The state of US schools is still very much in a state of pro-girl education. That’s not a bad thing. Especially if you care about girls being educated. But not at the expense of boys. Learning, memorizing, regurgitating information. It’s not usually the most effective way boys will learn things.
The reason your ship can be pointed any direction when firing your torpedos is that the torpedos have a gyro that turns them in the proper direction based on your targeting inputs. If you point your boat more or less directly at your aim point you will be a little more accurate because you are eliminating one of the variables that could potentially go wrong.
People have made some comments here about why the first speed calculation for the target failed. It did in fact have to do with the bearing of the target ship in relation to you. Consider this: Pretend that you are dead in the water and are looking due north at a ship that is coming due south directly toward you. In that case, you will NEVER be able to get a speed of the ship as you will never see the stern past the vertical bar of the crosshair. Essentially, the crosshair remains on the bow as the target rams right into you. If you adjust the direction of the target slightly off from due south, you will see the stern, but it could take a VERY long time before it passes your crosshair vertical -- even if the ship is travelling quite fast. However, your calculation will be that the ship is traveling very slowly. Because of this, the ONLY accurate measurement is to take the measurement when the target is bearing 90 degrees or 270 degrees (at right angles) from your ship. If the target is bearing at any thing other than at right angles, then you have to make some other calculations based on the variance from 90 or 270 degrees -- which would get very complicated. So, whenever lining up for an attack, if you don't know the speed of the target, make sure you take the calculation when at right angles to it. RedDragon1211, in your second attempt, the target was approximately at right angles, which meant that you (somewhat) got the right speed, and sure enough, a torpedo hit. Another thing to keep in mind that if your uboat is moving, then that can affect the calculation as well since the measurement as you click off the stopwatch as the stern passes your vertical crosshair will be taken with the positions of the two ships in relation to each other no longer being at right angles (which is easier to explain with a diagram than here in words). So to ensure the best accuracy, slow down as much as possible for as long as the stopwatch is running and make sure you are as close to right angles as possible.
The proper way to do it would be to first input the course - before measuring speed. Have not tested it myself yet, but logic implies that if you tell the computer target is traveling towards you vs. the 90 degree AOB - the the trigonometry calculated ship distance will be smaller for the needed speed calculation.
27:30 that’s not the case though. I mean, it used to be like that in WWI, but the vast majority of WWII torpedoes not only had a gyroscope to maintain their attack heading, but also had additional gyro used to turn the torp towards the enemy from any heading of the submarine. If you add even more gyros, by the way, you can program the torp to do some zigzags like in a tetris snake game, substantially elevating the chance of hitting an enemy in a very large convoy. I believe only some Soviet submarines had the old some school torpedoes with a single gyro which actually required to turn the entire submarine on to the attach heading, and that was such a gimmick it significantly reduced the efficiency of Soviet crews. That said, twin-gyro system was not perfect. Some German, English and American torpedoes had severe issues with that additional gyro, as bad as the torp never stopping turning off the tube, making a full circle and smashing into the submarine itself - several submarines actually died due to such malfunctions. Thankfully, detonators also used to fail. Imagine being the luckiest submarine ever with a double torpedo malfunction: the torp made full circle, slammed into the submarine and was supposed to detonate killing everyone on board, but instead the detonator failed, turning the whole thing into the best dud ever :D Also. The torpedoes missed during the first attack because the torpedo computer adds a correction to your periscope heading. That’s needed to allow really precise shots, like, aiming for an ammo rack of a battleship or boilers of aircraft carrier. In layman terms, you want to keep your periscope roughly where you want your torpedo to hit the enemy ship if you confident in your calculation, or at least at the center, if not so much. That’s how it worked irl, that’s how things were implemented in Silent Hunter, and I am pretty sure that’s how it works here too.
When you use the attack periscope, the point you are aiming out is where the torpedo will aim at. So, when you fired the first one, since you had your aim of, you missed. The second one, you had your aim on the back of the ship and your speed was a little below, so you also missed. Keep your periscope on the center of the ship to have grater chances. Another thing is that in the game convoys travel at full speed values, 4, 5, 6 So it’s always good to try a couple times if you ar missing a little over o a little below and round the speed accordingly ou put in manually the full value, it make a huge difference specially in low speeds! Third, the distance is only relevant to calculate the time for impact, so if you get the course and the speed correctly you can put in any distance and it is fine, since you can track torpedo on the map. Since in real life, you can’t track torpedos on the map, they calculated the distance so they could know if they hit or miss by the time for impact
Not EXACTLY true about distance. Distance doesn’t matter only when you’re firing near a zero Gyro angle (that means the torpedo will not turn very much after coming out of your boat) but if you fire at a higher Gyro angle (for example if the target ship was 45° or 60° off the bow of your boat) and the torpedo has to make a turn after firing then distance does matter. So distance does not matter with a zero Gyro angle but it becomes increasingly important as you get closer and closer to a 90° Gyro angle.
@@jameslanz2117 actually no, because the calculations are made in vectors (speed and angles) so the distance does not really matter, only the angles and speeds. Time is only relevant for “time to impact” calculations but not the “angle of fire” calculation. Of course at steeper angles (45° for example) you have a narrower window and the shot is more difficult and the inputs have to be more precise, but the distance is not an input
@@MrScarduelli actually I am correct. When you shoot off boresight the torpedo travels a short distance before turning. That negates the “distance doesn’t matter” phenomenon that happens with a zero Gyro angle. Try it in silent hunter 3 or the TDC mod of Uboat. When you’re firing with zero gyro angle range does not matter. When you’re firing 90° gyro angle range matters quite a bit.
@@jameslanz2117 if a higher distance you have a narrower window, and the unaconted effects like weather and sea conditions at magnified. But on “perfect conditions” the distance do not change the angle of attack. You can put your distance at different values with the same inputs and the angles will be the same.
@@jameslanz2117 the “turn” the torpedo make at different gyro angles make them more unreliable and are worse and longer ranges. That’s why you should fire as close to 0 as possible
Quick tip to calculate the course of the ships, to eliminate human error while doing the vertical line, use the w key to move the map up, this will give you an exact perpendicular line.
Your first (succesfull) speed-gestimate was a computer-error. You timed the 123,5 meter long ship at 43,5 seconds bow-to-stern, giving it a speed of 5,5 knots. The game rounded that from 4,5 maybe (as it showed a 4) or if it's an integer then the actual value maybe was 4,99) but was still off by a lot. When you manually entered '4' for the second ship, you were way off. Extra tip: At 20:24 when figuring out the course, the AOB of the target ship is "40-Green". We see the starboard side so, Green. And we see that the diagonal crane-booms are almost in line with their crane-masts. These booms are at 45 degrees to the center-line of the ship. We see them a bit to the left of the crane-mast so not 45 degrees yet -> about 40 degrees. Knowing your own heading (which the game doesn't give) gives you the target-course. You are right to say that the bearing tools doesn't work very well. I give it an estimated AOB and it returns a target-course that isn't remotely close to the true course. So I change the AOB value until the computer generates the right course. Always double-check a computer!
I watched so many tutorials, in english and german. Yours is the best one. Finally I understand how it works. Thank you so much!!! The mistakes of the other tutorials, they tell you to messure the angle of your ship to the target.
Thanks for this good video! It may be useful to know that 1 knot is 1 nautical mile per hour. As long as 1 mile has 10 cables, If you use nautical units you only have to measure distance in 3 minutes and multiply by 20 and you get the speed in knots. Even better and more accurate, you can count 6 min and multiply by 10. In games like SH3, as we had Km instead of miles, we were forced to use the 3'15" rule.
Hi,watched both of you guys about Uboat, big thanks to both of U,helps understand game lots quicker, than frustratingly learning at slow pace.look forward to watching more from both of you guys. 👍👍👍👍👍👍
For those that didn't stay long enough to see @32:33 and the following few mins, I laughed out loud and made this video epic. Way to get back on that horse Red Dragon and thanks for this very helpful tutorial!
If the way UBoat calculates the values is like the TDC in reality/Silent Hunter range shouldn't really matter for accuracy. It's mainly for estimated time to impact. Speed and angle are very, very important for accuracy due to how all torpedo math is glorious triangles. As others have said the Chronometer is best used at as close to a 90 degree angle as possible. Fantastic video. I especially appreciate the stadimeter visual for its explanation.
you can also add that in case you miss checking the distance of the torpedos every 50 meters you missed add 0.3 nm on boat speed (that if the miss was because of speed and not direction) and your case you missed because you measure the boat speed from the front and that made you count short on time because for you the angle of view was dif. on a convoy that are traveling at night you will not be able to see use that tool)
Very good video and method. Just wondering if you thought the map was a bit OP, considering the GPS like accuracy of the ships placement. Real world captains would get their AoB by observation based on experience, not by map geometry. I try to do it the same way. But to each their own. Not telling anyone how to play, just asking for thoughts on that. I’m wondering if we might see a bit more hardcore version of the map that’s not so accurate in later versions. A mod for SH5 did something similar.
That was the main reason for missed torpedos in WW2 The difficulty to calculate de AOB. You had to eyeball the angle, and that came with a lot of experience. That’s why in real life they would go very close and fire a salvo of torpedos in every target, to guarantee a kill.
the angle matters at speed calculation too but i think there is a way to do it on map wich includes setting up a distance and taking the time it takes to the boat to travel it i think it works if you know what kilometer stands for knots i dont know thats why im saying its more reliabble but needs a calculation wich you suprisingly cant do in game right now
Thank you for this, i found your channel today, and its been very helpful...Just bought this game 3 days ago, and have tried free aiming a few different times now, only to find out that im not really doing it right..lol
I am so glad you left the failure in as it made me feel better about my failures I'm so glad I'm not alone in my fuckups :> also good tutorial esp the maths and mapwork
does the game ask for the course of the target ship or its angle on the bow? Of course, angle on the bow was used historically but both are essentially the same information. If you know your ship's position , you can calculate the angle on the bow from the target ship's course (or direction of travel). Modern computers can calculate that easily but back then, it was far simpler for the TDC to calculate a solution using the AOB.
The AOB question is a common one. I have messed with the method however, as someone who is an outdoorsman and uses maps and compasses regularly, it made more sense to use the top down map and the tools to find bearing and course. I plan to grab the TDC mod and mess around with it. I will keep everyone updated.
Hello! Unfortunately they got rid of the Lat/Log lines with the big map update in 1.27 or 1.29. BIG monkey wrench in the way I do my target finding. I use the zoomed out ones to draw in one or two of my own near the target area. Its more work but, its the best we can do for now.
to measure the speed, the ships have to be perpendicular. Otherwise you are not measuring the true length of the ship due to angles measuring shorter lengths.
For the ship speed it felt like you were waiting too long with the stopwatch, clicking on the corner of the stern rather than the centre-back of the stern(which is slightly hidden from view by the angle and corner). Then again I could be wrong because the sterns are rounded, perspectives at that distance can be odd.
Good video thanks for posting even though you missed the first shots! Most people would just make a new one. Was wondering about taking the speed calculation and if the angle you are looking at the target makes a difference. Your first speed measurement the targets were coming towards you at an angle but the second one you were more at a 90 degree angle and I think you got a more accurate speed estimate. Would that make a difference?
It absolutely dose. My faith in the tools “in the moment” made me forget to consider that the measurement would be incorrect if not taken at 90deg. I was thinking more about what I was doing/saying not how I was doing it. Several people have pointed that out in the comments since. I usually measure the distance a target travels in a given time and hen work the math out to find speed.
Hi, started watching Salted vids, amazing and he recommended popping into yours for these very videos. So, hi from Salted Thanks for your, vids :) bothhelping no end...PS please say hi to Taff, watched his B-17 vids when he first put them out haha.
Sorry I know its 2 years later but I just found the channel. I am wondering how you would manually calculate ship distance without the computer? It looks like you are using the Pythagorean theorem and that the ships mast is filling a, how do you calculate what c or b is?
20:04 That's exactly why I'm here :D because I wanted to learn how to do it without the map to add realism. The shame is, that there is no explanation from the game itself (nor on any wiki or fan page) to explain what one has to do. After a few comparisons between the map technique and this in-game tool, I think I understood the reason why it never worked for me. If you manually position the tool so that it looks exactly how the ship looks to you, then you have kind of the first part done, but it isn't the correct angle, yet. The second part is to add or subtract the angle your ship is in comparison to the north and then position the tool to the angle you calculated. You see, the tool is actually a depiction of the uboat and what one needs to set up is the angle the target ship has in comparison to the uboat. But if this is how it should be done? no idea. And sorry if it sounds confusing, english is not my default language :D
If you look at the ship at an angle of 90 degrees, the lenght in the documents is correct. If they are at 056 and your not at 90 degrees to them, your speed measuring is not correct as the ship will become "shorter" in your optic and you miscalculate. You have to calculate the lenght of the ships in your optic before taking their time / Speed. How is that done?
Batteries are depleting very fastly, I didn't turn on anything except gyro and ventilation with electric engines on forward 1. And also crew are all sleeping at the same time.
My TDC is pretty accurate but I always find trying to figure out the ships heading a pain in the ass. The distance is easy and speed is too but I can’t seem to get the heading accurate enough and when I do the only T2 Torpedo I send it’s a dud
One thing I really can't get to understand is how it can figure speed with the chronometer if the ship is at a hard angle or coming right at you. Do you have to be at 90ﾟ to get an accurate speed or will it work at any relative angle to the other ship?
34:17 what about the course.. first timing course was not set so shouldent the ship be "shorter", second timing course is set so it caluculate lenght right
Screw my math teacher Mrs. Easter that old bat. If only this was the math taught maybe I'd have given a damn on the subject or seen how cool it is. Thanks for this video.
Apply this to a geometry class instead of just practice exercises that mean nothing and you'd have geometry whizzes. (At least those that are military nerds like me.) Haven't played since the Siemens target computer update that I'm a little intimidated by. Do you have a video on this? I don't like the changes they've made with map tools (like no grids) because I became very adept at it.
As of some recent update, the grid on the map is completely non existent unless you are incredibly zoomed out. Is there any way to complete these computations without the grid?
Hi, Lite_ly Salted send me. :) Vertical structures I would call king post. Good to know that I do not need to face the targets to fire torpedoes :D Is there any advantage to set different torp speed/depth?
In reality yes, changing the depth and speed of a Torpedo can have significant advantages. a faster torpedo is harder to dodge and the lower below the water line you can damage the ship the better. However, it seems that these settings are not fully fleshed out in the game. i know for sure that changing the depth at all can sen the torpedo way too deep and miss the target. I will have to play around with the settings and let you know.
@@RedDragon_1211 I found that bug when torpedo go way too deep. So for now I will not change depth until fixed. And it is so funny to lunch all 5 torps not facing target :) BTW I notice that when I connect two market points on the map by ruler it not only show distance but also bearing. Keep up the good content.
@@dusankollar602 I sort of hope they add an option for the hardcore players that limits the firing angle for the Torpedo tubes. It would require A LOT more planning before firing but, it would provide an interesting challenge.
@@RedDragon_1211 It is not normal, maybe it is done by mod? Only mods I think can alter this that I use is "compass navigation" and "authentic maps" Posted picture here: discord.com/channels/326159516595126274/575028511929139257/722727471442690052
Unfortunately no. These videos were made back in patch 126. They updated the map in 128. It is mildly frustrating but you can use the patrol sector lines they should line up north south and east west.
@@RedDragon_1211 mildly frustrating is an understatement. Why the HELL they removed the grid lines is a mystery to me. Unfortunately, the only two map mods out there don't have grid lines either.
I think your initial speed calculation was off because it didn't take into account the angle between the ship and the periscope, basically it appeared shorter because of the angle.
Mathematically the angle of measurement doesn't matter, it's the accuracy of the measurement. As the angle gets smaller the ship looks like it's traveling slower, but the hull also seems shorter so the time from the bow to stern measurement is the same. But the slower the movement the harder it is to exactly determine when the bow or stern passes a point for sure.
This video was from build 126. Recent patches have changed the map so there are no lat long lines. Planning to make an updated vid once my work schedule allows.
I cant get my torpedos to shoot right.. I liked silent hunter lock on better a 0 degree meand shot wher your boat is not a 130 degree and goes behind... this shoting is crazy screwed up....
Its not about what you like, Silent Hunter is Not UBOAT! UBOAT is not a shoot up game it's a simulation, therefor you need to learn and use the TDC MOD. The actual targeting computer used on those UBoat's in WWII. ua-cam.com/video/vhVal-4LrLQ/v-deo.html
@@RedDragon_1211 Could you clarify one thing for me please? You stated on the map 'North' is always 0 degrees. I understand if my bearing is true 0, then target bearing is let's say clockwise to perfect East is 90 degrees. No adding correct? Now say my bearing is perfect 'South'-is this 180 degrees according to the map or is it relative to what my uboat is as I've read elsewhere '0' degrees is always where your ship is pointing. In latter example let's say target bearing is heading West to my South bearing. Would this be 90 degrees relative to me or would it be 270 degrees? Sorry, I suck at math almost to the point of being dyslexic with numbers....I can read like a mofo but that does me little good here lol.
Ok this is a tricky thing to explain but I will do my best. There are four terms that get used in tandem with each other that mean ALMOST the same thing but are not. Heading, Course, Bearing, and Relative Bearing. The heading is the direction a ship/aircraft is pointed. The course is the direction a ship/aircraft is moving. Bearing (also known as Compass Bearing) refers to a targets position on a map or compass to you. (if the target is north of you it is bearing 0 deg.) Relative Bearing is a targets bearing to you, RELATIVE to your ship (bow is 0, the stern is 180 ect). Using the example above. if you are traveling west and a target is North of you. its Compass Bearing is 0 but its Relative Bearing to your ship is 90 (to you right/starboard) I would google a diagram for more clarity. This would not be a bad video to do eventually. I hope those distinctions helped.
@@RedDragon_1211 I understand the deal after playing for several days non-stop. A couple of times I was heading at a South-East direction and figured out that between 90 and 180 is 135 degrees and it matched on map tools with my periscope compass tool. I ALWAYS double check my sometimes zany math skills with the periscope compass tool and recheck. Angle on bow I understand is the position of your boat relative to if YOU were looking from the target at your uboat.
i hate this... i want an ability to blindfire the torpedo ans set its bearing relative to my own, and thats it! I was parked enemy fleet at bay, with my own eyes on periscope, they were docking ,but out of sight range, not registered! I jus twanted to set course for torpedo and fire away!
@@spooky3669 Didnt say i like shootemup nor this is anything like it, nor do i want it to be like it. Shooting torpedoes just suck, surely i should be able (like i would be in real submarine) to pint my nose and shoot out the torpedo in the direction i am facing! Game doesnt allow you that! You must see a target appear in radar and select it! In my case, i had a visual of 2 enemy ships sitting in enemy bay, but my ''sensors didnt pick them up, they were tooo far, but me as i player, i could CLEARLY see both of them, they werent even far away but my cres sensors didnt pick up on them no matter how hard i was starring at it with periscope, and i had no way of fireing torpeodes. That is what i call unrealistic, not being able to fire torpedoes when you want in a direction you want. Also, the fact that when calculating it doesnt matter where your sub is facing, torpedo just automaticly launches itself in the ''right'' direction...
Your original speed estimate was wrong because the ship was a quite the angle towards you, therefor making the ships length visually smaller, so youd have to eyeball it by stopping time slightly behind the target, this was one of the great challenges of this system, because rarely the captain had the luxury of being at a 90degree angle on target. experience was a big factor here :) amazing video, very thorough, thank you
That’s incorrect, because if the ship is at an angle, it will take longer for the ship to pass, so even things out. The same way the distance is irrelevant for measuring speed
Mathematically the angle of measurement doesn't matter, it's the accuracy of the measurement. As the angle gets smaller the ship looks like it's traveling slower, but the hull also seems shorter so the time from the bow to stern measurement is the same. But the slower the movement the harder it is to exactly determine when the bow or stern passes a point for sure.
@@Lite_lySalted Really?? Alright. But the description at the tool says you have to put the sea level of the ghost image on top of the highest mast on the actual target ship.
I wish they used something like this for Math problems when I was in school... makes it more interesting and I finally understand it completely.
The state of US schools is still very much in a state of pro-girl education. That’s not a bad thing. Especially if you care about girls being educated. But not at the expense of boys. Learning, memorizing, regurgitating information. It’s not usually the most effective way boys will learn things.
My teacher actually told me to memorize it instead of trying to understand it... Yea so i failed math badly
The greatest issue of maths: Really few people is able to teach them with aplications, and to see how you can use it
I appreciate that you did not edit-out the first misses. True transparency and gives players instruction on why their torpedoes missed.
The reason your ship can be pointed any direction when firing your torpedos is that the torpedos have a gyro that turns them in the proper direction based on your targeting inputs. If you point your boat more or less directly at your aim point you will be a little more accurate because you are eliminating one of the variables that could potentially go wrong.
Good video.. sent over by Salted... it's good you left the misses in, good learning for everyone
Thanks and welcome
People have made some comments here about why the first speed calculation for the target failed. It did in fact have to do with the bearing of the target ship in relation to you. Consider this: Pretend that you are dead in the water and are looking due north at a ship that is coming due south directly toward you. In that case, you will NEVER be able to get a speed of the ship as you will never see the stern past the vertical bar of the crosshair. Essentially, the crosshair remains on the bow as the target rams right into you. If you adjust the direction of the target slightly off from due south, you will see the stern, but it could take a VERY long time before it passes your crosshair vertical -- even if the ship is travelling quite fast. However, your calculation will be that the ship is traveling very slowly.
Because of this, the ONLY accurate measurement is to take the measurement when the target is bearing 90 degrees or 270 degrees (at right angles) from your ship. If the target is bearing at any thing other than at right angles, then you have to make some other calculations based on the variance from 90 or 270 degrees -- which would get very complicated. So, whenever lining up for an attack, if you don't know the speed of the target, make sure you take the calculation when at right angles to it. RedDragon1211, in your second attempt, the target was approximately at right angles, which meant that you (somewhat) got the right speed, and sure enough, a torpedo hit. Another thing to keep in mind that if your uboat is moving, then that can affect the calculation as well since the measurement as you click off the stopwatch as the stern passes your vertical crosshair will be taken with the positions of the two ships in relation to each other no longer being at right angles (which is easier to explain with a diagram than here in words). So to ensure the best accuracy, slow down as much as possible for as long as the stopwatch is running and make sure you are as close to right angles as possible.
Or just calculate the speed from map.
The speed can be calculated from the time the ship needed to get from point a to point b on the map.
The proper way to do it would be to first input the course - before measuring speed. Have not tested it myself yet, but logic implies that if you tell the computer target is traveling towards you vs. the 90 degree AOB - the the trigonometry calculated ship distance will be smaller for the needed speed calculation.
Just run stadimeter when you full stop. Most accurate measurement.
@@DBSTH0R the game states that the speed has to be set first, so it has been done correctly.
27:30 that’s not the case though. I mean, it used to be like that in WWI, but the vast majority of WWII torpedoes not only had a gyroscope to maintain their attack heading, but also had additional gyro used to turn the torp towards the enemy from any heading of the submarine. If you add even more gyros, by the way, you can program the torp to do some zigzags like in a tetris snake game, substantially elevating the chance of hitting an enemy in a very large convoy.
I believe only some Soviet submarines had the old some school torpedoes with a single gyro which actually required to turn the entire submarine on to the attach heading, and that was such a gimmick it significantly reduced the efficiency of Soviet crews.
That said, twin-gyro system was not perfect. Some German, English and American torpedoes had severe issues with that additional gyro, as bad as the torp never stopping turning off the tube, making a full circle and smashing into the submarine itself - several submarines actually died due to such malfunctions. Thankfully, detonators also used to fail. Imagine being the luckiest submarine ever with a double torpedo malfunction: the torp made full circle, slammed into the submarine and was supposed to detonate killing everyone on board, but instead the detonator failed, turning the whole thing into the best dud ever :D
Also. The torpedoes missed during the first attack because the torpedo computer adds a correction to your periscope heading. That’s needed to allow really precise shots, like, aiming for an ammo rack of a battleship or boilers of aircraft carrier. In layman terms, you want to keep your periscope roughly where you want your torpedo to hit the enemy ship if you confident in your calculation, or at least at the center, if not so much. That’s how it worked irl, that’s how things were implemented in Silent Hunter, and I am pretty sure that’s how it works here too.
Four years old but still relevant. A very good explanation! Thanks.
When you use the attack periscope, the point you are aiming out is where the torpedo will aim at.
So, when you fired the first one, since you had your aim of, you missed. The second one, you had your aim on the back of the ship and your speed was a little below, so you also missed. Keep your periscope on the center of the ship to have grater chances.
Another thing is that in the game convoys travel at full speed values, 4, 5, 6
So it’s always good to try a couple times if you ar missing a little over o a little below and round the speed accordingly ou put in manually the full value, it make a huge difference specially in low speeds!
Third, the distance is only relevant to calculate the time for impact, so if you get the course and the speed correctly you can put in any distance and it is fine, since you can track torpedo on the map. Since in real life, you can’t track torpedos on the map, they calculated the distance so they could know if they hit or miss by the time for impact
Not EXACTLY true about distance. Distance doesn’t matter only when you’re firing near a zero Gyro angle (that means the torpedo will not turn very much after coming out of your boat) but if you fire at a higher Gyro angle (for example if the target ship was 45° or 60° off the bow of your boat) and the torpedo has to make a turn after firing then distance does matter. So distance does not matter with a zero Gyro angle but it becomes increasingly important as you get closer and closer to a 90° Gyro angle.
@@jameslanz2117 actually no, because the calculations are made in vectors (speed and angles) so the distance does not really matter, only the angles and speeds.
Time is only relevant for “time to impact” calculations but not the “angle of fire” calculation.
Of course at steeper angles (45° for example) you have a narrower window and the shot is more difficult and the inputs have to be more precise, but the distance is not an input
@@MrScarduelli actually I am correct. When you shoot off boresight the torpedo travels a short distance before turning. That negates the “distance doesn’t matter” phenomenon that happens with a zero Gyro angle. Try it in silent hunter 3 or the TDC mod of Uboat. When you’re firing with zero gyro angle range does not matter. When you’re firing 90° gyro angle range matters quite a bit.
@@jameslanz2117 if a higher distance you have a narrower window, and the unaconted effects like weather and sea conditions at magnified.
But on “perfect conditions” the distance do not change the angle of attack. You can put your distance at different values with the same inputs and the angles will be the same.
@@jameslanz2117 the “turn” the torpedo make at different gyro angles make them more unreliable and are worse and longer ranges. That’s why you should fire as close to 0 as possible
Quick tip to calculate the course of the ships, to eliminate human error while doing the vertical line, use the w key to move the map up, this will give you an exact perpendicular line.
Do you mind explainig this in further detail?
Your first (succesfull) speed-gestimate was a computer-error.
You timed the 123,5 meter long ship at 43,5 seconds bow-to-stern, giving it a speed of 5,5 knots.
The game rounded that from 4,5 maybe (as it showed a 4) or if it's an integer then the actual value maybe was 4,99) but was still off by a lot.
When you manually entered '4' for the second ship, you were way off.
Extra tip:
At 20:24 when figuring out the course, the AOB of the target ship is "40-Green".
We see the starboard side so, Green.
And we see that the diagonal crane-booms are almost in line with their crane-masts. These booms are at 45 degrees to the center-line of the ship.
We see them a bit to the left of the crane-mast so not 45 degrees yet -> about 40 degrees.
Knowing your own heading (which the game doesn't give) gives you the target-course.
You are right to say that the bearing tools doesn't work very well. I give it an estimated AOB and it returns a target-course that isn't remotely close to the true course.
So I change the AOB value until the computer generates the right course. Always double-check a computer!
I watched so many tutorials, in english and german. Yours is the best one. Finally I understand how it works. Thank you so much!!! The mistakes of the other tutorials, they tell you to messure the angle of your ship to the target.
Thanks for this good video! It may be useful to know that 1 knot is 1 nautical mile per hour. As long as 1 mile has 10 cables, If you use nautical units you only have to measure distance in 3 minutes and multiply by 20 and you get the speed in knots. Even better and more accurate, you can count 6 min and multiply by 10. In games like SH3, as we had Km instead of miles, we were forced to use the 3'15" rule.
Hi,watched both of you guys about Uboat, big thanks to both of U,helps understand game lots quicker, than frustratingly learning at slow pace.look forward to watching more from both of you guys. 👍👍👍👍👍👍
Thanks. I've only recently started using the manual targeting, with mixed results. Glad to see the experts can miss sometimes!
Great video. Glad others miss too and good to see how to work out what went wrong then change and then hits 👍
For those that didn't stay long enough to see @32:33 and the following few mins, I laughed out loud and made this video epic. Way to get back on that horse Red Dragon and thanks for this very helpful tutorial!
Lite_ly Salted sent me here. Thank you very much to both of you for these videos.
If the way UBoat calculates the values is like the TDC in reality/Silent Hunter range shouldn't really matter for accuracy. It's mainly for estimated time to impact. Speed and angle are very, very important for accuracy due to how all torpedo math is glorious triangles. As others have said the Chronometer is best used at as close to a 90 degree angle as possible. Fantastic video. I especially appreciate the stadimeter visual for its explanation.
you can also add that in case you miss checking the distance of the torpedos every 50 meters you missed add 0.3 nm on boat speed (that if the miss was because of speed and not direction) and your case you missed because you measure the boat speed from the front and that made you count short on time because for you the angle of view was dif. on a convoy that are traveling at night you will not be able to see use that tool)
It's amazing how far the game has come but this is still useful. I could not figure it out
Well done. The best reasoning and explanation of the technique that I've seen. Thank you .
Found this channel thanks to Salted as well... both excellent channels good job mate
Welcome aboard!
Awesome tutorial......sent over by Salted ! Thanks.
Awesome! Thank you!
These are really helpful, thanks very much. Very easy to absorb.
thanks. I hope that soon we have options to make it more difficult and it will be a simulation game like silent hunter 3.
Very good video and method. Just wondering if you thought the map was a bit OP, considering the GPS like accuracy of the ships placement.
Real world captains would get their AoB by observation based on experience, not by map geometry. I try to do it the same way. But to each their own. Not telling anyone how to play, just asking for thoughts on that.
I’m wondering if we might see a bit more hardcore version of the map that’s not so accurate in later versions. A mod for SH5 did something similar.
I need to sit down and type a good response to this but the short answer is that I AGREE!
That was the main reason for missed torpedos in WW2
The difficulty to calculate de AOB. You had to eyeball the angle, and that came with a lot of experience.
That’s why in real life they would go very close and fire a salvo of torpedos in every target, to guarantee a kill.
I think the Course tool is what simulates this aspect ... so it's already implemented in the game.
the angle matters at speed calculation too but i think there is a way to do it on map wich includes setting up a distance and taking the time it takes to the boat to travel it i think it works if you know what kilometer stands for knots i dont know thats why im saying its more reliabble but needs a calculation wich you suprisingly cant do in game right now
Sent by salt cheers I really need this tutorials I love the game but I suck
Most informative TDC tutorial Ive seen so far. Thanks!
Thank you for this, i found your channel today, and its been very helpful...Just bought this game 3 days ago, and have tried free aiming a few different times now, only to find out that im not really doing it right..lol
litely salted sent me here. good tutorial
Welcome!
Fantastic, this is really going to help me - btw, I'm watching this after Lite_ly Salted recommended your channel ;)
Glad it helped!
Thanks for the tutorial, I'm learning alot!
I am so glad you left the failure in as it made me feel better about my failures I'm so glad I'm not alone in my fuckups :> also good tutorial esp the maths and mapwork
When "blow it out of the water" is taken seriously lmao
Thanks very much sr! i will try again now! :D
does the game ask for the course of the target ship or its angle on the bow? Of course, angle on the bow was used historically but both are essentially the same information. If you know your ship's position , you can calculate the angle on the bow from the target ship's course (or direction of travel). Modern computers can calculate that easily but back then, it was far simpler for the TDC to calculate a solution using the AOB.
The AOB question is a common one. I have messed with the method however, as someone who is an outdoorsman and uses maps and compasses regularly, it made more sense to use the top down map and the tools to find bearing and course. I plan to grab the TDC mod and mess around with it. I will keep everyone updated.
Hey just got the game. When you got the speed the first time you were not looking at the locked ship.
21:47 how do you get the grids? on your map mine only show when i zoom out really far
Hello! Unfortunately they got rid of the Lat/Log lines with the big map update in 1.27 or 1.29. BIG monkey wrench in the way I do my target finding. I use the zoomed out ones to draw in one or two of my own near the target area. Its more work but, its the best we can do for now.
to measure the speed, the ships have to be perpendicular. Otherwise you are not measuring the true length of the ship due to angles measuring shorter lengths.
For the ship speed it felt like you were waiting too long with the stopwatch, clicking on the corner of the stern rather than the centre-back of the stern(which is slightly hidden from view by the angle and corner). Then again I could be wrong because the sterns are rounded, perspectives at that distance can be odd.
Good video thanks for posting even though you missed the first shots! Most people would just make a new one. Was wondering about taking the speed calculation and if the angle you are looking at the target makes a difference. Your first speed measurement the targets were coming towards you at an angle but the second one you were more at a 90 degree angle and I think you got a more accurate speed estimate. Would that make a difference?
It absolutely dose. My faith in the tools “in the moment” made me forget to consider that the measurement would be incorrect if not taken at 90deg. I was thinking more about what I was doing/saying not how I was doing it. Several people have pointed that out in the comments since. I usually measure the distance a target travels in a given time and hen work the math out to find speed.
Hey, Red. Good video. Salted sent me.
Hi, started watching Salted vids, amazing and he recommended popping into yours for these very videos. So, hi from Salted Thanks for your, vids :) bothhelping no end...PS please say hi to Taff, watched his B-17 vids when he first put them out haha.
Great video. In real life could they get the periscope to lock onto ships? If yes how did this work?
Well done.
Sorry I know its 2 years later but I just found the channel. I am wondering how you would manually calculate ship distance without the computer? It looks like you are using the Pythagorean theorem and that the ships mast is filling a, how do you calculate what c or b is?
20:04 That's exactly why I'm here :D because I wanted to learn how to do it without the map to add realism.
The shame is, that there is no explanation from the game itself (nor on any wiki or fan page) to explain what one has to do. After a few comparisons between the map technique and this in-game tool, I think I understood the reason why it never worked for me.
If you manually position the tool so that it looks exactly how the ship looks to you, then you have kind of the first part done, but it isn't the correct angle, yet.
The second part is to add or subtract the angle your ship is in comparison to the north and then position the tool to the angle you calculated.
You see, the tool is actually a depiction of the uboat and what one needs to set up is the angle the target ship has in comparison to the uboat.
But if this is how it should be done? no idea. And sorry if it sounds confusing, english is not my default language :D
I have watched a few people do it and i think i know how to do it but, i have been playing this way for so long i dont know that i could go back lol.
How did you raise the periscope....mine literally has waves against it or underwater and I clicked on the up arrow also
If you look at the ship at an angle of 90 degrees, the lenght in the documents is correct.
If they are at 056 and your not at 90 degrees to them, your speed measuring is not correct as the ship will become "shorter" in your optic and you miscalculate.
You have to calculate the lenght of the ships in your optic before taking their time / Speed.
How is that done?
Had me watching for a half hour to F#cking miss. LOL Pure gold. You get a subscribe my friend.
I NEVER claimed to be perfect. 😂
DOPE! Looking forward to it! Also, not that I'm looking for any sort of reward or recognition, but I was your 100th subscriber! WOOP WOOP!
Thank You!
Batteries are depleting very fastly, I didn't turn on anything except gyro and ventilation with electric engines on forward 1. And also crew are all sleeping at the same time.
My TDC is pretty accurate but I always find trying to figure out the ships heading a pain in the ass. The distance is easy and speed is too but I can’t seem to get the heading accurate enough and when I do the only T2 Torpedo I send it’s a dud
Do distance first then speed perhaps?
Thank you for this video, its helped heaps.. Now time for me to go sink some ships :-)
Have fun!
I used to hit 25 % of my torpedo calculations. After this tutorial I hit 0.25 %. I am joking wolves.
One thing I really can't get to understand is how it can figure speed with the chronometer if the ship is at a hard angle or coming right at you. Do you have to be at 90ﾟ to get an accurate speed or will it work at any relative angle to the other ship?
34:17 what about the course.. first timing course was not set so shouldent the ship be "shorter", second timing course is set so it caluculate lenght right
thanks dude btw new version is hella lit
also i subbed
Screw my math teacher Mrs. Easter that old bat. If only this was the math taught maybe I'd have given a damn on the subject or seen how cool it is. Thanks for this video.
You do not need to use the angle to measure the distance, just use the map ruler.
Uboat doesn't have those grids for accurate coordinates anymore in the new updates :(
good job
Measure twice shoot once! Good tutorial though!
How would you measure the velocity of a ship, without putting its relative course into the equasion.
You see, this time measuring method seems only to work most accurately, when the target passes you at a 90 degree angle.
If you want to watch what his title promises you "Manual Targeting" ? then fast-forward to 11:25 minutes into the video.
Apply this to a geometry class instead of just practice exercises that mean nothing and you'd have geometry whizzes. (At least those that are military nerds like me.) Haven't played since the Siemens target computer update that I'm a little intimidated by. Do you have a video on this? I don't like the changes they've made with map tools (like no grids) because I became very adept at it.
Good job explaining targetting w/ the map - love doing the manual targetting (old SH player :) ). shame the AOB tool is virtually unusable.
Sent by my boy Salty 👀
ayyyyy
Very Helpful Thanks.xx
Thanks alot man
Nice video, helped a lot.
As of some recent update, the grid on the map is completely non existent unless you are incredibly zoomed out. Is there any way to complete these computations without the grid?
i have been extending the lines out to the patrol sector boarders. not sure why they got rid of the grid lines but its frustrating.
A great idea
i hope you gonna stream once 129b is out
I plan to. Stay tuned...
I cannot get teh grid marks your getting because the game updated what do i do?
how do you pull up all the officers on the screen at one time with the drop down task menus like you did right after rigging for red lighting?
The tab key will bring up the officer management screen.
Hi, Lite_ly Salted send me. :) Vertical structures I would call king post. Good to know that I do not need to face the targets to fire torpedoes :D Is there any advantage to set different torp speed/depth?
In reality yes, changing the depth and speed of a Torpedo can have significant advantages. a faster torpedo is harder to dodge and the lower below the water line you can damage the ship the better. However, it seems that these settings are not fully fleshed out in the game. i know for sure that changing the depth at all can sen the torpedo way too deep and miss the target. I will have to play around with the settings and let you know.
@@RedDragon_1211 I found that bug when torpedo go way too deep. So for now I will not change depth until fixed. And it is so funny to lunch all 5 torps not facing target :) BTW I notice that when I connect two market points on the map by ruler it not only show distance but also bearing. Keep up the good content.
@@dusankollar602 I sort of hope they add an option for the hardcore players that limits the firing angle for the Torpedo tubes. It would require A LOT more planning before firing but, it would provide an interesting challenge.
Wait..... I just read the second half of your comment. your ruler shows the bearing!? where!?
@@RedDragon_1211 It is not normal, maybe it is done by mod? Only mods I think can alter this that I use is "compass navigation" and "authentic maps" Posted picture here: discord.com/channels/326159516595126274/575028511929139257/722727471442690052
Are there any games like this that let you play as the battleship, or destroyer, and let you sink subs with depth charges?
Destroyer: The U-boat Hunter is still in development but there's a demo.
Thanks.
for some reason i don’t have the same grids on the map that you do. is that a setting that i can change?
Unfortunately no. These videos were made back in patch 126. They updated the map in 128. It is mildly frustrating but you can use the patrol sector lines they should line up north south and east west.
@@RedDragon_1211 mildly frustrating is an understatement. Why the HELL they removed the grid lines is a mystery to me. Unfortunately, the only two map mods out there don't have grid lines either.
do you still stream play on mondays and wednesdays?
I have had to change my schedule around. Mostly Fridays-Sundays at the moment.
@@RedDragon_1211 👌
funny video, thanks from croatia
I think your initial speed calculation was off because it didn't take into account the angle between the ship and the periscope, basically it appeared shorter because of the angle.
Mathematically the angle of measurement doesn't matter, it's the accuracy of the measurement. As the angle gets smaller the ship looks like it's traveling slower, but the hull also seems shorter so the time from the bow to stern measurement is the same. But the slower the movement the harder it is to exactly determine when the bow or stern passes a point for sure.
how do you get grid lines so compact mine are wide apart ?
This video was from build 126. Recent patches have changed the map so there are no lat long lines. Planning to make an updated vid once my work schedule allows.
OK will wait for the next one
Can anyone tell me if this is better than SH 5
With that being said ...
I cant get my torpedos to shoot right.. I liked silent hunter lock on better a 0 degree meand shot wher your boat is not a 130 degree and goes behind... this shoting is crazy screwed up....
Its not about what you like, Silent Hunter is Not UBOAT!
UBOAT is not a shoot up game it's a simulation, therefor you need to learn and use the TDC MOD.
The actual targeting computer used on those UBoat's in WWII.
ua-cam.com/video/vhVal-4LrLQ/v-deo.html
That missed sucked but informative video. Thanks for sharing.
Luck the sea is never this calm for me :(
I'm assuming the game treats 0 degrees the same as 360?
Yes sir!
@@RedDragon_1211 Could you clarify one thing for me please? You stated on the map 'North' is always 0 degrees. I understand if my bearing is true 0, then target bearing is let's say clockwise to perfect East is 90 degrees. No adding correct? Now say my bearing is perfect 'South'-is this 180 degrees according to the map or is it relative to what my uboat is as I've read elsewhere '0' degrees is always where your ship is pointing. In latter example let's say target bearing is heading West to my South bearing. Would this be 90 degrees relative to me or would it be 270 degrees? Sorry, I suck at math almost to the point of being dyslexic with numbers....I can read like a mofo but that does me little good here lol.
Ok this is a tricky thing to explain but I will do my best. There are four terms that get used in tandem with each other that mean ALMOST the same thing but are not. Heading, Course, Bearing, and Relative Bearing.
The heading is the direction a ship/aircraft is pointed.
The course is the direction a ship/aircraft is moving.
Bearing (also known as Compass Bearing) refers to a targets position on a map or compass to you. (if the target is north of you it is bearing 0 deg.)
Relative Bearing is a targets bearing to you, RELATIVE to your ship (bow is 0, the stern is 180 ect). Using the example above. if you are traveling west and a target is North of you. its Compass Bearing is 0 but its Relative Bearing to your ship is 90 (to you right/starboard)
I would google a diagram for more clarity. This would not be a bad video to do eventually. I hope those distinctions helped.
@@RedDragon_1211 I understand the deal after playing for several days non-stop. A couple of times I was heading at a South-East direction and figured out that between 90 and 180 is 135 degrees and it matched on map tools with my periscope compass tool. I ALWAYS double check my sometimes zany math skills with the periscope compass tool and recheck. Angle on bow I understand is the position of your boat relative to if YOU were looking from the target at your uboat.
:| so course is still using the map tools and not periscope
You missed so do I
Like de nº 979 Brazil , São Paulo
i hate this... i want an ability to blindfire the torpedo ans set its bearing relative to my own, and thats it! I was parked enemy fleet at bay, with my own eyes on periscope, they were docking ,but out of sight range, not registered! I jus twanted to set course for torpedo and fire away!
You are in the wrong game category, this is a Simulator Not a Shoot Up game!
@@spooky3669 Didnt say i like shootemup nor this is anything like it, nor do i want it to be like it. Shooting torpedoes just suck, surely i should be able (like i would be in real submarine) to pint my nose and shoot out the torpedo in the direction i am facing! Game doesnt allow you that! You must see a target appear in radar and select it! In my case, i had a visual of 2 enemy ships sitting in enemy bay, but my ''sensors didnt pick them up, they were tooo far, but me as i player, i could CLEARLY see both of them, they werent even far away but my cres sensors didnt pick up on them no matter how hard i was starring at it with periscope, and i had no way of fireing torpeodes. That is what i call unrealistic, not being able to fire torpedoes when you want in a direction you want. Also, the fact that when calculating it doesnt matter where your sub is facing, torpedo just automaticly launches itself in the ''right'' direction...
Your original speed estimate was wrong because the ship was a quite the angle towards you, therefor making the ships length visually smaller, so youd have to eyeball it by stopping time slightly behind the target, this was one of the great challenges of this system, because rarely the captain had the luxury of being at a 90degree angle on target. experience was a big factor here :)
amazing video, very thorough, thank you
That’s incorrect, because if the ship is at an angle, it will take longer for the ship to pass, so even things out.
The same way the distance is irrelevant for measuring speed
The problem is the rounding of numbers, the enemy’s always travel in full values, 4 or 5. The rounding messes up a lot
Mathematically the angle of measurement doesn't matter, it's the accuracy of the measurement. As the angle gets smaller the ship looks like it's traveling slower, but the hull also seems shorter so the time from the bow to stern measurement is the same. But the slower the movement the harder it is to exactly determine when the bow or stern passes a point for sure.
@@MrScarduelli i see, i stand corrected them apologies to Taff :)
@@knirkegaming5395 I am just a math nerd hahahaha =D
@23:00
You need to set the ghost image above the actual ship. Not below it.
Makes literally no difference at all.
@@Lite_lySalted Really?? Alright. But the description at the tool says you have to put the sea level of the ghost image on top of the highest mast on the actual target ship.
@@Focusonbehind It's always worked for me
@@Lite_lySalted Thanks for the tip. I'm going to try this too. See how it works.
I wish youtube didnt hide the dislikes. It would`ve saved me from watching this "tutorial"
Then you would have missed out on some good information.