Analog vs. Digital | Episode 1: Delay
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- Опубліковано 29 тра 2024
- Can you hear the difference? Watch as Andy Martin runs the same riffs through a bunch of different analog and digital delays.
Read more on Reverb: bit.ly/2Vfq1lo
Learn which type of delay pedal is best for you: bit.ly/3ycBpgf
Special thanks to The Bonfires Vintage shop for supplying some gear in this video. Check out their amazing inventory: bit.ly/3xaWgzd
Full gear used for video
Amp: Fender Deluxe Reverb Reissue
Guitars: Redtail Guitars ‘62, Nik Huber Twangmeister
Pedals:
Ross Stereo Analog Delay
Maxon AD-9
Maestro EP-3 Echoplex
Echofix EF-X2
GFI System Orca Delay
Boss DD-8
TC Electronic Flashback 2
Alexander History Lesson V3
Universal Audio EP-34 Tape Echo Plugin
Recording Gear: Universal Audio Apollo 8 QUAD, UA OX Amp Top Box, de Lisle Amp-Speaker Switcher 4x4 Pro Plus, Royer R-121 Mic
Strings: Stringjoy Signature 10-46
Cables: Sinasoid Sable & Sliver patch cables, Revelation Guitar Cables
*From time to time, brands and builders send Reverb free gear to test and review, some of which may have been included in this video.
0:00 - Alexander History Lesson & Maxon AD9
0:58 - Intro
1:44 - Slapback AD9
2:10 - Slapback Echoplex
2:39 - Slapback Digital DD-8
3:04 - Med Delay - AD9
3:32 - Med Delay - DD-8
3:54 - Long Delay - Ross Delay
4:53 - Long Delay - Echoplex
5:40 - Long Delay - DD-8
6:28 - Mod Delay - Jam Delay Llama
7:55 - Mod Delay - EchoFix Tape Delay
8:37 - Mod Delay - GFI System Orca
9:20 - Digital Tape Emulations
9:49 - Tape Emu - Maxon AD9
10:27 - Tape Emu - TC Flashback
11:31 - Tape - EchoPlex
12:15 - Tape - Universal Audio Echoplex
13:04 - Outro - Розваги
Way cool demo. I remember back in the 70's how my buddy Rob's Echoplex sounded. I don't think he ever changed the tape, so it was pretty lo-fi - more so than the tape delays in the demo. Rob has passed on and I miss him, not to mention that lo-fi echo and his whacky and manic soloing - hopefully he's jamming up there in the cosmos.
@Andrew Hoppe Thanks dude. He's been gone for quite awhile now and yeah, he was a bit of a character. I was a big Yes nut in the 70's (still am) and he turned me on to the Mahavishnu Orchestra. Seems like only yesterday that we were sitting in his basement/rehearsal studio smoking a bowl and listening to The Inner Mounting Flame. I'm hanging in there - getting old and I've got some pains but at least I can still play guitar.
"with a short delay time it's harder to distinguish character"
*echoplex still proceeds to smoke everything else*
also that ross thing sounds so good, it kinda almost ring mods on longer repeats
Yea, it does that "thing" .. what can a poor boy do? Save up for a Bellepoch deluxe? Likely. The unholy wave of money tossed at delay pedals...damn. I always regret buying a delay pedal because the appetite for another is still unresolved.
Nuthin like tape echo
This series has so much interesting potential
I’ve played dozen of analog and digital delays as well as a few real tape ones and despite the usual rhetoric of the differences- filtering, clarity, warble, fidelity- I’m pretty set on the main essential difference: tape loves an overdriven signal (beautiful harmonic saturation), digital hates one (harsh digital clipping), and BBD can go either way depending on the circuit. It’s also why my favourite chip based delays- the Belle Epochs, the Echorec, the Boonar- sound so good: the analog circuitry is designed so that it soft clips within itself and imparts this saturation to the codec without clipping it into digital distortion.
For me, it depends which one I would use... If my guitar tone is more distorted and high gain, I prefer more "pure and simple" digital delay. With more clean, bluesy or slightly crunch guitar tone I use analog delay so it can bring it's own warm character to sound. Nice series. Now waiting for the reverb episode.
I actually tend to prefer the opposite - analog delays work really well with high-gain tones imo as it tames the high end and blends very well, while with warmer and cleaner tones digital delays feel very balanced.
That Ross Delay is genuinely the most unique delay I've ever heard. It seems to clip out or something... I like it.
And it has some serious aliasing going on.
Sounds like bitcrushing
@@trentkraemer7109 It's called aliasing.
@@trentkraemer7109 For sure.
@@HenritheHorse yeah I know, bit crushing/sample rate reduction causes aliasing.
What a treat to get to see you demo some cool tape units! I wasn’t expecting it based on the title.
One of your best videos so far, Andy!
Ooohh, nice idea for a series; this is fun to watch!
The Ross delay, and the green MXR Analog Delay it essentially clones, used a "tracking filter". They both made a clever use of the clock that drove the delay chips, by dividing it down to adjust the lowpass filter rolloff point as delay time was lengthened or shortened (i'll elaborate if there is demand for it). At the time, manufacturers would pick one rolloff that they deemed suitable for eliminating clock noise at the longest delay time, and stick with that. Both the MXR and Ross pedals gave you *more* treble as the delay time was shortened. The old blue rackmount M-113 MXR Digital Delay sort of did that too, but changed the rolloff depending on the delay range one selected via the push-buttons on the front.
I find it ironic that the "warm" sound people associate with analog delay is really due to the more severe lowpass filtering needed by analog delays to keep the clock noise and hiss to a minimum. The same filtering applied to a digital delay can provide the exact same "warmth".
Thanks Mark, that’s very true about the lowpass filter in my experience with analog and digital. Always nice to hear from you!
@@AndyDemos A pleasure and honour to get a nod from you, Andy. Thanks. Keep up the good work.
Mark THE hammer?
Great video! Really showcases the differences. I got to say I do love the Carbon Comp's warmth and "girth".
Maxon AD9, I'm a harp player & guitarist and that Maxon is the best all round analogue delay for 70s sounds on both amped harmonica & guitar, the tonal quality of the delayed notes has a great blend of pleasing overtones
Had an Echoplex back in the 70's. Nice warm sound, but couldn't get it dialed in for vocals in the PA. Used a Roland RE-150 and RE-201. Better for instruments but only slightly better for sound system use. then I bought a Roland RE-301 Chorus Echo. WOW!!!! The best tape echo I've ever used. Great for ambiance in the PA sound system.
I just do not like a spotless delay. But when the repeats decay in a degenerative fashion with modulation and pitch imperfections- I just love it. Musical. A perfect delay repeat sounds contrived to me. Like seeing the horizon without some haze, rain or heat distortion, it's a picture perfect day except it's paint by numbers. Adineko is a current favorite of mine. I wish it was midi ready.
Awesome video as usual! Keep it up Andy!!
I'm glad you enjoyed it, thanks!
Great demo and some nifty guitar playing. There's no right or wrong answer here is there. They all have their own character.
One of my life's regrets is not buying the entire Ross line new when I had the chance.
Very cool idea that should generate a lot of polarizing opinions. Hopefully, we all get to hear what great offerings both technologies have to offer. Cheers
Somewhere in a dim lit studio, the magic words are spoken,
"well we could add some delay.."
It is only then that the intrepid realize the intricate vastness of the ambient rabbit hole.
4:16 Wow that's nice
Can’t wait for the next battle of the ages!
The echoplex sounds amazing
I have AD-9 on all the time (unless it´s a special part, where you wanna go dry af) and for the more spacy stuff, I´ll throw in the green beast, DL-4. Cannot imagine I would need any other delay in the next decade or so, I did, however, used to have Maxon ad-999 but I forget it in a taxi after heavy jam night...I do miss it because of the delay time can go further than AD-9, but then again I think the fundamental tone of AD-9 is perfect: You don't even hear it, but it just makes the tone more fat and juicy. That's my take: have one analog delay doing your basics, leave it on and then pair it with whatever is your weapon of choice for "actual delay".
That’s such a good idea, might pick up that mini AD to do just this on my board
I'm a harp player & guitarist and that Maxon is the best all round analogue delay for 70s sounds on both amped harmonica & guitar, the tonal quality of the delayed notes has a great blend of pleasing overtones
this was great, thank you
Killer playing Andy!
That Maxon sounds so good.
A very very interesting series fs
I play in a shoegaze band. Lots of both is good 👍
I think that any one of these pedals/effects would be fine. Each has their positives & negatives. I'm not a fan of tape echo/delay because of the reliance upon the tape and an older machine to function properly.
I think that reality strikes the players here. If you have a pedal you picked up that works well in your rig, you use that. Digital/analog, you work with the pedal and what it sounds like. If you are lucky enough to own an older classic sounding device, then fine use that and look after it when it needs servicing. If all that you have is an emulation Plug In within your DAW on your laptop or a Boss pedal, then use that and learn the ropes and make music with it.
All these devices that Andy played here sound good and can be used both live or in recording, I'm emphasising though, that many of us can't afford a genuine EP3, and there would be barely anyone 'hear' the difference of a Boss pedal emulating that sound amongst all the other sound in a live setting, or even on a demo recording.
I will always love analog and digital pedals, so as a bass player, I'm good either way. Not so important to me as it would be to a guitar player. There's something so alluring and personal about pedals.
4:47 That was sick!
TC Flashback seems to give great versatility and performance in all phases of A/D
In Dave Hunter "Guitar Effects Pedal: The Practical Handbook" (a book I found somewhat disappointing, in comparison to the quality of his other books and columns), there is a series of interviews with different esteemed pedal "pioneers". One of them is Roger Mayer. Keeping in mind the book was published in 2013, and the interview likely carried out before then, Mayer makes an interesting point in his preference for analog over digital, when it comes to delays. His contention is that there is little difference in the audio quality of initial pick attack, but as the delayed signal decays, one will notice a difference in quality because that much softer signal is encoded by fewer bits; i.e., decay has lower resolution in the digital domain. Again, important to recognize that contemporary digital delays are often 24-bit resolution and 96khz sampling rate...or better, so his caveats from 9 years ago may well be obsolete now.
This analog-vs-digital diatribe has much in common with what I hear in my professional field of digital imaging.
In imaging you get banding in 8-bit environments, but, if you work in 16 bits all the way, the added steps eliminate the banding. It's up to you, the user, to understand that.
Often with a prejudiced attitude, many people reluctantly looked at "digital" (loosely defined) decades ago, judged it lacking, then never bothered to update their judgment, heedless to how much the technology has advanced since then.
Like so much else, these differences of opinion, instead of opening to debate, harden and take on the flavor and smell of religious dogma.
Myself, I stick to facts and evidence.
In music, what SOUNDS good IS good.
Just as, with images, what LOOKS good IS good.
I wish that many more people saw it that way, instead of wasting so much energy chasing dragons.
@@raimondo3178 Agree. I suspect the people making decent music adopt the same approach as yourself, using whatever complements the overall sound they are working towards, regardless of its actual technical underpinnings, rather than cork-sniffing individual devices based on specs.
There was a seminal column (at least for me) in Stereo Review magazine in the early-to-mid-80s, by one of the then-deans of audio, either Julian Hirsch or Len Feldman, I forget which. At the time, there were several vinyl discs available, that were recorded on digital gear (Ry Cooder's "Bop 'Til You Drop" being one of the very first), but the benchmark was considered to be so-called "direct-to-disc" recordings where the musicians essentially "cut" the master plate as they played. Already there were complaints that digital sounded harsh and sterile, "brittle". The author noted that he himself was not always satisfied by the tone on such recordings, but felt that it resulted from misplaced engineering and mic-ing techniques. He contended that traditional engineering and mic-ing techniques strove to overcome what recording to mag tape, mixdown, and pressing onto vinyl from a copy of a copy of a copy of the mix did, and that mic-ing techniques were intended to let slected instruments "cut through", in spite of all that bandwidth loss, and problematic noise floor. His feeling was that, once recording engineers got used to the increased bandwidth, and much lower noise floor of digital recording, they would adapt their mic-ing techniques to this new medium and things would sound pleasing again to the purists. In other words, growing pains.
I feel the same way about digital delay. The idea that one didn't have to "suffer" the limited bandwidth of analog or tape delay, especially once higher-resolution A/D and D/A became available, seduced manufacturers into aiming for as much bandwidth in the wet signal as was technically possible. Specs-wise, that's great, but it's not at ALL what reflected sound sounds like. Sound reflected off surfaces, even off glass or polished marble, always has less top end than the dry sound. Eventually pedal-makers started removing top end, or providing controls for the end-user to do so, such that digital delay began to sound more natural. Personally, I always insert a bit of shallow lowpass filtering in the feedback path, of any analog or digital delay that provides access, such that successive repeats always have a bit less top end than the previous repeat. Sounds more natural, and in the case of analog delay also cleans up the audio grunge that builds up over multiple repeats.
@@markhammer643 :
Hi Mark.
Thank you for your reply.
One paradox that is not well understood in the "analog vs digital" controversy is that "digital" produces *higher and higher fidelity* as the sampling rate increases alongside with processing power.
Our ears are used to what some like to call "warmth" but can be less charitably called "noise" or "distortion". When the signal passes through much more cleanly, with less noise or distortion, ears used to earlier standards will cry "foul", instead of understanding that the newer technology requires a change in techniques of "sound acquisition".
When Cooder's "Bop" album came out in the 80s, I took notice immediately, and felt very interested in the new direction things were going.
All this time later, we are still figuring out how to use miking, recording and other techniques to best effect in the "digital" realm.
And there is still widespread, persistent and prejudicial hostility in the way. I understand that a number of people like the way things USED to sound: that is legitimate. But they make that a reason to dig in and declare war *on something they refuse to understand*, something that can be their friend if they make a minimum effort to expand their understanding.
There is no reason to "hate" something that is demonstrably and objectively powerful and capable of great results.
With a better understanding of the potentials of "digital", one can still admit that they themselves just feel more comfortable with the older ways, and also admit that the newer trends are something that they themselves will not use for *subjective* reasons, rather than expend energy attacking their objective value.
That, to me, seems more respectful and honorable.
In modern times, you either want the repeats to be obvious or natural. Or the timing to be spot on or on it's own course with multiple taps The different ways of doing it is where the preference lies. All these delays have a good use in one form or another and repeat times and feedback levels just add to the flavor of choosing. Short stuff may favor the digital sometimes but on some guitars (like LP) not so much, it gets muddy or too obvious. For longer delay times a tape sounding delay is often a great choice. Or an analog BBD could be preferable for getting rid of the high frequencies in the repeat that might be in the way delivered from a tape delay which actually rolls off some bottom end, and that keeps the repeats from being muddy in the present. It can make or break a guitar tone played for effect. Bandwidth degeneration is easier on the ears to a perfect repeat fading out imho. Good thing there are choices! - Try the Adineko for some wild repeats, I love it. But when it has to be just so...Volante gets it done for me, mild or wild.
@@markhammer643 Howdy Mark Hammer. You're rather famous in my effects building and tinkering circles, it's a pleasure to join a conversation with you. I have a million questions for you but I will limit myself to only two! lol! - From your life long study, what was your personal favorite self invented or realized circuit/pedal for guitars? And, , did you ever build a piezo instrument pre-amp in your explorations?
Great video. I used to run a black Echoplex into a Leslie for my entire rig. Now I run a Boss SY1, Source Audio Multiwave Distortion, Empress Zoia stereo into old Crate amps with Chorus and spring reverb built-in. Tried a million different things. You can impress with how you use the effects like ping-pong but I always sacrifice something. Lightweight is good as I age. Lol.
I have been thinking about those old combos for cheap springs
@@zeusapollo8688 yeah. I love the chorus on the Crate gx-30 etc.
Question ? Is the delay modulation that the newer delays you showed is that similar to having a worn out tape in a echoplex ep3
Excellent
Great to see the Maxon AD-9 getting shown some love. The world seems to have forgotten how great they are, except for the weak paint job.
Maxon is seriously overlooked, great company, top quality products. I use AD9 more than any other delays
I play with a Maxon AD900, I love it!
Very cool👏👏
The analog delays sound great, the digital was good too. I think I liked the analog colouration.
Tape echoes are too much trouble for most people as they need regular maintenance, this isn’t really an issue if you have the tools, parts and knowledge to do it, but sadly parts and knowledge on these effects are getting less every day.
they're manufacturing new versions of them.
That twangmeister is really nice
Those were some cool ass riffs.
Thanks so much!
Clean guitar = analog delay
Dirty guitar = digital delay
Quite possibly the simplest and most useful way to go. I like the summary.
EVH and the Edge would disagree.
Is this guy throwing in a little Limp Bizkit flair? Great video!
That Ross is f’ing awesome
7:19 Was that Sigur Ros ? Love it.
Andy is a really good player!
Good job Andy!
Echoplex so satisfying to hear
The Tape emulation Flashback vs Maxon bit sure sounded like Slowdive, was it?
Excited to see an episode of this about overdrive and fuzz
And let Andy's playing speak for itself!
The difference (for those with good hearing) between the Maxon and the tc electronic Flashback is pronounced. The Flashback is instantly 'heard' to be darker and woodier and smoother.
I GUESS it's a matter of taste but I'd take the Maxon.
Andy is the Man! He "plays a mean guitar;" I'm sure he also be as amazing in the new Ghostbusters movie "Afterlife!"
I actually saw Andy smile in this one :)
Can we all just agree that delay is the best guitar effect?
I recently got a delay for bass and I wonder how anyone gets anything done because just messing around with a delay is so much fun.
9:45 Mmm yes, what a nice riff, kinda gives me a New Sensation 😏
So impressed with the EchoFix Mod.
Mine has around 40h of playing, but there almost no mod... Was it pure tape wow & flutter in this caption ? How much wear has the tape ?
Cheers Andy !!
Hey Pierre, the modulation you hear on the Echofix is DSP, there is very little wow and flutter on the unit since it’s only a about a year old with just about the same hours as yours. Usually the pinch roller is the main cause for modulation in tape echoes and since they are really well made and brand new, I wouldn’t expect too much modulation naturally, hence the built in chorus. Thanks!
@@AndyDemos Thanks Andy ! That's more clear to me now. So the strong reliability of the EchoFix eliminate what most of us loves so much about real tape : The natural flutter !
It's still a crazy piece of gear which is a dream to play.
Wish you the best.
@@PeterGuitarSound Yes but I’ve always found the Space Echo design to have less flutter anyway, it’s the EP and shorter loop machines that really get warbly. Happy to help, thanks 👍🏻
Good demo, demo, demo, demo, demo ...
Can anyone explain to me what different between analog and digital?
St. Andy of our Gear Demos
The sound sounds sweeter through the Echoplex
Deluxe Memory Man receiving only a passing mention in this video is set trippin on DMM gang’s turf
I’ve got a few DMM demos already 😉
Lol
@@AndyDemos I’ve seen them since PGS, DMM gang approved 👍
A bloody minefield this one !
Could it rival the overdrive debate?
Why aren't you showing the Echoplex?
Analog still sounds lively
Andy, you are now the only youtube guitarist that I watch. I cannot stand those other guys anymore: MIW, Rob Scallon, Samurai Guitarist, Rudy Ayoub, Robert Baker, Philip Mcknight, you name it. They are all cringy in their own way and not really genuine. Ironically you play so well, that it might not be a real accurate representation of the gear you are demoing but that is your amazing ability and not your fault.
What are you on about? Phil and Rob Scallon are some of the most genuine people on this shithole we call youtube
Twooba?
@@ileutur6863 Andy's got an uncolored, professional style. He has the classic demo man persona. A lot of those other guys are comparatively obnoxious or reliant on gimmicks. They're trying too hard to be "UA-camrs". You don't see Andy watering down his brand with clickbait or drama.
At The end it's not about the Sound - it's about the feel. You can't show it on YT
Can't have a delay without modulation! All my analog and digital delays have modulation!
Wish they'd properly reissue an 18V AD80.
Need to hear an AD9 against a DE7
...Ocean Blue?
Well, I know what I'm doing with my AD-9 and a digital delay this weekend. I'm stacking them like a 4-yrold with Luke & Leia dolls.
That Ross sounds like its a bit crusher!
Yes it does! It's much cleaner and brighter with faster delay setting and it uses the famed Reticon BBDs.
Hi andy!
Even the *snobbiest* of Tone-Purists must agree that every single one of these sounded absolutely fantastic - especially in Andy's hands.
Which means that, if you're not happy with the sound of your delay, it might be your *playing* that's the real issue....
1:53 Police Truck?
More like Plastic Man 👍🏻
Well, I’m buying a tape delay.
Ad9 has a lil something special to my ears the others lack.
I was so close to buying that thing
Digital delays are the king. Tape echoes come close but probably sound better in front of a preamp than after. Analog delays suck in my opinion, muddy, lofi, buzzy and limited with what you can do with them. Although I believe the Rockman Stereo Echo was an analog delay, and that sounded really good so it may be the sole exception.
Analog is better and will always be better. Lol, hard to tell the difference.