Some minor feedback: 1) maybe you should define what makes a civ S-tier, A-tier...D-tier, i.e. S-tier civs should be civs that can handle almost all situations and are so flexible strat-wise...etc. 2) maybe put the twitch chat on the screen so we can see the community feedback as well. Great content as always, will look forward to the tierlist again next month.
"This is showing how unbalanced the civs are right now." If there's a lot of A civs, then that means that they're equally strong, therefore well balanced. I assume that the goal is that all civs are equally strong, right?
Yeah I made sure to keep it as quick as possible! Dutch is a tricky one because it really depends on your skill level and the experience that you’ve had either playing or playing against them.
In my humble opinion. First I have to say that in 1vs1 the clashes should be compared between sieves, that is to say that it is not the same for a Russian to play against the USA than against the Lakota. In other words, there are civilisations that work better depending on the sieve you are playing against... That said: A-Lakota, Hausa, British. B-China, Germany, Italy, India, Spain, USA, Iroquois C-Ethiopia, Ottomans, Inca, Malta, Netherlands, Japan, Mexico, Russia D-France, Aztecs, Sweden, Portugal Within the divisions in the letter, I have put the ones that I think are a bit better up front. I have to say that the sieves are all very balanced; I mean: I am an expert player with Russia and in 1vs1 I don't mind playing against a British or a USA that I have put above them, but nevertheless they are matches that Russia is good at. That's why I say 1vs1 should be compared one on one. Both Sweden and Portugal despite being D in good hands and well played are just as dangerous as other sieves. That is why I say that people should not think that by playing LAKOTA OR HAUSA they will play and win easy against sweden or portugal.... As a postscript add, that in my list I have also taken the variable of the difficulty of use of the sieve, for example Ethiopia is a very good sieve, yes, but one of the sieves more difficult to handle...
I think balance is generally very good right now. I do believe Russia and Portugal need some rework, but other than them most other civs are at least playable. Sure, I have gripes (I miss Spanish Gold, for instance) but overall things look well
@@thanakonpraepanich4284 I feel Portuguese are very map dependent. They get a landlocked map without trade posts and they might as well insta gg. Russia lacks sustain in Age 4, their army is too brittle; however their rush and early game are awesome.
What happened? Have the new build orders been found that let other civs pull away from the Dutch on economy side too far and too fast that 5 banks and 2 factories cannot close the gap, while 2 extra banks from Coffee Trade will cripple your army too much you'll lose?
Spain would have been stuck in A tier but that guerilla upgrade made them finally good in the late game. People who say Spain belongs in B don't know how to use the Unction card
I think that what defines an S tier civ is that it is potentially good at all or most strats (FF, FI, Age 2 pressure, turtle, & boom) and has some ability to recalibrate if the initial plan goes awry. An A tier civ in my opinion is a civ that can crush opponents with their scary dominance of at least two play styles, and is flexible enough to endure heavy pressure from an aggressive opponent that seizes the initiative from you. A B tier list is a civ that is good, perhaps even scary, at one strat or timing (usually an FF, or a FI), but may even hold on if they fail to close the deal in their power sweet spot. A C tier is a civ that has an extremely narrow window for victory in a single strat, and folds like a castle of cards if they fail to execute it perfectly. A D tier list would be a civ that is currently struggling to find their niche in the meta, or that are too brittle either at the outset or in the late game to be viable if the opponent does not play exactly as needed or if the map is not ideal for it to execute its winning strat. By this logic, probably Ports are the only current D tier civ, Brits would be S tier, and Russians would be C tier. By the way, I can't believe it took the UA-cam algorithm a month and a half to suggest me this video.
This shows how WELL balanced this game is, major hats off the Forgetten Empires for the dedication and expert balancing, can't imagine how difficult it was to attain this!!! When you want to put most civs in the 'A' tier, that means great balance! In my opinion, Japan and Sweden are S tier and all the other civs are D tier, except for Ports, that civ is so bad it is Z tier, I have no idea why they are so bad, maybe its because Cassadors and Organ guns are so terrible? Whenever I play Ports, unless I use the House of Baranga card, I almost never win. By the way, I am at the average level of most players, which is 900-1000. The way I think of tiers is, playing ranked skill matched 1v1 games online if my opponent is X civ, what are the odds I can win, and I never beat Japan or Sweden, unless I am some civ such as India which has Urumi which hard counter their inevitable OP musk spam.
I usually play with Spain and I just roflstomp everything, just too many instant troops buffed by missionaries: you can ff, rush, boom and even turtle with them, all at the same time. Missionaries x10 are just op as fuck, people who think it is B tier should learn to play the game, because they have no clue how op is this civ right now. You just have to counter the enemy army and buff yourself with missionaries and you are good to go. Not counting you have free mayan mercenaries which cost no pop and you can just throw them at your enemy non stop. In 1vs1 they're S tier, noobs just say spanish artillery and firearms are weak, but you don't even use that as your core army. You just ff and spam archaic soldiers and cheap troops and throw them from everywhere, non-stop, so your enemy can't even think of attacking you. And when you finally make a breach on his defenses, THEN you send your valuable artillery and expensive troops to finish the work. For me it is clearly an S tier, you simply overflood the battleground, your rival can't even think about anything if you know how to play with spain, you obliterate them with sheer numbers. It doesn't even matter if their troops are better than yours, they just can't keep the pace in the long run. And the constant flow of xp from combat keeps fueling your quick card envoys. It's just too good, spanish endgame feels like cheating.
One of the funnest games I play is a Lakota on Great Plains. Focus cav and native. They could get shot in the face by a Great Bombard and not care and tbh, that GB isn’t getting a second shot.
Russia is the only civ I have ever played really. They have had pretty much no support in any of the updates of DE. I think the only things are vil cost down by 10? and nerfing Oprichniks. Would really like to see them be supported
I strongly disagree with your understanding of balanced, at least how you explained it. An even distribution from S-D means that there are few good Civs in S and A and some counter Civs on B and the others are just bad or occasionally good. Having a lot Civs in A (Strong but not OP) is healthy for a game
@@cedriccoronel5716 I feel like the recent Hausa nerfs made them a bit on the weak side when it comes to defending against early aggression though. I get that their age 3 stuff is really strong but how often do they make it there?
@@cyclonegaming443 Hausa just got nerfed a couple weeks ago to start with only 3 cows and all shipments require 8% more xp to get. They also nerfed Griots but gave them back their 3 vill shipment so it's not all bad but it's still pretty damaging as far as I've seen.
Newb here, i have been playing China in casual team games but just wondering why is China considered a S+ civ for 1 v 1? I know how scary the African civs and Lakota rush can be, but what is scary about China?
essentially recent changes means that on a TP map you can FF 95% of your games while being defended by a russian cons blockhouse, (doesnt slow build and drastically safety, training units capacity), can age with with either a skirm shipment or a psuedo factory and has great spam of unit shipments and a full mixture of every unit type. In team games china struggles to excel at any one thing and at lower levels in 1v1s it can be hard defend age 2 pressure,
@@Harrison_Aoe Thank you for the answer, I have been using the FF strategy for most of my games with China; but I wasn't aware that it was actually competitively viable.
Are you playing against Ai or players? For ai India is the best choice cause of the age-up Agra fort, which can be placed at your town’s outer edge to distract enemy attacks (that’s the secret against ai)
lakota is not an S, lakota struggle hard Against any raid proof civ.they lack seize, so impossible to win against port,Japan. Japan is pure S.China Is Super S.Mexico, germnay is weaker than Ottoman, right now.inca should be Higher. China needs huge nerf.they simply dont have any weakness unit wise.china is most versatile civ Right now.
China is top of a Tier. yes they are very versatile, but cav reks China and so does artillery. Mexico and spain are S tier. Piro is strong, can play age 2, has every unit in the roster.
@@Widgie haha yes ofcourse everyone has different opinions, but i loveee your content on aoe3de and the fact that you still stayed in this comunity is just awesomeee
I have only 30 hours on this game and looked for a civs tierlist i wish he sorted the civs in the same tier cause then I would know if sweden was better than idk ottomons
You can't counter a spanish ff, because with the right cards you can't even rush a spanish player. It will turtle your rush with archaic soldier + unction spam then ff and then you're screwed. At least not in 1vs1 if he's at least half-skilled with this civ.
Some minor feedback:
1) maybe you should define what makes a civ S-tier, A-tier...D-tier, i.e. S-tier civs should be civs that can handle almost all situations and are so flexible strat-wise...etc.
2) maybe put the twitch chat on the screen so we can see the community feedback as well.
Great content as always, will look forward to the tierlist again next month.
Yep, I mean did not watch the whole video, but I‘m not sure what it is about. Rush? Treaty? Mid Game? Late Game? Units? Eco? Overall? Etc
@@uluomu 1v1 ranked
@@patximartel thank you!
Gotta love how this loser never responded to this
"This is showing how unbalanced the civs are right now."
If there's a lot of A civs, then that means that they're equally strong, therefore well balanced. I assume that the goal is that all civs are equally strong, right?
Exactly. All should be equally strong but strong in different ways.
Yes exactly he has it the wrong way around. The fact that most are A/B shows the relative balance of the game rn
Yeah, it is quite funny/illogical to say that, agreed. "Most civs are unbalanced" LOL
Great tier list video - glad you kept it under
im low elo and in my opinion dutch is the worst. i only win with rushing. but yeah everyone has own opinion :)
@@steroitzz Dutch is definitely not the best rush civ! They do have the option to do so but most MUs they're far more effective age 3 with max banks!
Yeah I made sure to keep it as quick as possible! Dutch is a tricky one because it really depends on your skill level and the experience that you’ve had either playing or playing against them.
@@Widgie true, Harrisons Dutch is very different to my Dutch :)
@@user-lp7wo7og4x I approve this statement 100%
Nice tier list and loved that cheeky mexico bump, recently been playing mexico but in 2v2 not 1v1 yet and it feels insane.
In my humble opinion. First I have to say that in 1vs1 the clashes should be compared between sieves, that is to say that it is not the same for a Russian to play against the USA than against the Lakota. In other words, there are civilisations that work better depending on the sieve you are playing against... That said:
A-Lakota, Hausa, British.
B-China, Germany, Italy, India, Spain, USA, Iroquois
C-Ethiopia, Ottomans, Inca, Malta, Netherlands, Japan, Mexico, Russia
D-France, Aztecs, Sweden, Portugal
Within the divisions in the letter, I have put the ones that I think are a bit better up front.
I have to say that the sieves are all very balanced; I mean: I am an expert player with Russia and in 1vs1 I don't mind playing against a British or a USA that I have put above them, but nevertheless they are matches that Russia is good at. That's why I say 1vs1 should be compared one on one. Both Sweden and Portugal despite being D in good hands and well played are just as dangerous as other sieves. That is why I say that people should not think that by playing LAKOTA OR HAUSA they will play and win easy against sweden or portugal....
As a postscript add, that in my list I have also taken the variable of the difficulty of use of the sieve, for example Ethiopia is a very good sieve, yes, but one of the sieves more difficult to handle...
I think balance is generally very good right now. I do believe Russia and Portugal need some rework, but other than them most other civs are at least playable. Sure, I have gripes (I miss Spanish Gold, for instance) but overall things look well
Portuguese and Russia have no mean to survive long enough to reach Age IV in the current meta I guess.
@@thanakonpraepanich4284 I feel Portuguese are very map dependent. They get a landlocked map without trade posts and they might as well insta gg. Russia lacks sustain in Age 4, their army is too brittle; however their rush and early game are awesome.
I only play Dutch but it's really getting harder and harder too win a couple of games in a row... so I agree with Dutch C!
What happened? Have the new build orders been found that let other civs pull away from the Dutch on economy side too far and too fast that 5 banks and 2 factories cannot close the gap, while 2 extra banks from Coffee Trade will cripple your army too much you'll lose?
@@thanakonpraepanich4284 try and you'll find out why it's a "weak" civ right know
A perfectly balanced game would have all factions in a single tier. The more evenly distributed across tiers the less balanced the game.
19:41 hey Widgie boy, is that the voice over of Skycaptian of Future Cop LAPD?! LOL:
Nice video as always
Oh my god… you are the first person to recognise one of the best games in history… did you used to play it on PlayStation?
@@Widgie on PC. One of my first games. Great game, SkyCap voice was terrifying.
Keep the good cuality content kind Sir.
@@ivancarrillo8809 Thanks man :)
nice video, looking forward to a teams one possibly
Spain would have been stuck in A tier but that guerilla upgrade made them finally good in the late game.
People who say Spain belongs in B don't know how to use the Unction card
I think that what defines an S tier civ is that it is potentially good at all or most strats (FF, FI, Age 2 pressure, turtle, & boom) and has some ability to recalibrate if the initial plan goes awry. An A tier civ in my opinion is a civ that can crush opponents with their scary dominance of at least two play styles, and is flexible enough to endure heavy pressure from an aggressive opponent that seizes the initiative from you. A B tier list is a civ that is good, perhaps even scary, at one strat or timing (usually an FF, or a FI), but may even hold on if they fail to close the deal in their power sweet spot. A C tier is a civ that has an extremely narrow window for victory in a single strat, and folds like a castle of cards if they fail to execute it perfectly. A D tier list would be a civ that is currently struggling to find their niche in the meta, or that are too brittle either at the outset or in the late game to be viable if the opponent does not play exactly as needed or if the map is not ideal for it to execute its winning strat.
By this logic, probably Ports are the only current D tier civ, Brits would be S tier, and Russians would be C tier. By the way, I can't believe it took the UA-cam algorithm a month and a half to suggest me this video.
This shows how WELL balanced this game is, major hats off the Forgetten Empires for the dedication and expert balancing, can't imagine how difficult it was to attain this!!! When you want to put most civs in the 'A' tier, that means great balance! In my opinion, Japan and Sweden are S tier and all the other civs are D tier, except for Ports, that civ is so bad it is Z tier, I have no idea why they are so bad, maybe its because Cassadors and Organ guns are so terrible? Whenever I play Ports, unless I use the House of Baranga card, I almost never win. By the way, I am at the average level of most players, which is 900-1000. The way I think of tiers is, playing ranked skill matched 1v1 games online if my opponent is X civ, what are the odds I can win, and I never beat Japan or Sweden, unless I am some civ such as India which has Urumi which hard counter their inevitable OP musk spam.
Thanks for this, wished we could have more people playing these other civs. I only see Dakota, Hausa, and China mostly
Yeah I’m planning on playing some of the uncommon civs like Portugal
Not sure if its sarcastic, but an even spread is bad, everything in the same tier is balanced
Malta feels stronger then end of B. Maybe B+/A-? Maybe it is because people don't know how to play against, but I main malta for next months
I usually play with Spain and I just roflstomp everything, just too many instant troops buffed by missionaries: you can ff, rush, boom and even turtle with them, all at the same time. Missionaries x10 are just op as fuck, people who think it is B tier should learn to play the game, because they have no clue how op is this civ right now. You just have to counter the enemy army and buff yourself with missionaries and you are good to go. Not counting you have free mayan mercenaries which cost no pop and you can just throw them at your enemy non stop. In 1vs1 they're S tier, noobs just say spanish artillery and firearms are weak, but you don't even use that as your core army. You just ff and spam archaic soldiers and cheap troops and throw them from everywhere, non-stop, so your enemy can't even think of attacking you. And when you finally make a breach on his defenses, THEN you send your valuable artillery and expensive troops to finish the work. For me it is clearly an S tier, you simply overflood the battleground, your rival can't even think about anything if you know how to play with spain, you obliterate them with sheer numbers. It doesn't even matter if their troops are better than yours, they just can't keep the pace in the long run. And the constant flow of xp from combat keeps fueling your quick card envoys. It's just too good, spanish endgame feels like cheating.
One of the funnest games I play is a Lakota on Great Plains. Focus cav and native. They could get shot in the face by a Great Bombard and not care and tbh, that GB isn’t getting a second shot.
Russia is the only civ I have ever played really. They have had pretty much no support in any of the updates of DE. I think the only things are vil cost down by 10? and nerfing Oprichniks. Would really like to see them be supported
You must be smoking something mighty strong
Ottos are S-tier in my heart u.u
Spain should be S-tier.
Italy and Malta should be C-tier
I strongly disagree with your understanding of balanced, at least how you explained it. An even distribution from S-D means that there are few good Civs in S and A and some counter Civs on B and the others are just bad or occasionally good. Having a lot Civs in A (Strong but not OP) is healthy for a game
what would you nerf about hausa? i find the civ really fun but people calling it lame makes it off putting
Hausa and ethiopia are for veteran players because they are harder to play than other civs but once you master them, they are strong.
@@cedriccoronel5716 I feel like the recent Hausa nerfs made them a bit on the weak side when it comes to defending against early aggression though. I get that their age 3 stuff is really strong but how often do they make it there?
@@GideonAI what nerfs? Haven’t been playing aoe3 for a while and Hausa used to be one of my favorite civs back then
@@cyclonegaming443 Hausa just got nerfed a couple weeks ago to start with only 3 cows and all shipments require 8% more xp to get. They also nerfed Griots but gave them back their 3 vill shipment so it's not all bad but it's still pretty damaging as far as I've seen.
Newb here, i have been playing China in casual team games but just wondering why is China considered a S+ civ for 1 v 1? I know how scary the African civs and Lakota rush can be, but what is scary about China?
essentially recent changes means that on a TP map you can FF 95% of your games while being defended by a russian cons blockhouse, (doesnt slow build and drastically safety, training units capacity), can age with with either a skirm shipment or a psuedo factory and has great spam of unit shipments and a full mixture of every unit type. In team games china struggles to excel at any one thing and at lower levels in 1v1s it can be hard defend age 2 pressure,
@@Harrison_Aoe Thank you for the answer, I have been using the FF strategy for most of my games with China; but I wasn't aware that it was actually competitively viable.
@@Harrison_Aoe for you what civ is the most hard counter of china in 1v1?
Can we have team games tier list too?
Maybe but that’s gonna need more help from other people as I rarely play team games
Hi Im a beginner to the game what do you suggest I learn first please ? And what civ should I start playing ?
Indians, Ottomans, Bri*ish and Spanish are the easiest civs to play. At least to me.
Are you playing against Ai or players? For ai India is the best choice cause of the age-up Agra fort, which can be placed at your town’s outer edge to distract enemy attacks (that’s the secret against ai)
Start with the europeans, France is probably the best easy & good. Once you learn the game go to others mechanics like asians and Natives
thanks all of you
lakota is not an S, lakota struggle hard Against any raid proof civ.they lack seize, so impossible to win against port,Japan. Japan is pure S.China Is Super S.Mexico, germnay is weaker than Ottoman, right now.inca should be Higher. China needs huge nerf.they simply dont have any weakness unit wise.china is most versatile civ Right now.
China is top of a Tier. yes they are very versatile, but cav reks China and so does artillery. Mexico and spain are S tier. Piro is strong, can play age 2, has every unit in the roster.
Great video, i would put the ottomans higher... And dutch maybe, rest are fine
Thanks man, there will also be different opinions lol
@@Widgie haha yes ofcourse everyone has different opinions, but i loveee your content on aoe3de and the fact that you still stayed in this comunity is just awesomeee
what is weird as a china main around 1100+ elo during ranked games i almost never encounter civs in the S-tier even though those civs are good.
can you make a recent video please?
Why port D ?
I have only 30 hours on this game and looked for a civs tierlist i wish he sorted the civs in the same tier cause then I would know if sweden was better than idk ottomons
I’ve got a latest tier video from last month, check it out
Why brits are not s?
Why is ports bad?
make a video for 40min treaty please
portugal botoom tier? is that sarcasm?
Make on e for treaty please
nerf after nerf and ppl still think spain is strong just because players don't know how to counter a ff
You can't counter a spanish ff, because with the right cards you can't even rush a spanish player. It will turtle your rush with archaic soldier + unction spam then ff and then you're screwed. At least not in 1vs1 if he's at least half-skilled with this civ.