6 Myths about Heaven and Thoughts on Near Death Experiences|With Dr. Clay Jones
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- Опубліковано 6 вер 2024
- What will heaven be like? Will we recognize anyone? If everything is perfect, what will we actually DO there? Then there's NDE's. What's up with those? I discussed these questions and more with scholar Clay Jones.
Clay Jones is a Visiting Scholar for the MA in Christian Apologetics program at Talbot Seminary and the chairman of the board of Ratio Christi. He holds a Doctor of Ministry from Trinity Evangelical Divinity School.
Timestamps:
00:52- Myth 1: Heaven Is Lonely-We Won’t Recognize Anyone
05:06- Myth 2: Heaven Is Hurtful-Too Many Painful Memories
11:00- Myth 3: Heaven Is Dreary-Full of Nerds and Prudes
13:20- Myth 4: Heaven Is Drab-Everything Is White
16:14- Myth 5: Heaven Is Less-No Taste, Touch, or Smell
21:35- Myth 6: Heaven Is Tedious-All We Will Do Is Sing
29:43- What is your position on NDE's/Near Death Experiences?
36:01- Are any NDE's actually authentic?
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When they were talking about possibly being able to speak with animals in Heaven, it reminds me of all of the profoundly disabled people who have no ability to speak. Our youngest son, who is 15 years old now, has never spoken a word, nor does he sign. He can use an augmented communication tablet to make his _needs_ known, but we've never been able to actually have a conversation with him. We talk to him as we would any of our other children, and I think he understands more than we know, but we have little idea of what's _really_ going on in his head. If we'll be able to speak with _animals_ in Heaven, to actually have a conversation with our youngest son, our "baby", will be a TRUE blessing! 😊
"There will be no more night there." And no more disability either.
Exactly! All those who suffer from various disabilities and disease will all be healed, restored, and have their glorified bodies, like that of Jesus, at the Rapture of the church. The rejoicing will last an eternity!
Yes, it will happen there ♥️
The question about pets in heaven: believer people ask this a lot. I would say God is about to blow people's minds. Why wouldn't a loving God send our lovable beasts in to eternity? He knows us and sympathizes with us. The new millennium in scripture already speaks about lions and lambs and vipers. Why not our pets?
we can communicate wth Animals with out Dyeing With or Without the Body Oviously its all done with ur Mind Threw Others confirming Visions threw each other exspecialy threw Strangers its easyer to pratice on doing with not everyones readable its like a spirutal wifi its how eye encountered JESUS him self and the 4 faced cherubim Beings eye never knew exsisted eye have Evidence of it on here all done always for FREE DUH
Preach the gospel to him.
My grandmother, a missionary in West Africa for most of my childhood, battled malaria and at one point was pronounced dead at a hospital in Abidjan for half an hour. Then she woke up. If you ask her about it, she will tell you she was surrounded by light and heard angels singing the most indescribable music. BUT, she doesn't like to talk about it. It's almost like the transfiguration, where Jesus told his disciples NOT to tell anyone what they saw.
Grandma has the most vibrant, passionate testimony for Jesus I've ever heard, but her near death experience is _never_ part of it, not even with us family unless we specifically ask. As a consequence, I'm highly skeptical of anyone who wants to talk about their NDE or use it as a ministry platform, even though I'm completely convinced they are real.
I don't think that's a universal truth to not talk about an NDE, sometimes God uses that experience to provide testimony to others and many have waited many yrs for the right time to come out and share it. God will lead the way.
But, they told us what they saw. I think He told them not to tell anyone what they HEARD.
The apostle Paul even said that it wasn't lawful for him to speak about what he had seen. There are a lot of people who are lying. If you test the spirit behind it you can usually tell when it is a lie. That's what the indwelling of the Holy Spirit is for.
There's also gold tones in heaven.
She spoke you carry it on
Thanks for this video. I feel one of the dangers of some cults is that they base their theology on "personal experiences" without testing spirits, etc. The discerning constant is always what does the Bible say. Not companion books, but the actual Bible.
what is "testing spirits"
and do you do that during the day to avoid being bored?
Amen!🎉
I was hit by a car going 45MPH while riding my skateboard it broke my body in ways you never recover from and my head trauma caused me to bleed out. The loss of blood is the only way the doctors could explain why I survived because it relieved the pressure on my brain. I had no vitals when the paramedics arrived and after being jumped started once had to be revived again on the way to the emergency room. The NDE experience for me was the absence of any worldly existence at all and I was at peace like the most peaceful sleep I could imagine floating in a starless space that words cannot explain. The Bible describes death as being asleep more than 50 times and I agree but it was unlike any sleep I have ever experienced while alive and I think I have been a little angry that the paramedics and doctors brought me back.
You should look into the Greek translation of "sleep" it might be helpful to describe what the bible meant by 'sleep'.
Maybe the LORD brought you back because He has a work for you to do. God bless you 🙏.
They say it takes about 7 years to integrate an NDE and I'm sure the grief of being back in your body is real.
Melissa, this is a touchy subject for parents who have lost a child. My 17yo died from a horrific car crash involving alcohol and drugs in 1997. Although thank God my dear friend from years ago called to remind me that one day took my son and her son to her church and reminded me that my son and her son (both 11yo at the time went forward to repent and give their lives to Jesus Christ. I was a mess just knowing my 17yo son had died and left worrying about my son's salvation until I received her call. My other son who did repent and give his life to Jesus died in 2019 from an overdose of heroin. So it's so hard for parents who lost their child to death and trying to live with the fear about if they're in heaven or not. Thanks Melissa for this subject because parents who lose their child or more is hell on earth if they're not sure ✝️🙏❤️
Agree. I'm about to listen to this but wanted to read comments first to know if it would be good for me. My 24 year old daughter passed last December and in the Lutheran tradition she was raised in, had been baptized and confirmed. She believed but was mostly a prodigal at 24. Counselor and God's amazing signs He has blessed me with so many times, plus multiple Christian NDE books and videos give me much hope she is in His glory and we will be reunited.
Please understand that in the Bible the closest thing that can be called the age of accountability is 20 years old. What?!!? When the Israelites were doomed to wandering in the desert for not trusting God for 40 years those 20 years old and younger were not condemned to die. There are no children _or_ teenagers in Hell. Hell is an adult situation not an immature one.
@@MountainFisher I always wondered about that as well, thanks for confirming that 😉✝️🙏
@@joansmith5947 ✝️🙏 First of all I'm so sorry you lost your daughter so recently, yes I know your pain and agony well. When my 2 sons died they were living prodigal lives, nonetheless my 17yo son Anthony who died in 97 repented, gave his life to Jesus at 12 . My other son Marcus died in 2019 he had repented and gave his life to Jesus when he was 9. He shared the gospel of Jesus with people on line every morning before work up until he died. He's won alot over for Jesus. I'm not familiar with your (traditions or confirmations). I've no idea what "NDE" is but I'm sure our kids are with Jesus right now ✝️🙏
People have such pedestrian concerns about Heaven. Do I think my dad Ken will recognize me? Sure, but I imagine he's glorifying God and exploring the universe God created to such a degree that it matters little to him. And for that, I am truly happy for my dad Ken.
For Christians to be worried about restoring Earthly social clubs seems pedantic and self-absorbed.
Would it be pedantic of me to comment, "nice use of the word, pedantic"?😄
I don't remember thinking very little of anything else being Adam and Eve's experience in the garden. 🤔
God’s greatest gift outside of Jesus is our loved ones. I think it’s totally normal to have these questions and concerns. ❤🙏🏻
@@kristencobb230If, in fact these are God's greatest gifts, why would anyone think He might take them away? Additionally, many loved ones will not be saved, so I have to assume God has greater things in store for us. It seems to me that getting caught up with such concerns requires a HUGE misunderstanding of God's character and an overly developed attachment to the things of this world. I''m not judging. These are just some thoughts.
I have seen a man come back from the dead. He was intubated and couldn't talk, but as we rushed him to ICU he was fully alert, kept grabbing our arms, each in turn, and desperately mouthing the words "I love you". He never got off the vent, as he took a turn for the worse and passed.
Having said that, I disbelieve every highly publicised experience of NDE. There is always something that is scripturally questionable about those experiences.
This. All of this
***comments*** WRT
I have seen a man come back from the dead.
***how do you know he was dead then***
He was intubated and couldn't talk,
***being intubated, does not make him dead. nor if he were DECLARED DEAD would he have been intubated. Your version of the story has some problems with material consistency. As do
a lot of the vague ones found in your favorite book in case you did not notice that
***
but as we rushed him to ICU he was fully alert,
***he was evidently at least partly CONSCIOUS but the rest you claim, has problems with supporting evidence***
kept grabbing our arms, each in turn,
***someone drowning will do that too. it does not prove your other claims
***
and desperately mouthing the words "I love you".
***if he NEVER RETURNED TO FULL CONSCIOUSNESS, you DO NOT KNOW what he was trying to say, nor to whom***
He never got off the vent, as he took a turn for the worse and passed.
***well THAT statement is VAGUE. Why were you apparenlty PRESENT during that entire period if he was under ER triage?***
Having said that, I disbelieve every highly publicised experience of NDE.
***your dis-belief has nothing to do with whether people have those experiences. I have examined THOUSANDS of them and I have not examined YOU
***
There is always something that is scripturally questionable about those experiences.
***and now we have reason to think that there is also "something" questionable about your version of deductive logic.
None of which negates whatever service you might have rendered to people despite your tendency to judge them.
You still get credit for doing it, even if your motives might have been somewhat less than entirely sincere.
***
White is not boring. Put white light through a prism and you get the most beautiful rainbows.
I heard a local politician argue for abortion on the grounds that we are simply sending a baby to heaven. That sort of "understanding" is ultimately destructive. Period.
That politician's reasoning is similar to the reasoning terrorists use to justify using their children as human shields. According to the Bible, it's God's prerogative to decide when someone goes to heaven, not man's.
Wow that’s insane. Sending babies to heaven and the moms to hell?
It's true, but still evil, therefore not justifiable.
Might be "sending a baby to heaven", but it's ALSO sending those who MURDER it to HELL, 'cause it's written CLEARLY in Revelation 21:8;
[8] "But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the 'MURDERERS', the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars-they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”
So, ANYONE who believes that they're doing these unborn babies a 'SERVICE' by aborting them to send them back to heaven, they're doing Satan's work by "MURDERING" as it is written in
Revelation 21:8.
@@mbb--: Yes, HOWEVER God DOES give law enforcement the authority to end someone's life when someone is out of hand, 'cause it's ALSO written in
Romans 13:1-5;
[1] "Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. [2] Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. [3] For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. [4] For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. [5] Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience."
"They do not bear the sword for nothing." Swords are for taking lives, not spanking, or pointing at people. Today law enforcement carry guns and they're used for the same purpose. When some people witness a cop shooting somebody dead, they get all bent out of shape and start hating on the cops, but they don't understand that cops work for God to keep order. Does that mean they all get it right all of the time? No, BUT THAT'S between that cop and God, NOT between the bystanders, 'cause THEY'RE far from perfect as well and do things that are just as bad as COMMITTING murder, yet THEY don't see it that way, even though God DOES. Basically, these people have no right to judge the cops who make mistakes in the heat of the moment and misjudge and shoot someone dead. Jesus said;
[1] “Do not judge, or you too will be judged. [2] For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you."
(Matthew 7:1-2)
I have had a NDE years ago it is for real it convinced me of the spiritual world and the truth of the bible
What did you experience?
I'm 62 and ive never fantasised about killing anyone, it's not because of consequences it's because I know it would hurt me spiritually I wouldn't be able to handle it, I once killed a cat when I was 12 and I've hated myself ever since,it hurts me to even think about it.
🙏🙏🙏
I'm sorry you still feel that pain. I was scratched by one of the kittens of my grandmother's cat. I put the kitten outside where our dog was, and the dog killed it. I've felt the guilt of it ever since, and I'm nearly 54 (I was 11 when it happened). God forgives us even if we don't forgive ourselves.
@@setyourmindfreenow thank you for your concern, both you and I,continue to carry the guilt and pain for being responsible for the life of an innocent animal, we both understand the pain thank the Lord for giving us respite.
Amen.🙏
exactly. I had to kill a suffering mouse, and it crippled me for days. lol Mankind does have natural empathy, despite what biblical scholars say.
@@emo516 it’s not that we’re absent of empathy, it is that we are prone to wrath as well. Murder in our hearts isn’t about fantasies of killing others, it is hatred that is equated to murder according to Jesus.
@@melindamercier6811 ok? and according to many others. Jesus was not the only wise man to ever walk the face of earth, and not all born again Christians are going to live a life of purity. Anyone is capable of wrath. Its a conscious choice to live without desire, and that was actually more of a Buddhist concept than a Jesus one, but the whole idea of controlling one's thoughts, mind and actions really stems from middle east.
I'm ready for a totally new mind and spirit. I don't care whether we know each other and I don't know why anyone would. I think we don't give credit to God's ability to give us a totally new existence that doesn't need any connection to life on this earth.
If God is telling us in scripture, that we will know each other, then His will be done. But, if not, I trust that God knows what it takes to equal eternal rapture.
👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
I was taught in school we'll recognize those who were saved in heaven but completely forget those who were not as if they never existed because there is no grief in heaven. For a long time, that thought made me so sad I didn't want to go to heaven then I remember our God is a just God.
Why would heaven be less magnificent than earth? When you think of the incredibly beautiful places on earth you know that heaven will be even more amazing.
Melissa, I am very glad that you are talking about this NDE subject. As a former EMT I have questions about this.
I bet you’ve seen some things as an EMT
As a nurse/social worker I've seen things unexplained.
@@susanfanning9480like what?
I have heard that some deaths are so horrendous (they literally see demons coming to get them) that that's why the practice of "making it easier" and "managing death" through nurses using morphine and midazolam has increased enormously in recent years.
I can understand up to a point but it's important for people to KNOW.
Atheists gathered round the death bed of a relative may be traumatized if they experienced that but it might wake them up into taking life seriously and searching for truth (i.e God).
Sometimes it takes something hard to wake people up who are drifting through life. It's a blessing in disguise.
Pumping someone full of drugs is interfering with nature i.e with God.
@@leenieledejo6849Many of those dying are in extreme pain. Denying them drugs so they can "experience death" is cruel. Case by case basis. God will be there either way.
These myths were my assumptions about Heaven for years. It would be a dreary place full of side hugs and loneliness, but it would be OK because I would be made happy by the presence of Jesus. Almost like I'd be in a box with happy feelings pumped into me. And, I didn't think too much about it until I went through a darker period of my life when I was feeling REALLY lost and finding no hope in the idea of Heaven. God put it on my heart to really read through the scriptures and understand the fullness of His promises and it was incredible. We as Christians are called to know these truths because they DO brace us and give us courage. I meet so many people now with what I call the "morphine drip" idea of Heaven and it's so important to counter this. Yet, I see SO MANY people online trying to one-up each other about what won't be in Heaven (I saw one guy say we wouldn't laugh...), and how they're ok with it to be in the presence of Jesus. That's not Biblical. Love this video, and it's a more important topic than many might realize.
My church has had the privilege of having Clay as guest pastor. He always leaves me thinking. I highly recommend his books and am thrilled Melissa had him on her channel (and Jeannie too)
I gave a like when he said that when we actually know that our loved ones rejected the King of the Kings we won't want to be with them. I highly agree. People are too enmeshed with their families, that doesn't mean we don't love them, but it was great to bring up that passage about Jesus saying "who is my mother my brother and sister? Those that do the will of my Father" we have a new family in Christ.
The talking animals is a cool theory, because I always wondered why Eve wasn't freaking out that the snake was talking.
This topic throws be back into a memory loop haha.
When we were children one of my sisters and I would take all the white and red ornaments off of the Christmas tree and arrange them on blankets to be “heaven” and “hell”. We would always make it so that the red ornaments were hell and we would arrange them in such a way that they looked extra appealing and exciting and royal looking on the edges (to us as children haha), but on the inside of that border we only had the oldest most ragged blanket, and with the white ones we would sort of tuck them behind little mounds of blankets so that our stuffed animals who were “deciding” where they wanted to go couldn’t tell they were there, but once they “got into heaven” they would keep being surprised and amazed by the beautiful treasures there, while the ones who went to “hell” were very angry by how deceptive the outside was haha.
Anyway, like you said at the beginning, Satan’s whole motive is to make all things pertaining to God, including heaven, look undesirable and to make his ways look like the better option.
John Burk's book, 'Imagine Heaven', about NDE experiences of heaven...and hell is about people's experiences that line up with scripture. He's a pastor who started and leads Gateway Church in Austin.
Bottom line: Scripture is truth. Experience… not necessarily.
Clay reminds me of a clean version of Norm Macdonald, especially when he smiles, but in the way he debunks the myths, like Norm would expose media lies. The two of you are super!!!
Melissa, if you can you should interview John Burke and J.P. Moreland on this topic, cause they talk about the different experiences that people have had in their NDEs. They also talk about how the studies on NDEs shows that people who have these experiences see the same things, but they interpret them differently.
Because they are seeing the same things, this would rule out chemical or hallucinations, or anything similar to that because those don’t give multiple people the same sights, scenes, etc.
It’s a subject that has a lot of assumptions to it, and it’s often either too much attention or too little. I’ve studied it quite a bit though, and am still studying it, so if you or anyone has any questions or wants resources please do ask. God Bless! :)
I love this book. I feel John Burke researched it well.
Just came across this. Thank you.God bless you. May everyone in this comment section also be blessed. May our lord forever guide us.
My mom had an NDE. He was young in a car and they had a very bad accident I think she might’ve been the only survivor. The doctors told her she would never walk, she would never have children. It took her 2 years to recover, had scars on her arms and legs. Then she married my dad and had six children! We watched the TV show and people were talking about their outer body experiences and she said that happened to me and she was not afraid to die when it came to that time many years later
I read some research about it somewhere. They said, that though the brain waves may have stopped, the brain itself releases a highly impactful cocktail of chemicals in these situations that may put you in a state of highly emotional perceptiveness, clearness and visualization. And as in a dream, you never really know what kind of experience it will be. But likely you will see things that your brain somewhat relates too. That may be the reason why Hindus see Krishna and Universalists get the message that everybody gets absorbed into heaven and People who feel guilty experience hell and so on. Maybe it is only a not fully understood natural experience with a natural cause. Maybe even including forms of perception (like the shue) that is impossible in a normal state of the brain. So no reason to make up a theology based on it. Like all wordly experiences entangled with strong emotions, it can lead us astray from the truth. Rely on scripture rather than on ever changing emotions.
Eben Alexander
@@robinmurphy8705 ?
How can you experience emotion if your nerves aren't firing anymore? Some people have actually seen their loved ones in a separate room away from themselves and known exactly what they were saying and doing. A body that isn't getting oxygen could not be able to comprehend something outside of the room.
@@inchristalone25 check Eben Alexander's experience. He is a highly respected neurosurgeon.
@@robinmurphy8705 Hmm seems like he didn't fully die? There are real fully dead NDE's where they actually met Jesus. Not that a still alive NDE isn't relevant, it is, but unless they meet Jesus they don't become a Christian. Anita Moorjani is another who was in a coma , met her loved ones and came back and healed in 2 weeks of end stage cancer, but she didn't become a christian she just preaches heaven is actually real it's just about love. Yeah God is love, but the only way TO God is through our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
I have very recently been watching near death experiences and I have been soo confused about them. Because some of them seem to contridict what I've always believed in which is God and heaven. All the most recent ones talked about a bright light and becoming one with the light but never say anything about believing in God before or after the experience. And the one who did talk about aomething that sounded like they were in heaven, to me sounded like everyone goes to this heaven no matter what. Which goes against EVERYTHING i ever learned and believed. And I wonder could ALL these people be lying? What if there not lying? It's actually really been bothering me and I was just dwelling on it this morning and talking about it to God and then I came across your video! Which is amazing. I think God showed me your video to reassure me that HE is real and heaven is real and maybe that's all I need to think about ❤
@@fml5910 yeah, i think that maybe those people really believe they are seeing this but its not a vision from God its a vision from the devil trying to confuse us even more bcoz ya know thats what he does. I obviously dont know for sure but its just a thought..Ive always figured if someone is telling a nde and it doesn't line up with Gods word then we shouldnt pay attention to it. You should listen to mary k baxters story, you can look her up here. She went to heaven and hell and her story lines up with scripture. Thats one experience i believe. And its a really cool/amazing story
Concerning the early question about knowing others in heaven & feeling bad that others are not in heaven: When in heaven your body will be perfect. That is you will want for nothing, need nothing, and understand all that you need to know. Under those circumstances I will not morn for the people that are not in heaven, it will be understood that they are where they want to be ... away from God. My own joy of being in heaven will not be decreased by such thoughts.
I don’t even think we will remember anyone who is not in heaven
@@Farmhouselivingroomwe will, they just won't "be called to mind for the former things have passed", this doesn't mean not remembering, it means not remembering with an emotional impact tied to it, it'll just be a memory that has no affect on your happiness then.
Good point! A lot of things are going to change in a sinless body and all tears are wiped away!
Actually, the Bible says there will be silence in heaven for half an hour for those who were not saved.
When it comes to NDE stories I definitely take them with a grain of salt. At the end of a day it's still someone's personal experience and thay means those can be deceptive. You cannot take them as truth just because it's an NDE or alleged NDE.
That was amazing! Dr Jones has the most useful response I've come across so far, when it comes to NDE's. Thanks for having him on, Melissa
I enjoyed his good sense of humor. But like many who enjoy their own, insensitivity can pop up. I think Melissa did a great job steering him away from when he was about to cross that line during this one and it was comforting to see bc I don't think he even realized his direction was about to error.
Very informative interview. I'm l9oking forward to no longer seeing through a glass dimly and be8ng able to see the beauty of the color spectrum of heaven, but mostly to see Christ whose beauty will outshine it all.
All the things that heaven could conceivably be like, megga trippy! The trouble I have with the premise is that Scripture says we will be on earth for a thousand years.❤ We will be busy!! Rev 20:6
Rev 5:10🙏Matthew 19:28
I read and reviewed a book called "Imaginne Heaven". It's written by John Burke. He did some research and confirmed a lot of what your guest said. He also gave some warnings, too. According too the people who John interviewed, Heaven is not boring.
Everyone needs to read Randy Alcorn’s book, Heaven. It’s a biblical look at our eternal destination and it’s amazing.
Great show today. I appreciate how well you both shared, it’s fun to talk about eternity. Chatting with the animals and family 🙏🏼🕊️😽💕
Sure it’s fun, but you’d have to really, really ask yourself, do you really have good reason to think heaven/hell is real other than “for the Bible tells me so.”?
It’s ironically really about self interest in not accepting one’s mortality. I’d love anyone to actually give any compelling reason to hold life after life with any scrap of actual fact that isn’t just complete conjecture.
You mean, we'll get to drink the best wines, not get drunk, hence no hangover!? Sign me up! Heaven is going to be beyond ALL comprehension. He gives us glimpses in the Bible, but we still can't even imagine big enough! Praise be to and Hail King Jesus! Loving your content built around TRUTH, Melissa! Thank you and God bless/protect you always 🙏
God must be working through you I've been watching several of these NDE videos lately. I'm not a fool who takes these things to be 100% true but I do find them interesting.
Ty for talking about this. Most teachers/pastors avoid this question.
Thanks Melissa, you always address the relevant topics... NDE's where a mind bender for me for a while.
You are both such a blessing to me today. What a wonderful topic! You said what I've been thinking which is that NDEs are personal dream experiences and are not necessarily to be viewed the same way as confirmed visions from God. Very intriguing angle to look at heaven from. And in Revelation there are so many descriptions about heaven being colorful.
As an art lover and former painter and musician, I am very attracted to the fact that colors exist in Heaven that I'be never seen before. 💞
Thank you Melissa for this discussion! Very interesting topic to explore! One point that didn't sit right for me was concerning those going to hell and not heaven. Personally, I think and feel I would grieve for their missed opportunity to be redeemed by Jesus. We all have sinned, and I don't think I would feel abhored by hearing about their sins at the white throne judgement. Rather, I would feel terrible for them and where they were going needlessly (meaning they could have been saved if they had better understanding or accepting heart). Someday we will know these things, but for now we are to be faithful and understand things the best we're able.
Just read Psalm 16:11: “You make known to me the path of life; in Your presence is fullness of joy; at Your right hand are pleasures forevermore.” The psalmist is speaking to God. In His presence sounds like a really wonderful place to be!
"Out-of-Body and Near-Death Experiences: Brain-State Phenomena or Glimpses of Immortality?" by Michael N Marsh, a Christian neurophysiologist. I do like the book by Habermas, but this one was a real eye-opener.
Regarding NDE’S: to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. 2 Chronicles chapter 5 verse 8 & 9
Wow! Very interesting. I have had what I would better call a near Life experience during a double brain surgery.
City of Angels got me when I was young, I was going through my parent's divorce at 14 when I saw it and I got sucked in to the emotional aspect of it and listened to the soundtrack every night crying myself to sleep. AWFUL! Yeah, it was evil.
NDE’s covered extensively in The Soul After Death Fr Seraphim Rose. Critique of Jung, Eastern Religion, Swedenborg, out of body experience, discussion of angels and records of NDE’s in the lives of the saints contrasted to new age. Also Protestant NDEs and similar conclusions in some, while many go off the rails.
Interesting discussion!
I always enjoy your work, Melissa, thank you
Thank you for spending time on these topics. It is wonderful to consider the Word of God. ❤🙏
I remember when that book came out Heaven is real, and everybody was talking about it, including some close family members that are pretty solid in their faith, and to me, it just
really didn't seem legit.. I had been, previous to that, in the charismatic movement for almost 2 decades and I was coming out of that movement questioning everything including stories about people going to heaven especially stories about people that supposedly died and went to heaven.
One really valuable read regarding the theology of heaven and the resurrection is N. T. Wright's Surprised by Hope (title playing off of C. S. Lewis's book Surprised by Joy).
I think of heaven more as a New Kingdom, and a New Earth as well. If our senses obring so much joy and wonder now, it will be unimaginably more so in the “age to come”!!
NDEs, much like Exorcisms, I am skeptical of many accounts/claims, but I always hold out that some may be authentic/real
An excellent chat went out in the Holy Post on heaven. Heaven is here now.
Jesus, hear my prayers these past three years have been difficult on me I am weak. Give me guidance. Please come back soon I don’t know how much longer I can hold on. As a single parent things are hard on me both of my sons are autistic and my hours to work are limited because I’m now homeschooling them. I’m constantly struggling to provide the basic necessities for them I’m so ashamed. I suffered an heart attack and I’m battling lupus I’m overwhelmed. Lord heal me. Father God hear my prayers. I constantly struggle to pay my bills and struggle to provide groceries. BUT I KEEP FAITH. Even though I want to give up. Jesus please take the fear from my heart. Father God it is you that gives me the strength to keep going. I praise you Father even as I fear homelessness please continue to give me strength.
God bless you. I pray that things work out for you.
I also wanna say there is going to be more than just the color white in heaven! There is going to be beautiful colors everywhere, colors that we have never even seen before! And jewels like you said and streets paved in gold!
Great topic. I'm really enjoying it.
I'd be so overjoyed that I made it to Heaven I wouldn't care what color it is!
And what heaven was all white? I'm sure it would be the most magnificent most spectacular white we had ever laid eyes on, and why? Because GOD had something to do with it.
Thank you Melissa. ❤ Australia 🇦🇺
When it comes to talking animals, I think of Balaams donkey. The Lord opened his mouth to warn Balaam of the Angel standing in front of them. It wasn’t the Lord speaking through the Donkey, but the donkey literally speaking it’s own kind. Makes you think how smart animals really are, and now I’m connecting animals being able to talk in eternity. Very interesting.
I just Saïd that also ...😂
This was so incredibly encouraging to me. Thank you!
No one comes to the Father but through Me.
God doesn't send people to Hell. The cursed don't care for Him. The damned don't want to be like Him, don't care about what He cares about, don't respond to the incredible love and mercy that shines from Him.
How could you not love God?
Everything, EVERYTHING good is in His voice, His thoughts are crafted in beauty and majesty and holiness. The fool has said in their heart "there is no God." You will say, "Thy will be done." Or He will say, "Thy will be done."
It is white and jewel toned both, but it is unlike the white or the color that we have seen at that level. This current place we are is a place dimly lit.
Also, i would recommend a book called" Deceived by the light", by Doug Groothuis.
LOL, I love to sing. Singing praises all day works for me!
If there is food in Heaven I hope that doesn’t mean we still have to use the bathroom. Those types of bodily functions are things I would prefer to live without.🚽
Love your content, Melissa, but love grammar too it's NDEs. No apostrophe.
I would love to hear more about deathbed experiences. My friend is a believer but she’s also a hospice nurse and the experiences her patients have makes her question things and she tends to lean towards universalism. Because someone, who was not a believer, they see angels or their loved ones coming to get them, or they speak of how beautiful things are right before they pass. How can she reconcile that to our beliefs and how should I respond to her?
It would be wiser to abstain from responding. Before the last breath, no one is safe from prelest and temptation. Such experiences can be either of God, of demons, or of (dying) human minds. If we are asked to say something on this issue, we can say that everything is in the hands of All-Merciful God.
Personal testimonies of any kind cannot be considered as evidence or proof for anything, unless they can be demonstrated to others...
How would we do that?
That's why we're still waiting for "science" to reproduce one single cell, much more so their "meteorite in a pool of soupy water created everything theory"
yes, it is so important to have a life change, heart change, mind transformation! praise Jesus, thank you God!
My impression was that in heaven we won’t really be aware of the past relationships we had with non-believers. We can’t be sad in heaven, so we won’t be missing people who aren’t there.
Wen u listen to occultist and ex-new agers that performed astral projections, their description of their experience bears a very striking resemblance to NDE. This has led me to speculate that perhaps, NDE are just an unmeditated, autonomous kind of astral projection.
In the garden of Eden the serpent talked to Eve so I think that gives us the notion that animals in the beginning could talk or at least have the capablity to speak.
Paralleling Dr. Jones re. loved ones in hell, RC Sprouell provided an interesting perspective on the scale of holiness... that we who are redeemed are made perfect, fit for sharing space with the Most High, and we would see those who are lost being so far away from that condition. We couldn't differentiate those whom we so esteemed with the likes of Hitler or Stalin.
CS Lewis in the Great Divorce also painted a great picture of this radical difference between the valley of the shadow of death and the almost unbearable shore leading to the mountain of life
Isaiah 50 15 And ye shall leave your name for a curse unto my chosen: for the Lord God shall ((((slay thee)))), and call his servants by another name:
@2:00 never mind that his reference to "Isaiah" directly contradicts everything else he just said prior to this point.
And never mind that "Isaiah" was EXECUTED for having made "a mistake" by predicting something for a king, which
evidently did not turn out as advised. The king had him cut in half with a saw.
So I have to conclude that he probably made "other mistakes before that" in his prophetic statements but after it
he did not make any more errors. The remaining question is just about HOW MANY MISTAKES and ABOUT WHAT,
but summarily I cannot recommend regarding ANYTHING HE IS CLAIMED TO HAVE SAID, as especially transcendent.
1:50 i'd love to know the entomology of the greek or hebrew or whatever it was in this verse, because something tells me it doesnt mean exactly that the memories will be wiped from our minds.
Rather I feel like we will have the memories, but they wont matter in the face of eternity with God.
I'm thinking your pic is new? If so, or if not (haha), it's great!
This is a good conversation. So needed-we don't talk enough about the enemy working to ruin Heaven for us on this side of eternity. Again we see the solution to those lies is simply: be IN the Word. 📖
We will remember based alone on the relatives are mentioned as been seen shortly before ones passing... as in that 'they come to receive them'
When I saw City of Angels, I was just starting to learn about the Watchers and the Nephilim and how very likely it was that all that was a literal thing that happened (as opposed to the Seth theory), so I was distracted and failed to zero in on little things like tastes and smells. Anyway, how interesting! I think it was C.S. Lewis who talked about how much more real heaven was than earth (The Great Divorce?). Thanks for this discussion!
Don't get caught up in Nephilim. Angels can't mate with humans because they aren't male or female and have no reproductive capabilities.
- the textures of the heavens is that of the spectrum (rainbow) with the firmament thereof baby blue
Thanks for this awesome interview. I immediately ordered the book ‘Immortal’ by Dr. Jones after watching this.
But we will have complete joy. So those we thought would be in Heaven and are not. ? We would suffer pain if we were aware of those who aren’t there.
I think no one can answer this particular question.
Thank you for this Melissa, absolutely loved the information and it was extremely well presented.
I saw heaven n hell. I became a hardcore Christian because of it.
Why would I want to be in Heaven knowing my loved one is not there?
We will truly understand that all of God’s ways are just and true
They sang the song of God’s servant Moses and the song of the Lamb: Great and awe-inspiring are your works, Lord God, the Almighty; just and true are your ways, King of the nations. Revelation 15:3
My favorite topic! Thanks for having this interview.
My story is I died according to what angels who surrounded my bed. A voice said I think he is dieing, and another said no he is dead.
I will not embellish this experience. It was confirmed to me. I share it for this reason. We are not to speculate about what we do not understand. We entered a passageway. As we walked I saw a light at the end of this passage way. I knew Jesus was there and He is all I wanted and ran calling out His name. This is all I will say there was light that is inexplicable, and it made everything what it is supposed to be. There are no questions only love and understanding. There was beauty that I cannot explain.
I asked to go as Paul went to heaven in 1973. That was a prayer moment, foolish request because I didnt know I had to die first....I will not share more. Just do not trust what man says or thinks because it is the Spirit that reveals all mystery. There is nothing that is on the cross but Jesus, our experiences all need to be placed at His feet. It is the cross and the blood. I do not laugh about Davids adultry it is foolish to judge as mere men anything. Be thankful for everything. We shall be one with God in Jesus Christ one as the angels. Do not speculate...foolishness to speculate.
I want to know where in Scripture does it say that the redeemed will go to heaven? Enter the kingdom of heaven is there but I can't find heaven. If the redeemed go to heaven, who will be on the new earth? The new earth is not heaven but it's in the kingdom of heaven.
We pray for God’s will to be done, here on earth. Why can’t we accept His design for Heaven? How dare anyone question God’s knowledge of what constitutes Paradise?
At about 38:30 Dr Jones talks about how the Christian's transition into the next life will be "seamless" ... that sounds like we skip the whole judgement thing. That doesn't sound right to me.
I took it to mean a seamless transition from the earthly realm to the next one. The judgement will be after you arrive there.
Paul said to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.
Whenever an NDE does not align with scripture, it must be discarded.
Wouldn’t it also be possible that your interpretation might be wrong?
thanks and God Bless❤
Thank you for this video! Until I watched it, I didn't realize that I did take the ones I saw for some sort of truth about death. But the other day I saw one talking about how there was no Hell or Heaven or something like that. I tried to watch it, but I just didn't want to finish it because I didn't like that people were going to be misled through it. I guess I'm sheltered because all the NDE's I'd seen before talked about God, or realizing God was real through them. So seeing that one shook me up a bit. Not my faith, but how I was suppose to view these experiences.
Randy Kay has a good testimony and is a Christian!
Lol i love that im listening to a video where, "you know you arent dead dead, just near death", over and over!
Right on the spot!! Hallelujah 💗🌸💗🌸💗🌸💗
Just a quick comment on color in heaven. In terms of light, my remembrance is that white is comprised of all colors. Perhaps the white is white light.
When you experience “the truth and the light” you will care not it’s name.
Christ will return, but may not be in the form you expect. Be prepared to recognize “the truth and the light” in whatever form or name it is presented.
I wouldn’t be so quick to say they’re massively different experiences. Scientists are currently feeding certified NDE stories through AI to collect all of the common threads, or Axioms as they’re calling them. The way it was explained to me is as follows: If we could imagine that we were a person living off grid with no contact or understanding of our outside world and a person approached us to tell us they had been to Paris and started to describe their single experience there, we would think they have, best case, an active imagination. However, if we sent just 50 people out to Paris on Uber’s and they all came back to report their personal experience, there will be bits that others didn’t experience, but there will be axioms like the big tourist attractions. Then, if we sent 100s of people out in Uber’s, their collective report could illuminate an image of Paris so detailed the off-grid person could not only imagine it in near detail, they also could not deny it’s existence.
Currently there are 11 major Axioms that unite all of these certified stories.
Lee Strobel’s book The Case for Heaven touches on this. The NDEs tend to be fairly similar at the surface level, its the details that tend to be greatly varied (who they saw, what they saw, whether the experience was good or bad, etc) because it is filtered through their worldview. Very interesting stuff!