The final joke of the video about Darrow as a farmboy killed me lmao. Rn I am a finishing Morningstar, and I would be lying if I said your channel didnt entice me to finish the books a bit faster than usual. Always love to grab a beer and listen to the reviews right after finishing one of them.
No one hates Tom Bombadil as a character, they hate how the already slow plot stops to introduce a character that is completely irrelevant to the rest of the book.
I couldn't get past that section. Later, as an adult, I attempted Fellowship again, having enjoyed the movies. "Why all the bloody singing." I cried. Then, I started the audio book read by Andy Serkis. Surely, the Serkis will get me through. No. The book is still a little dull. And Tom's bit is singing by Andy Serkis. It's annoying as hell. I eventually finished. His character is pointless.
@@spilchsaysstuff1427i skip spngs amd tom. Inly time the bring it up is to say he cant be arsed to help them. It is more than nothing it actually hurts the plot
The world is bigger than the main story, that is the whole point. Not everything has to matter for the plot, thats why the world feels so alive. Why are people in such a hurry for books to end? Just enjoy the storie
Loved this discussion because of the friendly dynamics in the disagreement and the thoughtful opinions from everyone! I didn't know about these guys but I was immediately sold when he said "the movies are going for the opposite tone that the books try for" with regards to LOTR and TB. Well-observed! So while I didn't agree with everything, loved how hard everyone tried to defend their own points and you all let each other speak!
Cosmere is literally the MCU of fantasy books, in a lot of ways. From how series and characters connect to how immensely fun but far from a literary masterpiece it is.
Scenes that focus on characters and relationships are actually much better than the main plot for me more often than not. I think that's where a lot of modern epic fantasy loses me. They have the action, magic and plot, but they don't have the heart, soul, emotion and characters I can grow attached to.
If you haven't read it already, definitely go for The Realm of the Elderlings by Robin Hobb. It's characterwork and emotional depth are unparalelled imo. Make sure you have some tissues though.
@@CallmeJochem Totally agree. The modern fantasy I tend to enjoy most is the grimdark stuff. Not necessarily because they’re darker, but because they have a higher focus on character development, high stakes emotions and complex psychological stuff.
Rothfuss weekly round-up: “Hi all, wrote nothing new. Rewrote the whole book for the 10,000th time. I owe you nothing. Be patient till next week’s update where I give you nothing and please don’t ask in between updates.”
Tom Bombadil perfectly fits the tone and texture of the books. Every life-threatening section of the books is followed by something life affirming. From the beginning, the first encounter with the Black Riders is followed by a stay at the farmers house. After the trip through the Old Forest, they meet and stay with Tom Bombadil. After the encounter with the barrow-wights, they spend time singing and drinking at the inn in Bree. After their encounter with the Black Riders, they spend a long time at Rivendell. Etc. Even in Mordor, Frodo and Sam get a break when they spend time with Faramir in Henneth Annun. The movies go for a much more consistently grim tone. You really only get moments of joy and simple relaxation at the very beginning and end, whereas the books have those moments included throughout. In part, I think this is because the movies establish a faster pace. The movies feel like the events are taking place over the span of weeks. The books make it clear this takes place over the course of a year.
Don't expect fantasy readers nowadays like something that is there for reasons other than plot development. Booktube is full of booktubers who just focus on plot, and don't analyse anything else.
I agree with Sanderson being overrated. He bores me. Too reliable on plot, not skilled as a writer. ASOIAF was already finished by other authora and we all know what happened. I'd rather have it unfinished, just in case.
I understand the desire for a nice background when you're filming, but many booktubers' bookshelves have begun to look the same with similar titles and matchy-matchy editions. It's getting a little boring. My mismatched bookshelves are filled with new books and thrift store books and it feels so cozy and personalized to me. 📚💚😊
I've never "designed" my bookshelves like that, because I don't have a "book fetish". I just read, and keep my old paperback editions bc they were the ones I enjoyed. I've seen bookshelves with nice colours, all red books together, all green ones, etc. Undecorated, undesigned bookshelves are more attractive to me, as were my uni teacher's shelves, so stacked with books that no space was left.
@@ernstbrehm1135the final empire was ok. I agree. Book two of the series is much better. And Stormlight archive is so much better. The endings are some of the best fantasy I’ve ever read.
Same. I personally liked Final Empire, but overall Mistborn for me was disappointing. I really like Stormlight though, but as you I don't get why he's almost being labelled as the best writer in fantasy. I suppose it's just because you see him releasing a book a year, while Martin for example has been stuck for a decade. But then they don't look at the quality of Sanderson's books compared to Martin's. Same could be said of Rothfuss, or Tolkien, who had a lifetime to publish books, but there's only so few books he did publish, because he wanted excellency. Sanderson idk, he's good, just not nowhere near the best. Definitely overhyped
@@Fenix-lr6ezI think some people (myself included) don't actually care all that much about things like prose, and prefer simpler, straightforward reads and consistency. No offense but I'm actually not a big fan of the way Martin writes. When he describes things like knights showing up for a tourney he tends to do the "and and and" thing a lot, which makes it feel intentionally historical/biblical which I personally don't enjoy. I'd also rather get something "ok" and know I'm getting it over something that's a "masterpiece" but have to wait decades for, or worry we'll never get the conclusion. I have major doubts that either Winds of Winter or Door of Stone will actually receive the praise or will be worth the long waits for them. Maybe that's my own literary hot take.
I have read the first two books of mistborn and I have the 4 books of stormlight archive and I prefer stormlight better because I couldn’t relate or like any character from mistborn
I read the first 4 stormlight books in under a week. I literally couldn’t put them down and it was my first fantasy series since some YA books in elementary school.
How you talk about Red Rising is how I feel about Mistborn. I've read the first two books and they both got 4 stars but everyone talks about it as it it's one of the greatest fantasy series of all time and I was just... where? Are you reading different books from me? My expectations were really high so I ended up disappointed.
So so true. Mist born was a snooze fest. Everyone I know hyped it up, and I’m just like “you killed off the beat character and kept the most annoying” his female characters are all the same
@@cjdflkjthat’s Mistborn book one. Book two is way better. You’ll find out why Kel had to die. It sets up the story. Vin is a tomboy. Shallan is a prissy split personality. Jasnah is hard core. Navani is a patient scholar who doubts herself. I didn’t get that experience from his female characters. Even lift, she’s totally unique from the others.
Had the exact same experience with mistborn. I think his writing improves a lot bc stormlight came out after he finished wheel of time. So he picked up a lot in Robert Jordan’s notes plus I think the characters are a lot better written
I agree about Narnia. I don’t love it as much now, but when I read it in 3rd or 4th grade, I absolutely loved it! I’m a Christian as well, but I think I prefer more vague and indirect allegories in my fiction.
Sanderson puts me to sleep. Talk about slogs. Why do people forgive him for this? It’s like no one edits. The Way of Kings was great, but every follow up puts me to sleep. If he cut 1/2 to 2/3 of the books out, he would have a decent story.
He is like a freight train relentlessly chugging out words upon words. He repeats the same concepts and ideas immediately and throughout the conversational dialogue. It’s like the old-school TV soap operas-lots of talking, but not much ever happens. He needs a better editor. Good writing needs content generation and also needs editing, condensing, and many more revisions than Sanderson and his editors do. It’s like reading never-ending grocery lists for a family of 8.
That’s exactly my feeling too. Sanderesons concept of the story is excellent but we don’t need to rehash Kallidin’s depression in every book for 1000’s of pages or Shallons split personality over and over. We got it it the first 2,000 pages . Can’t we move on? Of course some Sanderson fan will say “journey before destination “ or the Sanderlanche is worth it. But that means you are agreeing that the main body of the story is a slog.
Sanderson isn't over rated he just isnt epic fantasy tho in the league of tolkein hobb martin and those who bring a world with a story that you just see lore and lose yourself in it. he tells to much rather than show. this allows people that are not use to fantasy to follow and not be over whelmed and enjoyed. Storm light is trying and being a bit more grander but the more books that come out the more he pulls back and recaps so it is feeling less and less this is that grand fantasy world because he goes back to explaining. half of mistborn elantris warbreaker focuses on and telling us the rules like we don't get it is fantasy, that it is that world stop telling us how it is different from our own just tell the story.
I can definitely see where you're coming from, but I think a really essential point is (especially with Stormlight Archive) is that the world is at a huge changing point and characters are discovering a lot of new stuff (the surges, bonds, Odium, etc). Those things are new to us as well as to the audience so it has to be explained. While in the series you mentioned there isn't something totally new for the world that is happening, so it feels more of an established world.
That “explaining” is Sanderson’s bread and butter. His descriptions and intricate magic systems are what he’s known for, and his biggest strength IMO. The level of detail, consistency and complexity with his magic (and overall worldbuilding) is insane.
First off, Tom Bombadil is amazing. Period. Secondly, in addition to the movie poster cupboard being banned the "Now an [insert streaming service] original series" sticker should be banned as well! I hated them when they were *actually* stickers and now they had the *audacity* to PRINT them directly on the covers! Books 10, 12, and 13 of Wheel of Time on my book shelf will forever be marred by Amazon.
Stormlight was actually the second fantasy series to read after ASOIAF so I guess you can say I dove into the deep end. I really don’t know if I am weird or it’s just not true to say that beginners shouldn’t read epic fantasy
Me too actually. My best friend was reading ASOIAF, and he convinced me to read as well. We loved it so much that we were watching theory videos together when we were hanging out. When we were done, we discussed what to read next and we settled on stormlight. I loved it so much that I got through TWOK and WOR (that's all that was out) in 9-10 days.
Sanderson maybe just wants to create a large quantity of works rather than torture a page for style reasons and I'm totally cool with that - his writing is not bad at all and the Cosmere as a whole could go well into the 2040s and beyond, so yeah. Buuut the last Wax and Wayne book and Triss were both grating at times because the humor isn't working for me and they were both going out of their way to try to be funny. And he's just generally not particularly funny, but he does try. I find it pathetically generic humor, maybe a pun. Like a Mormon committee was tasked with generating jokes. Wayne and Lift as characters are a bit of a copy and paste of each other, with Wayne turned up to 20 in the last book it was just...not funny to me. I'm not sure if Wayne is supposed to be mentally ill in that way exactly, but Lift kinda is and is generally pretty funny, plays well off her voidbringer, etc. Perhaps Brandon's greatest and only success in humor actually, that running voidbringer joke. Wayne not so much, just annoying, exhausting, childish. I hope he works on that, but it's probably a huge PITA to be funny. On a side note the next audiobook I started after listening to Triss was a Hitler biography that I had no idea was narrated by Kramer, it worked a lot better with him describing Nazi atrocities than a teenage girls fairy tale.
I love his humor! But then again, I have a soft spot for witty humor and dad-joke level puns. I find it wholesome and silly, which I enjoy most of the time.
Nah, Sanderson is not overrated. He is well loved by his fans (as he should) due to his enormous dedication and engagement. If he were overrated he would be constantly nominated to things like Hugos and Nebulas and appearing in lists of the best fantasy writers ever. He won a Hugo for The Emperor’s Soul (totally deserved) but I don’t think the rest of his oeuvre is at a technical level to be earning prizes like that
Steven Erikson could finish GRRM’s book. As simple as that. He is famous for being able to write as other writers and he is (let’s be on hot take) better than him creating worlds by far and that kind of politics.
IMO, Brandon Sanderson is definitely overrated. He's very good, but none of his books have the characters, plot or grandoise of works such as Lord of the Rings, ASOIAF, or the Name of the Wind, among others. The fact that he releases books very often in a time when fandoms are thoroughly disappointed in the slowness of the writers of the previously mentioned books, Rothfuss and Martin, makes the fantasy fandom value him a lot more, I guess. To the point he's being overly deified, almost. His books are good (very good in Stomlight's case imo), but can't compare to other sagas.
I've never dove into the cult of Sanderson that deep. But he does appear to be the fast food of fantasy. Don't get me wrong, I love a whopper now and again. But I'm not gonna big it up. As for his exposure. I think an author should be invisible; not a celebrity. The star is the novel.
@@spilchsaysstuff1427 to compare him to fast food seems unfair to me. I'd rather say he's a one-star cook because he's pretty good at what he does, but to get another star (or two) he would need to refine his art in a way he probably doesn't even want to, especially because he for sure makes more money with what he's doing right now.
@@spilchsaysstuff1427 he's not fast food, cause his work is top-notch. Especially Stormlight, that's incredible. But they don't stand against other books like LOTR or any of the ASOIAF. But to say he's the fast-food would mean he produces only a lot of 5/10 books, while the truth is he normally produces 7-8/10 books with the occasional 9/10. But he never reaches above that, and the fandom makes him look like he has the writing of Tolkien and Martin but with releasing a book a year, which is just not true
@Fenix-lr6ez It all depends on your opinion of fast food. When I'm in the mood, there's nothing like a whopper with fries. Just hits the spot. But like the Marvel movies, it serves a purpose that is fleeting and doesn't enrich the soul. Not mine anyway. Sanderson is great at what he does. No one can take that away from him. Especially an insignicant speck like me . But Tom Bombadil. Don't get me started.
@@spilchsaysstuff1427 To me, his work *does* enrich me and make me think, more than some other fantasy authors I’ve read. I see elements of myself in his characters and in his overall writing style. And lines like “the most important step a man can take is the next step” have really stuck with me. His, admittedly almost YAish writing just isn’t enough to get in the way of his themes, characters, and worlds for me. And I’m an English major in college right now.
Sanderson CAN write well, but more recent entries have sometimes devolved into reading like a Marvel script. Oathbringer's last act being a notable offender
Why Tommy b works in the books and not the movies is that the movies are an action franchise and the books are a more episodic whimsical camping adventure journey.
I agree with wanting to see A Song of Ice and Fire concluded. Sanderson did great for Wheel of Time, but he isn’t the right fit. For ASOIAF, I think Joe Abercrombie is the guy
I honestly dont think Sanderson gets enough credit for his imagination. Or how valuable it is. Obviously he's popular, but I genuinely don't see anyone with the same amount of creative ideas.
I gave up on wheel of time after the forth book. Just couldn't get behind how annoying a lot of the characters were/are especially the female protagonists. Should I give it another shot?
The Cosmere universe felt very tacky and repressed. It felt like it was written for teens, which is fine. But it's not this high fantasy god tier content that everyone seems to worship it for.
Of course he is overrated. How can anyone say "he may not be on the same level of Robin Hobb" and then continue arguing he's not overrated? Sanderson in literature is the same what MCU is in cinema. Popular amusement park in which all rides have the same formula. Sure, you change costumes and environment, pretend you're here and there, music is loud, effects are expensive and shiny, but in the end, program is the same. In 10 books I have read from him, there was little to no substance to his allegory, he never changes his prose (in which he is at best at an entry level), he copy/pastes all his female characters (Jasnah, Shallan, Vivenna, Siri, Sarene), as well as henchmen characters (Teft, Galadon, Lopen), as well as world building for which he is often praised (he squeezes worldbuilding from Elantris all over his Cosmere Universe (goodnes gracious even that is copied from MCU)). Magic system is interesting. But for a child so is any "make belief" game he comes up on the spot while playing.
If you have seen his writing course, he literally says he does not believe in or do world-building. He believes, and teaches, that it's a waste of time.
yeah I'm not following your cult leader as I'm sure you do so that I should waste my time listening to another bullshit he's saying. If he truly said what you typed, then he doesn't know what he's even talking about.
I kind of disagree with you on mismatched shelves, I love having an eclectic mix of books. It feels a lot more cozy and lived in. However, it does depend on the books a little. For example, I don't keep matching sets of classics, they can all be their own thing, in fact I vastly prefer that. With something like Discworld where the books are related but many also can be read alone, I am not that concerned either way. But for a more contained linear series, I want them to match. I often have a mix of hardcover and paperback, just depending on what was available, that's ok, but the artwork needs to match. I don't want Fellowship of the Ring in one style and Return of the King in another.
@@arthurhaag9434 Overly long, Wide but shallow worldbuilding, extremely prude in regard to sex but indulges in violence, “Keeping faith in a time of modernization” has been done longer and better by other authors.
@@matcauthon9669I agree with wide but shallow world building. All of mistborn took place in essentially 3/4 locations, no real travelling portions, you only hear of the wider politics you don’t experience it.
I don’t understand the red rising is meh stuff personally. Im not a sci-fi guy and have always preferred fantasy as a genre that being said Brown is a great author and red rising is some of the best stuff I’ve read this year, the only book I enjoyed more than Dark Age and Golden Son was literally Dune which in my opinion is a perfect book so that’s high praise. I started RR because Rythm of War for me was really burning me out on Sanderson and it’s been a total slog. I’ve now gotten to Lightbringer and I think this is seriously a top 10 series for me personally. I get not everyone has the same preferences and that’s fine but I seriously can’t agree with RE being meh. Not a single book in my opinion goes blow a 7 (can’t say the same for Sanderson. ) So in summary totally disagree with the RR statement and super hot take i think currently Red rising is a more enjoyable series than Stormlight archive which was the series that got me back into fantasy and reading
People are living to 100 nowadays! She just finished her 11 book series War of Light and Shadow. I think she could handle 2 more books. GRRM should ask her to collaborate just like Raymond Feist did.
I think the problem with Sanderson's writing is that he's writing too fast and that always translates into a lesser level of quality. Now I'll absolutely give him props for being consistent on a level a lot of other very popular authors never reach, but when I think of brilliantly written fantasy, Sanderson basically never comes up in that inner monologue. Now there's a lot of authors I really like to read that aren't even as good as he is, so I won't hold that against him, but contrary to most of those other authors, I think he could be way better than he already is if he wanted to. And I'm pretty sure that this is a sacrifice he willingly made for sake of greater monetary success. So while I would agree that he could be one of the goats of modern fantasy if he wanted to, saying that he already is is, in my opinion, an overstatement. And that makes him, yes, overrated.
Yeah. I kinda think of him as the Dean Koontz of fantasy. Great ideas and very prolific career, but the actual execution of his books is often very shallow, unpolished and leaving a lot to be desired.
I really do disagree with this statement. First, I think that Stormlight is some of the best work in modern fantasy and is revolutionizing the genre with more hard magic systems, but I also think that Sanderson consistently puts out great books. Let's mention the Secret Projects, which he wrote during the pandemic (quite a short period for writing multiple extra books). They turned out great, especially SP1 and SP3 were amazing. They were creative, experimental in style for Sanderson and had great characterisation and plot. He also shows he can take his time when he needs to, as he decided to delay Stormlight 5 for a year.
@@CallmeJochem Again, I'm by no way saying he isn't very good consistently. The rest we might just have to disagree about because I could probably rattle off 20 names of authors I think have been better writers AND have actually written better stuff just in the last five years.
Yep. Yep. Yep. Yep. Skyward = coward, cowardice, M-bot, Jerkface Starsight = Alanik, eyes, delver, “My My” Winzil, Cuna, humans Cytonic = pirates, delvers, Chet Defiant = to fight or not to fight and why?, angst, tie everything in a neat little bow. The end.
These videos are so fun! Also gives us a chance to discover new booktubers! And I absolutely agree with an early comment in the video - I can't stand dream sequences. I skip over them immediately if I'm reading something that I know won't integrate them into the plot. They're fine in most Harry Potter cases, where he's witnessing actual events, or in a film like Inception, which wouldn't exist without them. Otherwise, no thanks, don't care, move on, please.
Totally agree. I DNF'd Words of Radiance. I guess he's good for people just coming into fantasy but I suspect hell be a flash in the pan once you start reading other stuff.
Really, he may not be for you, but I came into Sanderson's books pretty late in my fantasy reading and I enjoyed his work quite a bit. I don't claim that he's the greatest author to ever exist. But his books are good for what they are.
i feel that a book series being written by a different author or approved by somebody other than the original author. is fanfiction. incredibly well done fan fiction mind you. but robert jordans wife approved Sanderson to finish the books based off his notes. its not Jordans vision but a fanfiction as cloae as you can get. like Berserk is my favorite manga. and the passing of Kentaru miura was a tragedy. and even though Koji Mori is doing a great job so far. i read it as a best friend who inspired the main villian. honors his childhood friend
I don't mind slow burn if it builds out the ideas and themes of the book. If building out the ideas and themes means world building and character development, that sounds good. If it's just getting to know the characters "as people" and traveling around the world like tourists, I don't need that.
Have not yet watched the vid so i am just comenting based on the title Brandon sanderson is overrated in my opinion Does not mean i dont like the guy i think he is a good writer and also a very good person but nothing speaciale When i got back into reading i started reading brandpn because everyone was talking about him So i started with mistobr Loved the forst book still to this day zhe second was me and stopped 50 pages in the thrid ( need to finish it because i dont dnf books ) but i did not enjoy it Now i have over 600 books in my library and have read many writers i found out i dont really like sanderson like others do. I find his work ho estly boring compared to others authors i read I love grim dark now so he is not my main taste but i read everything and books similare to his i think are better His magic systems are amazing and he does write fast but in my mind he is overrated because everyone keeps talking about him and praising him Brandon is like the godfather movies to me I hated the godfather movies but people keep praising the movies and i know many who secretly hate the movies or thought they were boring but because everyone praises them so should they because of fear of rejection from their group In short brandon good writer great human being but after reading many books i do t think he should be getting this amount of praise Alot yes but this muvh Also to the commentore that said the cosmere is like the mcu Well the mcu now sucks and also the mcu had bad movies in the begining like iron man 2 thor 2 ant man guatdins of the galaxy 2 ( baby grout was the only good thing) only the captain america franchise was amazing from start to finish
My take on the wheel of time, and i hope it offends no one, is that it could be finished by another author BECAUSE of how generic and poorly made it was. Same for Sanderson as a whole. It supports the first hot take on fantasy being for entertainment without brains.
His wheel of time editions saved the series, books 6 through 10 totally fell off and he came in and saved it. Mistborn book one was good, but it’s basically oceans 11, but book 2 of Mistborn was awesome. Book 3 was solid too.
Thanks so much for having us on! Super fun time 🤠
The final joke of the video about Darrow as a farmboy killed me lmao. Rn I am a finishing Morningstar, and I would be lying if I said your channel didnt entice me to finish the books a bit faster than usual. Always love to grab a beer and listen to the reviews right after finishing one of them.
I’m here for you guys! 2toramble! And for Red Rising!
Whoever talks crap about OUR red rising should be banned from UA-cam 😅
@@Ruben86jz😂👊
@@720pchannellol - cheers and thanks for listening to us ramble!
No one hates Tom Bombadil as a character, they hate how the already slow plot stops to introduce a character that is completely irrelevant to the rest of the book.
sometimes i hate him as a character
I couldn't get past that section. Later, as an adult, I attempted Fellowship again, having enjoyed the movies. "Why all the bloody singing." I cried. Then, I started the audio book read by Andy Serkis. Surely, the Serkis will get me through. No. The book is still a little dull. And Tom's bit is singing by Andy Serkis. It's annoying as hell. I eventually finished. His character is pointless.
Inddeeed 😂
@@spilchsaysstuff1427i skip spngs amd tom. Inly time the bring it up is to say he cant be arsed to help them. It is more than nothing it actually hurts the plot
The world is bigger than the main story, that is the whole point. Not everything has to matter for the plot, thats why the world feels so alive. Why are people in such a hurry for books to end? Just enjoy the storie
Loved this discussion because of the friendly dynamics in the disagreement and the thoughtful opinions from everyone! I didn't know about these guys but I was immediately sold when he said "the movies are going for the opposite tone that the books try for" with regards to LOTR and TB. Well-observed! So while I didn't agree with everything, loved how hard everyone tried to defend their own points and you all let each other speak!
Cosmere is literally the MCU of fantasy books, in a lot of ways. From how series and characters connect to how immensely fun but far from a literary masterpiece it is.
Narnia as children's literature absolutely holds up and I will read it to my children for sure
I read the series for the first time two months ago. Really enjoyed them. The ending was wild as well!
Great idea bringing your channels together, loved the interaction, it was super fun.
Scenes that focus on characters and relationships are actually much better than the main plot for me more often than not. I think that's where a lot of modern epic fantasy loses me. They have the action, magic and plot, but they don't have the heart, soul, emotion and characters I can grow attached to.
If you haven't read it already, definitely go for The Realm of the Elderlings by Robin Hobb. It's characterwork and emotional depth are unparalelled imo. Make sure you have some tissues though.
@@CallmeJochem Totally agree. The modern fantasy I tend to enjoy most is the grimdark stuff. Not necessarily because they’re darker, but because they have a higher focus on character development, high stakes emotions and complex psychological stuff.
Rothfuss weekly round-up:
“Hi all, wrote nothing new. Rewrote the whole book for the 10,000th time. I owe you nothing. Be patient till next week’s update where I give you nothing and please don’t ask in between updates.”
Tom Bombadil perfectly fits the tone and texture of the books. Every life-threatening section of the books is followed by something life affirming. From the beginning, the first encounter with the Black Riders is followed by a stay at the farmers house. After the trip through the Old Forest, they meet and stay with Tom Bombadil. After the encounter with the barrow-wights, they spend time singing and drinking at the inn in Bree. After their encounter with the Black Riders, they spend a long time at Rivendell. Etc. Even in Mordor, Frodo and Sam get a break when they spend time with Faramir in Henneth Annun. The movies go for a much more consistently grim tone. You really only get moments of joy and simple relaxation at the very beginning and end, whereas the books have those moments included throughout. In part, I think this is because the movies establish a faster pace. The movies feel like the events are taking place over the span of weeks. The books make it clear this takes place over the course of a year.
Don't expect fantasy readers nowadays like something that is there for reasons other than plot development. Booktube is full of booktubers who just focus on plot, and don't analyse anything else.
I agree with Sanderson being overrated. He bores me. Too reliable on plot, not skilled as a writer.
ASOIAF was already finished by other authora and we all know what happened. I'd rather have it unfinished, just in case.
Cool
I understand the desire for a nice background when you're filming, but many booktubers' bookshelves have begun to look the same with similar titles and matchy-matchy editions. It's getting a little boring.
My mismatched bookshelves are filled with new books and thrift store books and it feels so cozy and personalized to me. 📚💚😊
I've never "designed" my bookshelves like that, because I don't have a "book fetish". I just read, and keep my old paperback editions bc they were the ones I enjoyed. I've seen bookshelves with nice colours, all red books together, all green ones, etc. Undecorated, undesigned bookshelves are more attractive to me, as were my uni teacher's shelves, so stacked with books that no space was left.
Refreshing to watch people having fun over their disagreements 🙂
I see 2ToRamble in the thumbnail and it gets an instant watch and thumbs up!
I’ve tried several Sanderson books and only finished The Final Empire which was ok. I don’t get the Sanderson hype. I’m done trying.
That's OK. I personally love Sanderson's stuff, but don't let anyone let you feel bad for what books you like or don't like.
@@hannahbrennan2131 yeah, I really wish I enjoyed his work because I love the whole Cosmere concept, in which everything ties together.
@@ernstbrehm1135the final empire was ok. I agree. Book two of the series is much better. And Stormlight archive is so much better. The endings are some of the best fantasy I’ve ever read.
Same. I personally liked Final Empire, but overall Mistborn for me was disappointing. I really like Stormlight though, but as you I don't get why he's almost being labelled as the best writer in fantasy. I suppose it's just because you see him releasing a book a year, while Martin for example has been stuck for a decade. But then they don't look at the quality of Sanderson's books compared to Martin's.
Same could be said of Rothfuss, or Tolkien, who had a lifetime to publish books, but there's only so few books he did publish, because he wanted excellency.
Sanderson idk, he's good, just not nowhere near the best. Definitely overhyped
@@Fenix-lr6ezI think some people (myself included) don't actually care all that much about things like prose, and prefer simpler, straightforward reads and consistency. No offense but I'm actually not a big fan of the way Martin writes. When he describes things like knights showing up for a tourney he tends to do the "and and and" thing a lot, which makes it feel intentionally historical/biblical which I personally don't enjoy. I'd also rather get something "ok" and know I'm getting it over something that's a "masterpiece" but have to wait decades for, or worry we'll never get the conclusion. I have major doubts that either Winds of Winter or Door of Stone will actually receive the praise or will be worth the long waits for them.
Maybe that's my own literary hot take.
James SA Corey could finish ASOIAF
This has to be my favorite collaboration EVER
I think the key for unfinished books are the amount of notes the author left behind.
I have read the first two books of mistborn and I have the 4 books of stormlight archive and I prefer stormlight better because I couldn’t relate or like any character from mistborn
This was hilarious🤣 Bombadil is a king amongst men. Also, Golden Son was my least favorite in RR because I was so not ready for “space opera”😅
MY 2 TO RAMBLE FRIENDS! I'm glad Tom is feeling the love
Damn right 😁
I read the first 4 stormlight books in under a week. I literally couldn’t put them down and it was my first fantasy series since some YA books in elementary school.
How tf did you manage that bruh, did you even sleep
How you talk about Red Rising is how I feel about Mistborn. I've read the first two books and they both got 4 stars but everyone talks about it as it it's one of the greatest fantasy series of all time and I was just... where? Are you reading different books from me? My expectations were really high so I ended up disappointed.
So so true. Mist born was a snooze fest. Everyone I know hyped it up, and I’m just like “you killed off the beat character and kept the most annoying” his female characters are all the same
@@cjdflkjthat’s Mistborn book one. Book two is way better. You’ll find out why Kel had to die. It sets up the story. Vin is a tomboy. Shallan is a prissy split personality. Jasnah is hard core. Navani is a patient scholar who doubts herself. I didn’t get that experience from his female characters. Even lift, she’s totally unique from the others.
Had the exact same experience with mistborn. I think his writing improves a lot bc stormlight came out after he finished wheel of time. So he picked up a lot in Robert Jordan’s notes plus I think the characters are a lot better written
@@CurieBohryeah I think he improves a lot character wise in stormlight
@@CurieBohrand everyone says final empire is the best one but I liked the second one the most
I agree about Narnia. I don’t love it as much now, but when I read it in 3rd or 4th grade, I absolutely loved it! I’m a Christian as well, but I think I prefer more vague and indirect allegories in my fiction.
C.s Lewis denies Jesus is God
Sanderson puts me to sleep. Talk about slogs. Why do people forgive him for this? It’s like no one edits. The Way of Kings was great, but every follow up puts me to sleep. If he cut 1/2 to 2/3 of the books out, he would have a decent story.
He is like a freight train relentlessly chugging out words upon words. He repeats the same concepts and ideas immediately and throughout the conversational dialogue. It’s like the old-school TV soap operas-lots of talking, but not much ever happens.
He needs a better editor. Good writing needs content generation and also needs editing, condensing, and many more revisions than Sanderson and his editors do. It’s like reading never-ending grocery lists for a family of 8.
That’s exactly my feeling too. Sanderesons concept of the story is excellent but we don’t need to rehash Kallidin’s depression in every book for 1000’s of pages or Shallons split personality over and over. We got it it the first 2,000 pages . Can’t we move on? Of course some Sanderson fan will say “journey before destination “ or the Sanderlanche is worth it. But that means you are agreeing that the main body of the story is a slog.
Sanderson isn't over rated he just isnt epic fantasy tho in the league of tolkein hobb martin and those who bring a world with a story that you just see lore and lose yourself in it. he tells to much rather than show. this allows people that are not use to fantasy to follow and not be over whelmed and enjoyed. Storm light is trying and being a bit more grander but the more books that come out the more he pulls back and recaps so it is feeling less and less this is that grand fantasy world because he goes back to explaining. half of mistborn elantris warbreaker focuses on and telling us the rules like we don't get it is fantasy, that it is that world stop telling us how it is different from our own just tell the story.
I can definitely see where you're coming from, but I think a really essential point is (especially with Stormlight Archive) is that the world is at a huge changing point and characters are discovering a lot of new stuff (the surges, bonds, Odium, etc). Those things are new to us as well as to the audience so it has to be explained. While in the series you mentioned there isn't something totally new for the world that is happening, so it feels more of an established world.
That “explaining” is Sanderson’s bread and butter. His descriptions and intricate magic systems are what he’s known for, and his biggest strength IMO. The level of detail, consistency and complexity with his magic (and overall worldbuilding) is insane.
First off, Tom Bombadil is amazing. Period. Secondly, in addition to the movie poster cupboard being banned the "Now an [insert streaming service] original series" sticker should be banned as well! I hated them when they were *actually* stickers and now they had the *audacity* to PRINT them directly on the covers! Books 10, 12, and 13 of Wheel of Time on my book shelf will forever be marred by Amazon.
Stormlight was actually the second fantasy series to read after ASOIAF so I guess you can say I dove into the deep end. I really don’t know if I am weird or it’s just not true to say that beginners shouldn’t read epic fantasy
Me too actually. My best friend was reading ASOIAF, and he convinced me to read as well. We loved it so much that we were watching theory videos together when we were hanging out. When we were done, we discussed what to read next and we settled on stormlight. I loved it so much that I got through TWOK and WOR (that's all that was out) in 9-10 days.
This was so awesome ❤
My conclusion after watching this video is that I need to read LOTR again 🤣
Sanderson maybe just wants to create a large quantity of works rather than torture a page for style reasons and I'm totally cool with that - his writing is not bad at all and the Cosmere as a whole could go well into the 2040s and beyond, so yeah.
Buuut the last Wax and Wayne book and Triss were both grating at times because the humor isn't working for me and they were both going out of their way to try to be funny. And he's just generally not particularly funny, but he does try. I find it pathetically generic humor, maybe a pun. Like a Mormon committee was tasked with generating jokes.
Wayne and Lift as characters are a bit of a copy and paste of each other, with Wayne turned up to 20 in the last book it was just...not funny to me. I'm not sure if Wayne is supposed to be mentally ill in that way exactly, but Lift kinda is and is generally pretty funny, plays well off her voidbringer, etc. Perhaps Brandon's greatest and only success in humor actually, that running voidbringer joke. Wayne not so much, just annoying, exhausting, childish. I hope he works on that, but it's probably a huge PITA to be funny.
On a side note the next audiobook I started after listening to Triss was a Hitler biography that I had no idea was narrated by Kramer, it worked a lot better with him describing Nazi atrocities than a teenage girls fairy tale.
I love his humor! But then again, I have a soft spot for witty humor and dad-joke level puns. I find it wholesome and silly, which I enjoy most of the time.
If there's any author trustworthy enough to finish ASOIAF, it's Joe Abercrombie.
Nah, Sanderson is not overrated. He is well loved by his fans (as he should) due to his enormous dedication and engagement. If he were overrated he would be constantly nominated to things like Hugos and Nebulas and appearing in lists of the best fantasy writers ever. He won a Hugo for The Emperor’s Soul (totally deserved) but I don’t think the rest of his oeuvre is at a technical level to be earning prizes like that
The Hugo awards are no longer merit based.
6:33 well no he can't. That's like the entirety of Oathbringer right there.
Tom is my actual favorite character lol. #JusticeForTom
Always a blast!
love these videos!
Steven Erikson could finish GRRM’s book. As simple as that. He is famous for being able to write as other writers and he is (let’s be on hot take) better than him creating worlds by far and that kind of politics.
IMO, Brandon Sanderson is definitely overrated. He's very good, but none of his books have the characters, plot or grandoise of works such as Lord of the Rings, ASOIAF, or the Name of the Wind, among others.
The fact that he releases books very often in a time when fandoms are thoroughly disappointed in the slowness of the writers of the previously mentioned books, Rothfuss and Martin, makes the fantasy fandom value him a lot more, I guess. To the point he's being overly deified, almost. His books are good (very good in Stomlight's case imo), but can't compare to other sagas.
I've never dove into the cult of Sanderson that deep. But he does appear to be the fast food of fantasy. Don't get me wrong, I love a whopper now and again. But I'm not gonna big it up. As for his exposure. I think an author should be invisible; not a celebrity. The star is the novel.
@@spilchsaysstuff1427 to compare him to fast food seems unfair to me. I'd rather say he's a one-star cook because he's pretty good at what he does, but to get another star (or two) he would need to refine his art in a way he probably doesn't even want to, especially because he for sure makes more money with what he's doing right now.
@@spilchsaysstuff1427 he's not fast food, cause his work is top-notch. Especially Stormlight, that's incredible. But they don't stand against other books like LOTR or any of the ASOIAF.
But to say he's the fast-food would mean he produces only a lot of 5/10 books, while the truth is he normally produces 7-8/10 books with the occasional 9/10. But he never reaches above that, and the fandom makes him look like he has the writing of Tolkien and Martin but with releasing a book a year, which is just not true
@Fenix-lr6ez It all depends on your opinion of fast food. When I'm in the mood, there's nothing like a whopper with fries. Just hits the spot. But like the Marvel movies, it serves a purpose that is fleeting and doesn't enrich the soul. Not mine anyway. Sanderson is great at what he does. No one can take that away from him. Especially an insignicant speck like me . But Tom Bombadil. Don't get me started.
@@spilchsaysstuff1427 To me, his work *does* enrich me and make me think, more than some other fantasy authors I’ve read. I see elements of myself in his characters and in his overall writing style. And lines like “the most important step a man can take is the next step” have really stuck with me. His, admittedly almost YAish writing just isn’t enough to get in the way of his themes, characters, and worlds for me. And I’m an English major in college right now.
Love this ! Such a fun video 😊
In regards to someone finishing a song of ice and fire my vote is for Abercrombie.
He's way too weak on plot for that to work.
Janny Wurts, she wrote GOT before GOT with Daughter of the Empire.
@@heidi6281
Isn’t she five or so years younger? If Martin dies in five, she’ll be the age he is now.
I see this point repeated all of the time and I just don't get it. Aside from both authors writing "grimdark fantasy", they're not that similar.
Always like watching ur videos 🎥🎥🎥🎥
I wanted this video to be an hour and a half :(
Tom Bombadil is a great character!!! And The Sword of Kaigen is just perfect!!!!!
YES, VERY MUCH SO!!!
Sanderson CAN write well, but more recent entries have sometimes devolved into reading like a Marvel script. Oathbringer's last act being a notable offender
Really, I loved the ending of Oathbringer
Yea but the main body of the story was mediocre at best.
Red Rising is the single most disappointing book I've ever read. Truly awful prose.
Why Tommy b works in the books and not the movies is that the movies are an action franchise and the books are a more episodic whimsical camping adventure journey.
I agree with wanting to see A Song of Ice and Fire concluded. Sanderson did great for Wheel of Time, but he isn’t the right fit. For ASOIAF, I think Joe Abercrombie is the guy
If someone else had to finish ASOIAF, maybe Abercrombie, I've only read 1.5 of his books but I think if he had the outline maybe.
I honestly dont think Sanderson gets enough credit for his imagination. Or how valuable it is. Obviously he's popular, but I genuinely don't see anyone with the same amount of creative ideas.
agree about dream sequences, i have never enjoyed a hallucination/dream sequence in any media EVER
I gave up on wheel of time after the forth book. Just couldn't get behind how annoying a lot of the characters were/are especially the female protagonists. Should I give it another shot?
The Cosmere universe felt very tacky and repressed. It felt like it was written for teens, which is fine. But it's not this high fantasy god tier content that everyone seems to worship it for.
Of course he is overrated. How can anyone say "he may not be on the same level of Robin Hobb" and then continue arguing he's not overrated? Sanderson in literature is the same what MCU is in cinema. Popular amusement park in which all rides have the same formula. Sure, you change costumes and environment, pretend you're here and there, music is loud, effects are expensive and shiny, but in the end, program is the same.
In 10 books I have read from him, there was little to no substance to his allegory, he never changes his prose (in which he is at best at an entry level), he copy/pastes all his female characters (Jasnah, Shallan, Vivenna, Siri, Sarene), as well as henchmen characters (Teft, Galadon, Lopen), as well as world building for which he is often praised (he squeezes worldbuilding from Elantris all over his Cosmere Universe (goodnes gracious even that is copied from MCU)).
Magic system is interesting. But for a child so is any "make belief" game he comes up on the spot while playing.
If you have seen his writing course, he literally says he does not believe in or do world-building. He believes, and teaches, that it's a waste of time.
yeah I'm not following your cult leader as I'm sure you do so that I should waste my time listening to another bullshit he's saying. If he truly said what you typed, then he doesn't know what he's even talking about.
@@darkwitnesslxxinteresting, any UA-cam videos criticizing Sanderson. I don’t know too much about allegory
@@darkwitnesslxx um…what? That is…not true at all. He has a whole several videos on _just_ worldbuilding. Where are you even getting this from?
His actual course at the University he teaches at.
I kind of disagree with you on mismatched shelves, I love having an eclectic mix of books. It feels a lot more cozy and lived in. However, it does depend on the books a little. For example, I don't keep matching sets of classics, they can all be their own thing, in fact I vastly prefer that. With something like Discworld where the books are related but many also can be read alone, I am not that concerned either way. But for a more contained linear series, I want them to match. I often have a mix of hardcover and paperback, just depending on what was available, that's ok, but the artwork needs to match. I don't want Fellowship of the Ring in one style and Return of the King in another.
Brandon Sanderson is everything wrong with modern fantasy
Why?
@@arthurhaag9434 Overly long, Wide but shallow worldbuilding, extremely prude in regard to sex but indulges in violence, “Keeping faith in a time of modernization” has been done longer and better by other authors.
@@matcauthon9669I agree with wide but shallow world building. All of mistborn took place in essentially 3/4 locations, no real travelling portions, you only hear of the wider politics you don’t experience it.
When I think of movie posters as book covers, I think of The Martian and I think every edition of that book has had great covers. So I’m good with it.
In my experiences discussing Bombadil with people, its either they love him or hate them
Two great channels!
👊👊
I don’t understand the red rising is meh stuff personally. Im not a sci-fi guy and have always preferred fantasy as a genre that being said Brown is a great author and red rising is some of the best stuff I’ve read this year, the only book I enjoyed more than Dark Age and Golden Son was literally Dune which in my opinion is a perfect book so that’s high praise. I started RR because Rythm of War for me was really burning me out on Sanderson and it’s been a total slog. I’ve now gotten to Lightbringer and I think this is seriously a top 10 series for me personally. I get not everyone has the same preferences and that’s fine but I seriously can’t agree with RE being meh. Not a single book in my opinion goes blow a 7 (can’t say the same for Sanderson. )
So in summary totally disagree with the RR statement and super hot take i think currently Red rising is a more enjoyable series than Stormlight archive which was the series that got me back into fantasy and reading
I loved Tom bombdil I was walking around my house talking about how great he was lol
People are living to 100 nowadays! She just finished her 11 book series War of Light and Shadow. I think she could handle 2 more books. GRRM should ask her to collaborate just like Raymond Feist did.
I agree with the vast majority of the opinions but I will say that you guys were a lot nicer to Red Rising than I would have been.
Hard agree with Austin on the red rising bit.
Mistborn better than Stormlight is a good one. Veeeeeery interesting 🤔
Wow! So there is someone else out in the bookiverse that does not rate the Wheel of Time highly. I am not alone, hurrah.
Who needs farm boys when you can grow potatoes on Mars?
Sanderson being considered one of the goats bodes horribly for the perception of the fantasy genre. Dude is mid at best
Cool
Give me the goats then. I like his first 2 storm light books with little filler.
Please name 10 authors with their greatest books first
I think the problem with Sanderson's writing is that he's writing too fast and that always translates into a lesser level of quality. Now I'll absolutely give him props for being consistent on a level a lot of other very popular authors never reach, but when I think of brilliantly written fantasy, Sanderson basically never comes up in that inner monologue. Now there's a lot of authors I really like to read that aren't even as good as he is, so I won't hold that against him, but contrary to most of those other authors, I think he could be way better than he already is if he wanted to. And I'm pretty sure that this is a sacrifice he willingly made for sake of greater monetary success.
So while I would agree that he could be one of the goats of modern fantasy if he wanted to, saying that he already is is, in my opinion, an overstatement. And that makes him, yes, overrated.
I agree but I also think this mindset might change when he gets older
Yeah. I kinda think of him as the Dean Koontz of fantasy. Great ideas and very prolific career, but the actual execution of his books is often very shallow, unpolished and leaving a lot to be desired.
I really do disagree with this statement. First, I think that Stormlight is some of the best work in modern fantasy and is revolutionizing the genre with more hard magic systems, but I also think that Sanderson consistently puts out great books. Let's mention the Secret Projects, which he wrote during the pandemic (quite a short period for writing multiple extra books). They turned out great, especially SP1 and SP3 were amazing. They were creative, experimental in style for Sanderson and had great characterisation and plot. He also shows he can take his time when he needs to, as he decided to delay Stormlight 5 for a year.
@@CallmeJochem Again, I'm by no way saying he isn't very good consistently. The rest we might just have to disagree about because I could probably rattle off 20 names of authors I think have been better writers AND have actually written better stuff just in the last five years.
All his books read like first draft brain dumps without any editing or revisions.
If someone has to finish A Song of Ice and Fire, I nominate Daniel Abraham.
I don't think there is a current author that could finish asoiaf
When I read Sanderson books I feel like I’m reading the same thing over and over without ever getting anywhere.
Yep. Yep. Yep. Yep.
Skyward = coward, cowardice, M-bot, Jerkface
Starsight = Alanik, eyes, delver, “My My” Winzil, Cuna, humans
Cytonic = pirates, delvers, Chet
Defiant = to fight or not to fight and why?, angst, tie everything in a neat little bow. The end.
lol... Tom Bombadil is the best.
These videos are so fun! Also gives us a chance to discover new booktubers!
And I absolutely agree with an early comment in the video - I can't stand dream sequences. I skip over them immediately if I'm reading something that I know won't integrate them into the plot. They're fine in most Harry Potter cases, where he's witnessing actual events, or in a film like Inception, which wouldn't exist without them. Otherwise, no thanks, don't care, move on, please.
😂
Totally agree. I DNF'd Words of Radiance. I guess he's good for people just coming into fantasy but I suspect hell be a flash in the pan once you start reading other stuff.
But these guys *have* read other stuff…
Really, he may not be for you, but I came into Sanderson's books pretty late in my fantasy reading and I enjoyed his work quite a bit. I don't claim that he's the greatest author to ever exist. But his books are good for what they are.
i feel that a book series being written by a different author or approved by somebody other than the original author. is fanfiction. incredibly well done fan fiction mind you. but robert jordans wife approved Sanderson to finish the books based off his notes. its not Jordans vision but a fanfiction as cloae as you can get. like Berserk is my favorite manga. and the passing of Kentaru miura was a tragedy. and even though Koji Mori is doing a great job so far. i read it as a best friend who inspired the main villian. honors his childhood friend
I don't mind slow burn if it builds out the ideas and themes of the book. If building out the ideas and themes means world building and character development, that sounds good. If it's just getting to know the characters "as people" and traveling around the world like tourists, I don't need that.
Dreams suckssss😅
I too hate most dream sequences
If you're gonna have a mistmatched bookshelf just get a kindle, please.
Have not yet watched the vid so i am just comenting based on the title
Brandon sanderson is overrated in my opinion
Does not mean i dont like the guy i think he is a good writer and also a very good person but nothing speaciale
When i got back into reading i started reading brandpn because everyone was talking about him
So i started with mistobr
Loved the forst book still to this day zhe second was me and stopped 50 pages in the thrid ( need to finish it because i dont dnf books ) but i did not enjoy it
Now i have over 600 books in my library and have read many writers i found out i dont really like sanderson like others do. I find his work ho estly boring compared to others authors i read
I love grim dark now so he is not my main taste but i read everything and books similare to his i think are better
His magic systems are amazing and he does write fast but in my mind he is overrated because everyone keeps talking about him and praising him
Brandon is like the godfather movies to me
I hated the godfather movies but people keep praising the movies and i know many who secretly hate the movies or thought they were boring but because everyone praises them so should they because of fear of rejection from their group
In short brandon good writer great human being but after reading many books i do t think he should be getting this amount of praise
Alot yes but this muvh
Also to the commentore that said the cosmere is like the mcu
Well the mcu now sucks and also the mcu had bad movies in the begining like iron man 2 thor 2 ant man guatdins of the galaxy 2 ( baby grout was the only good thing) only the captain america franchise was amazing from start to finish
Brandon Sanderson is the Taylor Swift of fantasy.
My take on the wheel of time, and i hope it offends no one, is that it could be finished by another author BECAUSE of how generic and poorly made it was. Same for Sanderson as a whole. It supports the first hot take on fantasy being for entertainment without brains.
The only thing good about Sanderson is stormlight. Ensuring else is terrible or mid
His wheel of time editions saved the series, books 6 through 10 totally fell off and he came in and saved it.
Mistborn book one was good, but it’s basically oceans 11, but book 2 of Mistborn was awesome. Book 3 was solid too.
@@CurieBohr uh huh
Short answer: no. Long answer: no, absolutely not
Not me here crying about Sword of Kaigen’s main relationship hot take 🥲! Absolutely the whole point of the story!!
😂