I know this is a old Video but i wanted to say ty. I own a 12 mustang 3.7. I was stumped New coils, plugs. Kept melting. I Watched your video Purchased a Noid light. It was PCM !!! My Mustang is more of a weekend / pick my 7 year old from school Car. My Daughter Hates Riding in our other Car the MiniVan. I Ordered 6 motorcraft DG520/ Sp520 plugs. Pcm be here Saturday. So excited. My lesson was changing my coils with cheap Amazon coils that shorted out, Causing it to back feed PCM. I decided to have CircuitBoardMedics fix it..
Hello, Glad you found the cause or your issue. It sucks your PCM is damaged, but at least you know you will be fixing it correctly! Thanks for reaching out and sharing your story! ~Ryan
Thank for your Great explanation Sir, your very knowledgable .... I AM A ASE CERTIFIED MECHANIC AND HAVE TAUGHT THIS IN TRADE SCHOOLS FOR 35 YEARS , AND I WILL ADMIT THAT NOT ONLY MYSELF BUT AMERICA DOES HATE FORD , ESPECIALLY TRUE MECHANICS !!!! THIS IS A SENSLESS NEEDLESS THING THAT HAS COST ITS CUSTOMERS MILLIONS ON IT AND FORD DID'NT GIVE A CRAP ! Ford should have made good on this and supplied its customers with free updated computers because of this ... i just had this problem on a one owner 2010 MKZ 3.5 and it nearly cost the elderly lady everything she had to have this repair done and i virtually did it for free labor... FREAKN FORD !!!!
Great video...sure it’s a lot of technical stuff....however now I know what the problem is . Pulled a coil out of a 2008 Mercury Sable, looked just like the melted coil you showed. Replaced the coil and all plugs...got OEM plugs. Yes, the car had the original plugs after 85, 000 miles (not really impressed with iridium) now after watching this video I realize that this may be deeper than a simple plug and coil replacement. I will probably contact the Ford dealer to find out if there was any recall on this problem. ....which I doubt. Replacing all plugs on this series engine is a PITA....thanks for the information.....now I know.
Eme nem, so you're telling me you found us on your travel into the rabbit hole? :) Thanks for watching and commenting! If you have any questions...don't hesitate to reach out! Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Bro u probably just save my 2004 dodge intrepid a trip to the junkyard. I had code's p0300 & p0304 your way of explaining how the coil works and what the wrong gap of a spark plug can do just saved the intrepid thank you I am a subscriber now
Just found you, great presentation style, now I have to go back and watch all your videos Keep up the good work, you’re as good as these guys with one million subscribers Looking forward to learning from u I’m a new hobby mechanic with a 01 trooper
The problem with this coil on plug design is that one ignition coil (primary winding - secondary winding) is assigned to each plug. If that setup (spark plug, etc) cannot discharge the stored energy in the coil / secondary winding, it will continue to build secondary energy until discharge or overheating occurs. This leads to higher current draw in the primary winding which can eventually destroy the delicate electronic circuitry of the spark plug driver circuits in the PCM (powertrain control module). Back in the "good ole days" of distributors you had one coil for a 4 , 6, or 8 cylinder engine. If one or more plugs did not fire properly and discharge the current in the coil secondary winding, there were other plugs that would discharge the energy. When distributors were made obsolete spark plugs were paired and fired together. Each cylinder had a spark plug that was paired with another cylinder 360 degrees out of phase firing order that would fire on its exhaust stroke. If one cylinder spark plug did not fire its mate would fire and discharge the energy in the coil and thus protect the coil from this type of failure. As others have mentioned engineering needs to add more current limiting software checks and diagnostics to prevent this expensive repair from happening with coil on plug ignition. Of course this type of failure typically happens after the 3 year - 36,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty expires and so the auto manufacturer is not responsible.
Hey ACarl, what is it that causes the coil not to be able to discharge it's energy? As the coil works harder, due to high secondary resistance it increases in heat, this heat leads to shorting of the coil winding, leading to lower resistance, leading to more amps through the PCM driver...which is what forces it to melt either open or closed to ground. As for engineering adding current limiting, many PCMs have it. This one did not. Also, newer smart coils (3-5 wire coils) take the heavy lifting away from the PCM. At that point it's simply a command signal between the coil and PCM really limiting any chance of failure inside the PCM. Thanks for watching and commenting! :) Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Mike, I was really surprised to see the design of this coil -- secondary coil connected to the PCM! Usually it is connected to ground, but here where does the secondary flyback go? To the battery positive through the primary -- and if not fast enough, zapping transistor in the PCM! IMHO, this circuitry is designed to fail when spark plug is disconnected or its gap is too large. Interested to hear your thoughts on this. Another point... is about the short-to-ground diagnostics. Isn't it possible that the suspect wire is touching another wire that, in turn, is grounded by the PCM? When you disconnect the PCM plug, the second wire loses ground, and the suspect wire becomes open loop. I know, it's highly unlikely, but it is just a debugger in me talking -- gotta enumerate all possibilities :) Thanks for a great video!
Hey Dmitriy, the secondary isn't really connected to the PCM. The primary coil is. Power flows into the primary at all times the key is on, PCM grounds and the primary builds a charge. PCM releases the ground and the charge has to find a path to ground. It jumps to the secondary windings, across the spark plug gap, through the block and back to battery negative. The PCM driver doesn't see that huge KV kick. That is true, if the PCM was holding a circuit to ground and the wire I was looking at was touching that one, sure its possible. But let me ask you this...are there any PCM circuits that will hold to ground inside the PCM with the key turned off? The PCM ground circuits sure, but anything else? Highly unlikely, but you are right, totally possible. So in this instance you would rip up the ENTIRE harness to verify its not touching somewhere in the middle? Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Mike, at 6:30 in the video the diagram seems to show a lead of secondary winding connected to a lead of the primary winding, then they go to the PCM. Can you confirm this? Under this assumption things can sometimes go really wrong -- I've done a circuit simulation, you can see it in just-posted video on my channel if you are interested. For the wiring integrity question, is it possible to connect to the corresponding pin at the PCM directly and check continuity to any of the PCM ground pins? That would be a bullet-proof test, but how cumbersome is it?' Thanks for taking the time to answer our questions! P.S. By the way, speaking about the wires, how are the test wires under your truck doing?
" . . . . But let me ask you this...are there any PCM circuits that will hold to ground inside the PCM with the key turned off? . . . . " Yes. Evaporative emissions system SMALL leak scenario will test with the ignition key in OFF position. The instructor has commented frequently about a FRONT DOOR and BACK DOOR to vehicle evaporative emissions systems. The BACK DOOR is the vent solenoid to the tank. The PCM will ground that vent solenoid valve for a short period of time after ignition set to OFF. A test can be run to check if the fuel tank, vapor lines and other components of the evaporative emissions control system will hold a vacuum for a certain period of time. These circuits are very low amperage (milliamp range) so no real threat to the PCM circuitry.
I was an ASE Certified Master Technician with training and certificates from Ford Motor Company in EEC, SBDS, and electrical systems for twenty years. I want to pay you compliments on your highly intelligent explanation on this particular processor, ignition coils, and spark plug operation. I was waiting for you to explain primary coil winding collapse to secondary high voltage winding, and you did. I would imagine the layperson was like, "Huh?" Again, my compliments to you and your knowledge.
No Problem. Thank You Guys again, times are hard you guys saved me hours of headache literally showed me how to test everything. Sounds funny but you guys made it idiot proof for me. My wife Laughed that I looked so professional and fixed it on the first Try...
Awesome video!!!!!!! I'm chasing a P0301 on a 2009 Escape w/2.5L and 178K miles. Found the spark plug well filled with oil, thought I had the cause in the bag. So with 178K miles and recognizing original parts I opted for 4 new Motorcraft DG-522 coils, 4 new Motorcraft SP-30 plugs and a new Fel-Pro valve cover gasket. STILL GETTING P0301 with cheap scanner tool counts in the hundreds per day. Going to look at a possible injector problem. Your video offered a LOT of insight to look at the PCM driver for cylinder 1. Can you offer any other pearls of wisdom?? Thank you!!!!!!!!
Hello Dale, Sounds like a fun diagnostic challenge! I would also check for valve leakage on 2.5L ford engines with higher mileage. Check out our video for more info ua-cam.com/video/Dzy-EzxIreg/v-deo.html . Ryan Wilsing, Technical Instructor
***important*** I had this exact issue with my 07 3.0L fusion. Remove your original spark plugs and save them!!!! When I got my new spark plugs to replace them I was given the part number of sp433, on the side they say agsf 32wm. I noticed the ones that were originally installed, said agsf 32n. These are a nickle spark plug and not a platinum. Your owners manual says to replace your platinum plugs at 100,000. These nickle plugs need to be replaced at 60,000. If you like almost every buyer ever, did not pull your plugs when you bought the vehicle, you would have never known to replace them at 60,000. Running these plugs after 60,000 would require more power to create the spark, causing your ignition coil to short, which in turn will fry your PCM. Mike's video above is completely valid and a great solution. But if you have your original plugs you may be able to get your Ford dealer to replace it at no cost to you or to be able to recoup your costs. I am currently working with my local dealer ship to try to have it taken care of and for them to put out a recall. If any lawyers know how to supoena the factory records of which spark plugs were installed on the factory line, your help would be much appreciated.
an one ownership vehicle ( maybe the factory originals were replaced )? A forum post with pictures of the Milan 3L/V6 factory original "32n" plugs ... www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/2812898/re-spark-plug-recommendations-3-0l-fusion-milan#Post2812898
@@unknownsaint86 - the 2011 Crown Vic uses the "32n" but Ford specified a 100K mile service interval. Another 2007 Fusion V6 with the 32n plugs ... ua-cam.com/video/C_kjRjqkECU/v-deo.html
this is absolutely the best explanation I've ever heard someone give . thank you very much I have a young friend that is starting a teaching career in the automotive business and I gave him your UA-cam page told him to watch because he could learn a lot from you . do you have a shop? And where are you located ?
Wow!!!! Mike you are Amazing. Clear, Concise diagnostics, love the troubleshooting method. Wish you had a shop here near me, Thank You and looking foward to more videos.
Sure, someday! The ECM watches crank speed and looks for excessive variations in the speed. If the crank slows down it's because the cylinder didn't fire. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining ok sir im glad you reply thank you so much I will wait....I am a filipino GM technician here in saudi arabia.....I always watch your videos Im one of your youtube subscribers...you have very technical explanation and I love to watched your videos....thank you so much godbless....
@@GoTechTraining I dont know how ecm know a specific cylinder mis....on 8 or 6 cylinders one or two mis...how ecm interprets inputs from cranks. And cam sensors to overcome dtc for specific cylinder....
I'm sure a lot of people put off changing the spark plugs because the upper intake has to be removed to access the rear bank. I can understand why engines like the GM 3.1, 3.4, and 3.8 had a separate ignition module from the PCM. In a worst-case scenario like this, the ICM is like a "sacrificial" module that would get destroyed, but the PCM would be saved. On those engines, the ICM is plug-and-play and requires no programming, so the repair is more cost-effective. In my opinion, older GM engineers were good at anticipating owner neglect of vehicles and designed them accordingly.
Joseph, that does make sense. Newer coils, smart coils, don't make the PCM do the heavy lifting anymore. So, it's less likely to get killed off by a coil. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
This is a great instructional video!. I have codes P0300, P0304, P0305, P0306, P0355, P0606. Coil 6 looks fine, No Noid light on cyl 6, If I connect my test light to the positive battery terminal, key off, I get a light on the grey wire across cyl's 4, 5, and 6. Not part of the diagnostic you did. ( I haven't looked at the rear bank yet. ) Is that normal? I do get the test light when connected to the negative battery terminal, key on, across the three GY wires as expected.
Hey Loren Jackson, If the GY wire is the same across all of the coils then that's most likely the main power feed. You should see power on that any time the key is on. The ground side is what controls the coil turning on and off. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Had similar problem with an fusion , cant remember the year at the moment but was early to mid 2000's , except the PCM driver on the car i was fixing was burnt open. Coil didnt show any visual sign of overheating though. I opened up pcm also and found same results , drive transistor was cooked .Problem was on one of the rear cylinders. By then ford had updated the coils and pcm . Very expensive repair !!
I had codes showing misfires on cylinders 2 and 4. The PCM tested faulty when swapping front coils, so I sent the PCM off to repair, and replaced all original (2005) spark plugs and coils. After replacing the upper intake, and checking for air leaks, it started right up. But now its starting to run rough. Bummer, I forgot to change PCV valve on the intake, so now I'll be back pulling the intake, replacing the PCV and any bad vaccum lines.
Hey Greg, smart to replace them all. How long did it take to get the PCM fixed and back? Sounds like a bit of a lengthy process. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
paint marker is used as a visual on the assembly line. each plug installer has their own color. when the plug (or bolt or fastener) is installed and torqued it is paint markered. thus eliminating problems with breaks.shift change lunch etc. if you see its not paint markered. you can stop the assembly line and correct it before it gets out the door
I was doing great diagnosing cyl 3 short to ground on my 2016 f150 3.5l non turbo using your vid. UNTIL about 12:45..... My ohm read high on cyl 3 and zero on know good cyl. You show the known good cyl should read HIGH and bad should read LOW. Then my brain exploded. Any thoughts on why I would read high on bad cyl and zero on known good?
Hi brother i have a ford fusion 2006 but the theft auto is on so the computer connection has no power I all ready checked the fuses but the r good do u have any idea how can I fix it ?
Yeah I was driving came to the house and when I tried to go somewhere it stopped working and like a week later star whit no problem and then later a week after stopped working again
I have 2009 Ford escape 3.0l . P0304 code . Changed spark plugs , 98,000 km I have & they’ve never been changed. 6. Cylinder spark plug was full inside and around coils of spark plug ? After changing only front 3 spark plugs 4,5,6 and swapping ignition coils etc the new spark plug cylinder 6 full of oil inside and around coil part . Why am I not getting a P0306 code ??? Engine light flashing when leave at 1500 rpm for 30-45 seconds. After at idle rpms the engine light stops flashing? Assuming oil is coming up at higher rpm and dropping at normal rpm ? Any advice TIA no fuel etc odour no white , dark smoke ? TIA
Good logic. Good idea to test for a shorted pcm. I like your testing with a filament bulb to draw real current. But we can't really read your multimeter.
Just an FYI. Because Ford knows there’s a problem, they offer a kit which includes; six coils, six spark plugs, upper plenum and throttle body gasket for around $275.
Cel po448 on 2006 subie sti had po442 and po456 cleared those .replaced purge control valve and charcoal canister found break in a vacuum hose all set except for annoying po448 code . I'll eventually fiqure it .your videos are helping.worst case it my be the pcm. No worries
Hey Lex Tr3, thanks for watching! The parts numbers for an 08 Fusion 3.0L are...PTR5C-13 for the spark plug and U5294 for the ignition coils. Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Hello, I need your help, I change ECU in Ford escape 2004 V6, I put ecu for mandatory tribute, and the car started, I find out cylinder 2 and 6 doesn't working, my question is : can the ECU I changed can affect the cylinder others cylinders do not work?
2016 Ford Explorer here....how do I know if I have a PCM or an ECM? I know this is an older video, but we have the exact same problem. Number 6 coil pack melted/cracked....check engine light came on.
Hi Sophie, I think a 2016 is new enough that the PCM would protect itself from failure...but in the event that it hasn't you'd want to perform the testing shown in this video to determine if the PCM is doing it's job. The set up is the same as this car if your Explorer is the non-turbo...meaning one wire should have power on it when the ignition is turned on. The other wire should only be grounding when the vehicle is running. If it's grounded all the time then either the wire between the coil and PCM is shorted to ground of the PCM driver is shorted to ground, like what happened on this Fusion. ~Mike
I had this happen today after a timing chain replacement I did on my 2013 ecoboost. I have no coil drivers on any coil now, and only cylinder 2 shorted, is it possible to short out all drivers from one shorted coil? I am a mechanic and i have tested everything you have tested. all grounds were reinstalled after the timing chain job and are strong... no wires seem to be damaged..
My eco boost mustang blew a spark plug “cracked in half” and it started a long journey into my PCM failing. Over the last 2 years it has been intermittently misfiring more and more until now that it can not be driven.
So my car is running perfectly again. I hade a damaged connector on the coil pack wire. New pigtail installed and car is running great again. Now I can schedule my car for a tune.
Professor Mike performing his macarena dance moves 6:53. Pink paint on the end of the spark plug is a good tip, thanks for sharing. haha Another great job with the vid Mr. Becker!
Did you build the car under the parts tab? After that you should see the firing order tab that you can click on. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I build the car under the parts tab as per above video. Including Year 2012-Ford-Fusion-V6 3.0 181cid. After that I cound not found the Firing Order in the list. I only see Filter, Fuel Injection System & Component, Fuel Storage, and then HVAC. There is no Firing Order on the list.
Hey, that's odd. You are right. We don't have it listed for that year/make/model. Email me! I'll get it to you. Michael.Becker@wellsve.com Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
PLEASE....I NEED HELP. 2012 FORD FUSION 3.0 WITH NO COMM, NO CRANK, NO START. THE PCM RELAY IS NOT WAKING UP. IF I GIVE GROUND TO THE PCM RELAY, THE CAR PCM WAKES UP. I BELIEVE IT IS NOT RECEIVING AN IGNITION SIGNAL? ANY IDEAS? PLEASE HELP THANK YOU IN ADVANCE.
I have a misfire on cylinder 1, also getting code for primary/secondary A, saw that coil for cylinder 1 was melted so I replaced all coils and spark plugs but still melted new coil on cylinder 1, any idea what’s happening?
I had a very similar issue with a Triton V-10. Loss of power, entire right bank. No change when removing one or all of the plug wires but it idled very smoothly. Found ground when checking wiring from coil pack to PCM (multiple cylinders). Finally pulled plug on pcm and ground went away. Turned out to be a shorted power transistor shorting the switching for the bank, making it impossible to build up a charge. Unfortunately, I was unable to identify the correct replacement transistor so I replaced the entire PCM and coil packs. All is well.
Hi Mike. I like thousands of others have had this problem with my 07 Ford fusion sel 3.0 L. I just started having this problem and replaced the faulty coils and plugs. Should I try clearing my PCM before I remove it and send it out to be repaired? Wonderful video and explanations. Keep up the great work.
Hey J Rod, sure you can try to perform a clearing of the PCM. It may or may not work. Maybe you caught it early enough and everything will be ok? Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Did you ever get the pcm repaired? Any idea of what that costs? I have an 07 SE 3.0L and should probably replace coils and plugs. Dont want anything to happen. 135k miles
Hey Andre, thanks for watching! I purchased the PCM from my local dealer. I then flashed it using my Autel J-2534 box that came with my Autel Elite scanner and used Ford's software that I purchased through Motorcraft service. Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Thanks for the info. My Brother has it at the dealer now after a shop changed all the plugs and coils and still had a miss fire. Im waiting now to see if they checked the pcm. Your video was on point and exact. 👍
Could not agree more about the spark plugs.It is often an item that can do untold damage to the system. A lot of car owners will only call for a replacement when the engine gives trouble and then it's too late. The price of 6 coils , 1 pcm and labour against the price of 6 sparkplugs is really a no brainer. Like the final look at the pcm electronics.
Ford was aware of this problem and the potential for thousands of damaged PCM's, soon after most warrenties were expiring. Fearing fall out or possible recall they extended warrenties on plug coil packs to 8 yrs or 80, 000 miles but only if original owner, or some shit. Pre PCM damage. The fact that no one has died or been seriously injured can only be explained by lack of reporting because most mechanics didn't know. Repairing coil packs & plugs doesn't fix it. That's a guess based on mechanics early findings. $900, all new coils & plugs. Still replacing sensors, charging batteries, chasing dummy lights and parasitic draws. But what do I know? I'm just a woman that started looking into the problem online. There's not enough people doing that to get the class action suit off the ground but there is an established real safety concern in the 100's of accounts, like mine, on nhs tab page. Where the car loses power, at random, at 70 mph on the highway, making a left hand turn, merging into traffic, crossing an intersection, while in the wilderness. Losing power to your 2 ton, deadliest machine known to human kind, iis negligent & criminal . Because in Ford's own words. It starts to be a problem after warranty. Even some of Ford s own are too prideful or lazy to dig deeper. After explaining my situation and still experiencing 4 of 5 symptoms laid out in TSB. I broke & paid the $145 diagnostic fee (credited towards repair😕) at Ford dealer . AGAIN, I explained my findings after the $900 repair with the local mechanic didn't work. They got my diagnosis fee & nothing more. Shameful. After looking at their estimate of over $400 to replace the FRPS. Just another sensor gone bad. That's what their computer said . When I asked if they would be willing to stand by that repair & give me 3 months warranty. If I was to throw another sensor in that time, they would do PCM repair for 1/2 price. They laughed at the stupid middle aged, single mom driving a 2005 vehicle and expecting it to get me over 100k miles before major repair . Maybe pass it down to my daughter. Like my mom had done for me. I did a quick look up & watched a couple videos of awesome mechanics, like these, on you tube. $32.00, 2 screws, lube and 10 minutes later I HAD FIXED IT MYSELF . Growing up in Michigan, with a families small business able to provide my brother & I college efucations. I was taught to buy local from your neighbors or the companies they worked for that PAID taxes & were invested in your community. That you may pay a little more than at large super stores. But it will come back full circle. Those days are gone, I'm afraid. Our entire landscape is s forever changed. This is the 5th Ford SUV in my 4 decades of driving. This the first that wasn't handed down to me by a 5000 mile a year mom. I did my research, I'd thought. KBB, FORD FORUMS, CARFAX, CONSUMERS REPORT, ETC This is highlighted on only one sight giving ratings on used cars. (I'm trying to change that). I wasn't nor were my daughter's, taken for their driver's test until they knew how to change a tire, check & add fluids, and demonstrate safety checks before road trips. I drove 50,000 miles a year, for 20 years. Each if the 4 previous models I proudly sold, over 150,000 miles, running like a top. Wear & tear but some of us go for the no payments, low insurance costs by choice or need, and find it worth the low cost, out of pocket, maintenance. To not worry about going over our lease miles or repo man if sick for a week. Like so many things these days ....profits have preceeded pride in Corporate America. Make a car that lasts over 100k with regular maintenance. Is just bad for the bottom line anymore. Disposable economy is destroying trust & good will, not to mention the planet. Sorry for the rant. After a worry free 3 months (keeping track of miles on odo cuz obd doesn't match reality) or computer unable to clear code. What code? Oh, that 2as last month . No codes this week. But am again without transportation for 48 hours while I trickle charge the completely dead battery. That I now must disconnect every night or parasite will deplete it again. I can't get a good feel for if throwing more money, in the way of junkyard or flashed unit can work? It's my understanding that reprogramming software is notoriously tricky and or a gamble. But then I saw where an updated release of the software was made available just Dec. 22, 2021. Idk if license required but just ss
Hello, Mike. As usual, nice presentation and very informative. I am trying to understand why you get ground with the battery disconnected and also if the positive battery cable is shorted to ground, is the engine block becomes power and causes spark at the negative battery cable when you try to connect it? As the negative now becomes shorted. Thank you.
Hey Carlo, thanks for watching! When the battery is disconnected we no longer have "ground." I believe you are talking about the OHM test to "ground." All that is doing is showing there is a path for flow to what is normally ground. If the positive cable were shorted to ground you would melt something or possibly even start a fire. Direct shorting the positive cable to ground essentially turns it into a welder. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Thank you for replying, Mike. The reason I asked about the positive cable is that one tech installed a starter and the positive cable at the starter touched ground, resulting in spark at the negative battery cable. I was just trying to understand how you get sparks at the negative battery terminal from a shorted positive cable. Thanks again!
Sparks can happen anytime you have a connection issue in the circuit. The positive and negative cable both pass the current. A circuit is a circle...you can get sparks in any part of it because the current is constant through the circle. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I have a 2007 Mercury Mariner and had a front right cylinder coil that burned and the maintenance facility changed out all 6 coil, plugs and computer. A couple of months later had the same problem. Could there be a short or some other kind of a problem that’s killing the computer and burning out that same coil? Thanks
Hey Larry, that's not good! The spark plugs were the proper plugs? Coils, plugs, and a NEW computer should fix it. Make sure they installed a good new computer with the most recent software updates. It's possible that a remanufactured computer could have some issues maybe. Just my guess. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Wells Vehicle Electronics. Thanks mike. They did try a different computer and have the same results. Would it be worthwhile to move the vehicle to another facility that would have diagnostic capability to check out the wiring. Thanks
Love all the detail you show! Always good to think deeper into WHY things happen to apply it down the road in other systems. Burning up expensive parts isn't good!
I have a 06 mariner with 3.0 I have misfire in the number 3 I replaced the coil and spark plug but still misfire in the same cylinder what else can be? And the engine is not idling roughly
Can this happen to ford's 2.5L engine? It's basically the same wiring diagram design with only 4 coils So to avoid this we should get the spark plugs changed before they completely wear. How about changing coils after hitting a milestone even when they are still ok I'm thinking about this to be safe. After 120k for example
I'm having the same problem this is the first time it gave a code for anything. on my 2001 Ford mustang gt I have a my code is p0355 I did all the test when I connected my noid light than started the car the cylinder 5 hardness there was ground no pulse could that be a large change the PCM is done for.
Hey Makinson480, it's possible the PCM has been friend but it wasn't a super common thing on that 4.6L. If the noid light didn't flash then you'll want to verify power there and then go after the ground side. Maybe you just have a broken wire somewhere? Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining my friend dad found out what happened to my mustang the spark plug was bad that caused the coil to fail making the ECU stop sending ground pulse to it so he bought a coil then checked the spark plug the gap was 0.063. So when we put the new spark plug plus and the coil cylinder 5 no more code car back to normal. Thanks you your video help me save my car.
Awesome! Sounds like the PCM stopped control of the coil once it recognized there was an issue...it saved itself. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I have a Lincoln zephyr 2006 and I found a misfire on cyl.1 I took it apart and found a melted coil .I. check voltage and it has battery voltage 14.volts on one wire.but I check the other side and it has ground and I check the other coils and doesn't have that ground .so my question is that ground shouldn't not have. To be present on the wire all the time..? It's a pcm problem?
Hey, that's exactly right. Sounds like a short to ground in the PCM. Key on engine off you should NOT have ground going to that coil. If you do, you have a short to ground in either the wire going to the PCM or more likely inside the PCM just like I showed in this video. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Matt, a drain on a battery can cause it to prematurely fail...but just to clarify, the power is only fed to the ignition coil with the key on or car running. If this was supplying power at all times(key off) the car would have likely burned to the ground. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I did the testing and then replaced the plugs and coils all 6 started ran better but rough sent out pcm to circuit board medics for repair and they fixed for 199 but said I would have to put all new coil and plugs in or it would not be warranted, I only ran for maybe 1 minute, is it your opinion that this small amount of time would have ruined my coils is there a way of checking these before I put this pcm back in.
Hey, A shorted PCM could cause a coil to fry incredibly quickly. If you want a warranty, i'd suggest you follow their instructions. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great video. Doesn’t look like ford really identifies the cause. I agree with your hypothesis with the coil first thing to go bad but ford should give a reason.
You're right, it doesn't really put a nail in the coffin of what is the CORE cause. I wish they would, but we can only deal with the information at hand. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
We experienced this on our 03 Ford Escape 3.0L V6 but worst case scenario. Engine harness are melted and also the FICM (Fuel Injection Control Module) harness, Coil packs fried, PCM malfuntion (not letting the OBDII scanner diagnose/read errors execpt the pending/saved codes before the PCM lost everything), Alternator with regulator fried, saved error codes are throttle body sensor, coolant temp sensor, Transmission shift solenoid error and idle air control valve error. To this day 2023 we're changing parts from harnesses and all the mentioned parts that failed got replaced and now we're installing new coils and spark plugs before putting a new PCM on the way. The engine harness near the exhaust probably started it and this 1st gen Escapes had flimsy and skinny grounding wires we replaced and that crappy battery terminal with quality gauge 2 wires with quick disconnect terminals. We also retapped the threads of body grounding locations like everything from engine to body, transmission to body, alternator and battery grounding, the head lights, and inside the cabin grounding down the passenger side lower peeler panel. This is a well known problems with this 3.0L V6 we got ours the worst and made our research a bit too late 😢😢
had codes P0353 and P0355 on a 2009 escape. replaced both coils, cleared codes but some of the codes showed as permanent. I guess this means the pcm disabled these coils from firing? it started yesterday morning. I left the driveway, no issue, by the time i got 200 feet away, the car lost power shuddered and stalled out. restarted, and got the traditional car with ignition problems shuttering and was able to back it into driveway, barely. pulled codes above, and replaced both coils, then i watched a couple videos that mentioned the pcm possibly wiped out, and also, that you can clear the pcm possibly, and it may or may not work. i had cable disconnected during repairs, put it back on, cleared codes. when i started it, it ran a little rough and codes came back. is it possible that the codes still were because of the permanent ones and pcm may be able to be cleared? how is the best way to clear the pcm to test before i go buy another pcm. I can install it myself, but if it must be programmed by a dealer (maybe other shops can do this now i dont know) i might just let them do it and be done with it. also means i need to scrape up money for a new pcm and the other coils. things never happen at a good time financially i guess. thanks
Hey Chessie, a code reader should be able to clear those codes no problem. If they don't clear, it's because it's failing the test as soon as you turn the key on and resetting the code. Best bet would be to test and verify the PCM driver operation. From there, if it is the PCM, then yes it will need to be programmed by a shop with those capabilities. Good luck! Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining i believe thats what happened. I left the driveway got 200 ft and suddenly the car shuddered and shut off. When i got it restarted, it ran rough like it wanted to stall again. Then it threw the codes. I made it back to the driveway and scanned it. Both p035x codes were showing. I figured with no previous car issues and suddenly this happening to two coils was odd but i changed both and it ran without shutting off but still very rough. So i think as you determined, the driver burnt up. Does one driver control 3&5 coils? I tested and have reference voltage to light a test light when hooking the test light to ground. Its not lighting up bright but it is lighting up a 12v test light. The coils arent melted , its a 2009 ford escape v6 btw.
So the each coil has an individual driver inside the PCM. You should have 12v power to the coils whenever the key is on. The ground side is what is being controlled by the PCM. You'll need to check and see if that's working, or shorted to ground. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Fernando, you're talking with just the key on, right? Not while it's running? The test light is used to check to see if the driver for the PCM is shorted to ground. Key on, engine off the light should not be lit. If that is the case, then yes, i'd just do coils/plugs, the PCM isn't shorted to ground. It is possible it is open circuited though. I'd look for the test light to flash to show control when the engine is running. Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Hey Leo, thanks for watching. The 6 pack coil is a little bit different..that uses waste spark, so there's only 3 control circuits going back to the PCM there. Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Great video. I have an 06 escape with cylinder 2 and 4 misfiring. Can't get to #2 but on number 4 I back probed the control wire with test light to ground and no pulsation. #5 and #6 pulsate when doing the same test. If the same test is done at the pcm connector and the result is the same can I call the pcm?
Hey, yeh that should be correct. We are talking ignition, right? Fuel injectors can be tested the same way...but it's possible the PCM shuts injectors off. You may want to clear codes and try the test again...in case the PCM shut off the coil driver due to the misfire code. I'm pretty sure on these that the driver keeps grounding even with a code...but it never hurts to be thorough. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I don't think the 906bt is able to. You need a J2534 tool to program the PCM and Ford software. I know the Autel Elite comes with the J-box...not sure about the 906. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Hmmm I don't think I have anything specific to coil testing at this time. I will get something together soon it that topic. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I replaced my coil and spark plug and the Code P0353 is still here. Any help? I'm tired of getting 12.6 mpg and all of the other issues with a misfire.
If í put car on drive, bank 2 reads low contribution -30 or so. New sparks, new coil, but only happens on drive or hard acceleration.. the only code that show up is p2197 there's a new o2 sensor. What else?
Hey. something is causing the engine to run rich, or at least think that it's running rich. You'll have to look into everything that can force an engine rich. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Hey Enrique, yes the PCM needs to be programmed upon installation. This requires either a dealer scan tool or a J-2534 box with the Ford subscription. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Does this solves the problem with misfire cylinder 1 problem on 2010 ford fusion hybrid? Because my shows misfire cylinder 1 as a critical problem in my car.
Alvaro, could be a lot of things. It's possible that the injector isn't working because the computer shut it down. If you clear codes, does the injector function for a few seconds? Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Question:IF there is a TSB for this type of thing (i.e. a known problem) like you found in this case, will the manufacturer cover any of the cost? (especially when they sort of admit they have a problem by coming out with a new revision ECU - which I assume eliminates the problem).
Great question Dave, a TSB is a form or reference material and is VERY different that a recall. Generally there is not covering the cost related to TSBs....but some will offer extended warranties...it depends on the issue and the manufacturer. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Sad. Especially when dealers probably use the problem as a cash cow. I'm sure they don't say anything to customers about it being a potential issue and just wait for the problems to come in the door and collect the bucks.Thanks for the great video.
You're right, it is sad...hopefully this video helps people to understand just how important that preventative maintenance is! Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I presume this is only a problem with the two wire coils where the ECU drives them directly. And not three (or more?) wire where the driver is in the coil??? Great video. Thanks Mike.
thanks for the video Mike. At what point would Ford replace the PCM as a recall? which they probably wouldn't do for somebody that went 35,000 miles overdue on the plugs but say it happened on a vehicle that was properly maintained? Thanks again.
I have the same issue on injector 6 ran the ohm test as you suggested numbers on 6 4 and 2 numbers going crazy as shown in your video as well. Disconnected connector to pcm all were showing OL. Only issue that has me scratching my head is that the coil pack on cyl 6 is perfectly fine no burns or signs of melting. Do you think it’s possible that cyl 6 injector itself is the issue? I will swap cyl 6 and cyl 4 to see if cyl 6 is the issue tomorrow. Thoughts or suggestions? Vehicle is a 2010 Fusion 3.0 V6.
Hey Egonzo, it's possible you could have coil failure without a bad driver and the coil looking fine. Swapping should confirm it for you. Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Hello Mike. I know you may be familiar with Toyota, Lexus, Nissan and Infinity 3 and 4 wire coils. I believe if the IGT is shorted to ground, the pcm driver controlling the coil driver may take a hit. How about if you wrongly install the IGT wire into the ground wire slot (pin), will the pcm driver take a hit in this case? I am looking forward to your video tomorrow.
Hey Carlos, my guess would be the IGT circuit would end up in self protection mode. I'd guesstimate that the PCM driver would survive. Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Is this only for 3.0 L's or no? Because My 2014 Ford Fusion 1.5L is having a similar issue. But I dont see any melted Ignition coils. I replaced all spark plugs, and the code was still there for P0302 & 0304. I really hope its just the ignition coils. I have ordered new ones
Hey Tony, I don't believe the problem was prevalent on the 1.5L. Theres a ton of things that can cause a misfire. Ignition is just one of the necessary pieces of the puzzle. Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Hi, Thanks for sharing. I have a Question that maybe could be a silly doubt. I have a MAzda tribute 2005, same like FORD escape 3.0 engine and the coil #4 is completely burned, with smoke and everything twice. What kind of failure could burn the same coil twice? Should I replace the PCM? or just put another coil there from different brand or quality? Thanks again.
Hey George, could be an inferior design coil. Did you replace the spark plug? That's usually what causes it. Grab an NGK coil and throw it in there. You won't be disappointed. U5060 is the part #. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Thanks, was the signal wire defective, making contact with ground in some positions. Replace this wire from PCM plug (Green and purple Cilynder 4) and ready to go.
Fixed with your advice. Green purple wire was making ground intermitent when I move with engine off. Replace that wire from PCM plug straight to coil and now run perfect!? Thanks, I owe you one!
I was an ASE Certified Master Technician with training and certificates from Ford Motor Company in EEC, SBDS, and electrical systems for twenty years. I want to pay you compliments on your highly intelligent explanation on this particular processor, ignition coils, and spark plug operation. I was waiting for you to explain primary coil winding collapse to secondary high voltage winding, and you did. I would imagine the layperson was like, "Huh?" Again, my compliments to you and your knowledge.
I agree with what you say, but people who don't know how a coil produces high voltage shouldn't be working on cars. That is one of the most fundamental pieces of knowledge.
Just got done doing this job. Took it to the dealer to get the keys programmed to the new pcm and they told me the pcm is sending voltage to the throttle body causing the throttle body to stay in one position, resulting in a no start. The tech said he didn't believe it was the throttle body because he tested it and it was working normal. I got another pcm, installed it and they said the same thing. What's the likelihood of receiving a faulty pcm twice? I dunno where to go from here
Hey BigRidge, something doesn't add up here. Why is the throttle sticking open? Is the pedal position sensor sending a nopen request? I highly highly doubt you have multiple new bad PCMs. I'd look somewhere else...i'd also maybe look at a different shop. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Hey there, watched this video and I’m having a slightly different issue than you are. My vehicle was bought at auction with two misfires, on cylinders 4&5. I replaced coil and plugs on all cylinders to be safe, with none of my coils having any signs of being burned/worn out and I am still throwing a code for cylinder 5 and misfiring hard. On the test light test, my cylinder 5 is still having issues. The lead at the battery negative to the green colored insert, equivalent of the purple connector on cylinder 6, has a light on connection identical to your testing. My problem is that my ohm testing doesn’t show the same signs that yours did and doesn’t have any sign of continuity on my problem cylinder. What would you recommend from this point if anything?
Eric, thanks for watching! I think you're saying that the ground side control wires for coil 5 and 6 are both shorted to ground. Is that correct? the short can be a direct short from harness to ground or internal to the PCM. If the light still lights with the PCM disconnected then your short is not in the PCM. Make sense? Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
NGK Technical Training Hey Mike, only mentioned cylinder 6 since it was the one that you were testing and wanted to make sure people could know which wire on my coil connection that I was talking about! My only issue is cylinder 5. I don’t think that I was thorough in my testing before commenting, after going back and trying again I’m now replicating the issue that you received on your scenario with your ohm testing, which has me believing it is the PCM for my vehicle. Thanks for the excellent video and incredible detail!
Eric, awesome! Glad you were able to get to the bottom of it. Remember that the PCM needs to be programmed and you need 2 keys at the time of programming as well. Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
New to your channel. I have a question. What if instead of it having power to the coil I am getting no power to the coil. Would this be the same problem with the pcm or a bad wire to the coil. Thanks
Finally a guys who knows how to use common sense diagnostic "flow" methods...... nicely done !!!! GR
This is absolutely one of the best auto repair channels on YT. I'm slowly working my way through all of your videos.
Wow Bgregg55, that's very nice to say. Thank you very much!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Probably one of the best diagnostic and repair video I've ever found on UA-cam! Great job!
Ahhh, it's like I always say, "The better you maintain a vehicle, the less you repair it". Great job as always Mike. Thanks for your time
That's so very true! Maintenance is cheap compared to repairs. Pay me now, or pay me MORE later! :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
It's not cheap Al, I would call a shop and ask for a quote on this. Everyone labor rate is different.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Pure simplicity and absolute logic always show the way, far past a simple OBD code. Nice work!
Hey Monkey Wrench, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I know this is a old Video but i wanted to say ty. I own a 12 mustang 3.7. I was stumped New coils, plugs. Kept melting. I Watched your video Purchased a Noid light. It was PCM !!! My Mustang is more of a weekend / pick my 7 year old from school Car. My Daughter Hates Riding in our other Car the MiniVan. I Ordered 6 motorcraft DG520/ Sp520 plugs. Pcm be here Saturday. So excited. My lesson was changing my coils with cheap Amazon coils that shorted out, Causing it to back feed PCM. I decided to have CircuitBoardMedics fix it..
Hello,
Glad you found the cause or your issue. It sucks your PCM is damaged, but at least you know you will be fixing it correctly!
Thanks for reaching out and sharing your story!
~Ryan
Always enjoy ur thorough common sense explanation of a complicated diag and repair, ur the best and thanks for posting
Hey Mark, thanks! You're the best for watching and support our channel. Thanks!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Thank for your Great explanation Sir, your very knowledgable .... I AM A ASE CERTIFIED MECHANIC AND HAVE TAUGHT THIS IN TRADE SCHOOLS FOR 35 YEARS , AND I WILL ADMIT THAT NOT ONLY MYSELF BUT AMERICA DOES HATE FORD , ESPECIALLY TRUE MECHANICS !!!! THIS IS A SENSLESS NEEDLESS THING THAT HAS COST ITS CUSTOMERS MILLIONS ON IT AND FORD DID'NT GIVE A CRAP ! Ford should have made good on this and supplied its customers with free updated computers because of this ... i just had this problem on a one owner 2010 MKZ 3.5 and it nearly cost the elderly lady everything she had to have this repair done and i virtually did it for free labor... FREAKN FORD !!!!
Great video...sure it’s a lot of technical stuff....however now I know what the problem is . Pulled a coil out of a 2008 Mercury Sable, looked just like the melted coil you showed. Replaced the coil and all plugs...got OEM plugs. Yes, the car had the original plugs after 85, 000 miles (not really impressed with iridium) now after watching this video I realize that this may be deeper than a simple plug and coil replacement. I will probably contact the Ford dealer to find out if there was any recall on this problem. ....which I doubt. Replacing all plugs on this series engine is a PITA....thanks for the information.....now I know.
Ran across the video while surfing the channels. Great job communicating the process.
Eme nem, so you're telling me you found us on your travel into the rabbit hole? :) Thanks for watching and commenting! If you have any questions...don't hesitate to reach out!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Thank You. I'm impressed both by the depth of knowledge and the very very well put together presentation.
Thank you very much BlackManOps!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Bro u probably just save my 2004 dodge intrepid a trip to the junkyard. I had code's p0300 & p0304 your way of explaining how the coil works and what the wrong gap of a spark plug can do just saved the intrepid thank you I am a subscriber now
This guy is a Master Mechanic with a capital M - no doubt! Thanks for a the information.. I learned so much from your video
Thanks Douglas! Glad the video was able to help :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Just found you, great presentation style, now I have to go back and watch all your videos
Keep up the good work, you’re as good as these guys with one million subscribers
Looking forward to learning from u
I’m a new hobby mechanic with a 01 trooper
Hey Kevin, thanks for watching! I really appreciate the kind words. Maybe someday i'll see a million haha!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
The problem with this coil on plug design is that one ignition coil (primary winding - secondary winding) is assigned to each plug. If that setup (spark plug, etc) cannot discharge the stored energy in the coil / secondary winding, it will continue to build secondary energy until discharge or overheating occurs. This leads to higher current draw in the primary winding which can eventually destroy the delicate electronic circuitry of the spark plug driver circuits in the PCM (powertrain control module).
Back in the "good ole days" of distributors you had one coil for a 4 , 6, or 8 cylinder engine. If one or more plugs did not fire properly and discharge the current in the coil secondary winding, there were other plugs that would discharge the energy. When distributors were made obsolete spark plugs were paired and fired together. Each cylinder had a spark plug that was paired with another cylinder 360 degrees out of phase firing order that would fire on its exhaust stroke. If one cylinder spark plug did not fire its mate would fire and discharge the energy in the coil and thus protect the coil from this type of failure.
As others have mentioned engineering needs to add more current limiting software checks and diagnostics to prevent this expensive repair from happening with coil on plug ignition. Of course this type of failure typically happens after the 3 year - 36,000 mile bumper to bumper warranty expires and so the auto manufacturer is not responsible.
Hey ACarl, what is it that causes the coil not to be able to discharge it's energy? As the coil works harder, due to high secondary resistance it increases in heat, this heat leads to shorting of the coil winding, leading to lower resistance, leading to more amps through the PCM driver...which is what forces it to melt either open or closed to ground.
As for engineering adding current limiting, many PCMs have it. This one did not. Also, newer smart coils (3-5 wire coils) take the heavy lifting away from the PCM. At that point it's simply a command signal between the coil and PCM really limiting any chance of failure inside the PCM. Thanks for watching and commenting! :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Mike, I was really surprised to see the design of this coil -- secondary coil connected to the PCM! Usually it is connected to ground, but here where does the secondary flyback go? To the battery positive through the primary -- and if not fast enough, zapping transistor in the PCM! IMHO, this circuitry is designed to fail when spark plug is disconnected or its gap is too large. Interested to hear your thoughts on this.
Another point... is about the short-to-ground diagnostics. Isn't it possible that the suspect wire is touching another wire that, in turn, is grounded by the PCM? When you disconnect the PCM plug, the second wire loses ground, and the suspect wire becomes open loop. I know, it's highly unlikely, but it is just a debugger in me talking -- gotta enumerate all possibilities :) Thanks for a great video!
Hey Dmitriy, the secondary isn't really connected to the PCM. The primary coil is. Power flows into the primary at all times the key is on, PCM grounds and the primary builds a charge. PCM releases the ground and the charge has to find a path to ground. It jumps to the secondary windings, across the spark plug gap, through the block and back to battery negative. The PCM driver doesn't see that huge KV kick.
That is true, if the PCM was holding a circuit to ground and the wire I was looking at was touching that one, sure its possible. But let me ask you this...are there any PCM circuits that will hold to ground inside the PCM with the key turned off? The PCM ground circuits sure, but anything else? Highly unlikely, but you are right, totally possible. So in this instance you would rip up the ENTIRE harness to verify its not touching somewhere in the middle?
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Mike, at 6:30 in the video the diagram seems to show a lead of secondary winding connected to a lead of the primary winding, then they go to the PCM. Can you confirm this? Under this assumption things can sometimes go really wrong -- I've done a circuit simulation, you can see it in just-posted video on my channel if you are interested.
For the wiring integrity question, is it possible to connect to the corresponding pin at the PCM directly and check continuity to any of the PCM ground pins? That would be a bullet-proof test, but how cumbersome is it?'
Thanks for taking the time to answer our questions!
P.S. By the way, speaking about the wires, how are the test wires under your truck doing?
" . . . . But let me ask you this...are there any PCM circuits that will hold to ground inside the PCM with the key turned off? . . . . "
Yes. Evaporative emissions system SMALL leak scenario will test with the ignition key in OFF position. The instructor has commented frequently about a FRONT DOOR and BACK DOOR to vehicle evaporative emissions systems. The BACK DOOR is the vent solenoid to the tank. The PCM will ground that vent solenoid valve for a short period of time after ignition set to OFF. A test can be run to check if the fuel tank, vapor lines and other components of the evaporative emissions control system will hold a vacuum for a certain period of time. These circuits are very low amperage (milliamp range) so no real threat to the PCM circuitry.
I was an ASE Certified Master Technician with training and certificates from Ford Motor Company in EEC, SBDS, and electrical systems for twenty years. I want to pay you compliments on your highly intelligent explanation on this particular processor, ignition coils, and spark plug operation. I was waiting for you to explain primary coil winding collapse to secondary high voltage winding, and you did. I would imagine the layperson was like, "Huh?" Again, my compliments to you and your knowledge.
Hey Patrick, thanks for watching! I really appreciate you taking the time to comment!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
A good example of why you always check tsbs! More importantly you still tested the circuit. good diag!
Exactly! Test don't guess :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Thanks!
Thanks so much for the generous support to our channel! We really appreciate it!
~Mike
No Problem. Thank You Guys again, times are hard you guys saved me hours of headache literally showed me how to test everything. Sounds funny but you guys made it idiot proof for me. My wife Laughed that I looked so professional and fixed it on the first Try...
Awesome video!!!!!!! I'm chasing a P0301 on a 2009 Escape w/2.5L and 178K miles. Found the spark plug well filled with oil, thought I had the cause in the bag. So with 178K miles and recognizing original parts I opted for 4 new Motorcraft DG-522 coils, 4 new Motorcraft SP-30 plugs and a new Fel-Pro valve cover gasket. STILL GETTING P0301 with cheap scanner tool counts in the hundreds per day. Going to look at a possible injector problem. Your video offered a LOT of insight to look at the PCM driver for cylinder 1. Can you offer any other pearls of wisdom?? Thank you!!!!!!!!
Hello Dale,
Sounds like a fun diagnostic challenge!
I would also check for valve leakage on 2.5L ford engines with higher mileage. Check out our video for more info ua-cam.com/video/Dzy-EzxIreg/v-deo.html .
Ryan Wilsing, Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Thank you for the advice!! You guys have great videos!!
I don't want to give it away but that was a great lesson! I loved the visual on the computer as well.
Thanks Wyatt!!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I see your comments on every good channel so I decided I'm going to subscribe to your channel lol
***important*** I had this exact issue with my 07 3.0L fusion. Remove your original spark plugs and save them!!!! When I got my new spark plugs to replace them I was given the part number of sp433, on the side they say agsf 32wm. I noticed the ones that were originally installed, said agsf 32n. These are a nickle spark plug and not a platinum. Your owners manual says to replace your platinum plugs at 100,000. These nickle plugs need to be replaced at 60,000. If you like almost every buyer ever, did not pull your plugs when you bought the vehicle, you would have never known to replace them at 60,000. Running these plugs after 60,000 would require more power to create the spark, causing your ignition coil to short, which in turn will fry your PCM. Mike's video above is completely valid and a great solution. But if you have your original plugs you may be able to get your Ford dealer to replace it at no cost to you or to be able to recoup your costs. I am currently working with my local dealer ship to try to have it taken care of and for them to put out a recall. If any lawyers know how to supoena the factory records of which spark plugs were installed on the factory line, your help would be much appreciated.
Nice little PSA there J Rod, thanks! Good luck in your battle!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
an one ownership vehicle ( maybe the factory originals were replaced )? A forum post with pictures of the Milan 3L/V6 factory original "32n" plugs ... www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/2812898/re-spark-plug-recommendations-3-0l-fusion-milan#Post2812898
@@tocrob plugs have never been changed and bought it brand new off the lot in 07.
@@tocrob I'm wondering if it was a one off mistake or if it was an issue with a specific factory line.
@@unknownsaint86 - the 2011 Crown Vic uses the "32n" but Ford specified a 100K mile service interval. Another 2007 Fusion V6 with the 32n plugs ... ua-cam.com/video/C_kjRjqkECU/v-deo.html
You're a great teacher Mike. Look forward to more videos.
Hey Mitchell, thanks!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
this is absolutely the best explanation I've ever heard someone give . thank you very much I have a young friend that is starting a teaching career in the automotive business and I gave him your UA-cam page told him to watch because he could learn a lot from you . do you have a shop? And where are you located ?
Wow!!!! Mike you are Amazing. Clear, Concise diagnostics, love the troubleshooting method. Wish you had a shop here near me, Thank You and looking foward to more videos.
Great diagnostics and repair Mike! Very detailed as always! 😀👍
Hey Terry thanks! :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Very bright young man he knows his stuff thank you
Sir..would you please make a video on how the ecm determine misfire on specific cylinder by using cam. And crank. Sensors?.....
Sure, someday! The ECM watches crank speed and looks for excessive variations in the speed. If the crank slows down it's because the cylinder didn't fire.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining ok sir im glad you reply thank you so much I will wait....I am a filipino GM technician here in saudi arabia.....I always watch your videos Im one of your youtube subscribers...you have very technical explanation and I love to watched your videos....thank you so much godbless....
@@GoTechTraining I dont know how ecm know a specific cylinder mis....on 8 or 6 cylinders one or two mis...how ecm interprets inputs from cranks. And cam sensors to overcome dtc for specific cylinder....
Fantastic presentation from
Start to finish - well done! Clear steps and great info 👍
Hey Gruss, thanks!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I'm sure a lot of people put off changing the spark plugs because the upper intake has to be removed to access the rear bank. I can understand why engines like the GM 3.1, 3.4, and 3.8 had a separate ignition module from the PCM. In a worst-case scenario like this, the ICM is like a "sacrificial" module that would get destroyed, but the PCM would be saved. On those engines, the ICM is plug-and-play and requires no programming, so the repair is more cost-effective. In my opinion, older GM engineers were good at anticipating owner neglect of vehicles and designed them accordingly.
Joseph, that does make sense. Newer coils, smart coils, don't make the PCM do the heavy lifting anymore. So, it's less likely to get killed off by a coil.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
This is a great instructional video!. I have codes P0300, P0304, P0305, P0306, P0355, P0606. Coil 6 looks fine, No Noid light on cyl 6, If I connect my test light to the positive battery terminal, key off, I get a light on the grey wire across cyl's 4, 5, and 6. Not part of the diagnostic you did. ( I haven't looked at the rear bank yet. ) Is that normal? I do get the test light when connected to the negative battery terminal, key on, across the three GY wires as expected.
Hey Loren Jackson, If the GY wire is the same across all of the coils then that's most likely the main power feed. You should see power on that any time the key is on. The ground side is what controls the coil turning on and off.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Had similar problem with an fusion , cant remember the year at the moment but was early to mid 2000's , except the PCM driver on the car i was fixing was burnt open. Coil didnt show any visual sign of overheating though.
I opened up pcm also and found same results , drive transistor was cooked .Problem was on one of the rear cylinders. By then ford had updated the coils and pcm . Very expensive repair !!
Hey Anthony, open circuit is ideal in this situation. That way the car won't start on fire. Thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I had codes showing misfires on cylinders 2 and 4. The PCM tested faulty when swapping front coils, so I sent the PCM off to repair, and replaced all original (2005) spark plugs and coils. After replacing the upper intake, and checking for air leaks, it started right up. But now its starting to run rough. Bummer, I forgot to change PCV valve on the intake, so now I'll be back pulling the intake, replacing the PCV and any bad vaccum lines.
Hey Greg, smart to replace them all. How long did it take to get the PCM fixed and back? Sounds like a bit of a lengthy process.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
paint marker is used as a visual on the assembly line. each plug installer has their own color. when the plug (or bolt or fastener) is installed and torqued it is paint markered. thus eliminating problems with breaks.shift change lunch etc. if you see its not paint markered. you can stop the assembly line and correct it before it gets out the door
Hey Richard, thanks for that insight! That totally makes sense!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I was doing great diagnosing cyl 3 short to ground on my 2016 f150 3.5l non turbo using your vid. UNTIL about 12:45..... My ohm read high on cyl 3 and zero on know good cyl. You show the known good cyl should read HIGH and bad should read LOW. Then my brain exploded.
Any thoughts on why I would read high on bad cyl and zero on known good?
Hi brother i have a ford fusion 2006 but the theft auto is on so the computer connection has no power I all ready checked the fuses but the r good do u have any idea how can I fix it ?
Hey Er Ernan, so the car is stuck in anti-theft mode?
~Mike
Yeah I was driving came to the house and when I tried to go somewhere it stopped working and like a week later star whit no problem and then later a week after stopped working again
I have 2009 Ford escape 3.0l . P0304 code . Changed spark plugs , 98,000 km I have & they’ve never been changed. 6. Cylinder spark plug was full inside and around coils of spark plug ? After changing only front 3 spark plugs 4,5,6 and swapping ignition coils etc the new spark plug cylinder 6 full of oil inside and around coil part . Why am I not getting a P0306 code ??? Engine light flashing when leave at 1500 rpm for 30-45 seconds. After at idle rpms the engine light stops flashing? Assuming oil is coming up at higher rpm and dropping at normal rpm ? Any advice TIA no fuel etc odour no white , dark smoke ? TIA
Great job Mike,thanks for taking the time to make the video! 👍
Thanks for taking the time to watch Nick!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Great video and good explanation of secondary ignition. Keep up the good work Mike.
Hey Paul, thanks man!!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Good logic. Good idea to test for a shorted pcm. I like your testing with a filament bulb to draw real current. But we can't really read your multimeter.
Hey Fred, yeh I noticed that while editing :( Sorry! Glad you enjoyed the class though!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Just an FYI. Because Ford knows there’s a problem, they offer a kit which includes; six coils, six spark plugs, upper plenum and throttle body gasket for around $275.
That's really good info to know Carroll, thanks!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Carroll, do you have a link for this kit?
give me the part number for the kit ? I just called Ford dealership and they had no such kit
Any idea if this kit still exists?
TOO BAD FREAKN FOR DIDN'T MAKE GOOD FOR THEIR FAILURES , AND GIVE A NEW COMPUTER ALONG WITH THE KIT !
Cel po448 on 2006 subie sti had po442 and po456 cleared those .replaced purge control valve and charcoal canister found break in a vacuum hose all set except for annoying po448 code . I'll eventually fiqure it .your videos are helping.worst case it my be the pcm. No worries
awesome. can you give the full info for the sparkplug and NGK coil (part number)
Hey Lex Tr3, thanks for watching! The parts numbers for an 08 Fusion 3.0L are...PTR5C-13 for the spark plug and U5294 for the ignition coils.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Hello, I need your help, I change ECU in Ford escape 2004 V6, I put ecu for mandatory tribute, and the car started, I find out cylinder 2 and 6 doesn't working, my question is : can the ECU I changed can affect the cylinder others cylinders do not work?
2016 Ford Explorer here....how do I know if I have a PCM or an ECM? I know this is an older video, but we have the exact same problem. Number 6 coil pack melted/cracked....check engine light came on.
Hi Sophie, I think a 2016 is new enough that the PCM would protect itself from failure...but in the event that it hasn't you'd want to perform the testing shown in this video to determine if the PCM is doing it's job. The set up is the same as this car if your Explorer is the non-turbo...meaning one wire should have power on it when the ignition is turned on. The other wire should only be grounding when the vehicle is running. If it's grounded all the time then either the wire between the coil and PCM is shorted to ground of the PCM driver is shorted to ground, like what happened on this Fusion.
~Mike
Thanks for the reply Mike! Where is the PCM located? Can't seem to get a straight answer from Google.
Passenger side under the wiper cowl panel
I had this happen today after a timing chain replacement I did on my 2013 ecoboost. I have no coil drivers on any coil now, and only cylinder 2 shorted, is it possible to short out all drivers from one shorted coil? I am a mechanic and i have tested everything you have tested. all grounds were reinstalled after the timing chain job and are strong... no wires seem to be damaged..
My eco boost mustang blew a spark plug “cracked in half” and it started a long journey into my PCM failing. Over the last 2 years it has been intermittently misfiring more and more until now that it can not be driven.
Hey Leo, thanks for watching! That sounds like a long journey. Is it all fixed up now?
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Its at the mechanic as I write this. I will post an update when it completed
So my car is running perfectly again. I hade a damaged connector on the coil pack wire. New pigtail installed and car is running great again. Now I can schedule my car for a tune.
Professor Mike performing his macarena dance moves 6:53. Pink paint on the end of the spark plug is a good tip, thanks for sharing. haha Another great job with the vid Mr. Becker!
Thanks Glen! You gotta see these dance moves, see if you can keep up!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I could not find the FIRING ORDER in the Wells website. Please check
Did you build the car under the parts tab? After that you should see the firing order tab that you can click on.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I build the car under the parts tab as per above video. Including Year 2012-Ford-Fusion-V6 3.0 181cid. After that I cound not found the Firing Order in the list. I only see Filter, Fuel Injection System & Component, Fuel Storage, and then HVAC. There is no Firing Order on the list.
Hey, that's odd. You are right. We don't have it listed for that year/make/model. Email me! I'll get it to you. Michael.Becker@wellsve.com
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
PLEASE....I NEED HELP. 2012 FORD FUSION 3.0 WITH NO COMM, NO CRANK, NO START. THE PCM RELAY IS NOT WAKING UP. IF I GIVE GROUND TO THE PCM RELAY, THE CAR PCM WAKES UP. I BELIEVE IT IS NOT RECEIVING AN IGNITION SIGNAL? ANY IDEAS? PLEASE HELP THANK YOU IN ADVANCE.
I have a misfire on cylinder 1, also getting code for primary/secondary A, saw that coil for cylinder 1 was melted so I replaced all coils and spark plugs but still melted new coil on cylinder 1, any idea what’s happening?
I had a very similar issue with a Triton V-10. Loss of power, entire right bank. No change when removing one or all of the plug wires but it idled very smoothly. Found ground when checking wiring from coil pack to PCM (multiple cylinders). Finally pulled plug on pcm and ground went away. Turned out to be a shorted power transistor shorting the switching for the bank, making it impossible to build up a charge. Unfortunately, I was unable to identify the correct replacement transistor so I replaced the entire PCM and coil packs. All is well.
I forgot to mention that there were error codes for all pri/sec coils in that bank.
Hey Dave, sucks when that happens! Costly repair on that truck I'm sure.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
low compression in one of your cylinders cause a burnt ignition coil?
Wells Vehicle Electronics does not make ignition coils? Just trying to understand why NGK coils were used.
Wells is now owned by NGK.
Exactly :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Hi Mike. I like thousands of others have had this problem with my 07 Ford fusion sel 3.0 L. I just started having this problem and replaced the faulty coils and plugs. Should I try clearing my PCM before I remove it and send it out to be repaired? Wonderful video and explanations. Keep up the great work.
Hey J Rod, sure you can try to perform a clearing of the PCM. It may or may not work. Maybe you caught it early enough and everything will be ok?
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Did you ever get the pcm repaired? Any idea of what that costs?
I have an 07 SE 3.0L and should probably replace coils and plugs. Dont want anything to happen. 135k miles
Great Video. When you replace the PCM what tools do you use to flash or learn process. Do you order parts from dealer or online?
Hey Andre, thanks for watching! I purchased the PCM from my local dealer. I then flashed it using my Autel J-2534 box that came with my Autel Elite scanner and used Ford's software that I purchased through Motorcraft service.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Thanks for the info. My Brother has it at the dealer now after a shop changed all the plugs and coils and still had a miss fire. Im waiting now to see if they checked the pcm. Your video was on point and exact. 👍
Could not agree more about the spark plugs.It is often an item that can do untold damage to the system. A lot of car owners will only call for a replacement when the engine gives trouble and then it's too late. The price of 6 coils , 1 pcm and labour against the price of 6 sparkplugs is really a no brainer. Like the final look at the pcm electronics.
Hey Tom, I could not agree more! The old saying "pay me now, or pay me more later!"
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Yup, I'm here, doing that. Verified damaged PCM. Now if I can just figure out the numbers to get a replacement, not as easy where I live.
Ford was aware of this problem and the potential for thousands of damaged PCM's, soon after most warrenties were expiring. Fearing fall out or possible recall they extended warrenties on plug coil packs to 8 yrs or 80, 000 miles but only if original owner, or some shit. Pre PCM damage. The fact that no one has died or been seriously injured can only be explained by lack of reporting because most mechanics didn't know. Repairing coil packs & plugs doesn't fix it. That's a guess based on mechanics early findings. $900, all new coils & plugs. Still replacing sensors, charging batteries, chasing dummy lights and parasitic draws. But what do I know? I'm just a woman that started looking into the problem online. There's not enough people doing that to get the class action suit off the ground but there is an established real safety concern in the 100's of accounts, like mine, on nhs tab page. Where the car loses power, at random, at 70 mph on the highway, making a left hand turn, merging into traffic, crossing an intersection, while in the wilderness. Losing power to your 2 ton, deadliest machine known to human kind, iis negligent & criminal . Because in Ford's own words. It starts to be a problem after warranty. Even some of Ford s own are too prideful or lazy to dig deeper.
After explaining my situation and still experiencing 4 of 5 symptoms laid out in TSB. I broke & paid the $145 diagnostic fee (credited towards repair😕) at Ford dealer . AGAIN, I explained my findings after the $900 repair with the local mechanic didn't work.
They got my diagnosis fee & nothing more. Shameful. After looking at their estimate of over $400 to replace the FRPS. Just another sensor gone bad. That's what their computer said . When I asked if they would be willing to stand by that repair & give me 3 months warranty. If I was to throw another sensor in that time, they would do PCM repair for 1/2 price. They laughed at the stupid middle aged, single mom driving a 2005 vehicle and expecting it to get me over 100k miles before major repair . Maybe pass it down to my daughter. Like my mom had done for me.
I did a quick look up & watched a couple videos of awesome mechanics, like these, on you tube. $32.00, 2 screws, lube and 10 minutes later I HAD FIXED IT MYSELF .
Growing up in Michigan, with a families small business able to provide my brother & I college efucations. I was taught to buy local from your neighbors or the companies they worked for that PAID taxes & were invested in your community. That you may pay a little more than at large super stores. But it will come back full circle. Those days are gone, I'm afraid. Our entire landscape is s forever changed. This is the 5th Ford SUV in my 4 decades of driving. This the first that wasn't handed down to me by a 5000 mile a year mom. I did my research, I'd thought. KBB, FORD FORUMS, CARFAX, CONSUMERS REPORT, ETC This is highlighted on only one sight giving ratings on used cars. (I'm trying to change that). I wasn't nor were my daughter's, taken for their driver's test until they knew how to change a tire, check & add fluids, and demonstrate safety checks before road trips. I drove 50,000 miles a year, for 20 years. Each if the 4 previous models I proudly sold, over 150,000 miles, running like a top. Wear & tear but some of us go for the no payments, low insurance costs by choice or need, and find it worth the low cost, out of pocket, maintenance. To not worry about going over our lease miles or repo man if sick for a week.
Like so many things these days ....profits have preceeded pride in Corporate America. Make a car that lasts over 100k with regular maintenance. Is just bad for the bottom line anymore. Disposable economy is destroying trust & good will, not to mention the planet.
Sorry for the rant. After a worry free 3 months (keeping track of miles on odo cuz obd doesn't match reality) or computer unable to clear code. What code? Oh, that 2as last month . No codes this week. But am again without transportation for 48 hours while I trickle charge the completely dead battery. That I now must disconnect every night or parasite will deplete it again.
I can't get a good feel for if throwing more money, in the way of junkyard or flashed unit can work? It's my understanding that reprogramming software is notoriously tricky and or a gamble. But then I saw where an updated release of the software was made available just Dec. 22, 2021. Idk if license required but just ss
Hello, Mike. As usual, nice presentation and very informative. I am trying to understand why you get ground with the battery disconnected and also if the positive battery cable is shorted to ground, is the engine block becomes power and causes spark at the negative battery cable when you try to connect it? As the negative now becomes shorted.
Thank you.
Hey Carlo, thanks for watching! When the battery is disconnected we no longer have "ground." I believe you are talking about the OHM test to "ground." All that is doing is showing there is a path for flow to what is normally ground. If the positive cable were shorted to ground you would melt something or possibly even start a fire. Direct shorting the positive cable to ground essentially turns it into a welder.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Thank you for replying, Mike. The reason I asked about the positive cable is that one tech installed a starter and the positive cable at the starter touched ground, resulting in spark at the negative battery cable. I was just trying to understand how you get sparks at the negative battery terminal from a shorted positive cable. Thanks again!
Sparks can happen anytime you have a connection issue in the circuit. The positive and negative cable both pass the current. A circuit is a circle...you can get sparks in any part of it because the current is constant through the circle.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Thank you for this brilliant explanation, Mike. I would have never figured that out on my own.
If I send in the PCM to be fixed/repaired, will the PATS system still remember my keys?
Hey Irvin, not sure. You'll want to check with who ever is fixing it.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Nice case study. But I wish you had shown the reprogramming (reflashing) of the new PCM.
I might next time, we'll see!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Could the PCM not have been put under the battery, or at least not in the path of battery acid.
I have a 2007 Mercury Mariner and had a front right cylinder coil that burned and the maintenance facility changed out all 6 coil, plugs and computer. A couple of months later had the same problem. Could there be a short or some other kind of a problem that’s killing the computer and burning out that same coil? Thanks
Hey Larry, that's not good! The spark plugs were the proper plugs? Coils, plugs, and a NEW computer should fix it. Make sure they installed a good new computer with the most recent software updates. It's possible that a remanufactured computer could have some issues maybe. Just my guess.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Wells Vehicle Electronics. Thanks mike. They did try a different computer and have the same results. Would it be worthwhile to move the vehicle to another facility that would have diagnostic capability to check out the wiring. Thanks
Love all the detail you show! Always good to think deeper into WHY things happen to apply it down the road in other systems. Burning up expensive parts isn't good!
Thanks Volvo09! Always ask why, we don't learn otherwise! :)
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Do you have a video that shows you pulling the connector on the PCM? I can't see what you're doing there and I don't want to mess anything up.
Great run through ignition fundamentals Mike. Thanks for sharing. Steve 👍
Hey Steve, thanks!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I have a 06 mariner with 3.0 I have misfire in the number 3 I replaced the coil and spark plug but still misfire in the same cylinder what else can be? And the engine is not idling roughly
Hey Soto's, is the coil being controlled by the PCM? DOes the cylinder have compression?
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
135k on a set of plugs? That's just car abuse! Great video. Thanks.
Hey, I could not agree more! Thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Can this happen to ford's 2.5L engine? It's basically the same wiring diagram design with only 4 coils
So to avoid this we should get the spark plugs changed before they completely wear. How about changing coils after hitting a milestone even when they are still ok I'm thinking about this to be safe. After 120k for example
Hey Bobo Momo, I have not seen this happen on the 2.5Ls. The 2.5ls are known for burning up valves though.
~Mike
I'm having the same problem this is the first time it gave a code for anything. on my 2001 Ford mustang gt I have a my code is p0355 I did all the test when I connected my noid light than started the car the cylinder 5 hardness there was ground no pulse could that be a large change the PCM is done for.
Hey Makinson480, it's possible the PCM has been friend but it wasn't a super common thing on that 4.6L. If the noid light didn't flash then you'll want to verify power there and then go after the ground side. Maybe you just have a broken wire somewhere?
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining my friend dad found out what happened to my mustang the spark plug was bad that caused the coil to fail making the ECU stop sending ground pulse to it so he bought a coil then checked the spark plug the gap was 0.063. So when we put the new spark plug plus and the coil cylinder 5 no more code car back to normal. Thanks you your video help me save my car.
Awesome! Sounds like the PCM stopped control of the coil once it recognized there was an issue...it saved itself.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
How to wire left headlight, high and low for ford escape, 06.
Not bulb or fuse. Directional works.
Socket had some rust.
I have a Lincoln zephyr 2006 and I found a misfire on cyl.1 I took it apart and found a melted coil .I. check voltage and it has battery voltage 14.volts on one wire.but I check the other side and it has ground and I check the other coils and doesn't have that ground .so my question is that ground shouldn't not have. To be present on the wire all the time..? It's a pcm problem?
Hey, that's exactly right. Sounds like a short to ground in the PCM. Key on engine off you should NOT have ground going to that coil. If you do, you have a short to ground in either the wire going to the PCM or more likely inside the PCM just like I showed in this video.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
That's what I thought...thank you...
Can this also cause a battery to go bad prematurely, since the circuit is constantly open and power is running through non-stop?
Matt, a drain on a battery can cause it to prematurely fail...but just to clarify, the power is only fed to the ignition coil with the key on or car running. If this was supplying power at all times(key off) the car would have likely burned to the ground.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I did the testing and then replaced the plugs and coils all 6 started ran better but rough sent out pcm to circuit board medics for repair and they fixed for 199 but said I would have to put all new coil and plugs in or it would not be warranted, I only ran for maybe 1 minute, is it your opinion that this small amount of time would have ruined my coils is there a way of checking these before I put this pcm back in.
Hey, A shorted PCM could cause a coil to fry incredibly quickly. If you want a warranty, i'd suggest you follow their instructions.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
This is probably the only thing that they missed in all of the videos that I watched, was not to do this
Great video. Doesn’t look like ford really identifies the cause. I agree with your hypothesis with the coil first thing to go bad but ford should give a reason.
You're right, it doesn't really put a nail in the coffin of what is the CORE cause. I wish they would, but we can only deal with the information at hand.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
We experienced this on our 03 Ford Escape 3.0L V6 but worst case scenario. Engine harness are melted and also the FICM (Fuel Injection Control Module) harness, Coil packs fried, PCM malfuntion (not letting the OBDII scanner diagnose/read errors execpt the pending/saved codes before the PCM lost everything), Alternator with regulator fried, saved error codes are throttle body sensor, coolant temp sensor, Transmission shift solenoid error and idle air control valve error. To this day 2023 we're changing parts from harnesses and all the mentioned parts that failed got replaced and now we're installing new coils and spark plugs before putting a new PCM on the way. The engine harness near the exhaust probably started it and this 1st gen Escapes had flimsy and skinny grounding wires we replaced and that crappy battery terminal with quality gauge 2 wires with quick disconnect terminals. We also retapped the threads of body grounding locations like everything from engine to body, transmission to body, alternator and battery grounding, the head lights, and inside the cabin grounding down the passenger side lower peeler panel. This is a well known problems with this 3.0L V6 we got ours the worst and made our research a bit too late 😢😢
had codes P0353 and P0355 on a 2009 escape. replaced both coils, cleared codes but some of the codes showed as permanent. I guess this means the pcm disabled these coils from firing? it started yesterday morning. I left the driveway, no issue, by the time i got 200 feet away, the car lost power shuddered and stalled out. restarted, and got the traditional car with ignition problems shuttering and was able to back it into driveway, barely. pulled codes above, and replaced both coils, then i watched a couple videos that mentioned the pcm possibly wiped out, and also, that you can clear the pcm possibly, and it may or may not work. i had cable disconnected during repairs, put it back on, cleared codes. when i started it, it ran a little rough and codes came back. is it possible that the codes still were because of the permanent ones and pcm may be able to be cleared? how is the best way to clear the pcm to test before i go buy another pcm. I can install it myself, but if it must be programmed by a dealer (maybe other shops can do this now i dont know) i might just let them do it and be done with it. also means i need to scrape up money for a new pcm and the other coils. things never happen at a good time financially i guess. thanks
Hey Chessie, a code reader should be able to clear those codes no problem. If they don't clear, it's because it's failing the test as soon as you turn the key on and resetting the code. Best bet would be to test and verify the PCM driver operation. From there, if it is the PCM, then yes it will need to be programmed by a shop with those capabilities. Good luck!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining i believe thats what happened. I left the driveway got 200 ft and suddenly the car shuddered and shut off. When i got it restarted, it ran rough like it wanted to stall again. Then it threw the codes. I made it back to the driveway and scanned it. Both p035x codes were showing. I figured with no previous car issues and suddenly this happening to two coils was odd but i changed both and it ran without shutting off but still very rough. So i think as you determined, the driver burnt up. Does one driver control 3&5 coils? I tested and have reference voltage to light a test light when hooking the test light to ground. Its not lighting up bright but it is lighting up a 12v test light. The coils arent melted , its a 2009 ford escape v6 btw.
So the each coil has an individual driver inside the PCM. You should have 12v power to the coils whenever the key is on. The ground side is what is being controlled by the PCM. You'll need to check and see if that's working, or shorted to ground.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
If number 6 was not lighting up test light would you still replace PCM or just coils and plugs?
Fernando, you're talking with just the key on, right? Not while it's running? The test light is used to check to see if the driver for the PCM is shorted to ground. Key on, engine off the light should not be lit. If that is the case, then yes, i'd just do coils/plugs, the PCM isn't shorted to ground. It is possible it is open circuited though. I'd look for the test light to flash to show control when the engine is running.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Does that TSB also apply to the 2010 Fusion 3.0L?
Hey Matthew, thanks for watching! No, the TSB only applies to 2006 to 2008 model years.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Thank you for the great presentation. Can the same testing be applicable to a 2002 Ford Taurus with the six coil pack. I did enjoy your presentation!
Hey Leo, thanks for watching. The 6 pack coil is a little bit different..that uses waste spark, so there's only 3 control circuits going back to the PCM there.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Great video.
I have an 06 escape with cylinder 2 and 4 misfiring. Can't get to #2 but on number 4 I back probed the control wire with test light to ground and no pulsation. #5 and #6 pulsate when doing the same test. If the same test is done at the pcm connector and the result is the same can I call the pcm?
Hey, yeh that should be correct. We are talking ignition, right? Fuel injectors can be tested the same way...but it's possible the PCM shuts injectors off. You may want to clear codes and try the test again...in case the PCM shut off the coil driver due to the misfire code. I'm pretty sure on these that the driver keeps grounding even with a code...but it never hurts to be thorough.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining thank you so much!!
Let me know what you come up with!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining most definitely will. Also I own an Autel ms906bt. Do you know if it could program a used PCM for the same vehicle?
I don't think the 906bt is able to. You need a J2534 tool to program the PCM and Ford software. I know the Autel Elite comes with the J-box...not sure about the 906.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
do you have any videos how to check the ignition coil whit scope?
Hmmm I don't think I have anything specific to coil testing at this time. I will get something together soon it that topic.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
really enjoyed this episode, thank you!
Hey Buku2008, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I replaced my coil and spark plug and the Code P0353 is still here. Any help? I'm tired of getting 12.6 mpg and all of the other issues with a misfire.
Aaron, a P0353 is a primary circuit code. this could be a broken wire or bad control.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining im gonna take a look at the PCM next
Very informative video, thanks for the time you put into this.
Hey Jeffrey, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
If í put car on drive, bank 2 reads low contribution -30 or so. New sparks, new coil, but only happens on drive or hard acceleration.. the only code that show up is p2197 there's a new o2 sensor. What else?
Hey. something is causing the engine to run rich, or at least think that it's running rich. You'll have to look into everything that can force an engine rich.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Do you need to program the computer and how you program it??And thank you for your videos I love them thank you very much
Hey Enrique, yes the PCM needs to be programmed upon installation. This requires either a dealer scan tool or a J-2534 box with the Ford subscription.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Does this solves the problem with misfire cylinder 1 problem on 2010 ford fusion hybrid? Because my shows misfire cylinder 1 as a critical problem in my car.
David, it might. A misfire can be caused by a bunch of things.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
My 2010 ford fusion has 2nd coil not responsive nor the 2nd injector. What would it be? It's a V4.
Alvaro, could be a lot of things. It's possible that the injector isn't working because the computer shut it down. If you clear codes, does the injector function for a few seconds?
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
Question:IF there is a TSB for this type of thing (i.e. a known problem) like you found in this case, will the manufacturer cover any of the cost? (especially when they sort of admit they have a problem by coming out with a new revision ECU - which I assume eliminates the problem).
Great question Dave, a TSB is a form or reference material and is VERY different that a recall. Generally there is not covering the cost related to TSBs....but some will offer extended warranties...it depends on the issue and the manufacturer.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
No. only if it is still under factory warranty
Sad. Especially when dealers probably use the problem as a cash cow. I'm sure they don't say anything to customers about it being a potential issue and just wait for the problems to come in the door and collect the bucks.Thanks for the great video.
You're right, it is sad...hopefully this video helps people to understand just how important that preventative maintenance is!
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I presume this is only a problem with the two wire coils where the ECU drives them directly. And not three (or more?) wire where the driver is in the coil???
Great video. Thanks Mike.
thanks for the video Mike. At what point would Ford replace the PCM as a recall? which they probably wouldn't do for somebody that went 35,000 miles overdue on the plugs but say it happened on a vehicle that was properly maintained? Thanks again.
Hey John, most likely only under factory or extended Ford warranty.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
I have the same issue on injector 6 ran the ohm test as you suggested numbers on 6 4 and 2 numbers going crazy as shown in your video as well. Disconnected connector to pcm all were showing OL. Only issue that has me scratching my head is that the coil pack on cyl 6 is perfectly fine no burns or signs of melting. Do you think it’s possible that cyl 6 injector itself is the issue? I will swap cyl 6 and cyl 4 to see if cyl 6 is the issue tomorrow. Thoughts or suggestions? Vehicle is a 2010 Fusion 3.0 V6.
Hey Egonzo, it's possible you could have coil failure without a bad driver and the coil looking fine. Swapping should confirm it for you.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I have the same issue I am going to send it to be rebuilt. Will it be ready to go or do I have to reprogram it?
Hello Mike. I know you may be familiar with Toyota, Lexus, Nissan and Infinity 3 and 4 wire coils. I believe if the IGT is shorted to ground, the pcm driver controlling the coil driver may take a hit. How about if you wrongly install the IGT wire into the ground wire slot (pin), will the pcm driver take a hit in this case?
I am looking forward to your video tomorrow.
Hey Carlos, my guess would be the IGT circuit would end up in self protection mode. I'd guesstimate that the PCM driver would survive.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Is this only for 3.0 L's or no? Because My 2014 Ford Fusion 1.5L is having a similar issue. But I dont see any melted Ignition coils.
I replaced all spark plugs, and the code was still there for P0302 & 0304. I really hope its just the ignition coils. I have ordered new ones
Hey Tony, I don't believe the problem was prevalent on the 1.5L. Theres a ton of things that can cause a misfire. Ignition is just one of the necessary pieces of the puzzle.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Hi, Thanks for sharing. I have a Question that maybe could be a silly doubt. I have a MAzda tribute 2005, same like FORD escape 3.0 engine and the coil #4 is completely burned, with smoke and everything twice. What kind of failure could burn the same coil twice? Should I replace the PCM? or just put another coil there from different brand or quality? Thanks again.
Hey George, could be an inferior design coil. Did you replace the spark plug? That's usually what causes it. Grab an NGK coil and throw it in there. You won't be disappointed. U5060 is the part #.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Thanks, was the signal wire defective, making contact with ground in some positions. Replace this wire from PCM plug (Green and purple Cilynder 4) and ready to go.
Fixed with your advice. Green purple wire was making ground intermitent when I move with engine off. Replace that wire from PCM plug straight to coil and now run perfect!? Thanks, I owe you one!
What website or program did you use for the wiring dygrams? I don't see it the description
Hey Daniel, I use AllDatapro and Identifix for all of my service information needs.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Impressive troubleshooting and instruction.!
Thank you very much VideoGrabBag!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I was an ASE Certified Master Technician with training and certificates from Ford Motor Company in EEC, SBDS, and electrical systems for twenty years. I want to pay you compliments on your highly intelligent explanation on this particular processor, ignition coils, and spark plug operation. I was waiting for you to explain primary coil winding collapse to secondary high voltage winding, and you did. I would imagine the layperson was like, "Huh?" Again, my compliments to you and your knowledge.
I agree with what you say, but people who don't know how a coil produces high voltage shouldn't be working on cars. That is one of the most fundamental pieces of knowledge.
@@fredbach6039 maybe proper training instead of saying they shouldn't work on cars.
Just got done doing this job. Took it to the dealer to get the keys programmed to the new pcm and they told me the pcm is sending voltage to the throttle body causing the throttle body to stay in one position, resulting in a no start. The tech said he didn't believe it was the throttle body because he tested it and it was working normal. I got another pcm, installed it and they said the same thing. What's the likelihood of receiving a faulty pcm twice? I dunno where to go from here
Hey BigRidge, something doesn't add up here. Why is the throttle sticking open? Is the pedal position sensor sending a nopen request? I highly highly doubt you have multiple new bad PCMs. I'd look somewhere else...i'd also maybe look at a different shop.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Ended up being the camshaft position sensors. After those were replaced it fired right up
Hey there, watched this video and I’m having a slightly different issue than you are. My vehicle was bought at auction with two misfires, on cylinders 4&5. I replaced coil and plugs on all cylinders to be safe, with none of my coils having any signs of being burned/worn out and I am still throwing a code for cylinder 5 and misfiring hard. On the test light test, my cylinder 5 is still having issues. The lead at the battery negative to the green colored insert, equivalent of the purple connector on cylinder 6, has a light on connection identical to your testing. My problem is that my ohm testing doesn’t show the same signs that yours did and doesn’t have any sign of continuity on my problem cylinder. What would you recommend from this point if anything?
Eric, thanks for watching! I think you're saying that the ground side control wires for coil 5 and 6 are both shorted to ground. Is that correct? the short can be a direct short from harness to ground or internal to the PCM. If the light still lights with the PCM disconnected then your short is not in the PCM. Make sense?
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
NGK Technical Training Hey Mike, only mentioned cylinder 6 since it was the one that you were testing and wanted to make sure people could know which wire on my coil connection that I was talking about! My only issue is cylinder 5. I don’t think that I was thorough in my testing before commenting, after going back and trying again I’m now replicating the issue that you received on your scenario with your ohm testing, which has me believing it is the PCM for my vehicle. Thanks for the excellent video and incredible detail!
Eric, awesome! Glad you were able to get to the bottom of it. Remember that the PCM needs to be programmed and you need 2 keys at the time of programming as well.
Mike Becker, Senior Technical Instructor
New to your channel. I have a question. What if instead of it having power to the coil I am getting no power to the coil. Would this be the same problem with the pcm or a bad wire to the coil. Thanks