Exceptional video! You’re funny, thorough, clear, honest, passionate and careful, i love your videos ! Thanks! Im building my first pack while watching this.
Great video. When I first saw that the length was over 90 minutes, I said to myself, "Ain't no way I'm gonna watch THAT whole video..." Yet, I was glued to the screen for the entire thing. I really like the way you explained everything. I love how it ended with that drawn out scene of you staring off all pissed at yourself... Lol..!
Haven’t gotten 5 minutes in and it’s already amazing! I’m looking to build a VERY similar battery molicel 20s6p. This is exactly what I needed to give me the confidence and knowledge to build it. Thank you a million!
Will, Thank you very much 😊 There is another battery building tutorial on my channel, have a look... just in case if there are some points that you were looking for. Happy building!
@@tobiasfunke It's actually 20s7p - and it's for an ebike. I'm building a custom 3D printed trapezoidal case... so it's kinda difficult to measure. I''ll say if you're planning to do 20s6p for a skateboard that would probably be way too big. Looking at 21700 cell holders.. they're 22.5mm long each. so ur battery would be like (22.5 x 20) mm long and (22.5 x 6) mm wide. Like 7in by 18in after you insulate it probably, and bigger if you plan on having a waterproof container. I guess you could always double stack it. Mine's going on an ebike in the frame so size isn't really a concern
I watched your videos multiple times start to finish, and god knows how many other videos. But built my first 13s5p pack, but felt yours had the most easy to follow along help. Now I have a new battery for my scooter and it’s working a treat!
Hi Pavel , very well filmed and instructive video , lot of thanks!! I already builded some DIY Lithium packs for old NICD power drills, E-bikes , and also motorcycles (lifepo4 with high amps). But actually it's more and more difficult , sometimes impossible to do that , simply because generic BMS are no more accepted by the engines , I think essentially for commercial reasons : Each society builds its own BMS with specific communication with the motor controller and also with the charger. And if I simply want to change the cells, the necessary disconnection of the BMS "locks" it definitively. For example with my E_bike (Panasonic system) I can add a second DIY battery in // (more capacity and discharge amps) but I need absolutely the Pana-battery to run, the same with Dyson vacuum cordless packs etc...We are prisoners of the manufacturers...For my car I can choose any battery without issue, but not here! I fear we will have more and more problems in the future with Lithium batteries if all these legal "robberies" are not forbidden. I say "robbery" because these schemes are absolutely not necessary for a good protection of the cells : A BMS like yours in the video is perfect. Friendly from France, Michel.
Thanks man, I think this has given me the info I needed for building a 10s2p 40t build as my meepo's battery just died, you are an excellent teacher, I really feel like this is the best video of its kind I've seen
Well, I am going to be binge watching your stuff, because I want to probably build my own battery. People complain about the more affordable Chinese batteries are just "meh" and not so great. And let's face it, they are not likely using quality cells, like Samsung or LG. So that's probably why many UA-camrs who do e-stuff like e-sk8boards, e-bikes and solar generator battery systems prefer building them and recommend against the cheap ones. And with the price of premade "good" ones and lithium demand now, it's so expensive. So building your own just makes good sense, but it's just so daunting, for newbies like me doing a DIY (even though I DIY a lot of other stuff). There's soooo much to learn and I've never been good at electrical or understanding it. Thank goodness for people like you, who are.
Pavel, Absolutely exceptional video again btw. Live watching these battery builds and this has to be the best most detailed one on YT. Thoroughly enjoyable and so so informative so thank you for putting the time in and sharing your knowledge and giving other new or novice builders a detailed guide and confidence to build their own packs 👌
Thank you for a nice comment. It did take quite a bit of time to film and edit but i do like helping so if the video will be useful yo someone - i am happy.
Pavel I have a tip I use when stripping insulation off large silicone cables Strip Back 6mm or so of end insulation solder loose end up allow some of the solder to run in cable just a little Cut exposed wire off level with insulation strip silicone insulation back amount required where you soldered inside insulation now will not fray and willbe a lot easier to handle cable will be like a shoe lace
Hey, very informative video. You can edit it on UA-cam settings to add chapters instead of timestamps at the beginning. And why connecting BMS tabs to positives when they are connected to next series negatives? Just spot weld BMS tabs to negatives and first positive, less risk of shorting and no need to secure each tab except only one positive.
Informative video ! Thank you. A question if I may ?How do you calculate the Nickel strip Amp capacity ? How much current can 25 mm x 0.2 mm handle ? I cannot find any specs on Nickel strips ?
Hi Pavel this video is really good! I was just wondering have you ever missed a positive weld and welded it to the negative? Im sure it is bound to happen. If so what do you do? Thanks.
Hi pal, your videos are amazing, thank you very much. Do you have a size for this battery please? It looks as if it would fit in my boys electric pit bike
@@PavelGarmas I definetly think icould get that to fit easy. Do you sell any of your batterys? i dont own any of the tools to do the job. thanks for the reply pavel👍😎
@@PavelGarmas hi mate, yes im uk, im southeast. i would like to enquire or look at prices with your friend if possible. could you point me in the me in the right direction please. thanks again pavel, amazing
Here you go mate. Quite a few ebay sellers got them. www.ebay.co.uk/itm/133404532904?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=wY77VAq9Sjm&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=CUPAOy4fTpS&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY
@@PavelGarmas I guess I needed to check the UK site, thanks a lot man. I'm gonna be starting on my 20s7p battery soon, your videos have been sooo helpful. I appreciate you
Pavel, When’s your next battery build project?? I think they’re fantastic and your attention to detail is incredible. Would love to see another and maybe using the nickel copper sandwich technique I hear many are doing now for high powered packs.
Great video, some good very ideas. You said you weren't sure about how much nickel you should use, as a ball park you should have 0.15mm² nickel/amp. In your configuration I would guess that the strip is about 140mm long therefore, 140x0.2=28mm², 28/0.15=187A. So you didn't need to double up but as you said it doesn't do any harm.
Hey Pavel, I have a 3000w 72v 100amp max 50 amp continuously motor. I'm thinking of making 18650 20s 6p battery. I wanted to know what size of nickel strips I should use? This is a budget build, so could i buy a bms only for charging and balancing? I would be bypassing the discharge,( which doesn't seem to hard). bypassing the discharge will be more dangerous for my long term battery, i believe. (Thanks for all your videos, I learned alot from watching you)
Hi mate, For straters, make sure that you use motors that are rated to the voltage you are planning to build a battery to. I do always by-pass bms on discharge and let esc do this part so yes, you can get the lowest Amp bms and use it for charge only. Higher voltage set up will not require as high Amps so if you use 0.2 thick nickel you should be fine.
Guys As requested, i did add links to the parts i have used in the description. Note that i do not promote any of the sellers so look for the better deals however Fogstar i would recommend. Hope this helps.
u used 2xlayer of 0.2mmx25mm pure nickel on ur pack is that good enough to discharge up to 150a peak like 5sec or best to use wider like 30mm sheet or not what are u advice?
Dual layer is an overkill but i do prefer to have a solid battery. Dual 0.2 x 25 with 4 pairs of weld will be good for 150 Amp in my opinion. I did manage to pull 189 Amp for 10 sec on my board and no problems.
Pavel, awesome tutorial and awesome content. I have a question in regards to the BMS. Will the BMS constantly draw current from the battery when connected? If the battery is put into storage for a few months, and the battery is at storage voltage, will the BMS continue to discharge the battery pack to 0V? If it does, have you thought of a way to disconnect the BMS when storing the battery for a few months or weeks?
Hi mate, Yes, BMS will consume electricity from the battery however it is minimal. I do normally leave the battery at 3.8 volt per cell and a few month of storage is not an issue. There is an option of static balancing and that does drain the battery much faster.
Damn... I learned alot from watching 2x 1h40m videos! I went straight to this one after the older one! This will be sooo helpful in making my build safer, better and looking a lot more sexy! I am however curious: I have the exact same BMS as you are using in this video (Double wires, only B- and C-, BT module etc). How do I wire it up, if I actually want to charge and discharge from the same port?
Hi mate, You will not be able to discharge via bms if you got the same unit as in the video...this is a 20Amp unit so really low. I do not use discharge...charge only. ESC will manage the discharge.
@@PavelGarmas Sorry I didn't clarify: I have the same BMS, but rated for 60A. I'm doing an eBike build with a rear rack and battery, so I want to use the same charge and discharge port (same Anderson connection in the front), but I'm not sure how to wire it up having only C- and B-. Your efforts are much appreciated mate, thank you!
Hope you get something from the links because I bought the BMS using it. I already had a 52v bms but I like the idea of bluetooth lol. I already have anxiety about doing this the first time and this video helped a lot plus having the smart bms to keep an eye on things is really nice considering I can't drive for medical reasons so I use my ebike as my car every day. put over 1200 miles in 1 year lol. cells all test really well though they were rated at 1500mah and i got 1450ish on all of them. out of over 100 cells only 1 was dead.
Thank you for watching mate. Appreciate the comment. I do always use the smart BMS for the reasons that you have mentioned - it is always good to know what is happening with the battery.
@@PavelGarmas So I have almost everything now. I can't find that connector though and your link is dead :( Would you be able to give a link for that? as well as the other end so I can modify my current charger (it has a different kind of tip). I'll be happy to buy it from an affiliate link if you have it! Otherwise I've got it set and the BMS is working I think or at least the app sees it. I need to figure out how to wire it up to my case now lol
@@UchihaSumairu hi mate do here is the power plug. You can buy anywhere you want, i do not have any affiliate links. www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ANTI-SPARK-QS8-S-Connectors-Pairs-Battery-High-Current-Power-Lipo-QS-8-ESC-RC-UK-/284372561695?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0
@@UchihaSumairu and here is a link to the charging plug that i have used. www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-5-Pin-IP68-Waterproof-Inline-Cable-Coupler-Plug-Socket-Connector-Pair-SP13-/294336364468?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0
i'm confused as to how it's able to show individual cell voltages when you only wired up cell 6 groups of 7 parallel cells to the battery management system. shouldn't it be only able to show 6 individual cell group voltage and 1 entire pack voltage?
@@Adgale ahh...sorry mate. Ok so ESC is an electronic speed controller that you will need to control the motor. Unit does control discharge of the battery. Have a look on my channel...i do have a few videos about esc units and the VESC programming.
Guys good job, but for me is one question I have meepo and just did battery for it and connect BMS like it is on BMS manual but I have problem with braking, when battery is full brakes don't work after they are very weak
@@PavelGarmas I did it like manual said and wire for discharge too, so now questions is if I take out negative cable from BMS and solder it to negative terminal on battery or Leave negative cable on BMS and bypas another cable on BMS negative battery terminal ?
I love your work! Most people won't share anything! It's like some ancient secret or something! Thank you for doing this!. PS: Which wires did you use for battery charging port? Which one is the the most proper wire?
Hi Steve! Thank you mate. I do have the flat pack tutorial on my channel as well have a look. The charging cable is high temperature silicone wire. I think it was 18 or 20 gauge. www.ebay.co.uk/itm/322860010747?hash=item4b2bf4ccfb:g:UpEAAOSwSk9ckP-2
Awesome! Can you please also post links to the products you buy? I really wanna buy the correct stuff since theres so many junk knock off stuff in China. Thanks mate
Pavel, great video, as always. I'm looking to use your design on my e-bike, and wonder if you can give me your approx. finished dimensions? Also, I wonder if anyone in your FB group might have suggestions for good suppliers in the U.S. Browsing on Amazon, I'm not seeing any 0.2 nickel in a solid 25 mm width, just the "hatched" variety (or whatever you call it). Any suggestions?
hey i love your videos. I have a problem I am building my board and life got in the way and i was not able to finish it for a long time any way I just got the Moli cells 21700 in for a 12s3p for a set of Torque boards Direct Drives. They are 80 amps a piece. Would I get away with a 12s3p? What do you recommend?
Hi mate, Thanks. 12S3P will be fine but what do you mean by " getting away with it "? Many factors here...your weight, terrain, riding style. You should be getting around 10 miles i would say.
Well my understanding is the heat becomes a factor in batteries when u draw more amps then they can easily supply. Hey can you make a video about wiring Batt, BMS, Anti Spark the charger and the ESC. I would love to see the correct order, an how they should lay in the batt box. Thanks
The BMS has to interrupt negative from battery to prevent over discharge. I don't see how this is done in your video. This is not manual discharge but monitors battery voltage and prevents over discharge.
I do not use BMS for discharge, it is by-passed. I do require high discharge rate and there are no BMS units to match the demand. Good esc will manage the discharge fine.
Hi Not printed. You can get them on ebay mste. www.ebay.co.uk/itm/133404532904?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=wY77VAq9Sjm&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=CUPAOy4fTpS&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY
Hi Thank you for watching and for the questions. 6.8 kilos Parts were circa 550 pounds UK but i got all the tools and build it myself. No idea how much retail would be.
Thank you mate. I am using these. Cheapest place to get them from. www.lithiumbatterypcb.com/product/12s-13s-14s-15s-36v-48v-58-8v-smart-bluetooth-bms-with-20a-30a-40a-to-60a-constant-discharge-current-with-uart-and-rs485-double-communication/
Pavel: Have you ever considered putting an in-line fuse into the battery circuit to protect from short-circuit condition, or perhaps something leading to thermal runaway? I don't seem to find anyone fusing these batteries anywhere. Not sure why. I'm wondering if you can install an ANL fuse rated for ... say 100 amps. Obviously, don't want it blowing (ever) but it would be some form of protection if something goes bad. This would be the same type of fuse that is used in the kweld battery welder. Seems that there are ANL fuse holders out there to isolate the fuse. Also, wondering if you have considered fusing the "charge" circuit leading to the BMS ... say an in-line 10 amp fuse, but would need to be rated for the higher voltages (50.4 volts in a 12S config). Anyways, just a thought if you have an opinion on it.
Hi mate, I know some good battery builders and some do use the fuses. My opinion is tat having the fuse blow when you are riding and loosing the breaks is worse than having a chance to stop even if the board catches fire. I do always monitor my batteries when charging and have fire alarm heads installed around the garage... I will try to make a video on this mate. Are you on my FB group ESK8FREEDOM? Would be a good topic to discuss.
@@PavelGarmas Heh Pavel, I'm not on Facebook at all. Never have been. Not really into all that crazy stuff. I get what you're saying about losing brakes in the event of a fuse blowing, but what if the fuse was sized large enough that it would basically never reach the point of failing unless there was a catastrophic battery failure? I would think that there is a point where a rider is free from risk of brake loss versus protecting the board from a complete lithium battery meltdown. No?
excellent video. You answered some key questions that I had. Also,Quick question- I have parts on the way for my first build. . I need to power a 24v 350watt motor 18amps. My plan is to build 6p-8s with 18650 cells that are 3150mah. My math says it will be 29.6 volts and 18.9 amps. I will be useing a cheap 8s bms 60amp. Will this work? and will this be enough for 2 hours run time.
With 8S you have a maximal voltage of 33,2V (4,2V x 8) , it's too much. More power , but can the motor accept it? For 24V , 6S (=25,2V) is good....and with 6P you will have much more than 18,9A, except if you use computer cells (not the best for a motor) with 5A x 6P = 30A. For a motor , cells with low amperage are not the best because the internal resistance is higher and it's not good if the motor drains sometimes more amps against resistance...but with 6P it will run . A lot of E-bikes batteries have not more than 5A/cell...if they have minimum 4P . It depends on the type and the use of your motor.
Hi Pavel, thanks for making these videos on battery building. They are awesome and have given me the confidence to build my first pack for an eBike. I have the same make of BMS with 2 blue and 2 black wires 52V 60A. I know you have removed one of the blue and one of the black wires as you do not use the BMS for discharge monitoring in your pack. For my eBike I do want to to have this feature. I can see each cable is labelled 10AWG. My question is about how I should wire the BMS - should I run one of the black C- wires to the charge -ve and the other black C- to the discharge -ve or do I join both black C- wires together and join them to an XT90 -ve and use the one XT90 for discharge and charging? Thanks for your help but I haven't been able to find an answer to this on searching the web of the manufacturers site.
@@PavelGarmas Thanks for the reply. This BMS, and the one you use in this video, does not have a P-ve. There are only 2 C- cables (black) and 2 B- cables (blue). Is the reason there are 2 black C- cables because the each cable can only handle 1/2 the BMS discharge current or because on black cable is for the charge -ve and the other for the discharge -ve?
@@jimhamilton7959 All depends if you got the old or new style of the unit. If exactly same as in my video then follow my earlier reply , if new then the charge and discharge are the same cables .
Can the Smart BMS’s be set up in a common port method like the Daly BMS’s? I have noticed on both your videos you have a separate charge and discharge port.
@@PavelGarmas you did, I am curious as to why. I joined your group on Facebook and it seems like a lot of the batteries built there use a separate port for charging. I understand the application of the batteries is different, but nobody (or very very few) building packs for what I am use a separate port for charging. I guess I’m just not educated enough on BMS to know why people go one way or the other with their pack builds.
Hi Pawel. I have ebike model MATE X-750W. My battery 48V/14Ah fail. Voltage battery output42V-when turn key to ignition position-drop to 0V. BMS or bad cells ?What can i do? Are you polish? Pomocy prosze
Charge the battery full and test voltage of each P lines. Add the total : if you really have 48V with all P...and only 42V on the two main wires , the BMS is faulty. If you have only 42V when add all P, you have one P with issue (but you will see it by testing) . And with ignition and drop to 0V : 2 options : -One P is faulty, (cells issue) voltage too low and the BMS stops the current for protection -all P are good , but a faulty BMS can do that : when switched on, it stops the negative current output (which runs across the BMS ; the positive runs direct from the battery to the motor controller) So first of all control the voltage of each P line.
Hi my friend how are you..?🙋♂️ I'm in a process to make my first powerful molicel battery pack... But... I want your "lights "... I'm going to buy them from e-kon.. Why molicel p42 capacity is 4000a?? Till now I know it was 4200a.. is Molicel change the capacity of battery p42..? I just want to confirm me that I will buy ORIGINAL molicel batteries..!! Thanks again..!!🙇♂️
Hay folks, did someone out of UK buy at "fogstar-wholesale" yet? When I compare their prices with Nkon.nl or Akku-Teile.de the difference per cell is huge! fogstar-wholesale - 4,37€ Nkon - 5,75€ Akku-Teile - 6,96€ @Pavel fogstar-wholesale sells new cells right?
Hi mate, Yes, they are new cells and i have used them for the last two batteries that I have built. They do sell good nickel as well and it is really cheap. They can maintain good price because they do buy a very large quantities from factories.
By asking for discount directly to the supplier I received following price's by an order of 90 cells: Fogstar-wholesale - did not reply Nkon - 3,80€ Akku-Teile - 5€
I found something else interesting. I will may buy and use them for future projects: Metabo 20v 10ah powertoolpacks using probably Samsung INR21700-30T cells (-checking on that). They will deliver 80amp constant for 4mins until they will flip the overheating safety switch. Have a look by yourself: You get 2x with a charger for around 330€ - ready to use for your tools and with a 3d printed slide for DIY projects: ua-cam.com/video/-g74ppz3NFA/v-deo.html
I love how detailed you get when going from nickel to copper wire, thank you for your content it has helped me greatly
Thank you for mate, means a lot .
Hope my tutorial helped you.
Exceptional video! You’re funny, thorough, clear, honest, passionate and careful, i love your videos ! Thanks! Im building my first pack while watching this.
Wow what a lovely comment. Thank you very much 😊
Great video. When I first saw that the length was over 90 minutes, I said to myself, "Ain't no way I'm gonna watch THAT whole video..." Yet, I was glued to the screen for the entire thing. I really like the way you explained everything. I love how it ended with that drawn out scene of you staring off all pissed at yourself... Lol..!
Thank you mate! Really glad that you liked it.
Haven’t gotten 5 minutes in and it’s already amazing! I’m looking to build a VERY similar battery molicel 20s6p. This is exactly what I needed to give me the confidence and knowledge to build it. Thank you a million!
Will,
Thank you very much 😊
There is another battery building tutorial on my channel, have a look... just in case if there are some points that you were looking for.
Happy building!
I'm gonna make the same battery. How did it go and what were your final dimensions?
@@tobiasfunke It's actually 20s7p - and it's for an ebike. I'm building a custom 3D printed trapezoidal case... so it's kinda difficult to measure. I''ll say if you're planning to do 20s6p for a skateboard that would probably be way too big. Looking at 21700 cell holders.. they're 22.5mm long each. so ur battery would be like (22.5 x 20) mm long and (22.5 x 6) mm wide. Like 7in by 18in after you insulate it probably, and bigger if you plan on having a waterproof container. I guess you could always double stack it. Mine's going on an ebike in the frame so size isn't really a concern
@@williammadisondavis thanks for the reply. I'm gonna put it in my Razor RSF 650. Ok was gonna do the offset cell holders. Good luck to you.
I watched your videos multiple times start to finish, and god knows how many other videos. But built my first 13s5p pack, but felt yours had the most easy to follow along help. Now I have a new battery for my scooter and it’s working a treat!
Hi Pavel , very well filmed and instructive video , lot of thanks!!
I already builded some DIY Lithium packs for old NICD power drills, E-bikes , and also motorcycles (lifepo4 with high amps).
But actually it's more and more difficult , sometimes impossible to do that , simply because generic BMS are no more accepted by the engines , I think essentially for commercial reasons : Each society builds its own BMS with specific communication with the motor controller and also with the charger. And if I simply want to change the cells, the necessary disconnection of the BMS "locks" it definitively.
For example with my E_bike (Panasonic system) I can add a second DIY battery in // (more capacity and discharge amps) but I need absolutely the Pana-battery to run, the same with Dyson vacuum cordless packs etc...We are prisoners of the manufacturers...For my car I can choose any battery without issue, but not here!
I fear we will have more and more problems in the future with Lithium batteries if all these legal "robberies" are not forbidden. I say "robbery" because these schemes are absolutely not necessary for a good protection of the cells : A BMS like yours in the video is perfect.
Friendly from France, Michel.
Hi Michael!
Thank you very much for watching and for the comment. Glad you liked the Tutorial.
Happy building!
I thought I was a crazy perfectionist, but you... I've learnt an awful LOT. Thanks A LOT mate. All the best!!!!!
Thank you kindly.
Thanks for sharing an awesome detailed build! Paranoia is a very good thing when it comes to battery packs.
Very true! : )
Thank you for a lovely comment.
This is really good stuff Pavel! Wish you all of luck in your builds and riding.
Much appreciated!
Battery performs really well and i am having a blast on the new board.
Thanks man, I think this has given me the info I needed for building a 10s2p 40t build as my meepo's battery just died, you are an excellent teacher, I really feel like this is the best video of its kind I've seen
Hi
Thank you very much mate. Does mean a lot.
Haha that's exactly what I'm doing. Bunch of 40Ts in a Meepo V2 Longboard.
Well, I am going to be binge watching your stuff, because I want to probably build my own battery. People complain about the more affordable Chinese batteries are just "meh" and not so great. And let's face it, they are not likely using quality cells, like Samsung or LG. So that's probably why many UA-camrs who do e-stuff like e-sk8boards, e-bikes and solar generator battery systems prefer building them and recommend against the cheap ones. And with the price of premade "good" ones and lithium demand now, it's so expensive. So building your own just makes good sense, but it's just so daunting, for newbies like me doing a DIY (even though I DIY a lot of other stuff). There's soooo much to learn and I've never been good at electrical or understanding it. Thank goodness for people like you, who are.
Thank you mate! Hope my tutorials will help. I do have tutorials on every aspect of battery building, soldering etc... enjoy.
Good tip about the negative centre not to heat. Re sensor or switch ,underneath the surface of the negative plate end of the 18650
I find your dedication in all your videos inspiring. thank you Pavel for the great tutorials. you are one of a kind.
What a nice comment. Thank you!
@@PavelGarmas
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Pavel,
Absolutely exceptional video again btw. Live watching these battery builds and this has to be the best most detailed one on YT.
Thoroughly enjoyable and so so informative so thank you for putting the time in and sharing your knowledge and giving other new or novice builders a detailed guide and confidence to build their own packs 👌
Wow, thanks! Appreciate the comment.
Great video, thanks for taking the time to put it together. I may build one similar for a small power bank
Thank you for a nice comment. It did take quite a bit of time to film and edit but i do like helping so if the video will be useful yo someone - i am happy.
Really great job man!
I enjoyed every second watching this video!
Thank for sharing with us!
Keep the good job!!
Great build, I've just finished a 12s4p similar with the p42a.
Thank you.
Thank you for this. You’re a great teacher.
I appreciate that!
Thank you, thank you! A lot I learned from your video. Keep them coming Pavel.
Glad to hear that!
Pavel
I have a tip I use when stripping insulation off large silicone cables
Strip Back 6mm or so of end insulation
solder loose end up allow some of the solder to run in cable just a little
Cut exposed wire off level with insulation
strip silicone insulation back amount required
where you soldered inside insulation now will not fray and willbe a lot easier to handle
cable will be like a shoe lace
Thank you mate 👍
@@PavelGarmas found your videos usefull in learning this electrickery stuff retired engineer trying to learn still, bought a Kweld for workshop
Hey, very informative video. You can edit it on UA-cam settings to add chapters instead of timestamps at the beginning. And why connecting BMS tabs to positives when they are connected to next series negatives? Just spot weld BMS tabs to negatives and first positive, less risk of shorting and no need to secure each tab except only one positive.
One thing to think about is annealing the nickel strip after bending and prior to spot welding.
Not a bad idea... i know copper does react well to it. Not sure if nickel does.
Active time stamps in comments below thanks to one of the lovely subscriber.
Easier to navigate through the video.
this is an awesome level of detail. thanks!
Glad you like it!
Informative video ! Thank you. A question if I may ?How do you calculate the Nickel strip Amp capacity ? How much current can 25 mm x 0.2 mm handle ? I cannot find any specs on Nickel strips ?
Thank you for a very informational step by step tutorial, respect, it gives me some confidence to make a battery for myself 👍
Thank you Ricky! Glad this video helped you. Did you see the rest of the tutorials?
Yes and I will be watching all your videos buddy very useful information 👍
Hi Pavel this video is really good! I was just wondering have you ever missed a positive weld and welded it to the negative? Im sure it is bound to happen. If so what do you do? Thanks.
Didn't happen to me, but that would make a big bang and will melt nickel.
Hi pal, your videos are amazing, thank you very much. Do you have a size for this battery please? It looks as if it would fit in my boys electric pit bike
Hi mate! Thank you for the nice comment.
190 mm X 170 mm X 140 mm is the outer size of the battery, please allow for some padding.
@@PavelGarmas I definetly think icould get that to fit easy. Do you sell any of your batterys? i dont own any of the tools to do the job. thanks for the reply pavel👍😎
@@baddadnyounglad7023 unfortunately i do not batteries for others but my mate does. Are you in uk?
@@PavelGarmas hi mate, yes im uk, im southeast. i would like to enquire or look at prices with your friend if possible. could you point me in the me in the right direction please. thanks again pavel, amazing
@@baddadnyounglad7023 email me on pavsreview@yahoo.com and i will put you guys together.
Thanks so much for the video. I can't find those cell spacers in stock anywhere. Could you point me in the right direction with a link?
Here you go mate. Quite a few ebay sellers got them. www.ebay.co.uk/itm/133404532904?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=wY77VAq9Sjm&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=CUPAOy4fTpS&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY
@@PavelGarmas I guess I needed to check the UK site, thanks a lot man. I'm gonna be starting on my 20s7p battery soon, your videos have been sooo helpful. I appreciate you
@@tobiasfunke good to hear. Build safely mate.
Pavel,
When’s your next battery build project?? I think they’re fantastic and your attention to detail is incredible.
Would love to see another and maybe using the nickel copper sandwich technique I hear many are doing now for high powered packs.
Hi,
In a few months i think. Have you seen my first tutorial - the flexible flat pack?
Do you recommend using more then one strip of nickel so that you can safely pull more amps without worrying about the amp rating of the nickel?
Yes, this is what i have done in the video...doubled up on the nickel
Great video, some good very ideas. You said you weren't sure about how much nickel you should use, as a ball park you should have 0.15mm² nickel/amp. In your configuration I would guess that the strip is about 140mm long therefore, 140x0.2=28mm², 28/0.15=187A. So you didn't need to double up but as you said it doesn't do any harm.
Dan,
Thank you. I just learned something new. Appreciate the comment mate.
i was just thinking of BATTERY TRAYS last night, May 25th.
and look what Pavel has got going on.
Shoutouts to you bro ill be wATCHING THIS LATER
Awesome ! Thank you mate. Enjoy.
Let me know what you think later.
Hey Pavel, I have a 3000w 72v 100amp max 50 amp continuously motor. I'm thinking of making 18650 20s 6p battery. I wanted to know what size of nickel strips I should use? This is a budget build, so could i buy a bms only for charging and balancing? I would be bypassing the discharge,( which doesn't seem to hard). bypassing the discharge will be more dangerous for my long term battery, i believe.
(Thanks for all your videos, I learned alot from watching you)
Hi mate,
For straters, make sure that you use motors that are rated to the voltage you are planning to build a battery to. I do always by-pass bms on discharge and let esc do this part so yes, you can get the lowest Amp bms and use it for charge only. Higher voltage set up will not require as high Amps so if you use 0.2 thick nickel you should be fine.
Guys
As requested, i did add links to the parts i have used in the description. Note that i do not promote any of the sellers so look for the better deals however Fogstar i would recommend.
Hope this helps.
Great video, can you tell me the cell try vendor?. Thanks in Advance
u used 2xlayer of 0.2mmx25mm pure nickel on ur pack is that good enough to discharge up to 150a peak like 5sec or best to use wider like 30mm sheet or not what are u advice?
Dual layer is an overkill but i do prefer to have a solid battery. Dual 0.2 x 25 with 4 pairs of weld will be good for 150 Amp in my opinion. I did manage to pull 189 Amp for 10 sec on my board and no problems.
Pavel, awesome tutorial and awesome content. I have a question in regards to the BMS. Will the BMS constantly draw current from the battery when connected? If the battery is put into storage for a few months, and the battery is at storage voltage, will the BMS continue to discharge the battery pack to 0V? If it does, have you thought of a way to disconnect the BMS when storing the battery for a few months or weeks?
Hi mate,
Yes, BMS will consume electricity from the battery however it is minimal. I do normally leave the battery at 3.8 volt per cell and a few month of storage is not an issue. There is an option of static balancing and that does drain the battery much faster.
Damn... I learned alot from watching 2x 1h40m videos! I went straight to this one after the older one! This will be sooo helpful in making my build safer, better and looking a lot more sexy!
I am however curious: I have the exact same BMS as you are using in this video (Double wires, only B- and C-, BT module etc). How do I wire it up, if I actually want to charge and discharge from the same port?
Hi mate,
You will not be able to discharge via bms if you got the same unit as in the video...this is a 20Amp unit so really low. I do not use discharge...charge only. ESC will manage the discharge.
@@PavelGarmas Sorry I didn't clarify: I have the same BMS, but rated for 60A. I'm doing an eBike build with a rear rack and battery, so I want to use the same charge and discharge port (same Anderson connection in the front), but I'm not sure how to wire it up having only C- and B-. Your efforts are much appreciated mate, thank you!
Absolutely the best DIY battery build vids ! Thanks again Pavel for sharing knowledge and skills. Love your bloopers you are fucking hilarious !
LOL
Thank you kindly!
Just a Tip: The mains operated spot welder cx4500 is real good.... and no gloves are needed ; )
Thanks for the info!
any bms on/off button? as smart bms draws power over time if battery is not used
No, it doesn't take that much... I do check my batteries once every 2-3 weeks.
How much would it cost to make a bicycle battery 48V20Ah? This will be my first and would need the cost of all the tools etc. Thank you
Welder, soldering iron,hand tools... circa 300.
Cells and nickel depends where you buy from. Have a look on Fogstar wholesale.
...and verify if the motor controller will run with a generic BMS. It's not the case with my Panasonic motor. It needs a specific Panasonic BMS.
Hope you get something from the links because I bought the BMS using it. I already had a 52v bms but I like the idea of bluetooth lol. I already have anxiety about doing this the first time and this video helped a lot plus having the smart bms to keep an eye on things is really nice considering I can't drive for medical reasons so I use my ebike as my car every day. put over 1200 miles in 1 year lol. cells all test really well though they were rated at 1500mah and i got 1450ish on all of them. out of over 100 cells only 1 was dead.
Thank you for watching mate. Appreciate the comment. I do always use the smart BMS for the reasons that you have mentioned - it is always good to know what is happening with the battery.
@@PavelGarmas So I have almost everything now. I can't find that connector though and your link is dead :( Would you be able to give a link for that? as well as the other end so I can modify my current charger (it has a different kind of tip). I'll be happy to buy it from an affiliate link if you have it! Otherwise I've got it set and the BMS is working I think or at least the app sees it. I need to figure out how to wire it up to my case now lol
@@UchihaSumairu hi mate do here is the power plug. You can buy anywhere you want, i do not have any affiliate links.
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ANTI-SPARK-QS8-S-Connectors-Pairs-Battery-High-Current-Power-Lipo-QS-8-ESC-RC-UK-/284372561695?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0
@@UchihaSumairu and here is a link to the charging plug that i have used.
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-5-Pin-IP68-Waterproof-Inline-Cable-Coupler-Plug-Socket-Connector-Pair-SP13-/294336364468?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0
@@PavelGarmas thanks so much!!
i'm confused as to how it's able to show individual cell voltages when you only wired up cell 6 groups of 7 parallel cells to the battery management system. shouldn't it be only able to show 6 individual cell group voltage and 1 entire pack voltage?
How bms cutt off the current if any fail happens when negative master are not conectted through it?.
ESC does it instead of the BMS mate.
@@PavelGarmas What is ESC?
@@Adgale ahh...sorry mate. Ok so ESC is an electronic speed controller that you will need to control the motor. Unit does control discharge of the battery. Have a look on my channel...i do have a few videos about esc units and the VESC programming.
Hi,
Great video and great build.
Does the bms work as a fuse? I did not see a fuse on it?
I like your Audio music , really funky👍 do you do you own tracks ?
Nope 😀
Guys good job, but for me is one question
I have meepo and just did battery for it and connect BMS like it is on BMS manual but I have problem with braking, when battery is full brakes don't work after they are very weak
Hi mate,
Did you wire the BMS for charge only? What is the vesc setting on the regenerative braking?
@@PavelGarmas I did it like manual said and wire for discharge too, so now questions is if I take out negative cable from BMS and solder it to negative terminal on battery or
Leave negative cable on BMS and bypas another cable on BMS negative battery terminal ?
I love your work! Most people won't share anything! It's like some ancient secret or something! Thank you for doing this!. PS: Which wires did you use for battery charging port? Which one is the the most proper wire?
Hi Steve! Thank you mate. I do have the flat pack tutorial on my channel as well have a look. The charging cable is high temperature silicone wire. I think it was 18 or 20 gauge. www.ebay.co.uk/itm/322860010747?hash=item4b2bf4ccfb:g:UpEAAOSwSk9ckP-2
@@PavelGarmas Thank you Pavel!
@@stevemuzak8526 no problem 😊
awesome g, i learned a lot thanks. i think i might also do the same with a smart bms.
big ups to ya man keep doing yer thing
Thank you mate 👍 Glad you liked it. I did leave a few useful link in description as well.
Awesome! Can you please also post links to the products you buy? I really wanna buy the correct stuff since theres so many junk knock off stuff in China. Thanks mate
Ohhh...good point! I forgot to do that.
I will get some links today
Cheers mate
I’d like to see links to the cells and product you use as well
@@K6TJO done! Check the description.
Done mate.
@@PavelGarmas many thanks! Keep up the great work!
Wich chainsprocket can I use for mbs hubs? Sorry for my gramar I‘m from switzerland😅😅
Hi mate
Are you on ESK8FREEDOM Facebook group?
@@PavelGarmas no i just want to build my own esk8 mountain board next jear😅
Pavel, great video, as always. I'm looking to use your design on my e-bike, and wonder if you can give me your approx. finished dimensions? Also, I wonder if anyone in your FB group might have suggestions for good suppliers in the U.S. Browsing on Amazon, I'm not seeing any 0.2 nickel in a solid 25 mm width, just the "hatched" variety (or whatever you call it). Any suggestions?
Join my ESK8FREEDOM fb group and feel free to ask members from us mate.
hey i love your videos. I have a problem I am building my board and life got in the way and i was not able to finish it for a long time any way I just got the Moli cells 21700 in for a 12s3p for a set of Torque boards Direct Drives. They are 80 amps a piece. Would I get away with a 12s3p? What do you recommend?
Hi mate,
Thanks.
12S3P will be fine but what do you mean by " getting away with it "? Many factors here...your weight, terrain, riding style.
You should be getting around 10 miles i would say.
Well my understanding is the heat becomes a factor in batteries when u draw more amps then they can easily supply. Hey can you make a video about wiring Batt, BMS, Anti Spark the charger and the ESC. I would love to see the correct order, an how they should lay in the batt box. Thanks
@@Nicoricanmarxist
Hi mate. All the videos thst you have requested are already on my channel mate. Wiring of BMS is part of this video.
The BMS has to interrupt negative from battery to prevent over discharge. I don't see how this is done in your video. This is not manual discharge but monitors battery voltage and prevents over discharge.
I do not use BMS for discharge, it is by-passed. I do require high discharge rate and there are no BMS units to match the demand. Good esc will manage the discharge fine.
Are the battery holders 3d printed? Or where can I buy them?
Hi
Not printed. You can get them on ebay mste.
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/133404532904?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=wY77VAq9Sjm&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=CUPAOy4fTpS&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY
Where can I find the video that led up to the video
Fantastic video! You are a excellent instructor!!!
2 questions
How heavy is this pack all in?
How much did this cost retail?
Thanks.
Hi
Thank you for watching and for the questions.
6.8 kilos
Parts were circa 550 pounds UK but i got all the tools and build it myself. No idea how much retail would be.
Hey @pavel garmas, another great video! What bms did you use for this build? Do you have any recommendations for a 12,s6p pack?
Thank you mate. I am using these. Cheapest place to get them from.
www.lithiumbatterypcb.com/product/12s-13s-14s-15s-36v-48v-58-8v-smart-bluetooth-bms-with-20a-30a-40a-to-60a-constant-discharge-current-with-uart-and-rs485-double-communication/
Pavel: Have you ever considered putting an in-line fuse into the battery circuit to protect from short-circuit condition, or perhaps something leading to thermal runaway? I don't seem to find anyone fusing these batteries anywhere. Not sure why. I'm wondering if you can install an ANL fuse rated for ... say 100 amps. Obviously, don't want it blowing (ever) but it would be some form of protection if something goes bad. This would be the same type of fuse that is used in the kweld battery welder. Seems that there are ANL fuse holders out there to isolate the fuse. Also, wondering if you have considered fusing the "charge" circuit leading to the BMS ... say an in-line 10 amp fuse, but would need to be rated for the higher voltages (50.4 volts in a 12S config). Anyways, just a thought if you have an opinion on it.
Hi mate,
I know some good battery builders and some do use the fuses. My opinion is tat having the fuse blow when you are riding and loosing the breaks is worse than having a chance to stop even if the board catches fire. I do always monitor my batteries when charging and have fire alarm heads installed around the garage... I will try to make a video on this mate. Are you on my FB group ESK8FREEDOM? Would be a good topic to discuss.
@@PavelGarmas Heh Pavel, I'm not on Facebook at all. Never have been. Not really into all that crazy stuff. I get what you're saying about losing brakes in the event of a fuse blowing, but what if the fuse was sized large enough that it would basically never reach the point of failing unless there was a catastrophic battery failure? I would think that there is a point where a rider is free from risk of brake loss versus protecting the board from a complete lithium battery meltdown. No?
excellent video. You answered some key questions that I had. Also,Quick question- I have parts on the way for my first build. . I need to power a 24v 350watt motor 18amps. My plan is to build 6p-8s with 18650 cells that are 3150mah. My math says it will be 29.6 volts and 18.9 amps. I will be useing a cheap 8s bms 60amp. Will this work? and will this be enough for 2 hours run time.
With 8S you have a maximal voltage of 33,2V (4,2V x 8) , it's too much. More power , but can the motor accept it? For 24V , 6S (=25,2V) is good....and with 6P you will have much more than 18,9A, except if you use computer cells (not the best for a motor) with 5A x 6P = 30A. For a motor , cells with low amperage are not the best because the internal resistance is higher and it's not good if the motor drains sometimes more amps against resistance...but with 6P it will run . A lot of E-bikes batteries have not more than 5A/cell...if they have minimum 4P .
It depends on the type and the use of your motor.
Hi Pavel, thanks for making these videos on battery building. They are awesome and have given me the confidence to build my first pack for an eBike. I have the same make of BMS with 2 blue and 2 black wires 52V 60A. I know you have removed one of the blue and one of the black wires as you do not use the BMS for discharge monitoring in your pack. For my eBike I do want to to have this feature. I can see each cable is labelled 10AWG. My question is about how I should wire the BMS - should I run one of the black C- wires to the charge -ve and the other black C- to the discharge -ve or do I join both black C- wires together and join them to an XT90 -ve and use the one XT90 for discharge and charging? Thanks for your help but I haven't been able to find an answer to this on searching the web of the manufacturers site.
Hi mate,
B- to battery negative
P- to load negative (esc)
C- to charge negative
Hope this helps.
@@PavelGarmas Thanks for the reply. This BMS, and the one you use in this video, does not have a P-ve. There are only 2 C- cables (black) and 2 B- cables (blue). Is the reason there are 2 black C- cables because the each cable can only handle 1/2 the BMS discharge current or because on black cable is for the charge -ve and the other for the discharge -ve?
@@jimhamilton7959
All depends if you got the old or new style of the unit. If exactly same as in my video then follow my earlier reply , if new then the charge and discharge are the same cables .
Can the Smart BMS’s be set up in a common port method like the Daly BMS’s? I have noticed on both your videos you have a separate charge and discharge port.
I do not use the discharge side of any BMS ...charge only. Did I get the question correctly?
@@PavelGarmas you did, I am curious as to why. I joined your group on Facebook and it seems like a lot of the batteries built there use a separate port for charging.
I understand the application of the batteries is different, but nobody (or very very few) building packs for what I am use a separate port for charging.
I guess I’m just not educated enough on BMS to know why people go one way or the other with their pack builds.
Hi Pawel.
I have ebike model MATE X-750W.
My battery 48V/14Ah fail.
Voltage battery output42V-when turn key to ignition position-drop to 0V.
BMS or bad cells ?What can i do?
Are you polish?
Pomocy prosze
Charge the battery full and test voltage of each P lines. Add the total : if you really have 48V with all P...and only 42V on the two main wires , the BMS is faulty. If you have only 42V when add all P, you have one P with issue (but you will see it by testing) .
And with ignition and drop to 0V : 2 options :
-One P is faulty, (cells issue) voltage too low and the BMS stops the current for protection
-all P are good , but a faulty BMS can do that : when switched on, it stops the negative current output (which runs across the BMS ; the positive runs direct from the battery to the motor controller)
So first of all control the voltage of each P line.
Thanks, great video, very informative. 👍
Glad it helped. Thank you for a nice comment.
How many 18650 was this build?
How 18650 lithium battery you need for 48v 15amp
All depends what cells are you using. 12S 7P battery for instance will need 84 cells. Take a look - ua-cam.com/video/IlVLbY7vw3s/v-deo.html
How could I reach you bro.... I wanna have a battery of 24 v 10ah ... help me.. please
Hi mate. You can reach me by emailing pavsreview@yahoo.com.
Thank you very much!
You're welcome!
Hi Mr Pavel Garmas, Can you build one 25.6Ah LG battery pack for vsett10+? And how much is it ?
Thanks.
Ps: I hope you can help me
Hi,
Unfortunately i do not build batteries for people.
Awesome video
Glad you enjoyed it
yo pavel, what do you think about a pool cover as insulation??
Never heard of that mate.
You could cover the middle 😊
Thank you
You're welcome
I clicked like after like 1:40.40 ... Great! Thanks
Great Great no words.
Thank you kindly.
Hi my friend how are you..?🙋♂️
I'm in a process to make my first powerful molicel battery pack...
But... I want your "lights "...
I'm going to buy them from e-kon..
Why molicel p42 capacity is 4000a?? Till now I know it was 4200a.. is Molicel change the capacity of battery p42..? I just want to confirm me that I will buy ORIGINAL molicel batteries..!!
Thanks again..!!🙇♂️
Hi mate ,
Nkon or Fogstar distributors are known and can be trusted.. P42 is 4200 mAmp cell.
Wonderful excellente You just got a new subscriber too
Awesome, thank you!
Excellent! Thank you.
You are welcome!
Thank you sir,very much
I clicked on "Like" after 1min 50 seconds,
Awesome 👌 thank you
Hay folks, did someone out of UK buy at "fogstar-wholesale" yet?
When I compare their prices with Nkon.nl or Akku-Teile.de the difference per cell is huge!
fogstar-wholesale - 4,37€
Nkon - 5,75€
Akku-Teile - 6,96€
@Pavel fogstar-wholesale sells new cells right?
Hi mate,
Yes, they are new cells and i have used them for the last two batteries that I have built. They do sell good nickel as well and it is really cheap. They can maintain good price because they do buy a very large quantities from factories.
By asking for discount directly to the supplier I received following price's by an order of 90 cells:
Fogstar-wholesale - did not reply
Nkon - 3,80€
Akku-Teile - 5€
I found something else interesting. I will may buy and use them for future projects: Metabo 20v 10ah powertoolpacks using probably Samsung INR21700-30T cells (-checking on that). They will deliver 80amp constant for 4mins until they will flip the overheating safety switch. Have a look by yourself:
You get 2x with a charger for around 330€ - ready to use for your tools and with a 3d printed slide for DIY projects: ua-cam.com/video/-g74ppz3NFA/v-deo.html
I just got the information from Metbo. They are using the Samsung INR21700-50S cells in their Metabo 10Ah packs
*nice video*
Thanks mate!
Yes friend so it's 😊
Nice vid👌👌👌
Cheers mate 👍
Hello friend Pete nice Christmas gift 🎁 package 😅
Sure is
It's negative and positive wire apart 😅😊
i know one needs to be careful the hard way!
True that. Hope you are ok.
alright Im off to make a 4p4s battery for a motorcycle
"S" - cells in Series
"P" - cells in Parallel
Correct. Did i make a mistake somwhere?
@@PavelGarmas No sir, its for the new-comers. They might not understand the meaning of the letters.
Yes sir ok😊
Ok.Bro..
Good luck...
Well...long story.
Thank you
Can you build me a battery?
Hi mate,
What battery are you after and where are you located?
@@PavelGarmas New York, looking for a triangle pack for an e-bike either 52/72v
Love the quality you put into your packs.
It's ok yes😅
again, kapton tape. for your viewers who go to try and find and buy some. not captain tape. makes it easier to search.
Thanks mate 👍 ... eleven the best make mistakes 😆
It changes from positive 😅
✌️💕
😎
Ok bought battery 🔋 are split 😊ok bought battery 🔋 are now one 😊