Usually, by the time you learn the person is a "covert narcissist", you have already 'dealt' with them in one way or another. You cannot and will not recognize the person as a 'covert narcissist' just by looking at them or having casual interactions with them. You have to observe, listen, and understand what you SAW,what you HEARD, and WHY you SAW and HEARD that. Now don't that sound easy. The better question is how do you STOP 'dealing with' a covert narcissist once you understand what you SAW, what you HEARD, and WHY you SAW and HEARD that? The 'best way' to 'deal with a covert narcissist' is to STOP listening, STOP observing, STOP wondering WHY, and STOP having ANY interaction with them. If you MUST have interactions with them, limit the interactions as much as possible. No "hi, how are you doing", no "hi, I wish I had time to talk to you", no "hi, it's nice to see you", just "hi, hope you're doing well, I've got to run" or just "hi" and keep walking. If at all possible avoid ANY setting or situation where the narcissist or a 'flying monkey' can observe you or listen to you. 'Flying monkeys' are the narcissist's 'possessions'. Dealing with or interacting with anything or anybody the narcissist 'owns' is considered the same as 'dealing with' or interacting with the narcissist. The more you 'deal with' a covert narcissist, the more you will have to 'deal with'. Do not 'run' from a covert narcissist unless you can 'run' totally away from them. When you 'run' from a narcissist, it makes them feel powerful and important. They like that and will make a sport out of watching you 'run'. Once you 'learn' the person is a 'covert narcissist', you have to 'learn' to either 'covertly' avoid the hell out of them or 'overtly' have NO CONTACT with them and refuse to 'deal with' them. This all SOUNDS so simple and easy, but ask anybody who has ever "dealt with" one and they'll tell you it's one of hardest things they've ever 'dealt with'. Additionally, Metaspyhub@gmail. com is a company that is ideal if you need to be able to confront a cheating spouse because they have some of the most advanced features in the industry.
Narcissism is a fairly new label. Most people won't understand. When I use words like two-faced, behind-the-scenes manipulator, or closet tyrant, they get it. My aging NPD father is getting worse. I was talking with his doctor and mentioned Dad displays all the signs of narcissism. The doctor replied, "Maybe You're the narcissist, ever thought about that?" So much for some understanding from a professional.
Absolutely 1000% true in every way ....even before I realised I was dealing with a covert narcissist., I knew that no one would believe the things he did to me when we were alone, I figured out in my own mind to say nothing & leave him....wow did he ever make my entire life a misery, but I became a rock so hard he couldn't get to me whatever he did , and he tried everything...just like in a manual. .... I won by doing nothing, saying nothing, no retaliation , and a never ending silence....never said a word to anyone, but all knew eventually with time, just who the monster was !
With a comprehensive evaluation that includes brain imaging, there is no need for guesswork. Did you know that psychiatry is the only medical field that doesn’t look at the organ it treats? This means people often go undiagnosed or misdiagnosed for years while their symptoms worsen. Because doctors don’t look at the brain, it means they have to rely on guesswork to diagnose and treat patients with symptoms of narcissism ADD/ADHD. It doesn’t have to be this way. The SPECT brain scans measure blood flow and activity in the brain and can take the guesswork out of psychiatry. They have a disordered brain learn compassion, forgiveness, and helps self after leave helps tremendously be mindful please that's strong baby
The feeling is of a stolen life, of having lived in captivity for years. At the same time you hate that the narcissist has subjected you to this torture, you need to recover and be able to enjoy the rest of your life. It is a confusing and painful time that requires a lot of willpower Everything is absolutely spot on! When you are undergoing constant stress because of narcissistic abuse, you are unable to express what is going on in a clear way. You are somehow paralyzed. It is better not to say anything. Covert narcissistic abuse is so terribly sadistic and diabolical that it is impossible to explain it to somebody who does not understand it. Thank you
I played back a message from my N mother to my counselor and asked the counselor, "Can't you hear the rage in her voice?" and to my amazement, the counselor said no.
If narcissists can get you scorned by family, they will. If they can make you uncomfortable, anxious or stressed, they will. The smallest satisfaction you can find in life they will try to take from you. It's because they hate it when their victim is happy.
Everything is absolutely spot on! When you are undergoing constant stress because of narcisistic abuse, you are unable to express what is going on in a clear way. You are somehow paralysed. It is better not to say anything. Covert narcisistic abuse is so terribly saddistic and diabolical that it is impossible to explain it to somebody who does not understand it. Thank you
Yeah, my mother is like this: mean at home (or in the car) but the most charming and charismatic lady in public, hugging people and smiling. Both faces seem so real.
This has been my issue I try to explain but people don't get it. I have been through breakups before and it was never like this, but people want to just think you are taking the break up worst than anyone else. Which makes you feel even worst like you are this weak person who just can't handle that someone moved on. I literally struggle to believe my eyes because I have been gaslit for years and keep defaulting to me being the issue or at fault in someway despite the fact that this person cheated and lied to me for almost a decade
Also my parent weren't validated by their parents so they couldn't truly love themselves. You can't give away what you don't have that's why we need to self parent.
Being punished, demeaned, talked down to by your own adult child is a huge stab in the heart. How can someone you love so much devalue you over and over again? It’s still baffling to me.
Everyone only saw my reactive abuse. Whenever I tried to explain what I was feeling, everyone said..”well just leave!” I couldn’t.. Now I know it was the trauma bond. I feel like a complete idiot. 50yrs old and getting played like a fiddle..😢
It happened to me. Back a few years ago, I often found myself unable to finish my own sentences. Forgetting the word that I want to say, unable to explain complex concept, and have to limit my sentences to 5 words. It’s a very difficult phase to go through. Barely functioning at work just enough to get by with daily tasks. Went home at the end of the day and went straight to bed after shower. Skipping dinner didn’t feel like a problem, it feels like a relief as I didn’t have to make another decision. I kept eating the same thing.. mainly fast food or cafeteria food. Poeple don’t understand and most would be having difficult time accepting the information especially of they have a believe that a parent would never do that to their own children. People called me lying or making accusation against my parent. Thanks for making this video, it’s a huge validation to what I experienced. I hope you stay healthy and keep doing this good work. You are a hero to some of us!
I can identify with you. The same time I moved in with my ex wife covert narcissist I started a job that my principle, asst. principle and co worker were all narcissist. After 5 years I was almost completely down and my achillies tendon snapped. Best thing that ever happened. In the time I was off I had several things happen that just made me resolved to leave my ex, which I did. The work ones almost got me too but I was able to hang in and in the last year the principal and a p made it their mission to get me fired and almost did but I was able to fight and hang in there because they didn't have anything just manufactured it. Then they left, one retired the other to another school. Their BS didn't work but it drove me into the ground and I had a breakdown because they broke me. I went to get help with my issues. It was the beginning of understanding who I was. I should thank them for breaking me because otherwise I'd still be a lost person in the world who came from a dysfunctional family. I wish you the best of luck. They say we need the breakdown before the break through. I think their right.
I did that too. I ate nothing or always the same, lost a lot of weight, could not decide what or even if I should eat . Before the abuse everyone was telling me I was well spoken with colorful words, and now I am happy when I can tell my name , literally . So I feel you...🍀🍀
I feel like crying hearing this.. I can't communicate, it's like my mind is disconnected from my mouth.. my thoughts go everywhere.. hard to form a chain of thought with clarity and the anxiety makes me forget simple words.. feel like I'm rushing to talk and it's in everyday stuff, not just talking personal stuff
In my experience, the professional counseling world doesn't want to deal with the narcissist's abusive provoking behavior, but wants to focus almost solely on the "abusive" reactions of the narcissist's target. They ignore the narcissist bad behavior and make the narcissist's target feel like the problem. While I can appreciate that the professional counselors might know that changing the narcissist is almost impossible and changing the narcissist's target is possible - they don't tell the narcissist's target that the other person is a narcissist and the true source of the relational problems. This lack of transparency and honesty makes the target feel horrible and keeps them trapped in the lie that they are the problem. Counselors who do this are absolutely secondary abusers. And those counselors who don't believe the target's testimony and deny that the narcissist is a narcissist is nothing more than a flying monkey and are just as abusive as the narcissist.
Amen! I’ve lived this myself. I regularly pointed out MULTIPLE instances of controlling, abusive behavior by my wife within our marriage counseling sessions, and the counselor never validated me. Friends too. It was very isolating, but I knew the truth.
I too gave various professional counselors and Christian pastors hundreds of specific examples exposing my ex-wife's covert narcissist destructive, abusive behavior. All ignored! And my ex-wife had all of her excuses, denials, or tried to blame me for all her bad behavior. I actually had one 'Christian" marriage counselor tell me to my face that I have to believe my wife's words over her actions. Why? According to him, actions can be misinterpreted. When I brought up that tongues lie and therefore we have to emphasize actions over words - he said to me, "Your wife is a born-again Christian who loves the Lord and has been given a ministry from Him. She is therefore filled with the Holy Spirit and is incapable of lying to the degree that you're suggesting by judging her actions." I fired him shortly thereafter. He had no concept of Jesus' warning of a wolf in sheep's clothing. Why? He was a wolf too - protecting his own kind. You shall know them by their fruits.
@@alphaomegaambassador4978 Professional simps. Churches have embraced the idea that women are wise and men are overgrown children. If a woman cheats, it must be his fault that she "had to do it". if he even looks at porn after years of no sex..."adulterer!!". Most churches failed pretty hard at "be in the world, not of the world".
One of the most painful scenes in the movie was a scene with a broach. He gave her (a cheap costume piece) of jewelry claiming it was a very valuable family heirloom right before they went out to a concert. Being a rare event, she was very excited to go out & see friends. In the carriage he takes it out & waits. During the performance, as she is at her happiest, he makes his move.. Turning out her purse & quietly humiliating her. She becomes so upset she starts to cry & defend herself.. All to the ignorance of those around her. He loudly explains she is ill & must be taken home & was too fragile to be out. The sheer panic she feels as he quietly demeans & reprimands her is excruciating!! I experienced that for years & trying to explain it to others was useless.
It's also death by a thousand cuts. The button pushing is so under the radar or seemingly small that to tell someone about this would make them think your easily offended but if you times this by a thousand it is overwhelming. It breaks yo down little by little everyday and the narcissist enjoys the hell out of it because it gives them supply. As usual the thing is if a person hasn't dealt with it themselves they won't get it. Same with a therapist. Also we need to self parent and self validate. Don't count on others to do what our parents should've done.
Then when you stop letting them push your buttons, they use you "being cold" as evidence of you being emotionally abusive. The worst part for me is that near the end of the marriage, some people commented on starting to notice the way my wife would constantly make emasculating comments at public gatherings. Yet in the end, they all decided not rocking the boat was more important that being there for me when it all collapsed. I hope they all get a triple dose of what she did to me.
@@vtmegrad98hi. So sorry to hear that. It sounds horrible. I hope they indeed get a triple dose of this kind of treatment from someone. Only then will they realize the toxicity of it.
My mom said it's because I was such a difficult child to raise and I was out of control that my dad's anger was justified. I was hurt and threatened on a daily basis and nobody, not the police or the church members ever believed my pleas for help when I tried to tell them and ask for it.
Me ex narcissist girlfriend feeds the homeless, visit nursing homes to deliver food. Yesterday, somebody said she was God sent! But behind closed doors 🚪 yikes 😳 the rage 😡 the insults , the put downs. Everybody thinks she the best thing since sliced bread.
Narcissists are excellent at acting. They get people by their charm and performance. It can leave you confused because they are so innocent in playing victim and pointing you as the abuser. Don't fall for it!💙UA-camr That Helps People Overcome Toxic Relationships
Those of you here who believe in God, regardless of your religion, i have a request. Please make it a habit to pray every day that God exposes the narcissists and takes away their power and grants relief and freedom to their children, spouses and other victims. You never know whos life will improve because of your prayer.
Wow- this is my mother. She visits church on a sunday. Other members of the congregation see her as sweet and kind- I have been told how "lucky" I am to have such a dear meek mother. What they don't know is the moment my mother gets home she launches into a tirade about others- " Mrs G is looking so fat, she really is a mess". " Miss D had her hair done and it was hard not to laugh, the style is so awful" "Thankgoodness Mr C didn't sit near me, he is so ugky I can't take my eyes off him". She also has a "church limp". She walks normally, no physical conditions, and in fact does a two mile walk most days. She walks along the path to church easily, but is she sees others she starts to limp, and teeter, so people will take her arm and walk her slowlrted by into the church. Coming out is the same, I wait in the car park to give her a lift, and she usually come out of the church supported by others, limping badly. I can see other church members glare at me- they probably think I should get out of my car to help her. I feel dreadful. But I can't be complicit in her games. My mother acts like a victim for supply, it is horribly manipulative.
When she's out for her walk sneak behind her and videotape her....... In case you ever need to use it 😊 it's sad that we have to do things like this, but I've learned through my own mother's actions that we need to😮
I had a boss like this. She told HR I was unqualified. She told other managers I was unqualified. She told me she supported me in getting a better role. Then I went to HR to talk about my transfer and they said “you can’t transfer, you’re underperforming.” I asked her about it and she said she had no idea why they said that to me, she never said that. She encouraged me to apply for other roles and blocked them for a full year. Then someone told me she was doing it so I asked her about it she said of course not I’m on our side. Then HR called me in and said “why are you accusing her of saying false things about you?” “False? You’re the one who said she said them and you upheld them as true.” The dude looked so confused. He could not accept that he had been lied to by her one way or another. Though there was no other explanation.
I went back to an old company in a different location. The manager really liked me and I got really good feedback from clients. I asked about transferring to my old location for commuting purposes. She spoke with the general manager and she lied, saying I was unhireable because of how I left things with clients and colleagues. And those people were still there. She lied. And I told the new manager about it. She agreed that the GM didn't make any sense because she really liked having me there. I wound up quitting because it was a second job and I was exhausted. She understood and said I WAS rehireable. I could definitely come back.
I'm sorry to hear that having dealt with several narcissists in the work place and knowing how frustrating it is. I think we were all like this guy in HR until the penny dropped. I couldn't believe that people would just tell blatant lies. I was like how can somebody just spread false lies about me because I , of course, would never do anything like that. I've learned just because I wouldn't do it doesn't mean somebody else won't. It was definitely a wake up call and slapped the naive right of me.
There is also what I like to call "Batman Villain Narcissism." My ex-husband and first relationship after my divorce were both extreme narcissists who exhibited such out-there insane levels of evil actions that even I didn't believe what I was going through, because of what I told myself and heard from others, "There's no way he would do anything this evil; that would make him a Batman villain and Batman villains don't actually exist in real life."
I just got out (after I finally called the police and obtained an order of protection)…all the memories of the evil are coming back and I am having to deal with the fact that he did all of it on purpose to hurt me or make me feel like I was crazy. You are definitely not alone
Went for bio energy session not realising they knew ex friend, saying how wonderful they are. I was triggered, I felt the hurt, the cruelty, injustice, they defended them so much, I felt not understood and I wish I had not responded with the truth.
My ex can be the babybrother type, the best friend, the kind soul...all these roles. No one believes me. I'm dominant, difficult, borderline....no one believes that in fact i have ptsd
I live in a community where narcissism existence was denied. This gives my covert narcissistic mother more power to hurt me and people around are always on her side. Every single person I know hates me for no reason.
I lost a lot of my family due to my covert narc mother spreading lies about me to them and playing the victim. It is so very painful, and I'm sorry to hear you've had to go through this. You're worthy of love, even if the people who have been manipulated may not see it. 💚
@@djer05010401 me too😔 lost my siblings, my friends because of a narcissistic mother. The worst is, we victims are to blame🥺 we became public center of hate for no reason. But you too don't worry, karma will make our narcissistic abusers and people who believes in them pay one day... I send my love to you ❤
I'm not a specialist, but according to my experience as the scapegoat of covert NM, covert is not two external faces (bad one for the victim and good one for everybody else), but one external face and one internal face.. meaning the covert will pretend to be nice even to the victim, but have an agenda which is opposite to their pretending.. but sure there is a spectrum and ppl are different.. what I see as evidence in my case is the sabotage, "unpretentious" or "righteous" smear, acting like she's a victim of me, control, competition, indirect messages and passive aggressiveness (consistently, but not strongly).. a huge one IMO is sabotage; you don't need to abuse someone behind doors, all you need to do is ignore anything good in them, deny their individuality, refuse to share useful information etc... it's very subtle, but I have no doubt she secretly wants me to to be a failure
To give an example, my narc mom sent me a letter full of double meanings and disguised insults.. one of her lines said, "I wish one day to see you happy." Clueless ppl read this and can't see anything or much wrong with it.. but I see her telling to my face that I've never been happy and that it's unlikely that I will be, bcs when ppl say "I wish XYZ", it's something very remote and probably won't happen.. she's saying I'll probably never be happy.. I know I'm not crazy or reading too much into it, the word choice is designed to hit the right spot.. this is covert in my opinion
@@cestmagnifique7932 don't be so humble. You're absolutely right. Especially about refusing to share useful information. Narcs taught me all too well how seriously damaging lying through omission is. The hardest part is coming to terms with all the Narcs flying monkeys being exactly that because they are just too chicken-sh!t to even admit the Narc treated you badly. The implication is they are in on it, and they think you deserve it. I had to basically amputate my social life for a long while because of this insidious nonsense.
@@bloodstripeleatherneck1941 Omission, yes! That word also describes it very well.. you wouldn't believe it, my best friend and confident for 20yrs, our relationship is now tarnished by my covert NM and toxic dad as my mom got cancer.. I have enough empathy for my parents' conditions, but I really can't allow them to control me even through illness.. however, that's what it took for them to be able to move my only long-term friend to their side: my friend is now seeing me through their lens.. I don't share details about the narcs with third-parties except this friend.. now I see that not even your closest person needs to know it, but only ppl who can relate, otherwise they just can't understand and are potential flying monkeys
@@cestmagnifique7932 wow, I have no problem believing you. Not only have I had to severe friendships since childhood, but I've had to cut out my parents too. That's as far as I go explaining as well. Sorry you had to experience it. I know it's cliché, but It's as if the movie the Matrix was a warning/signal in that the concept where when you're in the matrix, "undercover" and so much as say the wrong thing outloud around others who aren't unplugged it's as good as an, "agent" hearing you, and that person instantly transforms into one of THEM. It's really annoying 🙄😆
Named so well! Thank you I have experienced this and the heartbreak of the rejection and invalidation when I told family and friends. I have found it so complex to try to explain it seems to have turned back on myself especially after the narc has passed away and was adored. So grateful for this video Absolutely vital to learn to self validate Thank you 🙏🏻
Yep, so common. Everybody in my family just thought my brother was a jerk until I learned about narcissism. I only told 2 of my siblings and they have slowly come around around over the years to understand who he was and my sister's been married to a covert cerebral narcissists for 27 years and is destroyed. She seems to not want to believe he's a narcissist. It's not my job to convince her. I sincerely doubt anybody in my ex wife's family knows who she is or what she is, a covert narcissist.
I believe you!!!!, it's hard, I went through it, but God knows, and they will pay with their everlasting life taken away. Their wolves in sheeps clothing.
Older guy here. This is right on the mark. I can handle sneering comments from outsiders with wit, grace and mercy. From my family? Those neural pathways cut deep. It's not like they shut me down as I could retort with venom but that is not in my nature. So I bite my tongue, which leaves me rattled for days afterward, even though I am acutely aware of their neurotic flaws.
This is awesome information!!! Sooo accurate.. we need to 'repair' that trauma in order for us to begin to notice and begin reaffirming our own realities ... so we can distinguish clearly where we end and other people begin. And allow ourselves to honour ourselves with or without the permission of anyone else.
I understand u perfectly. It’s incredible what they’re able to do even to people balanced and with solid values. They dig into your brain and soul …and find a way to bring to the surface every little trace of vulnerability buried deep in your psyche. 😢
This is the exact relationship between me, my covert narc mother, and golden child narc brother. They act the supergoodfamily in public. Vile, cruel, and hostile in private. Just like D.C. and hollyweird.
Yep, especially when your own mother and best friend doesn't believe you....what a long lonely battle its been trying to find myself, and maybe feel like an actual human being with a life worth living again...oh and the therapist part too...what a long nightmare
Any mom who doesn't believe their child when they talk about abuse... That moms got issues. Also, sounds like a good time to get a new best friend. Friends are meant to support...
So true .I had to be quiet and let them show who they are I am going through that now. Keep records and notes anything you will need it. My mother and ex husband are the worst. Stay in prayer 🙏🙏🙏🙏
Its funny i cant control the way people see the abuse but one thing i can do is stop being friends with people who dont believe me. I no longer "host" these people in my home and i no longer "maintain" these relationships. I have separate friends now. Whats interesting is as soon as i did that it got such a HUGE reaction from him but i NEVER went back and hes given up now. Now he just blames me and says im the reason no one wants to come over when i reality its just not fun for him anymore because he cant abuse me prior to their arrival. Im crying now cause your words have hit home so MUCH. I seek validation everywhere else.
You are one of the best explaining this phenomena. Most people can't recognize it cause they either haven't experienced it, can't identify it, or are narcissistic themselves. It is nightmarish when you suffer covert narcissism and other friends become flying monkeys, and the only thing you can do is cut them off. Holding on to the few people who may honor your friendship.
This information definitely gives the "why" a logical reason. This isn't a weakness. The way we are wired was exploited. Imo the biggest reason to be repulsed is the coercive manipulation. Just like corporations selling legal vices, you can get all you want till it kills you.
I've worked out that there is no point even trying to relay what he did. It's easier for people to think I am over sensitive and misinterpreting a situation than consider there are some people on this earth who want to destroy you, disguised as your savior! I'd rather deal with overt any day, but the covert ones are just the lowest of the low. To abuse another, and then claim they abused you... That's really quite something! To groom someone into a relationship..... People just have no idea what this is! Another thing is how you suddenly start seeing all of the narc's and emotional manipulators out there for the first time in your life. Your own friends were doing it... Your own family were doing it.... You didn't realise until you took off those rose tinted glasses Now you are left, alone, because its better than being around a bunch of manipulators I have been wearing a mask my entire life trying to rescue and please others The whole time I was being manipulated by people who didn't deserve it in the first place I'm now learning to see for the first time, walk for the first time, I could quite literally reintroduce myself to the very few remaining people in my life because I am not who I once was and going through an existence crisis.... Nothing was as I thought it was in my head! A bunch of manipulators exploiting me is all
I tutored my child in reading. The narcissist found out. She went to a reading tutor franchise. Enrolled my child. She later returned to that franchise with her friend. She and her friend told the franchise I was 'dangerous to children.' That gossip escalated into an Emergency Court Motion against me. My child was taken away. Now I see my child in supervised visitation. Meanwhile, during the caper, I'd never left my home and wasn't part of any of it.
OMG, I AM SO VERY GREATFUL FOR YOU AND THIS VIDEO , you have no idea how good it feels to hear someone else who understands especially about the trying to just talk to people again without sounding like a dumb ass
When I came to realise what my wife was, 3 decades together, I tried to speak up to a handful of "friends". I couldn't ever put it into words what was going on. Nobody believed me.
you explained it better then i can put in words thank u so much this is how I have been treated my whole life like crap and no one i talked to would help me or believe me and blamed me for abuse and said i suffered consequences for being involved w.abuser for ex my ex husbands etc. My heart is shattered from what my ex husbands did to me. my parents are abusive and so called friends and work place bullying etc . thank u for making these videos.
People you try to explain to don't ever get it anyway, they run, no one has this depth of knowledge or compassion to be of any help. Michelle you are such a life saver thank you very much. Covert dissimive mother and sister golden child have reached levels with ex husband of sadist narcissism that kills me my children have been so badly influenced and never did I sell my soul to the devil, thank God, I saw the lies and hated how I was treated and still today I'm having bad episodes of anger wanting to share some righteousness, truth and correct the error they do inform me because I have a responsibility as a parent but I didn't raise them this way but God has never abandoned me or rejected me so I'm sticking with the Mercy and Love, be quiet and pray. I got more family and friends that know who I am and what I've been through! St Padre Pio, St Faustina pray for us 🙏🔥
3 abusive marriages, a total of 28 years of my life and didn't understand what was behind it until 4 years ago when someone was describing her son's behavior and mentioned narcissism. I looked it up and educated myself. This is what I've been married to all this time and thought I was the problem, because as my father always told me, "you're wrong"...
Man u say exactly what I can't figure out how to express. I literally have a playlist called best helps me explain because when I go to talk about things I can't express exactly or you mind blanks out. And if I am able to explain because of my addiction past people tend to think I'm using addict excuses to excuse my addiction which I don't blame my mother but I do know because I finally was so well trained to self sabotage out of narcissist abuse. But man learning that I wasn't stupid and wasn't making things up I wanted to explain to everyone was so happy that there was a reason for why I did what I did for 31 years. It felt good but now I just don't explain things just content in me knowing. Even therapist were telling me I was finding excuses for my bad choices. You are my hero u know that? In a way you have saved my life because of my self sabotage mind set. If it wasn't for me stumbling on your content i may not be here due to depression self hate and overdose. Please know you are saving lifes.
Thanks again Ms. Michelle! God bless. You said out-loud what I've been trying to say for years! Your voice has given me some peace and validation! :-] Much love pretty lady!
Thank you so much for sharing this with everyone. This is been a huge blessing and you will never know how much of an impact this will have on people and victims of this abuse. Thank you.
Michelle Your hair color is amazing and your makeup is flawless. You look like you are in your 20’s. Just wanted to say that. Content is awesome, needless to say
My ex did exactly Michele was talking about in this video. Was very mean and nasty and argumentative immediate before a therapy appointment and then walk into the therapist office all happy and charming talking about the weather and other insignificant things like we were not in a heated argument that she started five minutes before. Needless to say the therapist was looking at me like I was crazy and the aggressor. And definitely looking at her like the victim
The covert narcissist I was involved with can not look at herself in the mirror or look inward to fix herself. It's sad and beyond frustrating because she has everyone duped. How can you fix something if you are incapable of acknowledging the problem. If you are not honest with yourself about your condition then the advice and help you get from friends and counselors is invalid and only serves to reinforce a victimhood mentality. The appearance of victimhood serves to further injure and smear the narcissists target. The whole thing is sadistic and self serving. It's all about maintaining an image and protecting a fragile ego at the expense of another.
At least, trying to explain what has happened to us, is almost an introductory course in abusive relationships, even if we get no validation from them. People fear it, will bow to it, in order to not be victimized also. It is a real thing tho, it is in the family, schools, workplace and society. I thought those types of toxic people were in movies and not sleeping next to me. Thank you!
All you are saying is my Mother and sister. I literaly apperant went crazy. I was so confused and so trapped by them. It was unbelievable. I was there with them for 45 years. I am free for 8 years now. However I Still have some flashes of situations. But God is good.
Omg. Omg OMG --- you have no idea how helpful this is to me. Finally a REAL EXPLANATION as to why I can barely speak about the innumerable things he did to me I'm so stunned and grateful right now that's all I can even type.
Omg.. I've had that problem trying to explain to someone about the covert abuse I've been dealing with for ten years.. I cant form words, my thoughts are so disorganized... I literally start to apologize and say, I'm sorry I'm not good at explaining. " This the first video I've watched to mention that as a symptom of the trauma.. Makes me feel a little less scatterbrained. Thank you.
For people to believe me of the abuse I get from my narcissistic mother,I mostly recorded our arguments or/and agreements so that whenever she denies anything, ill just play the recording as my evidence. But even with my evidence,my narcissistic mother still ends ups being supported and as I lent more about narcissism,I realized that it’s useless trying to explain to someone else...more especially to someone who hasn’t experienced the same kind of abuse. YOU DONT KNOW WHAT ITS LIKE,UNTIL IT HAPPENS TO YOU.
I never went into great lengths about the abuse my 40 yr marriage to a covert narc .. but during the lock down my 81 yr old mom stayed w are family .. and seen her son in law how manipulative and mentally abusive he really is . He turned the power off in the whole house bc the tv was a bit loud . My mom is like Omg wtf is his problem ..
My mother is like this. She is a people pleaser to everybody else except me but to me, her entitlement to be horrible beggars belief, but yet, she is canny enough not to be horrible in front of my Dad and my brother. Although they do back her up 100%. They 100% believe that she is the victim of me. Yet accuses me of destroying the family and they agree with that. All I did was ask her to stop hurting me. She did the classic DARVO. She was the victim of my asking her not to label me paranoid et cetera. She gave me the silent treatment. She talked about me and how abusive I was but not *to* me. After 3 years spinning my wheels hoping that she'd finally agree to listen to me I now know that talking is pointless. All I can do is accept that I was only ever playing the part that she wrote for me.
Coverts are so good at putting on a show for the cameras that no one would believe you if you tell them about their nasty behavior "off screen." My narc wife was adept at putting on that face in public when we went out, but at home and on the way to the event in the car or the way home it was a different story.
Interesting point about #2. In the middle of the shitstorm that was my narc parents (and a couple different similar women) there's something I used to do that I don't seem to do any more. Many times my brain would combine two words together at once. But they're gone and I started the process of healing about a decade ago... but I've not done the Brain word combo thing in years now. So while I wasn't having quite as much issue explaining, it was definitely a sign that some neurons had been crossed wrong back then. And yes... I hate explaining it in detail now as it causes a bit of an emotional flare up.
in the workshops, summits they call it social retraumatization if you consider the blame or avoidance you, no support, no understanding then it makes sense it´s not just botherin
The covert narcissistic roommate was fidling with the gas line night after night. The gas service man came when I reported a leak. The leak was so strong the machine began to tick rapidly when the gasman entered my condo. My life was at risk! What a creep!
When you go through coercive control too, you are not able to restart a life where you are self-sufficient and in your own power. You can't rebuild your reality in a situation like that.
So funny how someone so young and beautiful could have figured out all this stuff and even turned it into an enterprise. For the rest of us, better late than never. haha
Years ago I formed a stutter I could not explain and now I swear I have a lisp, this all makes sense now I also had 2nd abuse from a LCSW who put general anxiety disorder on my health record plus another issue, I am now looking for a therapist who is familiar with narcissist abuse so i can get that removed If you have anyone who can help me with this please comment back
Imagine going through this when you're a male with baggy pants and tattoos. Then people really won't believe you. At least you're a sweet looking lady Michele. That makes you way more believable in the eyes of most people in society. That's why I appreciate these videos. If I really need to explain this to someone I will show them your video because they will believe you not me. In my experience nobody wants to hear any complaining about life or putting other people down coming from a white male and that's what I am (mostly). If the narcissist is a woman that makes me sexist. If they're black it makes me a racist. I can't speak out against anyone unless it's another white male and that's not who's abusing me.
The movie is "Gaslight." He dims the Gas Light, which is like our electric pole lights today. Ingrid Bergman and Maurice Chevalier are the stars of the movie.
Now there's entire bot armies doing it to people everyday online causing manipulation so massive nobody can really fathom what's going on, let alone anything at all 😳
He would pretend to go out for the evening.. leaving her vulnerable & alone. Only to backtrack to the attic to rummage for a rare jewel that was part of her Aunt's estate. The gaslight dimming and shuffling was the only clue (no one else heard) that someone was there. Thus, trying to slowly drive her insane.
Usually, by the time you learn the person is a "covert narcissist", you have already 'dealt' with them in one way or another. You cannot and will not recognize the person as a 'covert narcissist' just by looking at them or having casual interactions with them. You have to observe, listen, and understand what you SAW,what you HEARD, and WHY you SAW and HEARD that. Now don't that sound easy. The better question is how do you STOP 'dealing with' a covert narcissist once you understand what you SAW, what you HEARD, and WHY you SAW and HEARD that? The 'best way' to 'deal with a covert narcissist' is to STOP listening, STOP observing, STOP wondering WHY, and STOP having ANY interaction with them. If you MUST have interactions with them, limit the interactions as much as possible. No "hi, how are you doing", no "hi, I wish I had time to talk to you", no "hi, it's nice to see you", just "hi, hope you're doing well, I've got to run" or just "hi" and keep walking. If at all possible avoid ANY setting or situation where the narcissist or a 'flying monkey' can observe you or listen to you. 'Flying monkeys' are the narcissist's 'possessions'. Dealing with or interacting with anything or anybody the narcissist 'owns' is considered the same as 'dealing with' or interacting with the narcissist. The more you 'deal with' a covert narcissist, the more you will have to 'deal with'. Do not 'run' from a covert narcissist unless you can 'run' totally away from them. When you 'run' from a narcissist, it makes them feel powerful and important. They like that and will make a sport out of watching you 'run'. Once you 'learn' the person is a 'covert narcissist', you have to 'learn' to either 'covertly' avoid the hell out of them or 'overtly' have NO CONTACT with them and refuse to 'deal with' them. This all SOUNDS so simple and easy, but ask anybody who has ever "dealt with" one and they'll tell you it's one of hardest things they've ever 'dealt with'. Additionally, Metaspyhub@gmail. com is a company that is ideal if you need to be able to confront a cheating spouse because they have some of the most advanced features in the industry.
It hurts when nobody believes, when something is SO BAD.
Narcissism is a fairly new label. Most people won't understand. When I use words like two-faced, behind-the-scenes manipulator, or closet tyrant, they get it. My aging NPD father is getting worse. I was talking with his doctor and mentioned Dad displays all the signs of narcissism. The doctor replied, "Maybe You're the narcissist, ever thought about that?" So much for some understanding from a professional.
TRUST can only be build on truth. And that is only the *first* step!!!!
Absolutely 1000% true in every way ....even before I realised I was dealing with a covert narcissist., I knew that no one would believe the things he did to me when we were alone, I figured out in my own mind to say nothing & leave him....wow did he ever make my entire life a misery, but I became a rock so hard he couldn't get to me whatever he did , and he tried everything...just like in a manual. .... I won by doing nothing, saying nothing, no retaliation , and a never ending silence....never said a word to anyone, but all knew eventually with time, just who the monster was !
Hooray for you! Never doubt yourself nor explain.
With a comprehensive evaluation that includes brain imaging, there is no need for guesswork. Did you know that psychiatry is the only medical field that doesn’t look at the organ it treats? This means people often go undiagnosed or misdiagnosed for years while their symptoms worsen. Because doctors don’t look at the brain, it means they have to rely on guesswork to diagnose and treat patients with symptoms of narcissism ADD/ADHD. It doesn’t have to be this way. The SPECT brain scans measure blood flow and activity in the brain and can take the guesswork out of psychiatry. They have a disordered brain learn compassion, forgiveness, and helps self after leave helps tremendously be mindful please that's strong baby
Man, this is spot on. I just got the “I’ve known her for 10 years” lecture from the narcs friend and now I am back to square one. So brutal.
Exactly. They've known her PUBLIC face for 10 years. As we know, that's an entirely different thing!
The feeling is of a stolen life, of having lived in captivity for years. At the same time you hate that the narcissist has subjected you to this torture, you need to recover and be able to enjoy the rest of your life. It is a confusing and painful time that requires a lot of willpower Everything is absolutely spot on! When you are undergoing constant stress because of narcissistic abuse, you are unable to express what is going on in a clear way. You are somehow paralyzed. It is better not to say anything. Covert narcissistic abuse is so terribly sadistic and diabolical that it is impossible to explain it to somebody who does not understand it. Thank you
I played back a message from my N mother to my counselor and asked the counselor, "Can't you hear the rage in her voice?" and to my amazement, the counselor said no.
If narcissists can get you scorned by family, they will.
If they can make you uncomfortable, anxious or stressed, they will.
The smallest satisfaction you can find in life they will try to take from you.
It's because they hate it when their victim is happy.
Everything is absolutely spot on! When you are undergoing constant stress because of narcisistic abuse, you are unable to express what is going on in a clear way. You are somehow paralysed. It is better not to say anything. Covert narcisistic abuse is so terribly saddistic and diabolical that it is impossible to explain it to somebody who does not understand it. Thank you
🎯💯💯💯
Yeah, my mother is like this: mean at home (or in the car) but the most charming and charismatic lady in public, hugging people and smiling. Both faces seem so real.
Because they pretend to be human, but they are demonic 😢, God is getting ready to destroy the ungodly people, or wolves in sheeps clothing.
I know exactly what you mean cause I married a covert malignant narcissist...she literally has my family believing in crazy
This has been my issue I try to explain but people don't get it. I have been through breakups before and it was never like this, but people want to just think you are taking the break up worst than anyone else. Which makes you feel even worst like you are this weak person who just can't handle that someone moved on. I literally struggle to believe my eyes because I have been gaslit for years and keep defaulting to me being the issue or at fault in someway despite the fact that this person cheated and lied to me for almost a decade
It's not only you were not taught to validate yourself, is that if you dare to do so, you get either ignored or punished.
Also my parent weren't validated by their parents so they couldn't truly love themselves. You can't give away what you don't have that's why we need to self parent.
Being punished, demeaned, talked down to by your own adult child is a huge stab in the heart. How can someone you love so much devalue you over and over again? It’s still baffling to me.
Everyone only saw my reactive abuse. Whenever I tried to explain what I was feeling, everyone said..”well just leave!” I couldn’t.. Now I know it was the trauma bond. I feel like a complete idiot. 50yrs old and getting played like a fiddle..😢
It happened to me. Back a few years ago, I often found myself unable to finish my own sentences. Forgetting the word that I want to say, unable to explain complex concept, and have to limit my sentences to 5 words. It’s a very difficult phase to go through. Barely functioning at work just enough to get by with daily tasks. Went home at the end of the day and went straight to bed after shower. Skipping dinner didn’t feel like a problem, it feels like a relief as I didn’t have to make another decision. I kept eating the same thing.. mainly fast food or cafeteria food. Poeple don’t understand and most would be having difficult time accepting the information especially of they have a believe that a parent would never do that to their own children. People called me lying or making accusation against my parent.
Thanks for making this video, it’s a huge validation to what I experienced. I hope you stay healthy and keep doing this good work. You are a hero to some of us!
I can identify with you. The same time I moved in with my ex wife covert narcissist I started a job that my principle, asst. principle and co worker were all narcissist. After 5 years I was almost completely down and my achillies tendon snapped. Best thing that ever happened. In the time I was off I had several things happen that just made me resolved to leave my ex, which I did. The work ones almost got me too but I was able to hang in and in the last year the principal and a p made it their mission to get me fired and almost did but I was able to fight and hang in there because they didn't have anything just manufactured it. Then they left, one retired the other to another school. Their BS didn't work but it drove me into the ground and I had a breakdown because they broke me. I went to get help with my issues. It was the beginning of understanding who I was. I should thank them for breaking me because otherwise I'd still be a lost person in the world who came from a dysfunctional family.
I wish you the best of luck. They say we need the breakdown before the break through. I think their right.
I did that too. I ate nothing or always the same, lost a lot of weight, could not decide what or even if I should eat . Before the abuse everyone was telling me I was well spoken with colorful words, and now I am happy when I can tell my name , literally . So I feel you...🍀🍀
I feel like crying hearing this.. I can't communicate, it's like my mind is disconnected from my mouth.. my thoughts go everywhere.. hard to form a chain of thought with clarity and the anxiety makes me forget simple words.. feel like I'm rushing to talk and it's in everyday stuff, not just talking personal stuff
Sorry to hear that. I hope you find strength.
In my experience, the professional counseling world doesn't want to deal with the narcissist's abusive provoking behavior, but wants to focus almost solely on the "abusive" reactions of the narcissist's target. They ignore the narcissist bad behavior and make the narcissist's target feel like the problem. While I can appreciate that the professional counselors might know that changing the narcissist is almost impossible and changing the narcissist's target is possible - they don't tell the narcissist's target that the other person is a narcissist and the true source of the relational problems. This lack of transparency and honesty makes the target feel horrible and keeps them trapped in the lie that they are the problem. Counselors who do this are absolutely secondary abusers. And those counselors who don't believe the target's testimony and deny that the narcissist is a narcissist is nothing more than a flying monkey and are just as abusive as the narcissist.
Amen! I’ve lived this myself. I regularly pointed out MULTIPLE instances of controlling, abusive behavior by my wife within our marriage counseling sessions, and the counselor never validated me. Friends too. It was very isolating, but I knew the truth.
I too gave various professional counselors and Christian pastors hundreds of specific examples exposing my ex-wife's covert narcissist destructive, abusive behavior. All ignored! And my ex-wife had all of her excuses, denials, or tried to blame me for all her bad behavior.
I actually had one 'Christian" marriage counselor tell me to my face that I have to believe my wife's words over her actions. Why? According to him, actions can be misinterpreted. When I brought up that tongues lie and therefore we have to emphasize actions over words - he said to me, "Your wife is a born-again Christian who loves the Lord and has been given a ministry from Him. She is therefore filled with the Holy Spirit and is incapable of lying to the degree that you're suggesting by judging her actions." I fired him shortly thereafter. He had no concept of Jesus' warning of a wolf in sheep's clothing. Why? He was a wolf too - protecting his own kind.
You shall know them by their fruits.
@@alphaomegaambassador4978 Professional simps. Churches have embraced the idea that women are wise and men are overgrown children. If a woman cheats, it must be his fault that she "had to do it". if he even looks at porn after years of no sex..."adulterer!!". Most churches failed pretty hard at "be in the world, not of the world".
You can't make someone understand unless they've been through it themselves. Much like my military service.
Absolutely
Semper Fi. BloodStripe Leatherneck.
I feel you...big hugs....TBI and C-PTSD. Arg.... lol
@@allywolf9182 Oorah! Lol! Dogs always understand! Same deal here spirit friend 🫂
Exactly. I say that you people who don't understand it.
@@allywolf9182 my brother was a Marine. He was killed in Desert Shield on October 8th 1990.
Semper Fi.
One of the most painful scenes in the movie was a scene with a broach. He gave her (a cheap costume piece) of jewelry claiming it was a very valuable family heirloom right before they went out to a concert. Being a rare event, she was very excited to go out & see friends. In the carriage he takes it out & waits. During the performance, as she is at her happiest, he makes his move.. Turning out her purse & quietly humiliating her. She becomes so upset she starts to cry & defend herself.. All to the ignorance of those around her. He loudly explains she is ill & must be taken home & was too fragile to be out. The sheer panic she feels as he quietly demeans & reprimands her is excruciating!! I experienced that for years & trying to explain it to others was useless.
The guy in the movies plays such a smooth slimey guy perfectly that charms everyone. They think he's wonderful and she's a nut job.
It's also death by a thousand cuts. The button pushing is so under the radar or seemingly small that to tell someone about this would make them think your easily offended but if you times this by a thousand it is overwhelming. It breaks yo down little by little everyday and the narcissist enjoys the hell out of it because it gives them supply. As usual the thing is if a person hasn't dealt with it themselves they won't get it. Same with a therapist. Also we need to self parent and self validate. Don't count on others to do what our parents should've done.
Then when you stop letting them push your buttons, they use you "being cold" as evidence of you being emotionally abusive. The worst part for me is that near the end of the marriage, some people commented on starting to notice the way my wife would constantly make emasculating comments at public gatherings. Yet in the end, they all decided not rocking the boat was more important that being there for me when it all collapsed. I hope they all get a triple dose of what she did to me.
@@vtmegrad98hi. So sorry to hear that. It sounds horrible. I hope they indeed get a triple dose of this kind of treatment from someone. Only then will they realize the toxicity of it.
I call it the gradual dismantling of the self. Little by little. Slowly. Till the person is a shell of himself.
My mom said it's because I was such a difficult child to raise and I was out of control that my dad's anger was justified. I was hurt and threatened on a daily basis and nobody, not the police or the church members ever believed my pleas for help when I tried to tell them and ask for it.
Me ex narcissist girlfriend feeds the homeless, visit nursing homes to deliver food. Yesterday, somebody said she was God sent! But behind closed doors 🚪 yikes 😳 the rage 😡 the insults , the put downs. Everybody thinks she the best thing since sliced bread.
Narcissists are excellent at acting. They get people by their charm and performance. It can leave you confused because they are so innocent in playing victim and pointing you as the abuser. Don't fall for it!💙UA-camr That Helps People Overcome Toxic Relationships
Yes, all true. This abuse flys under the radar from very dysfunctional people.
Those of you here who believe in God, regardless of your religion, i have a request. Please make it a habit to pray every day that God exposes the narcissists and takes away their power and grants relief and freedom to their children, spouses and other victims. You never know whos life will improve because of your prayer.
Not only this, but heal the narcissists and the abused as well
Wow- this is my mother. She visits church on a sunday. Other members of the congregation see her as sweet and kind- I have been told how "lucky" I am to have such a dear meek mother. What they don't know is the moment my mother gets home she launches into a tirade about others- " Mrs G is looking so fat, she really is a mess". " Miss D had her hair done and it was hard not to laugh, the style is so awful" "Thankgoodness Mr C didn't sit near me, he is so ugky I can't take my eyes off him". She also has a "church limp". She walks normally, no physical conditions, and in fact does a two mile walk most days. She walks along the path to church easily, but is she sees others she starts to limp, and teeter, so people will take her arm and walk her slowlrted by into the church. Coming out is the same, I wait in the car park to give her a lift, and she usually come out of the church supported by others, limping badly. I can see other church members glare at me- they probably think I should get out of my car to help her. I feel dreadful. But I can't be complicit in her games. My mother acts like a victim for supply, it is horribly manipulative.
When she's out for her walk sneak behind her and videotape her....... In case you ever need to use it 😊 it's sad that we have to do things like this, but I've learned through my own mother's actions that we need to😮
I had a boss like this. She told HR I was unqualified. She told other managers I was unqualified. She told me she supported me in getting a better role. Then I went to HR to talk about my transfer and they said “you can’t transfer, you’re underperforming.” I asked her about it and she said she had no idea why they said that to me, she never said that. She encouraged me to apply for other roles and blocked them for a full year. Then someone told me she was doing it so I asked her about it she said of course not I’m on our side. Then HR called me in and said “why are you accusing her of saying false things about you?” “False? You’re the one who said she said them and you upheld them as true.” The dude looked so confused. He could not accept that he had been lied to by her one way or another. Though there was no other explanation.
I went back to an old company in a different location. The manager really liked me and I got really good feedback from clients.
I asked about transferring to my old location for commuting purposes.
She spoke with the general manager and she lied, saying I was unhireable because of how I left things with clients and colleagues. And those people were still there. She lied. And I told the new manager about it. She agreed that the GM didn't make any sense because she really liked having me there. I wound up quitting because it was a second job and I was exhausted. She understood and said I WAS rehireable. I could definitely come back.
I'm sorry to hear that having dealt with several narcissists in the work place and knowing how frustrating it is. I think we were all like this guy in HR until the penny dropped. I couldn't believe that people would just tell blatant lies. I was like how can somebody just spread false lies about me because I , of course, would never do anything like that. I've learned just because I wouldn't do it doesn't mean somebody else won't. It was definitely a wake up call and slapped the naive right of me.
There is also what I like to call "Batman Villain Narcissism." My ex-husband and first relationship after my divorce were both extreme narcissists who exhibited such out-there insane levels of evil actions that even I didn't believe what I was going through, because of what I told myself and heard from others, "There's no way he would do anything this evil; that would make him a Batman villain and Batman villains don't actually exist in real life."
I've dated a guy who was obsessed with Batman villains. He certainly took lessons from the Joker!
I just got out (after I finally called the police and obtained an order of protection)…all the memories of the evil are coming back and I am having to deal with the fact that he did all of it on purpose to hurt me or make me feel like I was crazy. You are definitely not alone
Oh the Batman villains do exist. And there are loads of them nowadays. Stay safe.
Went for bio energy session not realising they knew ex friend, saying how wonderful they are. I was triggered, I felt the hurt, the cruelty, injustice, they defended them so much, I felt not understood and I wish I had not responded with the truth.
My ex can be the babybrother type, the best friend, the kind soul...all these roles. No one believes me. I'm dominant, difficult, borderline....no one believes that in fact i have ptsd
I live in a community where narcissism existence was denied. This gives my covert narcissistic mother more power to hurt me and people around are always on her side. Every single person I know hates me for no reason.
I lost a lot of my family due to my covert narc mother spreading lies about me to them and playing the victim. It is so very painful, and I'm sorry to hear you've had to go through this. You're worthy of love, even if the people who have been manipulated may not see it. 💚
@@djer05010401 me too😔 lost my siblings, my friends because of a narcissistic mother. The worst is, we victims are to blame🥺 we became public center of hate for no reason. But you too don't worry, karma will make our narcissistic abusers and people who believes in them pay one day... I send my love to you ❤
I believe you
😢
Ditto for me @ 60 yoabuse
I'm not a specialist, but according to my experience as the scapegoat of covert NM, covert is not two external faces (bad one for the victim and good one for everybody else), but one external face and one internal face.. meaning the covert will pretend to be nice even to the victim, but have an agenda which is opposite to their pretending.. but sure there is a spectrum and ppl are different.. what I see as evidence in my case is the sabotage, "unpretentious" or "righteous" smear, acting like she's a victim of me, control, competition, indirect messages and passive aggressiveness (consistently, but not strongly).. a huge one IMO is sabotage; you don't need to abuse someone behind doors, all you need to do is ignore anything good in them, deny their individuality, refuse to share useful information etc... it's very subtle, but I have no doubt she secretly wants me to to be a failure
To give an example, my narc mom sent me a letter full of double meanings and disguised insults.. one of her lines said, "I wish one day to see you happy." Clueless ppl read this and can't see anything or much wrong with it.. but I see her telling to my face that I've never been happy and that it's unlikely that I will be, bcs when ppl say "I wish XYZ", it's something very remote and probably won't happen.. she's saying I'll probably never be happy.. I know I'm not crazy or reading too much into it, the word choice is designed to hit the right spot.. this is covert in my opinion
@@cestmagnifique7932 don't be so humble. You're absolutely right. Especially about refusing to share useful information. Narcs taught me all too well how seriously damaging lying through omission is. The hardest part is coming to terms with all the Narcs flying monkeys being exactly that because they are just too chicken-sh!t to even admit the Narc treated you badly. The implication is they are in on it, and they think you deserve it. I had to basically amputate my social life for a long while because of this insidious nonsense.
@@bloodstripeleatherneck1941 Omission, yes! That word also describes it very well.. you wouldn't believe it, my best friend and confident for 20yrs, our relationship is now tarnished by my covert NM and toxic dad as my mom got cancer.. I have enough empathy for my parents' conditions, but I really can't allow them to control me even through illness.. however, that's what it took for them to be able to move my only long-term friend to their side: my friend is now seeing me through their lens.. I don't share details about the narcs with third-parties except this friend.. now I see that not even your closest person needs to know it, but only ppl who can relate, otherwise they just can't understand and are potential flying monkeys
@@cestmagnifique7932 wow, I have no problem believing you. Not only have I had to severe friendships since childhood, but I've had to cut out my parents too. That's as far as I go explaining as well. Sorry you had to experience it. I know it's cliché, but It's as if the movie the Matrix was a warning/signal in that the concept where when you're in the matrix, "undercover" and so much as say the wrong thing outloud around others who aren't unplugged it's as good as an, "agent" hearing you, and that person instantly transforms into one of THEM. It's really annoying 🙄😆
Named so well! Thank you
I have experienced this and the heartbreak of the rejection and invalidation when I told family and friends.
I have found it so complex to try to explain it seems to have turned back on myself especially after the narc has passed away and was adored. So grateful for this video
Absolutely vital to learn to self validate
Thank you 🙏🏻
Yep, so common. Everybody in my family just thought my brother was a jerk until I learned about narcissism. I only told 2 of my siblings and they have slowly come around around over the years to understand who he was and my sister's been married to a covert cerebral narcissists for 27 years and is destroyed. She seems to not want to believe he's a narcissist. It's not my job to convince her. I sincerely doubt anybody in my ex wife's family knows who she is or what she is, a covert narcissist.
I believe you!!!!, it's hard, I went through it, but God knows, and they will pay with their everlasting life taken away. Their wolves in sheeps clothing.
Older guy here. This is right on the mark. I can handle sneering comments from outsiders with wit, grace and mercy. From my family? Those neural pathways cut deep. It's not like they shut me down as I could retort with venom but that is not in my nature. So I bite my tongue, which leaves me rattled for days afterward, even though I am acutely aware of their neurotic flaws.
This is awesome information!!! Sooo accurate.. we need to 'repair' that trauma in order for us to begin to notice and begin reaffirming our own realities ... so we can distinguish clearly where we end and other people begin. And allow ourselves to honour ourselves with or without the permission of anyone else.
That's right ☺️. thank you!!
Well said Lisa. Thank you!
Even being able to self validate, and having had a healthy childhood and only one abusive relationship, I still have some of these issues.
I understand u perfectly. It’s incredible what they’re able to do even to people balanced and with solid values. They dig into your brain and soul …and find a way to bring to the surface every little trace of vulnerability buried deep in your psyche. 😢
It's so sad Michelle when your good friends and family cannot see what's going on.
This is the exact relationship between me, my covert narc mother, and golden child narc brother. They act the supergoodfamily in public. Vile, cruel, and hostile in private. Just like D.C. and hollyweird.
Yep, especially when your own mother and best friend doesn't believe you....what a long lonely battle its been trying to find myself, and maybe feel like an actual human being with a life worth living again...oh and the therapist part too...what a long nightmare
Any mom who doesn't believe their child when they talk about abuse... That moms got issues. Also, sounds like a good time to get a new best friend. Friends are meant to support...
So true .I had to be quiet and let them show who they are I am going through that now. Keep records and notes anything you will need it. My mother and ex husband are the worst. Stay in prayer 🙏🙏🙏🙏
I keep a daily journal for my granddaughter if she comes knocking in her adult life seeking answers regarding her covert narcissist mother.
Its funny i cant control the way people see the abuse but one thing i can do is stop being friends with people who dont believe me. I no longer "host" these people in my home and i no longer "maintain" these relationships. I have separate friends now. Whats interesting is as soon as i did that it got such a HUGE reaction from him but i NEVER went back and hes given up now. Now he just blames me and says im the reason no one wants to come over when i reality its just not fun for him anymore because he cant abuse me prior to their arrival. Im crying now cause your words have hit home so MUCH. I seek validation everywhere else.
You are one of the best explaining this phenomena. Most people can't recognize it cause they either haven't experienced it, can't identify it, or are narcissistic themselves. It is nightmarish when you suffer covert narcissism and other friends become flying monkeys, and the only thing you can do is cut them off. Holding on to the few people who may honor your friendship.
This information definitely gives the "why" a logical reason. This isn't a weakness. The way we are wired was exploited. Imo the biggest reason to be repulsed is the coercive manipulation. Just like corporations selling legal vices, you can get all you want till it kills you.
I've worked out that there is no point even trying to relay what he did. It's easier for people to think I am over sensitive and misinterpreting a situation than consider there are some people on this earth who want to destroy you, disguised as your savior! I'd rather deal with overt any day, but the covert ones are just the lowest of the low. To abuse another, and then claim they abused you... That's really quite something! To groom someone into a relationship.....
People just have no idea what this is!
Another thing is how you suddenly start seeing all of the narc's and emotional manipulators out there for the first time in your life. Your own friends were doing it... Your own family were doing it.... You didn't realise until you took off those rose tinted glasses
Now you are left, alone, because its better than being around a bunch of manipulators
I have been wearing a mask my entire life trying to rescue and please others
The whole time I was being manipulated by people who didn't deserve it in the first place
I'm now learning to see for the first time, walk for the first time, I could quite literally reintroduce myself to the very few remaining people in my life because I am not who I once was and going through an existence crisis.... Nothing was as I thought it was in my head!
A bunch of manipulators exploiting me is all
I tutored my child in reading. The narcissist found out. She went to a reading tutor franchise. Enrolled my child. She later returned to that franchise with her friend. She and her friend told the franchise I was 'dangerous to children.' That gossip escalated into an Emergency Court Motion against me. My child was taken away. Now I see my child in supervised visitation. Meanwhile, during the caper, I'd never left my home and wasn't part of any of it.
You are sooo right. This is exactly what I lived with for many years. So stressful
Thank you Michelle 💜💎💜
OMG, I AM SO VERY GREATFUL FOR YOU AND THIS VIDEO , you have no idea how good it feels to hear someone else who understands especially about the trying to just talk to people again without sounding like a dumb ass
When I came to realise what my wife was, 3 decades together, I tried to speak up to a handful of "friends". I couldn't ever put it into words what was going on. Nobody believed me.
you explained it better then i can put in words thank u so much this is how I have been treated my whole life like crap and no one i talked to would help me or believe me and blamed me for abuse and said i suffered consequences for being involved w.abuser for ex my ex husbands etc. My heart is shattered from what my ex husbands did to me. my parents are abusive and so called friends and work place bullying etc . thank u for making these videos.
Thank you, Michele
Wow, I feel so grateful for the way you explained this. I've been going through this my whole life.
People you try to explain to don't ever get it anyway, they run, no one has this depth of knowledge or compassion to be of any help. Michelle you are such a life saver thank you very much. Covert dissimive mother and sister golden child have reached levels with ex husband of sadist narcissism that kills me my children have been so badly influenced and never did I sell my soul to the devil, thank God, I saw the lies and hated how I was treated and still today I'm having bad episodes of anger wanting to share some righteousness, truth and correct the error they do inform me because I have a responsibility as a parent but I didn't raise them this way but God has never abandoned me or rejected me so I'm sticking with the Mercy and Love, be quiet and pray. I got more family and friends that know who I am and what I've been through! St Padre Pio, St Faustina pray for us 🙏🔥
3 abusive marriages, a total of 28 years of my life and didn't understand what was behind it until 4 years ago when someone was describing her son's behavior and mentioned narcissism. I looked it up and educated myself. This is what I've been married to all this time and thought I was the problem, because as my father always told me, "you're wrong"...
Man u say exactly what I can't figure out how to express. I literally have a playlist called best helps me explain because when I go to talk about things I can't express exactly or you mind blanks out. And if I am able to explain because of my addiction past people tend to think I'm using addict excuses to excuse my addiction which I don't blame my mother but I do know because I finally was so well trained to self sabotage out of narcissist abuse. But man learning that I wasn't stupid and wasn't making things up I wanted to explain to everyone was so happy that there was a reason for why I did what I did for 31 years. It felt good but now I just don't explain things just content in me knowing. Even therapist were telling me I was finding excuses for my bad choices. You are my hero u know that? In a way you have saved my life because of my self sabotage mind set. If it wasn't for me stumbling on your content i may not be here due to depression self hate and overdose. Please know you are saving lifes.
Thanks again Ms. Michelle! God bless. You said out-loud what I've been trying to say for years! Your voice has given me some peace and validation! :-] Much love pretty lady!
Thank you so much for sharing this with everyone. This is been a huge blessing and you will never know how much of an impact this will have on people and victims of this abuse. Thank you.
Switching masks, that hurts omg. So on point
Michelle
Your hair color is amazing and your makeup is flawless. You look like you are in your 20’s. Just wanted to say that. Content is awesome, needless to say
My ex did exactly Michele was talking about in this video. Was very mean and nasty and argumentative immediate before a therapy appointment and then walk into the therapist office all happy and charming talking about the weather and other insignificant things like we were not in a heated argument that she started five minutes before. Needless to say the therapist was looking at me like I was crazy and the aggressor. And definitely looking at her like the victim
Yes exactly true..!!
The covert narcissist I was involved with can not look at herself in the mirror or look inward to fix herself. It's sad and beyond frustrating because she has everyone duped. How can you fix something if you are incapable of acknowledging the problem. If you are not honest with yourself about your condition then the advice and help you get from friends and counselors is invalid and only serves to reinforce a victimhood mentality. The appearance of victimhood serves to further injure and smear the narcissists target. The whole thing is sadistic and self serving. It's all about maintaining an image and protecting a fragile ego at the expense of another.
If you reverse the 10 commandments - that's the character of a narcissist! No love.
So well put that you bring up memories. Painful memories.
Michelle, you got right in to the point!!!
At least, trying to explain what has happened to us, is almost an introductory course in abusive relationships, even if we get no validation from them. People fear it, will bow to it, in order to not be victimized also. It is a real thing tho, it is in the family, schools, workplace and society. I thought those types of toxic people were in movies and not sleeping next to me. Thank you!
All you are saying is my Mother and sister. I literaly apperant went crazy. I was so confused and so trapped by them. It was unbelievable. I was there with them for 45 years. I am free for 8 years now. However I Still have some flashes of situations. But God is good.
Strange that UA-cam blocks me from sharing this very GOOD information
Omg. Omg OMG --- you have no idea how helpful this is to me. Finally a REAL EXPLANATION as to why I can barely speak about the innumerable things he did to me I'm so stunned and grateful right now that's all I can even type.
This is my whole childhood story
Omg.. I've had that problem trying to explain to someone about the covert abuse I've been dealing with for ten years.. I cant form words, my thoughts are so disorganized... I literally start to apologize and say, I'm sorry I'm not good at explaining. " This the first video I've watched to mention that as a symptom of the trauma.. Makes me feel a little less scatterbrained. Thank you.
Recalibrate Becomes My New Favorite Word. Displacing Transmutation. From Eckhart Tolle 10 years Ago.
For people to believe me of the abuse I get from my narcissistic mother,I mostly recorded our arguments or/and agreements so that whenever she denies anything, ill just play the recording as my evidence.
But even with my evidence,my narcissistic mother still ends ups being supported and as I lent more about narcissism,I realized that it’s useless trying to explain to someone else...more especially to someone who hasn’t experienced the same kind of abuse.
YOU DONT KNOW WHAT ITS LIKE,UNTIL IT HAPPENS TO YOU.
How do you record conversations without them seeing it? 🤔
I get it, now. I’m still not sorry I severed my relationship with my brother, it needed to happen anyway.
Get away and look at yourself if you can
Then maybe learn who to trust before speaking outloud
Thank you Michele ❤️🙏
I'm glad you broke free. Your so blessed. You got such a beautiful furniture. God bless you
I never went into great lengths about the abuse my 40 yr marriage to a covert narc .. but during the lock down my 81 yr old mom stayed w are family .. and seen her son in law how manipulative and mentally abusive he really is . He turned the power off in the whole house bc the tv was a bit loud . My mom is like Omg wtf is his problem ..
My mother is like this. She is a people pleaser to everybody else except me but to me, her entitlement to be horrible beggars belief, but yet, she is canny enough not to be horrible in front of my Dad and my brother. Although they do back her up 100%. They 100% believe that she is the victim of me. Yet accuses me of destroying the family and they agree with that. All I did was ask her to stop hurting me. She did the classic DARVO. She was the victim of my asking her not to label me paranoid et cetera. She gave me the silent treatment. She talked about me and how abusive I was but not *to* me.
After 3 years spinning my wheels hoping that she'd finally agree to listen to me I now know that talking is pointless. All I can do is accept that I was only ever playing the part that she wrote for me.
Thank you so much. This was very interesting. ❤️👍🏻🙏
Amazing video, had to watch a couple of times to let it all sink in!! ❤😃🌹🌞🌼
Coverts are so good at putting on a show for the cameras that no one would believe you if you tell them about their nasty behavior "off screen." My narc wife was adept at putting on that face in public when we went out, but at home and on the way to the event in the car or the way home it was a different story.
Wish I had seen this years ago, I could have sent it to the friends I've lost to my narcissistic ex!
How does one prove they were the one abused and not the narcissist?
Interesting point about #2. In the middle of the shitstorm that was my narc parents (and a couple different similar women) there's something I used to do that I don't seem to do any more. Many times my brain would combine two words together at once. But they're gone and I started the process of healing about a decade ago... but I've not done the Brain word combo thing in years now. So while I wasn't having quite as much issue explaining, it was definitely a sign that some neurons had been crossed wrong back then. And yes... I hate explaining it in detail now as it causes a bit of an emotional flare up.
Thank you so much for doing this! Your videos make me stronger and more determined. Thank you! ❤
Yup.
My mother, brother and former coworker.
Strengthening your ability to self-validate.
I do self validate, but I feel that telling survivors not to seek justice and instead be ok with only believing themselves, is demotivating.
in the workshops, summits they call it social retraumatization if you consider the blame or avoidance you, no support, no understanding then it makes sense it´s not just botherin
The covert narcissistic roommate was fidling with the gas line night after night. The gas service man came when I reported a leak. The leak was so strong the machine began to tick rapidly when the gasman entered my condo. My life was at risk! What a creep!
I love you and your videos.
When you go through coercive control too, you are not able to restart a life where you are self-sufficient and in your own power.
You can't rebuild your reality in a situation like that.
This is so accurate it’s painful
So funny how someone so young and beautiful could have figured out all this stuff and even turned it into an enterprise.
For the rest of us, better late than never. haha
Years ago I formed a stutter I could not explain and now I swear I have a lisp, this all makes sense now
I also had 2nd abuse from a LCSW who put general anxiety disorder on my health record plus another issue, I am now looking for a therapist who is familiar with narcissist abuse so i can get that removed
If you have anyone who can help me with this please comment back
Make sure there’s no mold in home. Mold can cause this
Thank you so much!
This was really good! Thanks for helping us to feel heard❤
Imagine going through this when you're a male with baggy pants and tattoos. Then people really won't believe you. At least you're a sweet looking lady Michele. That makes you way more believable in the eyes of most people in society. That's why I appreciate these videos. If I really need to explain this to someone I will show them your video because they will believe you not me. In my experience nobody wants to hear any complaining about life or putting other people down coming from a white male and that's what I am (mostly). If the narcissist is a woman that makes me sexist. If they're black it makes me a racist. I can't speak out against anyone unless it's another white male and that's not who's abusing me.
Dead on !ugh it’s sickening
Absolutely 💯correct 👌❤️x
You are amazing Michele! ❤️ Thank you for this xxx
One thing you should address is the a broken sex drive after narcissist abuse
The movie is "Gaslight." He dims the Gas Light, which is like our electric pole lights today. Ingrid Bergman and Maurice Chevalier are the stars of the movie.
Gas lights in the house like there used to be kerosene lights.
My mistake - the actor was Charles Boyer
Now there's entire bot armies doing it to people everyday online causing manipulation so massive nobody can really fathom what's going on, let alone anything at all 😳
He would pretend to go out for the evening.. leaving her vulnerable & alone. Only to backtrack to the attic to rummage for a rare jewel that was part of her Aunt's estate. The gaslight dimming and shuffling was the only clue (no one else heard) that someone was there. Thus, trying to slowly drive her insane.
And then removes a picture from the wall and tells his wife there had never been a picture when she mentions it.
Love this, thankyou beautiful soul ❤❤