It's a bit of a pity that you're not making any new videos, I hope everything's OK and you're just not feeling like making more any more. However, what's amazing is that there's this _huge_ back catalog for me to watch now. Amazing!
Thank you very much for your detailed videos. I am working toward my Electronic Technician degree in college and really enjoying your fixing and tear-down videos. Thanks a lot!
you sir are awesome great teardown. Im about to fix the TB boutique so i went looking for teardown videos. This video was so good i decided to stop my task and comment.
+Michael Smith Hi Michael. It is vert well made and the attention to detail right up to the silk screen printing is top class. (so it should be for £299) but yes it is a very well made unit. --- gripe alert > but no CC commands ?. I hope they look into updating this soon. but I'm very pleased with it and it sounds very good (coming from someone who owned the original Jupiter-8)
I agree that the lack of CC implementation is a serious oversight, but this is probably something they'll add as a "feature" later on (hopefully, with no added expense). Coming from someone who has never owned a Jupiter-8, it does sound marvelous. 10,000 pounds for a real one, these days. . .madness.
Greetings from USA. Just bought one of these used from Guitar Center. Interesting to see what makes it tick (I would be too nervous to open it myself!). Love your videos!
I used to own a Jupiter 8 too and *damn*... I also sold it in 1998 for next to nothing. However I find this AIRA series pretty cool. Thanks for sharing your videos!
lol, no its actually essential just a bit less versatile then the original and only 4 notes of polyphony instead of 8 or 6 like the junos, same with the ju-06 and the jx-03, btw, the jx-03 is finally a full analogue control analogue synth unlike the original jx-3p which was controlled digitally (to make it cheaper and somewhat more "professional essential" like the access virus that came at 1998?
its actually usable, dont hate before try, true, its more difficult to find the sweetest spot but i actually rather it to have at least 6 or 8 voices then bigger faders, now they have only 4 which is quite terrible, so you cant large chord pads (in an analogue synth the oscillators switch from one note to another harmoniclly when it run out of voices, yea you can use delay but seriously thats all that rolland has to offer as a relic to its classic revolutionery synthesizers? the good thing is that it sounds almost the same as the original, approximately... i aspecially liked the jx-03, a complete analogue (analogue modeling and analogue oscillatiors) cheap version of the jx-3p that was more digital modeling what was less accurate and more difficult its to adjust its parameters for a certian\ any sound accurately lunlike in an complete analogue \ modern digital synth but was more comfortable for professional\ amature speed use when if you wanted a certain sound directly, like the Oberheim Matrix and the access virus which was actually fully analogue despite this two synths, that was the idea. - get the sound efficiently, accurately and fast
Just figured I'd hop in here and thank you for this video, I switched my JU-06 over to all blue LED's and I was afraid to open the darn thing because of how much the lil' thing costs, but you relieved my anxiety completely!
David Rhodes Hello David swopping the leds over - I bet that looks real nice. I keep thinking about swopping the green leds in the system-8 but not sure what colour i want.
Very disappointing of Roland not to release these as plug outs for the System 1 which has 2 of those chips inside, so in theory should be able to easily achieve at least 8 notes of poly. They sound great but 4 notes give me a break
+markusfuller I think the reason why it only achieves 4 notes on the System 1 is that it runs at 96k so extra CPU power needed. Whilst the Boutiques currently run at 44.1k either way both great sounding systems albeit some slight annoyances
Of course. I was looking inside the system one last night thinking why did it only have 4 voices yet 2 FPGAs. Thankyou vinyljunkie07 you just answered my thoughts for me. sometimes the obvious is not so obvious. it is using two FPGAs for the 96K
I hope ROLAND eventually make an 8 voice version of the JP-8. theres enough room inside. or at least an update to half the 96k of the system 1 and have 48k 8 voices.
As a kid, I would steal money from my dad and buy things like calculators to tear apart, look at, and throw away. As an adult, your videos are saving me thousands of dollars. 😉 One of these days I'll get the Polysix and Juno-106 sitting in my closet working again.
It has the same board also on the D-05, with the midi out sw. limitations. There in not an octocoupler for the midi out in both boards, but there is only for midi in.
Great work Markus! It is very interesting to see that there was a spare memory slot. Perhaps Roland at one stage might have considered making this an 8 voice - then decided against it?
Hi The SE-02 looks and sounds interesting but at £509.00 I think its a bit overpriced with so many other things on sale at the moment. but if I manage to get my hands on one to play with I will certainly give it a go.
Nice tear down and another great video mate. I think your probably right about those main boards being the same, if i remember correctly your tear downs of the TB 3 and VT 3 had the same boards but with minor differences. I expect it saves them money if they can use the same components across multiple devices.
@@spookypen The D-50 was a digital synth originally. The JP08 had to use ACB (an algorithm designed by roland) to simulate an analogue process (Jupiter was analog obviously). Can I assure you this would be far more CPU dependent than simply emulating an digital synth.
Judging by the fact that Roland's website now shows there are 13 different models available, i'd say they must have been fairly successful. :) www.roland.com/us/promos/roland_boutique/
Hey there, please help me answer this question... when controlling thru midi can you still manipulate the sound from the slaves hardware? Particularly the sliders?
+ThomasGrillo Hi Thomas. Thank You, I too like the ribbon controllers though I wish they could be assigned to different parameters. I hope all is well.
The Jupiter 8 is now floating at 20k USD and even higher. These are a bargain and are no longer being made so price is going up. Roland released an update for MIDI CC. Also there's a certain roland with a J in its model name that can control all of the parameters on the boutique model. It also has similar arpeggio controls to the jupiter and juno models and can drive external synths with it! I find it funny that no one has tried to use an old synth to control these new boutique models!
Do the potentiometers used in have any model marking on them? The ones with fixed positions and free rotating potentiometers; can you tell if they are lin or log and what resistance? 6mm d shaft as i can see. Should be standard.
thanks for the breakdown. I was expecting to see those plastic button strips as some sort of connected overlay on the contacts. Sometimes my JU06 buttons LOOK misaligned that a simple push fixes or causes. I definitely see why . It is no problem with function everything works but it can look a bit alarming
I saw that Waldorf string machine in the background. They seems pretty cool, but a bit pricey for what they are maybe. I am shocked it can't handle CC commands. What good is a synth you can't send CCs to?
Hi Markus, Thank you very much for the JP-08 teardown. Very interesting to see the inside of JP-08 I have a question regarding the Slide Potentiometers with Orange LED. I recently bought a beaten-up used JP-08. 1 slider has been damaged, the LED is no longer working.. I have been trying to find replacement JP-08 slide potentiometer but it is very hard to find this component.. Do you think this component is exclusive to Roland? How would you rate this job considering that it is the HPF Cutoff slider ( First slider in the second row ). Thanks for your help regards Rene
I found a source in the US. But unfortunately they are out of stock. syntaur.com/Items.php?Item=7407 So question is where can I source: Slide potentiometer, 50KB with amber LED, 10mm travel.
+brickscratch Thank You. Maybe one day they will get this small before we can start getting the manufacturers to realise the average size of a human finger.
great video Markus. I just picked up a JP-08 yesterday... I'm so far really impressed with the sound (and really unimpressed with the lack of MIDI CC implementation!). I'm really curious if the other boutique devices do have the same main board... I think your assumptions are probably correct! Cheers!
We need class action for Roland to recall all boutiques and put back that second CPU, rewite the firmware to make use of parallel computing for the usb-midi-audio protocol, there's no other way. They stopped releasing firmwares updates. But fw is not the issue...
Hi Mark, how do the front panel boards connect to the main board? You said there was some sort plug? Would have been nice to see a close up of the plug or contacts. Cheers!
Apologies, meant to say Markus! Im starting to wonder if there is some voodoo magic wirelessly connecting the boards, as the connection does not seem obvious!
I think it is a 40 pin connector and it snaps into place quite positively plus the board is also screwed into place with 5 screws so there is no danger of it becoming loose over time.
well, korg actually nailed it with the korg ms-20 mini, have you tried those keys? I love 'em my fingers fit , I can reach fro C up to F# of the next octave and I can play faster than ever, they're better than regular size
Great video, i know you have a JP-08, but just in case¿do you know what type of slide potentiometers has the boutique ju06? I guess the potentiometer on the JP08 are smaller than the ones on the JU06 but i am not sure.
Hello The sliders on the JU-06 are longer than the ones on the JP-08. the JP-08 sliders have about 10mm travel where the JU-06 are about double that though I have not measured them.
I keep calling the ESC2 chip an FPGA (field programmable gate array) though there is now the possibility that it is actually a DSP chip. A digital signal processor which is a specialized microprocessor (or a SIP block), with its architecture optimized for digital signal processing. If Anyone at Roland could give us a clue to just what chip this and what it can achieve - it would be greatly appreciated.
Hi there! I have a small but important cuestion: Can the 08 do all the stuff that 06 does? I think is possible for the two oscilators that 08 have... i really can use some help on this one.. thank for read and answer!!!
Hello to use the JP-08 as close to the jupiter 8 you need to chain two of these JP-08s together. so some people are saying it should have been named the JP-04 really and not the JP-08.
+Kieron Edwards Hi Kieron. I had the Jupiter 80 & Integra-7 well before i started making these videos about whats inside them. I never did open up the J-80 so I cannot say what is inside them. one day another may come along and I will open it up.
Hello Markus, Thanks for this interesting teardown! I recently bought a JP-08 and was wondering how it was inside. Must say it is brilliantly put together, with the same items shared with different Boutique's. This helps keep the price down (and the profits high, I imagine...) Now, do you know if it would be possible to change the colour of the LED on the sliders, without desoldering/resoldering a new one? (i.e.: Do these LED linear pots have some sort of modularity for the LED in the cursor handle) Keep on the good work! Cheers, -SOS
Hi, very nice video. I have one roland jp 08 that has a problem with the ribbon controlers, they might to be stuck on sometimes, like if i had sending MIDI CC but im not. I was able to bypass the pitch wheel by utility functions on the synth but the modulation wheel doesn't have that option. Do yo think there is some why to disconnect the whole module ?????
Great video, very interesting. I was surprised that there is a great big chip on the controls pcb. I'd expected it to just take all the controls to a single connector and feed it to the main board. The way it is it's looking like it would be a lot harder than I expected to make a custom controller directly connected to it.
+Steve Baines Yes I think That Chip is just a busy AD converter for all the sliders pots etc and would be programmed differently depending which control board was fitted as the main boards are all the same. It looks like a very small 40 pin connector that marries the 2 boards. (image is on the markusfuller +google page). I bet someone will figure it out some day soon. (i hope)
+markusfuller The SYSEX messages for remote control of params have already been figured out, so that would be another approach to being able to use proper controls with it (which I'd like to be able to do). Could use an Arduino/Teensy/Shrimp to either convert CC messages from a generic controller to SYSEX, or to read full-size sliders etc directly, and convert them to SYSEX.
i love looking inside stuff like this, is there any chance you can do the same with the roland FA08 as it would nice to see how much on board memory it has inside , thanks for taking the time to do this video cheers
+Andrew Scott Hi Andrew, Sorry I do not have a FA-08 to take apart. I only have the items I bought myself or a few repairs for friends. I wish I could get my hands on more gear but who in the right mind would give me their gear to take apart. I wish ROLAND KORG YAMAHA etc would just loan me some things from time to time.
Hi mark, I've been looking at a TR09 and a TR8 and reading that they sound slightly different, but then i've also read Roland say they are sonically identical, I really would like the TR8 do you think that the boutique will be the exact same sound as the TR8 or do the boutiques have some special chips the others dont? Thanks
Templar K Hi I have only played with the tr09 for a short while in the music shop and its hard to tell the difference but the guy in the shop says its the same sound used in the tr-08.
Hey man I love these tear down look under the hood videos you're doing. I'd love for you to do a tear down of the Pioneer DJS-1000 sampler in comparison with the Toraiz SP-16 sampler... Pioneer really dropped the ball releasing these 2 samplers side by side but purposely left out features on the og sp-16 in order to not cannibalize their own products... Would love for you to do an episode tearing down these units and helping us glimpse under the hood... Great channel!
Hello I only teardown what I own or repair so some things are just not in my reach. I had the SP-16 for a week but was annoyed at the limited sampling time. that was its only downfall for me , pity as the rest of the unit was brilliant design.
ah I agree with you there... I was really looking forward to the live looper... The new update was such a disappointment and they released the DJS which was kind of a slap in the face to the early adopters of the SP-16. I only wish I knew the exact internal memory and ram within both the DJS and the SP-16. Thanks again for the response Markus.
I think the difficulty depends mainly on how skilled one is in using the various tools needed, because from an electronic viewpoint, i can't see anything that would prevent doing such a mod. As for 'is it worth it' i can only say, that depends entirely on the individual.
As soon as I saw what's inside, I thought of modding... difficulty wise: I'd have to check how sliders are attached to the case in bigger synths in order to do the same. Let's say for now that they are attached from the bottom side of the front panel (and I am talking about the new case that we are getting for this). Then, I would take out the panel board from JP-08, remove (desolder) all the original sliders from it, and then use jump wires to attach all my new big sliders to it (sliders are on the bottom side of the front panel of the new case). Then just find a way to fix those twp boards inside the big case, the main board with all the connections at the back side, and the panel board somewhere near. I'd see about the pitch control board. There is even a keyboard connector on the main board, for the keyboard. Or if needed, do that over MIDI. You would also need a On/Off switch, which is not mandatory, but is an easy fix. You can also do the LCD display with jump wires, similar to the sliders.
Hello Mohamad I have seen a few tiers made for these on google images but I really only used mine on the desktop. it would be nice if there was some end tabs made so you could put them into rack units or eurorack maybe.
Thank you Makus for taking the time to answer .. yes you are right .. that guy selling those tiers told me that the screws used are just those used with "Allen Key"?! so they tighten the wood and do not touch the machine .. so that's safe and smart !!! cheers
+Terry marsden Hi Terry, I played with the JU-06 and JX-03 they both sound very nice indeed. maybe one day i will have them but for now I could only get the JP-08 and that was a stroke of luck as someone had it on order early on and passed the option to me. I was a bit late ordering from the first batch.
Nice one, now I'm asking if there is a chance to change the mini usb connector included to a usb type C connector, Do you know if it is possible without affecting the synth?
+StickAroundBennett If I could get my hands on the MX-1 then yes I would like to tear that down. (message to ROLAND . please loan me one for a couple of days - I won't break it ) pretty please .
If you could make a bigger controller for the JP-08, how much do you think it would cost? Same layout just bigger knobs and sliders. With bigger case there is possible to polychain some of those under the controller ;-) Just wondering.
Im just hoping Roland has something newer and bigger in the pipeline, they are suppose to be revealing something new in the synthworld this month. but I guess this could be made on a bigger footprint with proper faders etc. though im not sure what it would cost to do it. be a nice project though.
Make room for a a Boss Re-20 and a Boss CE-2 on the controls. It would be a vey nice synth. Cost of two jp's and and the other stuff? Too much :-( Would be a nice synth anyhow..
This is way late but I gotta ask what informed you that it’s fpga instead of a fixedgate array or dsp? I’ve been trying to get more info on their chip line ups too.
Hi Ken. I am not 100% sure as it was so long ago but I think I must have read it on one of the roland websites or some other website that was talking about them when these were originally introduced. I cannot remember. by the way I am enjoying your patches/sounds that you made for the ASM Hydrasynth, Its becoming one of my favorite synths.
I just read one of my own comments from 5 years ago and it says its a DSP chip. I dont know where i got that info from either - oldtimers is creeping up on me LOL
@@markusfuller ok, yeah I just wasn’t sure I know in the old days they used some fixed array chips . But as far as I’m aware the aira line BMC etc chips haven’t been proven to be fpga but a lot of us had assumed it
Hi Markus :-) l'm looking to replace a chipped fader and wanted to ask you how difficult a job it'd be? I imagine there's some soldering to be done but wondered what level of difficulty it'd be? (by memory, I realise you did this a year ago! just can't make much out from the video) I'm also going to do a minor modification to my 3 Boutiques - mains power! There are a couple of scenarios where one might want to connect to USB, but no bus power is available and batteries would be undesirable. No idea why they couldn't have added a power port though? Cant believe I couldn't find anything on the web about doing this. Perhaps its just me. I'll just be opening it up to wire in a little power cable with a female connector and use a 6v 0.5A adapter with a male connector.. I'll probably just have the cable come out of the battery compartment for about 10-15cm so it can be stored within when not in use. I don't think I'll drill a hole in the case, just keep it stealthy. Seems like a no-brainer (hope that phrase doesn't come back to bite me - this is youtube after all!) It'd be nice to still be able to use batteries when necessary though, ill have to suck it and see when I get stuck in. Thanks for the vid!
Hi you should be able to change a fader though you would need to desolder the old one and there is not a lot of room in there. as for the usb power I would just use a good multi usb 7 to 1 type thing that has a separate power supply. I have one here a Belkin F4U041 that accepts a 5 volt power supply but you can still run the usb data back to a pc/mac if you wanted to.
Thanks very much for replying Markus. I decided to take it to a pro - as like you say, not a lot of room in there (but plenty of room for things to go wrong!) With regards to the power issue, I was aware that they can be powered via USB, but as I mentioned there are scenarios where that is not possible, and where using batteries is not desirable. Hence the need to modify the battery compartment. One such scenario is when a Boutique is plugged into a Roland MX-1 mixer via usb and NOT the single port which provides power. There are 4 available ports but only 1 provides power - thanks Roland! So I'll be using a fly lead with a female plug and a 6v 0.5A power adapter with a male plug. Job done x3 (3 Boutique synths). Anyway just wanted to let you know as you were kind enough to reply. Thanks again . You're a legend!
Hello. yes it would be possible to take off the sliders and run wires to a new set of larger sliders. it would be a bit messy inside but it is certainly possible. or you could just use a midi controller if roland has implemented the midi cc control.
Thanks for this! So in theory the rom chip would define the instrument with all the software, and what's to stop Roland making a plugout of these, apart from ringing more money out of these Boutiques? Still they're limited edition apparently so maybe afterwards.
+Michael Otton I think they will be offered as plugouts in 2016 though it may be a bit awkward to implement the control surface for all the parameters. still not impossible as the main ESC2 processor etc is already there.
wow you read my mind! I was wondering/hoping you would grab one of these and was happy to see you picked the jp-08! did you purchase it for yourself or is it a friends? i've three of them (jupiter-12?) running to a roland keyboard controller and i am as happy as a pig in slop! thank you as always mate ! cheers!
+Marc Abernathy Marc your Jupiter 12 must sound incredible, I'm truly amazed at my single 4 voice unit. but 12 WOW. they do sound amazing for their size.
Excellent teardown Markus! Was really hoping you'd open one of these! Not surprised to see an esc2 in it but was still curious. So if you have something capable of sending sysex data (perhaps software that converts cc to sysex) will that work the same way as midi CC? Also, do you think it would be possible for people to start modding these by making their own control panel with bigger knob/slider pots? Personally I would love to try something like that!
+fkthewhat I think if there was an 8 voice version of this in a 5 octave keyboard then Roland may sell many of them. I would certainly put my name down for one. though it would need the arpeggiator and keyboard split putting back into the game.
Hey man, I’ve got a question, do you know if I tear the the connection between the ribbons and the rest of the circuit the synth will work properly? I fear the modulation or pitch bend could be fix in some place other than 0
I am not sure I lnow what you mean by tear the connection between the ribbons. do you mean as in disconnecting the ribbons from the rest of the circuit? and using the synth without ribbon control ?. If so I do not know as I have never tried it out so I don’t know what will happen.
Hey any idea what would happen if you swapped out the main board between a JP-08 and a JX-03? Would you have JP-08 sounds but with JX controls, or would the whole thing glitch out?
Hi my friend. Love you technicall information. I’m lookiing for a synth to start and explore sounds. I will work with Ableton Like as a DAW, but I want a hardware synth to work on that. Any sugestion for one piece until US$ 1000? As Minilogue, System 1, This Roland JP, any Novation? I realy appreciate your suggestion.
Alexandre Baroni Hello Alexandre, its difficult for me to suggest a synth as there are so meny different kinds out there. The system 1 is ok as you can add to it later with plugouts but i dislike the slim keyboard but you can add a midi keyboard to it. if you are using ableton then why not get a good midi controller keyboard and use some of the instruments in ableton, you can get some really interesting and expressive sounds, if you want something down the analog route then the korg minilogue could tick those boxes for you. however i have made some of my best sounds using vst instruments like the arturia keylab 49 and arturia synth collection and you can pull these easily into ableton. other than that theres just too much to choose from. best wishes from markus.
Hi Marcus. First of all, thank you for your fast answer. To be honest, I start in Computer Music more than 30 year ago and I used all kind of softwares for some time. But I stopped and now I would like to return. BUT, I´m nostalgic and I would like to fell the knobs and faders again. But I agree that a good keybed is important also. Did you already tried Novation Ultranova? It could be a good option also with sensitive and aftertouth regular keys and synth also. In fact, if a have a portable synth this good keybed and USB to MIDI and Audio, will be perfect. Thank you again. Alex
+djdcode Hi. I mainly chose this mixer for its size. I use to have the Behringer X32 but that was way too big on my desk, I mainly use the QU16 just as a mixer and audio interface for the computer and have not tried the built in effects racks etc (yet) but the pre-amp quality seems very good - no real latency issues that I can find. just an all round perfect device for what i need in a small setup like mine. I do like the fact that I can use it as a standalone multitrack recorder without being connected to a computer.
How do these compare to the Yamaha Reface models ? Would you be able to achieve similar sound with say a Reface CS ? Not sure if that is a stupid question or not, but they are both in a similar price range. Thanks !
That's odd. I watched the SonicLab review of the JP-08... errr, 04? I thought 'it'll be years before MF can show us what's inside it.'. Yet, within 24hrs....
+Garry Field Hi Garry. I have both, the JP08 and the JX03 are both amazingly close to their originals. the JP08 is more expensive but I could not advise you as to which is the better as they are both quite good. you should take some good headphones and try them both out before buying. dont rely on the mini inbuilt speakers. best wishes from Markus
I have a Roland Boutique JU 06 that has developed a slider LED issue. The one LED has become intermittent on one slider. Apply pressure or slight movement & the LED lights. However without manipulating its off. I’ve tried cleaning with an air duster & contact cleaner with no improvement. I haven’t the confidence to disassemble the unit. Apart from this the JU 06 is functioning perfectly. Have you or anyone any ideas on how this can be easily repaired?
Hello. the led sort of rubs along a contact strip within the slider and thats how it is powered. as you say it is intermittent when you press or move the slider then it sounds like either there is dirt along that powered track or as you have tried cleaning it then the contact could just possibly be worn out enough that it barely touches the track. as for repairing it well that could be quite fiddly as its such a tiny potentiometer you may have to remove it off the board and disassemble it so you can get to inspect the insides to figure out whats wrong or it would be simpler to replace it if you can get hold of a new one.
Woah! Great video Markus - thanks for taking a look inside! Hope someone one day gets into the fpga - how fun would it be to have the jp-08 flashable to System-1, tb-3 or even just the ju-06 :-) Still so much on the fence with these, are you keeping yours? Cant believe Im going to say this but JUST a little bigger and I'd be happy! Lol! IF Roland do add CC control in an update - then yep, Im sold :-)
+mCKENIC Hi. Im about 99.9% sure that Roland will sell a system 1 (plug-out) download that will have the boutiques sounds. though the limitations would be the physical controllers on the System 1 & 1m could not really give the instant hands on usability to all the controllers required for the different boutiques. The electronics of the system-1 could certainly handle everything as the processor etc is the same chip. maybe 2016 will be the year these are released in system 1 format. I also think there will be an 8 voice version on the way instead of the 4 we currently have as that seems the next logical step for Roland.
Nice! Thanks for all your videos. :) Did you happen to measure the reference voltage on the controls? What do you think about feasibility of hacking on an expansion board for larger sliders or rotating pots? Or maybe a jack field with optocoupling for external cv? Or maybe since the pitch slider also triggers notes it could be used as a quantized cv pitch input? It'd be interesting to know if the DSP could handle audio rate modulation. :) If you need ideas for future videos I'd be nice to see someone with your skills demonstrate modifications to modern hardware. :) Also, I'm surprised roland didn't at least add 1 very giant knob or let you use pitch or mod slider for making fine adjustments of whatever small slider was touched last. I think it would've been nice compromise between alpha dial style and knob per function.
+Jp Sp Im sure looking in the circuitry you could remove the sliders and re-build it with much larger sliders though i did not look at what the values were on the pots. sorry it has been re-assembled now and wired into my setup. the sliders remind me of a car graphic equalizer i had many years ago even that had the leds on the sliders and were about the same 10mm travel.
Fun as always and I agree with your critisisms but let's be honest: It's al in the concept. Never before could so much synth be bought for so little money. Some compromises are unavoidable. These are simply not professional instruments anymore. They are built for the ""I want one to"" market. Perfect democracy against ultimate ergonomics I gues. I do hope I'll never have to point a soldering iron at one of these though. One would need an electron-microscope to see what one is doing! :-)
+Marc Brassé Hello Marc, I agree It's an amazing sounding synth for its price. It sounds so close to the real thing but at a fraction of the cost of the real thing. and it won't steal too much space in my studio.
I guess one day a whole computer will be one chip with memory etc all within and the pins will be the connections for the outside world. no more additional components just one large chip.
Yeah, but the periferals such as the power supply will most probbly stay individual parts, The same wil apply for stuff like amplification and screens. I expect a lot more integration as well though, especially in very large run products. So a phone on one almost one chip could indeed be practical. But there will probably come a point where it will still be more economic to use more parts at least for smal(er)l series electronics and these Boutiques are exactly that. One never knows though. The way things are going we'll one day only buy the software and print the parts in 3D ourselves. What bugs me a bit on the other hand is how all new stuff nowadys needs to boot up. Even user dedicated hardware. In my time (said the grey ancient) you switched on elctronics and they would work immedialy. That's progress for you! Imagine a coffee machines that, like the average laptop, boots up a bit slower every day, There'd be riots! It'll still happen though because the NSA wants to know exactly how many cups we drink! And a few years after that they will want to "correct" the recipe! Later still: Only virtual coffee in the cloud because it will be a controlled substance only attianble from non-affeliated "terrrorist" regions! :-). Sorry if I overdo it a bit but let's be honest: These are paranoid times. :-)
+Marc Brassé Hi Marc. I love my korg kronos but it takes just over 2 minutes to start which is annoying but i put up with it because it is a good instrument. oh by the way i have confirmation now that all the boutiques have the same board inside, they even have jp-08 silk screened onto them no matter if its a ju06 or a jx-03 . its all in the program and top control panel board that makes them different.
Fpga chips outputs analog or digital audio? The use of this technology is kinda new so i'm not really well informed about how they do it. Is it really a reconstruction based on the original circuits inside a FPGA chip?
+TheMetalMusicMachine I think the program tells the FPGA to specifically perform certain actions with quite accurate results. ie VCO LFO Envelopes etc would be programmed with a certain behaviour depending on the keyboard they wish to emulate. I have a pic chip with a reasonably good set of waveforms programmed into it where I can call up sine sawtooth and square and change frequencies and pulse width, It sounds terrible but does actually work and could be used as the simpler basis of synthesizers. the ECS2 is many times more powerful than my Pic chip version.
Im not 100% sure but the FPGA ECS2 chip is capable of digital and analog outputs so maube they are using analog direct from the FPGA ?. but don't quote me on that as I am not sure how Roland is using this chip. Its really difficult to find information about it.
I dont know, would be nice to test those roland synth searching for some aliasing in the high freq range... that would tell us a whole lot more about that... Although soft synths like U He DIVA shows an incredible performance when you push it hard into filter self oscillation and ring mod and high pitched oscillators and filter and vca overdrive despite being digitial emulations... so... who knows! Cheers from Argentina!
Just bought the Arturia V softsynth collection which has the Jupiter as one of the 11 instruments (the ARP2600 being my favourite so far ...). The drawbacks of softsynths should be known but apart from that I guess it beats this Roland with the fingers in the noise: more voices, arpeggiator, fx, etc ...
+Karl Georges Hi Karl. I too have the Arturia collection and agree that the Jupiter on it is pretty amazing. But I cannot take it apart so thats why I dont really do video's on softsynths even though I like them very much.
+Elsif Hi Elsif its bot the microsoft band its the sony SWR30 . I would have preferred the Microsoft band. this Sony is very limited in what it can do but as its ELpaper display it lasts about 3 to 5 days between charging and is always readable. but I still want the microsoft one ?.
From your quick review and the slightly more in depth Sonic State review I'd say it sounds very nice and I should probably get one so that I have some version of the Jupiter 8 in my collection. But I have to wonder if they will release a larger version at some point. I'd be glad to pay twice as much for a version with larger controls and 8 (or more) voices. But apparently these will only be around for 6 months so I have to decide fast!
+Scott Rogers You can get the whole Arturia v4 collecton for that money. Just add a MIDI keyboard with some knobs like Arturias own and you are good to go.
Could someone explain the basic architecture of JP-08 please? I acquired a broken one with low and distorted output and would like to locate DAC and OP amps that feed the output to see if I can trace if at some point signal is ok. It also has dodgy ribbon controllers that do not follow what you press with your finger, but I guess I could live without that only if audio path was ok. Anyone selling a broken JP-08? Thanks!
+Dan Thorpe I know what you mean. it's too compact really but it does sound just like the original. its sort of the soft synth without the need for a computer.
Hi, i want to mod the roland mx1 to add more analog channels.....any chance ypure gonna do a breakdown. And posisbly guide us modders in how to add the channel? Many thanks from new zealand, peter
Great work as ever! Thanks. I see you test drove a king Korg! The key question - is it a keeper? BTW, my mind is boggling that you owned the real thing - I'm presuming that wasn't from Adur Rec? Ha!
+James Porch Hi James, now I have the jp-08 and have heard some of the things it can do I think I will hold onto it and hope Roland will sort out the CC commands issue. Yes I owned the real thing indeed. I wish I had kept it now.
I did some dig. Now boutique have 10 models. JP-08,JX-03,JU-06 even have same firmware, and TR09,TB03,VP03 have same firmware, TR08,SH01A,D05 have same firmware. They boot with different configure. All board are the same, only different is memory. I have D05, it has 64m ram. As the video show, jp-08 has 32m. Roland now a software company, all their product is software, TR-8s,System1/8 and boutique are all the same. machine comes with different shell. There even software version of these synth... But only SE02 is different. We want save money!
Hi Markus Fuller, nice videos. When I knew about System-1 I said to myself: "the day Roland release Jupiter-8 as a plug-out I will buy Aira System-1". But that day never came, and now they released the Jupiter-08 in a crap hardware. Do you think they will make things right and release the famous synths for System-1, or they will abandon the child?
+fabiovsroque Hmm I wish I had a crystal ball but if I could place a bet then I think I would gamble that they will release a plug-out maybe next year. It makes business sense as theres money for them to be made by doing that.
It's a bit of a pity that you're not making any new videos, I hope everything's OK and you're just not feeling like making more any more.
However, what's amazing is that there's this _huge_ back catalog for me to watch now. Amazing!
Thank you very much for your detailed videos. I am working toward my Electronic Technician degree in college and really enjoying your fixing and tear-down videos. Thanks a lot!
+Roman A Thank You. I think I could learn a lot if I went back to college, in my day a chip is what you had at lunch time.
you sir are awesome great teardown. Im about to fix the TB boutique so i went looking for teardown videos. This video was so good i decided to stop my task and comment.
nice one, thanks for taking the time to explore the jp-08's insides!
+cresshead Thank You
Fascinating! I would never have guessed how clean the inside of one of these was. They sound very nice.
+Michael Smith Hi Michael. It is vert well made and the attention to detail right up to the silk screen printing is top class. (so it should be for £299) but yes it is a very well made unit. --- gripe alert > but no CC commands ?. I hope they look into updating this soon. but I'm very pleased with it and it sounds very good (coming from someone who owned the original Jupiter-8)
I agree that the lack of CC implementation is a serious oversight, but this is probably something they'll add as a "feature" later on (hopefully, with no added expense). Coming from someone who has never owned a Jupiter-8, it does sound marvelous. 10,000 pounds for a real one, these days. . .madness.
Yes I always wanted get hold of the real one again one day but the cost is simply madness. I think for the price of this "it will do nicely"
Greetings from USA. Just bought one of these used from Guitar Center. Interesting to see what makes it tick (I would be too nervous to open it myself!). Love your videos!
cc commands can be sent to these devices now, well for my JX-03 now so bound to be able to do that for this
I have had my Jupiter 8 since 1999 and it has Never Broken down!
I used to own a Jupiter 8 too and *damn*... I also sold it in 1998 for next to nothing. However I find this AIRA series pretty cool. Thanks for sharing your videos!
What is this, a synthesizer for ants?
LMAO!!! That was awesome...
lol, no its actually essential just a bit less versatile then the original and only 4 notes of polyphony instead of 8 or 6 like the junos, same with the ju-06 and the jx-03, btw, the jx-03 is finally a full analogue control analogue synth unlike the original jx-3p which was controlled digitally (to make it cheaper and somewhat more "professional essential" like the access virus that came at 1998?
The biggest ant-synth ever made.
its actually usable, dont hate before try, true, its more difficult to find the sweetest spot but i actually rather it to have at least 6 or 8 voices then bigger faders, now they have only 4 which is quite terrible, so you cant large chord pads (in an analogue synth the oscillators switch from one note to another harmoniclly when it run out of voices, yea you can use delay but seriously thats all that rolland has to offer as a relic to its classic revolutionery synthesizers?
the good thing is that it sounds almost the same as the original, approximately... i aspecially liked the jx-03, a complete analogue (analogue modeling and analogue oscillatiors) cheap version of the jx-3p that was more digital modeling what was less accurate and more difficult its to adjust its parameters for a certian\ any sound accurately lunlike in an complete analogue \ modern digital synth but was more comfortable for professional\ amature speed use when if you wanted a certain sound directly, like the Oberheim Matrix and the access virus which was actually fully analogue despite this two synths, that was the idea. - get the sound efficiently, accurately and fast
Indeed... A real mans synthesizer is big and black, with large mod wheel for stimulation.
Just figured I'd hop in here and thank you for this video, I switched my JU-06 over to all blue LED's and I was afraid to open the darn thing because of how much the lil' thing costs, but you relieved my anxiety completely!
David Rhodes Hello David swopping the leds over - I bet that looks real nice. I keep thinking about swopping the green leds in the system-8 but not sure what colour i want.
Very disappointing of Roland not to release these as plug outs for the System 1 which has 2 of those chips inside, so in theory should be able to easily achieve at least 8 notes of poly. They sound great but 4 notes give me a break
+vinyljunkie07 yes but the system 1 only achieves 4 notes. But I do think these will be offered as a plugout in 2016
+markusfuller I think the reason why it only achieves 4 notes on the System 1 is that it runs at 96k so extra CPU power needed. Whilst the Boutiques currently run at 44.1k either way both great sounding systems albeit some slight annoyances
Of course. I was looking inside the system one last night thinking why did it only have 4 voices yet 2 FPGAs. Thankyou vinyljunkie07 you just answered my thoughts for me. sometimes the obvious is not so obvious. it is using two FPGAs for the 96K
I hope ROLAND eventually make an 8 voice version of the JP-8. theres enough room inside. or at least an update to half the 96k of the system 1 and have 48k 8 voices.
As a kid, I would steal money from my dad and buy things like calculators to tear apart, look at, and throw away. As an adult, your videos are saving me thousands of dollars. 😉
One of these days I'll get the Polysix and Juno-106 sitting in my closet working again.
this is the only channel where I actually smash the like button
Very much appreciated Thank you
Great video as always Markus! It's nice to see Roland has a bit of its mojo back.
+RaveTracks Yes Roland is starting to get quite interesting again.
It has the same board also on the D-05, with the midi out sw. limitations. There in not an octocoupler for the midi out in both boards, but there is only for midi in.
Great work Markus! It is very interesting to see that there was a spare memory slot. Perhaps Roland at one stage might have considered making this an 8 voice - then decided against it?
+ranzeeee hang on...it's a jupiter 8, and it's not an 8 voice????
+i go bananas It's only 4 voices - stupid hey? ;)
+ranzeeee The empty RAM place is for a second plugout synth model. This is basically a System 1 board without plugout memory.
Great video!
I'd loved to hear your review on the SE-02.
Hi The SE-02 looks and sounds interesting but at £509.00 I think its a bit overpriced with so many other things on sale at the moment. but if I manage to get my hands on one to play with I will certainly give it a go.
Nice tear down and another great video mate. I think your probably right about those main boards being the same, if i remember correctly your tear downs of the TB 3 and VT 3 had the same boards but with minor differences. I expect it saves them money if they can use the same components across multiple devices.
+halcyondaystunes Im still wondering why only ONE memory chip when theres room for two on the board ?.
I bet they could get 8 voices out of it but would rather have people buy two.
Considering the d-05 has 8-voice they absolutely could have.
@@spookypen The D-50 was a digital synth originally. The JP08 had to use ACB (an algorithm designed by roland) to simulate an analogue process (Jupiter was analog obviously). Can I assure you this would be far more CPU dependent than simply emulating an digital synth.
@ff_____ wow, that's no fun. Good to know about this limitation of the TR-08
Thanks! I love these teardowns.
+Shinobi Stealth Thank You Shinobi.
Good money Roland could make with these little synths!! thanks Markus.
Judging by the fact that Roland's website now shows there are 13 different models available, i'd say they must have been fairly successful. :)
www.roland.com/us/promos/roland_boutique/
Hey there, please help me answer this question... when controlling thru midi can you still manipulate the sound from the slaves hardware? Particularly the sliders?
Indeed you can and that's the fun bit. Use a finger pinch instead of a wrist waggle.
Thanks for showing us this instrument. Very cool, indeed! I like the ribbon controllers.
+ThomasGrillo Hi Thomas. Thank You, I too like the ribbon controllers though I wish they could be assigned to different parameters. I hope all is well.
The Jupiter 8 is now floating at 20k USD and even higher. These are a bargain and are no longer being made so price is going up. Roland released an update for MIDI CC. Also there's a certain roland with a J in its model name that can control all of the parameters on the boutique model. It also has similar arpeggio controls to the jupiter and juno models and can drive external synths with it! I find it funny that no one has tried to use an old synth to control these new boutique models!
Do the potentiometers used in have any model marking on them? The ones with fixed positions and free rotating potentiometers; can you tell if they are lin or log and what resistance? 6mm d shaft as i can see. Should be standard.
thanks for the breakdown. I was expecting to see those plastic button strips as some sort of connected overlay on the contacts. Sometimes my JU06 buttons LOOK misaligned that a simple push fixes or causes. I definitely see why . It is no problem with function everything works but it can look a bit alarming
The LED colours correspond to the colours on the "binding" side of the boxes (which look like they could be books.)
love the teardown series :) Pls keep UP!
I saw that Waldorf string machine in the background. They seems pretty cool, but a bit pricey for what they are maybe. I am shocked it can't handle CC commands. What good is a synth you can't send CCs to?
+Michael Bauers I guess roland may (i hope) do an update to allow CC commands.
Hi Markus,
Thank you very much for the JP-08 teardown. Very interesting to see the inside of JP-08
I have a question regarding the Slide Potentiometers with Orange LED. I recently bought a beaten-up used JP-08.
1 slider has been damaged, the LED is no longer working.. I have been trying to find replacement JP-08 slide potentiometer but it is very hard to find this component..
Do you think this component is exclusive to Roland?
How would you rate this job considering that it is the HPF Cutoff slider ( First slider in the second row ). Thanks for your help regards Rene
I found a source in the US. But unfortunately they are out of stock.
syntaur.com/Items.php?Item=7407
So question is where can I source: Slide potentiometer, 50KB with amber LED, 10mm travel.
Hi. Thanks for your video clips, Markus. They are really great. Can you do one on the Elkatwin 61 please? Thanks.
OMG The Micro-MicroKorg gag :D Loved it Marcus
+brickscratch Thank You. Maybe one day they will get this small before we can start getting the manufacturers to realise the average size of a human finger.
Nice video! Can you please take apart the Roland TR-08?
great video Markus. I just picked up a JP-08 yesterday... I'm so far really impressed with the sound (and really unimpressed with the lack of MIDI CC implementation!). I'm really curious if the other boutique devices do have the same main board... I think your assumptions are probably correct! Cheers!
cool channel!! what is the cpu on these boutiques?
We need class action for Roland to recall all boutiques and put back that second CPU, rewite the firmware to make use of parallel computing for the usb-midi-audio protocol, there's no other way. They stopped releasing firmwares updates. But fw is not the issue...
Hi Mark, how do the front panel boards connect to the main board? You said there was some sort plug? Would have been nice to see a close up of the plug or contacts. Cheers!
Apologies, meant to say Markus! Im starting to wonder if there is some voodoo magic wirelessly connecting the boards, as the connection does not seem obvious!
hi Adrian stop the video at 8:13 as i have put a picture of the plug bottom left of the video. best wishes from markus.
+markusfuller thanks a lot, its a very tidy plug. Not sure how i missed it while watching!
I think it is a 40 pin connector and it snaps into place quite positively plus the board is also screwed into place with 5 screws so there is no danger of it becoming loose over time.
well, korg actually nailed it with the korg ms-20 mini, have you tried those keys? I love 'em my fingers fit , I can reach fro C up to F# of the next octave and I can play faster than ever, they're better than regular size
+Cooperman666ROFL Hello, Yes I have tried the 83% sized keys on the Korg and I agree They are very playable. I think they got it just right.
I hit subscribe 1min in, very relaxed timbre to your voice! loved the tear down!
"now I'm gonna take it apart"
*makes a serial killer face*
Cool. I have a JP-08 and JX-03 and JU-06 :) They are cute and small but look great and sound huge.
Great video, i know you have a JP-08, but just in case¿do you know what type of slide potentiometers has the boutique ju06? I guess the potentiometer on the JP08 are smaller than the ones on the JU06 but i am not sure.
Hello The sliders on the JU-06 are longer than the ones on the JP-08. the JP-08 sliders have about 10mm travel where the JU-06 are about double that though I have not measured them.
I keep calling the ESC2 chip an FPGA (field programmable gate array) though there is now the possibility that it is actually a DSP chip. A digital signal processor which is a specialized microprocessor (or a SIP block), with its architecture optimized for digital signal processing. If Anyone at Roland could give us a clue to just what chip this and what it can achieve - it would be greatly appreciated.
in the future no one can input proper velocity
In the future people will wear smaller versions on their wrists and use toothpicks to play them.
+markusfuller i love yr channel
ThankYou. theres more video's on the way as soon as i get time to make them I will keep on posting. Best wishes from Markus.
+markusfuller i smashed that subscribe button
Hi there! I have a small but important cuestion: Can the 08 do all the stuff that 06 does? I think is possible for the two oscilators that 08 have... i really can use some help on this one.. thank for read and answer!!!
Hello to use the JP-08 as close to the jupiter 8 you need to chain two of these JP-08s together. so some people are saying it should have been named the JP-04 really and not the JP-08.
Thanks!!
the filter on the ju06 is very different.
They both sound different...
Hi Markus, have you had a look inside the Jupiter 80? As a VA I'm wondering (as I own one) if it's using an ESC2?
+Kieron Edwards Hi Kieron. I had the Jupiter 80 & Integra-7 well before i started making these videos about whats inside them. I never did open up the J-80 so I cannot say what is inside them. one day another may come along and I will open it up.
Hello Markus,
Thanks for this interesting teardown!
I recently bought a JP-08 and was wondering how it was inside.
Must say it is brilliantly put together, with the same items shared with different Boutique's.
This helps keep the price down (and the profits high, I imagine...)
Now, do you know if it would be possible to change the colour of the LED on the sliders, without desoldering/resoldering a new one?
(i.e.: Do these LED linear pots have some sort of modularity for the LED in the cursor handle)
Keep on the good work!
Cheers,
-SOS
Hi, very nice video. I have one roland jp 08 that has a problem with the ribbon controlers, they might to be stuck on sometimes, like if i had sending MIDI CC but im not. I was able to bypass the pitch wheel by utility functions on the synth but the modulation wheel doesn't have that option. Do yo think there is some why to disconnect the whole module ?????
Hello I am only guessing as i do not own one now, I think the ribbon connectors are connected to the board with a cable that can be unplugged.
@@markusfuller thanks, im going to check it out if thats possible.
More than a year later, have Roland updated the firmware so that it accepts CC instead of SysEx ?
Yes
Great video, very interesting. I was surprised that there is a great big chip on the controls pcb. I'd expected it to just take all the controls to a single connector and feed it to the main board. The way it is it's looking like it would be a lot harder than I expected to make a custom controller directly connected to it.
+Steve Baines Yes I think That Chip is just a busy AD converter for all the sliders pots etc and would be programmed differently depending which control board was fitted as the main boards are all the same. It looks like a very small 40 pin connector that marries the 2 boards. (image is on the markusfuller +google page). I bet someone will figure it out some day soon. (i hope)
+markusfuller The SYSEX messages for remote control of params have already been figured out, so that would be another approach to being able to use proper controls with it (which I'd like to be able to do). Could use an Arduino/Teensy/Shrimp to either convert CC messages from a generic controller to SYSEX, or to read full-size sliders etc directly, and convert them to SYSEX.
I have an arduino mega spare on my shelf, I may look into that one day though i'm a bit of a newbie with the arduino's.
I love your videos. i wonder if you can fix my Roland JP8000.Dead keys problem.
i love looking inside stuff like this, is there any chance you can do the same with the roland FA08 as it would nice to see how much on board memory it has inside , thanks for taking the time to do this video
cheers
+Andrew Scott Hi Andrew, Sorry I do not have a FA-08 to take apart. I only have the items I bought myself or a few repairs for friends. I wish I could get my hands on more gear but who in the right mind would give me their gear to take apart. I wish ROLAND KORG YAMAHA etc would just loan me some things from time to time.
Hi mark, I've been looking at a TR09 and a TR8 and reading that they sound slightly different, but then i've also read Roland say they are sonically identical, I really would like the TR8 do you think that the boutique will be the exact same sound as the TR8 or do the boutiques have some special chips the others dont? Thanks
Templar K Hi I have only played with the tr09 for a short while in the music shop and its hard to tell the difference but the guy in the shop says its the same sound used in the tr-08.
Hey man I love these tear down look under the hood videos you're doing. I'd love for you to do a tear down of the Pioneer DJS-1000 sampler in comparison with the Toraiz SP-16 sampler... Pioneer really dropped the ball releasing these 2 samplers side by side but purposely left out features on the og sp-16 in order to not cannibalize their own products... Would love for you to do an episode tearing down these units and helping us glimpse under the hood... Great channel!
Hello I only teardown what I own or repair so some things are just not in my reach. I had the SP-16 for a week but was annoyed at the limited sampling time. that was its only downfall for me , pity as the rest of the unit was brilliant design.
ah I agree with you there... I was really looking forward to the live looper... The new update was such a disappointment and they released the DJS which was kind of a slap in the face to the early adopters of the SP-16. I only wish I knew the exact internal memory and ram within both the DJS and the SP-16. Thanks again for the response Markus.
How possible to mod 2 of these into a case with a full size keyboard AND, full size controls?
And, how dificult/worth it?
Cheers from PR
Thinking about doing a mod with a new case just to get some decently sized potentiometers.
I think the difficulty depends mainly on how skilled one is in using the various tools needed, because from an electronic viewpoint, i can't see anything that would prevent doing such a mod.
As for 'is it worth it' i can only say, that depends entirely on the individual.
As soon as I saw what's inside, I thought of modding... difficulty wise: I'd have to check how sliders are attached to the case in bigger synths in order to do the same. Let's say for now that they are attached from the bottom side of the front panel (and I am talking about the new case that we are getting for this). Then, I would take out the panel board from JP-08, remove (desolder) all the original sliders from it, and then use jump wires to attach all my new big sliders to it (sliders are on the bottom side of the front panel of the new case). Then just find a way to fix those twp boards inside the big case, the main board with all the connections at the back side, and the panel board somewhere near. I'd see about the pitch control board. There is even a keyboard connector on the main board, for the keyboard. Or if needed, do that over MIDI. You would also need a On/Off switch, which is not mandatory, but is an easy fix. You can also do the LCD display with jump wires, similar to the sliders.
Hi (thumbs up)
where do you think is best to have this screwed into a custom made tier ?
Hello Mohamad I have seen a few tiers made for these on google images but I really only used mine on the desktop. it would be nice if there was some end tabs made so you could put them into rack units or eurorack maybe.
Thank you Makus for taking the time to answer .. yes you are right ..
that guy selling those tiers told me that the screws used are just those used with "Allen Key"?! so they tighten the wood and do not touch the machine .. so that's safe and smart !!!
cheers
was thinking of getting the jp-08 but may wait for the plugouts but i have on order a ju-06
+Terry marsden Hi Terry, I played with the JU-06 and JX-03 they both sound very nice indeed. maybe one day i will have them but for now I could only get the JP-08 and that was a stroke of luck as someone had it on order early on and passed the option to me. I was a bit late ordering from the first batch.
Well i had luck from gak i bought the ju-06 on friday and its on its way to me for tuesday.
Brilliant. I think you will like it. I have been playing with mine all day long and it sounds great for such a tiny little synth.
Well i opened mine (ju-06) and the main board is a jp-08 .
Than You Terry for letting us all know. I thought it may all be the same. So what do you think of the sound it produces ?.
Nice one, now I'm asking if there is a chance to change the mini usb connector included to a usb type C connector, Do you know if it is possible without affecting the synth?
Enrique Apanco Hmm im not sure about that one to be honest.
Another great video from the named master of electronic technical breakdowns. Would it be possible to breakdown the MX1? Cheers Markus.
+StickAroundBennett If I could get my hands on the MX-1 then yes I would like to tear that down. (message to ROLAND . please loan me one for a couple of days - I won't break it ) pretty please .
If you could make a bigger controller for the JP-08, how much do you think it would cost?
Same layout just bigger knobs and sliders. With bigger case there is possible to polychain some of those under the controller ;-)
Just wondering.
Im just hoping Roland has something newer and bigger in the pipeline, they are suppose to be revealing something new in the synthworld this month. but I guess this could be made on a bigger footprint with proper faders etc. though im not sure what it would cost to do it. be a nice project though.
Make room for a a Boss Re-20 and a Boss CE-2 on the controls. It would be a vey nice synth.
Cost of two jp's and and the other stuff? Too much :-(
Would be a nice synth anyhow..
Really like your videos, much appreciated. Keep up your awesome work! :)
+d5000ster Thank You very much.
This is way late but I gotta ask what informed you that it’s fpga instead of a fixedgate array or dsp? I’ve been trying to get more info on their chip line ups too.
Hi Ken. I am not 100% sure as it was so long ago but I think I must have read it on one of the roland websites or some other website that was talking about them when these were originally introduced. I cannot remember. by the way I am enjoying your patches/sounds that you made for the ASM Hydrasynth, Its becoming one of my favorite synths.
I just read one of my own comments from 5 years ago and it says its a DSP chip. I dont know where i got that info from either - oldtimers is creeping up on me LOL
@@markusfuller ok, yeah I just wasn’t sure I know in the old days they used some fixed array chips . But as far as I’m aware the aira line BMC etc chips haven’t been proven to be fpga but a lot of us had assumed it
@@markusfuller ah you are too kind , I enjoy all your videos! Cue love fest lol 😂
Hi Markus :-) l'm looking to replace a chipped fader and wanted to ask you how difficult a job it'd be? I imagine there's some soldering to be done but wondered what level of difficulty it'd be? (by memory, I realise you did this a year ago! just can't make much out from the video)
I'm also going to do a minor modification to my 3 Boutiques - mains power!
There are a couple of scenarios where one might want to connect to USB, but no bus power is available and batteries would be undesirable.
No idea why they couldn't have added a power port though?
Cant believe I couldn't find anything on the web about doing this. Perhaps its just me.
I'll just be opening it up to wire in a little power cable with a female connector and use a 6v 0.5A adapter with a male connector.. I'll probably just have the cable come out of the battery compartment for about 10-15cm so it can be stored within when not in use. I don't think I'll drill a hole in the case, just keep it stealthy.
Seems like a no-brainer (hope that phrase doesn't come back to bite me - this is youtube after all!)
It'd be nice to still be able to use batteries when necessary though, ill have to suck it and see when I get stuck in. Thanks for the vid!
Hi you should be able to change a fader though you would need to desolder the old one and there is not a lot of room in there. as for the usb power I would just use a good multi usb 7 to 1 type thing that has a separate power supply. I have one here a Belkin F4U041 that accepts a 5 volt power supply but you can still run the usb data back to a pc/mac if you wanted to.
Thanks very much for replying Markus.
I decided to take it to a pro - as like you say, not a lot of room in there (but plenty of room for things to go wrong!)
With regards to the power issue, I was aware that they can be powered via USB, but as I mentioned there are scenarios where that is not possible, and where using batteries is not desirable. Hence the need to modify the battery compartment. One such scenario is when a Boutique is plugged into a Roland MX-1 mixer via usb and NOT the single port which provides power. There are 4 available ports but only 1 provides power - thanks Roland!
So I'll be using a fly lead with a female plug and a 6v 0.5A power adapter with a male plug. Job done x3 (3 Boutique synths). Anyway just wanted to let you know as you were kind enough to reply. Thanks again . You're a legend!
Do you think it's possible (or practical) to put bigger sliders on it and give it a new case ? Basically making it bigger but keeping the functinality
Hello. yes it would be possible to take off the sliders and run wires to a new set of larger sliders. it would be a bit messy inside but it is certainly possible. or you could just use a midi controller if roland has implemented the midi cc control.
Thanks for this! So in theory the rom chip would define the instrument with all the software, and what's to stop Roland making a plugout of these, apart from ringing more money out of these Boutiques? Still they're limited edition apparently so maybe afterwards.
+Michael Otton I think they will be offered as plugouts in 2016 though it may be a bit awkward to implement the control surface for all the parameters. still not impossible as the main ESC2 processor etc is already there.
wow you read my mind! I was wondering/hoping you would grab one of these and was happy to see you picked the jp-08! did you purchase it for yourself or is it a friends? i've three of them (jupiter-12?) running to a roland keyboard controller and i am as happy as a pig in slop!
thank you as always mate ! cheers!
+Marc Abernathy Marc your Jupiter 12 must sound incredible, I'm truly amazed at my single 4 voice unit. but 12 WOW. they do sound amazing for their size.
Love that nano korg you got there.
+SoloStuff Just a bit of fun for the video :-)
Excellent teardown Markus! Was really hoping you'd open one of these! Not surprised to see an esc2 in it but was still curious. So if you have something capable of sending sysex data (perhaps software that converts cc to sysex) will that work the same way as midi CC? Also, do you think it would be possible for people to start modding these by making their own control panel with bigger knob/slider pots? Personally I would love to try something like that!
+fkthewhat I think if there was an 8 voice version of this in a 5 octave keyboard then Roland may sell many of them. I would certainly put my name down for one. though it would need the arpeggiator and keyboard split putting back into the game.
Hey man, I’ve got a question, do you know if I tear the the connection between the ribbons and the rest of the circuit the synth will work properly? I fear the modulation or pitch bend could be fix in some place other than 0
I am not sure I lnow what you mean by tear the connection between the ribbons. do you mean as in disconnecting the ribbons from the rest of the circuit? and using the synth without ribbon control ?. If so I do not know as I have never tried it out so I don’t know what will happen.
@@markusfuller yes, exactly. I Tried it and it worked. The ribbon controller of my boutique weren’t working proper. Thank you!
Hey any idea what would happen if you swapped out the main board between a JP-08 and a JX-03? Would you have JP-08 sounds but with JX controls, or would the whole thing glitch out?
I think the whole thing would simply not work, the main boards are the same and both have JP-08 printed on them but the programming is different.
Hi my friend. Love you technicall information. I’m lookiing for a synth to start and explore sounds. I will work with Ableton Like as a DAW, but I want a hardware synth to work on that. Any sugestion for one piece until US$ 1000? As Minilogue, System 1, This Roland JP, any Novation? I realy appreciate your suggestion.
Alexandre Baroni Hello Alexandre, its difficult for me to suggest a synth as there are so meny different kinds out there. The system 1 is ok as you can add to it later with plugouts but i dislike the slim keyboard but you can add a midi keyboard to it. if you are using ableton then why not get a good midi controller keyboard and use some of the instruments in ableton, you can get some really interesting and expressive sounds, if you want something down the analog route then the korg minilogue could tick those boxes for you. however i have made some of my best sounds using vst instruments like the arturia keylab 49 and arturia synth collection and you can pull these easily into ableton. other than that theres just too much to choose from. best wishes from markus.
Hi Marcus. First of all, thank you for your fast answer. To be honest, I start in Computer Music more than 30 year ago and I used all kind of softwares for some time. But I stopped and now I would like to return. BUT, I´m nostalgic and I would like to fell the knobs and faders again. But I agree that a good keybed is important also. Did you already tried Novation Ultranova? It could be a good option also with sensitive and aftertouth regular keys and synth also. In fact, if a have a portable synth this good keybed and USB to MIDI and Audio, will be perfect. Thank you again. Alex
Alexandre Baroni I have seen the novation ultranova but never had one to try.
How do you like QU16 as audio interface?/ specially preamp quality and latency? Thank you for good
+djdcode Hi. I mainly chose this mixer for its size. I use to have the Behringer X32 but that was way too big on my desk, I mainly use the QU16 just as a mixer and audio interface for the computer and have not tried the built in effects racks etc (yet) but the pre-amp quality seems very good - no real latency issues that I can find. just an all round perfect device for what i need in a small setup like mine. I do like the fact that I can use it as a standalone multitrack recorder without being connected to a computer.
How do these compare to the Yamaha Reface models ? Would you be able to achieve similar sound with say a Reface CS ? Not sure if that is a stupid question or not, but they are both in a similar price range. Thanks !
Curious if the VST versions of these synths are using the same code, cross compiled for this FPGA/DSP chip vs the an x86 chip for the plugin.
That's odd.
I watched the SonicLab review of the JP-08... errr, 04?
I thought 'it'll be years before MF can show us what's inside it.'.
Yet, within 24hrs....
+outaspaceman I have just watched Nick's sonic-lab review thanks to your message "Excellent" always great unbiased reviews from Nick Batt.
+markusfuller he stops at the surface Markus.😉. You and him would make a great double act.👍😂😂😂😂😂
Yes I would not turn down making a video with Nick Batt. I think he is very talented and more importantly very honest.
👍
thanks markus.think i might just get one of these.was stuck between the jp 08 and the jx 03.like the jp 08 better though!
+Garry Field Hi Garry. I have both, the JP08 and the JX03 are both amazingly close to their originals. the JP08 is more expensive but I could not advise you as to which is the better as they are both quite good. you should take some good headphones and try them both out before buying. dont rely on the mini inbuilt speakers. best wishes from Markus
thank you markus.i have made my mind up and i am getting the jx 03.more geared for me i feel ,and those sliders on the 08 would drive me insane!
I have a Roland Boutique JU 06 that has developed a slider LED issue.
The one LED has become intermittent on one slider. Apply pressure or slight movement & the LED lights. However without manipulating its off.
I’ve tried cleaning with an air duster & contact cleaner with no improvement.
I haven’t the confidence to disassemble the unit.
Apart from this the JU 06 is functioning perfectly.
Have you or anyone any ideas on how this can be easily repaired?
Hello. the led sort of rubs along a contact strip within the slider and thats how it is powered. as you say it is intermittent when you press or move the slider then it sounds like either there is dirt along that powered track or as you have tried cleaning it then the contact could just possibly be worn out enough that it barely touches the track. as for repairing it well that could be quite fiddly as its such a tiny potentiometer you may have to remove it off the board and disassemble it so you can get to inspect the insides to figure out whats wrong or it would be simpler to replace it if you can get hold of a new one.
Woah! Great video Markus - thanks for taking a look inside! Hope someone one day gets into the fpga - how fun would it be to have the jp-08 flashable to System-1, tb-3 or even just the ju-06 :-) Still so much on the fence with these, are you keeping yours? Cant believe Im going to say this but JUST a little bigger and I'd be happy! Lol! IF Roland do add CC control in an update - then yep, Im sold :-)
+mCKENIC Hi. Im about 99.9% sure that Roland will sell a system 1 (plug-out) download that will have the boutiques sounds. though the limitations would be the physical controllers on the System 1 & 1m could not really give the instant hands on usability to all the controllers required for the different boutiques. The electronics of the system-1 could certainly handle everything as the processor etc is the same chip. maybe 2016 will be the year these are released in system 1 format. I also think there will be an 8 voice version on the way instead of the 4 we currently have as that seems the next logical step for Roland.
Saw that this vid got featured on Sonic talk! Well done Markus! =D
+Jakob Haq Thank You Jakob. I was surprised. PS I love your Video's
+markusfuller aw thanks Markus, means a lot to me. I love your videos to, you're awesome! :D
+markusfuller A Nick Batt and Marcus Fuller cross over video of some sort... That would be great!
Oh if only. Nick is really interesting and I'd love to have a chat with him about synth technology.
Do the usb port works to send audio or midi to a computer ? (Like a classic synth)For use the keyword with a secuenser or only works for power?
Nice! Thanks for all your videos. :)
Did you happen to measure the reference voltage on the controls? What do you think about feasibility of hacking on an expansion board for larger sliders or rotating pots?
Or maybe a jack field with optocoupling for external cv? Or maybe since the pitch slider also triggers notes it could be used as a quantized cv pitch input? It'd be interesting to know if the DSP could handle audio rate modulation. :)
If you need ideas for future videos I'd be nice to see someone with your skills demonstrate modifications to modern hardware. :)
Also, I'm surprised roland didn't at least add 1 very giant knob or let you use pitch or mod slider for making fine adjustments of whatever small slider was touched last. I think it would've been nice compromise between alpha dial style and knob per function.
+Jp Sp Im sure looking in the circuitry you could remove the sliders and re-build it with much larger sliders though i did not look at what the values were on the pots. sorry it has been re-assembled now and wired into my setup. the sliders remind me of a car graphic equalizer i had many years ago even that had the leds on the sliders and were about the same 10mm travel.
Fun as always and I agree with your critisisms but let's be honest: It's al in the concept. Never before could so much synth be bought for so little money. Some compromises are unavoidable. These are simply not professional instruments anymore. They are built for the ""I want one to"" market. Perfect democracy against ultimate ergonomics I gues.
I do hope I'll never have to point a soldering iron at one of these though. One would need an electron-microscope to see what one is doing! :-)
+Marc Brassé Hello Marc, I agree It's an amazing sounding synth for its price. It sounds so close to the real thing but at a fraction of the cost of the real thing. and it won't steal too much space in my studio.
+Marc Brassé Have you not seen a modern laptop motherboard? Looks more like nanoscale art than something soldered together.
I guess one day a whole computer will be one chip with memory etc all within and the pins will be the connections for the outside world. no more additional components just one large chip.
Yeah, but the periferals such as the power supply will most probbly stay individual parts, The same wil apply for stuff like amplification and screens.
I expect a lot more integration as well though, especially in very large run products. So a phone on one almost one chip could indeed be practical. But there will probably come a point where it will still be more economic to use more parts at least for smal(er)l series electronics and these Boutiques are exactly that.
One never knows though. The way things are going we'll one day only buy the software and print the parts in 3D ourselves.
What bugs me a bit on the other hand is how all new stuff nowadys needs to boot up. Even user dedicated hardware. In my time (said the grey ancient) you switched on elctronics and they would work immedialy. That's progress for you!
Imagine a coffee machines that, like the average laptop, boots up a bit slower every day, There'd be riots!
It'll still happen though because the NSA wants to know exactly how many cups we drink! And a few years after that they will want to "correct" the recipe! Later still: Only virtual coffee in the cloud because it will be a controlled substance only attianble from non-affeliated "terrrorist" regions! :-).
Sorry if I overdo it a bit but let's be honest: These are paranoid times. :-)
+Marc Brassé Hi Marc. I love my korg kronos but it takes just over 2 minutes to start which is annoying but i put up with it because it is a good instrument. oh by the way i have confirmation now that all the boutiques have the same board inside, they even have jp-08 silk screened onto them no matter if its a ju06 or a jx-03 . its all in the program and top control panel board that makes them different.
Fpga chips outputs analog or digital audio? The use of this technology is kinda new so i'm not really well informed about how they do it. Is it really a reconstruction based on the original circuits inside a FPGA chip?
+TheMetalMusicMachine I think the program tells the FPGA to specifically perform certain actions with quite accurate results. ie VCO LFO Envelopes etc would be programmed with a certain behaviour depending on the keyboard they wish to emulate. I have a pic chip with a reasonably good set of waveforms programmed into it where I can call up sine sawtooth and square and change frequencies and pulse width, It sounds terrible but does actually work and could be used as the simpler basis of synthesizers. the ECS2 is many times more powerful than my Pic chip version.
Interesting, but this kind of approach to circuit emulation happens in the digital domain right? Do you need a DAC at the output? What about aliasing?
Im not 100% sure but the FPGA ECS2 chip is capable of digital and analog outputs so maube they are using analog direct from the FPGA ?. but don't quote me on that as I am not sure how Roland is using this chip. Its really difficult to find information about it.
I dont know, would be nice to test those roland synth searching for some aliasing in the high freq range... that would tell us a whole lot more about that... Although soft synths like U He DIVA shows an incredible performance when you push it hard into filter self oscillation and ring mod and high pitched oscillators and filter and vca overdrive despite being digitial emulations... so... who knows! Cheers from Argentina!
Thank You TheMetalMusicMachine and Hello to Argentina :-)
Just bought the Arturia V softsynth collection which has the Jupiter as one of the 11 instruments (the ARP2600 being my favourite so far ...). The drawbacks of softsynths should be known but apart from that I guess it beats this Roland with the fingers in the noise: more voices, arpeggiator, fx, etc ...
+Karl Georges Hi Karl. I too have the Arturia collection and agree that the Jupiter on it is pretty amazing. But I cannot take it apart so thats why I dont really do video's on softsynths even though I like them very much.
C'MAWN, where did you get that micromicrokorg?
It really is only a USB stick disguised as a microkorg. Just a bit of fun for the video
Perhaps they originally designed it to be 8 voice, then only put one chip inside and made it 4 voice to keep the cost down?
Great video. no cc control is just completely weird. nice Microsoft band, btw:) how you liking it?
never mind. I looked closer :P
+Elsif Hi Elsif its bot the microsoft band its the sony SWR30 . I would have preferred the Microsoft band. this Sony is very limited in what it can do but as its ELpaper display it lasts about 3 to 5 days between charging and is always readable. but I still want the microsoft one ?.
From your quick review and the slightly more in depth Sonic State review I'd say it sounds very nice and I should probably get one so that I have some version of the Jupiter 8 in my collection. But I have to wonder if they will release a larger version at some point. I'd be glad to pay twice as much for a version with larger controls and 8 (or more) voices. But apparently these will only be around for 6 months so I have to decide fast!
+Scott Rogers You can get the whole Arturia v4 collecton for that money. Just add a MIDI keyboard with some knobs like Arturias own and you are good to go.
Could someone explain the basic architecture of JP-08 please? I acquired a broken one with low and distorted output and would like to locate DAC and OP amps that feed the output to see if I can trace if at some point signal is ok. It also has dodgy ribbon controllers that do not follow what you press with your finger, but I guess I could live without that only if audio path was ok. Anyone selling a broken JP-08? Thanks!
So is this basically a soft synth in a box? I'm struggling to see the value in this one.
+Dan Thorpe I know what you mean. it's too compact really but it does sound just like the original. its sort of the soft synth without the need for a computer.
Nandos Dan dedicated hardware is what people want.
You make great video's. I like small devices but they need indeed to allow remote control via cc's.
+Roland Gerard I agree 100%
Hallo Markus ,can you show what is inside" DeepMind12" new synthesizer from Behringer ,because we don't believe this is pure analogue Can You ? pls.
YAVAMAYstudio Hi If I get my hands on one I will ceratainly open it up, as far as I have heard it is analog.
Hi, i want to mod the roland mx1 to add more analog channels.....any chance ypure gonna do a breakdown. And posisbly guide us modders in how to add the channel? Many thanks from new zealand, peter
Great work as ever! Thanks. I see you test drove a king Korg!
The key question - is it a keeper?
BTW, my mind is boggling that you owned the real thing - I'm presuming that wasn't from Adur Rec? Ha!
+James Porch Hi James, now I have the jp-08 and have heard some of the things it can do I think I will hold onto it and hope Roland will sort out the CC commands issue. Yes I owned the real thing indeed. I wish I had kept it now.
You could just look at the back of all three units to see whether the plugs are roughly at the same spot...
I did some dig. Now boutique have 10 models. JP-08,JX-03,JU-06 even have same firmware, and TR09,TB03,VP03 have same firmware, TR08,SH01A,D05 have same firmware. They boot with different configure. All board are the same, only different is memory. I have D05, it has 64m ram. As the video show, jp-08 has 32m. Roland now a software company, all their product is software, TR-8s,System1/8 and boutique are all the same. machine comes with different shell. There even software version of these synth... But only SE02 is different. We want save money!
Hi Markus Fuller, nice videos. When I knew about System-1 I said to myself: "the day Roland release Jupiter-8 as a plug-out I will buy Aira System-1". But that day never came, and now they released the Jupiter-08 in a crap hardware. Do you think they will make things right and release the famous synths for System-1, or they will abandon the child?
+fabiovsroque Hmm I wish I had a crystal ball but if I could place a bet then I think I would gamble that they will release a plug-out maybe next year. It makes business sense as theres money for them to be made by doing that.
What was the very small key board?
+Noname7401 that was just a bit of fun for the video. it was not a real keyboard it was a USB stick in the design of the MicroKorg.
What model of MIDI controller do you use?
+Desmaad Hello I was using the Arturia keylab 49. I have several but this one is my goto midi controller for almost everything.
Do you think there is a way to add voices ?