This was an important topic because i can see a lot of old man forms being taught by people who have nothing hidden in their old man form. Which means that they are like a hollow tree. One assumes they have strength from years of practice yet if one knows what to look for due to their own experience and practice, they can see that no details are being hidden. It’s like a pretty dance that been memorized. Thank you brother Hai. I have been studying the internals arts for some years now and understand exactly all the points you are presenting. Another great 👍🏻 video.
I was fortunate enough to train for a brief period with master Ma Hong the same year he had turned 80. He was very impressive doing the long form with low postures and jumps even as it was a hot and humid summer.
“I have to say I have seen many people at the manure high level even after a decade of practice” Amen. I have seen several 20year failures of even the most competent of systems. The player makes all the difference. People simply do not put in the effort needed to gain these skills. It mystifies me how boxing and mma attract the type of people who are willing to work hard, but these traditional arts are largely attracting a completely inept population. As a 20+ year practitioner I can honestly say I have met very few willing to put in the work and consistently train and improve in these arts.
Master Yang, this is an amazing treasure of philosophy, not just martial arts. It is evident that besides being a superb teacher, you are a profound thinker, and I believe people could totally change their lives if they learned from this video. I have practiced for a couple of decades, and follow the internal practice. I will have my students study this video very carefully, and recommend it to many others. As a philosopher, I am delighted such remarkable work is made public, and I hope I can help promote it and you. I am the Editor of The Marginalia Review of Books, a major magazine that helps bring academics and intellectuals to the broader public. I would be delighted to perhaps interview you for our magazine, on the internal arts as a way of life, a kind of philosophy. Happy to email you if that sounds interesting, and thank you for this video (and the many others I have watched) and your teaching work; they are a precious gift. (I fondly hope to study with you in time.)
Hello Mr. Loncar, Thank you for your comments. I am very happy to know that people in different fields connect together. Actually, I have learned many valuable knowledge after moving to the West. I hope more and more people will benefit from our practice. Please write to me at wudangmontreal@gmail.com if you have any suggestion.
Thank you for the information!! Yes, many masters think their curriculum is the most direct path to their art’s mastery. But the path to their skill level is actually looking at what and how they trained. 👍👍👍
Thank you very much, Master Yang, for explaining and clarifiing method and methodology and also the concept of "old man form" That´s realy something we all should be aware of and practice accordingly. You asked for martial proverbs that are unclear. There are many :-) but one is bothering me. In the Classics of Taijiquan bei Wangzongyue he writes: "The spirit (shen) reaches the top of the head, and the qi sinks to the dantien." Maybe you´ll find time to explain the meaning of shen, or that saying, in one of your future videos. ( I know that you already talked about shen in one of the videos .) I am looking forward to your teachings, and I am also a litle bit grateful for the corona pandemic, because otherwise maybe you wouldn´t be able to make those enlighting videos for us. I wish you a wonderful day, Thomas
Great deconstruction of knowledge even for outside applications of martial arts! Also, authority method made me think of this quote: “ Understanding what is true does not, or should not, flow from authority. If someone has authority over what you think, they can get you to believe anything. “ - Neil Degrasse Tyson
Having gone through Japanese styles before coming to gongfu and then to internal practice I have seen quite a bit of old-man-style-teachers who often have a huge collection of forms they are always prepared to demonstrate - but inside these forms they do not really have form (posture, precision, application of energy). It's nice to have a term for this now. Thanks for another great video.
Old masters always said that the tradition or real sayings are absolute must and students must to know them in the beginning to enter the door, however if the knowledge is lost or wrong then the problems are bad,but not incurable ,in fact this will probably happen , just have pure heart and never stop learning, you could learn from every human being and fake masters are not that hard to be seen, lineage is good, however when it comes to money even some very pure lineages don't give their knowledge ,if you expect to buy a piece of paper that made you a master and you practice for 6 months - probably someone will sell you some papers,but real skills and real tradition required dedication and commitment, respect can't be paid with PayPal or paper, knowing some people they have what they deserve,some people are victims of fake masters, however if one is honest and sincere he will find the answers and decent teacher, in fact your master could give you the tradition,but it is for you to achieve the desired skills,it is your body parts after all.
@@HaiYangChannel Yes,in fact master Yang things you said in this topic are absolutely correct and even old texts like 10 thesis which is old indeed are saying the same principle of learning to express and know your own body, really nobody could be the same and even in old pictures there are differences in the positions and postures , copy paste it doesn't work , internal principles of Dao are the same not the outside appearance.
in the west it is difficult to enter the door... OLD MAN'S FORM is a rabbit hole easy to fall in to in the west...a worthy lecture HY... wrapping my head around these ideas...thank you
Thank you for expressively sharing your thoughts with the rest of us folks. You presentation summarized the facets of validating knowledge through an acknowledgement of methodology is a bravo well done.
Hi Master Yang, great video once again! I think this video should probably the first thing a new student should watch!! Among the interesting topics discussed, you mentionned studying the learning path of Masters. I feel a challenging part of this in North America might be 1) the lack of abundance of masters for any fixed given style (i.e. if a practionner picks a Chinese Martial Art style in one city, there will be maybe a few Master's, but not hundreds of them) 2) the unfortunate fact that not all people share your concerns about transparency. This is something I enjoyed learning from you: the fact that you were straightforward and transparent about many aspects of the way you learn, from whom, how, etc. With some other prior styles, let's say I didn't experience the same level of transparency, and I believe you might be more the exception than the norm in terms of allowing students benefiting from such knowledge. A related question I always had about styles I practiced is the degree of heterogeneity among practionners of the same style. For example, due to differences in body shapes that you mentionned, to what extent does the practice differ at a high level. To answer this question I've tried several times to browse videos and find high-level practice to compare to what I was learning and do some benchmarking. The least to say is that it's not very easy to go on UA-cam and find many different high-level practitionners of Xing Yi for instance (probably there are more on the chinese version of youtube, but for me it's impossible to browse such website). I guess there might be many very good people who do not necessarily share videos of their practice on the web. All this scarcity of relevant information makes your contributions through this video series very valuable! But again, it is hard to compare the learning path of many Master's when only a few of them provide information. One notable exception, I enjoyed the videos of Liu Jung Feng from the Shang branch (ua-cam.com/video/UhyjM3crCS8/v-deo.html). Thanks again for these enjoyable videos! Fred
yes, I totally agree with you. Liu Junfeng practices Shang Style, which is a branch of Hebei style. I like that style too and his practice is nice. Thanks,
Very instructive video. I'm now convinced that most of my elder kung fu brothers had no clue how to train their art so that they would improve steadily over time. Sad...😟
Fantastic Master Yang, always exceeds my expectations. This video is very enlightening, but as a colleague said here in the comments, we do not always have all the information available, I find more facilities nowadays on the internet, but definitely, in my experience, intertwining the study of principles with practice is fundamental to seek depth. Today, more mature, I give more importance to improve the simple movements and I found this also in the academic riding masters. I hope to be entering the door instead of leaving ... laughs..much thanks for your contributions.
further thoughts...before i started watching u... all i ever saw was SOFT INSIDE SOFT...SUNG...SUNG...SUNG...... then i saw u and u described SOFT INSIDE HARD... OLD MAN'S form IS ALL I WAS EVER EXPOSED TO ESPECIALLY re YANG STYLE as tai chI chuan has been transported to the west...but i like attempting to retain the power-bone-tendon of a young man as an old man...this is a much better practice and goal... to train for the defense I never need in my life...i hope...and to maintain health with vigor.. your explosive CHEN TAI CHI and XING YI was new to my eyes...but i have been watching u for months now... and with my YI QUAN beginning to feel my frame and over come the lack of feeling my body developed from sitting in a chair for 40 years and injuries from weakness and bad food... feeling good body-mind-spirit... yi quan in my sleep and in my life... SOFT INSIDE HARD..thx again HY
Thank you. I now think my Xing Yi practice is 100 year Old Man with Head Injury Practice. So, maybe I can fall on the opponent and hurt their foot with my body, I will train Collapse Method. Sorry, I enjoy making a jokes about my form.
Can you please do a youtube video on standing principles and bringing energy from the ground for push hands practices as this seems to be something people are not addressing openly or have you already covered this subject?
Actually, I usually do 老头拳 because I have to work a lot and usually can only practice a little and when I have no energy. Actually, physical practice is a luxury. Usually, I can only practice in my head while falling asleep. I'm memorizing the basic sequences of movements, but hopefully someday I won't have to work so much.
This was an important topic because i can see a lot of old man forms being taught by people who have nothing hidden in their old man form. Which means that they are like a hollow tree. One assumes they have strength from years of practice yet if one knows what to look for due to their own experience and practice, they can see that no details are being hidden. It’s like a pretty dance that been memorized. Thank you brother Hai. I have been studying the internals arts for some years now and understand exactly all the points you are presenting. Another great 👍🏻 video.
Thank you. Good to know that you share the same feeling.
I was fortunate enough to train for a brief period with master Ma Hong the same year he had turned 80. He was very impressive doing the long form with low postures and jumps even as it was a hot and humid summer.
Yes, that was how did he practiced...
“I have to say I have seen many people at the manure high level even after a decade of practice”
Amen. I have seen several 20year failures of even the most competent of systems. The player makes all the difference. People simply do not put in the effort needed to gain these skills. It mystifies me how boxing and mma attract the type of people who are willing to work hard, but these traditional arts are largely attracting a completely inept population. As a 20+ year practitioner I can honestly say I have met very few willing to put in the work and consistently train and improve in these arts.
Master Yang, this is an amazing treasure of philosophy, not just martial arts. It is evident that besides being a superb teacher, you are a profound thinker, and I believe people could totally change their lives if they learned from this video. I have practiced for a couple of decades, and follow the internal practice. I will have my students study this video very carefully, and recommend it to many others. As a philosopher, I am delighted such remarkable work is made public, and I hope I can help promote it and you. I am the Editor of The Marginalia Review of Books, a major magazine that helps bring academics and intellectuals to the broader public. I would be delighted to perhaps interview you for our magazine, on the internal arts as a way of life, a kind of philosophy. Happy to email you if that sounds interesting, and thank you for this video (and the many others I have watched) and your teaching work; they are a precious gift. (I fondly hope to study with you in time.)
Hello Mr. Loncar, Thank you for your comments. I am very happy to know that people in different fields connect together. Actually, I have learned many valuable knowledge after moving to the West. I hope more and more people will benefit from our practice. Please write to me at wudangmontreal@gmail.com if you have any suggestion.
Thank you for the information!! Yes, many masters think their curriculum is the most direct path to their art’s mastery. But the path to their skill level is actually looking at what and how they trained. 👍👍👍
So true! Thanks,
Thank you very much, Master Yang, for explaining and clarifiing method and methodology and also the concept of "old man form" That´s realy something we all should be aware of and practice accordingly. You asked for martial proverbs that are unclear. There are many :-) but one is bothering me. In the Classics of Taijiquan bei Wangzongyue he writes:
"The spirit (shen) reaches the top of the head, and the qi sinks to the dantien."
Maybe you´ll find time to explain the meaning of shen, or that saying, in one of your future videos. ( I know that you already talked about shen in one of the videos .)
I am looking forward to your teachings, and I am also a litle bit grateful for the corona pandemic, because otherwise maybe you wouldn´t be able to make those enlighting videos for us.
I wish you a wonderful day, Thomas
Wonderful suggestion. I will definitely do it. Thanks,
Great deconstruction of knowledge even for outside applications of martial arts!
Also, authority method made me think of this quote:
“ Understanding what is true does not, or should not, flow from authority. If someone has authority over what you think, they can get you to believe anything. “
- Neil Degrasse Tyson
Thanks for your input too.
Having gone through Japanese styles before coming to gongfu and then to internal practice I have seen quite a bit of old-man-style-teachers who often have a huge collection of forms they are always prepared to demonstrate - but inside these forms they do not really have form (posture, precision, application of energy). It's nice to have a term for this now.
Thanks for another great video.
Your first hand experiences confirmed my video:)
@@HaiYangChannel It certainly did.
Old masters always said that the tradition or real sayings are absolute must and students must to know them in the beginning to enter the door, however if the knowledge is lost or wrong then the problems are bad,but not incurable ,in fact this will probably happen , just have pure heart and never stop learning, you could learn from every human being and fake masters are not that hard to be seen, lineage is good, however when it comes to money even some very pure lineages don't give their knowledge ,if you expect to buy a piece of paper that made you a master and you practice for 6 months - probably someone will sell you some papers,but real skills and real tradition required dedication and commitment, respect can't be paid with PayPal or paper, knowing some people they have what they deserve,some people are victims of fake masters, however if one is honest and sincere he will find the answers and decent teacher, in fact your master could give you the tradition,but it is for you to achieve the desired skills,it is your body parts after all.
interesting.
@@HaiYangChannel Yes,in fact master Yang things you said in this topic are absolutely correct and even old texts like 10 thesis which is old indeed are saying the same principle of learning to express and know your own body, really nobody could be the same and even in old pictures there are differences in the positions and postures , copy paste it doesn't work , internal principles of Dao are the same not the outside appearance.
in the west it is difficult to enter the door... OLD MAN'S FORM is a rabbit hole easy to fall in to in the west...a worthy lecture HY... wrapping my head around these ideas...thank you
Well said and thank,s
One more relevant video ! Really. I bow before your talent.
Thank you.
Thank you for expressively sharing your thoughts with the rest of us folks. You presentation summarized the facets of validating knowledge through an acknowledgement of methodology is a bravo well done.
My pleasure and thank you.
Another interesting video, thank you for sharing.
Thank you.
Very good explanation !
Glad you liked it!
Hi Master Yang, great video once again! I think this video should probably the first thing a new student should watch!!
Among the interesting topics discussed, you mentionned studying the learning path of Masters. I feel a challenging part of this in North America might be 1) the lack of abundance of masters for any fixed given style (i.e. if a practionner picks a Chinese Martial Art style in one city, there will be maybe a few Master's, but not hundreds of them) 2) the unfortunate fact that not all people share your concerns about transparency. This is something I enjoyed learning from you: the fact that you were straightforward and transparent about many aspects of the way you learn, from whom, how, etc. With some other prior styles, let's say I didn't experience the same level of transparency, and I believe you might be more the exception than the norm in terms of allowing students benefiting from such knowledge.
A related question I always had about styles I practiced is the degree of heterogeneity among practionners of the same style. For example, due to differences in body shapes that you mentionned, to what extent does the practice differ at a high level. To answer this question I've tried several times to browse videos and find high-level practice to compare to what I was learning and do some benchmarking. The least to say is that it's not very easy to go on UA-cam and find many different high-level practitionners of Xing Yi for instance (probably there are more on the chinese version of youtube, but for me it's impossible to browse such website). I guess there might be many very good people who do not necessarily share videos of their practice on the web. All this scarcity of relevant information makes your contributions through this video series very valuable! But again, it is hard to compare the learning path of many Master's when only a few of them provide information.
One notable exception, I enjoyed the videos of Liu Jung Feng from the Shang branch (ua-cam.com/video/UhyjM3crCS8/v-deo.html).
Thanks again for these enjoyable videos!
Fred
yes, I totally agree with you. Liu Junfeng practices Shang Style, which is a branch of Hebei style. I like that style too and his practice is nice.
Thanks,
Very instructive video. I'm now convinced that most of my elder kung fu brothers had no clue how to train their art so that they would improve steadily over time. Sad...😟
hahaha, thanks,
Fantastic Master Yang, always exceeds my expectations. This video is very enlightening, but as a colleague said here in the comments, we do not always have all the information available, I find more facilities nowadays on the internet, but definitely, in my experience, intertwining the study of principles with practice is fundamental to seek depth. Today, more mature, I give more importance to improve the simple movements and I found this also in the academic riding masters. I hope to be entering the door instead of leaving ... laughs..much thanks for your contributions.
Thank you for your comment. Yes, we all should not leave, instead, we should remain inside of the door.
This is wonderful.
Thank you.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Thanks Sifu... great info
My pleasure and thank you.
Glorious production work! Keep it up over there!
Thanks, will do!
19:00 Very important!
Thanks,
further thoughts...before i started watching u... all i ever saw was SOFT INSIDE SOFT...SUNG...SUNG...SUNG...... then i saw u and u described SOFT INSIDE HARD... OLD MAN'S form IS ALL I WAS EVER EXPOSED TO ESPECIALLY re YANG STYLE as tai chI chuan has been transported to the west...but i like attempting to retain the power-bone-tendon of a young man as an old man...this is a much better practice and goal... to train for the defense I never need in my life...i hope...and to maintain health with vigor.. your explosive CHEN TAI CHI and XING YI was new to my eyes...but i have been watching u for months now... and with my YI QUAN beginning to feel my frame and over come the lack of feeling my body developed from sitting in a chair for 40 years and injuries from weakness and bad food...
feeling good body-mind-spirit... yi quan in my sleep and in my life... SOFT INSIDE HARD..thx again HY
Thank you for your input. IT is very interesting to see how you summarize the concept.
Thank you. I now think my Xing Yi practice is 100 year Old Man with Head Injury Practice. So, maybe I can fall on the opponent and hurt their foot with my body, I will train Collapse Method. Sorry, I enjoy making a jokes about my form.
Interesting.
Can you please do a youtube video on standing principles and bringing energy from the ground for push hands practices as this seems to be something people are not addressing openly or have you already covered this subject?
I will see what I can do for it. Thanks,
Where do you draw the line between teacher and student responsability in methodology?
hard to answer it in a very short sentence. Sorry.
Actually, I usually do 老头拳 because I have to work a lot and usually can only practice a little and when I have no energy. Actually, physical practice is a luxury. Usually, I can only practice in my head while falling asleep. I'm memorizing the basic sequences of movements, but hopefully someday I won't have to work so much.
haha:) great.
@@HaiYangChannel Yes, I look forward to your online program so I can complete my xingyi, bagua, augment my taiji studies, and begin daoist meditation.
I heard Guo Yun Shen wrote a book. Neng Shuo Xingyiquan Jing. Have you heard of it, and is it available? Your videos rock.
Guo had a book. But Neng Shuo Xingyiquan Jing was not written by him.
Do you know who wrote this book?