Villager Nerfs Are Causing Players To QUIT MINECRAFT
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- Опубліковано 23 вер 2023
- Players are quitting Minecraft in droves due to huge nerfs to villager trading... but it doesn't have to be this way! The changes to villagers on their own aren't all bad... but the alternatives to trading with villagers are TERRIBLE. Here we recap the nerfs, get to the root of the problem, and talk about HOW it can be fixed!
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Imo, the number one problem by far that plagues the enchantment system unequivocally is by far the anvil. The reason low level enchantments from any source, be it loot from a majority of loot chests of any variety, or even villagers suck is because of how much it costs to upgrade and combine enchantments. It is insanely inefficient and just does not make it at all even close to worth it to use em. Both in terms of XP use and the time it takes to find the exact enchantment level you need to upgrade a pre-existing one. Not to mention the "too expensive" nonsense they tacked on for no reason.
Amen
A few worlds back, I was making new amour and with my max level books, to put every enchantment I wanted onto a piece of amour was taking 30 levels!! If you add into it combining books that aren't max level to get them up there, you could easily burn through 60 levels and if you aren't at an insane xp/loot farm that's a LOT of levels to get just for 1 piece of amour.
😢
One of the things with villager trading halls is that they can also be a huge source of xp. Which is yet another reason why they are so worth it to build even though the process can be a real pain. Right now all they are doing is nerfing some things without giving players multiple alternative ways to do things differently. Only addressing one aspect of enchanting is a mistake. They need to rebalance the entire system all at once or just leave it alone.
@HellBlazerMNE07 Blud just did not read my comment at all 💀💀💀
You're the definition of trying to make a paragraph into a 10,000 word essay 😴
Also, for switch players, forcing people to generate thousands of new chunks to find these villages increases file size dramatically, and any file size on switch above 200mb is a huge issue. Makes the game laggy and crashes and basically unplayable.
Same on android
Java lags in any case. Just worse
Java never lags for me unless im loading unloaded chunks at super speeds. Plus java has server optimization mods that can be used to help with any performance issues.@@menosproblemos6993
@@menosproblemos6993sodium, optifine, etc have entered the chat
mine just passed 500 MB :face_with_spiral_eyes:
My problem with these changes is how hard it will be to get good equipment then you die and lose it all then it takes another 10 hours to replace it, why would you want to go explore the world when you die 10k blocks away from spawn having slept and broke your bed and try to get back to all you lose
Yep, this is where a better enchanting table experience would be great. If it was easier to grind out getting better gear at the enchanting table, then you wouldn't need to worry about traveling out 10k blocks to get villager trades.
@@Prowl8413 and unless the change the XP cost of building up equipment it's going to thousands of levels to get top equipment
because Mojang doesn't think common sense like this. There's dozens of people using "statistics" determining what they think players would want or how the overall "mid game" experience can be prolonged instead of giving the players better reasons for sticking around in the "end game".
Things like special powers or tools to act as "on the go" versions of Beacons to uncover, unique weapons that can't be crafted but are distinct like from Minecraft Dungeons to more simple, basic additions like concrete stairs, slabs & walls.
Yeah I’m 100% not interested in playing like that. Experiences like that are enough to make me walk away from the game for a loooooooong time.
@@HellBlazerMNE07 either your Java player or you don't play the way I do, but which ever what gives you the right to judge someone else just because I can't we all can't be super combat specialists like you
Ive always felt a little strange that Im 48 years old and I just Love Minecraft. Seeing other adults that are obsessed makes me feel like hey maybe I am normal.
Gaming has no age restriction. We all have our own pastime and shouldnt judge what make other people happy. Im 50 and been gaming all my life. I still remember when they use to say gaming rots the brain, or its just a fad LOL. The 1st time I saw my nephews playing Minecraft about 10 years ago, i said "Why are you playing this game. It looks so bad"... Then they talked me into playing it and showed me how to build with redstone and I was hooked.
Man, I have three uncles that got me into Minecraft nearly 10 years ago. They had a dedicated server and we would play as a large extended family. I'm now in my 30s and still play Minecraft. My uncles (in their 50s and 60s) still play MC occasionally, too.
All they need to do is make enchantment combining and gear repairing WAY cheaper and not have a cap on how much you can combine/repair. And make leading villagers easier too.
its funny we dont have any cap(until the programing logic cap)in getting xp while you git this capped wall for anvil
Yeah, THIS would be really useful. especially with the Ideas Prowl mentions. if you have a bunch of low level enchantments its nearly impossible to grade them up to high tiers.
So yes, Cap the Level and from this point every combination yhould always cost this amount of levels
I have very little trouble with villagers - I play villager based and move them around constantly. The secret is don't give them options and don't get in a hurry. Of course, as my kids always say about me, being OCD really helps too!
if anvil woldnt have a cap, i bet a lot of people wouldnt need to put mending on everything, but nowadays if u dont put mending eventualy you gear will breake
or maybe just make repairing fucking free besides the material.
As a player that likes big builds and terraforming I absolutely despise the experimental villager changes and will stop playing if they go through as is. The proposed changes you suggested combined with removing the anvil limit would make the changes more palatable.
Yeah, I intend to stop playing anything other than my two worlds that are established with a trading post.
As the changes are it makes the game not fun for me in new worlds.
I've spent 4 months building my world with traders and farms just so I can eventually do a big build. Anyone doing big builds in survival will be affected greatly by this.
Turn off Automatic updates. Stay in this version of the game
You can still play with mods/datapacks or use commands if you play singleplayer, no need to stop playing.
For me, it isn't the over 7200 blocks I would have to travel to the closest swamp from my base,(spawn) it's the leveling up of the villagers once you get there. Then to have to go to six other biomes is just crazy. It would take away my time to explore the things I want to check out, as well as time from my builds. It kind of eliminates the freedom you're supposed to have in Minecraft.
Yes, i agree with you i have to travel 6000 blocks to the nearest desert It makes use of enchantment useless and limited
A really important thing Mojang should consider is that Bedrock players, which are more than Java players and usually younger and less knowledgable, are forced to accept the features they provide (even though for those plays on PC, we have some ways to bypass this limitation), so when they are nerfing features, they really should be very very careful. Especially the revive of Minecraft community is highly related to Dream's Manhunt series, it will be hard to hope the community to revive again if it is destroyed once more
Basically your "normie" minecraft player will never get most enchants now.
@@Prowl8413 until they fix the update, they won't have people playing anyway.
@@Prowl8413 not really though, afk fishing farm is pretty easy to set up in bedrock edition
I don’t know many norm or players setting up afk fishing farms. Especially on console or mobile.
@@Prowl8413what Mojang need to consider is the lack of features available to Bedrock players.. Java players can find the trades they want in the relevant biomes and then move villagers quite easily utilising the Nether roof.. A feature hugely lacking to Bedrock. They also have far superior raid farms available due spawn rates etc meaning discounts won't effect them the same as they have pretty much unlimited emeralds.. They should at the very least consider seriously buffing the "Hero of the village" effect so that bigger discounts apply
OMG thank you! 👏 I really feel this villager change is focused on making the game more difficult for professional players/streamers. The rest of us derps just want to enjoy the casual game.
Hmm.. For streamers , its another episode searching for a villager , its casual people that dont have all day to spend in the game that will find it more annoying having to spend days finding things .
@@bencoley7024 Yes, but that's the point being made; the devs aren't thinking through the second order effects, or they don't care about them. Slowing down the pros is the point, and whatever happens to the casuals doesn't matter. That's what's so annoying about it. What is a minor inconvenience to pros is significantly more trouble to the rest of us, so if the changes are being made to nerf the top players, that seems like an unwise focus.
Honestly, though making a 1 emerald trading system isn't really casual minecraft if you ask me. I did put hours into mine though 😢
Minecraft has a definite scalability problem. It goes from scarcity to OP like you are flicking a switch. They should be working on a better ramp up between the early game and late game if they really want to fix things
I think really the issue is that OP is too OP... XP, and drop rates likely would need to be nerfed significantly on the top end... then the way different things scale, like XP, would need to be adjusted down to compensate.
I doubt they ever do this though.
or just a better end game so people want to stick around. because scalability is relative. watching my little brother still in the "Iron Age" on day 30 while I'm on my backup set of Netherite armor makes this impossible to legitimately improve. The early / mid game can be traversed through at whatever pace you'd like. The problem is their lack of end game substance keeping people around & wanting to play after they've already seen the handful of minor additions they've made to the early / middle part of most people's SEVERAL playthroughs.
Be cooler if they wanted people to create long-term sustaining worlds instead of 2 week spurts that happen every couple years …
It's an absolute mess since last this most recent update, the game keeps crashing and in game keeps freezing up,, the mobs are not spawning properly, etc.... it seems to be getting worse and worse
@@Prowl8413 I think XP system doesn't have to be nerved though, having too many XP doesn't really make you too OP.
Love the idea of being able to spend lapis to re-roll enchants at the enchanting table. Along with that I think we should be able to add enchants to already enchanted gear and that we should be able to selectively remove enchants from a piece of gear.
I thought about this idea after I finished the video... being able to add enchants at the enchanting table to existing gear would be great.
@@Prowl8413 Or at the very least, they should do something about the silly level punishment after using anvil to combine items
@@user-ej7sr3ow8b my thoughts are charge xp to combine the books together but not have that effect the xp level cost to put it on equipment
@@user-ej7sr3ow8bI sigh heavily every time I see the words "Too Expensive"
@@Prowl8413 Being able to change the table's hovering book to different enchanted books have you choose which enchantment you want (if you want sharpness enchants you put a sharpness book on there)
It'd even give more of a purpose for the new bookshelf.
This is my comment about the villager nerfs:
In the update note, there were mentions of "some players think trades are too random" and "enchanting table is relatively weak" (I'm paraphrasing), as justifications for the nerfs. None of the changes fix these 2 problems in a good way. The enchanting table is still anachronistic, and while there's less randomness involved in trading, in some cases it is now rendered almost pointless.
Yes, maxed out trading was OP, but that doesn't mean it had to be nerfed to that extent. As OP as it was, still most players didn't built trading halls with all the enchantments. Even less players had access to 1 emerald trades, since that option is only reliable in Hard, and still is very costly in terms of time and resource (yes, most players dont have gold farms either).
For me, villager trading was just one of several options to get enchantments. It sucks to have Mojang cripple the best of those options, and it's worse when the reasons they give don't make much sense.
I think that the argument "it doesn't affect me directly, so I don't care" is very narrow and shortsighted. What we have now is a bad behavior on the part of the developers of our beloved game, that could be fixed with better communication with the playerbase, not just "some players".
A way to put our xp into bottles or another storage container in the game would be nice as well..
I like this idea, so often we have to travel and or explore and end up getting killed in some far away land, if we had the levels stored at home we would travel more to other locations in the world.
I think they thought Skulk could be that way to store XP. It's way too cumbersome for the little you get, however. I would like to store XP manually. Bottle is a decent way. They could also add a new totem that you hold when getting XP and it absorbs it. Then you can "use" it to get it when desired.
There's furnaces too for storing xp, but that's not really an intended use. The sad part is that it's easier, in just about every possible way, to use furnaces for xp storage than it is do the same with skulk. Even though that's an intended function of skulk and not an intended function of furnaces.
Oh! Almost forgot. In bedrock multi-player worlds, it's been my experience that maps cause horrible lag. To the point that they've been banned on Prowl's Patrion worlds. Now they're adding more maps. Is there a way to code maps so that lag is minimized?
It's frustrating that almost nobody is talking about the Bedrock map issues. I've been in "pending approval" limbo on their feedback site since Sept 7. I tried a second comment a few days later with zero formatting & less obvious bug talk. It hasn't been approved either.
It’s impossible unless they do it themselves. The only way to deal with them is to use a file trimmer and do it that way.
Yes, it would be nice to be naive and think they will of course fix the Map Bugs and not break people's Worlds and wreck the servers and realms... But I have been playing Minecraft far too long for that.
It basically has to be a demand from Us Bedrock Players to Fix The Maps before bring in the new Maps.
I would Love the Village Map circle.... IF the Maps were not going to be a huge huge problem.
I don't think Minecraft would last a week after the Update with the Maps the way they are now. Not everyone knows how bad Maps are for a World, even people who play Multiplayer on Realms or Servers. So people open the 7 Village Maps, a few Shipwreck Maps...
I haven't really played in probably 2 years now. The new Caves and Cliffs world generation destroyed the world I was playing, then Ores and More did the same to my new world. That combined with the warden (that nobody asked for) and the continued lack of the promised pouches has basically killed my desire to play.
Changes like these are clearly because they're upset that people are shortcutting the boring and tedious parts of the game so they can just go have fun. "Why are you having fun? Stooop it!!"
Game companies in general seem to be forgetting that the purpose of a GAME is to have FUN.
The enchantment table could be infinitely cooler. If we utilized the new bookshelves then you could add differnt enchanted books which would expand a library of enchants that you now have immediate acces to without having to reroll, and it could be changed to where certain enchants can be apllied over already enchanted gear and certain enchants would require certain ingredients, eg, fire aspect-blaze powder, protection iron, etc.
You know how long I spent on building my villager farm? I don’t think it’s OP because it took me real time weeks to set up
Dude exactly my point. I spent the time getting resources and building it. I spent a godly amount of material to trade with villagers. I spent literal days just breeding villagers. Took me a full 3 months to get max enchantments of every possible book and the worst part, moving these fing villagers where they belong. That alone took months to get right because if they got loose after breeding or something, now you have a lost villager that's connecting to job blocks THAT YOU WILL NEVER FIND sometimes. I also zombified over half my villagers 4 or 5 times a piece before the update so ive gone through chests of gold just for apples alone. Ive put more work into villagers than anything else in this game. Thank god i finished it before the update came out. As i would most likely stop playing entirely.
Now you cant even get max enchantments on top of the thousands of blocks to move a villager? Without even mentioning the anvil, its already not worth the time just because of moving villagers.
Grand total, start to finish, took me a full 4 months to accomplish. I couldnt play every day all day, when i could, i didnt get very far because of rerolling trades constantly and figuring out every little trick that involves village/r rules. Its much more specific than meets the eye. I know for an absolute fact that not many people play like i do. Ill spend months on villagers and making farms to trade or build with. Most people ive spoken to, wont even think about doing that. Especially if they dont like Redstone. The only people complaining and wanting a nerf, are complete professionals at this game. Im good at the game, and it was legit not an easy task whatsoever. Now, its something i wont ever do again unless they change this. I wont spend a whole year on villager trades. F that.
One possible compromise would be to have the new villager trade system stay, but it becomes possible to unlock the old style trade system.
To do so you might have to get a special item by trading from say, a swamp village (which should start generating) and giving it to a librarian elsewhere will unlock the mending trade in the librarian at the trading hall.
That would still encourage exploration whilst cutting down the need for travel or moving villagers, since you don't have to have separate trading halls in each biome and travel between for a book of each type, or you don't have to move villagers from all over the world to your base
I had previously suggested something similar to this... but instead you use the special item from the biome to convert a previously untraded with villager to that biome type.
Just finished the video. Excellent work Prowl. One point I do not remember you speaking about is the limited number of upgrades / combining you can make on an anvil. Top level books available of say efficiency 3 means, I need to combine efficiency 3 books two times to get 2 efficiency 4 book an combine those 2 to get a 5. Pretty soon, the anvil tells me it is too expensive, even if I have enough levels. They really are driving me away from the game.
Yeah, I didn't bring it up here but it is a hot topic as well.
I think the easy fix is instead of "too expensive", just make the level cap like 40... so if you repair a ton... you're gonna have to spend the 40 levels each time to do it... otherwise, get mending, or make a new piece of gear.
@@Prowl8413 Why have a Cap at all? Foxy and Slack did a video on the enchants on Boots and Helmets, with the current proposed changes and to get Top Gear would take well over 300 Levels... Or you go to an outside source and it calculates the exact order you follow to get everything you want as cheaply as possible, and it is still way way over Cap at 170.
A slightly more efficient way of getting that level 5 enchant is to combine the books until maxed, then put it on the item. If I remember correctly, the books don't have a max limit on combinations, but I could be wrong. Since the items do have that limit, you can save a bit of the max by using this method.
They're just making multiple decisions lately that make the game more tedious instead of convenient. I don't want more reasons for exploration. I want more pieces for building & easier ways to accomplish bigger & better builds. I don't want to prolong the reasons for why I'm playing Minecraft to begin with - making awesome builds.
But instead of giving players more reasonable ways to accomplish these things, they've made it more difficult for what?
From the Netherite template bullcrap to the Deep Dark making Diamond mining more impossible to Villager trades being nerfed out of existence, it just feels like Mojang hates seeing players in the "end game" making wonderful, big builds & are focused on the parts most of us want to blow right by because of its tedium & redundancy …
Right?! Like wtf is there to do in mid game anyways? Collect resources and build stuff? Nobody is enjoying those things more because their gear makes it go slower…
Enemy combat is boring even with sub-par gear.
I loved the feeling that minecraft gameplay was what you wanted it to be. If you liked farming, it was a farming game. If you liked mining, it was a mining game. If you liked survival from mob attacks guess what it was that sorta game however over the last few years it has felt like mojang have an idea of what the game is and everyone should play it this way. I don't like their idea of the game and haven't played in some time.
This is definitely the undercurrent of their design choices. It's unfortunate, because it's easily forseeable that as devs try to force players into their idea of what the game is, they alienate people. They should be making tools and options, not trying to make a "golden path" for what the game ought to be.
Villagers needed nerfs. But they totally destroyed librarians. Like i am not a very technical player i consider myself average. And i didnt even new that you could breed villagers to get swamp villagers. So the people who dont follow new regularly wont even know how to get mending anymore. They will have to learn a lot of stuff just to get mending from a villager
I mean, if you watch even a little bit of minecraft content, it’s gonna be hard to avoid that news. Litterally everyone would be talking about it, which means tutorials for handling villagers and transporting them as well as all the details about swamp and jungle villagers are going to pop up all over the place. If they’re even remotely part of the online community, it’d probably be pretty hard to miss.
and since I didn't spell it out clearly: even if you don't watch the tutorials, you're still going to have friends who have, or Minecrafters who have too, who will spread that knowledge to others. We optimized villagers, we can do it again.
Should make it player selectable if they want it the new way or the old way
I disagree, having too many player selectable options just ends up with everyone playing a different game. 1 system that works for everyone is more preferred.
This is also why the community was greatly damaged after Java 1.9 update
I find so much lapis and use the enchanting table so little after getting a trading hall that they need to balance the table differently so that enchanting is not so wasteful.
The enchanting table is really an awesome tool in the game... but an awesome one that is completely worthless to most people. It needs a buff
Prowl, I agree with you 100%. The younger players in my family have quit Minecraft already and they were the reason why I stared playing it. Maybe more/better optional ways to play the game would get them back. I don't think nerfing the current game will get them back.
my younger ones here too. I am the only one sticking with the game. They have already moved on to some other game, they are feeling discouraged and hopeless to get anywhere in the game. I agree with Prowl also.
Yep! Make all ways of playing the game viable, and the problem is solved.
These changes suck. Requiring diamond to buy the diamond gear completely defeats the purpose. If I have to hunt for diamond anyway why even bother with the villager. I much prefer the building farms and trading halls to build my resources, and THEN exploring after I'm well equipt. I will not be running this update.
The biggest thing to me is having to travel 5000 blocks to find the different biomes
Bro swamp is common biome do you know that's
I have 25 world and 8 from them i respawned into swamp and one of them there's a village inside it
I think if Mojang wants us to explore more and is using nerfing villagers to make us maybe they need to have biome specific items a player can find and give to a villager to give the villager the ability to give you the enchantment you’re looking for.
If you want efficiency V and Mojang wants you to go to the swamp to get a villager. Maybe you can bring a muddy root block to give to your villager that gives them the ability to have the level 5 enchantment.
Interesting ideas!
Yes, the villager nerf was the final straw for myself and many others, but, its because Mojang goes out of their way to dictate how we play a "sandbox" game.
2 things ya didn’t mention
1 not everyone has the ability to trim their world or have very much storage space. I happen to know this detail of more chunks explored=larger file size=harder to load or play. So exploring thousands and tens of thousands is not beneficial in the long run when you’ll never be in most of those areas again.
2. New players or players who have yet to set up any trading hall. I’m lucky cause I just started a new world so I scrambled and got all the trades I wanted right away. But this also means I’m less likely to start up a new world again in the future cause of these changes. Oh and as happened to my old world. If this one corrupts or becomes unplayable. I’m not going to be very happy at all.
Hope they re evaluate this
You talking about being able to play the way we want really hits home with me. I’m best described as a low tech explorer. Going to other biomes to get different villagers actually sounds fun to me, as does exploring for enchantments in monuments and POIs, but I absolutely see how that would be less fun for others. But since I’m low tech, I don’t make farms for xp. Changing the xp awarding and costs would be fantastic for me.
I like your ideas about improving enchanting using a more holistic approach instead of just nerfing one part. It is probably too far into the development cycle to expect them to bundle those changes with the villager updates but you should continue to beat this drum. Hopefully, they'll hear it and make improvements to the other aspects of enchanting.
Personally, I think this should be something added to a harder mode. I don't think this should be forced to everyone. I don't like the changes; a trading hall is a challenge to set up and takes quite a bit of time. Yes, once it's done it's OP, but it is work and takes hours to get there. Maybe it loses power over time and then you have to do things to repower. I don't know.
I like your ideas to for changing the enchanting table, because it sucks. Totally agree on that.
I don't think fishing should be nerfed. I think fishing is fine as it is. Instead of getting a lot of low tier books, as it is now, it takes a while but you might get one high tier book, which is infinitely, and I mean INFINITELY more useful than a bunch of low tier books for one simple reason:
Anvil combine costs. They are absurd. Having to combine eff 2 books to eff 5 is so not worth it, it would basically tank fishing to where no one would ever use it for books again.
My suggestion was more of a buff... get luck of the sea 3, and you have a relatively high chance to get 1 of like 10 different books that players normally like... but you have a very rare chance to get the other ones, meaning fishing would be great to get you started, but not very viable to fully deck out your character with every single thing needed.
On one of my realms, a member did some creative testing and got this results.
Using Clerics and Raw Flesh.
The discounts stack.
The zombie spawner is the same as curing a villager in front of another villager.
```
A = zombie spawner/being near a cure
B = cure
C = village hero
32 - initial cost
31 - A
26 - B
26 - A+B
23 - C
22 - A+C
17 - B+C
17 - A+B+C
```
So cure once and have village hero for lowest price. Use zombie spawner only for frequent trading needs.
While reasonable, now makes having a raid farm to get hero of the village a necessity, so it makes the game more grrindy. And yeah, on some big servers or realms, this can be a pain now.
After watching the video: I like a lot of your Ideas, and also Im thankful for the way you delivered in this video, very reasonable and actually making sense, being honest and on top of that, being thoughtful about the many different kind of players.
If there's a post on the website on these ideas, i will gladly upvote them.
Specially the rework on the enchanting table (better re rolling, more uses to lapis instead of exp), and the ability to transfer enchantments between gear regardless of the material.
Thank you! Someone needed to say this. Seriously! Who is making these awful decisions?! 😢
AWESOME TALK Prowl! ❤
Microsoft just so you know
Non-players.
Maybe they should let you combine enchanted tools armour etc together no matter what material they're made from. Let's say you find an efficiency 4 fortune 3 unbreaking 3 gold pick axe you could combine this with a diamond pick axe and transfer those enchantments onto the diamond one at the cost of some xp levels
And make the Allay bring back your gear/tools/armor upon death, then it'd be a useful mob
If you redstone player they are useful
Instead of re-roll wouldn't it be nice to see the whole list of enchantments and select the one you need? Obviously the level of enchantments and rarity could be a factor to consider the amount of experience required (just s little bit more or maybe more lapiz). It's not like getting an enchantment is impossible, it's just tedious sometimes. Maybe enchantments that are specific to the time of day or moon phase? Something fun and interesting. Why are villagers supposed to trade enchanted books anyway 😂
I like the Moon Phases idea! Gives a whole day to remember to Enchant. Time of Day one could miss a lot.
Minecraft has lost its vision, they are stuck between a fantasy survival game and a realistic survival game
As someone who's not that great at Minecraft, I play on bedrock/mobile with my kids on a realm so traveling far is just not an option, it starts to lag out the realm especially the more maps we end up with. My kids are on iPads and me and their dad are on our phones so we keep starting over on new realms once the map/travel lag gets too bad. I can't imagine having to go that far too get villager trades. Not too mention I have to get carefully plan out mob farms to avoid the lag as well and I'm the only one who knows how to make the farms 😅 we'll probably still play but the changes do make it sound way more frustrating for us to play overall
Just dont plan on updating my minecraft ever again
We've already begun looking at other games as a result of what they are trying to push. You hit on a big point of my own which is that they are trying to force the gameplay in a direction or the player will in effect be punished if they do not play that way by not being able to get things that are already in the game and have been forever. The changes being proposed also don't take into account that not everyone has 24/7 to play Minecraft to grind aimlessly.
All of your ideas here are excellent but I fear they really do not understand the player base or have simply convinced themselves that a few vocal people who say advancement is too easy is the reality for all players...and it is not.
Last thing I would add is this. IF Minecraft are so fixated on the game being about exploration....then THEY need to make the game more interesting to explore. I am sorry but the swamp biome? Boring. The Mesas? Boring. The caves in many respects before were better and should have just been made bigger. Deepslate everywhere below Y level O? Boring. Look at the immersion that exists in other games just with animal/bug sounds, wind. Ambient atmosphere for each specific biome needs to happen. Many more things could be done to make players WANT to explore....forcing them to do so is not very sandbox at all and just shows a lack of creativity and fear of change.
I really don’t play anymore because I play on a switch and it just doesn’t have the resources to handle the game anymore
Ive heard the performance on Switch has been in significant decline lately.
Since they allowed the wither to drop through bedrock (to take away the wither cheese methods) - I can’t get beacons because the game just freezes halfway through the wither fight
A bit excessive, I'm just not even gonna bother trading with them. The developers only done this is because of the very small group of Minecrafters called UA-camrs that do massive projects by using villagers but haven't thought about the casual Minecraft player that doesn't play for work and has school or a job to go to and therefore can't put in the stupid amount of hours like UA-camrs do.
Edit: We NEED a mystical update not an enchantment update. Think to most of the new stuff that has been added, exclude the deep dark its all realistic. Back in the day we had realistic pigs cows sheep chickens and also mystical stuff reanimated zombies skeletons giant spiders CREEPERS other dimensions a bloody dragon!
As the game has progressed we've gotten less and less magic stuff and a mystical update with the enchantment system in there is well; my idea is add a third slot into the table this is where mob drops will be placed to be consumed. You want smite? place in phantom membrane, rotten flesh or a bone. or maybe a prismarine shard/crystal for higher chance for respiration/depth strider/aqua infinity so on so forth, you get the idea
I saw someone make a comment on a Call of Duty video one day that essentially said to quit nerfing the good guns and just buff the bad ones. People spend time finding the attachments they want for that weapon and then a week later CoD nerfs the gun itself so that it does less damage to be on par with other weapons, but then will buff another weapon at the same time as nerfing others. It doesn't make sense to do things this way because then you are just in a cycle of buffing and nerfing different weapons all the time instead of working on improving the actual gameplay.
good luck finding villages on servers or realms! 10k blocks travel to reach a looted village...
Yep, another bad side-effect of this change.
The search inventory function is basically broadcast storage from a different game. Would do wonders for this game
Yes! Even if it's just on a per-chest basis... would help so so much.
Here's my solution : Integrate the systems together to encourage travel and exploration early on, and then transition into having an OP final base set up.
Here's how it would work. Initially, your character wouldn't know any enchantements whatsoever. Even if you unlock an enchanting table, they wouldn't know what to do with it. The only enchants they have access to immediately are those found pre-generated on looted gear, and those only last them as long as they have the piece of gear, or choose to maintain it via the Anvil. Then you make them hunt across the world for BOOKS. Books would be consumables that teach you how to make a given enchantment, such as Mending or Efficiency. You get books from trading with villagers yes, but also from shipwrecks, temples, end city looting, etc etc.
And once you've learned an enchantment, you can slap it on any valid piece of gear using the enchanting table. In this scenario, the enchanting table is no longer random. You get to target pick ANY enchantment you have discovered through the process of book hunting. You can even pick multiple enchants at once and create the Perfect Pick, or Perfect Helmet, provided you have the experience and lapis for it (which would obviously scale with the number and potency of enchantments you want to slap on any piece of gear.)
And there you have it. You've technically nerfed villager trading by making it just one of the many options a player has to learn enchantments, and you've given new life to the enchanting table, which really should be any endgame player's all-in-one destination for enchanting stuff.
Alternative solution : Rather than consuming the books to give the player knowledge of the enchant, have it so the players have to put the enchanted books inside of chiseled bookshelves that would surround the enchanting table proper. This adds a nice thematic touch (You are literally building an enchantment library one book at a time), makes it so friends who join your advanced world don't need to go book hunting to get access to high level enchanting, they can just use your library, and also that library makes a juicy target in a PvP scenario.
Last point to the devs : Please stop trying to make Minecraft an arduous grind by nerfing all the OP strats people have figured out over the last 15 years. This game is SOLVED, it is not Dark Souls, and it shouldn't try to become it. Default Minecraft should remain relatively chill. Explore, Mine, build a main base, farm key mats, kill Ender Dragon in under 10 hours if you know what you're doing, then get Elytra and chill in a semi-creative endgame with maxed out enchants, and find a good spot for your accurately scaled reproduction of Minas Morgul. No need for this utterly asinine set up where you have to find 7 villages in 7 different biomes, set up a trading hall in each for their specific books, and have it all linked up via a nether portal network or something. Keep it simple. Keep it fun.
Please don't you leave Prowl
This wont really effect me much. I'll work around it.
One way to compensate for the distance and traveling to other villages is to add a trailer/cart to horses so you can put a villager in the cart, then attach the cart to the horse. At least this way you can get around some struggles like moving the villager uphill and you'll move much faster. This would also mean that saddles should be craftable. You kill a cow for leather, turn it into a saddle and off you go.
setting up a full trading hall with all enchants discounted to the max requires MANY hours of work, not just a bit.
first you'll need a villager breeder, easy enough, even if moving villagers on location can be very tedios.
you'll need to capture and nametag zombies to zombifie the villagers, can be finnicky, but easy enough,
you'll need to breed dozens of villagers, wich in turn will probably require a carrot farm.
you'll need to set the correct trades, and it will take a lot of time as it requires resetting the villager profession many times.
then you'll need a LOT of golden apples to cure the villagers over and over, and that step itself will require a gold farm just to sustain the gold sink to craft enough golden apples.
the weakness potions are easy enough, but you'll still need to have some brewing operation going as you'll need tons of those, and brewing 3 at a time won't cut it.
once you have done this, you'll need some other farms to have various spare materials to sell in exchange for emeralds.
then you'll finally be able to start doing some trading to begin hoarding emeralds.
IMHO it is not overpowered, not compared to any other farm you can easily build for endless food, iron, gold, logs, px, gunpowder, fuel, bonemeal, etc.
I recently finished building it in my base with all enchants, and I also added the useful trades at max discount ( mainly to buy redstone and golden carrots, and to sell strings, rotten meat, carrots, potatoes, and stone for emeralds).
It took me many dozens of hours of work over several weeks in total, all this, to basically have a quick(er) way to replace my gear when I die and lose my stuff (it will save some diamonds but you'll still need netherite and the PX to re enchant).
the new system not only will force players to build multiple trading halls in different biomes, transporting more villages, and having to travel on locatio to trade each time, instead of doing it close to base, but the trades will also be less efficient, how many trades do we need to do to build up an enchant to its max level, like for example an efficiency V?
What about already existing world ? I've been playing in mine since 1.14. I have a massive trading hall that mainly serve as a golem but I also have a library with all the possible books. What will happen to these villagers ? Will their trade reset or will the villagers simply vanish ?
I think op farms are the fun part of this game. Yes you spend a lot of time and efforts but the result is satisfying. I remember when mojang tried to nerf gold and iron farms. I think nerfing is killing this game slowly
16:11 this part, they can just retexture the books so that you can see the enchantments just by looking at it.
So for example, “smite” has a skull on it or, “sharpness” has a sword on it.
I think this is much better and easier because it is just retexturing and not making an entire new program which uses more effort.
What's the visual mods you're using? Looks simple but neat
Minecraft is appealing because it is a sandbox game that has SO MANY different play styles. The idea of Balancing because some people get resources to easily is frustrating because why cant those players choose to play that way? I have only ever built a full trading hall once. I usually just have one of two librarians (usually unbreaking III and mending) and maybe a couple villagers for tools only because i have a tendency to lose mine. Because Rolling and rerolling and grinding the villagers is not my preferred play style. If people think its too OP then DONT DO IT. Just let the people who want to Do it have that option and add new options to get the same enchantments elsewhere so people dont feel Forced to exploit the villager trades. Like loot chests, and better fishing rates. Some Enchantments feel impossible to get without Librarians. Making it HARDER to get with the librarians is just going to make the game harder for the average player.
We need teleporters. Especially if we have to travel 10k blocks. We should only have to do that once and be able to teleport back and forth after. Which we should be able to teleport the villagers back as well.
I'm actually happy and I returned to Minecraft because of this. Villagers made diamond mining and treasure enchatment hunting pointless. Now we have to actually play the game to get stuff instead of just curing a zombie villager and farming wheat to trade for emeralds.
First in game week not a lot of lapis but after that I have blocks of it. Just mining for iron and Redstone and before I know it I got blocks of Redstone and lapis. So reroll table with lapis yes but that makes you wonder about a similar way of reroll workstations. If it's just the master trades that are set but not lower trades like a bell or axe for smith's and bookshelves and glass for librarian make a easier way to reroll those using Redstone like the table with lapis.
What shader are u using in this Video??
Thanks, I really appreciate you taking the time to share well-considered and balanced opinions like this.
14:24 Idea for how to incorporate books. 📖
In villages books could spawn in librarians house inside a chiseled bookshelf
I think it would be cool to have the pillagers capture a librarian villager who is already a higher level and had access to mid teir books for trading. This way you don’t have to incorporate bookshelves into an outpost
For someone who has just started playing Mine Craft this is discouraging to say the least. Some of us are just learning how to play much less adding all these changes makes it hopeless for new players.
Don't worry, once they finalize whatever it is they decide to do, I'll make some tutorials showing the easiest way possible to get enchantments again.
Only just started watching your videos, they are extremely helpful. I appreciate your hard work, thank you. @@Prowl8413
Mojang could care less about their game base, because there’s such a big following they think that can do whatever they want regardless of the communities views because they are untouchable. It’s going to take a mass walk away to make them wake up and realize they should listen to their game base!
I know several of their devs do pay attention to my feedback... so hopefully they go through this comments section and see some of the built-up frustration, and implement some of the suggestions that I have.
4:06 what texture pack is that?
As far as enchanting is concerned, they need to tie in enchanting level (and even available enchantments) to player experience level. It makes no sense from a balance standpoint to tie in level to a trivial amount of a certain resource
another question, if minding is in the swamp only and there are no villages there how do we get the book without cheating?
Another change (i am only halfway through, but I want to write this before I forget) I would like to see with the enchanting table is this:
It is currently impossible (to the best of my knowledge) to max out boots using an enchanting table. Allow treasure enchantments and remove "Too Expensive" also allow for max level enchants like efficiency V
I am not going to give up on Minecraft you inspired me to make these advanced projects for my survival worlds.
Love everything you do! Can anyone tell me what texture pack was seen in the fishing clip?
what they need to do is especially repairing enchanted armor is where it does not cost more to repair it like stay the same so you dont have to keep farming for hours on getting books. well anyways can you still get mending books from fishing i had no luck i always try to get at least a couple of books
Mojang dropped the ball & shot themselves in the foot. This is going to cause tons of people to quit. With the nerfs there is less point in exploring because villagers are completely useless. Instead of spending 6hours rolling for trades, you should just spend that time on an xp farm and roll on the enchantment table. All in all they should be using this time to add new features, not remove existing features that are totally fine. Villagers needed to be buffed not nerfed
Great content Prowl, I do hope the game will help those players get along with levels and enchantments if villagers are tough to use. I do like the enchanting table idea alot as I like to explore a little but not travel all the time when building is what I like most
My family has a realm that my dad runs, and we reboot it every time there's an update. My cousin kind of carries the realm with his villager centers, he's basically the only one of us with the patience to deal with villagers long enough to get it set up. With this update, our realm is done.
My two major problems with these nerfs is the lack of variation with the librarians' books outside of the last trade for their best book. I think it's a crazy cool idea to have exclusive enchantments sold by specific biome villagers because that's a good lore aspect. What I don't love is that there should be books that can be obtained through all villagers, mainly protection and unbreaking. I also don't love how some of the "biome exclusive" trades don't make sense from a lore standpoint, as some of them don't make sense. The other thing that I really dislike is how low all the enchantments are, if they were the highest tier, A+. But having efficiency 3? Hell nah, that's going to be so much cheaper from enchanting. It's almost like they want to remove the villagers' uses and just make them not worthwhile. I don't entirely hate the armorer changes, it actually does make sense to spend diamonds for a piece of armor that's less than what the piece uses because that does make it look like the professional knows what he's doing because he can use less for more. I love that idea, it works so well. But, very big but, the enchantments for it? Not worth it, even if they were tier two, they would be better, but having tier three or four would be nice. I think it would actually be better to have it this way. You spend more emeralds and a little less diamonds for a higher enchantment level, but have less emeralds and more diamonds for a lower enchantment level. Adding even a little bit of variation like that to show the different levels of skills that these guys have would be a fantastic addition because no two weaponsmiths are made equal (I know they are armorers but still). This should also be the case for iron and chainmail, because it seems quite scummy to only nerf the best overworld armor in the game like this because it should operate on the same playing field. It just makes sense.
But at this point, we really gotta be honest with ourselves, Mojang is hard set on this course and there's nothing we can really do about it. Our only options really are to just use mods to give us what we want or use older versions. Knowing how long some of these features take to come to us (months and even years) they will surely take their sweet time in waiting to finally improve things for us again. I'm not hopeful at all.
What does it mean when a trade is highlighted red (not red x) and how do I fix it so I can make the trade again?
Insane they want to nerf the trading, they should be making new challenges for us not taking away from what is. I've definitely slowed down playing and will probably not bother making new bases if I can't have a nice trading hall to fix my broken tools after a couple hours of exploring.
Another thing is that the anvil “too expensive” sucks. Also another thing is what if you fallen in lava and lose everything it would be less fun to get everything back. Also there’s no good way to get the villagers back to one location. The thing is that even if you get all the things in one location that by the time you reach that point you’ll probably be bored and play something else. The way that I would do it is that have the master tier be the maximum enchant (or item of the type (for example diamond gear, cooked food, golden apples, stuff like that))
This Nerf is Terrible!!! I agree they are trying to force players to play 'Their' way!!
This most recent update I thought the things they added were cool. You had incentive to go adventuring to get these new artifacts, Armour designs, etc... but now this nerf.... It makes it less cool!!
My Iron farm/Trading hall.... got WRECKED by this as soon as it dropped.
They're making it harder to get/do things, and again, forcing people to play 'Their' way... and they shouldn't do that to a Sandbox like Minecraft!!! If they're going to, essentially, take away Trading Halls... they need to give other options for players who don't want to do all the exploring to trade with Villagers who 'have what you need'!!
Minecraft was my favorite game until now. In my opinion Mojang is destroying the game that I feel in love with many years ago. I think this villager nerf is hurting the game. We have a world that is well over 5 years but we don't explore everything to keep many areas untouched. We save those areas for when the new updates come out. We move to an unexplored areas for the new update and many times start over but we still have access to go back and get materials for builds.
This is a great point.
Excellent points and suggestions made here. In terms of exploration, another important factor worth mentioning is that the more you explore, the larger your save file gets!
I rather enjoy exploration, but I find myself doing so very conservatively now, knowing that the new expedition is going to cost that much more hard drive space, or even worse, SSD space.
I resorted to playing on a private server I run off of a spare laptop, since that way, you don't have to keep copying a multi-gigabyte save back and forth between computers you play on. The downside of this solution is that you can't pause in a multiplayer server, but the improvement in framerate makes up for that somewhat.
If the developers intend to encourage even more exploration than they already do, I feel they should also greatly optimize how chunks are saved.
The solution is very simple. Have the empty book shelves work for the enchanting table. Every enchanted book you place in gives you that enchantment forever as an option. Then you make it possible to enchant an object more than once. Lastly tweek the XP cost.
I am not fond of traveling, I will not fight my way through a bastion so netherite upgrades are now out of the question for me. They really are not letting me play this “sandbox” game the way I like to play. Mojang is taking the joy out of this game for me.
On my realm, my friends call me the emerald king because I built an iron farm/villager trading hall around a zombie spawner. I have a double chest of emerald blocks. Now, i gotta use those emeralds to purchase books from my librarians because the discounts went away.
As far as enchanting goes, I would just suggest a 4th tier of enchantment. One that guarantee's a suffix like unbreaking with the main enchantment. As far as XP goes there's no reason to increase XP given by any source. Just find an ancient city and bring your favorite garden tool. Maybe bring your entire enchantment setup with you. Console is especially easy to find them. I think villagers also need a tier system. No I'm not talking about trade mastery. I'm talking about the village as a whole. The higher the mastery throughout the village would mean unlocking of more rare items. And rather of having multiple villagers, one villager would over time be able to sell you the rarest of items like mending
I created a server, then created my world on it based on the way it is. I just wont do the upgrade. Why would people quit? Am I missing something? What instance would people be forced to update?
why travel to those places? when you can use silk touch and bring back a part of those biome specific items and use them from their specific biome to your trading hall? easier said then done? maybe. if you simply buy the items from the wandering trader it wont work. you will have to travel to the biome and personally take an element or biome specific block. like in the swamp you would have to get mud with silk touch to put with your mending villager. the savanna you would need a piece of natural forming terracotta using silk touch. ect ect. we'll have to see if this will work or not after the release.
I spent 3 hours trying to get my villager to trade for efficiency 5 and also mending (that's per trade) why are they doing this (the grind is going to be too much for most people and the average world doesn't have certain biomes in at a 8k block radius from spawn)
I don't know if anyone else had this problem but I have a five year old world that I have been exploring my game save on that is almost 985mb and my game constantly crashes when leaving the over world or nether having to explore even more means larger world saves and more crashes
I play on ps5
I think they could add another slot for another material and that other material will give you different enchantment,. Like soul sand, soil soil, or wither flower could give you soul speed
The anvil XP levels and "Too Expensive" cap needs to change.
Yes! At a minimum, it just needs a cap... like instead of "Too Expensive" there should be a max level cost of like, 40 levels or something, once you get to that point, any repair or upgrade or whatever will always cost you the 40 levels.
what would this mean for trading halls? would you have to get a villager from each biome to get the specific trade?
I've said it before and I'll say it again, these changes will primarily hurt the younger audience, who don't like traveling too far from spawn (my 9 year old still doesn't like going a couple of thousand blocks as she's scared of getting lost) and players who don't have a lot of time to spend on the game. Players who are more technical and have a lot of experience will just suck it up and see it as a new challenge....... but that's maybe 2% of your ordience (just guessing on the % but I'm probably guessing to HIGH in this case!!). Yes, there needs to be a change to the whole enchanting and Villager trading system but Mojang need to nurf some things and improve others to keep some kind of balance to the whole system. This is NOT something that can be done a step at a time.... especially not a massive nurf for that first step! It needs to be done as a whole update in 1 go.
I agree. The other methods for getting xp, gear and books needs to be upgraded for the the other player types to balance the village trading nerf. This would definitely be more well-balanced.
I think the nerfs can be done better as well.
Before watching the video: I watched Docm77's Hermitcraft Season 10 video. Without spoilers, I can tell you that he was in full enchanted diamond armor with full enchanted diamond tools within a few hours of gameplay. He could have waltzed into the end and beat the dragon, have elytra on day 1, no exploits. That pacing feels broken. I don't think the villager nerf goes far enough, tbh, but I also think they should make gear repair work better, the reason I get mending is because repairing sucks.
My problem with the villager trade nerf is that the most basic enchantments are spread out thousands of blocks away. It should be the other way around. All librarians in any biome should have guaranteed at least one of protection, mending, efficiency, unbreaking, fortune. Any other spell can be biome-specific, but these basic ones are essential for an enjoyable game play. Also, higher level spells should be available at higher mastery level. Without them we turn back into the xp issues Prowl has discussed. It is incredibly frustrating to *need* an xp farm to be able to have protection 3 unbreaking 2 on an iron chest plate. I really hope they listen to the community on how these changes will just make the game a lot less enjoyable. I am one of the ppl that is playing a lot less because they will be implemented and it really sucks
Seems to me it's not the new players that are crying out about these changes but the min-maxers who have played through 100 times and don't want to play and explore anymore. This seems somewhat like a precursor to an End update as we know the vast majority of players never kill the dragon. But perhaps there is incentive if 1) the End is updated with new things to do or experience and 2) there comes a need for something like the elytra to travel long distances to get those End game enchants. In a game that has real progression, the ability to permanently repair your best tools and gear is an end-game concept. Personally I don't think ender chests should be craftable either. This game is incredibly easy and made even easier by the ability to automate nearly every aspect of it.
I think they could put an option in to have or not have this update kind of like education edition for bedrock where when you make the world you get to choose if its on or off or maybe keep some of these changes there making but not biome lock anything