Actually, young people need truth. The evidence of true repentance is a humble confession of one's sin nature and a desire to let God have their whole heart. Joy is a result of repentance.
Gavin’s humble hunger and broad historical perspective is wise and generous. Praise our Lord Jesus for his sovereign outpourings! Blow upon my dry bones.
People like Alisa who spread fear and tribalism in the name of “discernment” are a part of the reason why Christianity in America and the West, is in the hole it’s in.
Apparent sincerity of belief doesn't have any bearing on if it's true. If sincerity were the standard, cults like Bethel, Islam, Jehovah's Witness, and Latter Day Saints would be equally viable. They are not viable. This dude has a conflict of interest that must be acknowledged. He has a vested interest in making his school appealing to any looking for their own degree. Take him with a grain of salt.
@reiner311 although i hear what you say, my point stands. Many JW and Islamic leaders do not come across as sincere. I would argue that Isincere Muslims are ex-muslims or severely brainwashed. I know plenty of academics whose motivation is dubious, but they don't come across as sincere. I have never thought Bill Johnson is sincere
i have a confession, i was a Trans girl all over the internet making porn videos, when I was young I was raped by my grandfather I was so scared I did not tell anyone out of fear that he would kill me, I was having sex with him at 9 to 12 years old, then my mom throw me out at 15 years old I was living in the streets in and out foster homes, at 17 i was selling my self as a trans-t-girl whore that went on till I was 26 than at 30 i got into porn than I got into drugs and alcohol always trying to hide the abuse I went trow as a child and all my youth, so at 23 years old I started to get help only for the trauma and i could not accept the fact i was a woman in a man's body only for all the doctor to say to me i was born that way, every time I tried to get into a relationship With a lot of guys, I was never accepted for maybe a few years because of who I was, and all I was a piece of A_S_S to all the men, a lot of them were married, and one day i pic up the bible, and something happened it open my eyes, and it took another 10 more years for me to wake up and for god to deliver me from this, i always knew it was wrong but i did not understand what was going on with me and i really did not want to live this lifestyle if you ever want to be close to hell live this lifestale ,all i was just another piece meat fulfilling someone else's sick fantasies have any idea how men i sleep with in just one day , than one day ,i was praying god please help me after 3 suicides and i was going to kill my self and god heard me and his grace touched my heart and soul, it took a little work not long and a lot praying , but he delivered me from it not only from the homosexual lifestyle but from porn also and drugs and alcohol and cigarettes, im free , im just sorry all my photos and porn videos are all over the internet there no way to remove it , but I'm free im free living a normal somewhat lifestyle except i have to deal with the Disassociation and Disconnecting. all the times even when im typing you this massage im sorry for my spelling i never made it in school but its so hard to focus ill just have to i pray god he will help me with the trauma iv been throw ,but to all of you doctore and Therapist. it's a lie I was too steps from getting the operation and i thank god did not, i did have some makeover to pass as a woman but lucky me i did not go all the way , but god has set me free to all, the doctors and different Therapist.i went throw all those years was a waste of my time they lied to me, you are not born that way god does not make junk lol my old icon pic was the old me my name used to be Samantha but can call me Tommy, please please i pray for all the lgbt turn your life over to god, and please pray for me so god can remove the ugly past i can't sleep sometimes because of this
I have been praying for the expansion of the Father's kingdom across our nation and the world, and this has greatly cheered me to see. At a time when everything seems corrupted I really needed this. There is hope, and God is still in charge.
God grants us failures to grow If your hopes are crushed to pieces then God’s gunna work with you but it’s gunna take a while before you’re ready for anything beyond trivial in His kingdom
I'm Catholic so I'm not that familiar with all of that "revival" and "awakening" talk that protestants use, but being 24 years old myself and coming form atheism to Christianity, I think for all that I've seen happening at Asbury, it is something really beautiful and gives me hope for young people, how can't I rejoice when people are finding Christ and repenting of their sins? I hope God works in the hearts of all those who were there.
@@ProfYaffle As a catholic I can affirm Gavin is good I like his historical approach to the topics, also like Jordan Cooper's work. But to be honest if you convert as an adult to Catholicism from atheism in the 21st century there are very few things that could make me go protestant😂😂 I'm sorry guys to be catholic in this day and age requires you to do a lot of study and discernment so for me the only other option to Catholicism is just something like neo-platonism. God bless you still
I am 76 and was introduced to the charismatic renewal movement in 1971, which I was told was the outgrowth of the 1970 Asbury outpouring. Most of the emphasis was experiencing the power of the Holy Spirit and His gifts, healing and casting out demons. There was little, if any, focus on core doctrine such as the Fall, original sin, what it means to be born again (gifts of saving repentance and faith), dealing with the flesh post new birth, the fear of God. It led to super-controlling practices like shepherding, which hurt a lot of people; and even new age ideology such as Agnes Sandford’s “the healing light.” I so appreciate men like Steve Lawson who teach core doctrine - which is largely “not” what you hear from pulpits today. Is a revival among today’s leadership - biblical reformation - the greatest need? Without it, will “experience” be placed above “truth.” And how can true discipleship take place without core doctrine? Do the young people at Asbury see the Trinitarian Jesus, Lord and Judge, or the “nice” Jesus who doesn’t want to hurt anyone? Can we learn from the past, so the present Asbury revival reaches the maturity God wants?
Are you saying that the real Jesus does want to hurt people? And for the record Steve Lawson is a Calvinist. You don't go to a Calvinist to get a sound presentation of the gospel.
@@JewandGreek Jesus does not want to hurt people - it is His will that none should perish. That is why He suffered on Calvary. What I am saying is that Jesus is God, and he is Judge, and He will judge people who don't repent of their sin. He being both Savior and Judge is biblical truth. Hell is real. Many churches present Him only as Savior. One's coming to Jesus for salvation (and what it means to believe in Him and not only have head knowledge of Him) involves a conviction of our rebellion against Him; sorrow for it; turning from our rebellion (sin); relying on Jesus and His finished work on Calvary on our behalf; and yielding to Him as Lord is the only way to be saved from God's wrath (the wrath of the Trinitarian Jesus), and eternal separation from Him. That's the gospel! And it is what Steve Lawson proclaims. That is more important than he is a Calvinist. It is biblical truth. Are you born again? Do you have the assurance of eternal life? Does your church teach that truth? (John 3:3) To contend with Calvinism is to major in minors. Contending for biblical truth is what matters. Please stand for biblical truth! Check out John 3:18, in which Jesus said that "he who doesn't believe in me is condemned already." That is not the water-downed so-called American gospel that is preached today. What gospel do you believe in?
@TinaMarie Johnson can I suggest you watch his streams. Where exactly do you think he should have drawn on the Scriptures, but didn't, in this conversation. And where did Alisa, in contrast, noticeably draw on Scripture. I think both of them are good, but Alisa appears to have become understandably cynical because of NAR
I was there multiple nights and was blessed to be able to pray for many people as a member of the prayer team. IMHO this was an outpouring of God's love, not a revival. I will always look back at this time where "God came near" as one of the highlights of my life. There was confession, repentance, salvations, healings and even some deliverances. Thanks be to God! It is hard to convey what it felt like to be there and I am excited to see the fruit of what will come out of this whole thing. Also, the University and the Seminary did an excellent job stewarding this two week outpouring, trying to honorably respond moment by moment as needs demanded immediate decisions.
Hi Jeff, when you say there were healings, do you mean that people with actual ailments that could not be treated with modern medicine were healed by some otherworldly force?
@@RLBays yes, that is correct. Supernatural power of God came down upon natural man. The following Sunday, after the Asbury two week session, there was another event at Rupp Arena which is our big basketball arena where the Univ of Ky plays basketball and it was rented out by another ministry called Pulse from Minnesota. On that Sunday, a man who had been wheelchair bound since 2018 was able to get out of his chair, give testimony and walk and dance on stage. It was really wonderful what the Lord did for him. However, I see various types of healings every week. Thanks be to God!
I believe Mr. Ortlund Spoke with much wisdom. My sense is that (IF) Mrs. Childers concerns about the colleges (possilble) liberal leanings are a reality then this latest publicity will bring everything out in the open. Her concerns are valid up to a certain point, the churches today are apostatizing left and right, but as Mr. Ortlund stated there are manifestations of the Holy Spirit at work in the lives of these students and it will now be the job of the college to continue the work the Holy Spirit began by teaching these students Biblical truths.
Wait wait! So, somehow the Spirit was working apart from the clarity of the essential message of the gospel? Interesting, so, that is learned afterward huh? The gospel is the power of God onto salvation! It’s what brings spiritual life that leads to a true repentance through the Holy Spirit. There is no truly knowing biblical truths apart from being spiritually alive first. Plus, the Holy Spirit does not work apart from the gospel message in bring spiritual life. And again spiritual life is needed even to repent. What will bring spiritual life is literally the gospel with the Holy Spirit. They work together in bring the spiritual life, never apart.
Even the spreading of the gospel by the early church was messy. Good talk. Clarity and change in behaviour happen over time. I like Garvin's balanced approach.
Was it messy? I doubt that from my reading of Acts. 'Revivals are known by their fruit." Well, I was part of a local revival in 1972 coming directly out the Jesus People Movement, and what I saw in this particular local revival in 1972 was in no way messy. And there were lasting fruits -- there was a rare obedience and focus on Jesus, powerful and restrained love, devotion to prayer and Bible study and fellowship and availability to God and each other, evangelism etc. Real revival produces a totally renewed church and the definition if that is simply given in Acts 2:42 where the key is really 24/7 devotion which is really missing generally in the church in the US. Act 2:42 And they devoted themselves to the apostles' teaching and fellowship, to the breaking of bread and the prayers. FYI, my maternal grandparents also came out of a local revival in 1900 and that had great and lasting fruit, and my grandparents also led holy and totally exemplary lives. So I know what I am talking about. God's peace to y'all. ❤
i have a confession, i was a Trans girl all over the internet making porn videos, when I was young I was raped by my grandfather I was so scared I did not tell anyone out of fear that he would kill me, I was having sex with him at 9 to 12 years old, then my mom throw me out at 15 years old I was living in the streets in and out foster homes, at 17 i was selling my self as a trans-t-girl whore that went on till I was 26 than at 30 i got into porn than I got into drugs and alcohol always trying to hide the abuse I went trow as a child and all my youth, so at 23 years old I started to get help only for the trauma and i could not accept the fact i was a woman in a man's body only for all the doctor to say to me i was born that way, every time I tried to get into a relationship With a lot of guys, I was never accepted for maybe a few years because of who I was, and all I was a piece of A_S_S to all the men, a lot of them were married, and one day i pic up the bible, and something happened it open my eyes, and it took another 10 more years for me to wake up and for god to deliver me from this, i always knew it was wrong but i did not understand what was going on with me and i really did not want to live this lifestyle if you ever want to be close to hell live this lifestale ,all i was just another piece meat fulfilling someone else's sick fantasies have any idea how men i sleep with in just one day , than one day ,i was praying god please help me after 3 suicides and i was going to kill my self and god heard me and his grace touched my heart and soul, it took a little work not long and a lot praying , but he delivered me from it not only from the homosexual lifestyle but from porn also and drugs and alcohol and cigarettes, im free , im just sorry all my photos and porn videos are all over the internet there no way to remove it , but I'm free im free living a normal somewhat lifestyle except i have to deal with the Disassociation and Disconnecting. all the times even when im typing you this massage im sorry for my spelling i never made it in school but its so hard to focus ill just have to i pray god he will help me with the trauma iv been throw ,but to all of you doctore and Therapist. it's a lie I was too steps from getting the operation and i thank god did not, i did have some makeover to pass as a woman but lucky me i did not go all the way , but god has set me free to all, the doctors and different Therapist.i went throw all those years was a waste of my time they lied to me, you are not born that way god does not make junk lol my old icon pic was the old me my name used to be Samantha but can call me Tommy, please please i pray for all the lgbt turn your life over to god, and please pray for me so god can remove the ugly past i can't sleep sometimes because of this
@@SaharanKnight My dear you need to read Acts carefully. All the problems you see today are mirrored in some small way in Acts. E.g. Ananias and Sapphira attitude to be seen of men; Jewish discrimination of the Gentiles; etc. All the epistles that we read are attempts to correct issues that were present in the church. That is what I mean by messy. With any move of God you still have stuff to clean-up. Hence you cannot judge a move of God because things get messy. Messy is what humans do.
@Adam Fontenet Read Acts carefully. I do not mean the disciples were not preaching the gospel, it means that there were people with their own agendas; there was discrimination among Jews and Gentiles, etc. Hence, the apostles had to address these issues. This is largely the contents of the epistles, the apostles instructing believers.
I understand your concerns about introducing scripture during this revival. However, My personal story is I was so hungry & thirsty to know Jesus . After searching in all the wrong churches & feeling & believing that I was not worthy of His Love. I came to a point that I knew in my heart He was the only way. Through His intervention and plan for me, He placed 2 women in my life at my most desperate moment. They started out with scripture and asked me what it meant to me. I had nothing. I started to ask questions and Praise His Holy Name, my God given mentors gently and lovingly walked me through with patience and love. I get your concerns about possibly not having mature mentors there during this Asbury revival. But it will come to those who are truly seeking our Savior. Hope this made sense. Praise Jesus.
Yes. That is what I am trying to say. Even if there is wrong stuff, we have to believe God can reach people who are seeking. In the NT we do not see a one size fits all approach to sharing the goid news. And ultimately God convicts, not humans.
Also, what Alisa is expressing is NOT biblical 'truth' but rather HER PERSONAL AND DENOMINATIONAL PERSPECTIVE on what the Bible says. She is splitting hairs here and expecting a revival that looks like her own views and NOT the life changing work of the Holy Spirit.
Greetings from Kentucky! I'm very blessed to listen to my favorite Calvinist, my favorite daughter of a Jesus Music pioneer, and my favorite British person have a reasonable discussion of this important topic. As someone burned very badly by the Word of Faith Movement (and Progressive Christianity), I am naturally skeptical. I have been very encouraged by the majority of what I have witnessed.
@@dawnzimmerman6818 they did not turn up they got invited to speak. There is much you don't know. Don't base your judgement on positive fine cause then you need to be Islamic then.
@@dawnzimmerman6818 the thing is these funny things happen and with people with rick warren and Ihop being planned and invited is never good. Again just the same as those in bethel and other supernatural conferences.
In a world so filled with alarming news from every quarter this is news of hope in God calling His people to draw near Him. This awakening has brought hope to many. My prayer is that God will continue to send a spirit of repentance and forgiveness to Asbury and beyond.
@@Sherlock245 actually they didn’t. They were supposed to… planned to… advertised… but I watched the whole event for Collegiate Prayer Day and Warren, Chan, and iHop didn’t show.
@@michellemyers4219 its ending and shutting down that why they did not come but they did invite them over. Go to a catholic church you can exp God moving.
Very good, clear, respectable conversation Alisa and Gavin. Each of you made great points! It is good to see the different perspectives of each of you coming from different Christian backgrounds, experiences and concerns. God Bless you and continue the conversations!
As a recovering “bethel type” of church. Anytime I hear bethel and Hillsong music combined with certain types of prayer patterns and “lingo” it gives me the heebie-jeebies. Is the gospel being preached ? Are people being called to repent ? Is this a group of “Christians” getting emotionally whooped up or are non believers coming to faith and turning from sin? Hope it’s real….
All you hear from the men is “peace, love, joy, but no repentance. No gospel being preached. They’re simply peddling disingenuousness and hot air talking fillers.
Maybe research the entire event for yourself and how it began before you jump to conclusions. Also, who is going to have a problem with a song saying “Worthy Is The Lamb” - the angels proclaim that in John’s vision In Revelation. Don’t get me wrong - I’m Australian and am well versed in Hillsong, however there were some sincere songwriters who have since moved on, like Miriam Webster.
Alisa’s concern about whether the Gospel is being preached and whether it’s being preached truthfully and fully is very important. If we model after Jesus, He was very clear and bold with the Truth when He spoke, and either people were convicted and followed Him or were insulted because they thought they knew better as Alisa said. Thanks to Alisa for not backing down on that critical distinction. Otherwise, it’s potentially leading people astray.
*Hunger for God and hunger for the supernatural. Thats what we're seeing at Asbury. What is going to fill the hunger... Thats what has yet to be seen. We want to jump the gun and tie everything up in a neat little package so we can comfort ourselves. Instead of being cautious and waiting.*
I pray is that thease precious young people are and will be led by the Holy Spirit through Jesus Christ and their hearts will be genuinely turned back to Abba Father and they obey his word and receive the complete and whole Gospel and word of God as Is God's will for the young one 🙏 ❤️
@@PETERJOHN101 I thought she had valid insights that were ignored. She is deeply knowledgeable about the progressive movement but they totally dismissed her. .
The Asbury campus pastorette and her husband were both formerly at my university. They held an ecumenical candlelight service where all religious leaders were invited and performed their own worship and prayer. We were supposedly building bridges and learning truth from one another. These are the people leading the "revival". I have emails from both, they are far from orthodox. They also had a who's who of the emerging church march thru the campus. Speaking "Christianeese", but far from believing the truth of the Word
Alisa, It is good to be cautious and discerning but as someone who was there for 3 days I can say there have been clear and strong messages given throughout this revival. I'm not really sure how they could be any more classical within the evangelical tradition. Anyone can access these messages through the internet. There's been a strong push for repentance, holiness, accountability before God and man, and total dependence on Jesus Christ as the only savior of the world.
What is the gospel? How would you explain it? You Been there three days now, and they’ve been proclaiming it with clarity, so you must have a clear idea of how to express it in a short paragraph. So what’s the gospel message?
@@TheDavidBarraza just by the tone of your comment, I have to wonder if you know the gospel message. Not just by rote, but actually living it out. Can you preach the clear truth of the gospel message by the power of the Holy Spirit with the love of Jesus Christ?
*Ya, Ive seen the gospel being preached there but not by students or staff. Its by people who came from outside. And as soon as this happened they moved to shut it down. I have to question that.*
What makes her an expert in how God works? I think they have no clue what is happening. They have no prepared themselves for this. As it has been foretold as far back as 2014.. She seems like she does not believe in the Gifts of the Spirit.. And will be her mistake. As Jesus told them, And greater things then I have done. Will you do in my Name. As they were commanded to wait in the upper room. Till the Holy Spirit fell on them. then they went out healing all kinds of sickness. Diseases. Raising the Dead etc.. It's been going on in China for 40 years...
@@WizzRacing because God does not violate his word. And Rick warren, bethel, Ihop attendending the event has violated it. Don't be deceived of the positiveness. As you can get that too in a catholic church.
His glory, He will not share with any man. Alicia , give glory to the power of the Holy Spirit at work in one of most precarious time in history in America. Stop being analitical of God's move within and among the younger generation. Instead of viewers applauding Alicia, Let God do His work in His own way and time. Main while, Let all the SAINTS JOIN TOGETHER IN PRAYER FOR THE POWER OF GOD TO BE EXPERIENCE AMONG THE YOUTH.
@@Sherlock245 You have no idea what you are talking about. Unless you want to show evidence for such matters. So I would ask you. Have you been filled the Holy Spirit and the gifts of God? If so explain the experience.
@@patoz4959 They can't tell you what is going on. Why God is going to show them his Power and Glory. Not their water down version of of the Gospels. This is going to change the landscape of America and the world. And God will get the credit for it. Not the Churches. Not Governments. Not Politics. This is God raising up a new church. His Church. Which will have power over all things in his Name, It will be something to behold..Be like some out of the movie The Ten Commandments. Behold the Power Of God..As Aron puts forth his staff.. Great times to witness..
"Clarity on the gospel, sin and repentance." 👍 Thanks Alisa for putting that out. I believe your concerns are on point. Also appreciate you for always going back to the scriptures. "Your emotions are a great engine light, but they're not a great GPS. 😅 We want to make sure that our emotions are being brought under the subjection of the truth of God's revealed word." A very good and timely reminder for me 🙂
Thank you, thank you so much Alisa Childers, you are a real breath of fresh air in this conversation. Your wait-and-see perspective (not skeptical) is much needed. You voiced my concern perfectly when you asked regarding the place the Gospel in the Asbury 'revival.' I am in Sydney Australia, so I only have the interviews, commentaries and videos to go by, but I have not heard the Gospel. It seems to be a singing 'revival,' and I wonder if there is such a thing, really. Bless you Alisa!
It's not unreasonable to question. I begins to be unreasonable to persist when adiquit answers are provided. Asbury is experiencing a move of the Holy Spirit. Let the Spirit move. This is not the time to worry but rejoice. These kids need this.
Alisa brings so much clarity, compassion, wisdom, Godly caution, love of the gospel and biblical knowledge. So grateful that she is not intimidated to speak the truth and ask questions to ensure that the flock is being shepherded well.
She has no idea what God is doing.. This movement started in a University. It will spread across the Universities. As the Church is dead. It's been dead for 40 years. As they got to caught up in Politics. Why this Revival is for the younger generations. As the churches failed them. So God is doing it. It will surpass anything the world has seen. As it's God's turn now. And he is raising up a new church. One that will see the power of God like it never has...
The degree to which Childers subordinates all other concerns to her very particular culture war hangups ("CRT"!) becomes increasingly awe-inspiring as the discussion progresses.
@@wildhias6195 On the one hand I credit her for being so blatant about it. On the other hand, equating that stuff with "the gospel" comes close to idolatry
there is a Christian show in Canada called "100 Huntley Street"....these 2 men in their 40's went from downtown Toronto location to Asbury.They planned to stay 2 hrs and fly home. They stayed over 8 hours, the brokenness and honor they gave to this outpouring is worth a watch!
there's a Wikipedia page on Alisa Childers, she is the daughter of Chuck Girard (popular Jesus Movement singer).....she has 2 books about the deception within Christianity over the last 20 years (which of course is valid), yet I get the distinct impression she is hostile to Asbury because she is still injured (I could be wrong)! She's on the panel because 'she is the daughter of a famous person ', and also of her own fame as being in a 2000's gospel girl group! To me, she is a problem...she's not the right commentator for this outpouring, I have seen many post out there and she is virally dominant!
I watched 100 Huntley street, my whole life, until about 4 years ago. It is not a reliable Christian program. They have true authors, preachers, teachers, mixed in with all the crazy hyper charismatics, false teachers / preachers and heretical authors, plus Catholics. My eyes were finally open to the lack of discernment and false teachers allowed on their program, and stopped watching it. Take a look at who’ve they’ve allowed on there over the years, and who’ve they’ve rubbed shoulders with. There is a huge lack of discernment and a disconnect on the program, to the real God of scripture.
Alisa Childers is much, much more optimistic amd constructive from her initial cynicism in her own posts. It is encouraging to hear her equivocation and qualifiers to her criticism of this revival last week. It is a sign of her own, " radical humility" as Dr.Tennet clarified with earlier.
Hi everyone! I pray we are all well. A beautiful answer to this is to remember the revival in 2 Chronicles 34, during Josiah's remarkable and Spirit-led leadership. Take time to read over it to see the key ingredients needed in that revival. The main ingredient was the reading of God's Word, the book of the Law. Not much is known on my end about Asbury or the revival going on. I am not here to confirm nor deny it. I have not witnessed it yet, but I would like to share this great study so we can see the revival in Jerusalem and Judah. God bless us all! The Word of God is important as a lamp unto our paths.
I agree to the gospel needing to be preached. As someone who struggled with anxiety my whole life, the only thing that cured that was the gospel, understanding my need for Jesus. If I was just given an evening of peace it would not cross over into my daily life. Yes I understand people who are hurting feeling peace there. But how will that help them once they leave the building? They will wonder where that peaceful feeling went? I was caught up in that and it left me feeling empty, chasing the emotional high. People need the gospel, they need something lasting, a person Jesus Christ.
God is patient with our sins. Let’s not be too quick to judge when people fall short of scripture or make mistakes. If and when we see signs of maliciousness, then we act with firm love and stand our ground in the Lord.
Peter kept sinning AFTER being baptized in the spirit. We know this since he was being judgmental, as Paul tells us, towards gentiles. Last time I checked that WAS sin.
@@mountbrocken God knows we are not perfect. He gives us gentle correction when we are humble enough to accept that. It’s when we forget that we are not perfect that we get into “trouble”.
i have a confession, i was a Trans girl all over the internet making porn videos, when I was young I was raped by my grandfather I was so scared I did not tell anyone out of fear that he would kill me, I was having sex with him at 9 to 12 years old, then my mom throw me out at 15 years old I was living in the streets in and out foster homes, at 17 i was selling my self as a trans-t-girl whore that went on till I was 26 than at 30 i got into porn than I got into drugs and alcohol always trying to hide the abuse I went trow as a child and all my youth, so at 23 years old I started to get help only for the trauma and i could not accept the fact i was a woman in a man's body only for all the doctor to say to me i was born that way, every time I tried to get into a relationship With a lot of guys, I was never accepted for maybe a few years because of who I was, and all I was a piece of A_S_S to all the men, a lot of them were married, and one day i pic up the bible, and something happened it open my eyes, and it took another 10 more years for me to wake up and for god to deliver me from this, i always knew it was wrong but i did not understand what was going on with me and i really did not want to live this lifestyle if you ever want to be close to hell live this lifestale ,all i was just another piece meat fulfilling someone else's sick fantasies have any idea how men i sleep with in just one day , than one day ,i was praying god please help me after 3 suicides and i was going to kill my self and god heard me and his grace touched my heart and soul, it took a little work not long and a lot praying , but he delivered me from it not only from the homosexual lifestyle but from porn also and drugs and alcohol and cigarettes, im free , im just sorry all my photos and porn videos are all over the internet there no way to remove it , but I'm free im free living a normal somewhat lifestyle except i have to deal with the Disassociation and Disconnecting. all the times even when im typing you this massage im sorry for my spelling i never made it in school but its so hard to focus ill just have to i pray god he will help me with the trauma iv been throw ,but to all of you doctore and Therapist. it's a lie I was too steps from getting the operation and i thank god did not, i did have some makeover to pass as a woman but lucky me i did not go all the way , but god has set me free to all, the doctors and different Therapist.i went throw all those years was a waste of my time they lied to me, you are not born that way god does not make junk lol my old icon pic was the old me my name used to be Samantha but can call me Tommy, please please i pray for all the lgbt turn your life over to god, and please pray for me so god can remove the ugly past i can't sleep sometimes because of this
Praising the Lord for a woman of the Word like Alisa. May the Lord comfort and encourage her as she boldly stands firm on the truth of God's Word. "Discernment is not knowing the difference between right and wrong. It is knowing the difference between right and almost right.” - Charles Spurgeon.
I'm sorry but I am of the opinion that Alisa Childers' insistence that the students who have been the recipients of the Spirit's move at Asbury clarify immediately their stance on CRT and the LGBTQ+ is theologically and pastorally misguided. When I preach to a larger group, I make no assumptions about where they stand on those issues that have been tearing apart the social fabric of our nation. I follow what Paul tells Timothy: "Remember Jesus Christ, raised from the dead, descended from David" (2 Timothy 2:8). As the Spirit convicts the heart and renews the mind of those who receive this core message, then it is appropriate to explore issues of theological anthropology and Christian ethics. Here too we can trust the Spirit as he attests the truths of the Scriptures that he has inspired.
Alicia Childers, thank you for being concerned for the true work of the Holy Spirit in convicting concerning sin, righteousness and judgment. For that we can go on giving Him praise and honor and glory! If there is a hunger for God we have to make sure they are fed the right and holy God of scripture and not a false Jesus, not a false gospel and not a false Holy Spirit. Did Timothy even understand what Alisa was asking him about identity issues and the gospel? It seemed to me that he did not understand or he didn’t seem to give a clear answer to her question.
I respect this woman so much. It's not so easy to find a woman with this much discernment and articulation. Praise God for her voice in apologetics. ❤️
.....it's difficult to find men and women like Childers. But the network she us connected with which includes Greg Laurie, Amir Tsafarti, Jack Hibbs, there is a solid foundation in The Word and spirit of truth.
If I get nothing else from this occurrence atAsbury college, I am grateful for having been introduced to Allisa Childers. She has quite a head on her shoulders. Her approach to this seems balanced and healthy.
@ Sa. Hayes, I consider her being balanced because she is not writing this off as NOT being a work of God. She’s allowing for the possibility. That’s what I meant by balanced. For the record, let me state that I do NOT believe that this is a work of God. I do believe that God can use it, but I do not believe that it is coming from God but, rather, man.
Thank you guys very much. Alisa Childers great concern I appreciate you very much. I see it as God doing something here with theses college kids. Those mature in the faith should help balance what does go on here. I'm not there or haven't been there but from almost all video clips iv seen I haven't heart the actual Gospel clearly preached at all. Preach Christ and continue to preach. Yes sing and praise and pray but preaching the Gospel is the power of God unto salvation.
Alisa, you are right on in all you’ve said. I grew up Pentecostal and use to the long services and such focus on “experiencing God.” I’ve since come to a better understanding, through the Holy Spirit leading me out , and attend a Baptist church. I now feel closer to God, and now it’s not about the music or hype, but the focus is on God’s word, scripture. I would attend a church that’s all about the preaching / teaching, and wouldn’t even care if there’s a song sang..that’s how much I’ve been changed. I’m grateful everyday that the Holy Spirit lead me to a great church.
Valerie Hancock Joined Sep 25, 2020 *Yep. This is the OBJECTIVE. The OBJECTIVE right now is to destroy Churches that ACCEPT the Holy Spirit. This comment is complete bunk. Its intended to INFLUENCE others. It has NO MERIT. The WAR right now is on ANY Church that ACCEPTS the New Testament Acts doctrinal precepts of t Holy Spirit*
The Bible is full of His people singing songs of praise and lament. Psalms is well - a book of songs. When Jesus ascended back into heaven His last words were that He left a Comforter in his stead. It's interesting that He did not use that moment to talk about the collection of written testimonies that would become the Bible hundreds of years later as a replacement for His physical presence. The Holy Spirit is confirmed by the Bible, not replaced by it.
Great conversation! I think they did a great job with shepherding this. God will continue to move. I do think we have a specific definition of "revival" that we are trying to make this fit into rather than seeing it as an awakening. Also remember not all students are in their late teens/early 20's ;) (Alisa seems really stuck on the LGBTQ question - appreciated Gavin's response about how there is time for those issues later)
"I do think we have a specific definition of "revival" *Because it isnt a Biblical concept. The concept of Revival isn't present over the entire Biblical Record. Its a word that was associated with Evangelistic efforts going back to the 19th century. If the Church needs a revival it is NOT a good sign. Thats something you NEVER hear anyone saying. Why should the Church imparted with the Life of God need a revival? The world cannot be revived. The world needs to be Resurrected. Thats the problem with these Non-Biblical terms and concepts that have no meaning. People are then free to give it ANY meaning THEY CHOOSE.*
I like both Gavin and Alisa. I think Gavin is a very scholarly guy. I think Alisa is saying, we really need to apply biblical discernment, and we must love the truth. The gospel cannot be watered down, and it must be preached boldly and clearly and faithfully. When this is done, it will cause persecution from the world and division.
1 John 4:1: "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world." I think it is always healthy to expect God's answer our prayers for true Revival. Also, to recognize God's Ways are not our ways, but to recognize humans will "get" part of God's ways, and mess up other aspects. 🙏🤲🕊🤗
@@Sherlock245 - there is no evidence of Francis Chan, Rick Warren or IHOP being at this event; much less being platformed. Can you provide images of their being present at Asbury?
@@Sherlock245 that Feb 23rd prayer event was taking place at college campuses nationwide- my educated guess is that if Francis Chan or Rick Warren attended, likely it was at a college or university closer to where they reside.
@@dawnzimmerman6818 no it was meant to be at the college. I am not mistaken as others got it confirmed too but again di you check out the gay student leading worship do you understand the issue?
I have been following this and agree with Alisa but also, as a social worker, believe that the people making the pilgrimage are doing it because they are starving for the spirit and the reason they are going there is because we are all so disconnected. If they are not affiliated with a home church, their experience can change their lives. Some people need that desperately right now. Hopefully, there will be true repentance and dedication to living a Christlike life, learning and becoming like Him. That is my prayer 🙏🏻
At first I thought Alisa was being closed minded, but the more I listened I think she’s simply asking, if someone shared the gospel about sin and rebirth that comes from repentance and acceptance of Jesus as Lord during the “revival”, and actually named certain things as sin that’s a social red flag these days, would people applaud in agreement or would it be mood kill? Would revivalist back then refrain from calling out sin to avoid “quenching the spirit”? I’m not saying this to validate her point. Just think it’s a fair question.
She’s very graceful in her tone and she comes from a good place bringing up these valid points. I would appreciate if the preachers would talk about rampant sin plaguing this generation primarily homosexuality and trans lifestyle. It’s all over tik tok, men becoming women and women becoming men. The kids are doing it too from peer pressure and also parent pressure…this was a missed opportunity to reach the lost and unsaved generation. Why aren’t they approaching secular campuses, hosting debates, opening dialogue to discuss these glaringly obvious sins? At least with the Jesus movement in 60s and 70s many gave up their free sex lifestyle, drugs and rebellion against parents. To compare this “revival” to that movement is not appropriate. Why aren’t these issues talked about when the call to action is to evangelize the world not the church? Something is missing here and not many are noticing.
I agree with Alissa a lot. Simplicity and clarity of the good news of Christ and the cross are very sadly lacking in Churches and schools. How can I support that which is not clear and often repeated? Blessings
Is a revival is something other than a new beginning of obedience to God? Just as in the case of a converted sinner, the first step is a deep repentance, a breaking down of heart, a getting down into the dust before God, with deep humility, and forsaking of sin. Christians having their faith renewed. This happened.
I guess my concern is that what should regularly accompany evangelism (repentance, water baptisms, loving affection, faith, and even the manifestations of the gifts of the Spirit) is now called "revival" instead of what is commonly accompanied with evangelism, as we see in the book of Acts. I agree with Alisa that we can't play loose with terminology, we need to be specific and concrete in our definitions of terms.
*What accompanied the ACTS were people being Baptized in the Holy Spirit, speaking in NEW tongues, casting out devils and HEALING of the SICK. Let people start getting HEALED of complications from having been v **-x-** n t'd. Then watch what happens.*
Around 1977, a group of students came to my historical theology professor Dr. Robert Webber at Wheaton College Graduate School and asked if he would pray with them for revival. He offered to discuss with them the needs of the contemporary Church. They declined. Perhaps we need both.
@@Sherlock245 if this is true, may he be convicted of his sin and repent. There’s hope in the gospel and the assurance of salvation if we humble ourselves and repent and live lives pleasing to our Heavenly Father.
@Adam Fontenet I too approach this with some scepticism and would tend to agree though there may be some genuine believers. The Lord knows who they are. My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all ; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand. I and the Father are one
It Breaks my heart when young people deconvert into skepticism or atheism and agnosticism. So when I see young people going forward and repenting of their sins and turning to Christ, I rejoice.
Test the spirits. Make sure all aspects of Gospel of Jesus Christ is occurring first and foremost. Without the one Gospel anything can appear as Angel of Light. In Jesus name.
So disappointed in Alisa’s lack of discernment. I am afraid she has become so focussed on her metrics and fears that her jadedness is all that’s coming thru. Praying for her ministry going forward.
I couldn't agree more, I have long appreciated her ministry but here I sense a lack of humility in her tone and speaking which is a bit of a flag to me. The problem with apologetics is that knowledge puffs up.( 1 Corinthians 8:12 Now about food sacrificed to idols; We know that "We all possess knowledge". But knowledge puffs up while love builds up. Teachers should always be on guard for that. John 13:34-35 comes to mind, A new command I give you; Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another. People are won by the love of Christ not apologetics and theology. Babes need milk first.
Something written on their page, does not suffice if it’s not put into practice. You can be historic in Christian faith, and still stray. Which Asbury like so many other Christian Seminaries have done.
Justin, you are a great host! You know how to ask very good questions you are a great moderator. Thank you for help bringing up the IQ of Christian discourse solely with your British accent 😂
I share with Alisa's concerns, but I was just speaking with someone and I was so happy that the world is seeing a gathering of Christians that was all about worship, repentance, and Jesus. The world would love for this to become moral/political. I love that I can point to this as an example that Christians are obsessed with Jesus, and not with anti-abortion and anti-LGBT mantras.
Amen! THANK YOU for this critically important conversation. I LOVE it when we aren't speaking over one another - but engaging in serious discourse from different vantage points to make sense of what God is doing through the Asbury Outpouring. I hope we can see this type of discussion more in the future. Iron sharpening iron combined with a respectful, graceful, but also honest and candid debate is a godly way for us to collectively grow in grace. Well done!!!
4. If I were preaching the Gospel to friends, I talk about sin, but I don't list all the possible sins and I certainly don't highlight LGBT necessarily. 1:04:58 Why is Alisa emphasising this? 5. Most of us, when we become Christians, repent and believe as we are convicted of sin and we are justified. But our sanctification takes longer as God convicts us further and works in us.
She highlighted sin period. But the school has taken on the likes of Marxist Theology via Critical Race Theory, Gay & Christian, Racism etc. These are issues are they not?
@TinaMarie Johnson I'm not sure that was clear from the stream. But if God has been convicting them of sin, in my experience, he will continue to work in them. In my experience, God doesn't completely sanctify us at conversion. It takes time. I get why she is cautious, because of abuse and distortion e.g. in NAR, but God is working beautifully, and I think we can trust Him to convict people in His own time and way.
You're right about her emphasis. Indeed, I have seen video after video of various Christian apologists using same sex relationships as their singular example of a "sin" that must be confronted and, yes, judged. So, it's contagious. I assume it's because it's the one sin that they're at least mostly sure they haven't committed. We need to have a more robust doctrine of sin, with the knowledge that all of us -- even me and Alisa -- are constantly sinning in some way compared to an infinitely holy God. And you're right about sanctification. People often invite the Holy Spirit in to fix a window, but are then surprised to discover that He wants to tear down all the walls.
@Tim Schnacke I have never heard anyone say a person has to fix their bad relationship with food (overeating/greed) before they become Christian. Yet this sin also damages our body, the Temple of the Holy Spirit.
Sorry Alisa, I heard that message and it was to Seminary Students, and it was an advance message to realize that they cannot keep God's commandments, because they cannot love like is required. This was a very faithful message to call biblically literate people to examine their destitution and desperate need for self-examination.
Like some theologians, pastors and experts on revivals like Gavin have been reiterating, moments like these are not organised. It can get messy. People whom we wished were not part of it will show up. Trying to intervene, will be to disrupt the work of God. Looks like for Alisa, every revival, prayer meeting and what not needs to be about the right view of gender, justice etc. Obstinacy to accept/understand/empathise with the counterpart's view is often misunderstood to be 'standing for the truth.' And a willingness to accept your rival's justification unless it does contradict Scripture, does not mean compromise or watering down Scripture. I understand gender issues are rampant. Biblical view of marriage is being challenged. But there is a place and time to address them and address them trenchantly. I wish Alisa was a bit more mature and was able to see the magnitude of things happening there instead of myopically using this opportunity to lobby for her views and sowing doubts in people's minds.
Her scrutiny was responded to and yet she was not satisfied and that's because Tennent's perspective was not hers. That is why she was obstinate. Tennent did acknowledge that the fruit of this awakening can only be witnessed in the future. What more does she want? Alisa was impetuous enough to judge it now. Tennent's reply and Gavin's explanation were not only intelligent but wise and mature.
Tennant needs to make sure that the gospel is clearly proclaimed in these meetings. That is the only way people can truly be saved (other than individual Christians sharing with others). I trust that the latter is happening, but the former needs to be ubiquitous. "Jesus has a wonderful plan for your life" is NOT the gospel, yet this is apparently what one of the women proclaimed the gospel was from the stage.
Alisa’s points of the need for the Gospel to be preached clearly so that can repent is supported by what we see the apostles doing while talking to the crowds. That’s a valid question.
I’m very impressed with Timothy’s humble responses- & love Gavin responses of how Jesus tells us to discern. I’m not sure why there’s questioning the move of the Holy Spirit- you can’t put ‘structure & answers’ to the outpouring of the Holy Spirit - does alisa want repentant people to follow some kind of script?? Hmmm Jesus help us against this spirit of criticism
Timothy and Gavin choose to follow Jesus while Alisa did not ask but was born to followers. This might be what be fuels her skepticism. Do you think Satan would orchestrate these kids to come to repentance with the love of God? Are we afraid that the Gospel is not being taught at this Wesleyan college? I’m Not a Skeptic but a person that loves to see people hearing God speaking to them. I say, on March 1st, 2023, that I’m so happy MANY young people are hearing God express His love for them, repenting and letting go of depression, anger, wrong thoughts and feelings. It’s good. Don’t wish you had experienced the fullness of Asbury while you were there Alisa, as you said we don’t have to go to a place to find God - He is right where you are when you need Him.
This whole conversation is why our kids can't stand the evangelical leadership in the United States. All it takes is to have a social media following and you can pontificate on whether this is a good thing. Dear God, these kids responded to a law and gospel message and they spent a week worshipping and praying. Thank you God.
Jesus said: I am going to send you what my Father has promised; stay in the city until you have been clothed with power from on high.” People are so dried up in their emotionally and spiritually dead congregations and are so tired of hearing the same mental religion over and over again that they will travel and experiment a move of God because they are thirsty to feel the presence of God.
The absolute disconnect of Alisa Childers to cite Jonathan Edwards in her article favorably as a positive example of how to evaluate a revival, and then complain that this revival hasn't cause youth to publicly abandon CRT. The man owned slaves....
I understand Alisa's concerns, but Asbury is a Christian college with clearly defined orthodox Christian belief statements that all Asbury students should be familiar with and revival is something that happens to Christians who already understand the gospel- Revival refers to a spiritual reawakening from a state of dormancy or stagnation in the life of a believer. It encompasses the resurfacing of a love for God, an appreciation of God’s holiness, a passion for His Word and His church, a convicting awareness of personal and corporate sin, a spirit of humility, and a desire for repentance and growth in righteousness. Revival invigorates and sometimes deepens a believer’s faith, opening his or her eyes to the truth in a fresh, new way. It generally involves the connotation of a fresh start with a clean slate, marking a new beginning of a life lived in obedience to God. Revival breaks the charm and power of the world, which blinds the eyes of men, and generates both the will and power to live in the world but not of the world. Revival, in many respects, replicates the believer’s experience when he or she is saved. It is initiated by a prompting of the Holy Spirit, creating an awareness of something missing or wrong in the believer’s life that can only be righted by God. The evidence of revival, a great outpouring of the Holy Spirit upon believers, is changed lives. Great movements toward righteousness, evangelism, and social justice occur. Believers are once again spending time in prayer and reading and obeying God’s Word. Believers begin to powerfully use their spiritual gifts. There is confession of sin and repentance. Got Questions . org God simply confounds us and doesn't always act according to how WE would expect. We are all made in his image and know who He is inside while at the same time suppressing our knowledge of Him (Romans 1). As stated, there is a human response to His Spirit when He meets our longing for Him. It's a wonderful thing when this happens, we should enjoy it while it lasts because the thorns and thistles of life are still here as well. This time of revival is not going to be a time of deep theological education and discipleship, but that will come as they pursue their newfound desire (that comes with revival) to please the Lord with their lives. Why would we be expecting a revival to be less messy than the church itself is messy and has been messy. Those who want to pursue God and learn and grow in doctrine will do so. There's an abundance of good theological education on the internet these days! Let's also keep in mind that many Christians have testimonies of being drawn to Christ, but not through stellar gospel preaching and while they were not even in church and yet, they pursued God and then found Him and grew in their understanding of Him and what the gospel is and then they were discipled. Yes, let's be ready to steward what God is doing. Praise God for bringing people together to read scripture, sing, pray, and praise His name.
As a reformed Calvinist, all i will say is God can strike a straight blow with a crooked stick. Those people asking and accepting Jesus into their lives and souls and they are seeking truth WILL find Christ and conviction via the Holy Spirit. Whether they are doing SJW preaching or biblical faithful or loose or tight. If a persons heart is open to truth, he or she will find it by sincerely reading scripture and following Jesus who is truth. But Alisa is asking the right questions. My conversion was through conviction of my sin. I didn't even hear a message. I grew up in a Christian house and one day the Holy Spirit came down on my like a ton of bricks
I agree with Gavin young people need this joy in their lives. The last few years have been awful for them and it’s not getting better.
Actually, young people need truth. The evidence of true repentance is a humble confession of one's sin nature and a desire to let God have their whole heart. Joy is a result of repentance.
@@jillcolvin4196 And there has been repentance at these events.
Under 90 would be 'young' among Christians...
Gavin’s humble hunger and broad historical perspective is wise and generous.
Praise our Lord Jesus for his sovereign outpourings! Blow upon my dry bones.
Really appreciate Dr. Ortlund, he always seems to bring a measured, sensible perspective and a humble attitude.
Thank God for Alisa and how she powerfully stood her ground. The clarity of the gospel must be the engine that drives true repentance.
People like Alisa who spread fear and tribalism in the name of “discernment” are a part of the reason why Christianity in America and the West, is in the hole it’s in.
Timothy Tennent gave the impression of being in awe of and humbled by what was happening. He obviously believes it is genuine
Make a list of those who think this is of God, you can really tell who has discernment and who doesn’t right now.
@Ephesians511 I don't really know apart from these two, tbh. Do you have a list?
I think Alisa is just tired and cautious
Apparent sincerity of belief doesn't have any bearing on if it's true. If sincerity were the standard, cults like Bethel, Islam, Jehovah's Witness, and Latter Day Saints would be equally viable. They are not viable.
This dude has a conflict of interest that must be acknowledged. He has a vested interest in making his school appealing to any looking for their own degree. Take him with a grain of salt.
@reiner311 although i hear what you say, my point stands. Many JW and Islamic leaders do not come across as sincere. I would argue that Isincere Muslims are ex-muslims or severely brainwashed. I know plenty of academics whose motivation is dubious, but they don't come across as sincere.
I have never thought Bill Johnson is sincere
i have a confession, i was a Trans girl all over the internet making porn videos, when I was young I was raped by my grandfather I was so scared I did not tell anyone out of fear that he would kill me, I was having sex with him at 9 to 12 years old, then my mom throw me out at 15 years old I was living in the streets in and out foster homes, at 17 i was selling my self as a trans-t-girl whore that went on till I was 26 than at 30 i got into porn than I got into drugs and alcohol always trying to hide the abuse I went trow as a child and all my youth, so at 23 years old I started to get help only for the trauma and i could not accept the fact i was a woman in a man's body only for all the doctor to say to me i was born that way, every time I tried to get into a relationship With a lot of guys, I was never accepted for maybe a few years because of who I was, and all I was a piece of A_S_S to all the men, a lot of them were married, and one day i pic up the bible, and something happened it open my eyes, and it took another 10 more years for me to wake up and for god to deliver me from this, i always knew it was wrong but i did not understand what was going on with me and i really did not want to live this lifestyle if you ever want to be close to hell live this lifestale ,all i was just another piece meat fulfilling someone else's sick fantasies have any idea how men i sleep with in just one day , than one day ,i was praying god please help me after 3 suicides and i was going to kill my self and god heard me and his grace touched my heart and soul, it took a little work not long and a lot praying , but he delivered me from it not only from the homosexual lifestyle but from porn also and drugs and alcohol and cigarettes, im free , im just sorry all my photos and porn videos are all over the internet there no way to remove it , but I'm free im free living a normal somewhat lifestyle except i have to deal with the Disassociation and Disconnecting. all the times even when im typing you this massage im sorry for my spelling i never made it in school but its so hard to focus ill just have to i pray god he will help me with the trauma iv been throw ,but to all of you doctore and Therapist. it's a lie I was too steps from getting the operation and i thank god did not, i did have some makeover to pass as a woman but lucky me i did not go all the way , but god has set me free to all, the doctors and different Therapist.i went throw all those years was a waste of my time they lied to me, you are not born that way god does not make junk lol my old icon pic was the old me my name used to be Samantha but can call me Tommy, please please i pray for all the lgbt turn your life over to god, and please pray for me so god can remove the ugly past i can't sleep sometimes because of this
I have been praying for the expansion of the Father's kingdom across our nation and the world, and this has greatly cheered me to see. At a time when everything seems corrupted I really needed this. There is hope, and God is still in charge.
God grants us failures to grow
If your hopes are crushed to pieces then God’s gunna work with you but it’s gunna take a while before you’re ready for anything beyond trivial in His kingdom
Thanks Dr. Gavin for your input, gentle, assertive and balanced in his view.
I am completely confident that Jesus Will Build His Church and nothing, nor no one, will stop Him from doing that.
...very brave Alisa Childers .....thank you ....
What a blessing to have such wise leadership at Asbury. Thank you God .
I'm Catholic so I'm not that familiar with all of that "revival" and "awakening" talk that protestants use, but being 24 years old myself and coming form atheism to Christianity, I think for all that I've seen happening at Asbury, it is something really beautiful and gives me hope for young people, how can't I rejoice when people are finding Christ and repenting of their sins? I hope God works in the hearts of all those who were there.
You should listen to Richard Bennett.
@@Sherlock245 Oh bro that's children stuff 😂😂 if you want real Catholic polemics you should listen to Diamond brothers or Jay Dyer
I recommend Gavin Ortlund. His channel is Truth Unites
@@joelmontero9439
I love Jay Dyer, been subscribed to him for years. He has some great bible studies..
@@ProfYaffle As a catholic I can affirm Gavin is good I like his historical approach to the topics, also like Jordan Cooper's work. But to be honest if you convert as an adult to Catholicism from atheism in the 21st century there are very few things that could make me go protestant😂😂 I'm sorry guys to be catholic in this day and age requires you to do a lot of study and discernment so for me the only other option to Catholicism is just something like neo-platonism.
God bless you still
Dr Gavin Ortlund - fabulous to see him on this show!
I am 76 and was introduced to the charismatic renewal movement in 1971, which I was told was the outgrowth of the 1970 Asbury outpouring. Most of the emphasis was experiencing the power of the Holy Spirit and His gifts, healing and casting out demons. There was little, if any, focus on core doctrine such as the Fall, original sin, what it means to be born again (gifts of saving repentance and faith), dealing with the flesh post new birth, the fear of God. It led to super-controlling practices like shepherding, which hurt a lot of people; and even new age ideology such as Agnes Sandford’s “the healing light.” I so appreciate men like Steve Lawson who teach core doctrine - which is largely “not” what you hear from pulpits today. Is a revival among today’s leadership - biblical reformation - the greatest need? Without it, will “experience” be placed above “truth.” And how can true discipleship take place without core doctrine? Do the young people at Asbury see the Trinitarian Jesus, Lord and Judge, or the “nice” Jesus who doesn’t want to hurt anyone? Can we learn from the past, so the present Asbury revival reaches the maturity God wants?
Amen. And thank you
Thank you for sharing such great insight!
Are you saying that the real Jesus does want to hurt people? And for the record Steve Lawson is a Calvinist. You don't go to a Calvinist to get a sound presentation of the gospel.
@@JewandGreek Jesus does not want to hurt people - it is His will that none should perish. That is why He suffered on Calvary. What I am saying is that Jesus is God, and he is Judge, and He will judge people who don't repent of their sin. He being both Savior and Judge is biblical truth. Hell is real. Many churches present Him only as Savior. One's coming to Jesus for salvation (and what it means to believe in Him and not only have head knowledge of Him) involves a conviction of our rebellion against Him; sorrow for it; turning from our rebellion (sin); relying on Jesus and His finished work on Calvary on our behalf; and yielding to Him as Lord is the only way to be saved from God's wrath (the wrath of the Trinitarian Jesus), and eternal separation from Him. That's the gospel! And it is what Steve Lawson proclaims. That is more important than he is a Calvinist. It is biblical truth. Are you born again? Do you have the assurance of eternal life? Does your church teach that truth? (John 3:3) To contend with Calvinism is to major in minors. Contending for biblical truth is what matters. Please stand for biblical truth! Check out John 3:18, in which Jesus said that "he who doesn't believe in me is condemned already." That is not the water-downed so-called American gospel that is preached today. What gospel do you believe in?
@@samanthabotha3456 Thank you.
So pleased you've got Dr Gavin Ortlund on the show, Justin
He’s a false teacher along with his brother and father. Beware!
And I'm so grateful for Gavin's ability to see the good in this
Why? He didn’t anything biblically tangible.
@@worldupsidedown1 oh! Could you tell me something he has said that is false, please?
@TinaMarie Johnson can I suggest you watch his streams.
Where exactly do you think he should have drawn on the Scriptures, but didn't, in this conversation. And where did Alisa, in contrast, noticeably draw on Scripture.
I think both of them are good, but Alisa appears to have become understandably cynical because of NAR
I was there multiple nights and was blessed to be able to pray for many people as a member of the prayer team. IMHO this was an outpouring of God's love, not a revival. I will always look back at this time where "God came near" as one of the highlights of my life. There was confession, repentance, salvations, healings and even some deliverances. Thanks be to God! It is hard to convey what it felt like to be there and I am excited to see the fruit of what will come out of this whole thing. Also, the University and the Seminary did an excellent job stewarding this two week outpouring, trying to honorably respond moment by moment as needs demanded immediate decisions.
Which is a Biblical promise, that in the last days he will pour out His spirit! Praise God!
Thank you for this first hand account! Amen. Thanks be to God!
Hi Jeff, when you say there were healings, do you mean that people with actual ailments that could not be treated with modern medicine were healed by some otherworldly force?
@@RLBays yes, that is correct. Supernatural power of God came down upon natural man. The following Sunday, after the Asbury two week session, there was another event at Rupp Arena which is our big basketball arena where the Univ of Ky plays basketball and it was rented out by another ministry called Pulse from Minnesota. On that Sunday, a man who had been wheelchair bound since 2018 was able to get out of his chair, give testimony and walk and dance on stage. It was really wonderful what the Lord did for him. However, I see various types of healings every week. Thanks be to God!
@@jeffrogers4251 Thanks for the response! I'm curious though, how do you know the man was wheelchair bound since 2018?
Great conversation. Thanks Justin, for your shows. The Ortlunds are a blessing.
I believe Mr. Ortlund Spoke with much wisdom. My sense is that (IF) Mrs. Childers concerns about the colleges (possilble) liberal leanings are a reality then this latest publicity will bring everything out in the open. Her concerns are valid up to a certain point, the churches today are apostatizing left and right, but as Mr. Ortlund stated there are manifestations of the Holy Spirit at work in the lives of these students and it will now be the job of the college to continue the work the Holy Spirit began by teaching these students Biblical truths.
Well said
Wait wait! So, somehow the Spirit was working apart from the clarity of the essential message of the gospel? Interesting, so, that is learned afterward huh?
The gospel is the power of God onto salvation! It’s what brings spiritual life that leads to a true repentance through the Holy Spirit. There is no truly knowing biblical truths apart from being spiritually alive first. Plus, the Holy Spirit does not work apart from the gospel message in bring spiritual life. And again spiritual life is needed even to repent. What will bring spiritual life is literally the gospel with the Holy Spirit. They work together in bring the spiritual life, never apart.
@@TheDavidBarraza Jesus said it the most succinctly: those who worship me must worship in Spirit and in Truth!
Even the spreading of the gospel by the early church was messy. Good talk. Clarity and change in behaviour happen over time. I like Garvin's balanced approach.
Wrong they did not invite other gods in. And you just sold your soul to bethel to todd white and Kate kerr powerful prophetic women.
Was it messy? I doubt that from my reading of Acts. 'Revivals are known by their fruit." Well, I was part of a local revival in 1972 coming directly out the Jesus People Movement, and what I saw in this particular local revival in 1972 was in no way messy. And there were lasting fruits -- there was a rare obedience and focus on Jesus, powerful and restrained love, devotion to prayer and Bible study and fellowship and availability to God and each other, evangelism etc. Real revival produces a totally renewed church and the definition if that is simply given in Acts 2:42 where the key is really 24/7 devotion which is really missing generally in the church in the US.
Act 2:42 And they devoted themselves to the apostles' teaching and fellowship, to the breaking of bread and the prayers.
FYI, my maternal grandparents also came out of a local revival in 1900 and that had great and lasting fruit, and my grandparents also led holy and totally exemplary lives. So I know what I am talking about. God's peace to y'all. ❤
i have a confession, i was a Trans girl all over the internet making porn videos, when I was young I was raped by my grandfather I was so scared I did not tell anyone out of fear that he would kill me, I was having sex with him at 9 to 12 years old, then my mom throw me out at 15 years old I was living in the streets in and out foster homes, at 17 i was selling my self as a trans-t-girl whore that went on till I was 26 than at 30 i got into porn than I got into drugs and alcohol always trying to hide the abuse I went trow as a child and all my youth, so at 23 years old I started to get help only for the trauma and i could not accept the fact i was a woman in a man's body only for all the doctor to say to me i was born that way, every time I tried to get into a relationship With a lot of guys, I was never accepted for maybe a few years because of who I was, and all I was a piece of A_S_S to all the men, a lot of them were married, and one day i pic up the bible, and something happened it open my eyes, and it took another 10 more years for me to wake up and for god to deliver me from this, i always knew it was wrong but i did not understand what was going on with me and i really did not want to live this lifestyle if you ever want to be close to hell live this lifestale ,all i was just another piece meat fulfilling someone else's sick fantasies have any idea how men i sleep with in just one day , than one day ,i was praying god please help me after 3 suicides and i was going to kill my self and god heard me and his grace touched my heart and soul, it took a little work not long and a lot praying , but he delivered me from it not only from the homosexual lifestyle but from porn also and drugs and alcohol and cigarettes, im free , im just sorry all my photos and porn videos are all over the internet there no way to remove it , but I'm free im free living a normal somewhat lifestyle except i have to deal with the Disassociation and Disconnecting. all the times even when im typing you this massage im sorry for my spelling i never made it in school but its so hard to focus ill just have to i pray god he will help me with the trauma iv been throw ,but to all of you doctore and Therapist. it's a lie I was too steps from getting the operation and i thank god did not, i did have some makeover to pass as a woman but lucky me i did not go all the way , but god has set me free to all, the doctors and different Therapist.i went throw all those years was a waste of my time they lied to me, you are not born that way god does not make junk lol my old icon pic was the old me my name used to be Samantha but can call me Tommy, please please i pray for all the lgbt turn your life over to god, and please pray for me so god can remove the ugly past i can't sleep sometimes because of this
@@SaharanKnight My dear you need to read Acts carefully. All the problems you see today are mirrored in some small way in Acts. E.g. Ananias and Sapphira attitude to be seen of men; Jewish discrimination of the Gentiles; etc. All the epistles that we read are attempts to correct issues that were present in the church. That is what I mean by messy. With any move of God you still have stuff to clean-up. Hence you cannot judge a move of God because things get messy. Messy is what humans do.
@Adam Fontenet Read Acts carefully. I do not mean the disciples were not preaching the gospel, it means that there were people with their own agendas; there was discrimination among Jews and Gentiles, etc. Hence, the apostles had to address these issues. This is largely the contents of the epistles, the apostles instructing believers.
I understand your concerns about introducing scripture during this revival. However,
My personal story is I was so hungry & thirsty to know Jesus . After searching in all the wrong churches & feeling & believing that I was not worthy of His Love. I came to a point that I knew in my heart He was the only way. Through His intervention and plan for me, He placed 2 women in my life at my most desperate moment. They started out with scripture and asked me what it meant to me. I had nothing.
I started to ask questions and Praise His Holy Name, my God given mentors gently and lovingly walked me through with patience and love.
I get your concerns about possibly not having mature mentors there during this Asbury revival. But it will come to those who are truly seeking our Savior. Hope this made sense. Praise Jesus.
Yes. That is what I am trying to say. Even if there is wrong stuff, we have to believe God can reach people who are seeking. In the NT we do not see a one size fits all approach to sharing the goid news. And ultimately God convicts, not humans.
Also, what Alisa is expressing is NOT biblical 'truth' but rather HER PERSONAL AND DENOMINATIONAL PERSPECTIVE on what the Bible says. She is splitting hairs here and expecting a revival that looks like her own views and NOT the life changing work of the Holy Spirit.
Greetings from Kentucky! I'm very blessed to listen to my favorite Calvinist, my favorite daughter of a Jesus Music pioneer, and my favorite British person have a reasonable discussion of this important topic. As someone burned very badly by the Word of Faith Movement (and Progressive Christianity), I am naturally skeptical. I have been very encouraged by the majority of what I have witnessed.
Rick warren, bethel, Ihop attendend the event. Don't be deceived of the positiveness. As you can get that too in a catholic church.
@@Sherlock245 - why are you judging this by people who showed up? It’s not like they were invited as platform speakers.
@@dawnzimmerman6818 they did not turn up they got invited to speak. There is much you don't know. Don't base your judgement on positive fine cause then you need to be Islamic then.
@@Sherlock245 - can you please provide video or photo evidence of their presence at these gatherings?
@@dawnzimmerman6818 the thing is these funny things happen and with people with rick warren and Ihop being planned and invited is never good. Again just the same as those in bethel and other supernatural conferences.
In a world so filled with alarming news from every quarter this is news of hope in God calling His people to draw near Him. This awakening has brought hope to many. My prayer is that God will continue to send a spirit of repentance and forgiveness to Asbury and beyond.
Thank you, Alisa.
Alisa is so intelligent and asking the questions that need to be asked!
Alisa, thank you for staying true and being Christ centered! 🙏🏾❤️
Rick warren, bethel, Ihop attendend the event. Don't be deceived of the positiveness. As you can get that too in a catholic church.
@@Sherlock245 actually they didn’t. They were supposed to… planned to… advertised… but I watched the whole event for Collegiate Prayer Day and Warren, Chan, and iHop didn’t show.
@@Sherlock245 May have been 2 fold:
Protecting from “Christian celebrities” and also the Warren/Saddleback issue that came up the past couple days.
@@michellemyers4219 its ending and shutting down that why they did not come but they did invite them over. Go to a catholic church you can exp God moving.
Very good, clear, respectable conversation Alisa and Gavin. Each of you made great points! It is good to see the different perspectives of each of you coming from different Christian backgrounds, experiences and concerns. God Bless you and continue the conversations!
Rick warren, bethel, Ihop attendend the event. Don't be deceived of the positiveness. As you can get that too in a catholic church.
As a recovering “bethel type” of church. Anytime I hear bethel and Hillsong music combined with certain types of prayer patterns and “lingo” it gives me the heebie-jeebies. Is the gospel being preached ? Are people being called to repent ? Is this a group of “Christians” getting emotionally whooped up or are non believers coming to faith and turning from sin? Hope it’s real….
Amen
All you hear from the men is “peace, love, joy, but no repentance. No gospel being preached. They’re simply peddling disingenuousness and hot air talking fillers.
Maybe research the entire event for yourself and how it began before you jump to conclusions. Also, who is going to have a problem with a song saying “Worthy Is The Lamb” - the angels proclaim that in John’s vision In Revelation. Don’t get me wrong - I’m Australian and am well versed in Hillsong, however there were some sincere songwriters who have since moved on, like Miriam Webster.
@@tinamariejohnson7520 that is an absolute lie
There are some great traditional hymns that people sing without a second thought that we're written by hymns writers with unorthodox theology to.
Alisa’s concern about whether the Gospel is being preached and whether it’s being preached truthfully and fully is very important. If we model after Jesus, He was very clear and bold with the Truth when He spoke, and either people were convicted and followed Him or were insulted because they thought they knew better as Alisa said. Thanks to Alisa for not backing down on that critical distinction. Otherwise, it’s potentially leading people astray.
*Hunger for God and hunger for the supernatural. Thats what we're seeing at Asbury. What is going to fill the hunger... Thats what has yet to be seen. We want to jump the gun and tie everything up in a neat little package so we can comfort ourselves. Instead of being cautious and waiting.*
I pray is that thease precious young people are and will be led by the Holy Spirit through Jesus Christ and their hearts will be genuinely turned back to Abba Father and they obey his word and receive the complete and whole Gospel and word of God as Is God's will for the young one 🙏 ❤️
I found her demeanor somewhat disappointing, she has seen enough to know this is a genuine outpouring of God's Spirit.
@@PETERJOHN101 I thought she had valid insights that were ignored. She is deeply knowledgeable about the progressive movement but they totally dismissed her. .
The Asbury campus pastorette and her husband were both formerly at my university. They held an ecumenical candlelight service where all religious leaders were invited and performed their own worship and prayer. We were supposedly building bridges and learning truth from one another. These are the people leading the "revival". I have emails from both, they are far from orthodox. They also had a who's who of the emerging church march thru the campus. Speaking "Christianeese", but far from believing the truth of the Word
A great pastor this Gavin.
Alisa, It is good to be cautious and discerning but as someone who was there for 3 days I can say there have been clear and strong messages given throughout this revival. I'm not really sure how they could be any more classical within the evangelical tradition.
Anyone can access these messages through the internet.
There's been a strong push for repentance, holiness, accountability before God and man, and total dependence on Jesus Christ as the only savior of the world.
What is the gospel? How would you explain it? You Been there three days now, and they’ve been proclaiming it with clarity, so you must have a clear idea of how to express it in a short paragraph. So what’s the gospel message?
We’ll see how it all turns out when the dust settles. Hopefully the university folks don’t turn out to be woke. That would be a great turn off.
What I get from Alissa is that she is trying to say “TEST ALL THINGS”!!!
@@TheDavidBarraza just by the tone of your comment, I have to wonder if you know the gospel message. Not just by rote, but actually living it out. Can you preach the clear truth of the gospel message by the power of the Holy Spirit with the love of Jesus Christ?
*Ya, Ive seen the gospel being preached there but not by students or staff. Its by people who came from outside. And as soon as this happened they moved to shut it down. I have to question that.*
I'm so glad you included Dr. Ortllund in this podcast. He puts things into perspective (for me).
Alisa has very compelling points that need to be considered thoroughly. We need to be discerning and watch for the fruits of these movements.
What makes her an expert in how God works? I think they have no clue what is happening. They have no prepared themselves for this. As it has been foretold as far back as 2014.. She seems like she does not believe in the Gifts of the Spirit.. And will be her mistake. As Jesus told them, And greater things then I have done. Will you do in my Name. As they were commanded to wait in the upper room. Till the Holy Spirit fell on them. then they went out healing all kinds of sickness. Diseases. Raising the Dead etc.. It's been going on in China for 40 years...
@@WizzRacing because God does not violate his word. And Rick warren, bethel, Ihop attendending the event has violated it. Don't be deceived of the positiveness. As you can get that too in a catholic church.
His glory, He will not share with any man. Alicia , give glory to the power of the Holy Spirit at work in one of most precarious time in history in America.
Stop being analitical of God's move within and among the younger generation.
Instead of viewers applauding Alicia, Let God do His work in His own way and time.
Main while, Let all the SAINTS JOIN TOGETHER IN PRAYER FOR THE POWER OF GOD TO BE EXPERIENCE AMONG THE YOUTH.
@@Sherlock245 You have no idea what you are talking about. Unless you want to show evidence for such matters.
So I would ask you. Have you been filled the Holy Spirit and the gifts of God? If so explain the experience.
@@patoz4959 They can't tell you what is going on. Why God is going to show them his Power and Glory. Not their water down version of of the Gospels.
This is going to change the landscape of America and the world. And God will get the credit for it. Not the Churches. Not Governments. Not Politics.
This is God raising up a new church. His Church. Which will have power over all things in his Name, It will be something to behold..Be like some out of the movie The Ten Commandments. Behold the Power Of God..As Aron puts forth his staff..
Great times to witness..
"Clarity on the gospel, sin and repentance." 👍 Thanks Alisa for putting that out. I believe your concerns are on point. Also appreciate you for always going back to the scriptures.
"Your emotions are a great engine light, but they're not a great GPS. 😅 We want to make sure that our emotions are being brought under the subjection of the truth of God's revealed word."
A very good and timely reminder for me 🙂
Excellent conversation! Justin, you’re a gifted host. I covered Asbury on my channel and I’m thankful for what God is doing in the hearts of people. ❤
Thank you, thank you so much Alisa Childers, you are a real breath of fresh air in this conversation. Your wait-and-see perspective (not skeptical) is much needed. You voiced my concern perfectly when you asked regarding the place the Gospel in the Asbury 'revival.'
I am in Sydney Australia, so I only have the interviews, commentaries and videos to go by, but I have not heard the Gospel. It seems to be a singing 'revival,' and I wonder if there is such a thing, really. Bless you Alisa!
Alisa could very well be projecting upon what is happening at Asbury out of what she focuses on in her personal ministry.
It's not unreasonable to question. I begins to be unreasonable to persist when adiquit answers are provided. Asbury is experiencing a move of the Holy Spirit. Let the Spirit move. This is not the time to worry but rejoice. These kids need this.
Alisa brings so much clarity, compassion, wisdom, Godly caution, love of the gospel and biblical knowledge. So grateful that she is not intimidated to speak the truth and ask questions to ensure that the flock is being shepherded well.
She has no idea what God is doing.. This movement started in a University. It will spread across the Universities. As the Church is dead. It's been dead for 40 years. As they got to caught up in Politics. Why this Revival is for the younger generations. As the churches failed them. So God is doing it.
It will surpass anything the world has seen. As it's God's turn now. And he is raising up a new church. One that will see the power of God like it never has...
Rick warren, bethel, Ihop attendend the event. Don't be deceived of the positiveness. As you can get that too in a catholic church.
@@Sherlock245 Well it didn't start in ma church.
So no. I never heard of a revival breakout in a Catholic Church. Unless you want to name some..
@@WizzRacing revival can be anything you just have not been to one. Do you want to go to a catholic and exp the move of God in there?
@@WizzRacing hilarious
I appreciate Alisa s voice of reasoning as one tha she wants it to be a genuine revival and thus doesn't shy to look for the true fruits of a revival
"Clarity" does not mean bashing
The degree to which Childers subordinates all other concerns to her very particular culture war hangups ("CRT"!) becomes increasingly awe-inspiring as the discussion progresses.
One could almost assume that she is a grifter
@@wildhias6195 On the one hand I credit her for being so blatant about it. On the other hand, equating that stuff with "the gospel" comes close to idolatry
There can be no revival without the truth of God’s Word.
Amen. Say it louder
What is a revival? And why do we need to use that label for what happened at Asbury?
"Blessed is the man who trusts in the Lord, And whose hope is in the Lord". Jeremiah 17:7 🙏
there is a Christian show in Canada called "100 Huntley Street"....these 2 men in their 40's went from downtown Toronto location to Asbury.They planned to stay 2 hrs and fly home. They stayed over 8 hours, the brokenness and honor they gave to this outpouring is worth a watch!
there's a Wikipedia page on Alisa Childers, she is the daughter of Chuck Girard (popular Jesus Movement singer).....she has 2 books about the deception within Christianity over the last 20 years (which of course is valid), yet I get the distinct impression she is hostile to Asbury because she is still injured (I could be wrong)!
She's on the panel because 'she is the daughter of a famous person ', and also of her own fame as being in a 2000's gospel girl group!
To me, she is a problem...she's not the right commentator for this outpouring, I have seen many post out there and she is virally dominant!
@@projectdesign4675 I believe it's wisdom to be cautious, and wait to see the fruit.
Many pastors are saying the very same things she is saying.
I watched 100 Huntley street, my whole life, until about 4 years ago. It is not a reliable Christian program. They have true authors, preachers, teachers, mixed in with all the crazy hyper charismatics, false teachers / preachers and heretical authors, plus Catholics. My eyes were finally open to the lack of discernment and false teachers allowed on their program, and stopped watching it. Take a look at who’ve they’ve allowed on there over the years, and who’ve they’ve rubbed shoulders with. There is a huge lack of discernment and a disconnect on the program, to the real God of scripture.
*Asbury is not an Outpouring. It isnt a Revival. If you don't know what these things are how do you know that Asbury is one or both?*
@@projectdesign4675 she is certainly right for this interview.
We always need to worship in spirit AND truth.
Praise God for discerning spirits.
Alisa Childers is much, much more optimistic amd constructive from her initial cynicism in her own posts. It is encouraging to hear her equivocation and qualifiers to her criticism of this revival last week. It is a sign of her own, " radical humility" as Dr.Tennet clarified with earlier.
Praise God for Alisa!
Hi everyone! I pray we are all well. A beautiful answer to this is to remember the revival in 2 Chronicles 34, during Josiah's remarkable and Spirit-led leadership. Take time to read over it to see the key ingredients needed in that revival. The main ingredient was the reading of God's Word, the book of the Law. Not much is known on my end about Asbury or the revival going on. I am not here to confirm nor deny it. I have not witnessed it yet, but I would like to share this great study so we can see the revival in Jerusalem and Judah. God bless us all! The Word of God is important as a lamp unto our paths.
Great job Alisa, they need to be asked tough questions
Why?
@@edplaster9802 Because scripture says “Test all things”
They also need our prayerful support. None of this is easy for the local leadership.
I agree to the gospel needing to be preached.
As someone who struggled with anxiety my whole life, the only thing that cured that was the gospel, understanding my need for Jesus. If I was just given an evening of peace it would not cross over into my daily life. Yes I understand people who are hurting feeling peace there. But how will that help them once they leave the building? They will wonder where that peaceful feeling went?
I was caught up in that and it left me feeling empty, chasing the emotional high.
People need the gospel, they need something lasting, a person Jesus Christ.
Also the gospel is a message of Jesus work on the cross. Not a command to go love others. That is the result.
God is patient with our sins. Let’s not be too quick to judge when people fall short of scripture or make mistakes. If and when we see signs of maliciousness, then we act with firm love and stand our ground in the Lord.
Peter kept sinning AFTER being baptized in the spirit. We know this since he was being judgmental, as Paul tells us, towards gentiles. Last time I checked that WAS sin.
@@mountbrocken God knows we are not perfect. He gives us gentle correction when we are humble enough to accept that. It’s when we forget that we are not perfect that we get into “trouble”.
@@markr5251 agreed, we should speak the truth in love, listen well and love well, be gentle and gracious and keep our focus on Jesus.
i have a confession, i was a Trans girl all over the internet making porn videos, when I was young I was raped by my grandfather I was so scared I did not tell anyone out of fear that he would kill me, I was having sex with him at 9 to 12 years old, then my mom throw me out at 15 years old I was living in the streets in and out foster homes, at 17 i was selling my self as a trans-t-girl whore that went on till I was 26 than at 30 i got into porn than I got into drugs and alcohol always trying to hide the abuse I went trow as a child and all my youth, so at 23 years old I started to get help only for the trauma and i could not accept the fact i was a woman in a man's body only for all the doctor to say to me i was born that way, every time I tried to get into a relationship With a lot of guys, I was never accepted for maybe a few years because of who I was, and all I was a piece of A_S_S to all the men, a lot of them were married, and one day i pic up the bible, and something happened it open my eyes, and it took another 10 more years for me to wake up and for god to deliver me from this, i always knew it was wrong but i did not understand what was going on with me and i really did not want to live this lifestyle if you ever want to be close to hell live this lifestale ,all i was just another piece meat fulfilling someone else's sick fantasies have any idea how men i sleep with in just one day , than one day ,i was praying god please help me after 3 suicides and i was going to kill my self and god heard me and his grace touched my heart and soul, it took a little work not long and a lot praying , but he delivered me from it not only from the homosexual lifestyle but from porn also and drugs and alcohol and cigarettes, im free , im just sorry all my photos and porn videos are all over the internet there no way to remove it , but I'm free im free living a normal somewhat lifestyle except i have to deal with the Disassociation and Disconnecting. all the times even when im typing you this massage im sorry for my spelling i never made it in school but its so hard to focus ill just have to i pray god he will help me with the trauma iv been throw ,but to all of you doctore and Therapist. it's a lie I was too steps from getting the operation and i thank god did not, i did have some makeover to pass as a woman but lucky me i did not go all the way , but god has set me free to all, the doctors and different Therapist.i went throw all those years was a waste of my time they lied to me, you are not born that way god does not make junk lol my old icon pic was the old me my name used to be Samantha but can call me Tommy, please please i pray for all the lgbt turn your life over to god, and please pray for me so god can remove the ugly past i can't sleep sometimes because of this
Praising the Lord for a woman of the Word like Alisa. May the Lord comfort and encourage her as she boldly stands firm on the truth of God's Word. "Discernment is not knowing the difference between right and wrong. It is knowing the difference between right and almost right.” - Charles Spurgeon.
Indeed. We need more bible-centred Christians like Alisa speaking out.
Dr Gavin Ortlund😃👍
I'm sorry but I am of the opinion that Alisa Childers' insistence that the students who have been the recipients of the Spirit's move at Asbury clarify immediately their stance on CRT and the LGBTQ+ is theologically and pastorally misguided. When I preach to a larger group, I make no assumptions about where they stand on those issues that have been tearing apart the social fabric of our nation. I follow what Paul tells Timothy: "Remember Jesus Christ, raised from the dead, descended from David" (2 Timothy 2:8). As the Spirit convicts the heart and renews the mind of those who receive this core message, then it is appropriate to explore issues of theological anthropology and Christian ethics. Here too we can trust the Spirit as he attests the truths of the Scriptures that he has inspired.
So excited: My favorite theology content creator as guest on my favourite podcast! Must be a dream come true 😊
Alicia Childers, thank you for being concerned for the true work of the Holy Spirit in convicting concerning sin, righteousness and judgment. For that we can go on giving Him praise and honor and glory! If there is a hunger for God we have to make sure they are fed the right and holy God of scripture and not a false Jesus, not a false gospel and not a false Holy Spirit.
Did Timothy even understand what Alisa was asking him about identity issues and the gospel? It seemed to me that he did not understand or he didn’t seem to give a clear answer to her question.
Thankful for this.
I’m very impressed with Alisa Childers ability to speak with incredible eloquence and brilliance!
“Radical humility” I love that phrase.
I respect this woman so much.
It's not so easy to find a woman with this much discernment and articulation. Praise God for her voice in apologetics. ❤️
.....it's difficult to find men and women like Childers. But the network she us connected with which includes Greg Laurie, Amir Tsafarti, Jack Hibbs, there is a solid foundation in The Word and spirit of truth.
If I get nothing else from this occurrence atAsbury college, I am grateful for having been introduced to Allisa Childers. She has quite a head on her shoulders. Her approach to this seems balanced and healthy.
I thought she was cautious which is somewhat understandable but not balanced though. I see where her concerns lie, but some of them are ideological.
@ Sa. Hayes, I consider her being balanced because she is not writing this off as NOT being a work of God. She’s allowing for the possibility. That’s what I meant by balanced. For the record, let me state that I do NOT believe that this is a work of God. I do believe that God can use it, but I do not believe that it is coming from God but, rather, man.
Spirit AND truth for real worship!!!
Thank you guys very much.
Alisa Childers great concern I appreciate you very much. I see it as God doing something here with theses college kids. Those mature in the faith should help balance what does go on here. I'm not there or haven't been there but from almost all video clips iv seen I haven't heart the actual Gospel clearly preached at all. Preach Christ and continue to preach.
Yes sing and praise and pray but preaching the Gospel is the power of God unto salvation.
As a former charismatic, I affirm Alisa’s concerns.
Alisa, you are right on in all you’ve said. I grew up Pentecostal and use to the long services and such focus on “experiencing God.” I’ve since come to a better understanding, through the Holy Spirit leading me out , and attend a Baptist church. I now feel closer to God, and now it’s not about the music or hype, but the focus is on God’s word, scripture. I would attend a church that’s all about the preaching / teaching, and wouldn’t even care if there’s a song sang..that’s how much I’ve been changed. I’m grateful everyday that the Holy Spirit lead me to a great church.
God bless your testimony. Wise words.
Valerie Hancock
Joined Sep 25, 2020 *Yep. This is the OBJECTIVE. The OBJECTIVE right now is to destroy Churches that ACCEPT the Holy Spirit. This comment is complete bunk. Its intended to INFLUENCE others. It has NO MERIT. The WAR right now is on ANY Church that ACCEPTS the New Testament Acts doctrinal precepts of t Holy Spirit*
*The Holy Spirit would never lead anyone to a Church that DENIES HIMSELF.*
The Bible is full of His people singing songs of praise and lament. Psalms is well - a book of songs.
When Jesus ascended back into heaven His last words were that He left a Comforter in his stead. It's interesting that He did not use that moment to talk about the collection of written testimonies that would become the Bible hundreds of years later as a replacement for His physical presence. The Holy Spirit is confirmed by the Bible, not replaced by it.
Great conversation! I think they did a great job with shepherding this. God will continue to move. I do think we have a specific definition of "revival" that we are trying to make this fit into rather than seeing it as an awakening.
Also remember not all students are in their late teens/early 20's ;)
(Alisa seems really stuck on the LGBTQ question - appreciated Gavin's response about how there is time for those issues later)
"I do think we have a specific definition of "revival" *Because it isnt a Biblical concept. The concept of Revival isn't present over the entire Biblical Record. Its a word that was associated with Evangelistic efforts going back to the 19th century. If the Church needs a revival it is NOT a good sign. Thats something you NEVER hear anyone saying. Why should the Church imparted with the Life of God need a revival? The world cannot be revived. The world needs to be Resurrected. Thats the problem with these Non-Biblical terms and concepts that have no meaning. People are then free to give it ANY meaning THEY CHOOSE.*
I like both Gavin and Alisa. I think Gavin is a very scholarly guy. I think Alisa is saying, we really need to apply biblical discernment, and we must love the truth. The gospel cannot be watered down, and it must be preached boldly and clearly and faithfully. When this is done, it will cause persecution from the world and division.
I agree
1 John 4:1: "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world." I think it is always healthy to expect God's answer our prayers for true Revival. Also, to recognize God's Ways are not our ways, but to recognize humans will "get" part of God's ways, and mess up other aspects. 🙏🤲🕊🤗
Rick warren, bethel, Ihop attendend the event. Don't be deceived of the positiveness. As you can get that too in a catholic church.
@@Sherlock245 - there is no evidence of Francis Chan, Rick Warren or IHOP being at this event; much less being platformed.
Can you provide images of their being present at Asbury?
@@dawnzimmerman6818 there is there were invited but the whole even is now shut.
@@Sherlock245 that Feb 23rd prayer event was taking place at college campuses nationwide- my educated guess is that if Francis Chan or Rick Warren attended, likely it was at a college or university closer to where they reside.
@@dawnzimmerman6818 no it was meant to be at the college. I am not mistaken as others got it confirmed too but again di you check out the gay student leading worship do you understand the issue?
I have been following this and agree with Alisa but also, as a social worker, believe that the people making the pilgrimage are doing it because they are starving for the spirit and the reason they are going there is because we are all so disconnected. If they are not affiliated with a home church, their experience can change their lives. Some people need that desperately right now. Hopefully, there will be true repentance and dedication to living a Christlike life, learning and becoming like Him. That is my prayer 🙏🏻
The woman in this video reminds me of Charles Finney’s critic, John Williamson Nevin. Praying she does not harm the work of Holy Spirit.
Thanks for sharing. Quite informative and also quite revealing of what is in the hearts of the 3 participants.
At first I thought Alisa was being closed minded, but the more I listened I think she’s simply asking, if someone shared the gospel about sin and rebirth that comes from repentance and acceptance of Jesus as Lord during the “revival”, and actually named certain things as sin that’s a social red flag these days, would people applaud in agreement or would it be mood kill? Would revivalist back then refrain from calling out sin to avoid “quenching the spirit”? I’m not saying this to validate her point. Just think it’s a fair question.
She’s very graceful in her tone and she comes from a good place bringing up these valid points. I would appreciate if the preachers would talk about rampant sin plaguing this generation primarily homosexuality and trans lifestyle. It’s all over tik tok, men becoming women and women becoming men. The kids are doing it too from peer pressure and also parent pressure…this was a missed opportunity to reach the lost and unsaved generation. Why aren’t they approaching secular campuses, hosting debates, opening dialogue to discuss these glaringly obvious sins? At least with the Jesus movement in 60s and 70s many gave up their free sex lifestyle, drugs and rebellion against parents. To compare this “revival” to that movement is not appropriate. Why aren’t these issues talked about when the call to action is to evangelize the world not the church? Something is missing here and not many are noticing.
She exudes grace and courage and humility, I love her❤️
I agree with Alissa a lot. Simplicity and clarity of the good news of Christ and the cross are very sadly lacking in Churches and schools. How can I support that which is not clear and often repeated? Blessings
Our approach needs to be balanced. We should be excited, but not foolish, and discerning, but not overly critical.
Is a revival is something other than a new beginning of obedience to God? Just as in the case of a converted sinner, the first step is a deep repentance, a breaking down of heart, a getting down into the dust before God, with deep humility, and forsaking of sin. Christians having their faith renewed. This happened.
I guess my concern is that what should regularly accompany evangelism (repentance, water baptisms, loving affection, faith, and even the manifestations of the gifts of the Spirit) is now called "revival" instead of what is commonly accompanied with evangelism, as we see in the book of Acts. I agree with Alisa that we can't play loose with terminology, we need to be specific and concrete in our definitions of terms.
*What accompanied the ACTS were people being Baptized in the Holy Spirit, speaking in NEW tongues, casting out devils and HEALING of the SICK. Let people start getting HEALED of complications from having been v **-x-** n t'd. Then watch what happens.*
Alisha a voice of reason and gives a clear voice of truth and to the gospel of Jesus Christ.
I love your show Justin. Keep up the great work.
Around 1977, a group of students came to my historical theology professor Dr. Robert Webber at Wheaton College Graduate School and asked if he would pray with them for revival. He offered to discuss with them the needs of the contemporary Church. They declined. Perhaps we need both.
Thank God for His work in Asbury.
Where gay student lead worship
@@Sherlock245 if this is true, may he be convicted of his sin and repent. There’s hope in the gospel and the assurance of salvation if we humble ourselves and repent and live lives pleasing to our Heavenly Father.
@Adam Fontenet I too approach this with some scepticism and would tend to agree though there may be some genuine believers. The Lord knows who they are.
My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all ; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand. I and the Father are one
It Breaks my heart when young people deconvert into skepticism or atheism and agnosticism. So when I see young people going forward and repenting of their sins and turning to Christ, I rejoice.
Test the spirits. Make sure all aspects of Gospel of Jesus Christ is occurring first and foremost. Without the one Gospel anything can appear as Angel of Light. In Jesus name.
I just hope that, in their hunger, they are truly desiring biblical truth and not merely therapeutic moralism or feel-good religion.
So disappointed in Alisa’s lack of discernment. I am afraid she has become so focussed on her metrics and fears that her jadedness is all that’s coming thru. Praying for her ministry going forward.
I couldn't agree more, I have long appreciated her ministry but here I sense a lack of humility in her tone and speaking which is a bit of a flag to me. The problem with apologetics is that knowledge puffs up.( 1 Corinthians 8:12 Now about food sacrificed to idols; We know that "We all possess knowledge". But knowledge puffs up while love builds up. Teachers should always be on guard for that. John 13:34-35 comes to mind, A new command I give you; Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another. People are won by the love of Christ not apologetics and theology. Babes need milk first.
Something written on their page, does not suffice if it’s not put into practice.
You can be historic in Christian faith, and still stray. Which Asbury like so many other Christian Seminaries have done.
Justin, you are a great host! You know how to ask very good questions you are a great moderator. Thank you for help bringing up the IQ of Christian discourse solely with your British accent 😂
Haha!
I share with Alisa's concerns, but I was just speaking with someone and I was so happy that the world is seeing a gathering of Christians that was all about worship, repentance, and Jesus. The world would love for this to become moral/political. I love that I can point to this as an example that Christians are obsessed with Jesus, and not with anti-abortion and anti-LGBT mantras.
Alisa was brilliant and asks some excellent questions.
She really was. And had a sober balance.
Amen! THANK YOU for this critically important conversation. I LOVE it when we aren't speaking over one another - but engaging in serious discourse from different vantage points to make sense of what God is doing through the Asbury Outpouring. I hope we can see this type of discussion more in the future. Iron sharpening iron combined with a respectful, graceful, but also honest and candid debate is a godly way for us to collectively grow in grace. Well done!!!
4. If I were preaching the Gospel to friends, I talk about sin, but I don't list all the possible sins and I certainly don't highlight LGBT necessarily. 1:04:58
Why is Alisa emphasising this?
5. Most of us, when we become Christians, repent and believe as we are convicted of sin and we are justified. But our sanctification takes longer as God convicts us further and works in us.
She highlighted sin period. But the school has taken on the likes of Marxist Theology via Critical Race Theory, Gay & Christian, Racism etc. These are issues are they not?
@TinaMarie Johnson I'm not sure that was clear from the stream. But if God has been convicting them of sin, in my experience, he will continue to work in them. In my experience, God doesn't completely sanctify us at conversion. It takes time.
I get why she is cautious, because of abuse and distortion e.g. in NAR, but God is working beautifully, and I think we can trust Him to convict people in His own time and way.
You're right about her emphasis. Indeed, I have seen video after video of various Christian apologists using same sex relationships as their singular example of a "sin" that must be confronted and, yes, judged. So, it's contagious. I assume it's because it's the one sin that they're at least mostly sure they haven't committed. We need to have a more robust doctrine of sin, with the knowledge that all of us -- even me and Alisa -- are constantly sinning in some way compared to an infinitely holy God. And you're right about sanctification. People often invite the Holy Spirit in to fix a window, but are then surprised to discover that He wants to tear down all the walls.
@Tim Schnacke I have never heard anyone say a person has to fix their bad relationship with food (overeating/greed) before they become Christian. Yet this sin also damages our body, the Temple of the Holy Spirit.
Sorry Alisa, I heard that message and it was to Seminary Students, and it was an advance message to realize that they cannot keep God's commandments, because they cannot love like is required. This was a very faithful message to call biblically literate people to examine their destitution and desperate need for self-examination.
Like some theologians, pastors and experts on revivals like Gavin have been reiterating, moments like these are not organised. It can get messy. People whom we wished were not part of it will show up. Trying to intervene, will be to disrupt the work of God.
Looks like for Alisa, every revival, prayer meeting and what not needs to be about the right view of gender, justice etc.
Obstinacy to accept/understand/empathise with the counterpart's view is often misunderstood to be 'standing for the truth.'
And a willingness to accept your rival's justification unless it does contradict Scripture, does not mean compromise or watering down Scripture.
I understand gender issues are rampant. Biblical view of marriage is being challenged. But there is a place and time to address them and address them trenchantly.
I wish Alisa was a bit more mature and was able to see the magnitude of things happening there instead of myopically using this opportunity to lobby for her views and sowing doubts in people's minds.
The god of the bible promotes murder, rape, incest, polygamy, infanticide, slavery, human and animal sacrifice and cannibalism
Her scrutiny was responded to and yet she was not satisfied and that's because Tennent's perspective was not hers. That is why she was obstinate. Tennent did acknowledge that the fruit of this awakening can only be witnessed in the future. What more does she want? Alisa was impetuous enough to judge it now. Tennent's reply and Gavin's explanation were not only intelligent but wise and mature.
Tennant needs to make sure that the gospel is clearly proclaimed in these meetings. That is the only way people can truly be saved (other than individual Christians sharing with others). I trust that the latter is happening, but the former needs to be ubiquitous. "Jesus has a wonderful plan for your life" is NOT the gospel, yet this is apparently what one of the women proclaimed the gospel was from the stage.
I agree with Alissa
I’m burned out from Christian Narcissists. Period. Tired of them!!! These are good. Meditation is good! Let the Holy Spirit do its work!
Alisa’s points of the need for the Gospel to be preached clearly so that can repent is supported by what we see the apostles doing while talking to the crowds. That’s a valid question.
The entire testimony was that they were repenting of sin, so they pass the test right?
The Apostle Paul asked for prayer that he might preach the Gospel more clearly. Why? Because that's what's needed for true transformation to occur!
I’m very impressed with Timothy’s humble responses- & love Gavin responses of how Jesus tells us to discern. I’m not sure why there’s questioning the move of the Holy Spirit- you can’t put ‘structure & answers’ to the outpouring of the Holy Spirit - does alisa want repentant people to follow some kind of script?? Hmmm Jesus help us against this spirit of criticism
I agree
Wish Dr Tennet had been on the whole time
What a humble and loving guy
Timothy and Gavin choose to follow Jesus while Alisa did not ask but was born to followers. This might be what be fuels her skepticism.
Do you think Satan would orchestrate these kids to come to repentance with the love of God? Are we afraid that the Gospel is not being taught at this Wesleyan college?
I’m Not a Skeptic but a person that loves to see people hearing God speaking to them. I say, on March 1st, 2023, that I’m so happy MANY young people are hearing God express His love for them, repenting and letting go of depression, anger, wrong thoughts and feelings. It’s good.
Don’t wish you had experienced the fullness of Asbury while you were there Alisa, as you said we don’t have to go to a place to find God - He is right where you are when you need Him.
This whole conversation is why our kids can't stand the evangelical leadership in the United States. All it takes is to have a social media following and you can pontificate on whether this is a good thing. Dear God, these kids responded to a law and gospel message and they spent a week worshipping and praying. Thank you God.
You are spot on. Just exhausting
The gospel is centered in the death of Christ in his atonement in our place, for our sin. That is basic, basic, basic. Where/when did you hear that?
@@margiedenavarre7919 Listen to the talk the chapel speaker gave.
Jesus said: I am going to send you what my Father has promised; stay in the city until you have been clothed with power from on high.” People are so dried up in their emotionally and spiritually dead congregations and are so tired of hearing the same mental religion over and over again that they will travel and experiment a move of God because they are thirsty to feel the presence of God.
I agree. ❤️
Pick this apart y'all ---- There Is Joy in Heaven over One Sinner Who Repents
Luke 15:8 - 10
The absolute disconnect of Alisa Childers to cite Jonathan Edwards in her article favorably as a positive example of how to evaluate a revival, and then complain that this revival hasn't cause youth to publicly abandon CRT.
The man owned slaves....
I understand Alisa's concerns, but Asbury is a Christian college with clearly defined orthodox Christian belief statements that all Asbury students should be familiar with and revival is something that happens to Christians who already understand the gospel-
Revival refers to a spiritual reawakening from a state of dormancy or stagnation in the life of a believer. It encompasses the resurfacing of a love for God, an appreciation of God’s holiness, a passion for His Word and His church, a convicting awareness of personal and corporate sin, a spirit of humility, and a desire for repentance and growth in righteousness. Revival invigorates and sometimes deepens a believer’s faith, opening his or her eyes to the truth in a fresh, new way. It generally involves the connotation of a fresh start with a clean slate, marking a new beginning of a life lived in obedience to God. Revival breaks the charm and power of the world, which blinds the eyes of men, and generates both the will and power to live in the world but not of the world. Revival, in many respects, replicates the believer’s experience when he or she is saved. It is initiated by a prompting of the Holy Spirit, creating an awareness of something missing or wrong in the believer’s life that can only be righted by God. The evidence of revival, a great outpouring of the Holy Spirit upon believers, is changed lives. Great movements toward righteousness, evangelism, and social justice occur. Believers are once again spending time in prayer and reading and obeying God’s Word. Believers begin to powerfully use their spiritual gifts. There is confession of sin and repentance. Got Questions . org
God simply confounds us and doesn't always act according to how WE would expect. We are all made in his image and know who He is inside while at the same time suppressing our knowledge of Him (Romans 1). As stated, there is a human response to His Spirit when He meets our longing for Him. It's a wonderful thing when this happens, we should enjoy it while it lasts because the thorns and thistles of life are still here as well. This time of revival is not going to be a time of deep theological education and discipleship, but that will come as they pursue their newfound desire (that comes with revival) to please the Lord with their lives. Why would we be expecting a revival to be less messy than the church itself is messy and has been messy. Those who want to pursue God and learn and grow in doctrine will do so. There's an abundance of good theological education on the internet these days!
Let's also keep in mind that many Christians have testimonies of being drawn to Christ, but not through stellar gospel preaching and while they were not even in church and yet, they pursued God and then found Him and grew in their understanding of Him and what the gospel is and then they were discipled. Yes, let's be ready to steward what God is doing. Praise God for bringing people together to read scripture, sing, pray, and praise His name.
Christians need the gospel daily, not just the unsaved.
@@paulajames6149 How do you know they don't understand the gospel and remind themselves of it daily?
As a reformed Calvinist, all i will say is God can strike a straight blow with a crooked stick. Those people asking and accepting Jesus into their lives and souls and they are seeking truth WILL find Christ and conviction via the Holy Spirit.
Whether they are doing SJW preaching or biblical faithful or loose or tight. If a persons heart is open to truth, he or she will find it by sincerely reading scripture and following Jesus who is truth.
But Alisa is asking the right questions.
My conversion was through conviction of my sin. I didn't even hear a message. I grew up in a Christian house and one day the Holy Spirit came down on my like a ton of bricks