Yes they did. But AOF wasn't one of them. The other 3 England props looked way better to my eye. AOF was small, slow, and entirely unimpressive. What do others see that I don't?
Excellent analysis. I'm fed up of people knocking the England team. Everyone has an opinion of who should be playing but SB's is the one that counts and he's developing it his way. Good on him.
Oh shut up. He can only beat poor teams or teams ranked below us. He has a 44% win rate, yet we have the most resources. He deserves to be called out. Grow a spine
Don’t need to play Curry with his head injury; I’m certain he’s ok and would be fine were it SA or NZ but not Japan. Would love to see Ted Hill play with CCS on the bench. Would also love to see Tom Willis at 8 too. AOF at tight head is brilliant.
So he'd be fine for SA or NZ, but not Japan? England desperately need to win, win convincingly and leave nothing to chance. They don't have luxuries of second-choices anymore.
@SolarMumuns health protocols are focused around immediate issue prevention. They haven't got the length of data yet to determine long term effects. I'd get the decision if it was a must win game but it's an easy friendly with eager young players waiting in the wings. There's just no point
It's an uninspiring selection given the situation England are in. Why not bring more of the wider squad in, eg Ted Hill, Theo Dan, Northmore? It's a no-win for some of his other selections, other than to simply get the game done with and move on...What's a good result against Japan...? 40 points victory..?
What people are forgetting is this is now a must win game. If England had beaten any of the big teams this autumn, the cost of a defeat to Japan would be much lower. But Borthwick cannot risk losing or getting close to losing this match so he has picked arguably his A-team. On top of that, we mustn't forget the rivalry between Borthwick and Eddie Jones. They go back a long way and they will both be desperate to win with Jones likely to throw a few curveballs. All the more reason to have your A-team out there.
Disagree that the back row looks awesome. They're all good players but playing three 7s feels very unbalanced. Agree that Curry should not be playing regardless of return to play protocols.
They are playing Japan who play mad quick, so they need a super fast jacking back row. The three of them are all incredible tacklers and potent in attack. I'd say it's pretty awesome on paper. Famous last words!😂
Do feel it’s a win win regards Englands full back. Freddie has his strength in the air and no little experience. He’s still young and can improve his overall game particularly defending with better positional play which will obviously come with more caps. Furbank as well can improve his game as he plays more times foe England and already he’s a fine attacking player.
Fresh blood! Exactly the issue that faces England. The prem is over 1/3 full of overseas Irish Scottish and Welsh players. Meanwhile positions like TH, No8 SH IC the strength in depth is poor, and many of those positions are dominated by players who can never play for England! It’s time the prem was full of players that will enhance the national team, not a training ground or pension pot for players that can never play for England!
Uninspiring selections as expected to be honest because it’s SB! How on earth has JVP been retained at scrum-half? He’s never had a great game for England. Very unfair on Harry Randall as this game would have really suited his game! Fed up with England not having an inspiring coach tbh!
I seem to recall Japan starting at blistering pace and ruck speed against us recently and England had to rely on some good fortune and refereeing 50/50 favours to keep the line intact. I really dont see us losing but SB has coached us to losses to Fiji, struggling victories over Samoa and Tonga and of course we are 5 losses on the bounce (albeit against much tougher opposition). We have to make a statement win to salvage anything from the Autumn. As for Curry, well this is just irresponsible from a welfare perspective and a huge missed opportunity to see Hill get a shot.
It just shows a lack of inspiration again. What does it matter if we lose, isn’t it better to blood younger players to start and leave the experience to come off the bench. Curry should never be considered and his long term health should be priority. It seems the ghost of Eddie Jones is still a worry for England.
In a word boring. Concussion aside does Curry's form warrant his place? Will he get back to the player he was? Borthwick clearly has his favourites-JvP was poor last week but what do you expect when he's thrown back in? Spencer probably will find himself in the international wilderness now despite England being ahead both times he was hooked. Ted Hill is rapid and you're retaining a lineout option. Can we really not look at someone else at centre? What if Slade or Lawrence are injured for the 6N? Bench at least looks more impactful. Dombrandt is a bit of a luxury player, he starts or doesn't feature and I don't think his skill set really is suited to the international game. He could yet add to his game but he's approaching 30.
This is the game Dombrandt should have started in. He is no use off the bench as he is not an impact player and they won't risk starting him against a top team because they have the fear. Same with Isiekwe tbh. England are stuck with having second best starters on the Bench as if the bomb squad or Eddies finnishers never happened.
Why not have a look at Ted Hill instead of Curry? Re Dombrandt, he either should start or not at all and like Zack Mercer, Im not convinced he fits how England want to play.
3 opensides (1 of suspect fitness following recent concussions) in the back-row and 2 blindside lineout specialists in the bench. No no.8. Combined age of hookers, 65, with replacement carrying a (permanent?) injury to neck/right arm. Captain to be replaced after 50/55 minutes. Fast opposition; fast back-row; fast back 3; s - l - o - w scrum half. At least AO-F is recognised as a tighthead (I know whose judgement I trust more between national set up and Alex S!). I don't think I can be bothered to watch (on TV).
This team is a real sign of a desperate man. I think it should be clear that England can’t win with Marcus smith at 10 , to win England need Fin Smith, Marcus has lost every game he’s played at 10 and its not a coincidence and until England realise this they will continue to lose. Marcus would be better as a sub 10.
No chance lol, Fin has been mediocre every time he’s played for England because he’s not ready yet. Marcus Smith was pretty much the only player offering anything in attack and has been our best player this autumn. We lost to NZ because of a missed tackle on telea, a missed pen by Ford, and a bad pass by Randall making the DG impossible. We lost to Australia because Slade darted out of the line too early and left a massive gap on the wing. We lost to the Boks because Luke Cowan-Dickie threw a dummy throw and then off the free kick we knocked it on again and lost all momentum. In all cases, the only reason we even had that chance to win was because Smith got us there.
@ you think you only lose games at the end of games, that’s not you losing that’s the other team winning. Marcus has been 10 for the last 5 games and England have lost , that’s not a coincidence, losing is not about bad luck it’s about how a team plays, Marcus doesn’t play with a team he plays with one or two individuals. He is the lowest passing 10 in international rugby against NZ he passed 7 times. Stats don’t lie Marcus at international level has an appalling record. But hey they’ll win today against weak opposition and he will be flavour of the month. He’s a great player but not for England and the way they want to play.
Stewart playing fullback didn't exactly go well against the boks , and in my opinion was a complete waste of time . Dropped how many high balls and was side stepped a couple of times once again
Quite a few players showed their quality in the England A game against Aus A. It's disappointing not to see a few more of them included against Japan.
Yes they did. But AOF wasn't one of them. The other 3 England props looked way better to my eye. AOF was small, slow, and entirely unimpressive. What do others see that I don't?
Excellent analysis. I'm fed up of people knocking the England team. Everyone has an opinion of who should be playing but SB's is the one that counts and he's developing it his way. Good on him.
Oh shut up. He can only beat poor teams or teams ranked below us. He has a 44% win rate, yet we have the most resources. He deserves to be called out. Grow a spine
Don’t need to play Curry with his head injury; I’m certain he’s ok and would be fine were it SA or NZ but not Japan. Would love to see Ted Hill play with CCS on the bench. Would also love to see Tom Willis at 8 too.
AOF at tight head is brilliant.
So he'd be fine for SA or NZ, but not Japan? England desperately need to win, win convincingly and leave nothing to chance. They don't have luxuries of second-choices anymore.
For me they're sacrificing Curry's future health to give him a throw away cap, seems madness and irresponsible
He has passed all of the health protocols though...
@SolarMumuns health protocols are focused around immediate issue prevention. They haven't got the length of data yet to determine long term effects. I'd get the decision if it was a must win game but it's an easy friendly with eager young players waiting in the wings. There's just no point
It's an uninspiring selection given the situation England are in. Why not bring more of the wider squad in, eg Ted Hill, Theo Dan, Northmore? It's a no-win for some of his other selections, other than to simply get the game done with and move on...What's a good result against Japan...? 40 points victory..?
Why not Willis and Hill ??
What people are forgetting is this is now a must win game. If England had beaten any of the big teams this autumn, the cost of a defeat to Japan would be much lower. But Borthwick cannot risk losing or getting close to losing this match so he has picked arguably his A-team. On top of that, we mustn't forget the rivalry between Borthwick and Eddie Jones. They go back a long way and they will both be desperate to win with Jones likely to throw a few curveballs. All the more reason to have your A-team out there.
Disagree that the back row looks awesome. They're all good players but playing three 7s feels very unbalanced.
Agree that Curry should not be playing regardless of return to play protocols.
They are playing Japan who play mad quick, so they need a super fast jacking back row. The three of them are all incredible tacklers and potent in attack. I'd say it's pretty awesome on paper. Famous last words!😂
Do feel it’s a win win regards Englands full back. Freddie has his strength in the air and no little experience. He’s still young and can improve his overall game particularly defending with better positional play which will obviously come with more caps. Furbank as well can improve his game as he plays more times foe England and already he’s a fine attacking player.
Fresh blood! Exactly the issue that faces England. The prem is over 1/3 full of overseas Irish Scottish and Welsh players. Meanwhile positions like TH, No8 SH IC the strength in depth is poor, and many of those positions are dominated by players who can never play for England! It’s time the prem was full of players that will enhance the national team, not a training ground or pension pot for players that can never play for England!
Uninspiring selections as expected to be honest because it’s SB! How on earth has JVP been retained at scrum-half? He’s never had a great game for England. Very unfair on Harry Randall as this game would have really suited his game! Fed up with England not having an inspiring coach tbh!
Possibly the solution is to have Furbank as 15 and Steward on the wing. Steward can marshall the high kicks and Furbank can be the second playmaker
I seem to recall Japan starting at blistering pace and ruck speed against us recently and England had to rely on some good fortune and refereeing 50/50 favours to keep the line intact. I really dont see us losing but SB has coached us to losses to Fiji, struggling victories over Samoa and Tonga and of course we are 5 losses on the bounce (albeit against much tougher opposition). We have to make a statement win to salvage anything from the Autumn. As for Curry, well this is just irresponsible from a welfare perspective and a huge missed opportunity to see Hill get a shot.
It just shows a lack of inspiration again. What does it matter if we lose, isn’t it better to blood younger players to start and leave the experience to come off the bench. Curry should never be considered and his long term health should be priority. It seems the ghost of Eddie Jones is still a worry for England.
I’m done with Borewick
In a word boring. Concussion aside does Curry's form warrant his place? Will he get back to the player he was?
Borthwick clearly has his favourites-JvP was poor last week but what do you expect when he's thrown back in? Spencer probably will find himself in the international wilderness now despite England being ahead both times he was hooked. Ted Hill is rapid and you're retaining a lineout option.
Can we really not look at someone else at centre? What if Slade or Lawrence are injured for the 6N? Bench at least looks more impactful. Dombrandt is a bit of a luxury player, he starts or doesn't feature and I don't think his skill set really is suited to the international game. He could yet add to his game but he's approaching 30.
This is the game Dombrandt should have started in. He is no use off the bench as he is not an impact player and they won't risk starting him against a top team because they have the fear. Same with Isiekwe tbh. England are stuck with having second best starters on the Bench as if the bomb squad or Eddies finnishers never happened.
Started ? , shouldn't even be selected .
@clayton8944 if he doesn't start he shouldn't be selected. Selecting him but not starting him is doubling down...
Why not have a look at Ted Hill instead of Curry? Re Dombrandt, he either should start or not at all and like Zack Mercer, Im not convinced he fits how England want to play.
Borewick is all about saving his job. So many decent players ignored, past it players retained etc etc etc. Another wasted opportunity.
3 opensides (1 of suspect fitness following recent concussions) in the back-row and 2 blindside lineout specialists in the bench. No no.8. Combined age of hookers, 65, with replacement carrying a (permanent?) injury to neck/right arm. Captain to be replaced after 50/55 minutes. Fast opposition; fast back-row; fast back 3; s - l - o - w scrum half. At least AO-F is recognised as a tighthead (I know whose judgement I trust more between national set up and Alex S!).
I don't think I can be bothered to watch (on TV).
Disappointed
Lack of line out in the back row
Know wonder players leave England and go play in france.
This team is a real sign of a desperate man. I think it should be clear that England can’t win with Marcus smith at 10 , to win England need Fin Smith, Marcus has lost every game he’s played at 10 and its not a coincidence and until England realise this they will continue to lose. Marcus would be better as a sub 10.
No chance lol, Fin has been mediocre every time he’s played for England because he’s not ready yet. Marcus Smith was pretty much the only player offering anything in attack and has been our best player this autumn. We lost to NZ because of a missed tackle on telea, a missed pen by Ford, and a bad pass by Randall making the DG impossible. We lost to Australia because Slade darted out of the line too early and left a massive gap on the wing. We lost to the Boks because Luke Cowan-Dickie threw a dummy throw and then off the free kick we knocked it on again and lost all momentum. In all cases, the only reason we even had that chance to win was because Smith got us there.
@ you think you only lose games at the end of games, that’s not you losing that’s the other team winning. Marcus has been 10 for the last 5 games and England have lost , that’s not a coincidence, losing is not about bad luck it’s about how a team plays, Marcus doesn’t play with a team he plays with one or two individuals. He is the lowest passing 10 in international rugby against NZ he passed 7 times. Stats don’t lie Marcus at international level has an appalling record. But hey they’ll win today against weak opposition and he will be flavour of the month. He’s a great player but not for England and the way they want to play.
@@RhydderchApRheged-rh7sj look at Ford and Slade closer weak links?
You are being way too diplomatic. Borthwick needs to be stood up for his lack of vision and planning. He picks teams like a scared rabbit
Stewart playing fullback didn't exactly go well against the boks , and in my opinion was a complete waste of time . Dropped how many high balls and was side stepped a couple of times once again
still not making any depth to the squad