate* to are much more likely to be characters we empathise with and invest in. Han Solo is not 'unlikable' because he is cynical and cocky. He is there as a contrast to Luke, and Han's courage, competency, humor & straight-talking attitude make him appealing.
I’ve always loved the villains journey but the look of Darth Vader is timeless, reminds me of what a medieval Knight & a Samurai Warrior would look like if they were merged together then throw in David Prowse physicality & the voice of James Earl Jones along with the character’s back story makes him utterly compelling. So sad to witness what’s happened to this once loved franchise
I think the best recent example I can think of for a villain who has a lot of presence looming over the film despite little screen time would be the Riddler in The Batman. He was scary, had a memorable design, had a great parallel to the hero, was several steps ahead the whole time, was shown to be layered with things like his personality when in costume compared to without it, and he had a point with exposing the corruption of Gotham that he'd been a victim of his whole life.
Hans Gruber, top-notch villain. I feel Vader had some compassion, Gruber had none and was expelled from a known terrorist organization. His brother was a good villain too.
This is such a great question that one could go on and on about it. Chris nails a lot of great points here, but I think it’s the kind of question that deserves a discussion around it.
The last villain I actually enjoyed was Valentine from Kingsman... because I was at least able to go, "I disagree with the method, but the idea has some merit"...
It's weird regarding villains, not all stories NEED villains but a good one can greatly elevate a mediocre story and would make a good story even better. Agent Smith for example helped made the first Matrix good among the other stuff that movie had, and he greatly elevated the sequels by becoming the very thing he hated, remove Agent Smith from the sequels and they would be much worse. Agent Smith's arc of starting off as a machine controlled by the system to becoming a free man who is more human and constantly multiples himself like a virus which he hated humanity for in the first Matrix makes the Matrix trilogy worth watching, not just the first, even though the first Matrix is a much more satisfying as a movie and a narrative. I also feel the best villains are the ones who highlight the qualities of the hero, a "foil" basically. Lex Luthor is a classic example, the guy pratically is the pinnacle of what humanity can be and yet he is corrupt and chooses to go against Superman because he the former thinks he can take over humanity. Luthor highlights the purity of Superman and how easy it is for the latter to turn on humanity and do exactly what Luthor think he would do. Fiction is weird in that makes you like and respect people who you can't stand in real life.
Actually, Smith can be removed from the Matrix sequels. You'd just have to come up with a new reason why The Architect needs Neo to fight for him at the end, which is what brings a halt to the war. The point of the Matrix sequels was to show that humans and machines depend on each other and need to co-exist. Smith really didn't elevate the sequels; he was simply the vehicle for that to be shown to The Architect. I can cut most of Smith's scenes out of the sequels and not lose anything of importance.
For me the best villains were T1000 and Anton Chigurh. Modern movies should stop making every villain as the "misunderstood person" or "the main villain was the society" or "toxic masculinity was the villain". Some people are simply evil and terrifying. Where did those villains go?
I loved the comment about the villain appealing to something dark inside us. We have boundaries and responsibilities, yet part of us wants to break through and do what is right, or not so right, or get revenge for some injustice. As for female villains, the best one by far that I have seen is Olivia in the TV series of 12 Monkeys. The protagonist is smart, and very capable, but Olivia is smarter, stronger, and anticipates everything. Her past hardships make her understandable, even to the point where you think she could swap sides.
This is also why I dislike modern stories, because instead of treating the villains as interesting character studies (the flaws and evil within all of us) or just interesting characters in general, modern writers only use villains as something to hate and vilify. A lot more villains are some combination of: white/male/conservative/billionaire capitalist, and any villain that doesn't fall under than purview is tragic/misunderstood/well-intentioned/technically right because it's like the writers believe that having a villain be something like say, a gay black woman, it would mean they hate gays/POC or something.
Subscribe to Chris Gore's UA-cam Channel - ua-cam.com/users/FilmThreat
Excellent question about Skyler White. Even the great Gore needed to think about that one. This is why I prefer watching Gore on this channel over his own. Great guests, great interviewer. Love it.
Yyyeahhh right, that was the disneytized thanos who wasn't allowed to b without a thing, ppl can use as help to see him as "actually no bad dude ,just a victim of circumstances", like disneytized villains allways r done now.
The real thanos killed half of all life to impress a woman which happened to b death incarnate. How redemable that would look, i wonder? Thanos as a powercrazy wannabygod with a fragile beta ego bedded in the most gigantic narcicism ever seen.
But in change for the disneytized actually misunderstood victimillains, they also took away something else.
Because their antagonists aren't "really" evil, u now of course, can't give him a redemption arc cuz u need to b a sinner to b redeemed. And u have to b aware of acting wrong to feel guilt, u can still lie about ur motives, even to ur self but as soon u write a villain to b truely convinced to act morally it takes away from whatever evil stuff is done. A part of true evilness is the hidden n selfish motiv in the insidious -, or the openly cruel monstrous evil. It can b a sin worth it for a selfish goal, or a sin because of having the power to do so.
Power only really exists when it's used, n between ppl power can only used by one, against some one else, so the villain has to hurt others cuz his power is worth nothing iin theory n has to b shown to b acknowledged.
I'm frankly a lil' biased cuz i'm a fan of darkseid n since i know that jack kirby himself said that thanos is a copy of him in design, i can't find anything good in him any longer, but if we start challenging their feeds n strip thanos of his gauntlet, their really is not even remote similarity - "Darkseid is !" ;)
But seriously that is a constant thing about creating evil. U even see it in real live, if u r busted n convicted as comic thanos u go to jail as inmate. Do it n get convicted as movie thanos u will go into a clinic as patient, doing therapy instead simply ur time.
Actually, the theoretic possibility for a redemption arc is the best way to quickly find out if a villain was written well or not. If his whole story already goes out it's way to make him simpathic, not to others in the stories but the viewer, if he's created overly ambigious (quasi an "anti villain") then it's equally hard to create a real redemption. U can't b an actually not so bad guy cuz that would make a redemption which requires a personality change, into a thing that twists his actually good victimized core away from that or to make it really sharp - A POORLY WRITTEN VILLAIN CAN B EXPOSED WHEN A REDEMPTION WOULD ACTUALLY MEAN A CORRUPTION TO HIM.
This kind of pseodo villain actually would belong into a 2nd act of an antagonists arc of an antihero in a tragedy. Starts as a guy who loses his moral compas on a noble cause n turns from anti hero to antivillain n then into really evil once nothing of his cause is left n he realizes to have sold his soul. Actually, pretty much the anakin, vader ark minus his redemption.
tbh, when it comes to female villains, Disney is top notch here. Ursula, Snow White's stepmother, Cinderella's stepmother, Cruella De Vil, Maleficent, Queen of Hearts, Mother Gothel, Yzma...
As George Lucas once said when he was asked why Vader was so successful, two words:
Power and freedom, power to impress everyone and freedom to use that power. This applies to most villains ever invented, and it fascinates people.
Wow that’s a cool quote
partially true but liberals tend to make excuses for real villains by saying past trauma is the reason a person kills or rapes but that doesnt help the victims of society and many times because of shortened prison sentences they commit murder.rape again when released.
Vader walks into a room and scares the shit out of everyone without even raising his voice or directly threatening people. He doesn't even have to pose, strut, or run. That's power.
@@Theomite "Tell me about it, i just hear that name i shudder!"
"Mufasa!"
@@AndreNitroX ...Do it again.
Chris Gore ALWAYS has something interesting to say, no matter what!
Chris Gore = awesome
I love every interview he does. Amazing!
I never miss a video from this gentlemen. He absolutely knows what he’s talking about, and has great insight. I would love to sit down and talk movies with him.
Same 👍
Agreed he knows his movies
It's gentleman.
He could discuss grass growing and make it interesting
@@Russ0107 oh man a grammar Nazi. Haven’t seen one of you since 2013.
We love villains because they're dark mirrors to ourselves: those who succumb to their weaknesses, those who are so swept up in the notion of self-righteousness they've disregarded how others have a say in the matter, those who think because they've been hurt they're entitled to hurt the world, those who are detestable, but also uncomfortably *human.*
Everybody once in their life desires to stare off into the abyss and consider jumping in. This is why we need moral warnings, to show what we could become and why we are stronger for not giving in to those temptations.
I think people love villains because their ability to feel so free in what they do is what makes them fun. Actors tend to say that it's more fun to play a villain rather than a hero. I feel that the greatest human desire is for their not to be consequences to our actions, giving us the ability to fulfill any want we can have.
Ever wondered what kind of situation could "turn you around", what would push you past that critical point of no return? What if, say, you had to wipe out a family to save your own? You know you'll be committing an act that will fundamentally forever alter your person, but at what point does that toll become tenable, at what point do the means justify the ends?
It's not specifically simply settling a score and thinking you're justified, and "to hell with the rest of the world", you know it's a destructive path, you know it'll bring ruin to those around you, including yourself, but you still choose to walk it. Why?
I think if you can answer that question you can probably find what would turn you, and by extension, anyone, into a villian.
@@G360LIVE There’s no freedom when you’re consumed by evil. Being free to do anything means you are caged by worldly desires
So true! Wonderfully said!
Chris hits it out of the park
Why is no one in Hollywood not asking him for his advice
Because Hollywood is mostly full of idiots
The bean counters don’t want profits, they want political power and Chris is not interested in politics over everything else.
Because they (1) don’t want to put forth the effort to do what he suggests, and (2) don’t want to give up one iota of wokeness in order to make better movies.
Agenda. A failing, money-losing agenda.
He is not a box ticker
Peter Cushing as Grand Moff Tarkin was a good example of a great villain. Only a few minutes of screen time, but Peter made every second count...You May Fire When Ready.
Love this guy but huge props to the interviewer. Clear, concise questions and the patience and social grace to know when her interviewee is ready for the next question. Very refreshing.
Chris is right about the villain. Certain types of stories just die without a good antagonist
All action stories die without a good villain.
The best is the one where you think that you are following the hero, only to find out in the end that you were following the villain the whole time.
@@thechicagobox name 5
The last 3rd of the Last Jedi comes to mind. No real threat from that whiny kid. No stakes. It's no wonder they thought they needed to resurrect an old villain for the last film. (Still a poor decision IMO.)
ALL stories die without a good antagonist, even if that antagonist isn't a person.
I remember watching Infinity War in theater for the first time and realizing how much I was enjoying the movie just because of Thanos alone, and how much of a good villain he was.
Such presence, assertiveness, and composure. We haven't had a lot of "fantasy" villains of that caliber since Darth Vader imo.
Plus, the fact that his motivations lived in a somewhat moral grey zone just made the whole thing even better. You understand his quest, from his perspective. That makes for the best villains.
Say what you will about the bland copy/pasted Marvel movies, but some of them do stand out, and this one was just absolutely riveting in good part for its villain.
I would argue the same for Winter Soldier, actually. The political thriller was pretty good, but Bucky was a damn Terminator in that movie. It's always great when our heroes meet a seemingly unstoppable force.
Thanos was good but is incredibly overrated, not even the best Marvel villain imo
@@DarkHallwayz Which one would it be in your opinion? (talking about the MCU here, not Marvel as a whole)
Bucky wasn't the villain in winter soldier. The villain was shield/hydra
@@nicholaso6721 Fine. An antagonist then.
@@thisisfyne He’s not MCU but Kilgrave from Jessica Jones series was the best. His character arc was crazy
Jaws is the greatest movie villain of all time. He was totally justified in his actions and just wanted to eat. Trying to survive. Outside the rare times we saw Jaws on screen the characters were talking about him almost constantly. Hell, he's the title of the movie xD
Same as movie Life 🥺
Yea really identified with him.
Jaws is tryna grab a bite yo. Brotagonist
Thought you were talking about the Bond villain at first.
His name was Bruce
I could listen to Chris Gore talk about movies all day…I completely relate to his thoughts on mordern movies and old classics…
A fantastic hero needs to battle a powerful, vile, formidable villain.
The eviler the villain, the greater the hero
The villain makes the property. If you have a villain that wasn't written well your property will fail. cough cough Disney Star Wars cough cough
@@BigDaddyJinx well said
Ricardo Montalban from ST2 was one of my favorite villains. The man absolutely chewed up the screen when he was on it with passion and vengeance. He’s one of the main reasons that Wrath of Khan is the best ST of all time.
Easily in top 20 best villains of all time
"Khan Noonien Singh is the most dangerous adversary the Enterprise ever faced. He is brilliant, ruthless, and will not hesitate to kill every single one of you."
The One Ring is an excellent villain. It seems like just a ring, doesn't do anything on its own, but look at the influence it has on anyone who comes near it.
I may be completely wrong, but I always took the one ring as a metaphor for how people become when they become addicted to drugs. How they can't let go of it even when it is harming them, and they turn away help from a true friend.
@@DarthSoto78 I don't think that was Tolkien's intent, but you can definitely see the correlation.
The ring is just a symbol for power. Absolute power.
Awesome video! One minor correction: it was Ralph McQuarrie and not Ralph Bakshi who designed the Star Wars characters and sets. Bakshi was the director of the animated Lord of the Rings film :)
I heard that and I was like "I didn't know Bakshi worked on Star Wars??".
@@PneumanonSame!
I would be very curious to hear Chris's assessment of Hans Landa from Inglorious Basterds. Easily one of the coldest and must calculating villains who the audience couldn't really relate to, but you felt nothing but dread when he was on screen.
Thought he was very overrated
@@Aeneiden dork.
Senator Palpatine could be the smartest villain of all time. When you think of how he manipulated an entire galaxy to achieve his goals and how he was able to push other villains to the spotlight while operating from the shadows is just incredible. Maul, Dooku, Anakin/Vader... He is the villain maker.
He was boring.
He was a bit lacking in terms of motivation - power just for power, like typical politician?
👍
Ozymandias from Watchmen is a smart villain, only explaining his plan to the heroes after it had already been completed.
Villains are almost always more interesting because they usually have a vision for how they want things to be and then work to make that vision happen. They are often ambitious, driven, and are able to gather others to their cause.
The hero typically just reacts to what the villain is doing in the world.
Plus they almost always sport the coolest costume / uniforms, weapons and vehicles.
Or maybe it's just my taste?
This is why so many women want to date the bad guy.
Media and society has brainwashed them that good guys are boring and lame.
That’s troubling.
Both heroes and villains can be interesting.
Greatest movie villain of all time: Hans Landa from Inglorious Basterds. Highly intelligent, highly motivated, totally amoral, absolutely ruthless, extremely dangerous.
He steals every single scene he is in. You are always on the edge of your seat waiting to see what he will do next and how the heroes will react to it.
I can listen to him all day every day
Annie Wilkes in Misery was the best female villian imho.
I'll second that.
She is a cautionary tale of what todays true fans can turn into if Hollywoke keep ruining classic movie characters.
I think the top 5 Movie villains are
Darth Vader, Hannibal Lecter, Anton Chigurh, Hans Landa and the Joker. Gruber is great too but these are I think the most resonant as dynamic and interesting villains of their respective films
How is moriarty not on that list 😂
Honorable mention:
1) Jigsaw
2) Ghostface
2) Freddy Krueger
4) Commodus
5) Alex De Large
6) Tyler Durden
@@lucaschudleigh7193 OK Top 10 for sure
Great list
No pinhead, he is awesome
Thanos wanted to wipe out half of all life in the universe to give the survivors access to more resources. What makes him a villain is that he never considered just doubling the amount of resources. Or to give knowledge of how to use existing resources much more efficiently. Or any number of other options that never occurred to him. His mind went straight to genocide.
This one is one of the best of this channel and Chris Gore. It explains everything what we love about stories and movies. Its about great human archetypes and legends. This is what made Star Wars so great. Something happened back then and it "simply" peaked through the 80s movies. I was quite young back then myself - naive, yes, but every time I hear the original soundtracks of those movies it touches me deeply with the same strength like the first time. Star Wars, Back To The Future, Ghostbusters, you name it. Even some TV shows. All made for commercial success, all mainstream. But great stuff nonetheless. And our entire world was a quite different one because of these, we had visions, we were excited. We were crazy. What happened ...
I've thought for many years that the Academy should have an award for Best Actor or Actress in the Role of an Antagonist. Villains never get the credit they deserve for literally carrying the films they're in as much as or sometimes even more than the hero does. Without a good antagonist, many forms of story structure don't work at all and their importance cannot be underestimated.
Awesome idea
Some of my favorite villains are relatable and tragic. Even going back to Ancient Greek and Roman myths. I also love the unstoppable single minded monster type villain. Frankenstein, Dracula, T-100/T-1000, Dr. Hannibal Lector, Norman Bates, Biff Tannen, Jack Torrance, Annie Wilkes, Nurse Ratched, John Creese, Ivan Drago, HAL-9000, Sephiroth, Albert Wesker (games) are among my favorites.
@@x_demighoul_x Indeed. That's why I like him so much. He's been depicted many ways in movies and media in general but those characteristics are usually present. Call backs to the original as it were. The villains I listed aren't necessarily one or the other, just what I personally tend to like.
I'd like to posit Kefka as the ultimate example of that type of villain. My absolute favorite.
@@salmongod9115 Oh, dude. Kefka's great. Fully agree. FFVI, my man!
Anton Chigurgh is one of the greatest villians ever.
Mike LaPointe +
Oh, indeed. The coin toss between Anton and that poor man, the split-second look of Anton relieved of the outcome.
When I watch "Austin Powers" movies, I always look forward to Dr. Evil being on-screen. ;-)
I really love the Spike Lee movie Inside Man, which sort of features multiple villains, some of whom could also be viewed as heroes based on their own perspective or motives. It’s a movie that really delves into the fine lines between hero and villain IMO.
We love villains because of our earliest memories of our parents.
When you are a small child, your parents are larger than you, stronger than you, they know what you did, they know what you're thinking about doing, they swoop down and take what you value most (the cookie, or the three-inch screw that you are trying to swallow). They reduce us to helpless tears. And you spend your life trying to figure out how to finally overcome them.
Doesn't that sound like a great movie villain? That story appeals to our deepest psyche, and our earliest understanding of the world. And who did Darth Vader turn out to be? Luke's father.
I didn’t grow up that way with my parents
I never thought of that before! Very good!
Authorities are not villains. They can be, but they're not the same thing. You're just describing an authority.
@@Lilliathi Spend an afternoon with any toddler and at least one of their parents. You will see the parent command and control the child over and over again. You must hold my hand. Do not chase that cat. Do not put that thumbtack in your mouth. And you will see the child weep and howl with rage at how hopelessly oppressed it is.
Damn. Epiphany moment.
Most villains work best when we have some insight into their insecurities, delusions and motivations. The set-up for the next villain on Ted Lasso is a beautiful example.
Another example of a villain that had little screen time was Brando's Col. Kurz in "Apocalypse Now."
The Operative from Serenity is one of the great villains. Perfect example of everything Chris speaks about.
The author Brandon Sanderson has an interesting technique/theory (his lectures are free on youtube).
Your characters can be defined by three sliding scales.
1. Competency
2. Sympathy/relatable
3. Proactivity (makes the story move forward)
To make the characters interesting they can't have those three maxed out.
Sherlock Holmes for example is highly competent and proactive but not relatable.
This is also a possible explanation as to why we "like" villains. They are often proactive (they initiate the conflict) and competent (to raise the stakes).
Darth Vader is competent, proactive and at some point somewhat relatable (especially when he tries to redeem himself).
I’M so happy to hear Amelie being discussed and praised- brilliant film
We love villains because they reflect the dark parts of ourselves that we can't let go in a civilized society. The villain does what we wish we could do but can't or don't because of the ramifications of doing so (fines, jail, beatings, death). The villain doesn't give a shit about any of that, and so we're fascinated by him/her.
Edit to add: This is why the villain needs to get his comeuppance in the end, too, so the audience gets closure. "I couldn't get away with that shit, so why should s/he?"
Chris Nolan said "If the main character is going to be complex than so does his enemies"
Your timing is always perfect! My WIP has a villain who is very charming and likeable...until his deeds are unraveled at the end. And you're right: he directs the entire novel's plot even though he is only present in a limited number of scenes. Thanks so much for your gift of clarity.
Smartest villains: Gus from Breaking Bad and Professor Moriarty from Sherlock Holmes. Light Yagami from Death Note if we're including antiheroes.
Light is a anti hero and a villain he seen that criminals were getting a away with crimes. Then found a Death Note then tried to do right by punishing criminals. But then a God complex came into play. So he started off as a anti hero when he was killing criminals. Then he became villain when he started to kill innocent people. Because he was trying to stop Crime and punish criminals. But killing every criminal is kind of going too far hans anti hero. But it did make people stop and think about committing crime. The reason he did that is because criminals who were guilty with evidence to prove it. Whore getting away with their crimes so he was trying to help. But them he got a God complex then started to kill innocent people so he became a Villain at that point. Theirs a old saying The Road to Hell is full of good intentions. Light had good intentions in the beginning but then he crossed the line. When he started to kill innocent people.
Emperor Palpatine, might I suggest? That is a good candidate, if not the best candidate, to be called the epitome of cunning.
If you want to talk about smart villains in general. Then I would say Beast Wars Megatron from Transformers Beast Wars. Small spoiler in case no one has seen it but if it wasn't for 2 things . He would have succeeded and wiped out autobots before they were even activated. Meaning the original Megatron and Decepticons would have won the War. Lets just say he would have an he actually did come close to wiping out Humanity before humans the evolved into humans. Then he came close to killing Optimus Prime before he was even discovered in present day. But in the one case someone unexpected stop him in the then one in the other case one of his own. Predacons stopped it to save themselves so if it was not for those two characters. Beast Wars Megatron would have won the war for Decepticons in the future. Because of brilliant and cunning planning.
The Shape: "Halloween"
Zod: "Superman II"
Khan: "Star Trek II"
Tulsa Doom: "Conan the Barbarian"
Darth Vader: "Empire Strikes Back"
T-800: "Terminator"
Lopan: "Big Trouble in Little China"
Xenomorph Queen: "Aliens"
Predator: "Predator"
Hans Gruber: "Die Hard"
👍😎
Well said! It's the reason why Darth Vader is such a mythological figure in our psyche, because his journey towards the Dark Side is something we all can relate to.
12:56 "Somehow, Palpatine Returned." That is all that one needs to know, apparently.
"From hell's heart, I stab at thee! For hate's sake, I spit my last breath at thee!"
Now THAT is a villain.
I think that the reason villains so often fall to their deaths is symbolic. They have reached the "height" of power, prestige, knowledge, etc only to "fall"
True, it can be symbolic. But it also is, in a lot of stories where the writer doesn't want to dirty the hero's hands, a way of killing off the villain without having the heroic protagonist kill them.
Infinity War was so good. When Thanos won you could feel the despair in the theater...it felt like the air was thicker when the credits rolled and it was harder to breathe. Two of my favorite villains that many have forgotten..... Les Grossman, and The Shogun of Harlem...Sho Nuff!!
Most people don't realize that Indiana Jones was not even necessary for the story in Raiders....he was just along for the ride and it was fun.
Every villain that Gary Oldman has ever played.
Or Alan Rickman.
My favourite villain is Clarence Boddicker, who managed to be utterly unlikeable but he was compelling and darkly funny
While I don't necessarily buy into the bandwagon thinking that villains are more relatable than the heroes, I do find myself defending not only Robocop's Clarence Boddicker, but Dick Jones as well.
They're Earth's equivalent of Vader and Palpatine. Like Vader, Boddicker is the enforcer, the one who is on the ground committing the physical acts of evil and violence, yet he is highly intelligent. And just like Palpatine, Dick Jones is the one high above in his office (Deathstar), nearly untouchable, plotting and scheming.
In the case of Boddicker, I feel he never gets enough credit for being a great villain, especially a villain of 80's cinema because he is always overshadowed by the likes of Hans Gruber or even Vader. While I like Hans Gruber and think he's a good villain, I don't he's as intimidating or effective as Boddicker.
After all, Boddicker did what Gruber could never accomplish, he actually killed the hero.
Oh, and as far as Die Hard villains go, I've always preferred Colonel Stewart (William Sadler) over Hans Gruber.
I like all of those villains, Corey. Good point about the mastermind and the thug. Hannibal Lecter and Buffalo Bill too, even though they were separate threats rather than cohorts.
@@AlmostEthical
I do like Hannibal Lecture and not just Hopkins performance, but Brian Cox's take on the character as well. I own the Hannibal series on blu-ray but haven't watched it yet, so the verdict is still out for me on Mads Mikkelsen's performance, but given everything else he's ever done, I'm 99% sure I'm going to like his version.
But the thing with Lecture (or Lekter, according to Manhunter) is much like Vader, Gruber, and the Joker, he's always brought up whenever great villains are talked about. Dick Jones and Clarence Boddicker are never discussed to the extent that the previously stated villains are.
As a matter of fact, here are some other great villains that I believe are largely ignored.
1.) Commander Kruge. In the pantheon of Star Trek adversaries, Christopher Lloyd's Klingon baddie is always overshadowed by Ricardo Montalban's Khan Noonien Singh.
2.) Magua ( Wes Studi / The Last Of The Mohicans)
3.) Sho-Nuff ( Julius Carry / The Last Dragon)
4.) Thulsa Doom (James-Earl Jones / Conan The Barbarian)
5.) Conan Cochran (Daniel O'Herlihy / Halloween III: Season Of The Witch)
6.) The Tall Man (Angus Scrimm / Phantasm)
7.) Diana ( Jane Badler / V, the miniseries and regular series)
8.) Alexander Pierce ( Robert Redford / Captain America: The Winter Soldier)
9.) Lord Darkness ( Tim Curry / Legend)
10.) Peyton Flanders, a.k.a. Mrs. Mott ( Rebecca DeMornay / The Hand That Rocks The Cradle)
11.) The Baron Vladimir Harkonen (Kenneth McMillan / Dune-1984)
12.) Big Boy Caprice (Al Pacino / Dick Tracy)
Okay, that's enough. I was only going to list 10 but I went for two more.
@@coreyc5982 I bow before your greater villain knowledge :) The only ones I've heard of are the Baron and Kruge.
I think Clarence and Dick tend to miss out because they have appeared in one single movie, and nowhere else. I also enjoyed Clarence's gang of thugs, each of which had a distinct personality, which is not easy to pull off. The first Robocop was very good at the "show, don't tell" approach to exposition.
I found Anton Chigurrgh and Frank Booth to be unforgettable villains.
In 1987 Boddicker was a terrifying, sociopath of a villain. Today I fear people who watch it for the first time will only see him as Red from That 70s Show. It makes him much less scary.
The villain from Seven is actually smart. They had no clue who he was till he turned himself in, and even after that he followed his plan to completion.
There was a direct social commentary to his motivations as well. So his methods were deplorable but his purpose had a level purity to it. It was malicious self-righteousness, but there was a point to it.
John Doe
Always a delight to hear from Chris Gore.
Most audience members do NOT want to see the villain be successful with their evil plan, they want to see the hero thwart, and punish the villain thoroughly and without TOO much trouble. That’s why Joker is kind of a unique villain, because it’s one of the few occasions where the audience wants to see the bad guy have his fun, and because he’s so fun to watch, we don’t really want to see him punished too much even though we do ultimately want to see him thwarted.
Idk about that. Not always. That's what made infinity war sooo good was the fact that the heroes lost
I don't think so
Completely agree. Without a good villain, you won't have a good hero.
Robocop is the gold standard for memorable villains.
Clarence Boddicker. Definitely up there.
Probably one of the best villians I've seen recently is John Wick...I know, he's the protagonist, but if you look at the structure of the first movie he's really the villain. He's not reacting to what the bad guys do, they're reacting to him and trying to stop him. He's set up as the impossible to beat force that these guys are up against. So he's the villain in the structural sense but you root for him because of his motivations.
L take
Interesting commentary. Thanks for posting.
That dog was wicked cute. I'd go off too... 😂
The “protagonist” Russians broke into his home, murdered his dog, stole his shit and then beat him nearly to death.
Wick isn’t the villain. He’s bringing justice to evil and fighting fire with fire.
Modern day ideologies want you to believe that evil men deserve forgiveness, hugs and teddy bears.
Reality is not that.
Wick is a protagonist in the oldest sense and you’ll find familiarity in westerns and older movies with conviction.
The bad guys don’t get away, they do not pass go, they do not collect a free pass.
A hero with balls is incredibly rare in Hollywood, so your confusion is somewhat understandable.
@@lucaschudleigh7193 I think you misunderstood what I was saying. I don't think the mobsters were the good guys by any stretch, and as I said John Wick IS the protagonist. What I was saying was that structurally the story sets up his character like the villain is usually set up. Typically in a story like this the hero would be facing a mysterious, seemingly unstoppable villain. The hero would spend the story trying and failing to overcome the villain. With John wick they reversed it and made him the mysterious, unstoppable boogyman that the bad guys are trying and failing to defeat. I liked how they turned it on its head.
Kreia will forever, to me, have some of the most valid points as the villan. God I wish she would make an appearance in the Star Wars movies 😫.
Michael Douglas in Falling Down is one of my favorite "bad". The older I get, the more I can relate to him.
Jaws was an amazing villain, he even had a full story arc.
Some of the best actors play villains, Tim Curry, Alan Rickman, Christopher Walken, Gary Busey & who can forget Terry Thomas!
Honourable mention to Raul Julia in Street Fighter, he mostly did not play villains but in street fighter he was amazing '"For you, the day Bison graced your village was the most important day in your life, but for me? It was Tuesday."
O and as ever the god Christopher Lee!
Dammit you beat me by 50 minutes! Jaws was just trying to eat! Perfectly justified! :P
@@the7percentsolution Sharks will shark, the humans may have been the villain's in Jaws.
I was thinking of Jaws from James bond
Who Terry Thomas?
@@jnnx dick dastardly is based on Terry Thomas, wiki will tell you all you need to know.
Villains are appealing because sometimes they can exhibit traits that could be viewed as admirable, honorable, and/desirable.
Being self driven and having the determination to achieve one's goals.
Sometimes villains can be just as hard working at trying to push through their limits and overcome their own weaknesses like many of our heroes.
I think when a villain can be liked or well received is whether or not they have redeemable qualities.
But there are sometimes villains who have none what so ever, and are just plain cruel. But, they can still serve as a good set piece in a story.
"Villains tend to be more interesting" So true, just look at Demolition Man
Michael Rosenbaum as Lex Luthor in Smallville is my favorite villain of all time. Would love to see Chris Gores take on him.
Some Of The Greatest Movie Villains To Me In No Order:
1.Freddy Krueger:A force that makes us face our greatest fears.
2.Michael Myers:So great were his inner demons that he gave into evil and madness.
3.The Joker(1989):Despite his humor he sees chaos and death as funny.
4.Doc Ock:He only wanted to help mankind and sees his actions as justifiable.
5.Magneto:Gave up on mankind and became that which he hated.
6.General Zod(Man Of Steel):He only wanted to save Krypton.
7.Darth Vader:For what Gore said.
8.William "D-Fens"Foster(Falling Down):A guy who made valid points about how bad society had gone down despite the violent acts he did.
9.Jeanine Matthews(Divergent,Insurgent):She showed great intellect and her main goal was to keep the society of Chicago safe and in order,not for power.
10.Blofeld(On Her Majesty's Secret Service):Blofeld's plan of global bio warfare was genius and he only wanted a pardon not world domination.
11.Muriel(Hansel And Gretel:Witch Hunters):Clever,diabolical,gave the heroes a run for their money.
12.Dr No(Dr No):He was cunning,shrewd,brilliant,one of the few not afraid to fight Bond.
13.Franz Sanchez(License To Kill):Clever drug lord who didn't care about world conquest only making money and was one tough s.o.b.
14.The Shredder(TMNT 1990):Cold and cruel,this one almost killed the turtles.
15.Joanie(Cursed 2005):All she cared about was getting the man she wanted and didn't care about who she had to kill to do it.
16.Jason Voorhees:An unstoppable force of nature who makes you dread going camping.
17.Leatherface:Simple minded or not he can and will find you all just to please his crazy family.
18.Courtney Shayne(Jawbreaker):The kind of girl who you not only knew in high school but seemed like she could get anyone to crush you like a bug.
19.Billy Chapman(Silent Night Deadly Night):An early sympathetic villain a few years after Vader whose mind was shattered on Christmas Eve.
20.The Joker(Joker 2019):Arthur Fleck is quite sympathetic.He shows what happens to some of us when we fall down the rabbit hole.
21.The Lizad:Another scientist who only wanted to help mankind.
22.Hans Gruber:Diabolical and debonair at the same time.
23.Mystique:Swayed into villainy by man's intolerance for different people.
24.Angela Baker(Sleepaway Camp):A child whose mind was broken early in life and put back together though not properly by his crazed aunt.
25.Cheetah(Wonder Woman 1984):I know the movie stunk yet I found the character sympathetic regardless of the cliches they put on her.After all, haven't we all wanted to be special but some of us paid the price for it?.
I have spent my life saying you can't have a compelling story without a strong antagonist. If there is nothing terrible to overcome, what conflict is there, what risk, what victory to achieve? A strong villain embodies risk, conflict, challenge, the possibility of failure and the hope of victory. A strong villain is an avatar for anybody's own adversity and what it means to overcome it.
And we ALL overcome adversity. A compelling villain gives that adversity a face and a voice...even if it's not a person.
I have watched The Lost Ark so many times, and this is the first time I thought that Indy actually lost at the end... Bravo Chris Gore for opening my mind.
I guess this is why I really liked and felt for Joaquin Phoenix's Joker. I could listen to Chris talk about movies for hours. If he had a podcast where he talked about 1 movie for 2+ hours, that would be awesome.
I’ve always found Thanos in IW interesting in that he works as both a villain and protagonist.
The brilliance of that movie is thanos is the main character
in my 20s I was on the hero's journey, but now in my 40s I am more on the villain journey.
You can still have your redemption arc.
@@guilherme5094
Who needs one? ;)
@@G360LIVE Those that feel something is wrong in their conscience.
Javier Bardem as Anton Chigurh in No Country for Old Men.
Great stuff, love Chris Gore's explanations and interpretation. I agree that too many villains get outsmarted but I like Hans Gruber and Moriarty from Sherlock Holmes.
Actors have the most fun playing villians and take a humorous approach, even if its dark humor.
'The driving force of drama is the dark side." Barbara Steele
Villains like Vader stand the tests of time because they have three things going for them
1: A design that makes them stand out
2: A presence that exudes "Big Bad"
3: Having the power to inflict change or force heroes in motion
Maleficent of Disney's Sleeping Beauty is another iconic villain. Just from her first scene alone, you know she means business. Same can be said for other iconic Disney villains, like Ursula, Gaston, Scar, etc. Outside of the Disney bubble, even the Joker and Voldemort are iconic because they have the three things above. If a villain has all three, then you know you have a potential great villain on your hands.
Scorpius from Farscape, one of the best villains ever. Has a menacing look, extremely intelligent, very strong and hard to kill. From his point of view everything he does is completely justified because he does it to stop an even greater threat, that and his personal grudge against them. When you watch the show it's hard not to understand why he is doing the things that he does.
Wayne Pygram was absolutely fantastic in that roll.
In general, villains know exactly what they want, and have no inner conflict about how to get it. Being ruthless in this way is admirable, a kind of power and purpose we never get to experience in normal life but wish we could, even if their actions or mindset are revolting. I think likability is really overrated. Characters we can *relate* to are much more likely to be characters we empathise with and invest in. Han Solo is not 'unlikable' because he is cynical and cocky. He is there as a contrast to Luke, and Han's courage, competency, humor & straight-talking attitude make him appealing.
Thank you for this ☮️🙂🕯
This is a great channel.
I’ve always loved the villains journey but the look of Darth Vader is timeless, reminds me of what a medieval Knight & a Samurai Warrior would look like if they were merged together then throw in David Prowse physicality & the voice of James Earl Jones along with the character’s back story makes him utterly compelling. So sad to witness what’s happened to this once loved franchise
I think the best recent example I can think of for a villain who has a lot of presence looming over the film despite little screen time would be the Riddler in The Batman. He was scary, had a memorable design, had a great parallel to the hero, was several steps ahead the whole time, was shown to be layered with things like his personality when in costume compared to without it, and he had a point with exposing the corruption of Gotham that he'd been a victim of his whole life.
Heath Ledger's Joker is my all time favourite villain. Fascinating, terrifying, brilliant and psychopathic.
Who?
If you ever need to cite an amazing female villain, I submit for your review Sarah Michelle Gellar in Cruel Intentions. Brilliant.
This is spot-on. My top three villains of all time are Darth Vader (Star Wars), John Doe (Seven), and Hans Gruber (Die Hard).
Whenever I think of my favorite villain, I think of Jon Irenicus from the original Baldurs Gate II: Shadows of Amn.
Hans Gruber, top-notch villain. I feel Vader had some compassion, Gruber had none and was expelled from a known terrorist organization. His brother was a good villain too.
One of the best villains in media, in my opinion, is Tywin Lannister. He’s not a good guy, but there is something that makes us like him.
In my latest script I made my hero a villain in the making. This way I can love her development and maintain her darkness.
A good villain doesn't think they're evil.
Douglas in Falling Down is the perfect example of that.
underrated - Zod from Man of steel. Really well played and you really feel his motivation.
And the Immortan Joe... so good
These are seriously the best to listen to while at the gym
This is such a great question that one could go on and on about it.
Chris nails a lot of great points here, but I think it’s the kind of question that deserves a discussion around it.
The last villain I actually enjoyed was Valentine from Kingsman... because I was at least able to go, "I disagree with the method, but the idea has some merit"...
The Joker film. The journey to becoming the Joker. Brilliant film
I know we're talking about movie villans, but Mads Mikkelsen in S1 of Hannibal, Charles Danse in GOT, and Vincent D'Onofrio in Daredevil are excellent
Ralph MacQuarrie did the design work for Star Wars, Ralph Bakshi is someone else entirely.
Chris Gore needs to run Hollywood, it gives hope that ppl like him are around
Hannibal Lecter is on the screen for only 24 minutes of a 2 hr film and it is the DOMINATING performance of that film, proving Mr. Gore's point
I need to rewatch Amelie again... Such a One-of-a-kind movie
It's weird regarding villains, not all stories NEED villains but a good one can greatly elevate a mediocre story and would make a good story even better.
Agent Smith for example helped made the first Matrix good among the other stuff that movie had, and he greatly elevated the sequels by becoming the very thing he hated, remove Agent Smith from the sequels and they would be much worse. Agent Smith's arc of starting off as a machine controlled by the system to becoming a free man who is more human and constantly multiples himself like a virus which he hated humanity for in the first Matrix makes the Matrix trilogy worth watching, not just the first, even though the first Matrix is a much more satisfying as a movie and a narrative.
I also feel the best villains are the ones who highlight the qualities of the hero, a "foil" basically. Lex Luthor is a classic example, the guy pratically is the pinnacle of what humanity can be and yet he is corrupt and chooses to go against Superman because he the former thinks he can take over humanity. Luthor highlights the purity of Superman and how easy it is for the latter to turn on humanity and do exactly what Luthor think he would do.
Fiction is weird in that makes you like and respect people who you can't stand in real life.
Actually, Smith can be removed from the Matrix sequels. You'd just have to come up with a new reason why The Architect needs Neo to fight for him at the end, which is what brings a halt to the war. The point of the Matrix sequels was to show that humans and machines depend on each other and need to co-exist. Smith really didn't elevate the sequels; he was simply the vehicle for that to be shown to The Architect. I can cut most of Smith's scenes out of the sequels and not lose anything of importance.
@@G360LIVE
Yeah remove the most intetesting character in the whole trilogy. Glad you didn't write them.
For me the best villains were T1000 and Anton Chigurh. Modern movies should stop making every villain as the "misunderstood person" or "the main villain was the society" or "toxic masculinity was the villain". Some people are simply evil and terrifying. Where did those villains go?
I loved the comment about the villain appealing to something dark inside us. We have boundaries and responsibilities, yet part of us wants to break through and do what is right, or not so right, or get revenge for some injustice. As for female villains, the best one by far that I have seen is Olivia in the TV series of 12 Monkeys. The protagonist is smart, and very capable, but Olivia is smarter, stronger, and anticipates everything. Her past hardships make her understandable, even to the point where you think she could swap sides.
This is also why I dislike modern stories, because instead of treating the villains as interesting character studies (the flaws and evil within all of us) or just interesting characters in general, modern writers only use villains as something to hate and vilify. A lot more villains are some combination of: white/male/conservative/billionaire capitalist, and any villain that doesn't fall under than purview is tragic/misunderstood/well-intentioned/technically right because it's like the writers believe that having a villain be something like say, a gay black woman, it would mean they hate gays/POC or something.
I need more Gore with Critical Drinker reviews of stuff. I could listen to them two all day