Berry's needs to publish a book with load data, crimping, case prep... specifically for Berry's. And also tackle the questions about weird OAL on the 220g 300bo.
I use berry's and xtreme to load my .40sw and 9mm. Have always been impressed with performance and reliability with both brands. Thanks for the validation.
@@Ultimatereloader Because Berry's state that it is okay to use jacketed load data on their website, that is what I follow. Some load data will have data specific to plated bullets which leads me to believe that the data is for bullets from other manufacturers. That is why Berry's is the only brand of plated bullets that I use. Their 220gr 300 Blackout #21019 bullets with 11.0 grains of SW Blackout, converted Lake City brass & CCI No 41 primers is a very accurate subsonic load for my 10.5" barreled AR.
to you new reloaders, a chronograph is a very helpful piece of equipment. i shot plated, fmj, lead cast, and coated bullets for pistol. All perform differently. knowing velocities is very instrumental. cheers!
Definitely, especially if you are going to use plated bullets with a max velocity on them, or lead bullets that don’t have a jacket. I did this when I was shooting 30-30, 9mm, and 45 and I was exceeding the recommended velocity for plated bullets (unintentionally at first with the 9mm in a PCC with a longer barrel which upped the velocity, then intentionally later). Didn’t have any of the issues described in the video but the chronograph was able to confirm my initial mistake and aide in my experimenting.
@@randytolle6706 I'm thinking about getting a lab radar sometime. especially for rifle load development. i've been using a caldwell IR one and it is fantastic for pistol. had a Chrony for a while and it was unreliable.
I use Berry's in 9mm and .45acp, I load a little under max using win 231 and have had no problems at all, they are accurate and they ring steel just fine.
I have loaded lotsa types of bullets over the years(swaged, cast, jacketed & plated) I have loaded many plated bullets with decent success. But in the late 80s I used plated bullets with heavy loads in 44 magnum that seemed to separate severely. So I reserved plated bullets for light loads in all calibers. Appreciate the content.
I've been using Berry's Plated bullets for years in my .45 ACP and .40 S&W pistols. Excellent accuracy for both. The load I use for the .45 is the 230 grain bullet with 7.0 grains of Long Shot with 1.250 O.L and for the .40 I use the Berry 180 grain bullet over 6.7 grains Long Shot 1.125 O.L. Excellent bullets.
I have recently been loading and testing some 9mm Berry bullets, and trying different powder charges. Not interested in high velocity, just accuracy and function. Your results mirror mine. Great bullets, I bought more. LOL
I’ve been using Xtreme 124 gr rn for years now and they have similar velocity recommendations. Any load on the high end for hard cast lead or mid range jacketed works just fine. 5.4 gr of CFE Pistol works in all my guns with 100% reliability.
Been loading with berrys for years but just plinking ammo, so I typically rock the starting load unless I have cycling issues, which only happened once.. I have yet to do anything more than just basic range ammo very similar to the old federal champion that walmart used to have in the brick red 100rnd bulk packs. I miss those days.
Just started reloading and I’ve got Berry’s 125gr flat point bullets loaded in .38spl/.38spl+P with AA#5. I also have some Berry’s 158gr flat points loaded in .357 mag with AA#7. Still need to get out and try them.
In general no problems with plated RN but I have a load of 147 9mm berry’s FP that won’t fit in anything I own. :/ It would be great to see you work with powder coated lead bullets in terms of load data and how they perform for you 🇺🇸
I second this notion. I started casting and am having issues with leading in my 9mm. However 45 acp has been perfect. It would be great to see the results.
Very good presentation that I have not seen covered well or at all by others. I would like to see you do more in the pistol bullet area. For example, jacketed versus, plated, swaged lead lubricated, swaged lead powder coated, and cast both standard lubricated and powder coated. Oh, there are so many rabbit holes to go down here.
Thank you for your video. I used Barry's in a .357 mag. long gun, at 2199 fps. The recommended max velocity for the bullet was 1250fps. It left me with a wild, 5" group at about 60 yards. I had different results with 3.7 grains less powder. The velocity was 1927 fps. The group was 1 inch. Still 677 fps faster than recommended. In both groups I didn't experience any key holeing, or copper flecks. (Clean holes) I think that says a lot about Berry's
I use a Campro plated bullets in handguns, semi-auto carbines, and lever action rifles- 124gn RN & HP 9mm, 125gn & 158gn TC FCP 38/357, 200gn & 240gn 44cal, 300gn & 405gn 45-70Gov. Campro provides load data on their web site. I regularly shoot the back yard gongs with the Campro's 240gn TC FCP 44cal bullet from a 444Marlin, loaded with 51gn of H4895, just under 44Mag MAX chamber pressures, gives me a muzzle velocity just over 2000fps. Great bullets to have available during this component shortage.
I have been using xtreme for 38sp 45 acp 40sw with no issues at all. I like plated bullets for all the reasons you stated. I have used Berrys for 300 blk and they seem to be great for subsonic
Berry's puts out a great product. I've been using their pistol caliber bullets for a number of years for practice/range ammo. These bullets are certainly cheaper than jacketed bullets with many of the same advantages as described in the video. More care is called for when loading plated bullets. It is best to load plated bullets as if loading cast lead bullets. When loading cast lead, mouth flaring and proper chamferring is a must. This will protect the plating from scraping during the seating process. Further only a light crimp can be tolerated by the thin copper plating on the bullet. Should you crimp too tightly, you will cut the plating and the plating will likely separate from the lead during firing caused by the rotational (centrifigal) forces exerted on the plating. I've found that cast lead loading data works well for me. This forces me to load within the limitations of the plated bullets and excellent accuracy can still be obtained. What I find nice about Berry's bullets is that their Thick Plated bullets avoid leading and work well in polygonal rifled (Glock and Walther as examples) barrels which are notoriously prone to leading using hard cast bullets. For those magnum caliber rimmed cartridges such as .38 Special, .357 Magnum, etc, a collet style crimp can be used with a tighter crimp than can be tolerated by a roll or taper crimp. This is possible as many of these revolver cartridges headspace off of the rim, and not the mouth of the cartridge. Still care must be used to not over crimp even using a collet style (Lee Factory Crimp as an example) die. Keep in mind though that bullet setback is not likely as the velocities many of the non-magnum cartridges are loaded to do not offer significant recoil (Lever guns with tubular magazines may be a bit more of concern here). I still recommend a light crimp for safety's sake. For what it's worth, there's my two cents worth of "My Observations". Your mileage may vary.. Happy reloading/hunting/shooting!
Personally if I'm loading ammo that's not going to be used for self defense or hunting I'm doing what I can to save money so that means budget bullet and low charge weights. So I do like these plated bullets and I normally try to keep the charge weight just high enough to reliably cycle the gun and use whatever OAL a similar jacketed bullet uses. I've shot thousands of plated bullets from a few different manufacturers and honestly I can't tell a difference between them and regular old FMJ bullets other then the name and sometimes the price. Great video as always keepem coming brother!!!
Finding load data that will be safe for plated bullets can be confusing at first but I've loaded over 2k in 9mm with plated bullets with great results.
HK USP .45 ACP Elite - polygonal barrel. It likes the 185 grain ball nose from Berrys. Feeds right, and I'm limited by my skills, not the accuracy of the load. BTW, in your cards, it's fouling, not fowling.
Thanks. Bought a quantity of Berry’s 158 grain plated in .357 You’re video was an excellent confirmation of recent homework. I bought jacketed XTP to do high velocity hand loads. The plated Berry’s I plan to load well below rated 1,500 fps max so I can fire them at my local gun club (where magnum loads are frowned upon). Once I run out of 38 special factory ammo the Colt Target will never shoot that short round again!
I would love to see some videos on cast bullets. I started casting my own. And I've had no luck with 9mm reduced loads still lead the barrel. 45 acp has been fantastic. No issues there. 357 Magnum has been amazing! Great results with powder coat linotype and a gas check. I get very bad gas cutting on my 9mm
I just ordered some berry's .45 ACP for a batch of 500 right before your video came out. I have loaded more than a 1000 rounds of 9mm with berry's plated both HP and RN. Crimping caution is real. My experience with crimping plated rounds is that if you crimp AT ALL, no matter how light, the projectiles jiggle and rotate and continue to get looser almost by the minute. On every round that I have not crimped, I have had ZERO issues with neck tension or projectile shift or fit. My other discovery is that proper brass prep and case deburring is ESSENTIAL when loading plated rounds. There is a chance that the plating can snag and rip when you're seating if you don't go slow and careful.
Yes!!! Berry’s bullets rock!! Like you said, the .30 caliber 220 bullets are excellent for 300BO sub-sonic cartridges! I even use Berry’s in my 50AE without any issues whatsoever!
My understanding has always been that, with standard plated bullets, you don't want to push them over 1200-1250. But you can use any data provided your under the velocity limit.
I have pushed berry manufacturing plated bullets passed their advertised max velocity (9mm, 45, 30-30), by roughly 100 fps for the pistol rounds and 200 fps for the 30-30. I was curious to see if it would damage the plating, or if it would impact accuracy. It did no such thing. I did so with some relatively hot loads and pistol caliber carbines for the 9 and 45, and for 30-30, just picked out a load that would push that bullet past 2000fps out of a Marlin lever action. I shot the PCCs at 100 yards and the 30-30 at 200 yards and didn’t see any accuracy issues. Edit: Of course I wouldn’t recommend pushing the bullets that fast, just wanted to share my experience. Keep in mind you can easily push a 9 or 45 past the recommended velocity with a PCC with a longer barrel, even with your standard load you use in a traditional pistol.
I've shot the Berry's plated 30 cal 150 gr in my 30-30. Keeping the velocity down around 1800 fps was very accurate out to 150 yds. After that they became unstable. This was used in a levergun silhouette match. So once my targets were past 150 yds my hits went goofy. At 100 yds from the bench it would shoot close to 1in. I've got some of the 230 gr rn for my 45 but haven't tested it yet. Looking at your results I'd be happy if even close. Thanks for the video.
Only issue I had with plated bullets. I reloaded Rainier and Berrys RN and JHP's for my 38 special revolver. After each shot I measured the OAL of the remaining bullets in the cylinder and found the bullets had moved. I increased the crimp. Buy the time I found enough of a crimp to stop that. I had pierced the bullet plating. Can't use them for my revolvers unless I use Berrys DE wadcutters. In my 45 ACP, 9MM pistols they work great no issues. I use nothing but plated for them. Both Berrys and Rainier. Very happy
I've loaded Berry's 350 FP plated bullet (.458") in my 45-70 Guide Gun, and my Ruger #1 in .458 WinMag, to around 1300 fps with no issues. They are accurate and at such modest velocities they make a great "plinking" round. They have a cannelure which makes it easier. I've also loaded them in my .458 SoCom to around 1600 fps. The box says maximum MV around 1700. Plus, I've loaded their .500" 350 grain bullet in my 500 S&W to around 1250 fps, which makes for a nice, easy-shooting load. They also feature a cannelure.
Gavin, first I would like to thank you for being so informative however I would really like if you went into detail about OAL OR COAL because your discussion would have been excellent with this exact data. We all strive for reloading perfection with success and safety being paramount. I have been a major follower of yours as I have endeavored into the realm. I was introduced to this back in the early 90's with my grandfather Stan Waugh and his best friend Wiley Clapp while they diligently worked together and raised me into marksmanship and the "ultimate" lifestyle those of us give proclamation too. I would really like to make your acquaintance someday to learn more from one I consider a master of the craft.
Gavin. Thanks for your critical thinking on aspects of use that don't always appear from the focused use bloviator. The mention of greater velocities from a rifle barrel is a good example. Enginearing R fun.... God bless my Cpk.
Have had some difficulties with oal as some of their bullets are a different shape. Solved by placing an empty brass over the top and seeing where exactly the ogive was then adjusting as required
I once bought up a bunch of old plated .38spcl for real cheap that was made by a now defunct company that used plastic cases that looked like little shotgun shells and used narrow necked projectiles that snaped into the neck of the case so you could handload without tools. The plastic cases were so brittle due to age that they were unusable, but I found I could load the unusual shaped projectiles upside down in a brass case and the result was a sort of stepped semi-wadcutter and the accuracy was excellent as long as I kept the velocity down. I've found the plating was so thin that if I pushed these much past load data for lead, the plating would sheer off the bullets leaving jagged holes all over the target like a nasty shotgun round.
Just purchased HSW 115gr Round Nose Plated, made up a dummy round C.O.L. 1.100" and it looked good, then went looking for load Data CFE powder, and my search brought me here.
Regarding lead vapor, bear in mind that regardless of bullet type, most modern primers use lead styphnate as the priming compound, so they produce lead vapor and/or particulate anyway.
I've been reloading since the mid 70s. Some interesting plated bullet observations for reloaders: I did a ladder test reload session with 40 S&W and 165 gr plated bullets. I loaded 10 rounds of each load stepping the powder up a half grain each time with 50 rounds total. I used a Beretta model 96. The lowest load did not cycle properly though they hit the target accurately. I took 7 rounds home with me. The next step up had 2 fail to cycle out of 10 rounds. The next 3 loads all worked well but the highest did show signs of over pressure bleed back on a couple primers. When I got home I disassembled the 7 rounds I brought back and found that after resizing the brass the pulled bullets slid down beyond the case mouth to sit on top of the powder. Apparently once you do a slight taper crimp the bullet gets resized and cannot be re-used as a pull. I used a very light taper crimp and found this disappointing. It'd be costly to need to disassemble a bunch to lose the bullets. Bullets that I find around the 25 yard steel plate targets at my range have a lot of plated bullets in the backstop. Most of those bullets are slightly flattened from the impact but almost all of them do not have any open spots around the plating exposing the lead inside. I found whacking a plated bullet with a 3 pound hammer on a chunk of granite will not expose the lead. (I do melt fired range bullets to cast some bullets) I just bought some 308 plated flat point 150gr bullets for 30-30. Most lead bullet load data I have is for older powders. I don't find much lead data for rifles in my newer load books. Since many of the powder companies have been sold and powders reformulated by their new manufacturers I am hesitant to rely on 25 year old data. I am going to have to develop loads cautiously. I am surprised with the popularity of plated and powder coated bullets that there aren't better resources for load data.
Cast lead bullet load data is available in the "Lyman Reloading Handbook 51st Edition" and the "Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook 4th Edition" both contain load data for modern powders and both available from Lyman's website as well as MidwayUSA, BassPro/Cabellas, Graff & Sons, and most gun shops that sell reloading components. Best wishes to you in your endeavors to reload.
Mark 7 Apex 10 press (non-auto drive) Berrys 124 grain, 6.0 grain of Accurate #5, OAL of 1.15, 10 shot average over chronograph was 1052 fps, spread of 24 fps, and std.dev of 10.2. Shot from a Canik TP9 SFX. Wonderful practice ammo!
Ran some .45 GAP reloads using Berrys 185gr hollow base bullets. 5.0gr of bullseye was just right but 5.5gr had the plating coming apart and keyholing.
I’ve been chasing Buffalo Bore and Underwood hard cast numbers with my 10mm. Plated 220gr and some Longshot with small primer brass has been the best for 1250-1300fps. Granted I’m loading beyond the recommended 1200fps from the bullet manufacturer but when I shoot into water and sand I’m not seeing any fouling of the plating. I switched to small primers after your small vs large primer video.
@@allenhoward178 watch his video on the debate between small primer brass and large primer brass. It made me give it a shot. I use large primer brass for my range ammo. I saw more consistency using small primers in my spicier loads.
I've been wondering about 9mm pccs using pistol loads with Berrys. The load I'm using says it goes in the high 900s in a pistol. But the gain in a 16" barrel is hard to predict. 6.7 gns accurate # 7 124 gn RN. I'm hoping for no problems but it's too cold yet for plinking. Update: this load seems fine in the carbine.
I was shooting a match with my G20, someone noticed that my bullets were tumbling through the paper. Shooting HSM loads. Long story short, I called HSM and apparantly they had some plated rounds that went out as jacketed. The factory Glock barrel besides lead, doesn't like plated either.
Not sure what`s going on that your glock doesn`t like plated.... every glock i own, shoots fantastic with berry`s plated. I shoot 9mm, 40S&W, 10mm, 45ACP glocks, w/zero issues.
The only issue I ran into with plated bullets is that you definitely need to chamfer the inner edge of the case mouth or you'll end up scraping chunks of copper plating in front of the case mouth wich prevents the cartridge from fully chambering
+1 on this for rifle rounds if you have to trim. Also, flaring the case mouth for pistol rounds needs to be dialed in otherwise, regardless of how much you clean up the mouth of the case, you’ll get the same pealing of the plating. Finishing off your pistol cartridge with a Lee factory crimp die to make sure you don’t “dent” the plating with the crimp is also helpful.
@@bannedbycommieyoutube5time920 I decided to op for the chamfering of the case mouth instead of flaring for two reasons: #1 is that I reload my 45ACP cases multiple times and didn't want to over work the brass, causing spit case mouth. #2 I'm lazy; I only have to chamfer once, where as you'll have to flare each and every time.
@@Oldhogleg Makes sense, although I wonder which wears out brass mouth quicker, stretching the cartridge or removing the brass thickness. Hard to tell id imagine with a low pressure cartridge like 45acp. With 45, I’ve found the cases last a long time with standard loads since it’s a relatively low pressure cartridge. I can’t remember last time I had one split on me, if ever. I don’t sort them, nearly all were collected at an indoor public range so I wouldn’t be able to test anything scientifically anyway. I reload 45 on a Hornady 5 stage progressive press, so flaring takes no more effort than not flaring, just another die on the press and pull the handle. Whatever works 🇺🇸!
@@bannedbycommieyoutube5time920 Good point, I only have a single stage myself. I only can guess at which would most likely split case mouths, so I made a calculated guess on that. I do the same thing, as a rule I typically try to come home with twice as much brass as I shot when the range people are not looking 😁. After going through the tumbler, it's easy to see wich ones I've already chamfered and wich one needs chamfering that were range pick ups.
@@Oldhogleg makes sense, didn’t think about being able to actually see the chamfering after the fact. Good tip. I have a single stage also, got the progressive press used for less than half off, took some tinkering and a couple calls to Hornady to get it running smoothly. Probably worth it for high volume pistol shooting, I load most of my rifle caliber stuff on the single stage though, old school like you 😁👍🏼. I am just like you, I ask people if they are going to save their brass and if not, I kindly sweep it up for them and keep it hehehe. We are both brass vultures in that regard. I had 7 five gallon buckets full of 9mm, it was getting ridiculous, so during the last ammunition crunch (ongoing unfortunately) I sold most of it off to some people getting started in the reloading game.
I can reliably get 1300fps from .400 220gr plated bullets. Max speed I’ve seen is 1350fps and I haven’t had any delaminating when shooting into water or wet sand.
I'd like to see you cover a similar topic related to coated bullets - Hi-Tek and/or polymer coated. I use these for handgun and some slower velocity rifle cartridges.
I use them in 45 acp, 9mm, 30/30 & 30 carbine. All work great. Tested the 30 carbine today & was very accurate @ 25 yards, 1 big hole @ .5" . The 3030 shoot good but I found the seating depth to be a lot shorter than jacket or cast bullets. Could be my rifle has a shorter throat than most.
X-treme plated have reloading data on their site. They have a load for every bullet they make using power pistol and then 2 other powders that aren’t always the same. They don’t post min or max loads but what they say is a safe load that will cycle
loaded a lot of berrys 185gr 45, i use the low end of hndy jswc data for charges of win 244. no issues with large and magnum primers, dec .2 for magnums. for 230gr with 244 i use the high end of lead rn data. both at 1.250 COL. shooters reference website is great. Had trouble finding data for these combos so thats my experience. Dont have to change die heights or setups between the two rounds which is nice.
Gavin, glad to see a video related to Berry's bullets! The question I have specific to their bullets is they run .001 larger in diameter then other bullets of the same caliber does this create any issues in relation to barrel wear. Thanks for any responses.
Anecdotal, but after shooting probably 15,000 (maybe more) of the plated pistol bullets, I had a batch of 45acp that were oversized that I had to run through a bullet sizing die (for bullet casting) to get Them to load correctly. Since then I check each time I bought them and have noticed the same thing, all of them are a bit oversized. Never caused an issue shooting (other than the aforementioned batch of 230 grain 45acp) Edit: the plating is pretty soft, as noted by now easy it is to “dent” when you apply a crimp, for both rifle and pistol, so I seriously doubt it would do any additional wear to your guns.
You are correct about the .001 oversize. This is required to promote accuracy. You will find that cast lead bullets will cast out at about .001 in diameter for a given caliber. Cast lead .308" bullets are typically cast and resized to .309" to obtain maximum accuracy. Plated bullets have such a thin plate and the Berry's bullets are Double Struck, meaning that they resize the lead core prior to plating and then resize after copper plating to assure a perfect diameter bullet. These bullets do not need to be resized as they should be used straight out of the box. Jacketed bullets, because of the hard thick jacket on the other hand, need to match the groove diameter of the firearm, or for a .308 groove diameter, a .308 diameter bullet is required, otherwise chamber pressures can reach dangerous levels causing safety concerns for the shooter. As I stated in an earlier post, using Cast Lead Bullet loading data is a good way to develop safe and accurate loads. Think of these bullets as Hard Cast Lead Bullets without gas checks and load accordingly. A great deal of load data for Cast Lead Bullets can be found in the "Lyman Reloading Handbook" and I believe the new 51st Edition is now available and can be purchased online at Lyman's website. As always, Your Mileage May Vary. Happy Reloading/hunting/shooting!
When u said rifle bullets limited to 2000 fos, my imnediate thought was "Krag". Hopefully they make a 180 gr or 200 gr 30 cal. I hear good things about the pistol bullets. I will certainly try them when i am able to load. A limit of 1250 should be fine for 158 gr 357 in handguns, and of course 180's are a bit slower. Pistol bullets should be fine for slightly under max loads with 210 gr 41 mag or 240 or heavier 44 mag (assuming Berry's makes them). If they make a 358 rifle bullet, that might do well in my 357 Herrett (or experiment with the pistol bullets to see how much they can take. Holding 30-30 to 2000 fos or less with 150's or 170's might make a pleasant practice load for new shooters or those who are recoil sensitive. Lots of good applications. Thanks for the info.
I have loaded Berrys in 9mm, 38 Spec and now started 45 ACP. Been very happy, and they are more accurate than I am. I test with chrono and have my state champ friend verify accuracy in my handguns - he gets very good groups😂. No issues with Berry's round nose using Hornady data. I find that with several handguns (Taurus G3c and Springfield XDM 45acp) using XTP COAL with Berry's Hybrid HP results in failing to pass "plunk test" due to the 'fat' profile of the nose. Using Speer Gold Dot published overall length solves the problem since it typically shortens COAL. I either use Speer powder data, or back off XTP powder charge and work up. I do test with chrono, but tend to use light loads anyway. Have used Unique, CFE Pistol and Titegroup. I load 38 Spec roundnose and flatnose at mild target velocities, but haven't tried Berry's for 357 due to velocity and heavier crimp needed.
All the TMJ 's i've used, (Namely H P), have failed to expand. I don't like them, however i live in the Woods, so, i don't go to indoor shooting ranges. I enjoy the information you provide in your videos. Still, i only care about Muzzle Energy when it comes to Pistols, hopefully will give me time to get to a rifle.
The latest Lee reloading manual contains quite a lot of plated bullet data now. Good on Lee. Lyman manual (50th edition) not a single plated bullet load.
I've used lots of Berrys bullets, and like the 220 grain 300BO... but have shifted to RMR for most other stuff... as they have quality jacketed bullets for about the same price. In 147 grain 9mm, the RMR bullets are SIGNIFICANTLY more accurate in my guns. As for price, the cheapest I've found Berrys is Powder Valley. RMR comes straight from RMR and they offer free shipping. Would love to see you do some tests with RMR. They also have 'Nuke' hollow points now that work well.
Berry’s 220gr 300 BO bullets have a disclaimer not to exceed 1:7 twist. I bought it for my Sig MCX with 1:5 twist not realizing the limitation and they don’t group at all. At 25 yds I was struggling to even keep it within a 5moa circle. I wish I could use them because they’re so economical but I guess I have to stick with a jacketed bullet.
@@RadDadisRad I think that would be a question for Sig but my guess is they were trying to get 1 full rotation before exiting the barrel on their 5.5” barrel lengths.
Can you also do a video like this for coated bullets like HiTek and Blue Bullets? There is basically no load data for them. Only some cast lead data, and plated… Since coated is even more economical than plated, would be interested to see how those stack up.
I shoot plated .308 bullets using cast bullet data for my model 94 in 30-30. (Red Dot, 700x etc.) I haven't considered jacket bullet load data. (Or loads for .308 Win. I use sorted Factory Second jacketed to safe money and still shoot 1000 yard steel targets. Thanks for the info.
With rifle, I'd skip Berry's altogether and get Speer's TMJ or Gold Dot bullets. They don't have those velocity thresholds, and also are excellent for range and hunting/SD purposes, respectively.
Well, maybe they changed something, but for the past 10 years I’ve loaded plated bullets as per Berry’s instructions in their ad in the Dillon “Blue Press”: “When loading plated bullets we have found best results using LOW to MID-RANGE jacketed data in the load manual. You must use data for a bullet that has the same weight and profile as the one you are loading. Do not exceed _mid-range_ loads.” Also: “Velocities depend on the caliber, but as a rule of thumb, we recommend you don’t shoot our plated bullets over 1200 FPS. Our .44s actually shoot best around 1150 FPS. 45s are generally good at 850-900 FPS. Our bullets are NOT recommended for magnum velocities.” I would never try anything close 1850 for a .44 plated bullet.
The .44 bullets I got from Berry’s state 1,400 FPS max velocity. They are 180 grain, so that speed is easily reached. When I run 180 grain XTP bullets (which are plated also) I run them over 1,800 FPS, which I’m told is fine by Hornady.
Hi John, that is a great bullet choice! I don't mean to be contrary, so I am just putting this out for accuracy sake. Page 55 of the "Hornady Handbook of Cartridge Reloading - 11th Edition" describes the XTP/ XTP Mag bullet as "Drawn Gilding Metal Jacket", indicating that this particular bullet and design is jacketed and will therefore allow greater velocities than copper electroplated bullets. Again, I like your choice of bullet! An excellent choice for accuracy and dependability. I use the Berry's bullets (the cheap stuff) for target/plinking, and reserve my Hornady XTP loaded 180gr 357 Magnum cartridges as my "Good Stuff" for mission critical applications such as self-defense. Have a great day!
I wonder why they make rifle bullets in lower weight ranges... I was about to buy a box of 250 130gr .308" just to have a nice plinking load for a gas gun, but going down to 2000fps, I'm really not even sure if it would cycle the bolt. They've got a 220gr option as well, but in a 1-10" twist barrel I'm not sure they'd even stabilize. Both would probably be fantastic for .300aac or .30-30 plinking loads. Just thinking out loud, lol Glad I watched this video though as I had 5 boxes in the cart! Better to spend more on a bullet I can actually use than get a "great deal" on bullets I have no use for!
At 6:30 your 45load data has a lot of variation in the powder charge. Your minimum was 685ft/s while your max was 835ft/s . Thats 150ft/s extreme spread. Check your powder dropper lol
Does any reloader remember '80s - '90s Remington's Power Lokt Hollow Point (PLHP) .224" 52 gr bullets??.. As far as I know, those little guys were actually plated, (Copper or brass plated??. IDK). In fact, I used to load those, from .223 / 5.56, thru .22- 250 & up to .220 Swift, from 2.950 fps, up to 3.500+ fps. NO jacket separation whatsoever. Actually, I still keep a couple houndred. Pretty decent groups & terminal ballistics.
I've reloaded and shot probably close to 100k rounds of Berry's...hands down my favorite round for reloads. But i have NEVER heard about the velocity issue. I've talked to Berry's several times about reload data and wasnt pointed toward velocity. Awesome info Gavin. I just wish i knew this before i just received my order of 20K rounds of 5.56 rounds. So from what i heard, as long as its not key holed or brass specks around the bullet on a paper target, im good to press above 2000fps...I just did a whole work up using that bullet and we were around 2990 fps with our chosen load. I was about to load them all up, but now i think i need to go back to 30 feet and check. No key holes at 100M, acceptable group size...am i good to go?
Berry's needs to publish a book with load data, crimping, case prep... specifically for Berry's. And also tackle the questions about weird OAL on the 220g 300bo.
Xtreme does have a load manual for their bullets
@@charlesphillips5906 Very limited powder testing with the Xtreme load manual.
@@NickLoecke Yes only a few powders tested. But it is helpful because it gives you OAL for their bullets, which is what I use most of the time.
Totally agree 👍
Been shooting berrys double struck heavy plate for quite a while as their quality has come up in leaps and bounds.I simply love their products.
I've been shooting Berrys bullets for about ten years, no complaints at all.
I would love to see some terminal ballistic tests with Berry’s bullets and maybe X-treme bullets!
I’ve been using Berry’s for years and they never disappoint !
Ranier says to use jacketed data, and it's worked for me so far
I use berry's and xtreme to load my .40sw and 9mm. Have always been impressed with performance and reliability with both brands. Thanks for the validation.
Now this is a video that NEEDED to be made. Load data can get confusing when it comes to plated bullets.
Glad you found it helpful John!
@@Ultimatereloader Because Berry's state that it is okay to use jacketed load data on their website, that is what I follow. Some load data will have data specific to plated bullets which leads me to believe that the data is for bullets from other manufacturers. That is why Berry's is the only brand of plated bullets that I use. Their 220gr 300 Blackout #21019 bullets with 11.0 grains of SW Blackout, converted Lake City brass & CCI No 41 primers is a very accurate subsonic load for my 10.5" barreled AR.
I love how you talk to manufacturers and great supply companies. Thank you.
to you new reloaders, a chronograph is a very helpful piece of equipment. i shot plated, fmj, lead cast, and coated bullets for pistol. All perform differently. knowing velocities is very instrumental. cheers!
Great comment! This can’t be said enough..... chronograph data along with reading primers and cases is so valuable!
Definitely, especially if you are going to use plated bullets with a max velocity on them, or lead bullets that don’t have a jacket.
I did this when I was shooting 30-30, 9mm, and 45 and I was exceeding the recommended velocity for plated bullets (unintentionally at first with the 9mm in a PCC with a longer barrel which upped the velocity, then intentionally later). Didn’t have any of the issues described in the video but the chronograph was able to confirm my initial mistake and aide in my experimenting.
Surprised to see the bullet shadow timing chronograph on this channel. I have abandoned mine and now use LabRadar.
@@randytolle6706 I'm thinking about getting a lab radar sometime. especially for rifle load development. i've been using a caldwell IR one and it is fantastic for pistol. had a Chrony for a while and it was unreliable.
@@nathandively8524 my only experience with the bullet shaw units is with my Chrony and couldn't trust the numbers
I use Berry's in 9mm and .45acp, I load a little under max using win 231 and have had no problems at all, they are accurate and they ring steel just fine.
I have loaded lotsa types of bullets over the years(swaged, cast, jacketed & plated) I have loaded many plated bullets with decent success. But in the late 80s I used plated bullets with heavy loads in 44 magnum that seemed to separate severely. So I reserved plated bullets for light loads in all calibers. Appreciate the content.
I've been using Berry's Plated bullets for years in my .45 ACP and .40 S&W pistols. Excellent accuracy for both. The load I use for the .45 is the 230 grain bullet with 7.0 grains of Long Shot with 1.250 O.L and for the .40 I use the Berry 180 grain bullet over 6.7 grains Long Shot 1.125 O.L. Excellent bullets.
I have recently been loading and testing some 9mm Berry bullets, and trying different powder charges. Not interested in high velocity, just accuracy and function. Your results mirror mine. Great bullets, I bought more. LOL
I’ve been using Xtreme 124 gr rn for years now and they have similar velocity recommendations. Any load on the high end for hard cast lead or mid range jacketed works just fine. 5.4 gr of CFE Pistol works in all my guns with 100% reliability.
Been loading with berrys for years but just plinking ammo, so I typically rock the starting load unless I have cycling issues, which only happened once..
I have yet to do anything more than just basic range ammo very similar to the old federal champion that walmart used to have in the brick red 100rnd bulk packs.
I miss those days.
Excellent review! My 7th grade grammar teacher would have given you her red pen though. Fowling is to duck hunting. Fouling is to soiled barrels. ;-)
Just started reloading and I’ve got Berry’s 125gr flat point bullets loaded in .38spl/.38spl+P with AA#5. I also have some Berry’s 158gr flat points loaded in .357 mag with AA#7. Still need to get out and try them.
In general no problems with plated RN but I have a load of 147 9mm berry’s FP that won’t fit in anything I own. :/
It would be great to see you work with powder coated lead bullets in terms of load data and how they perform for you 🇺🇸
I second this notion. I started casting and am having issues with leading in my 9mm. However 45 acp has been perfect. It would be great to see the results.
Very good presentation that I have not seen covered well or at all by others. I would like to see you do more in the pistol bullet area. For example, jacketed versus, plated, swaged lead lubricated, swaged lead powder coated, and cast both standard lubricated and powder coated. Oh, there are so many rabbit holes to go down here.
Thank you for your video.
I used Barry's in a .357 mag. long gun, at 2199 fps. The recommended max velocity for the bullet was 1250fps. It left me with a wild, 5" group at about 60 yards.
I had different results with 3.7 grains less powder. The velocity was 1927 fps. The group was 1 inch. Still 677 fps faster than recommended.
In both groups I didn't experience any key holeing, or copper flecks. (Clean holes) I think that says a lot about Berry's
I use a Campro plated bullets in handguns, semi-auto carbines, and lever action rifles- 124gn RN & HP 9mm, 125gn & 158gn TC FCP 38/357, 200gn & 240gn 44cal, 300gn & 405gn 45-70Gov. Campro provides load data on their web site. I regularly shoot the back yard gongs with the Campro's 240gn TC FCP 44cal bullet from a 444Marlin, loaded with 51gn of H4895, just under 44Mag MAX chamber pressures, gives me a muzzle velocity just over 2000fps. Great bullets to have available during this component shortage.
I have been using xtreme for 38sp 45 acp 40sw with no issues at all. I like plated bullets for all the reasons you stated. I have used Berrys for 300 blk and they seem to be great for subsonic
Berry's puts out a great product. I've been using their pistol caliber bullets for a number of years for practice/range ammo. These bullets are certainly cheaper than jacketed bullets with many of the same advantages as described in the video. More care is called for when loading plated bullets. It is best to load plated bullets as if loading cast lead bullets. When loading cast lead, mouth flaring and proper chamferring is a must. This will protect the plating from scraping during the seating process. Further only a light crimp can be tolerated by the thin copper plating on the bullet. Should you crimp too tightly, you will cut the plating and the plating will likely separate from the lead during firing caused by the rotational (centrifigal) forces exerted on the plating. I've found that cast lead loading data works well for me. This forces me to load within the limitations of the plated bullets and excellent accuracy can still be obtained. What I find nice about Berry's bullets is that their Thick Plated bullets avoid leading and work well in polygonal rifled (Glock and Walther as examples) barrels which are notoriously prone to leading using hard cast bullets. For those magnum caliber rimmed cartridges such as .38 Special, .357 Magnum, etc, a collet style crimp can be used with a tighter crimp than can be tolerated by a roll or taper crimp. This is possible as many of these revolver cartridges headspace off of the rim, and not the mouth of the cartridge. Still care must be used to not over crimp even using a collet style (Lee Factory Crimp as an example) die. Keep in mind though that bullet setback is not likely as the velocities many of the non-magnum cartridges are loaded to do not offer significant recoil (Lever guns with tubular magazines may be a bit more of concern here). I still recommend a light crimp for safety's sake. For what it's worth, there's my two cents worth of "My Observations". Your mileage may vary.. Happy reloading/hunting/shooting!
Personally if I'm loading ammo that's not going to be used for self defense or hunting I'm doing what I can to save money so that means budget bullet and low charge weights. So I do like these plated bullets and I normally try to keep the charge weight just high enough to reliably cycle the gun and use whatever OAL a similar jacketed bullet uses. I've shot thousands of plated bullets from a few different manufacturers and honestly I can't tell a difference between them and regular old FMJ bullets other then the name and sometimes the price. Great video as always keepem coming brother!!!
I just love your channel! The information given here about plated bullets is excellent! I use Berry's jacketed and plated 115 gr. 9mm.
Finding load data that will be safe for plated bullets can be confusing at first but I've loaded over 2k in 9mm with plated bullets with great results.
HK USP .45 ACP Elite - polygonal barrel. It likes the 185 grain ball nose from Berrys. Feeds right, and I'm limited by my skills, not the accuracy of the load.
BTW, in your cards, it's fouling, not fowling.
Thanks.
Bought a quantity of Berry’s 158 grain plated in .357
You’re video was an excellent confirmation of recent homework. I bought jacketed XTP to do high velocity hand loads.
The plated Berry’s I plan to load well below rated 1,500 fps max so I can fire them at my local gun club (where magnum loads are frowned upon).
Once I run out of 38 special factory ammo the Colt Target will never shoot that short round again!
Another thorough video. Always fun and informative
to watch.
I would love to see some videos on cast bullets. I started casting my own. And I've had no luck with 9mm reduced loads still lead the barrel. 45 acp has been fantastic. No issues there. 357 Magnum has been amazing! Great results with powder coat linotype and a gas check. I get very bad gas cutting on my 9mm
I just ordered some berry's .45 ACP for a batch of 500 right before your video came out. I have loaded more than a 1000 rounds of 9mm with berry's plated both HP and RN. Crimping caution is real. My experience with crimping plated rounds is that if you crimp AT ALL, no matter how light, the projectiles jiggle and rotate and continue to get looser almost by the minute. On every round that I have not crimped, I have had ZERO issues with neck tension or projectile shift or fit. My other discovery is that proper brass prep and case deburring is ESSENTIAL when loading plated rounds. There is a chance that the plating can snag and rip when you're seating if you don't go slow and careful.
I’m looking forward to using berry’s in my 14” contender. Have had good success with them in my 357 revolver
@J B good for you.
Yes!!! Berry’s bullets rock!!
Like you said, the .30 caliber 220 bullets are excellent for 300BO sub-sonic cartridges! I even use Berry’s in my 50AE without any issues whatsoever!
My understanding has always been that, with standard plated bullets, you don't want to push them over 1200-1250. But you can use any data provided your under the velocity limit.
I’ve loaded platted bullets. The rule of thumb is to use the lowest amount of powder rated for a comparable FMJ and adjust as needed.
I have pushed berry manufacturing plated bullets passed their advertised max velocity (9mm, 45, 30-30), by roughly 100 fps for the pistol rounds and 200 fps for the 30-30. I was curious to see if it would damage the plating, or if it would impact accuracy.
It did no such thing. I did so with some relatively hot loads and pistol caliber carbines for the 9 and 45, and for 30-30, just picked out a load that would push that bullet past 2000fps out of a Marlin lever action.
I shot the PCCs at 100 yards and the 30-30 at 200 yards and didn’t see any accuracy issues.
Edit: Of course I wouldn’t recommend pushing the bullets that fast, just wanted to share my experience. Keep in mind you can easily push a 9 or 45 past the recommended velocity with a PCC with a longer barrel, even with your standard load you use in a traditional pistol.
I've shot the Berry's plated 30 cal 150 gr in my 30-30. Keeping the velocity down around 1800 fps was very accurate out to 150 yds.
After that they became unstable. This was used in a levergun silhouette match. So once my targets were past 150 yds my hits went goofy.
At 100 yds from the bench it would shoot close to 1in.
I've got some of the 230 gr rn for my 45 but haven't tested it yet. Looking at your results I'd be happy if even close.
Thanks for the video.
Only issue I had with plated bullets. I reloaded Rainier and Berrys RN and JHP's for my 38 special revolver. After each shot I measured the OAL of the remaining bullets in the cylinder and found the bullets had moved. I increased the crimp. Buy the time I found enough of a crimp to stop that. I had pierced the bullet plating. Can't use them for my revolvers unless I use Berrys DE wadcutters. In my 45 ACP, 9MM pistols they work great no issues. I use nothing but plated for them. Both Berrys and Rainier. Very happy
I've used Berry's and Acme's (?) powder coated before. I'll use them both as they work really well in my 9mm pistol.
I've loaded Berry's 350 FP plated bullet (.458") in my 45-70 Guide Gun, and my Ruger #1 in .458 WinMag, to around 1300 fps with no issues. They are accurate and at such modest velocities they make a great "plinking" round. They have a cannelure which makes it easier.
I've also loaded them in my .458 SoCom to around 1600 fps. The box says maximum MV around 1700.
Plus, I've loaded their .500" 350 grain bullet in my 500 S&W to around 1250 fps, which makes for a nice, easy-shooting load. They also feature a cannelure.
Gavin, first I would like to thank you for being so informative however I would really like if you went into detail about OAL OR COAL because your discussion would have been excellent with this exact data. We all strive for reloading perfection with success and safety being paramount. I have been a major follower of yours as I have endeavored into the realm. I was introduced to this back in the early 90's with my grandfather Stan Waugh and his best friend Wiley Clapp while they diligently worked together and raised me into marksmanship and the "ultimate" lifestyle those of us give proclamation too. I would really like to make your acquaintance someday to learn more from one I consider a master of the craft.
Berry's 115 grain copper plated bullets, 4.6 grains of titegroup, with a the standard factory o.a.l. works great for my glock.
Same, only 4.5 grains instead of 4.6, loaded within a couple hundredths of max COAL. Good load in all my 9mm handguns and PCCs. Happy shooting 🇺🇸!
Gavin. Thanks for your critical thinking on aspects of use that don't always appear from the focused use bloviator. The mention of greater velocities from a rifle barrel is a good example.
Enginearing R fun.... God bless my Cpk.
I have used Berry's bullets for many years and then have been consistently good and have never had any problems .
Have had some difficulties with oal as some of their bullets are a different shape. Solved by placing an empty brass over the top and seeing where exactly the ogive was then adjusting as required
I once bought up a bunch of old plated .38spcl for real cheap that was made by a now defunct company that used plastic cases that looked like little shotgun shells and used narrow necked projectiles that snaped into the neck of the case so you could handload without tools. The plastic cases were so brittle due to age that they were unusable, but I found I could load the unusual shaped projectiles upside down in a brass case and the result was a sort of stepped semi-wadcutter and the accuracy was excellent as long as I kept the velocity down. I've found the plating was so thin that if I pushed these much past load data for lead, the plating would sheer off the bullets leaving jagged holes all over the target like a nasty shotgun round.
Just purchased HSW 115gr Round Nose Plated, made up a dummy round C.O.L. 1.100" and it looked good, then went looking for load Data CFE powder, and my search brought me here.
Regarding lead vapor, bear in mind that regardless of bullet type, most modern primers use lead styphnate as the priming compound, so they produce lead vapor and/or particulate anyway.
I have used Berry's for many years and have never been disappointed.
I've been reloading since the mid 70s. Some interesting plated bullet observations for reloaders: I did a ladder test reload session with 40 S&W and 165 gr plated bullets. I loaded 10 rounds of each load stepping the powder up a half grain each time with 50 rounds total. I used a Beretta model 96. The lowest load did not cycle properly though they hit the target accurately. I took 7 rounds home with me. The next step up had 2 fail to cycle out of 10 rounds. The next 3 loads all worked well but the highest did show signs of over pressure bleed back on a couple primers. When I got home I disassembled the 7 rounds I brought back and found that after resizing the brass the pulled bullets slid down beyond the case mouth to sit on top of the powder. Apparently once you do a slight taper crimp the bullet gets resized and cannot be re-used as a pull. I used a very light taper crimp and found this disappointing. It'd be costly to need to disassemble a bunch to lose the bullets.
Bullets that I find around the 25 yard steel plate targets at my range have a lot of plated bullets in the backstop. Most of those bullets are slightly flattened from the impact but almost all of them do not have any open spots around the plating exposing the lead inside. I found whacking a plated bullet with a 3 pound hammer on a chunk of granite will not expose the lead. (I do melt fired range bullets to cast some bullets)
I just bought some 308 plated flat point 150gr bullets for 30-30. Most lead bullet load data I have is for older powders. I don't find much lead data for rifles in my newer load books. Since many of the powder companies have been sold and powders reformulated by their new manufacturers I am hesitant to rely on 25 year old data. I am going to have to develop loads cautiously. I am surprised with the popularity of plated and powder coated bullets that there aren't better resources for load data.
Cast lead bullet load data is available in the "Lyman Reloading Handbook 51st Edition" and the "Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook 4th Edition" both contain load data for modern powders and both available from Lyman's website as well as MidwayUSA, BassPro/Cabellas, Graff & Sons, and most gun shops that sell reloading components. Best wishes to you in your endeavors to reload.
Mark 7 Apex 10 press (non-auto drive) Berrys 124 grain, 6.0 grain of Accurate #5, OAL of 1.15, 10 shot average over chronograph was 1052 fps, spread of 24 fps, and std.dev of 10.2. Shot from a Canik TP9 SFX. Wonderful practice ammo!
Awesome!
The check from Berry’s is on the way.
Ran some .45 GAP reloads using Berrys 185gr hollow base bullets. 5.0gr of bullseye was just right but 5.5gr had the plating coming apart and keyholing.
I’ve been chasing Buffalo Bore and Underwood hard cast numbers with my 10mm. Plated 220gr and some Longshot with small primer brass has been the best for 1250-1300fps. Granted I’m loading beyond the recommended 1200fps from the bullet manufacturer but when I shoot into water and sand I’m not seeing any fouling of the plating. I switched to small primers after your small vs large primer video.
You went from large primers to small primers in 10 mm?
@@allenhoward178 yeah I was shooting large primer brass and went to small primer brass for my hotter/higher pressure loads.
@@allenhoward178 watch his video on the debate between small primer brass and large primer brass. It made me give it a shot. I use large primer brass for my range ammo. I saw more consistency using small primers in my spicier loads.
I've been wondering about 9mm pccs using pistol loads with Berrys. The load I'm using says it goes in the high 900s in a pistol. But the gain in a 16" barrel is hard to predict. 6.7 gns accurate # 7 124 gn RN. I'm hoping for no problems but it's too cold yet for plinking. Update: this load seems fine in the carbine.
I was shooting a match with my G20, someone noticed that my bullets were tumbling through the paper. Shooting HSM loads. Long story short, I called HSM and apparantly they had some plated rounds that went out as jacketed. The factory Glock barrel besides lead, doesn't like plated either.
Not sure what`s going on that your glock doesn`t like plated.... every glock i own, shoots fantastic with berry`s plated. I shoot 9mm, 40S&W, 10mm, 45ACP glocks, w/zero issues.
@@D70340 Yeah, hard to say. But HSM knew exactly what happened as soon as I explained my situation.
The only issue I ran into with plated bullets is that you definitely need to chamfer the inner edge of the case mouth or you'll end up scraping chunks of copper plating in front of the case mouth wich prevents the cartridge from fully chambering
+1 on this for rifle rounds if you have to trim.
Also, flaring the case mouth for pistol rounds needs to be dialed in otherwise, regardless of how much you clean up the mouth of the case, you’ll get the same pealing of the plating. Finishing off your pistol cartridge with a Lee factory crimp die to make sure you don’t “dent” the plating with the crimp is also helpful.
@@bannedbycommieyoutube5time920 I decided to op for the chamfering of the case mouth instead of flaring for two reasons: #1 is that I reload my 45ACP cases multiple times and didn't want to over work the brass, causing spit case mouth. #2 I'm lazy; I only have to chamfer once, where as you'll have to flare each and every time.
@@Oldhogleg Makes sense, although I wonder which wears out brass mouth quicker, stretching the cartridge or removing the brass thickness. Hard to tell id imagine with a low pressure cartridge like 45acp.
With 45, I’ve found the cases last a long time with standard loads since it’s a relatively low pressure cartridge. I can’t remember last time I had one split on me, if ever. I don’t sort them, nearly all were collected at an indoor public range so I wouldn’t be able to test anything scientifically anyway.
I reload 45 on a Hornady 5 stage progressive press, so flaring takes no more effort than not flaring, just another die on the press and pull the handle.
Whatever works 🇺🇸!
@@bannedbycommieyoutube5time920 Good point, I only have a single stage myself. I only can guess at which would most likely split case mouths, so I made a calculated guess on that.
I do the same thing, as a rule I typically try to come home with twice as much brass as I shot when the range people are not looking 😁. After going through the tumbler, it's easy to see wich ones I've already chamfered and wich one needs chamfering that were range pick ups.
@@Oldhogleg makes sense, didn’t think about being able to actually see the chamfering after the fact. Good tip.
I have a single stage also, got the progressive press used for less than half off, took some tinkering and a couple calls to Hornady to get it running smoothly. Probably worth it for high volume pistol shooting, I load most of my rifle caliber stuff on the single stage though, old school like you 😁👍🏼.
I am just like you, I ask people if they are going to save their brass and if not, I kindly sweep it up for them and keep it hehehe. We are both brass vultures in that regard. I had 7 five gallon buckets full of 9mm, it was getting ridiculous, so during the last ammunition crunch (ongoing unfortunately) I sold most of it off to some people getting started in the reloading game.
Wish berry's would make their 10mm .400 bullets to take 1500+. I have a 6.5" barrel and I'm going to go way over their Max velocities.
I can reliably get 1300fps from .400 220gr plated bullets. Max speed I’ve seen is 1350fps and I haven’t had any delaminating when shooting into water or wet sand.
Yep 9mm and 45 pushed faster doesn’t cause issues either (out of PCCs with longer barrels)
I'd like to see you cover a similar topic related to coated bullets - Hi-Tek and/or polymer coated. I use these for handgun and some slower velocity rifle cartridges.
...I've been using Berry's plated bullets for many years both in my 1911 and 9mm
Can you do a similar episode on all copper bullets. I’m new to reloading and any information on pressures and velocities would be greatly appreciated.
Very clear and informative video, thanks!
I use them in 45 acp, 9mm, 30/30 & 30 carbine. All work great. Tested the 30 carbine today & was very accurate @ 25 yards, 1 big hole @ .5" . The 3030 shoot good but I found the seating depth to be a lot shorter than jacket or cast bullets. Could be my rifle has a shorter throat than most.
X-treme plated have reloading data on their site. They have a load for every bullet they make using power pistol and then 2 other powders that aren’t always the same. They don’t post min or max loads but what they say is a safe load that will cycle
loaded a lot of berrys 185gr 45, i use the low end of hndy jswc data for charges of win 244. no issues with large and magnum primers, dec .2 for magnums. for 230gr with 244 i use the high end of lead rn data. both at 1.250 COL. shooters reference website is great. Had trouble finding data for these combos so thats my experience. Dont have to change die heights or setups between the two rounds which is nice.
Nice video man. Thank you
Love their 9mm bullets. Usually use 147 gr and some 124 gr.
Gavin, glad to see a video related to Berry's bullets! The question I have specific to their bullets is they run .001 larger in diameter then other bullets of the same caliber does this create any issues in relation to barrel wear. Thanks for any responses.
Anecdotal, but after shooting probably 15,000 (maybe more) of the plated pistol bullets, I had a batch of 45acp that were oversized that I had to run through a bullet sizing die (for bullet casting) to get
Them to load correctly.
Since then I check each time I bought them and have noticed the same thing, all of them are a bit oversized. Never caused an issue shooting (other than the aforementioned batch of 230 grain 45acp)
Edit: the plating is pretty soft, as noted by now easy it is to “dent” when you apply a crimp, for both rifle and pistol, so I seriously doubt it would do any additional wear to your guns.
You are correct about the .001 oversize. This is required to promote accuracy. You will find that cast lead bullets will cast out at about .001 in diameter for a given caliber. Cast lead .308" bullets are typically cast and resized to .309" to obtain maximum accuracy. Plated bullets have such a thin plate and the Berry's bullets are Double Struck, meaning that they resize the lead core prior to plating and then resize after copper plating to assure a perfect diameter bullet. These bullets do not need to be resized as they should be used straight out of the box. Jacketed bullets, because of the hard thick jacket on the other hand, need to match the groove diameter of the firearm, or for a .308 groove diameter, a .308 diameter bullet is required, otherwise chamber pressures can reach dangerous levels causing safety concerns for the shooter. As I stated in an earlier post, using Cast Lead Bullet loading data is a good way to develop safe and accurate loads. Think of these bullets as Hard Cast Lead Bullets without gas checks and load accordingly. A great deal of load data for Cast Lead Bullets can be found in the "Lyman Reloading Handbook" and I believe the new 51st Edition is now available and can be purchased online at Lyman's website. As always, Your Mileage May Vary. Happy Reloading/hunting/shooting!
Great content!! You answered a lot of my questions, thanks
Been loading Berry's and getting great results for many years.
When u said rifle bullets limited to 2000 fos, my imnediate thought was "Krag". Hopefully they make a 180 gr or 200 gr 30 cal. I hear good things about the pistol bullets. I will certainly try them when i am able to load. A limit of 1250 should be fine for 158 gr 357 in handguns, and of course 180's are a bit slower. Pistol bullets should be fine for slightly under max loads with 210 gr 41 mag or 240 or heavier 44 mag (assuming Berry's makes them). If they make a 358 rifle bullet, that might do well in my 357 Herrett (or experiment with the pistol bullets to see how much they can take. Holding 30-30 to 2000 fos or less with 150's or 170's might make a pleasant practice load for new shooters or those who are recoil sensitive. Lots of good applications. Thanks for the info.
GREAT INFO, Thanks. Please keep up the good work.
Good information thank you
Very good content, thank you!
I have loaded Berrys in 9mm, 38 Spec and now started 45 ACP. Been very happy, and they are more accurate than I am. I test with chrono and have my state champ friend verify accuracy in my handguns - he gets very good groups😂. No issues with Berry's round nose using Hornady data. I find that with several handguns (Taurus G3c and Springfield XDM 45acp) using XTP COAL with Berry's Hybrid HP results in failing to pass "plunk test" due to the 'fat' profile of the nose. Using Speer Gold Dot published overall length solves the problem since it typically shortens COAL. I either use Speer powder data, or back off XTP powder charge and work up. I do test with chrono, but tend to use light loads anyway. Have used Unique, CFE Pistol and Titegroup. I load 38 Spec roundnose and flatnose at mild target velocities, but haven't tried Berry's for 357 due to velocity and heavier crimp needed.
Very interesting, thank you. What should the crimp look like for a 9 mm bullet?
Have been using 124gn jacket for the last 4 years but am going back to plated due to " supply issues". The supplier is not worth the hassle
I believe that you should use cast hard bullet data. The problem with them is they are very inconsistent on the diameter.
All the TMJ 's i've used, (Namely H P), have failed to expand. I don't like them, however i live in the Woods, so, i don't go to indoor shooting ranges. I enjoy the information you provide in your videos. Still, i only care about Muzzle Energy when it comes to Pistols, hopefully will give me time to get to a rifle.
The latest Lee reloading manual contains quite a lot of plated bullet data now. Good on Lee. Lyman manual (50th edition) not a single plated bullet load.
Love Barry's bullets, Wish they came with PRIMERS
Thank you Gavin..... I do have some plated bullets from Everglades and was wondering what load data I should use...
I've used lots of Berrys bullets, and like the 220 grain 300BO... but have shifted to RMR for most other stuff... as they have quality jacketed bullets for about the same price. In 147 grain 9mm, the RMR bullets are SIGNIFICANTLY more accurate in my guns. As for price, the cheapest I've found Berrys is Powder Valley. RMR comes straight from RMR and they offer free shipping. Would love to see you do some tests with RMR. They also have 'Nuke' hollow points now that work well.
Berry’s 220gr 300 BO bullets have a disclaimer not to exceed 1:7 twist. I bought it for my Sig MCX with 1:5 twist not realizing the limitation and they don’t group at all. At 25 yds I was struggling to even keep it within a 5moa circle. I wish I could use them because they’re so economical but I guess I have to stick with a jacketed bullet.
My question is why are you using such a tight twist?
@@RadDadisRad I think that would be a question for Sig but my guess is they were trying to get 1 full rotation before exiting the barrel on their 5.5” barrel lengths.
Can you also do a video like this for coated bullets like HiTek and Blue Bullets? There is basically no load data for them. Only some cast lead data, and plated… Since coated is even more economical than plated, would be interested to see how those stack up.
I shoot plated .308 bullets using cast bullet data for my model 94 in 30-30. (Red Dot, 700x etc.)
I haven't considered jacket bullet load data.
(Or loads for .308 Win. I use sorted Factory Second jacketed to safe money and still shoot 1000 yard steel targets.
Thanks for the info.
I use plater bullets in my .38 spc , .357 mag , 45/70 and .30 cal carbine . I load according to FMJ specs .
With rifle, I'd skip Berry's altogether and get Speer's TMJ or Gold Dot bullets. They don't have those velocity thresholds, and also are excellent for range and hunting/SD purposes, respectively.
I was wondering about this. Thanks for asking this question for me. BTW, what Chronograph are you using in the video? Great stuff. Keep em Small
Well, maybe they changed something, but for the past 10 years I’ve loaded plated bullets as per Berry’s instructions in their ad in the Dillon “Blue Press”:
“When loading plated bullets we have found best results using LOW to MID-RANGE jacketed data in the load manual. You must use data for a bullet that has the same weight and profile as the one you are loading. Do not exceed _mid-range_ loads.”
Also:
“Velocities depend on the caliber, but as a rule of thumb, we recommend you don’t shoot our plated bullets over 1200 FPS. Our .44s actually shoot best around 1150 FPS. 45s are generally good at 850-900 FPS. Our bullets are NOT recommended for magnum velocities.” I would never try anything close 1850 for a .44 plated bullet.
The .44 bullets I got from Berry’s state 1,400 FPS max velocity. They are 180 grain, so that speed is easily reached. When I run 180 grain XTP bullets (which are plated also) I run them over 1,800 FPS, which I’m told is fine by Hornady.
Hi John, that is a great bullet choice! I don't mean to be contrary, so I am just putting this out for accuracy sake. Page 55 of the "Hornady Handbook of Cartridge Reloading - 11th Edition" describes the XTP/ XTP Mag bullet as "Drawn Gilding Metal Jacket", indicating that this particular bullet and design is jacketed and will therefore allow greater velocities than copper electroplated bullets. Again, I like your choice of bullet! An excellent choice for accuracy and dependability. I use the Berry's bullets (the cheap stuff) for target/plinking, and reserve my Hornady XTP loaded 180gr 357 Magnum cartridges as my "Good Stuff" for mission critical applications such as self-defense. Have a great day!
@@jeffreymccright3542 good info, I had always thought the XTP’s were plated. I use the XTP’s in my .44 and my 10mm.
I wonder why they make rifle bullets in lower weight ranges... I was about to buy a box of 250 130gr .308" just to have a nice plinking load for a gas gun, but going down to 2000fps, I'm really not even sure if it would cycle the bolt.
They've got a 220gr option as well, but in a 1-10" twist barrel I'm not sure they'd even stabilize. Both would probably be fantastic for .300aac or .30-30 plinking loads. Just thinking out loud, lol
Glad I watched this video though as I had 5 boxes in the cart! Better to spend more on a bullet I can actually use than get a "great deal" on bullets I have no use for!
Thanks
Could you test poly coated lead bullets such as acme or similar. Enjoy your vids.
At 6:30 your 45load data has a lot of variation in the powder charge. Your minimum was 685ft/s while your max was 835ft/s . Thats 150ft/s extreme spread. Check your powder dropper lol
Does any reloader remember '80s - '90s Remington's Power Lokt Hollow Point (PLHP) .224" 52 gr bullets??.. As far as I know, those little guys were actually plated, (Copper or brass plated??. IDK). In fact, I used to load those, from .223 / 5.56, thru .22- 250 & up to .220 Swift, from 2.950 fps, up to 3.500+ fps. NO jacket separation whatsoever. Actually, I still keep a couple houndred. Pretty decent groups & terminal ballistics.
Can we use copper plated hollow point reloaded ammunition for hunting? I am not including the Berrys Hybrid in my question.
I've reloaded and shot probably close to 100k rounds of Berry's...hands down my favorite round for reloads. But i have NEVER heard about the velocity issue. I've talked to Berry's several times about reload data and wasnt pointed toward velocity. Awesome info Gavin. I just wish i knew this before i just received my order of 20K rounds of 5.56 rounds. So from what i heard, as long as its not key holed or brass specks around the bullet on a paper target, im good to press above 2000fps...I just did a whole work up using that bullet and we were around 2990 fps with our chosen load. I was about to load them all up, but now i think i need to go back to 30 feet and check. No key holes at 100M, acceptable group size...am i good to go?
An interesting comparison would be Plated vs Hi Tek coated bullets