TSP #59 - Keithley DMM7510 7.5-Digit Multimeter Review, Teardown & Experiments
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- Опубліковано 9 сер 2015
- In this episode Shahriar takes a detailed look at the new Keithley DMM7510 7.5-Digit Multimeter. Boasting Keithley’s touchscreen GUI interface, 100mV, 1-Ohm and 10uA ranges makes this multimeter a precision instrument for a variety of applications. The multimeter is also capable of 1MS/s digitization functionality.
The teardown of the unit reveals the complex multi-board construction and analog board design intricacies. After a brief performance verification and GUI overview the multimeter is used in several experiments including measuring the conductivity of a flame, digitizing a large dynamic range multi-tone signal and DC-DC converter noise analysis. Furthermore, the scripting capability of the unit is employed to estimate the location of a short in an Ethernet cable and measure the dielectric constant of a parallel plate capacitor.
The Signal Path Blog
www.TheSignalPath.com - Наука та технологія
I bought the DMM6500 after watching all the reviews and tutorials. The depth of the Signal Path video examples helped make the decision. The DMM6500 has a lot of common features with the DMM7510 and DAQ6510 at much lower cost but meets my requirements and budget. The possibilities are endless with the DMM6500 meter, especially with TSP. One strange aspect about these meters, is sealing a CR2032 battery into the case as a non user replaceable part for memory backup, as these coin batteries are notorious for having a short life and used in almost everything these days. It should have been easy to put a battery compartment on the rear. Your videos are well constructed and the presentation is excellent.
These aren't the kind of instruments that users service. Opening them to change the battery is likely to cause the calibration to become void. Also, I'm sure they've chosen a quality brand of coin cell. And since you've watched this video, you know that it is technically user replaceable, especially if you're not some big company that requires metrology-grade calibration.
I'm curious -- does your unit show the same periodic noise in the 100V range that Shahriar showed? Or have they managed to fix that?
Thanks again for another superb review, my Agilent and Rigol DMMs over on the bench bowed their heads in shame for being so much less capable! ;-)
Thanks for sharing your reviews.
The flame experiment is absolutely amazing.
Very useful review. Actually, much more than a review, I learned a bit about physics that I'll try out for myself, and a few things about my own multimeter. I can't imagine how long the video took to put together. Greatly appreciated.
I'm ordering one of these for work thanks to this video. Seems great!
Hi, fantastic review, this time it pissed me off, because I want the multimeter after this review, but I don't have the money, electronics is just a hobby. So I'll have to shed a tear and keep measuring with my Rigol, Metex or Hantek. It is unbelievable what these top multimeters or measuring sources can do. 👍
Tom from Prague wishes everyone a beautiful day 🙂
The Fan design incorporates some engineering thought, certainly not last minute, the fan is a static pressure style capable of causing even flow over the entire top shield PCB, exiting through the elevated ventilation slots on top cover. Laminar airflow over shield surface, This has more to do with temperature stability and keeping humidity out. Lab instrument , many environments, uA meters and moisture = leakage internally. Nice job shielding the low current sensitive fuse.. RFI / EMI. Handy work..
Nice instrument. Thanks for sharing.
Very good review. I loved the experiments. I have nothing but good things to say about your channel and videos Keep up the great work and once again thank you.
Thank you very much for the great Review. Especially for your measurement examples to Show the Special capabilities of this Instrument. Sadly I bought the Keysight already with less capability.
Great video, thanks!
This thing samples so fast, that you can used as a low speed oscilloscope, or spectrum analyzer. You can digitalize an audio signal, perform an FFT on the raw data, and compute distortion!
Another amazing video !! Thank you !!
A very informative video, thank you!
Thank you for this review
Excellent review! Keep up the great work, please.
Great review, loved the experiments
Thank you for this.
Great Job Thanks for sharing
That was amazing...
Great reviews, this and others. Your tests/physics experiments are a step-up (a big one) from the rote: V, A, Ω.
Cheers,
Mark
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SignalPath, AppliedScience and EEVblog release new video today!?
That is the awesome monday:D
Gonna grab some tea+tiramisu and watch them all.
Toni T800 I asked them all to do a video a day so I could cancel my Directv satellite TV subscription !!
Is Dave still whining about silly things? I stopped watching him as he as so annoying some times.
norbsli yes, he is stil annoying and his videos are not so educational as TheSignalPath. But I think every 5th video is good to watch:)
Thank you , for a super review , now i know what i wil replace my keithley thd 2015 whit
Thanks
Hi Shahriar, Thanks for one more great video!
Regarding fan placement in the beginning of the video.
If you look carefully the fan is actually blowing OUT of the case not IN the case where the "power ICs are placed"©.
Unfortunately you did not shown case with closed cover from sides, but i can imagine that the slots in the cover are at top of the case.
If my assumption is true, then the air flow in the device is as follows: fresh air is getting sucked from the back of the unit (the grill below fuses) getting pumped by the fan and pushed out at top left and right fins of device.
If all my assumptions are true it is quite clever design which is not working against physics (hot air is moving up and the fan is taking out mostly hot air).
Levon Avagyan Hi Levon, thanks for the kind comment.There are actually no holes immediately above the fan in the instrument. There are holes on the edges. I imagine some flow in possible through that. They probably didn't put any holes immediately above the fan either because it was too late to change the chassis or that they were worried things can fall into the unit and directly on the PCB.
Pardon the question on a rather old thread, but did Keithley ever respond with a fix, explanation, or at least insights on the periodic input noise you observed on the 10V range?
what kind of cable do you use for connecting the instruments, from power to the multimeter input?
Superbe video
Very interesting reivew, the DMM checkbox is very useful and handy, I am wondering if it will possible to have an episode about it, Thank you!!!
I recall using the Keithley 2000s in our EE lab and disliking them because they updated so fast. I preferred the HP ones that were "slower" so I could catch what was actually going on. Took me a couple years and working beginning work at Keithley to realize why they were updating so fast...and that I could have just turned down the update rate ;-)
Great video again.
Who makes the DMM test box used here? Where did you purchase it?
Thanks.
Wow that's a good piece of kit.
Great Video Shahriar, nice proofing of the spec of this beast.
I was thinking half way through, that it may replace a cheap Oscilloscope.
You're right about the FFT function, seems to be a bit of a waste of the instrument if they don't include it.
I wonder if they had this in mind and was going to include it as an expensive upgrade or leave it for as newer model.
You didn't mention the cost of this unit.
Great reviews with actual experiments! Do you consider to do a review of the new DMM6500 6.5 digit sister meter? Thanks!
Can you measure power? It should be able to if it makes voltage and current measurements simultaneously.
Does this meter have the auto hold feature like the keysight or Rigol multimeter that holds the measurement value until you make the next measurement? keysight even holds a list of the last 8 values and every time you make the next measurement it moves up the list.
Thanks for your thorough videos Shahriar. I've really enjoyed all of them so far!
Did Keithley get back to you on the periodic noise in the higher DC ranges?
Do you happen to know what was going on and if that's fixed now?
I tried it on my DMM7510, and I did not see any on the higher ranges (it's within 50uV, and I'm not in an ideal environment); in Shahriar's lab maybe there is a noise source that gets picked up by the meter, thru that long cable? LED lighting or something? @The Signal Path
Thanks for your video. minimum how much current is possible to measurements with this device?
1:03:22 Freq button stops being highlighted for no apparent reason. Just an example for a bug report :)
just watched it, and one thing come to my mind. What's seen for example at 57:24 DOES NOT represent measured signal.
Have You ever seen such signal in real life? Of course, not. What's missing - is sinx/x interpolation. In this class instrument - it is a MUST. It would give user a basic idea of what measured signal may look like for real (BW limited) instead of 1st order approximation.....
looking forward to watching this with a large glass of Red tonight.....secretly waiting for the cat to make an appearance!
Thanks for the detailed review and explanation, very informative and useful. Did you build the DMM check box shown in the video ? I'm interested in building a compact reference / reference transfer unit for my 34401a. Cheers!
That reference box is called a DMM Check Plus, should be easily googleable
Where do i download the kickstart free application?
What is up with the dangling not heatsinked TO-220 (TO-247) regulators on the underside of the board. If there is vibration in the lab it can really screw them up.
WOW, what a presentation and DMM! Now I just need to save up $$$ and buy something like this! Thanks for your videos! Have you done something recently with newer bios/software updates?
Would you not have to account for thermionic emission of electrons? Maybe that explains why the ion distribution in the flame is asymmetric.
Hi Shahriar, Excellent demo and interesting experiments as always. How does DMM7510 compare to 2450 SMU for low current measurements, in terms of max measurement speed, accuracy, glitch-free range switching? Thank you very much.
Hi, If you still have one of these or a DMM6500, can you measure the resistance of some transformer windings to see if you have strange readings on some ranges.
So what is the difference between a source meter and a very high precision multi meter?
Your mind makes me almost sick... LOL I mean, come ON! I pray no one thinks that ANY engineer can follow at the speed he shows here. Go man, go! LOL
This makes me pretty jealous. I'm considering getting a Keysight/Agilent 34465A, but the graphical features on this Keithley puts it to shame. But then again it costs 4 times as much in my country anyway.
Shame Keithley doesn't have similar offerings at lower prices and with some lower specs - the user interface alone is fantastic.
Mythricia , What a fantastic idea! This would make a great way to illustrate the "Less is More" idea!
Try again with the flame and use the PSU modulation input to see if you can get a singing flame with the setup. As well try making a simple triode or diode using concentration gradients along the flame, feed being cathode and an anode and grid wire ( tungsten wire) in the flame.
For the touch screen just get a few styli for smartphones, that are usable with multitouch capacitive screens, and put them by each meter so you then have an effective tiny finger. they should give them as standard with that type of instrument, as not everybody has tiny fingers.
SeanBZA I like it. Thanks! :)
The Signal Path Blog That noise probably is residual from the DC converter that drives the input side. Going to be hard to fix that without redesign or additional filtering on that side. The ratio measurement is nice, you should try it on some wide range attenuators ( AC and DC just to see how good the attenuator and the meter is on those ranges) to see how wide a range it can handle.
a fine piece of equipment, but did the cat gave its stamp of approval? that's very important 😺
I wish I could afford that dmm
What is the material the copper plates are stuck into? Are you sure you are not measuring its conductivity? In the end when the flame goes off, the current flow doesn't seem to change...
Dennis Lubert The material is a high-resistivity insulation foam. The reason you don't see a current change at the end is because beyond 500V I don't have the meter connected at all.
The Signal Path Blog oh, missed that, thats what you get for letting the video run in the background ;)
Dennis Lubert No problem. I am glad that you asked the question and are considering all variables. :)
👍👍
hi i am looking for a current and dc voltage and current source.............up to 30 volts and 100 mili amp current ...................... any advice ??? ................... Thanks
The carbon content of the flame decreases the resistance of the dielectric (air) between the plates.
A gas furnace senses whether the burner has actually lit off in nearly the same manner... In a furnace, the resistance is measured from the burner assembly to the flame rod. The carbon within the flame creates a 'resistor' between the two which is sensed and a flame is assumed.
icesoft1 I am not fully convinced that it is just the carbon. There must be some charged ions involved otherwise the flame would not be deflected toward the plates. :)
The Signal Path Blog Is the flame resistance linear? Try using the curve tracer.
The Signal Path Blog could it be that there is actually some airflow between the plates and that it deflects the flame? Care to repeat that in vacuum? :)
es casi un mini osciloscopio. lo de la tabla logarítmica, lo explicará en el manual; porque descargue de la página de keithley.com como 4 pdf's que hablan sobre el.
I'm in the market for a bench multimeter, $4000 dollars kills my wallet.
Very good video, your experiments are really interesting.
Kickstart doesn't seem to be free software?
Did you ever make a video on the 2280 psu shown at 47:56 if so where is it? By the way long-time subscriber thanks for the good reviews. And to the test equipment manufacturers could you please send more test equipment to this guy he really does make the best reviews for test equipment I was considering buying a keysight 34470A but because of this guy's video alone I'm going to save up until I can afford one of these instead. The EEVBlog video was useless (I realize it was a teardown and not a review but still this is the only solid review for this product).
Hi.
Thank you for recording the video. I always enjoy your movies are they are well-prepared and scientific in focus. Having said that I only have one negative comment. I would like to ask you to pay attention to the wording around software. You've used the term "free software" but it is my impression that the software you are using is simply gratis, but not free (as in freedom).
For viewers with a strong free software background this may leave the incorrect impression that Kithley are creating free and open source software. To the best of my knowledge that is not the case. They simply allow you to download the software for free.
Best regards
ZK
Zygmunt Krynicki Thanks! I never said the software was open-source. I said it was free, which means you don't have to pay for it. Both the KickStart and Scripting platform are free to download.
Yes, this is exactly the confusion. The term "free software" has a well-defined meaning of "free, open source software". I would use "free to download" or "gratis" to avoid the connection with the free-as-in-freedom software.
I realize that very little free software exists in the professional test equipment market.
In any case, thank you for the video :-)
MichaelKingsfordGray Language is a living and evolving concept. The word "free" had many meaning, also including the meaning of freedom, well before the advent of free software as we know it today. Nobody is trying to "shift the normal definition of English words". New terms are added all the time. It would be foolish to claim that the term "free software" has no other meaning, apart from "gratis software". As can be seen on wikipedia, there are multiple meanings associated with it: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_software_%28disambiguation%29
My original suggestion was to avoid terms that might be misinterpreted. This video blog is full of well defined factual information. I would assume that it is the desire of the author to express himself as clearly and unambiguously as he can.
Best regards
ZK
It was never my intent to gain attention. Free and open source software is more popular now than ever before. As to your question: I don't think anyone "picked" the term. It just grew by itself. Perhaps Stallman coined that term, I'm not sure. In either case, it's there.
Is there a way to log the data to a computer?
howard shen of course, there are dozen ways, USB, LAN, GPIB, flash drive
I do have a question, which is your favourite test equipment manufacturer?
TheAmmoniacal I don't have a favorite equipment manufacturer. I do have favorite instruments from various vendors. :)
The Signal Path Blog Hi Shariar -- just curious about something. On other reviews you are clear that you're not being paid -- is that true here as well? Or is the payment the instrument itself?
***** I am never paid for any review nor do I get any cut of the sales. There is no payment. My videos are never seen or edited by the manufactures before they are posted, my experiments are designed by myself. Aside from leaving the instrument with me the vendors are not involved in any way.
The Signal Path Blog Awesome, I was fairly sure but usually you explicitly mention it, plus you really seem to be excited about the Keithley instruments in particular, but it's understandable because they're pretty amazing instruments.
***** They do make some very nice instruments. I was also very excited about the Keysight S-Scope, that was a fun review.
Hopefully the spectral purity of its timebase and converter are good enough to exploit its amplitude dynamic range you rave about and justify a in-meter dft.
With a low-mid-range 8 bit scope you may already achieve maybe -100 dBc if you do a sufficiently long dft, here we may achieve -130 dBc, if the spectral purity of sampling and timebase allow it, which i don't see much use for because with the scope i can go to much higher frequencies quickly.
It may be nice to have, if you have the money and the time to play around with it. The only real reason for me is the dc precision, which i can have cheaper.
Raymund Hofmann This is not supposed to replace your oscilloscope. The idea is to exploit the 1MS/s at 6.5-digit resolution which seems to work rather well.
Whilst we all love repair videos I think it's time for some real science
Fantastic video and very informative like all the other you made, but for my regret these meters are to far to expensive for a hobbiest :)
I like the screwup in editing at 1:14:xx...we are all humans and make mistakes ;)
Few more things :) * Seems you forgot to cutout section on 1:13:21 ;) * Also if it's not a big hassle, could you collect some zero noise data from DMM7510 with short on inputs on different ranges/NPLC for my stability analysis of different DMMs (xdevs.com/article/dmm_noise/ ,and also on EEVBlog thread). I'm really curious to see how true is Keithley's statement that this meter lower noise than 8.5 DMM. I have Model 2002 and dozen of 2001's which already tested. If it's much better, i'd consider selling few of my meters to get 7510. * Was trying to get demo unit from KI back when meter was released, did not even get reply from them :D Anyhow, Good job on review, we miss more cats, thank you!
xDevs.com More cats for sure in the next video! :) I can try that measurement for you and post it. I'll reply to your message once it is posted.
hello sir, keithley is an indian machine
$4k and only an intertek rating? Jeeze they must cutting it close on the profit margin :p
Quién de habla hispana lo tiene?
A flame as a dielectric material ... xD
More cats!
Keithley is about 25 years late to the party again.
Look at this Prema 8017 multimeter:
www.amplifier.cd/Test_Equipment/other/Prema-8017.html
7.5 digits, powerful 80386 processor, advanced MS-DOS operating system with graphical user interface, most of the functions you just demonstrated, you sure you don't want to swap?
Prema was so far ahead of it's time with this, it boggles the mind.
+stefantrethan Actually, your Prema is even better than this Keithley, because it goes up to 30,100,000 counts!
It might be a great instrument, but the front panel looks cheap compared to my Keithley 2015THD - The plastic overlay isn't even well made, the rubber (which is is also crooked...) covers the very bottom of the power button label and the red on the upper right looks cheap. The UI also looks like it was designed in the 1990's.... I know it's being picky, but it's also a lot of money, even in a well funded lab. At least the buttons are backlit.
I'm also disappointed such an expensive instrument is made in China. I understand the need for preserving margins on cheaper instruments but at this level, why?
I noticed the crooked rubber on the bottom too, and suspect it's a remnant of Shahriar putting it back together after pulling the cover for review.
the front is actually really awesome, very high quality, beats the 2015 or any other instrument hands down; the rubber is flexible and can be removed and repositioned
Maybe that spurious noise was due to your cat being trapped inside the instrument... Please double check when closing the case...
DJSolitone Hehe.
First again
joblessalex Congratulations, would you like a cookie?
joblessalex Grow up
Justin Bell Yes please.
Dr. Lecter Never.