Mulan is the perfect example of what you are talking about. In the original animated Mulan, she started off as a weak recruit that was trained and hardened into a fighter. She learned to fight using her speed and intelligence, not brute force. In the live action remake, she started off with a special ability that allowed her to quickly excel with little effort. The first one could be seen as inspiration for girls to exceed despite what hinders them. The remake just says, "she exceeded because she had special powers."
meh, all female protagonists are empowered by magic including the ones we look back upon fondly. Men are twice as strong in the upper body. That is not a little. Men evolved to mentally cope in combat situations. Men have faster reflexes. A woman vs. a man is a child vs. an adult. No comparison. More female nature does not allow for heroism. They evolved to be too valuable to risk and naturally avoid conflicts and risk. See how many female firefighters died rushing into the burning WTC (zero btw) Take Beth Harmon Utterly fictional character because women do not compete mentally either. Hundreds of male top chess players exist for a single average female chess player. Hence why Beth was fiction (yet acted like women were good at chess, they are not)
She was trained, worked with, and fought... MEN. So... does that make her magically STRONG and EMPOWERED??? Ummm... and one more thing... IT. WAS. AN. ANIMATED. FILM. BY. THE. WOKE. HEADQUARTERS... DISNEY!
@@DrakeSilver truth does tend to upset awful people who then get baited. So i suppose so? But more importantly, it raises the awareness of how fooled into believing lies like muh empowered women, normies are.
@@linus1792 yep, the original mulan was still a circle jerk of unfounded reality but at least it was done in a minimalist to ego boosting way There are people who want us to believe that women can fight for the same reason why their are people who slip poison into besieged cities wells.
Sarah Connor remains one of the most compelling female leads - she totally comes across as more than capable to best most men she encounters as she actually put in the work to convincingly portray the part. Yet in T2 the second she encounters the terminator she collapses in fear and flees, as she is self aware and understands her limitations. And NO ONE with a functional brain or beating heart thinks any less of her for it.
The awesome "Sarah-ness" continued in Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles. Lena Headey has almost eclipsed Linda Hamilton as my favourite Sarah, and I wish the series had done better. The writers said that the end of T2 left Sarah in a really interesting dramatic position: she was a single mother on the run from law enforcement, knowing what was coming and having to prepare John for the future. The series reflected this, how angry and isolated she is, and the certainty that she's going to die sometime between 1999 (when the series starts) and 2007 (they do a time jump in the first episode). And the horror of raising a wayward teenager who does stupid things like hack into the school's computer, which can leave a trail to tip off future Terminators is something she has to deal with every day.
@@scottgimple8107 I think so. We are introduced to her working in a diner. A completely unremarkable and average woman of her age. She largely plays mentee to Kyle Reese throughout the first movie, but you see her grow as a character. Only a few days pass throughout the entire first movie. At the end we see her drive off into a storm and expect a positive future for her. The beginning of the second movie, we find that she didn't live happily ever after, she's institutionalised, she failed at raising her son, but she is hardened, physically and mentally. After John and The T800 rescue her, and some more growth after trying to kill Dyson, she then takes on the mentor role for John that Kyle Reese did with her.
@@hjf3022 I absolutely concur with that. She is written very well, with plenty of failings and struggles to overcome. And when she overcomes them, we cheer her on because we know that she put in the work to get where she is.
Ripley was done perfectly. She was often scared, indecisive, bested in battle, belittled by her male coworkers, and even - gasp - cried now and again. At the same time, she was 100% grade A badass.
Absolutely 100%. She was such a wonderful character. She also valued the men and women around her she felt she could trust and didn't treat them like they were less than her, but instead as equals. She was one of the best action heroes, man or woman.
I propose that female characters in action movies be measured in units called Ripleys (R). Ripley = 1 R. Someone like, say, Sarah Conner = 0.85 R (Aliens are slightly harder to deal with than Terminators). Of course, Strong Female Characters should be measured in Micro-Ripleys (mR, 1 R = 1000 mR). Rey would be ~20 mR.
She was one of a great many strong female characters who we all loved. Sarah Conner. Furiosa. Uma Thurman(Kill Bill). Vasquez. Princess Leia. Karen Allen(Raiders of the lost Ark)... to name a few. They were badass, and empathetic characters. We cared about them. Now they make strong female characters that no one gives a shit about.
This can be so dangerous for girls/women, too. The fantasy that they can physically fight men and win can be deadly in real life. And I'm a woman trained in martial arts... where we were taught to avoid fights if at all possible.
I think your argument could be made for men as well though. A young man might get the false impression from seeing a 5'6, 145lbs Jet Li beating up men twice his size left and right that he can do it as well. Yet In agreement with your point, at least Jet Li is a 5-time Wushu champion and has the athleticism, speed, and martial arts background to help suspend our disbelief. His fighting choreography also shows that he's in serious trouble when he fights men much bigger if he fails to keep his distance from them, favoring an out-boxing type of mindset when fighting them with flurries of jabs and other swift attacks, or even reaching for weapons, to keep them at bay. The problem I find with the way Hollywood often approaches this with female action heroes (unlike Asian cinema) is that they don't even bother to hire exceptionally athletic women or even design the choreography accordingly to help sell how she can take on bigger and stronger men. They can hire some pretty 5'2, 115lbs dramatic actress with only a modeling background -- and no background whatsoever in the likes of martial arts, aggressive sports, bodybuilding, stuntwork, not even dancing -- and have her beating up men left and right while getting in grappling distance with them. Even Jet Li has the humility and self-awareness to know that he can't plausibly sell that type of choreography in fight scenes involving him against bigger opponents.
@@darkengine5931 It is simple: either somebody was 1. in a fight 2. as Ramsey Dewey's guest said, tried to physically handle child throwing a tantrum - these two situations will learn ANYONE regardless of physical size or training that "strange things happen in one-two-point". Being huge, imposing brusier can be advantage in *discouraging* the fight, but peak of male strength / agility performance is usually in "high 170s cm". People having 190cm+ really need to train to catch up and from young age. Not to mention, that most movie scenes are shot specifically to be entertaining, show off not to be effectvie.
No, women cannot act the part and they do not look the part. Same stances, same looks, rarely looked trashed and will never go through the movie with the black eye or swollen lip received while they were being strong.
@@winstonsmiths2449 Yes they can dumbazz, there are many women who have acted perfectly well and can pull emotions better than men actually since they tend to use emotions more often. The fact you deny this means you are just one of those incels. Are there bad female actors? Yes just like there are bad male actors. Are all of them bad at acting? No to generalize so is stupid.
@@winstonsmiths2449 Bro, if you think we want your type, your wrong. We hate sexisim agains men AND woman. Edit: I have said that I misunderstood them and even said sorry. I'm getting real annoyed how you guys keep replying to my comment but won't put any effort to see my new responses. Edit: I would usually be proud of this many likes but something tells me it's by woke lunatics, unless I'm wrong. Also, for the love of gosh, please stop sending me hate and saying how I'm sexist or wrong when I have admitted to being incorrect
The reason why Sigourney Weaver was so incredible in Aliens, is because her character didn't possess any insane abilities. She wasn't overly smart or strong, she didn't fly around and walk through walls. She was a average scientist who had no idea how to fight or operate guns etc. Her weaknesses were on display the entire time and she managed to get herself though it. The role wasn't some stupid caricature of female empowerment and everyone loved it.
She wasn't even a scientist. Ripley's job was like an interstellar truck driver. They wanted her to come along because she was the only one who had a damn clue about the Xenomorphs.
Ridley did whatever she could to survive with what she had. She didn’t possess special powers only an instinct to survive. That’s what made this movie so great and Weaver’s character so iconic. The other characters were great as well. I never get tired of watching this movie!
I'm a tall girl, 5'9. I was in a brief relationship with a guy who was shorter, skinnier, and weighed less than me, and he was still significantly stronger than me to the point I knew he could hurt me if he actually tried. Modern movies are ridiculous in their lack of realism.
atomic blonde is a film I would recommend as it has realistic action based on the hand to hand combat they teach women who work as spies and in special forces.
@@samueldawkins I still don't buy it. I'm in the army and even when women join special forces, they alway take support or surveillance roles. Those hand to hand combat techniques are last ressort and will still fail most of the time if your opponent is bigger/stronger.
@@samueldawkins a story based on something I heard, from someone who told me, that something was possibly based on a thing they heard, was maybe true. Tell us more about the so called SF/spy techniques that are taught. Please. The audience is enthralled with your fairy tales of she-hulks barely defeating average men.
@thibaldus3 agreed. When I went through combatives training, I had the opportunity to have to roll with two women. One immediately went to my back and correctly applied the rear naked choke. She wasn't strong enough. I choked the first one I grabbed until she tapped, then I pulled the one off my back and did the same. She was really upset and couldn't understand why it didn't work. I told her she just didn't have the strength necessary to apply the choke.
Marge Gunderson from _Fargo_ is one of the strongest characters in film history. Coincidentally, she's a great example of how Lawful Good doesn't need to be "lawful stupid."
All the female protagonists in the Fargo TV series are also pretty great characters. Smart, brave, and likeable, but also flawed. And not just written like male action heroes.
Absolutely. One of my all time favorite female movie characters. Seems like a naive rural housewife first, but is actually a super clever detective. Very well written and well acted.
Heck I'd argue Penny from the Rescuers in 1977 is a better female character and shes just an animated little girl. In the first half of the film, she drops a help message in a bottle that travels to the Rescue Aid Society and attempts running away too. Madame Medusa the villain of the film even yells shes done it again meaning this isnt Penny's first escape and the fact Penny is willing to run away without packing any supplies prives her willingness to escape her captors
Strong female character is really just shorthand for abrasive, unlikable, completly flawless, and portrayed by an actress garaunteed to get into Twitter fights with anyone who doesn't worship her role as stunning and brave
Modern definition refers to a non ovulating female with too must testosterone as a strong female. A strong female character would be what is a woman. Muscles is men. Nurturing is women. Ripley only went back to the planet because of her nightmares, but once there she kept fighting because of her maternal instincts protecting Newt when her own child grew up without her and had already died. Sarah protected her kid. Marion in Indian Jones, she didn't seem that strong. Buffy was given a younger sister to raise after losing her mom.
Ripley from Aliens was one of the best female characters ever because she showed bravery and skill not because she was not afraid-she clearly was-but because she was so committed to rescuing the little girl that she found the courage to confront the Alien mother and kill it. Humanity with courage and competence is a very attractive combination.
@@_.hybrids._1680 imagine not steeling your nerves when someone else’s life is in danger, your lady professor would’ve probably been the first casualty in a survival movie 😂
Also, Ripley character wasn't written with a woman or man in mind. The writers created a well rounded believable character, then it happened Sigourney Weaver was cast as Ripley.
Ripley was the "strong female" only because the men in the cast were portrayed as a bunch of incompetent sissies, even the little girl had more balls then these military trained men. Even the guy that was in charged of the mission freaked out under pressure, so with idiots like those, it was pretty easy to see Ripley as the "strong female" type.
Nah, there are several characters that over-confidence works very well on. Easy examples : John Wick and Clint Eastwood. They are oozing with overconfidence, and we LOVE them for it.
Sarah Connor is a very good example which I never realized about. The writers never tried to overpower her from other men, she ran and escaped where she had to. She planned things out with her team. The writers never forcefully tried to show us that she's "equal" and as strong as the terminator.
@@WaryofExtremes after the third film they discarded the John Conner act. Yes the messianic figure that the original film and its even more popular sequel build up. Instead they reintroduced Sarah Conner as a "strong female character". She was played by the same actress just older, but now she was scrubbed clean of flaws and personality. My old drama teacher always said that they make the first film because they have a great idea, and the second just to make money. But what do they do when they turn it into a franchise? well I don't even think money is the goal anymore. by the fifth film they actually kill John conner in the past
The best example of this is Mulan. In the animated movie, she constantly struggles during boot camp to the point where others are telling her to quit. Then comes the giant pole with the arrow on top of it, and no one can get to it. No one! Not even the strongest recruit. Mulan refuses to give up, and while everyone else is sleeping, she keeps trying her hardest until she reaches the top of that giant pole. When her drill Sergeant comes out in the morning, Mulan throws that arrow at his feet. It was a powerful moment, not just for Mulans character, but for ALL kids regardless of gender. Jump to the live action movie, and Mulan is so strong from the moment of birth that she literally has to physically hold herself back so as not to easily embarrass everyone around her. Absolutely butchered her character with a straight trash message.
Keep in mind it wasn't simply endurance that got Mulan to the top. Getting to the top of the pole had to be done while wearing weights. Mulan uses cleverness in order to use the weights as an advantage instead of a handicap. It played to her using her intelligence to keep pace and even surpass others.
This, right here. The cartoon Mulan had everything to lose. If she was discovered, she'd be arrested. Going into battle, she very well might die. But, even knowing this, she risked it for her father. She could not physically keep up with the men. She literally had to be helped just to try and keep up. But, when she climbed the pole, it wasn't brute strength that got her there. The men were trying to climb the pole wearing the weights and they couldn't. She couldn't. It was when she stopped trying to be the strongest and used her brain that she did it. Instead of letting the weights pull her down, she used them to climb with. It was brilliant. During the battle with the Huns, she again thought through the problem and played to her strengths, showing that everyone has talents and they are all just as valuable as physical strength. In the end, she again risked everything to save her friends and her country, also playing to her strengths. She grew in confidence and saw her value. She had the confidence to say to the men, "I have an idea, follow me." Can you see her doing that at the beginning of I'll Make a Man Out of You? And they follow her without question, even Shan. And we went on that journey with her. We wanted her to succeed. We cheered when she did. We learned that we all have skills and worth, even if we don't see it. We just have to find it. What risk did the new Mulan have? She was the strongest and the best. She wasn't going to die and all she had to do was just have the men get out of the way. She wasn't really likeable. There was no risk which made the reward hollow. I didn't get to know her and I didn't care if she won or not. What growth did she have, what did we learn? You are 100% right. The two Mulans are a very good illustration of what went wrong.
Mulan turns the challenge of climbing the pole, around by thinking outside the box. Work/think smarter not harder, there's more than one way to skin a cat. They had to climb with 2 weights with was impossible for anyone at the time. She figured out the solution, ties the weights together throws them around the pole and uses them to her advantage to climb the pole super easily with barely an inconvenience. Overcoming the challenge and making it look easy to everyone else by comparison. Our mind and our ingenuity are our only and greatest weapon and Mulans mind has been honed to a razor sharp edge by the end. She also single handedly destroys the entire Mongol horde by using the environment to her advantage and causing an avalanche too. She learned a lot from the pole challenge. And later they infiltrate the palace to save the emperor using her technique of wrapping stuff around poles to enable them to climb up and do eventually save the day.
Also, can we just talk about how Disney felt the need to elevate already strong female characters into "even stronger" by basically making their whole personality "badass female character"? For example, Belle was already a well written character, a girl who is nerdy and quiet but also knows where to stand up for herself or the people she cares about (rejecting Gaston directly, yelling at the Beast and refusing to join him for dinner, showing no qualms about walking away from him when he tried to scare her, scolding him later for not controlling his temper). But the live action? Belle is not strong enough, she needs an occupation to be a good character, so she is the scientist now. They also shoved in a few sexist comments that were too on the nose and cringy, to say the least. Jasmine? OG Jasmine was already strong. Again, she knew when to speak for herself and exactly what she wanted. She knew her own worth and she wanted a suitor who would accept her as a person, rather than for her title. But in the live action, Jasmine needs an ambition. She wants to be the sultan. And she positively insults all men (unlike in the animated version, where she only insults the over the top haughty princes) and has an entire song that talks about not allowing herself to be silenced when there were no instances of anyone trying to silence her. Again, "strong female character". And quite possibly the most unnecessary change was to Mulan. OG Mulan was arguably the most physically powerful female character but the creators felt the need to change that as well. OG Mulan was a socially awkward girl who cares about her family, and disguises herself as a soldier for selfless reasons. She is not perfect; she has to learn everything from scratch, she fails time and time again while training, she has to work her way to the top. She also used her brains in most of the fights because physical strength in itself isn't enough, and that's what made her stand apart from the others. She got along with the male characters perfectly well, with no need of comparison or proving herself to be better. But the live action version? That Mulan is born with magical chi, she has trained from when she was a child, so she has to face no difficulties when joining the army. The only thing stopping her from proving herself is the society; otherwise, she is perfect. She is far from being a realistic character because young girls would look at her and think, "well, she's strong because she was born with it". Not to mention, the live action Mulan was as boring as a slice of bread. She had no character other than "female warrior", emphasis on the "female". Basically, physical strength isn't everything. All of the OG princesses were strong in their own ways. Cinderella dealt with abuse and torment for years, but still kept her good morals and kindness. Snow White realized that running away from toxic situations is not cowardly. Tiana wanted to have an occupation to support herself and her mother, and worked hard for it. Ariel wanted to explore a new world that she didn't know, and be part of new experiences. Also. Romance is not weak. A strong female character can still fall in love. And if they choose to stay single, it should not be because "she's too independent for a partner". You can be in a relationship and still be independent. If the relationship is built on mutual trust and understanding, no one is "too strong" for it. I understand that aroace characters can exist, but their motive for not having a partner should not be "oh, I don't need a man"; it should just be that they're happier with friends or family, and they don't really feel the need to be in a relationship.
Mulan was pretty stupid in the animated version too though. She went from what you'd expect from a young girl who's been raised to be a housewife and completely in over her head as a soldier, physically unfit and far behind her male counterparts, to suddenly being able to outshoot, outrun, outlift and generally outperform all of the others - even defeating the captain, a man clearly much more physically imposing and trained as a warrior his whole life, in a sparring match, over the course of a single song (okay, of unspecified time but logically at best a few weeks to a month or two) purely from sheer force of will. I'd totally get it if was just that she'd been using her smarts and being underestimated (elements like causing the avalanche, maybe figuring out how to climb the pole) but no. Literally she just instantly turns into the best.
Excellent, excellent commentary, and dead on. My first thought was “do women like being pandered to in this obvious and blatant way?” Box office returns answers that, and seeing the quote from Emily Blunt validates it even further. I used to be a total cinephile, going to the movies 3 to 4 times a month, yet since Hollywood went all in on the DEI bullshit, I haven’t gone in 3 years. You’re doing good work with these videos and you’re speaking for the vast majority of men and women who are tired of this shit.
I don’t think people talk about her enough, but Holly McClane is a great example of being strong without physical strength. When her boss, Joe Takagi, is shot by Hans Gruber, she makes sure the needs of the other hostages are met, literally walking right up to Hans to ask him to get the pregnant woman a sofa to help her back. She remains calm under pressure, and when she is taken hostage by Hans later in the film, she is not afraid to insult him right to his face (calling him a “common thief.”) She knows what kind of a man Hans is, and she doesn’t hesitate. Not to mention all of her dialogue is outstanding. Imagine if Holly McClane was written today, she’d kill a terrorist with her brute strength, start a hostage uprising, mow down all the terrorists on her floor, and when John is upstairs confronting Hans and the fake security guard, she shoots Hans and the other guy, saving her husband with not a scratch on her. I’m so glad the drinker made this video, as a homo sapien without a Y chromosome I feel better represented in this video than in 98% of Movies today. Edit: love these comments getting into all the details of her character, Holly is really underrated.
I would like to see a die-hard-sequel where John's and Holly's daughter has married the computer nerd from DH4 and both get in trouble over something, most likely dad. They could form a couple with her being the action and him ... well, doing what he did in DH4. I think that would work ...
Grace under pressure, this is what's lacking in these female roles and the Alphabet mob in real life. The roles are all boring but the real people are always "victims" who cry wolf every time some pressure and work are expected. An employer can't demand some competence bcoz that will be "harassment" and "toxic". They immediately need meetings to deal with simple problems and "therapists" to cement their "victimhood."
Another actress who gets slotted into the 'strong female character' role a lot these days, Evangeline Lilly, has also come out against this 9:14 trend in particular: "Why are we only applauding masculinity in women and villainizing it in men? And why are we only applauding femininity in men and debasing it in women? Why can't we just allow for all of it? Why do we feel the need to vilify a man wearing shit-kicker boots, driving a pick-up truck who's not afraid to punch someone in the face, but if they were a woman, they would be the epitome of cool? Why is a man who loves make-up, cries easily and stays at home to tend to the domestic responsibilities valiant, but a woman who does the same is pathetic?"
She fought in dangerous situations how people, both male and female, fight in real life. Screw being fair. If I can throw some dirt in that guys eyes to get an advantage, I’m gonna do it. If I see him clinching his fist and fixing to throw a punch I’m gonna punch him first.
yeah... it was men who came up with rules of warfare so that the full horror of war did not fall on the women and children. So absolutely, anti-hero females who fight dirty are the real modern protagonists. Dirty-fighting is a symptom of weak character. Just as claiming to be a girl so you can go from being a 500th place loser to a 1st place "winner"... because winning is more important than how you win.
@@OrtadragoonX That's true about how things work in a real, dangerous situation. Even in man vs. man, the fair fight only works in a civil setting with previously agreed upon rules such as official boxing or MMA fights. Bruce Lee, the legend considered to be the forefather of MMA, was notorious for being dirty and pragmatic. If he was in a fight, he aimed to win. He would poke your eyes, bite your hand, kick you in the knee cap, even deal a low blow. He never competed, he fought.
I think it's funny how the one time Disney hired an actress who actually looks like she has a pretty reasonable chance of being able to fuck up an average man in a one-on-one fight (Gina Carano) they went and shit-canned her.
I do love seeing her fight in movies cause it's extremely believable, as she's also an actual fighter; she does seem like she could rip someone in half. But she hasn't had many good scripts to work with...
Amazing that in the same breath, they wish to call masculinity "toxic" meanwhile, EVERY positive trait that creates the modern; Strong Female Character™ is masculine! The irony cannot be lost if you are immune to it.
thank you! I swear I had given up hope that anyone would ever realize this OBVIOUS Paradox. But this aint even half the story. Feminists CLAIM to be for the "feminine (hence "Feminist") but they demonize everything that is feminine while at the same time glorifying everything that is masculine. So they should be called ANTI FEMINISTS!!!!! Though that has a limit. They only demonize the feminine until "the ship starts sinking". Then they all cry out "Women and Children first". No "equality" when it comes to DYING ey? Same with wars! Then there is another Paradox that is beyond funny! Imagine Slaves asking their Masters to "fight" for THEIR Freedom...can you imagine such a nonsensical Situation? That is EXACTLY what Feminists do. They call men "oppressors", "Tyrants", "Patriarchs" and then ask the SAME MEN to "help them" against men. That is so beyond ridiculous that only mental infants can come up with something like that.
I think the scene in Raiders of the Lost Ark, where Indy and Marion are attempting to steal the plane is a perfect example of toughness on both counts. Indy is fighting a guy twice his size and getting his butt handed to him, but he keeps on fighting in spite of the size disadvantage. And Marion, far from the typical damsel in distress, fights alongside him, first by knocking out the pilot and then using the machine gun to take out a truck load of soldiers. A perfect action sequence that displays the bravery of both characters without going overboard.
They also did it without framing Marion as better than Indy in every way. They also didn’t remove Marion’s femininity and give her masculine attributes.
Sarah Connor had an incredible and believable character development across T1 and T2. T1 she was scared, working a dead-end job, lacked confidence, and didn't know what was going on. She was useless. T2 she's figured it out, she has purpose, she's been working out every day and training with guns all to protect her son. Her combat skills make sense.
And simultaneously was neglecting her son (and becoming callous towards the rest of doomed humanity in general) whilst pursuing her single-minded hero's journey, and has to develop and begin to reconnect with him and appreciate her life in the moment rather than always being afraid of the future to come.
@@colinr0380 and it helps she came to realise she was becoming no different than the killer machines she hated and feared so much than when she went to try and assassinate miles dyson in the belief killing him would prevent skynet. Outright almost killing him in front of his own wife and kid. And how she came to respect the T100 aftermoutright distrusting it given its twin almost ended her own life. She came to think of it as the sort of father figure John needed in life and gave it a salute when it chose to have itself destroyed. “If a terminator,a machine,can learn to appreciate the value of human life…there’s hope”
The only thing I didn't particularly care for in T2 was they made her out as unhinged and almost psychopathic. I mean, I get where Cameron was coming from thematically with her character (i.e. she's becoming as machine-like as the Terminators themselves) and knowing the fate of humanity would cause anyone to go a little nuts, but I just didn't particularly care for it. The way Reese described Sarah in T1- "The Legend" "Who taught her son to fight," ect.-- made me believe Sarah kept her wits and was that revered figure that set John on his course to liberating Humanity. That's why, upon watching T2, I was disappointed that she was in a psych ward while John's out being a hulligan that just thinks his mom's a nutcase. Yeah, yeah, it makes a good story. I personally didn't care for it (but I'm also not the biggest fan of T2 in general, so I may be a bit biased).
@@GPMM213 hmmm. I felt frustrated at the way that Sarah Connor was being treated in the psych ward; but I think that’s how the audience is supposed to react. Since we, as the audience, know that she’s not delusional. And yes, it’s sad and also frustrating that John thinks that she’s crazy; but these things make the payoffs more satisfying; when she breaks out of the psych ward the audience is really rooting for her because we know that she probably doesn’t belong there. Same kind of thing happening with John and Sarah’s relationship; it starts out in a bad place but we see them rebuilding their bond during the movie; the fact that they are so much closer by the end - is made that much more rewarding given where they started. There are many satisfying and rewarding character arcs and relationship arcs in this movie. But hey, maybe it’s down to personal taste as much as anything. Personally I like T1 but I think that T2 is a perfect movie.
She does. It's literally a story about a sheltered child growing up and learning the hardship of work, demeaning bosses, and problem-solving through improvisation because real life has no definite answers! She even gets immense self-esteem boosts after cleansing the river god, as seen when she eats the red bean bread with delight. Such a great and timeless story.
Miyazaki knows how to write a character arc. He gives them personality and charm; by the end you can’t help but love the character. That’s why I’ll watch his movies over and over, whereas with Marvel movies I can’t hardly watch them ONE time.
I’ll add: Nausicaa is an interesting case, almost a counter example; she’s the “strong female lead.” However that story is less about character growth and more about sacrifice.
One of the strongest female characters I've ever seen on screen was Mrs. Brisby from the Secret of NIMH. She had no powers, she was weaker and smaller than those around her. And she was terrified of what she was asked to face. But she faced the peril to save her family. She never gave up even in the face of utter failure. She was kind, she was caring, and she was brave (not fearless). Cinema and television need more Mrs. Brisby's.
That was a perfect example to use in that moment of explanation. Because she is SO POWERFUL in that moment. It makes a 34 year old big man cry to see it. She looks so afraid, but your eyes well up and you start to cry because you realize how unbelievably brave she's being. THAT is amazing story telling. The fact that she's doing it to protect her father because they nurtured and loved one another just makes her look even stronger.
Éowin represents everything that a man actually love in a strong woman. Beauty Courage Compassion Empathy Respect Fierceness But also vulnerability and Femininity Miranda Otto was the perfect cast for that role.
@@twelvecatsinatrenchcoather uncle. Her father died long before events in the trilogy. She and her brother eomer stays in the palace with their uncle.
Hermione Granger wasn't as powerful as Harry but she often outperformed him cause she spend hours and hours reading books and no one ever said that one of these characters were weaker than the other. Hermione just found a way to compensate the lack of pure power and used her intelligence to outsmart others.
Hermione is not a good exemple. She was not just intelligent, she could do spells on her first try. She was not just book smart. Harry was forced to be competent in moment of crisis because he was put in those positions. He was powerful but we never knew if his magic was stronger than hers.
@@istoria4999 Um--the magic is a metaphor for her other "powers" of brains and personality--the reason she has more powerful magic is that she studies a lot! She's not ALWAYS superior magically--e.g. the contrast between her dissing the others over raising a feather (it's winGARDia!) and her paralysis before the troll, when it's the guys who can say the spell better in a physical crisis. Metaphors, metaphors.
Hermione put in more work than the entire school man, she even asked for an artifact that could turn back time just so that she can attend more classes, man, a time machine. to do more work. There is a reason that she always acts like a know-all, it's 'cause she fkn do. She deserves all of her strength and wit. she a real one in my book.
Hermione was great at magic because she is smart and her thirst for knowledge drove her forward but she was never perfect. She has her flaws like being extremely good in a classroom setting but less competent in dangerous situations (more notable in the earlier books/years), she also could be annoying because she got hyper focused on studying and would chatted insistently about it and although she was usually the best in every subject she was not as good in Defence Against The Dark Arts (she even admits this herself and struggled to produce a patronus until Harry helped her in their DA lessons). Now I admit she was probably the closest to being a perfect character in the books (and film) but she wasn’t actually perfect, she was still a flawed individual who messed up and struggled but her struggle was to do with growing up, discrimination and social interaction with her peers. Hermione is a weird example because she could be interpreted as a “strong female character” but she is nuanced and well written enough that she comes across as talented individual that you low key envy in some respects but don’t actually wish you were. Sorry about the essay but I thought Hermione was an interesting character to discuss in this subject matter.
As a woman, I'm just tired of this trope. It's not empowering to see a female character just act like an asshole to everyone and then succeed like Velma or Fake Galadriel. It's not empowering to see them be such a boring character like Rey. It's not empowering to see someone just be an inconsistent character like Wanda. I want more than the damsel in distress stereotype but by getting rid of it, they're just stereotyping us even more. You know what is empowering? Watching Mulan get kicked out of training for bringing the team down and instead of leaving and giving up, working all night to complete Shang's challenge and do what every other man in the camp couldn't by retrieving the arrow. That was character development. That was a beautiful and powerful moment. Why is it so difficult to have more moments like that for women?
Thank you for saying this. I'm so tired of seeing female characters as the strong lead rescuing men ... so unrealistic - its fantasy! Even in Disney cartoons like Brave, Mulan, Tangled - Hollywood is such a joke.
Sorry to say,in Tangled I believe doesn't have that kind of woke thing.In the end,it a hero character who come to save a heroin character.The man been stab and the girl heal him with her special power from her hair.And last they be together.Happy ever after.
I always loved Eowyn's story. She wasn't being left behind when Theoden and Eomer rode off. Theoden understood that they were going on a suicide mission. And he needed someone whom he could trust and was strong to lead the Rohirrim, thus making Eowyn queen. She faced down the Witch-King to protect her king and kinsman, showing both loyalty and bravery. After the battle, she married Faramir and settled down: "I will be a healer, and love all things that grow and are not barren." She understood that the time for being a shieldmaiden was over but she still had much to contribute in bringing peace after all of the destruction.
One important thing about Sarah Connor. Do you remember her repetitive dream sequence? This is the fucking huge epitome of her character. She sees herself, her former self, wearing a floral dress, playing with kid and being happy, just to be destroyed by impending doom. Her dreams about being a normal woman and mother of her child destroyd by an inevitable war. She hates this idea so much that she's deciding to kill that Cyberdyne dude. She never wanted to be like that, she just HAD to become one to protect her child. She decided to give up on her dreams not because she didn't want that "patriarcy induced bullshit" but because she wanted them so much that she had to sacrifice everything to keep them safe. It is not just "she is so cool and badass", people just didn't realize her strong feminine aspirations.
She had her femininity & innocence destroyed by the 1st Terminator's relentlessness. She just became like a hardened combat vet after, the writers didn't treat her as an overcompensating woman at all but just human. Reminded me of Vietnam vets that went into the woods & became anti-social survivalist preppers.
A friend of mine is an actual female writer. When I asked her about her views , she says the issue is agenda. Modern/woke female writers don't want to write female characters as people. They want to write them as agenda driven memes.
I’m a female writer myself, as well someone with a very strong sense of empathy. Making my characters, especially women, less human doesn’t roll with me either
Emily Blunt was called out for that comment on the basis of her having played a number of strong female characters. However, if you read the context in the interview where she said it she means that if a writer has to use that phrase to describe a character she knows that they are a terrible writer and the rest of the script or pitch is trash and she shouldn't waste her time actually reading it.
She plays the ultimate Strong Female Character in Edge Of Tomorrow, the script is smart in letting us know that the trials that Cruise's character went through were the same trials SHE went through. We believe she is tough by seeing how Tough Cruise gets it, making the whole thing much more believable. Scriptwriters must have noted that, learnt none of the lessons and just thought, oh Emily Blunt. She can play tough, and take it from there. The Drinker is right, it's so boring.
The Full Metal Bitch was way stronger than Cage. Cage let his feelings for Vrataski stop their mission. He knew she died in that farm, but once she realized she wouldn't let something as basic as a gruesome and painful death stop the mission.
@@jayavionharris And the support they do get isn't even from normal women, it's from crazy feminists and trans women. And they all pretend they care when these movies flop, but they don't, really. Success or not, they're just happy that Hollywood panders to them. They know that all they have to do is say over and over that they flopped because mAn tRaNspHobiC & BaD, and way too many people will just go along.
I can't say why "strong female" characters are so popular ( it seems they aren't ), but I can say why I found the obvious matriarch of this gynocentric genre of kickassery appealing ( it wasn't her fabulous fashion sense in leather ). Most of the time Xenia was just hanging out and messing around with Gabriel - she was off duty. This what I find disappealing about so many "strong male" characters. Stuck in tough guy mode. You kicked somebodys' ass did you ? Wow, get over it. The problem is these "strong male" characters were not invented by tough guys. What we got is a preadolescent image of what a man should be ( Jody ).
As a writer, we plan out a heroic character arc, then the suits come in and make the main character a female, gay, crippled, black, etc... And if they have any weaknesses, it becomes, "You Hate (insert non-hetero white male character type)." So, all of the flaws and weaknesses are removed and the character is suddenly perfect, just the way they are. It's got all the dramatic tension of watching someone play a video game with cheat codes.
You hit the nail right on the head! I am so sick of these crap filled lead women action rolled movies. Why can't they see the meaning of insanity, keep doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result. We, the majority of audience hate these movies! The fact that they lose money on every one of them, just doesn't out way their desire to push their agenda no one wants to hear! Thanks for saying it out loud!!!
Tbh, before I discovered you're channel, I often felt like I was just spouting nonsense as no one really seemed interested. Glad there is someone out there, putting out their of frustration with modern entertainment and the lack of quality therein. Keep up the work Drinker.
What’s funny is I have always found that man love, well, written, strong, female characters. You don’t have to go all the way back to terminator or alien. You don’t even have to go back to fury road you can look no further to everything everywhere all at once. You write a female character. Well, you can make her as strong as you want. Men will respond positively.
@@Stockhandle123 Everything Everywhere All At Once was great. EEAAO showed that audiences will love great characters in an interesting story regardless of gender, age, ethnicity, whatever. Arcane was great. It showed that most people aren't turned off by interracial or same sex relationships, but are invested in good human stories.
Xena was a wonderful example of a female character who was not only physically strong but it didn't feel out of place. She would outsmart and use what she knew to her advantage, rather than just being strong. She had motherly instincts, emotional flaws and felt far more well rounded as a character than a lot of the female characters these days.
The advantage was also that she was written as counterpart to hercules. As god of strengh he solved most conflict by tossing giants. Xena used her speed, techniques weapons and sorroundings more akin to a trained shaolin. It was still silly fantasy fights but within the universe it all felt natural and fitting. Now a days shed outmuscle a bodybuilder just because. But luckly her actress nailed it. Im dissapointed with how unbelivable and poor most modern action actresses peform as opposed to their past counterparts. Like someone using a weapon as if they picked one up for the first day in their life, weakly or wildly swinging while opponents let themseoves fall on purpose rather then delivering a good belivable coreography.
@@TrafalgarWaterDLaw-dl5cm I think the other difference is that Lucy Lawless genuinely looked like she could kick your ass if she put her mind to it. She was tall, muscular enough and imposing in a way that wasn't hyper masculine. Xena took those triats and enhanced them yes, but even though it was silly over the top fantasy, it felt like it was possible
@@Mazikeen1809 I agree. She looked moved and acted the part to embody a belivable warrior woman. Now a days every skinny 5 ft girl kicks bulky man around while moving very stiff and fake. I miss when you had to learn skills for a role to a belivable degree.
The pregnant Marge Gunderson in Fargo was a strong female character. Persistent, courageous, intelligent, noble. I didn't have to see her kick some guy's ass to get the message.
Yes, agree with you. Loved that movie, for years after seeing it I wanted my own personal heavy duty woodchipper, to use in case I ever found some guy intruding into my house. After I shot him, I'd chip him up, really good, and no one would know what happened!! LOL ;D
Strength of character matters. Just as this video illustrates, all Hollywood seems toc are about is establishing a false equivalency of physical strength, demonstrating a clear preference for female empowerment over actual character development.
Like one of your fans below writes 'establishing a false equivalency' for the Corporate-World, the false equivalency media fuels the social deterioration CCP weaponizes via Woke fakery.
Man, going back and watching all these drinker videos on why modern movies suck has been so eye-opening. Not in a “oh thats why” sort of way, but in the “yes thats exactly what i thought i just couldnt put those thoughts into words” sort of way. Thanks drinker for calming my mind and letting me get back to the important things… like this bottle of Laphroaig quarter cask 😎👍
I’m glad you mentioned the ridiculous woman taking down a man twice her size thing. As an average sized woman, that has always annoyed the hell out of me
@Caro1ns - that would be a difficult even for the average guy, or a man with some basic fighting skills. Twice the size? Nah, not gonna happen. That guy would simply want to be close to you, so he can grab you, and spin your body so your head will hit some pavement, trash can, some corner of a table in the pub, and so on. In extreme cases (when on drugs) he will try to take your eyes out, break one of youe fingers, crush your throat, stab you with a pen or pencil multiple times in a few seconds, or try to bite off part of your nose, cheek, upper/lower lips and so on... (note: seen all of that in a real life). Even a normal guy, with some basic skills wouldn't want to fight a dude like that. Even if you manage to win that one, good luck with your own treatment in a hospital.
As a smaller-than-average-sized man, this annoys the hell out of me too. I’ve been hit by average sized women many times and I’ve never even had a bruise to show for it. Watching a 100 pound woman kick a man across the room is beyond ridiculous.
@@Superabound2 Or, like the Drinker hinted at, the woman attacks with surprise and uses her environment and tools therein to get off a solid, staggering shot and then does not let up in her attacks. Even then, it only closes the gap in strength and size.
When you put Elizabeth Swan from "Pirates of the Caribbean", I had a realization: she is what a real "strong and independent woman who no need no man" is. She starts being trapped in her role as a daughter of a wealthy man whose only purpose is to be married to someone powerful for the sake of her family, but due to her strenght of character and intelligence, she ends up being a vital character, and not just a damsel in distress. And though she's not the greatest fighter (iirc, she learns how to fight after the first movie, but can't recall a single major duel of her), she never yields to the wims of others. In fact, all the female characters of the trilogy are pretty great (and yes, I said trilogy, the other movies don't exist), and if Hollyweird wasn't so fixated nowadays in turning women into disguised men, they would use characters like her more in their movies.
Elizabeth Swan is a great character. But everyone in Pirates have amazing and satisfying arcs from top to bottom from Jack Sparrow to Capt Barbosa to even James Norrington. Love the scriptwriting in this trilogy (yep trilogy) overall
They aren't even turning them into disguised men. They are turning them into unlikeable abominations. A very good example of how men are written good is in, say, Saving Private Ryan. This movie shows that all of the soldiers have their problems and flaws. They try to act tough at times, but at others their hold on their emotions breaks and they show how vulnerable they actually are. Captain Miller with his hand tremors from PTSD, the medic calling out for his mother when fatally wounded, Vin Diesel trying to save the girl, and getting killed for it, the translator that has to overcome his cowardice. It shows that, while men may be acting more stoic or seem emotionless at times, that they still do have emotions and the vulnerabilities that come with it.
With T2, I like that they made Sara Connor more of a desperate character than a strong character. It shows how she took the time between 1984 and 1997 to prepare, and she didn't just magically have all these inhuman strengths to start with.
She was also a very active character. By that I mean, , whatever stuff gets inflicted upon her, how Sarah react to said-things, instead of actively making them happen, is what defines her character. She also had a defining personality, especially shown very well in the first film. Plus the two films manage to create some of the greatest instances of set up-&-payoff and dramatic irony to it's effect with her character.
Right. Only male white characters, similar to me and you can acquire magically such great traits! We want movies with no females at all or at least in totally submissive roles! 🙃
@@reedr7142 I think it's set in 95, because Sarah was pregnant when she drove off at the end of T1, and John is listed as 10 years old in the police computer at the start of T2. It's reasonable to assume that he was born sometime in 85. However, the movie came out in 91.
That's why a movie like "Gone with the Wind" is a masterpiece. Scarlet starts being frivolous & spoiled & lives, grows & changes through her trials. The character has depth & difference facets to it. This relentless & stubborn feminism is not only tiring but a pure scam
Emily Blunt is probably the last good female action star, even in A Quiet Place, she's shown to be a caring loving mother but she's also still a badass momma bear who takes on horrifying aliens to save her kids. And she's believable at it too. John Krasinski hit the jackpot with her.
I think agent Clarice Starling from "Silence of the Lambs" is a really good example of strong character. The way she fights and overcome her inner demons to save the hostage in the final sequence makes her strong in a very credible way.
She's also based on an ancient European storytelling trope: The virgin offered to the demon sealed in the cave to appease its hunger. MAN I love that movie...
I'd like to nominate Jessica Fletcher from Murder She Wrote as a great example of an actual strong female character. She's highly intelligent without bring condescending. She's thoughtful, charming, graceful, forgiving, resourceful, and funny. The fact that I, as a thirty year old man, can relate to and respect a middle aged female character more than any modern day "hero" says a lot.
Without fail, everywhere Jessica went, someone died. That's power! Love how a novelist with no forensic training was able to walk through crime scenes contaminating evidence yet still gets the killer. Put realistic procedure aside, this show was so well written to the point where Jessica's strength as a character never needed to be acted at all. It solely came through in the writing.
Strength is a lot like bravery, it’s doing something in the face of an adversarial force and using your whole being to overcome it no matter the difficulty, or not faltering in the face of it.
As a black female growing up (41 now) I never felt that I wasn't represented in films! I loved seeing women in films that made me want to be like them. Not because they were white, black, asian, whatever race but because of what they over came in the story or how the raised above a hardship and the strength it took for them to accomplish it. I'm not saying that it isn't nice be diverse in films but don't do it for just to say you are being inclusive. Do it because this actor has something to add to the film. He or she is well fitted for the role. Now a days it feels so forced that it makes the film bad!
I'm a white guy from a rural area, growing up on a farm I loved to watch Fat Albert it provided a glimpse into the world of city life and it was fun to relate to characters from a completely different background, and they were relatable because they were human and humanity relates to it's own story
@@johntabler349 Normal people appreciate and are intrigued by different cultures and people groups. Society tries to indoctrinate us into being "threatened" by them. Divide and Conquer.
Ripley was a woman, which was obviously invented by a male. It suited the plot, as the feminist woke shit was already running in the US, which was the most important market. People knew, it was just a quota woman. But a man wouldn't be able to destroy "Mother" and kill an "Alien Queen" as it was politically incorrect in regard to liberals.
So were the 1950s in fact. Western heroines Annie Oakley, Dale Evans, Frankie Adams and Police Officer Casey Jones all ruled the TV while the movies had the actresses Grace Kelly, Maureen O'Hara and ESPECIALLY Barbara Stanwyck in multiple action or other strong roles. Can't believe he didn't mention any of them here.
Traits like arrogance, self-entitlement, know it all, stoic, bluntness, rudeness, ruthlessness, confidence, self-respect, and aggressiveness For males, they’re flaws But for females, they’re “strengths”. Double standards
Some of Aragorn's most powerful scenes were when he displayed utter humility: closing Frodo's hand around the ring and telling him he would have followed him into the very fires of Mordor, consoling Boromir on his deathbed, and bowing to the hobbits.
Then after showing signs of humility and superiority over Bomori who had been overcome of his "white man's greed"... His skin turned black. Now she is Aragon the black. Pretty sure that is how it will go in next lotr movie when progressives make it.
Yo I've never cried so much in a movie than the first time I saw everyone in Gordor bowing to those Hobbits. I saw it in IMax the first time and it was unreal.
I'm glad you included Clarice Starling. When she relates the story of her trying to save one lamb from the slaughter, it was chilling, and yet you could feel her sorrow and pain. Even Hannibal is moved by it, so much that he won't kill and eat her. That's saying something.
There was an element of "luck" to it too, in that if Hannibal's cell neighbour Miggs hadn't Spidermanned his jizz at Clarice, Hannibal wouldn't have opened up to her. He was combative and dismissive until that happened. In his words, "discourtesy is unspeakably ugly to me" - he felt that he owed Clarice his time because of this incident. Then he also convinces Miggs to kill himself as a perverse "gift" to Clarice, too.
Hannibal Lecter was in love with Starling. He didn't feel sorry for her. He wanted her for himself. At the end of the novel Hannibal, sequel to Silence...he gets his wish. The movie changed it to a more stupid, less interesting end.
@@Marss13z The book is even weirder than just love, he sees Clarice as a vessel he can somehow channel his dead sister into. The chapters when he's genuinely trying to figure out a mathematical equation to reverse time and bring his sister back really illustrate how batshit insane he is, underneath the calculating genius. Although his origin story did hurt his mystique a fair bit.
Emily Blunt has portrayed probably the most actually true "strong female characters" in the last decade between Rita Vrataski, Kate Macer, and Evelyn Abbott, all flawed characters dedicated and relentless in the pursuit of their duties in the face of massive challenges. And, ironically considering 'the message', her character arc in Edge of Tomorrow is that she softens/opens up more as the movie goes along and the challenges increase, never not being a badass as a result.
She's also fantastic in Looper. Play's the typical "strong female character" at the start, but we quickly realise that it's an act the character herself is putting on as a bluff to survive, and she is actually far more vulnerable and complex and relatable than she appears at first, while still being a badass.
It's really mind boggling to me that there are weirdos who are so obsessed with stahng whamen that they don't seem to judge a movie by any other standard than that. Like imagine someone being that obsessed with strog male characters in movies. Literally what does the sex of a character has to do with anything? Grow up.
Not familiar with the other ones, but her performance in Sicario is one of my favorites by any actress ever. Glad to see her speaking out against this nonsense.
@@candide1065 It is even more mind blowing that you don't realize that the depiction of a character is tied to the narrative, and thus impacts the quality of a production, its reach, and the story.
That ending clip where Sarah Connor is comforting her son is the most badass womanly scene I can imagine. After John's idealized father figure, The Terminator, sacrifices himself to prevent the future from repeating itself, John is grieving because of his feelings towards the inanimate machine. John's mother provides him a shoulder to experience and release that emotion, an astounding feat given her personal animus against all things Skynet. The character of Sarah Connor isn't tough because she says "I AM WAMEN HEAR ME ROAR'. Sarah Connor is tough because she HAS to be to protect her only child from a deadly threat in the future. Yet, at the end of the movie, she turns that all off because the threat is over, and she returns to being a mother who needs to comfort her own son in his deep sadness. A loving mother--there's nothing more badass and feminine than that.
Agreed... although I would add that she was tough and strong because at the end of the movie the t1000 was no more and she was still standing (barely) .... she outlasted the machine. Anyone else would have broken, run, died, pick your poison. Because she was a trained operator AND a mum... take away either of those ingredients and that cake dont bake Good chat
"failure itself does not define a character, its how they react to it that matters" - The Drinker “Why do we fall, Bruce? So we can learn to pick ourselves up.” - Thomas Wayne
I wrestled in high school and in the US military. Served in two wars. Have been in countless fights. I lost every fight until I was 16, and most wrestling matches until I was 15. Still lost matches until my very last one, but have not lost a fight in nearly 40 years. I learned how to fight and defend myself by losing... a lot. Now I drag race, build my cars and compete against others. I learn more from losing than I do by winning, because it means someone has figured out how to do it better, go faster, or whatever else they did to win. Losing makes me better at everything I do. It teaches me where I need to improve, what I need to learn, and motivates me to put in the work required to win. When life beats you down, you have a choice. Lay there and take it, give up and expire, or get up and fight back. I have always gotten up and fought back, even when I would just get knocked down again and again.
I like how you explained that being physically strong, doesn’t make them a strong person. I think a great example of that is Captain America The First Avenger, before he got the serum he was already strong in his ideals and always did the right thing. Regardless of his size, it made him strong to me and I empathized and idolized him.
Exactly, this is true of male characters as well. Physical strength is merely the surface level of strength and generally shown to be a guise for internal weakness. Yes, it’s more believable for men but still shallow if that’s all there is too it.
Another example is Homelander. His physical strength fractures his mental state and drives him absolutely mad with his power. While he is nearly invincible and stronger than the entirety of the human race, he's a psychotic freak who literally loves murdering people. Captain America already had the morals, Homelander didn't. The two are foils of each other. One is likeable because of his character and values, and the other is hateable because of his lack of morals and values. Taking out the strength and physical aspect, nothing really changes. One is already strong, while the other is immature, weak, and insecure.
Quote from the movie "The Hunt For The Wilderpeople"; "Im the Terminator, you're Sarah Conner. No, I'm the terminator and you're Sarah Conner, the first one not the second one, before she could do chin-ups!😄
What I love about Ripley in Aliens is during the opening scenes she is totally traumatised by her experience in Alien. Then throughout the film she is continually facing her fear, pushing through and doing what needs to be done. Then at the end, that moment in the lift as she is prepping her weapons about to dive into the alien hive to get Newt, you can tell she is terrified but psyching herself up, breathing, focusing, getting through that terror. It's so engaging to watch and grounds the character and film, and makes the win at the end well and truly earnt. I've watched the film countless times, but that level of humanity draws me in every time, so despite knowing the end by heart, it always makes me feel tense as to whether she can or will survive that literal nightmare.
True, but horror movies also historically have a young women be the main character and only survivor. I think horror suffers from an entire different issue when it comes to gender stuff.
@@cancerino666 I was going to post about this very thing. The "Final Girls" in horror films were always dismissed by the horror hating critics of the time, but they were almost always resourceful and survived in the end, in spite of being in terrifying situations where all of their friends have died. They were true "empowered women", before it was even a thing. Kirsty from Hellraiser is probably my favorite of these as she managed to negotiate her survival with the demonic Cenobites, crafting a deal to give them her uncle Frank who escaped them in exchange for her own survival.
This is why I like Mr. and Mrs. Smith fight scenes: Angelina uses weapons and tries to keep her distance to even her odds but loses that advantage when Brad gets into close range not to mention how she’s great with protocol but bad with improv. It shows that she has strengths and weaknesses and how she tries to negate the weaknesses
Pretty sure a modern remake would make Angelina's character some all perfect battle machine and make her save Brad's character constantly so that people can get the Message™.
The Secret of Nimh features a widowed mother as its main character. She grieves her husband, struggles with her children, and faces all manner of fears and obstacles along the way, aided by friends whom she expresses gratitude towards. THAT is a strong, female character AND a positive role model!
My 30yo kid's favorite movie of all time. My Mom insisted we have that movie for my daughters. We didn't have regular TV, I'm a music/radio person--tunes from daybreak to bedtime. Thus, so were my kids. But my Mom sent two VCRs for their bedtimes and provided the movies that they watched. Generational Wisdom is crucial. My grandchildren live with me/next door. They are not like other children. Critical thinkers.
They should watch Yor Forger from SpyxFamily. A badass assassin who can kill armies of enemies in seconds but still deals with physical defeat at times and emotional issues for her family. Ladies and Gentleman, this is how you get a great female character that you just want more of.
If I were an actress I’d be VERY careful about the work I take because being the next Rey or Captain Marvel could kill your career and cause audiences to dislike the actress instead of dislike the ones who truly destroyed that character: the writers.
Maybe, they choose to actively antagonize potentially paying customers off the screen. They could have just said that yeah, "maybe my character is a bit OP" and taken some flak for it. Instead they go out very publicly saying "this movie wasn't made for you". These roles aren't killing their careers (though certainly not helping), their behavior off screen is.
@@TravisHi_YT true however many of them don’t know what the final product is going to be until right before it release. The writers and producers are directly responsible for the story. The actors go out and do their best to make a believable character. Bree Larson and the Charlie’s Angels crew is kinda the exception. I’m not sticking up for the actors per say but instead just want to put the blame where it really belongs.
Haha! It sure is! It really makes you wonder what exactly these writers are basing their characters off of. Obvious absence of any real-world reference other than... probably a male character from something else.
Leelu in The 5th Element was a badass female done relatively well, she WAS imposing in her combat abilities but just because she was more powerful than everyone else didn't mean that she didn't face hardships. In fact she spent the majority of the movie as a fish out of water, despite being a superior being she was confused about the world she found herself in, and without a means of communication that everyone could understand she had to struggle to get her wants across and to understand why people were chasing her to begin with. She overcomes that by studying her futuristic computer to learn English and almost immediately during learning she also realizes the shit humans do and is torn on whether we're even worth saving to begin with. She hasn't completed her education, but it's so bleak that she nearly lost hope entirely...then of course she is shown "love" (cheese) and releases her power to save the world. But even during bouts of kicking all of the ass available for kicking, she STILL lost and still failed, despite her advantages. It made her relatable, it made her vulnerable when she's crying in an air vent doing her best to avoid being shot to pieces. She has all that power, but she's also not invincible and unflappable...in short, she was believable as a character within the context of her story. She couldn't have completed her task without the help from Bruce Willis's character and a few other guys also pitching in to help along the way. Despite having all the required power and being the only being capable of defeating Evil, she wouldn't have succeeded all by herself. Plus that opera scene is dope as fuck. I even get a kick out of the inserts and shifts to her kicking the Mangalores asses while the music is still going. Even matches up to it a few times.
I've always looked at it from this point of view: Most of these writers work under a grave misconception. They seem to belief that power and strength (of character) are the same thing. As an example, let's take a look at Luke and Rey from Star Wars: Both of them are quite powerful by the end of their respective trilogies. However, whereas Luke by then has also demonstrated great strength of character, Rey has not. Over the course of the original trilogy Luke starts out as a cocky and arrogant teenage "boy" who gets humbled almost immediately after he leaves the small, secluded world he grew up in. And from the moment he learns of his uncle's and aunt's fate as well as coming across many tough and scary people in the cantina, he realizes just how dangerous of a place the galaxy is and how much he needs Ben moving forward to protect and guide him. By this point of the story Luke is still just a "weak" boy. But through all the trails and tribulations he faces, losing Ben, losing to Vader, finding out the truth about his father and being unable to rescue his friend Han, he never gives in to despair, he perserveres and rights the wrongs of the past. He helps free Han, free his father from the darkness and frees the galaxy from the tyrannical empire. What makes Luke so inspiring is not his power with the force, it is the strength of character he developed throughout his journey. Rey on the other hand doesn't have these defining moments. She beats Kylo and basically every step of their journey. She develops force powers of extreme potency without putting the work into it or struggling with it. For crying out loud, from the start of her trilogy, at which point she doesn't even believe the force to be a real thing, to the end of episode 8 she somehow learns to do feats of power with the force that take jedi masters years of dedicated training and struggle to match. To show how ridiculous this is, between the start of episode 7 and the end of episode 8 just a short few days have passed. She however doesn't need to train for any of this. She never falls short at anything. She never yearns for anything because she already has everything the writers want or need her to have for the plot to move forward. By the end of her trilogy she has never once shown any strength of character because she never had to struggle for anything or fail at doing anything. She only ever shows feats of power and might. To me that is just not compelling though. Anyway, that was my two cents on the matter. Go away now.
The great aspect of Sarah Connor to me was the transformation from T1 to T2. In T1 she was a waitress. An ordinary girl. Pretty physically helpless against violence. By the end of T1 she'd toughened and started her journey. In T2 she'd transformed herself. You could believe it. And her backstory was told. The alliances she'd made. Learning from anyone who could teach her. She didn't simply arrive ready made.
I’ll add that it was her mothering instincts that motivated the transformation. She’s grows tough as nails because that’s what it takes to protect her child. It’s very feminine at its core.
Her transformation from T1 to T2 was the worst thing. Her change from the beginning of T1 to the end was good, but jumping from that to the ugly lunatic in T2 was a huge disservice to that character.
@@mattstorm6568 Why? She had terrible knowledge of Judgement Day, and got locked in an asylum, and essentially tortured. Her change is precisely what happens to people in the system.
I was a big fan of Pam Grier; she was a pioneer of the modern tough, independent female, but she was never seen beating up men larger than her. She was smart and determined and she came out on top.
Except she *wasn't* a pioneer of anything because there always have been tough and independent women in films. Like everything feminists say, it's a feminist lie that women have always been portrayed negatively by Hollywood. Dorothy Gale in The Wizard of Oz (1939) is one that immediately springs to my mind.
I remember the cop lady from season 2 of true detective she carried lots of knifes because she knows most of the criminals she has to deal with can over power her seems way more realistic then always been good at fighting
Vasquez in aliens didn't need to beat up one of the male marines to pander, instead they made her witty, cool and a part of her team and you will probably get more enjoyment out of just her scenes than the entirety of captain marvel
True, then Jenette Goldstein is a far better actor on top of that. Her scant scenes as John Connor's foster mother were better than all of Captain Marvel also. Especially when she was playing the T-1000 in her form, that was damn scary 😅
It's like she knew they were just a bunch of immature kids but she had earned her place by being one of them throwing back the jokes and even making jokes but when it came down to it, they had each other's backs and she was just as equal as anyone else on the team.
Ripley was such an amazing, complex character... saw the original film in the theatre when I was much younger and the film/character still sticks in my mind today.
Years ago, one of my Karate sensei’s was a woman. She was smaller than me, but much more experienced. She knew how to use her size to her advantage. It wasn’t about strength, it was about leverage, cunning, strategy, and patience.
Did you ever see her fight a man who was as skilled as she was, or did her karate only work on her students? A 6'5", 280lb male Black Belt will beat the piss out of a 5'2, 115 lb female Black Belt.
And would have happened if you had picked her up and body slammed her? Karate nerds watch far too many films. Traditional martial arts have been proven to be ineffective when tried against or fighting styles. Far too much focus on forms and not enough focus on real sparring and pressure testing. I can almost guarantee if she got into an actual fight against a man he would absolutely flatten her.
@@RedHeadKevin All other things being equal a man will have a strength advantage over a woman but that is hardly an insurmountable advantage for a skilled martial artist. In HEMA for example women have won entire tournaments against men. Now that's not to say women are the optimal choice for combat but the argument that woman can't beat men is objectively incorrect.
Sarah Connor was the coolest female protagonist in any movie ever. She was tough, smart, strong, and brave… but she still showed love for her son, and compassion to Miles Dyson’s family. And she never had to be pandered to, or have a male role put down to prove that she was capable.
@@Silence_Duder_Gooder Ellen Ripley is wonderfully written. There's a voice message by her in _Alien: Isolation_ read by none other than Sigourney Weaver. That 2 minutes made better characterization of Ellen Ripley than most writers in a whole movie.
It should be noted that Eowyn was severely depressed, having suffered under Wormtongue almost as much as Theoden, and losing her cousin Theodred in battle only a couple weeks earlier (who she was raised with & would have considered a brother). She believed self-deletion to be dishonorable, but saw "a way out" and went to the Battle of the Pelennor Fields fully expecting not to survive, only searching for one moment of lasting glory to finally give her life meaning before she died.
Plus, she was in love with Aragorn and was upset that he didn't feel the same way toward her. She begged him to let her go with him, but he refused her. She then begged Theoden to join the fight, and was refused again. The Witch-king's greatest weapon was fear, but Eowyn was too depressed to let that get to her when she faced him.
@@witteafval She also has the "happiest" ending in the entire story, considering the movies that is, what makes it even more deserved. Great character!
I’d dispute ‘depressed’. Eowyn was filled with despair and Aragorn represented the hope she’d lost (you know, because he’s called Estel?), so fixated her love on him. When she thought that hope lost, she went to die in the only way she saw as honourable, on the battlefield. Eowyn is a classic Anglo-Saxon heroine.
I knew a guy with a similar death wish. Far too crazy for the military, he got himself attached as a journalist to a front line combat group in Iraq. Before he went he got a tattoo of a dotted line around his neck. In front it said 'cut here', in back it said the same thing, in Arabic. He survived the war, then put a shotgun in his mouth. Eowyn's struggle was real. RIP, Caleb.
Tolkien understood all of what the Drinker was saying, somewhere deep in his writing bones. That's why it wasn't Eowyn alone who took down the Witch King--Merry and also a magic blade were needed. Tolkien for sure knew that the Witch King was too powerful for any one mortal. Even subtracting Glorfindel's prophecy, I doubt that, say, Eomer or Faramir or Boromir alone could take the WK. MAYBE Aragorn, but that brings in the whole other matter of the true king of the line of Elendil and what power and destiny might be in that.
True story: when I first started Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, my gym tossed all newbies to a female black belt they had on staff because she couldn't really hurt you. When she was showing me guard and different holds she'd always say, "Remember, this is gonna be really different sparring with a guy. Doesn't matter what I do, you could just muscle me around. But equal size and strength is a whole other thing".
@@absoluteai41 When they start out, you don't want to punish their inexperience, you want to let them know what they can do and what they can grow into.
@@absoluteai41 I've trained various martial arts for more than a decade, and the sad thing is weight and size are the biggest factors in a lot of fights. Proper technique and the right mindset helps a lot to even those odds, but if you take two fighters with relatively equal experience, but different sizes, the odds are in favor of the bigger one, this is the exact reason most fighting sports have different weight divisions. Another factor people tend to disregard is the willing to hurt the other. If someone wants to hurt you, they will and that's fucking scary. Also most martial arts and fighting sports spare the weak parts of the body, like eyes, crotch, throat etc. Self defense systems like Krav Maga are specifically designed for, well, self defense.
I was lucky enough to have a creative writing class at my school and an incredible creative writing teacher. One of the things he did was show us one of your videos to explain the issues with character writing in modern movies. Every time I watch one of your videos, I always learn something valuable and important about writing. As someone who eventually wants to put a book out there with well-written characters and an interesting plot, thank you Drinker for this channel and your videos.
This analysis of the present state of current movie making says it all. Thankyou Critical Drinker for revealing the stupidity and ineptitude of those who run the entertainment industry!!! Well done.
Case in point: Sarah Connor was tough as nails in T2, yet there is that pivotal scene during the escape from the mental hospital where she is briefly but absolutely terrified as the Terminator walks in. The trauma and total loss of composure shown by Linda comes through so effectively; yes she has a moment of weakness but it makes so much sense. Proof that tough female characters can show weakness at understandable points and it makes them more endearing.
That's some weird obsession that you have there. Why is it of any importace how """""tough"""""" a (FEMALE) character is? Can movies not be good if a - explicitly FEMALE - character isn't """""tough"""""". Are movies like American Psycho or No country of old men bad because they "lack" """"""tough""""" women? How about """""tough""""" men? Do they trigger you? And is the sex of any """""tough"""" character so important for you?
Tough *characters,* male or female, can do that. Watch Dr. No sometime. Watch the scene where the bad guys slip a tarantula in to James Bond's bed while he's sleeping. He wakes up just in time and is able to smash it, but Connery looks absolutely terrified. Good scene.
One of my all time favorite characters is Trinity from The Matrix. A strong character who, without having to say a million lines about how badass she is, is a badass. She’s driven, has a set of beliefs, and actually has some inner turmoil about it those beliefs. And best of all, it never comes off as forced. You believe it, because it was well written and phenomenally well acted.
We all have our favourites like that. Mine's Eryn Sun from Farscape. In the show, she's an alien and stronger than an Earth-man (the shows protagonist), but with enough inner turmoil and growth through the show to keep her interesting.
and best of all when she ccame up against the agents....she RAN!!!. She knew her limits. had that moment been in current day she would have stayed Stared them down "bravely", (looking at you peach) and attacked them 🙄🙄🙄 and almost certainly "beat" them. The hardest bosses in the movie.
I watched Alita Battle Angel yesterday, this female character is a warrior but also a realistic female who can fail time to time, can be arrogant and is punished for that, and is at several occasions saved by males. She is thankful for these characters and shows herself emotionnally vulnerable at several occasions. Despite her abilities she is not in competition with the males around her, she CARES for THEM and tries constantly to use her abilities TO HELP THEM. She is a great example of a physically strong but realistic, and lovely female character.
5:50 I think we all leaned this lesson with the Olympics this week when a DSD intersex biological male took out a skilled Olympic female boxer in less than 46 seconds.
I re-watched Dredd (2012) last week and realised that Judge Anderson is overlooked by most as a good female character, I liked her development from naive rookie to capable Judge through the film. She wasn't obnoxious, invincible or trying to out-do Judge Dredd all the time, she just earnestly tries to do what's right and they made a good team that can compensate for each other's weaknesses.
Ma-Ma was an excellent female villain, as well: smart, tough, ruthless and downright scary. She was the undisputed ruler of Peach Trees {at least, until the Judges showed up} not because the plot required it, but because she was the strongest and most dangerous. Her gender wasn't even an issue.
@@JonahsWail Agreed, I always thought it was a pity that it didn't get the full reboot treatment but they catered the marketing too much to the original audience for the little bit they did put out.
Amanda Tapping as Samantha Carter in SG1 was so amazing and had a big effect on me. Not only because she was a total badass in the show when she was called into action. But for the episode where she learned that her father had developed cancer. Let's just say it came very close to the mark with me in what I had to deal with in real life. Her character had such an amazing journey in the show and Samantha in the show got something I didn't get, more time with her father.
Ive been rewatching SG1 lately (up to S7) and really enjoy her character and what they did. Even Dr. Frasier in a smaller role, has a better character than modern female characters.
@@buzzcomber Frasier was one of the most heroic characters in the series. Loved every episode where she got the spotlight. Teryl Rothery played her brilliantly and added strength and warmth to her character in equal measure.
Watching 'Aliens' at the cinema a few weeks ago, I realised how great films contain little moments that build their characters. There is a moment where Hicks is showing Ripley how to use the pump-action gun thing. As he does so, she flinches - very brief, but enough to show that this was a real person who wasn't used to this environment and was genuinely unsettled. And this made her heroism all the more remarkable and relatable.
Ellen Ripley is perhaps the all time best example of a strong female character. Aliens is a masterclass in how to portray a woman that is strong yet feminine. She is vulnerable yet brave, afraid yet courageous. She is compassionate, empathetic and nurturing yet competent and decisive when relied upon. She is terrified to an almost debilitating state yet refuses to give up. She doesn’t try to compete with the marines or other men. Instead she adds value and attempts to think of things they may have missed. Thus she gains their respect.
I love Aliens. It’s one of my all-time favorite movies. I love Ripley. I think she is one of the best fictional characters ever. Her progression throughout the movie is phenomenal. But every time I watch it, during the scene where she has rescued Newt and it seems the Queen is going to let them go, when one of the eggs hatches and Ripley does that little head tilt, I want to scream, “Don’t do it, just get the f**k out of there, IT’S GONNA BLOW THEM ALL UP ANYWAY !!!!” And every time, she opens fire on the eggs, pissing off the Queen, starting the (admittedly awesome) battle resulting in the Queen hitching a ride on their escape shuttle, etc etc etc. I understand the drama and tension and excitement and whatever. But, damn, if ever there was a time to just…walk away, Renee, er, Ripley. 🤷♀️
Uma Thurman in kill bill was a great example of a female protagonist, you see the struggles she went through and see how badass she is now, it really makes you appreciate her more when you see her training
I don’t remember any struggles. She went from badass to winning. Very little challenge for her. Only struggle was before the movie. That’s the same as Rey. All her struggles were before the movie.
@@TeensierPython Before the movie? Lol.. I won't spoil for others what her struggle was but you're seriously either trolling or straight up joking right now.
@@TeensierPython Let’s see, she spent years learning how to fight, studying under a brutal master. She killed mercilessly until she became pregnant and realized life is precious and so on. Watch the movie.
Speaking about characters facing failures and backtracks on their path, I remember there was a webcomic about mercenaries that had this particular line: "Failure is not an option. It is mandatory. The option is whether or not to let failure be the last thing you do." It seems that Hollywood has forgotten that.
I remember that scene from _Sicario._ I was like, "Don't do it, don't do it, don't make this 'that kind of movie'....!" And then she got smacked down like almost anyone would going up against a seasoned professional trained to dispense violence. That's a great movie.
Sicario was a great, gritty movie that absolutely did not fuck around with fantasy wish fulfillment in many, many ways, including but not limited to the realities of being a woman on the force.
He's a CIA dog, not even remotely that kind of seasoned professional. I'm sure that the people around him were though. Not that he even needed to be that to put her down, just big, strong and kind of expecting it anyway. They were not unaware that she was tricked into it - that knowledge brings an expectation of, er... bad feelings when it gets found out later, unless they happened to be a simpleton which does not jive with a CIA operative, dog or not.
The same could be applied to Trinity in Matrix 4, where she suddenly could use all the powers and skill in a blink of en eye that Neo died to attain... Modern "strong female characters" uses cheat code to make them look superficially strong. There is no struggle, no learning curve, apathy...
I think that the more powerful the end point, the more painful the initial struggle has to be. My headcanon of Dovahkiin is destined to become a force that even Gods fear, but starts out on death's door because she's overdosed on her own healing magic so hard that her organs are failing.
For me these female characters are very cartoony. Very over the top comic strip. That is ok in that genre, but does not translate to live action at all. Live action implies live people (IMO)
@@silo_fx3182 There have always been live action males who are written as powerful characters from the start, and no one complained. Just look at any 80's action hero, or James Bond, even Indiana Jones. But God forbid they make a strong female character and all of a sudden the insecure guys come out of the woodworks complaining about what's real life or not. 🙄
FYI - Experienced an editing glitch that caused the video to freeze half way through. Sorry about that, but its fixed now so enjoy the vid!
It's not an issue. Keep fighting the good fight against THE MESSAGE
I thought ‘they’ had disappeared you. Relieved! You are a ray of fun in a crazy world, who saves my frame of mind.
I thought you had been flagged.
my conspiracy theory brain just overloaded when midway through your video it stopped and was suddenly not available anymore ;-P
Too bad... I had a great and poignant comment on the last video, but since I forgot it I'll just say... women ☕️
Mulan is the perfect example of what you are talking about. In the original animated Mulan, she started off as a weak recruit that was trained and hardened into a fighter. She learned to fight using her speed and intelligence, not brute force. In the live action remake, she started off with a special ability that allowed her to quickly excel with little effort. The first one could be seen as inspiration for girls to exceed despite what hinders them. The remake just says, "she exceeded because she had special powers."
meh, all female protagonists are empowered by magic including the ones we look back upon fondly.
Men are twice as strong in the upper body. That is not a little. Men evolved to mentally cope in combat situations. Men have faster reflexes. A woman vs. a man is a child vs. an adult. No comparison.
More female nature does not allow for heroism. They evolved to be too valuable to risk and naturally avoid conflicts and risk. See how many female firefighters died rushing into the burning WTC (zero btw)
Take Beth Harmon
Utterly fictional character because women do not compete mentally either. Hundreds of male top chess players exist for a single average female chess player. Hence why Beth was fiction (yet acted like women were good at chess, they are not)
She was trained, worked with, and fought... MEN. So... does that make her magically STRONG and EMPOWERED??? Ummm... and one more thing... IT. WAS. AN. ANIMATED. FILM. BY. THE. WOKE. HEADQUARTERS... DISNEY!
@@TheBelrick is this supposed to be bait?
@@DrakeSilver truth does tend to upset awful people who then get baited. So i suppose so?
But more importantly, it raises the awareness of how fooled into believing lies like muh empowered women, normies are.
@@linus1792 yep, the original mulan was still a circle jerk of unfounded reality but at least it was done in a minimalist to ego boosting way
There are people who want us to believe that women can fight for the same reason why their are people who slip poison into besieged cities wells.
Sarah Connor remains one of the most compelling female leads - she totally comes across as more than capable to best most men she encounters as she actually put in the work to convincingly portray the part. Yet in T2 the second she encounters the terminator she collapses in fear and flees, as she is self aware and understands her limitations. And NO ONE with a functional brain or beating heart thinks any less of her for it.
The awesome "Sarah-ness" continued in Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles. Lena Headey has almost eclipsed Linda Hamilton as my favourite Sarah, and I wish the series had done better. The writers said that the end of T2 left Sarah in a really interesting dramatic position: she was a single mother on the run from law enforcement, knowing what was coming and having to prepare John for the future. The series reflected this, how angry and isolated she is, and the certainty that she's going to die sometime between 1999 (when the series starts) and 2007 (they do a time jump in the first episode). And the horror of raising a wayward teenager who does stupid things like hack into the school's computer, which can leave a trail to tip off future Terminators is something she has to deal with every day.
I mean, she is cool, but is she compelling? I don’t think anyone watching her is thinking wow, what a well written naunced character
@@scottgimple8107 I think so. We are introduced to her working in a diner. A completely unremarkable and average woman of her age. She largely plays mentee to Kyle Reese throughout the first movie, but you see her grow as a character. Only a few days pass throughout the entire first movie. At the end we see her drive off into a storm and expect a positive future for her. The beginning of the second movie, we find that she didn't live happily ever after, she's institutionalised, she failed at raising her son, but she is hardened, physically and mentally. After John and The T800 rescue her, and some more growth after trying to kill Dyson, she then takes on the mentor role for John that Kyle Reese did with her.
@@hjf3022 I absolutely concur with that. She is written very well, with plenty of failings and struggles to overcome. And when she overcomes them, we cheer her on because we know that she put in the work to get where she is.
Think less of her? It made her more compelling. To see the determination not flinch but just shift current priorities. Love that. That's good writing
Ripley was done perfectly. She was often scared, indecisive, bested in battle, belittled by her male coworkers, and even - gasp - cried now and again. At the same time, she was 100% grade A badass.
Absolutely 100%. She was such a wonderful character. She also valued the men and women around her she felt she could trust and didn't treat them like they were less than her, but instead as equals. She was one of the best action heroes, man or woman.
I propose that female characters in action movies be measured in units called Ripleys (R). Ripley = 1 R. Someone like, say, Sarah Conner = 0.85 R (Aliens are slightly harder to deal with than Terminators). Of course, Strong Female Characters should be measured in Micro-Ripleys (mR, 1 R = 1000 mR). Rey would be ~20 mR.
She was one of a great many strong female characters who we all loved. Sarah Conner. Furiosa. Uma Thurman(Kill Bill). Vasquez. Princess Leia. Karen Allen(Raiders of the lost Ark)... to name a few. They were badass, and empathetic characters. We cared about them. Now they make strong female characters that no one gives a shit about.
best female character tied with Sarah Connor...Sijourney wins because she had more films...
My favorite
This can be so dangerous for girls/women, too.
The fantasy that they can physically fight men and win can be deadly in real life.
And I'm a woman trained in martial arts... where we were taught to avoid fights if at all possible.
I think your argument could be made for men as well though. A young man might get the false impression from seeing a 5'6, 145lbs Jet Li beating up men twice his size left and right that he can do it as well. Yet In agreement with your point, at least Jet Li is a 5-time Wushu champion and has the athleticism, speed, and martial arts background to help suspend our disbelief. His fighting choreography also shows that he's in serious trouble when he fights men much bigger if he fails to keep his distance from them, favoring an out-boxing type of mindset when fighting them with flurries of jabs and other swift attacks, or even reaching for weapons, to keep them at bay.
The problem I find with the way Hollywood often approaches this with female action heroes (unlike Asian cinema) is that they don't even bother to hire exceptionally athletic women or even design the choreography accordingly to help sell how she can take on bigger and stronger men. They can hire some pretty 5'2, 115lbs dramatic actress with only a modeling background -- and no background whatsoever in the likes of martial arts, aggressive sports, bodybuilding, stuntwork, not even dancing -- and have her beating up men left and right while getting in grappling distance with them. Even Jet Li has the humility and self-awareness to know that he can't plausibly sell that type of choreography in fight scenes involving him against bigger opponents.
@@darkengine5931 It is simple: either somebody was 1. in a fight 2. as Ramsey Dewey's guest said, tried to physically handle child throwing a tantrum - these two situations will learn ANYONE regardless of physical size or training that "strange things happen in one-two-point". Being huge, imposing brusier can be advantage in *discouraging* the fight, but peak of male strength / agility performance is usually in "high 170s cm". People having 190cm+ really need to train to catch up and from young age. Not to mention, that most movie scenes are shot specifically to be entertaining, show off not to be effectvie.
That goes for men too, you never know when someone has a concealed weapon
You also don’t know what friends they have who are lurking in the shadows.
100% correct. The fact is, women just aren't that tough, and everybody knows that. Women who fight, lose badly.
People don't dislike female characters. They dislike poorly written characters.
No, women cannot act the part and they do not look the part. Same stances, same looks, rarely looked trashed and will never go through the movie with the black eye or swollen lip received while they were being strong.
@@winstonsmiths2449 Yes they can dumbazz, there are many women who have acted perfectly well and can pull emotions better than men actually since they tend to use emotions more often. The fact you deny this means you are just one of those incels. Are there bad female actors? Yes just like there are bad male actors. Are all of them bad at acting? No to generalize so is stupid.
@@winstonsmiths2449 Bro, if you think we want your type, your wrong. We hate sexisim agains men AND woman.
Edit: I have said that I misunderstood them and even said sorry. I'm getting real annoyed how you guys keep replying to my comment but won't put any effort to see my new responses.
Edit: I would usually be proud of this many likes but something tells me it's by woke lunatics, unless I'm wrong.
Also, for the love of gosh, please stop sending me hate and saying how I'm sexist or wrong when I have admitted to being incorrect
Thank you, This channel is starting to turn into right wing circle jerk. These are just movies at the end of the day.
No, it's not the role for them no matter how you write it, it's out of place. Stop with this "compromise" nonsense. Stop being a fence sitter.
The reason why Sigourney Weaver was so incredible in Aliens, is because her character didn't possess any insane abilities. She wasn't overly smart or strong, she didn't fly around and walk through walls. She was a average scientist who had no idea how to fight or operate guns etc. Her weaknesses were on display the entire time and she managed to get herself though it. The role wasn't some stupid caricature of female empowerment and everyone loved it.
Mad integrity, too, to refuse to let her injured mate on the ship because it could (and did) harm everyone else on board.
She wasn't even a scientist. Ripley's job was like an interstellar truck driver. They wanted her to come along because she was the only one who had a damn clue about the Xenomorphs.
She had courage, reasonable intelligence and _common sense_ - something severely lacking in Weyland Yutani employees.
Ridley did whatever she could to survive with what she had. She didn’t possess special powers only an instinct to survive. That’s what made this movie so great and Weaver’s character so iconic. The other characters were great as well. I never get tired of watching this movie!
She was just a pilot, not a scientist. Like someone working on a container ship.
I'm a tall girl, 5'9. I was in a brief relationship with a guy who was shorter, skinnier, and weighed less than me, and he was still significantly stronger than me to the point I knew he could hurt me if he actually tried. Modern movies are ridiculous in their lack of realism.
atomic blonde is a film I would recommend as it has realistic action based on the hand to hand combat they teach women who work as spies and in special forces.
@@samueldawkins I still don't buy it. I'm in the army and even when women join special forces, they alway take support or surveillance roles. Those hand to hand combat techniques are last ressort and will still fail most of the time if your opponent is bigger/stronger.
@@samueldawkins a story based on something I heard, from someone who told me, that something was possibly based on a thing they heard, was maybe true.
Tell us more about the so called SF/spy techniques that are taught. Please. The audience is enthralled with your fairy tales of she-hulks barely defeating average men.
@thibaldus3 agreed. When I went through combatives training, I had the opportunity to have to roll with two women. One immediately went to my back and correctly applied the rear naked choke. She wasn't strong enough. I choked the first one I grabbed until she tapped, then I pulled the one off my back and did the same. She was really upset and couldn't understand why it didn't work. I told her she just didn't have the strength necessary to apply the choke.
But you're ok with Rambo doing all kinds of impossible things....why? Cause he's a man? lol....
the best way to end with such a garbage agenda is to IGNORE such films completely.
Marge Gunderson from _Fargo_ is one of the strongest characters in film history. Coincidentally, she's a great example of how Lawful Good doesn't need to be "lawful stupid."
All the female protagonists in the Fargo TV series are also pretty great characters. Smart, brave, and likeable, but also flawed. And not just written like male action heroes.
Absolutely. One of my all time favorite female movie characters. Seems like a naive rural housewife first, but is actually a super clever detective. Very well written and well acted.
Great movie
Heck I'd argue Penny from the Rescuers in 1977 is a better female character and shes just an animated little girl.
In the first half of the film, she drops a help message in a bottle that travels to the Rescue Aid Society and attempts running away too. Madame Medusa the villain of the film even yells shes done it again meaning this isnt Penny's first escape and the fact Penny is willing to run away without packing any supplies prives her willingness to escape her captors
@@andybrice2711Probably one of the best TV shows of all time IMO.
Strong female character is really just shorthand for abrasive, unlikable, completly flawless, and portrayed by an actress garaunteed to get into Twitter fights with anyone who doesn't worship her role as stunning and brave
I wonder if you’ll consider this template being used for a man character problematic.
@@SoyboyPeter "Gary Stu" is a thing, yea.
Modern definition refers to a non ovulating female with too must testosterone as a strong female. A strong female character would be what is a woman. Muscles is men. Nurturing is women. Ripley only went back to the planet because of her nightmares, but once there she kept fighting because of her maternal instincts protecting Newt when her own child grew up without her and had already died. Sarah protected her kid. Marion in Indian Jones, she didn't seem that strong. Buffy was given a younger sister to raise after losing her mom.
Women need to be allowed to act feminine on screen again
Too perfect Mary Sue = "Strong Female Character".
Ripley from Aliens was one of the best female characters ever because she showed bravery and skill not because she was not afraid-she clearly was-but because she was so committed to rescuing the little girl that she found the courage to confront the Alien mother and kill it. Humanity with courage and competence is a very attractive combination.
Lmao right? I just got out of a semester with a professor who said that the movie was sexist because she was “too masculine.” She was a woman too.
@@_.hybrids._1680 imagine not steeling your nerves when someone else’s life is in danger, your lady professor would’ve probably been the first casualty in a survival movie 😂
Also, Ripley character wasn't written with a woman or man in mind. The writers created a well rounded believable character, then it happened Sigourney Weaver was cast as Ripley.
Yepp one of the best female characters in one of the best movies ever
Ripley was the "strong female" only because the men in the cast were portrayed as a bunch of incompetent sissies, even the little girl had more balls then these military trained men. Even the guy that was in charged of the mission freaked out under pressure, so with idiots like those, it was pretty easy to see Ripley as the "strong female" type.
I think Over-confidence looks gross on both men and women. No balance.
Exactly!
IT LOOKS LIKE THAT EVEN ON WOMEN
Overcofindence is a flimsy shield - Tekhartha Zenyatta
Nah, there are several characters that over-confidence works very well on. Easy examples : John Wick and Clint Eastwood. They are oozing with overconfidence, and we LOVE them for it.
No. they just don't have to be glorified or be shown in complete positive light. realistically such a people do exist
Sarah Connor is a very good example which I never realized about. The writers never tried to overpower her from other men, she ran and escaped where she had to. She planned things out with her team. The writers never forcefully tried to show us that she's "equal" and as strong as the terminator.
Female or otherwise....that's what you WANT to see. An underdog protagonist bravely fighting against something much bigger/stronger/dangerous.
yea but only in the first and second movie
@@WaryofExtremes after the third film they discarded the John Conner act. Yes the messianic figure that the original film and its even more popular sequel build up. Instead they reintroduced Sarah Conner as a "strong female character".
She was played by the same actress just older, but now she was scrubbed clean of flaws and personality.
My old drama teacher always said that they make the first film because they have a great idea, and the second just to make money. But what do they do when they turn it into a franchise?
well I don't even think money is the goal anymore. by the fifth film they actually kill John conner in the past
@@stevej71393 Sarah Conner is the mother of John Conner, that is her MO, he is the one that is the prophetised one in the frasnshise
That key toss as a diversion before the gut hit with the baton was such a nice touch .
The best example of this is Mulan. In the animated movie, she constantly struggles during boot camp to the point where others are telling her to quit.
Then comes the giant pole with the arrow on top of it, and no one can get to it. No one! Not even the strongest recruit.
Mulan refuses to give up, and while everyone else is sleeping, she keeps trying her hardest until she reaches the top of that giant pole. When her drill Sergeant comes out in the morning, Mulan throws that arrow at his feet. It was a powerful moment, not just for Mulans character, but for ALL kids regardless of gender.
Jump to the live action movie, and Mulan is so strong from the moment of birth that she literally has to physically hold herself back so as not to easily embarrass everyone around her. Absolutely butchered her character with a straight trash message.
That moment when is climbing up and song hits its peak. Fantastic, you are in on her journey.
Keep in mind it wasn't simply endurance that got Mulan to the top. Getting to the top of the pole had to be done while wearing weights. Mulan uses cleverness in order to use the weights as an advantage instead of a handicap. It played to her using her intelligence to keep pace and even surpass others.
This, right here. The cartoon Mulan had everything to lose. If she was discovered, she'd be arrested. Going into battle, she very well might die. But, even knowing this, she risked it for her father. She could not physically keep up with the men. She literally had to be helped just to try and keep up. But, when she climbed the pole, it wasn't brute strength that got her there. The men were trying to climb the pole wearing the weights and they couldn't. She couldn't. It was when she stopped trying to be the strongest and used her brain that she did it. Instead of letting the weights pull her down, she used them to climb with. It was brilliant. During the battle with the Huns, she again thought through the problem and played to her strengths, showing that everyone has talents and they are all just as valuable as physical strength. In the end, she again risked everything to save her friends and her country, also playing to her strengths. She grew in confidence and saw her value. She had the confidence to say to the men, "I have an idea, follow me." Can you see her doing that at the beginning of I'll Make a Man Out of You? And they follow her without question, even Shan. And we went on that journey with her. We wanted her to succeed. We cheered when she did. We learned that we all have skills and worth, even if we don't see it. We just have to find it. What risk did the new Mulan have? She was the strongest and the best. She wasn't going to die and all she had to do was just have the men get out of the way. She wasn't really likeable. There was no risk which made the reward hollow. I didn't get to know her and I didn't care if she won or not. What growth did she have, what did we learn?
You are 100% right. The two Mulans are a very good illustration of what went wrong.
Not only that but once everyone saw that it could be done. Every one got their morale up and started working together.
Mulan turns the challenge of climbing the pole, around by thinking outside the box.
Work/think smarter not harder, there's more than one way to skin a cat.
They had to climb with 2 weights with was impossible for anyone at the time.
She figured out the solution, ties the weights together throws them around the pole and uses them to her advantage to climb the pole super easily with barely an inconvenience.
Overcoming the challenge and making it look easy to everyone else by comparison.
Our mind and our ingenuity are our only and greatest weapon and Mulans mind has been honed to a razor sharp edge by the end.
She also single handedly destroys the entire Mongol horde by using the environment to her advantage and causing an avalanche too.
She learned a lot from the pole challenge.
And later they infiltrate the palace to save the emperor using her technique of wrapping stuff around poles to enable them to climb up and do eventually save the day.
Also, can we just talk about how Disney felt the need to elevate already strong female characters into "even stronger" by basically making their whole personality "badass female character"?
For example, Belle was already a well written character, a girl who is nerdy and quiet but also knows where to stand up for herself or the people she cares about (rejecting Gaston directly, yelling at the Beast and refusing to join him for dinner, showing no qualms about walking away from him when he tried to scare her, scolding him later for not controlling his temper). But the live action? Belle is not strong enough, she needs an occupation to be a good character, so she is the scientist now. They also shoved in a few sexist comments that were too on the nose and cringy, to say the least.
Jasmine? OG Jasmine was already strong. Again, she knew when to speak for herself and exactly what she wanted. She knew her own worth and she wanted a suitor who would accept her as a person, rather than for her title. But in the live action, Jasmine needs an ambition. She wants to be the sultan. And she positively insults all men (unlike in the animated version, where she only insults the over the top haughty princes) and has an entire song that talks about not allowing herself to be silenced when there were no instances of anyone trying to silence her. Again, "strong female character".
And quite possibly the most unnecessary change was to Mulan. OG Mulan was arguably the most physically powerful female character but the creators felt the need to change that as well. OG Mulan was a socially awkward girl who cares about her family, and disguises herself as a soldier for selfless reasons. She is not perfect; she has to learn everything from scratch, she fails time and time again while training, she has to work her way to the top. She also used her brains in most of the fights because physical strength in itself isn't enough, and that's what made her stand apart from the others. She got along with the male characters perfectly well, with no need of comparison or proving herself to be better. But the live action version? That Mulan is born with magical chi, she has trained from when she was a child, so she has to face no difficulties when joining the army. The only thing stopping her from proving herself is the society; otherwise, she is perfect. She is far from being a realistic character because young girls would look at her and think, "well, she's strong because she was born with it". Not to mention, the live action Mulan was as boring as a slice of bread. She had no character other than "female warrior", emphasis on the "female".
Basically, physical strength isn't everything. All of the OG princesses were strong in their own ways. Cinderella dealt with abuse and torment for years, but still kept her good morals and kindness. Snow White realized that running away from toxic situations is not cowardly. Tiana wanted to have an occupation to support herself and her mother, and worked hard for it. Ariel wanted to explore a new world that she didn't know, and be part of new experiences.
Also. Romance is not weak. A strong female character can still fall in love. And if they choose to stay single, it should not be because "she's too independent for a partner". You can be in a relationship and still be independent. If the relationship is built on mutual trust and understanding, no one is "too strong" for it. I understand that aroace characters can exist, but their motive for not having a partner should not be "oh, I don't need a man"; it should just be that they're happier with friends or family, and they don't really feel the need to be in a relationship.
Basically they had to make the side characters pathetic so they can stand out 😂
Very well said, and great points!
Exactly
Mulan was pretty stupid in the animated version too though. She went from what you'd expect from a young girl who's been raised to be a housewife and completely in over her head as a soldier, physically unfit and far behind her male counterparts, to suddenly being able to outshoot, outrun, outlift and generally outperform all of the others - even defeating the captain, a man clearly much more physically imposing and trained as a warrior his whole life, in a sparring match, over the course of a single song (okay, of unspecified time but logically at best a few weeks to a month or two) purely from sheer force of will.
I'd totally get it if was just that she'd been using her smarts and being underestimated (elements like causing the avalanche, maybe figuring out how to climb the pole) but no. Literally she just instantly turns into the best.
Because they cant write female in the first place
Excellent, excellent commentary, and dead on. My first thought was “do women like being pandered to in this obvious and blatant way?” Box office returns answers that, and seeing the quote from Emily Blunt validates it even further. I used to be a total cinephile, going to the movies 3 to 4 times a month, yet since Hollywood went all in on the DEI bullshit, I haven’t gone in 3 years. You’re doing good work with these videos and you’re speaking for the vast majority of men and women who are tired of this shit.
I don’t think people talk about her enough, but Holly McClane is a great example of being strong without physical strength. When her boss, Joe Takagi, is shot by Hans Gruber, she makes sure the needs of the other hostages are met, literally walking right up to Hans to ask him to get the pregnant woman a sofa to help her back. She remains calm under pressure, and when she is taken hostage by Hans later in the film, she is not afraid to insult him right to his face (calling him a “common thief.”) She knows what kind of a man Hans is, and she doesn’t hesitate. Not to mention all of her dialogue is outstanding.
Imagine if Holly McClane was written today, she’d kill a terrorist with her brute strength, start a hostage uprising, mow down all the terrorists on her floor, and when John is upstairs confronting Hans and the fake security guard, she shoots Hans and the other guy, saving her husband with not a scratch on her.
I’m so glad the drinker made this video, as a homo sapien without a Y chromosome I feel better represented in this video than in 98% of Movies today.
Edit: love these comments getting into all the details of her character, Holly is really underrated.
Why is this comment not top-rated? It's incredibly accurate!
I would like to see a die-hard-sequel where John's and Holly's daughter has married the computer nerd from DH4 and both get in trouble over something, most likely dad. They could form a couple with her being the action and him ... well, doing what he did in DH4. I think that would work ...
Grace under pressure, this is what's lacking in these female roles and the Alphabet mob in real life. The roles are all boring but the real people are always "victims" who cry wolf every time some pressure and work are expected. An employer can't demand some competence bcoz that will be "harassment" and "toxic". They immediately need meetings to deal with simple problems and "therapists" to cement their "victimhood."
Totally agree with this. Great comment.
Yes, all of the characters in that film were well written, Allen Rickman as Hans Gruber is one of my all time favorite villains.
Another actress who gets slotted into the 'strong female character' role a lot these days, Evangeline Lilly, has also come out against this 9:14 trend in particular:
"Why are we only applauding masculinity in women and villainizing it in men? And why are we only applauding femininity in men and debasing it in women? Why can't we just allow for all of it? Why do we feel the need to vilify a man wearing shit-kicker boots, driving a pick-up truck who's not afraid to punch someone in the face, but if they were a woman, they would be the epitome of cool? Why is a man who loves make-up, cries easily and stays at home to tend to the domestic responsibilities valiant, but a woman who does the same is pathetic?"
There is an answer to her question. Because it upends tradition and accelerates the destruction of society. That is the drive and always has been.
Then why's she playing those roles
@@santhosh4474 people need to eat
@@supsock180 Nah. She's too big of a star to go out of job.
@@supsock180 she literally had no role in Ant man 3. Remove her and it's the same movie. Did she not have any other movies to act? Only Ant Man 3?
The way Sarah Connor was in T2 will ALWAYS be legendary. She was always fighting dirty to win, it felt legit.
She fought in dangerous situations how people, both male and female, fight in real life.
Screw being fair. If I can throw some dirt in that guys eyes to get an advantage, I’m gonna do it. If I see him clinching his fist and fixing to throw a punch I’m gonna punch him first.
Watched Terminator 2 recently and it hasn't aged one bit. Linda Hamilton performance is stellar. She's so badass
yeah... it was men who came up with rules of warfare so that the full horror of war did not fall on the women and children. So absolutely, anti-hero females who fight dirty are the real modern protagonists.
Dirty-fighting is a symptom of weak character. Just as claiming to be a girl so you can go from being a 500th place loser to a 1st place "winner"... because winning is more important than how you win.
@@OrtadragoonX That's true about how things work in a real, dangerous situation. Even in man vs. man, the fair fight only works in a civil setting with previously agreed upon rules such as official boxing or MMA fights. Bruce Lee, the legend considered to be the forefather of MMA, was notorious for being dirty and pragmatic. If he was in a fight, he aimed to win. He would poke your eyes, bite your hand, kick you in the knee cap, even deal a low blow. He never competed, he fought.
Yep she learned from the first movie. Unstoppable machines coming to get her. She has to use everything possible to overcome.
I think it's funny how the one time Disney hired an actress who actually looks like she has a pretty reasonable chance of being able to fuck up an average man in a one-on-one fight (Gina Carano) they went and shit-canned her.
She herself is a completely anti toxic feminist so they threw her out.
she's a strong female character in real life and she was blackballed by Disney
I do love seeing her fight in movies cause it's extremely believable, as she's also an actual fighter; she does seem like she could rip someone in half. But she hasn't had many good scripts to work with...
I never watched the mendalorian so I googled to see how she looks and HOLY FUCK, this woman could suplex a bear and I wouldn't give a shit.
Because she spoke the truth.
Amazing that in the same breath, they wish to call masculinity "toxic" meanwhile, EVERY positive trait that creates the modern; Strong Female Character™ is masculine!
The irony cannot be lost if you are immune to it.
Lmfao nail on the head
More like a caricature of masculinity tbh
thank you! I swear I had given up hope that anyone would ever realize this OBVIOUS Paradox.
But this aint even half the story. Feminists CLAIM to be for the "feminine (hence "Feminist") but they demonize everything that is feminine while at the same time glorifying everything that is masculine. So they should be called ANTI FEMINISTS!!!!!
Though that has a limit. They only demonize the feminine until "the ship starts sinking". Then they all cry out "Women and Children first". No "equality" when it comes to DYING ey? Same with wars!
Then there is another Paradox that is beyond funny! Imagine Slaves asking their Masters to "fight" for THEIR Freedom...can you imagine such a nonsensical Situation? That is EXACTLY what Feminists do. They call men "oppressors", "Tyrants", "Patriarchs" and then ask the SAME MEN to "help them" against men. That is so beyond ridiculous that only mental infants can come up with something like that.
👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Absolutely right.
I think the scene in Raiders of the Lost Ark, where Indy and Marion are attempting to steal the plane is a perfect example of toughness on both counts. Indy is fighting a guy twice his size and getting his butt handed to him, but he keeps on fighting in spite of the size disadvantage. And Marion, far from the typical damsel in distress, fights alongside him, first by knocking out the pilot and then using the machine gun to take out a truck load of soldiers. A perfect action sequence that displays the bravery of both characters without going overboard.
Indy still saves her, just like if she were any other sidekick.
@@pflume1 But she still fought by his side and kicked butt rather than just cringing in a corner and waiting to be saved.
@@pflume1yeah, but it is his movie after all
Agreed! I get so annoyed when the lady doesn't jump in to help. I mean, do anything besides just stand there..
They also did it without framing Marion as better than Indy in every way. They also didn’t remove Marion’s femininity and give her masculine attributes.
Sarah Connor had an incredible and believable character development across T1 and T2. T1 she was scared, working a dead-end job, lacked confidence, and didn't know what was going on. She was useless. T2 she's figured it out, she has purpose, she's been working out every day and training with guns all to protect her son. Her combat skills make sense.
And simultaneously was neglecting her son (and becoming callous towards the rest of doomed humanity in general) whilst pursuing her single-minded hero's journey, and has to develop and begin to reconnect with him and appreciate her life in the moment rather than always being afraid of the future to come.
@@colinr0380 and it helps she came to realise she was becoming no different than the killer machines she hated and feared so much than when she went to try and assassinate miles dyson in the belief killing him would prevent skynet. Outright almost killing him in front of his own wife and kid. And how she came to respect the T100 aftermoutright distrusting it given its twin almost ended her own life. She came to think of it as the sort of father figure John needed in life and gave it a salute when it chose to have itself destroyed. “If a terminator,a machine,can learn to appreciate the value of human life…there’s hope”
@@Sketchfan Absolutely. She 'changed' and 'developed' over the course of the film.
The only thing I didn't particularly care for in T2 was they made her out as unhinged and almost psychopathic. I mean, I get where Cameron was coming from thematically with her character (i.e. she's becoming as machine-like as the Terminators themselves) and knowing the fate of humanity would cause anyone to go a little nuts, but I just didn't particularly care for it. The way Reese described Sarah in T1- "The Legend" "Who taught her son to fight," ect.-- made me believe Sarah kept her wits and was that revered figure that set John on his course to liberating Humanity. That's why, upon watching T2, I was disappointed that she was in a psych ward while John's out being a hulligan that just thinks his mom's a nutcase. Yeah, yeah, it makes a good story. I personally didn't care for it (but I'm also not the biggest fan of T2 in general, so I may be a bit biased).
@@GPMM213 hmmm. I felt frustrated at the way that Sarah Connor was being treated in the psych ward; but I think that’s how the audience is supposed to react. Since we, as the audience, know that she’s not delusional.
And yes, it’s sad and also frustrating that John thinks that she’s crazy; but these things make the payoffs more satisfying; when she breaks out of the psych ward the audience is really rooting for her because we know that she probably doesn’t belong there.
Same kind of thing happening with John and Sarah’s relationship; it starts out in a bad place but we see them rebuilding their bond during the movie; the fact that they are so much closer by the end - is made that much more rewarding given where they started. There are many satisfying and rewarding character arcs and relationship arcs in this movie.
But hey, maybe it’s down to personal taste as much as anything. Personally I like T1 but I think that T2 is a perfect movie.
Chihiro Ogino from Spirited Away is another well written female protagonist who got actual character development.
She does. It's literally a story about a sheltered child growing up and learning the hardship of work, demeaning bosses, and problem-solving through improvisation because real life has no definite answers! She even gets immense self-esteem boosts after cleansing the river god, as seen when she eats the red bean bread with delight. Such a great and timeless story.
Miyazaki knows how to write a character arc. He gives them personality and charm; by the end you can’t help but love the character. That’s why I’ll watch his movies over and over, whereas with Marvel movies I can’t hardly watch them ONE time.
I’ll add: Nausicaa is an interesting case, almost a counter example; she’s the “strong female lead.” However that story is less about character growth and more about sacrifice.
Spirited Away is one of my favorite movies ever
@@truthpurpose same
Don’t forget the first ever female character to be strong:
Jennifer Lawrence
Then everything changed when Mystique came and downright assasinated her character with one line 😂
Didn't she literally take it in the ass from Harvey Weinstein to get her oscar?
She won’t let us forget!
Hahaha. Oh, stop.
Jennifer Lawrence is the first woman to exist, read the Bible
One of the strongest female characters I've ever seen on screen was Mrs. Brisby from the Secret of NIMH. She had no powers, she was weaker and smaller than those around her. And she was terrified of what she was asked to face. But she faced the peril to save her family. She never gave up even in the face of utter failure. She was kind, she was caring, and she was brave (not fearless).
Cinema and television need more Mrs. Brisby's.
Excellent example! One of the most underrated heroines of film.
Such a great movie.
WOW! SUCH a great example! That movie was PHENOMENAL.
I had forgotten about her, it's been so long since I last watched it. But you're absolutely right!
I agree with this, such a good movie and character. Came to my mind when watching the video and then saw your comment. May your day go well for you.
Éowyn was so well played by Miranda Otto in that scene. She looked so scared. And stood her ground anyway. That's a strong female character.
That was a perfect example to use in that moment of explanation. Because she is SO POWERFUL in that moment. It makes a 34 year old big man cry to see it. She looks so afraid, but your eyes well up and you start to cry because you realize how unbelievably brave she's being. THAT is amazing story telling.
The fact that she's doing it to protect her father because they nurtured and loved one another just makes her look even stronger.
Éowin represents everything that a man actually love in a strong woman.
Beauty
Courage
Compassion
Empathy
Respect
Fierceness
But also vulnerability and
Femininity
Miranda Otto was the perfect cast for that role.
@@twelvecatsinatrenchcoather uncle. Her father died long before events in the trilogy. She and her brother eomer stays in the palace with their uncle.
@@worldoftophits I did not know that.
@@twelvecatsinatrenchcoatpoint remains. He was her father figure.
Just one of the many reasons why I haven't been to a movie theater in over 3 years...
Hermione Granger wasn't as powerful as Harry but she often outperformed him cause she spend hours and hours reading books and no one ever said that one of these characters were weaker than the other. Hermione just found a way to compensate the lack of pure power and used her intelligence to outsmart others.
Hermione is not a good exemple. She was not just intelligent, she could do spells on her first try. She was not just book smart. Harry was forced to be competent in moment of crisis because he was put in those positions. He was powerful but we never knew if his magic was stronger than hers.
@@istoria4999 Um--the magic is a metaphor for her other "powers" of brains and personality--the reason she has more powerful magic is that she studies a lot! She's not ALWAYS superior magically--e.g. the contrast between her dissing the others over raising a feather (it's winGARDia!) and her paralysis before the troll, when it's the guys who can say the spell better in a physical crisis. Metaphors, metaphors.
Mulan (in the animated movie) is a better example of overcoming physical weakness with smarts.
Hermione put in more work than the entire school man, she even asked for an artifact that could turn back time just so that she can attend more classes, man, a time machine. to do more work. There is a reason that she always acts like a know-all, it's 'cause she fkn do. She deserves all of her strength and wit. she a real one in my book.
Hermione was great at magic because she is smart and her thirst for knowledge drove her forward but she was never perfect. She has her flaws like being extremely good in a classroom setting but less competent in dangerous situations (more notable in the earlier books/years), she also could be annoying because she got hyper focused on studying and would chatted insistently about it and although she was usually the best in every subject she was not as good in Defence Against The Dark Arts (she even admits this herself and struggled to produce a patronus until Harry helped her in their DA lessons). Now I admit she was probably the closest to being a perfect character in the books (and film) but she wasn’t actually perfect, she was still a flawed individual who messed up and struggled but her struggle was to do with growing up, discrimination and social interaction with her peers.
Hermione is a weird example because she could be interpreted as a “strong female character” but she is nuanced and well written enough that she comes across as talented individual that you low key envy in some respects but don’t actually wish you were.
Sorry about the essay but I thought Hermione was an interesting character to discuss in this subject matter.
This video should be required viewing once a week in every Hollywood studio boardroom. Except Disney -- EVERY DAY for them!
Honestly Like Disney you don't have to make every character in your movies either strong female character gay or black to make a good movie.
@@Dinklebot0 if Disney doesn't do it. who will take the responsibility of making the next generation "ultra woke" all over the world?
@@Dinklebot0 fr like you arent racist homophobic or sexist when you dont do that
Yep, I like my fantasy halfway believable.
why are you still watching their movies then? just ignore them and thats all
As a woman, I'm just tired of this trope. It's not empowering to see a female character just act like an asshole to everyone and then succeed like Velma or Fake Galadriel. It's not empowering to see them be such a boring character like Rey. It's not empowering to see someone just be an inconsistent character like Wanda. I want more than the damsel in distress stereotype but by getting rid of it, they're just stereotyping us even more.
You know what is empowering? Watching Mulan get kicked out of training for bringing the team down and instead of leaving and giving up, working all night to complete Shang's challenge and do what every other man in the camp couldn't by retrieving the arrow. That was character development. That was a beautiful and powerful moment.
Why is it so difficult to have more moments like that for women?
God Rey was so fucking boring. Nothing worse than English Mary Sues
Preach
Because that would cause the women to have flaws. That doesn’t fit “ThE mEsSaGe” so it can’t be written as such.
Why?
Cause women are born perfect, it’s the law of nature, everyone knows that. And if you don’t agree, you must be a man then.
yep , as a man i loved the original mulan . she was a badass cause she worked hard and never give up .
Thank you for saying this. I'm so tired of seeing female characters as the strong lead rescuing men ... so unrealistic - its fantasy! Even in Disney cartoons like Brave, Mulan, Tangled - Hollywood is such a joke.
Sorry to say,in Tangled I believe doesn't have that kind of woke thing.In the end,it a hero character who come to save a heroin character.The man been stab and the girl heal him with her special power from her hair.And last they be together.Happy ever after.
I always loved Eowyn's story. She wasn't being left behind when Theoden and Eomer rode off. Theoden understood that they were going on a suicide mission. And he needed someone whom he could trust and was strong to lead the Rohirrim, thus making Eowyn queen. She faced down the Witch-King to protect her king and kinsman, showing both loyalty and bravery. After the battle, she married Faramir and settled down: "I will be a healer, and love all things that grow and are not barren." She understood that the time for being a shieldmaiden was over but she still had much to contribute in bringing peace after all of the destruction.
Nailed it.
Good point, but I'm trying to recall moments she had genuine chemistry with Faramir.
@@louisduarte8763 They were injured together and both were single. Times are simpler in such worlds and times.
And when she cried out, "I am no man!" it actually meant something other than "I'm better than you because I'm female."
@@louisduarte8763 It's briefly nodded at in the books; the movies spend like a moment of screen time hinting at it during Aragorn's wedding iirc both.
Write female _characters_
Not _female_ characters.
Don't write strong characters
write characters who are strong
Truth has been spoken!
I think these writers are conflating strength (which has a moral dimension) with power (which does not).
This ^
More like beMale characters
One important thing about Sarah Connor.
Do you remember her repetitive dream sequence? This is the fucking huge epitome of her character.
She sees herself, her former self, wearing a floral dress, playing with kid and being happy, just to be destroyed by impending doom.
Her dreams about being a normal woman and mother of her child destroyd by an inevitable war. She hates this idea so much that she's deciding to kill that Cyberdyne dude.
She never wanted to be like that, she just HAD to become one to protect her child. She decided to give up on her dreams not because she didn't want that "patriarcy induced bullshit" but because she wanted them so much that she had to sacrifice everything to keep them safe.
It is not just "she is so cool and badass", people just didn't realize her strong feminine aspirations.
Her character is awesome, isn't it? She's a believable character. Not like Guy-ladrial
Hahaha Guy-ladriel! That's a good one ;-)
She had her femininity & innocence destroyed by the 1st Terminator's relentlessness. She just became like a hardened combat vet after, the writers didn't treat her as an overcompensating woman at all but just human. Reminded me of Vietnam vets that went into the woods & became anti-social survivalist preppers.
This! Thank god someone gets it.
Yes! That's why that deleted dream scene with Kyle Reese is so important. Notice she's back to having her more feminine hair in that dream.
A friend of mine is an actual female writer. When I asked her about her views , she says the issue is agenda. Modern/woke female writers don't want to write female characters as people. They want to write them as agenda driven memes.
Which proves how lazy they and the companies are.
That's why everyone hates it but the psychos and political liars
Sorry, it just doesn't fly.
I’m a female writer myself, as well someone with a very strong sense of empathy. Making my characters, especially women, less human doesn’t roll with me either
Emily Blunt was called out for that comment on the basis of her having played a number of strong female characters. However, if you read the context in the interview where she said it she means that if a writer has to use that phrase to describe a character she knows that they are a terrible writer and the rest of the script or pitch is trash and she shouldn't waste her time actually reading it.
She plays the ultimate Strong Female Character in Edge Of Tomorrow, the script is smart in letting us know that the trials that Cruise's character went through were the same trials SHE went through. We believe she is tough by seeing how Tough Cruise gets it, making the whole thing much more believable. Scriptwriters must have noted that, learnt none of the lessons and just thought, oh Emily Blunt. She can play tough, and take it from there. The Drinker is right, it's so boring.
Actually writing down "Strong Female Lead" is a prime example of telling instead of showing
The Full Metal Bitch was way stronger than Cage.
Cage let his feelings for Vrataski stop their mission. He knew she died in that farm, but once she realized she wouldn't let something as basic as a gruesome and painful death stop the mission.
@@Kayback Great point!
No faults.
No learning.
No suffering.
No realism.
No story.
= No Truths
So simple…. So basic… yet, it’s ignored to pander to an audience whose support is almost statistically nonexistent.
@@jayavionharris And the support they do get isn't even from normal women, it's from crazy feminists and trans women. And they all pretend they care when these movies flop, but they don't, really. Success or not, they're just happy that Hollywood panders to them. They know that all they have to do is say over and over that they flopped because mAn tRaNspHobiC & BaD, and way too many people will just go along.
I can't say why "strong female" characters are so popular ( it seems they aren't ), but I can say why I found the obvious matriarch of this gynocentric genre of kickassery appealing ( it wasn't her fabulous fashion sense in leather ). Most of the time Xenia was just hanging out and messing around with Gabriel - she was off duty. This what I find disappealing about so many "strong male" characters. Stuck in tough guy mode. You kicked somebodys' ass did you ? Wow, get over it. The problem is these "strong male" characters were not invented by tough guys. What we got is a preadolescent image of what a man should be ( Jody ).
A complete Mary Sue. Who need such ridiculous character, which does not evolve at all?
As a writer, we plan out a heroic character arc, then the suits come in and make the main character a female, gay, crippled, black, etc...
And if they have any weaknesses, it becomes, "You Hate (insert non-hetero white male character type)."
So, all of the flaws and weaknesses are removed and the character is suddenly perfect, just the way they are.
It's got all the dramatic tension of watching someone play a video game with cheat codes.
Ironically, it makes it even more demeaning to minorities to make characters that are supposed to represent them so infallible.
And yet so many writers stand by their work. Bizarre behavior if it's the suits that caused it.
@@tezwah5651 I can only presume that it is because they don’t want to make the people that pay their bills look bad publicly.
@@be1uuga355 maybe, but you could also presume they stand by their work.
Are the “suits” jewish?
You hit the nail right on the head! I am so sick of these crap filled lead women action rolled movies. Why can't they see the meaning of insanity, keep doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result. We, the majority of audience hate these movies! The fact that they lose money on every one of them, just doesn't out way their desire to push their agenda no one wants to hear! Thanks for saying it out loud!!!
Tbh, before I discovered you're channel, I often felt like I was just spouting nonsense as no one really seemed interested. Glad there is someone out there, putting out their of frustration with modern entertainment and the lack of quality therein. Keep up the work Drinker.
No one tell him about efap!
What’s funny is I have always found that man love, well, written, strong, female characters. You don’t have to go all the way back to terminator or alien. You don’t even have to go back to fury road you can look no further to everything everywhere all at once. You write a female character. Well, you can make her as strong as you want. Men will respond positively.
mega dittos
@@Stockhandle123 Everything Everywhere All At Once was great. EEAAO showed that audiences will love great characters in an interesting story regardless of gender, age, ethnicity, whatever. Arcane was great. It showed that most people aren't turned off by interracial or same sex relationships, but are invested in good human stories.
Xena was a wonderful example of a female character who was not only physically strong but it didn't feel out of place. She would outsmart and use what she knew to her advantage, rather than just being strong. She had motherly instincts, emotional flaws and felt far more well rounded as a character than a lot of the female characters these days.
Helps that Lucy Lawless is 6ft tall and built like a brick shithouse
The advantage was also that she was written as counterpart to hercules.
As god of strengh he solved most conflict by tossing giants.
Xena used her speed, techniques weapons and sorroundings more akin to a trained shaolin.
It was still silly fantasy fights but within the universe it all felt natural and fitting.
Now a days shed outmuscle a bodybuilder just because. But luckly her actress nailed it.
Im dissapointed with how unbelivable and poor most modern action actresses peform as opposed to their past counterparts.
Like someone using a weapon as if they picked one up for the first day in their life, weakly or wildly swinging while opponents let themseoves fall on purpose rather then delivering a good belivable coreography.
@@TrafalgarWaterDLaw-dl5cm I think the other difference is that Lucy Lawless genuinely looked like she could kick your ass if she put her mind to it. She was tall, muscular enough and imposing in a way that wasn't hyper masculine. Xena took those triats and enhanced them yes, but even though it was silly over the top fantasy, it felt like it was possible
@@Mazikeen1809 I agree. She looked moved and acted the part to embody a belivable warrior woman.
Now a days every skinny 5 ft girl kicks bulky man around while moving very stiff and fake. I miss when you had to learn skills for a role to a belivable degree.
Like Hercules though it was cheesy as hell - and in retrospect the association with Hercules and Kevin Sorbo does it no justice I'm afraid.
The pregnant Marge Gunderson in Fargo was a strong female character. Persistent, courageous, intelligent, noble. I didn't have to see her kick some guy's ass to get the message.
Yes, agree with you. Loved that movie, for years after seeing it I wanted my own personal heavy duty woodchipper, to use in case I ever found some guy intruding into my house. After I shot him, I'd chip him up, really good, and no one would know what happened!! LOL ;D
Strength of character matters. Just as this video illustrates, all Hollywood seems toc are about is establishing a false equivalency of physical strength, demonstrating a clear preference for female empowerment over actual character development.
You can never be strong unless you have plenty of testosterone. You know how much women has it. Women ☕
Oh yah, you betcha!
Like one of your fans below writes 'establishing a false equivalency' for the Corporate-World, the false equivalency media fuels the social deterioration CCP weaponizes via Woke fakery.
Man, going back and watching all these drinker videos on why modern movies suck has been so eye-opening. Not in a “oh thats why” sort of way, but in the “yes thats exactly what i thought i just couldnt put those thoughts into words” sort of way.
Thanks drinker for calming my mind and letting me get back to the important things… like this bottle of Laphroaig quarter cask 😎👍
I’m glad you mentioned the ridiculous woman taking down a man twice her size thing. As an average sized woman, that has always annoyed the hell out of me
@Caro1ns - that would be a difficult even for the average guy, or a man with some basic fighting skills. Twice the size? Nah, not gonna happen.
That guy would simply want to be close to you, so he can grab you, and spin your body so your head will hit some pavement, trash can, some corner of a table in the pub, and so on. In extreme cases (when on drugs) he will try to take your eyes out, break one of youe fingers, crush your throat, stab you with a pen or pencil multiple times in a few seconds, or try to bite off part of your nose, cheek, upper/lower lips and so on... (note: seen all of that in a real life). Even a normal guy, with some basic skills wouldn't want to fight a dude like that. Even if you manage to win that one, good luck with your own treatment in a hospital.
As a smaller-than-average-sized man, this annoys the hell out of me too. I’ve been hit by average sized women many times and I’ve never even had a bruise to show for it. Watching a 100 pound woman kick a man across the room is beyond ridiculous.
The ONLY way it works is if the woman has magical superstrength
@@Superabound2 Or, like the Drinker hinted at, the woman attacks with surprise and uses her environment and tools therein to get off a solid, staggering shot and then does not let up in her attacks. Even then, it only closes the gap in strength and size.
Yea, that just makes them look stupid...
When you put Elizabeth Swan from "Pirates of the Caribbean", I had a realization: she is what a real "strong and independent woman who no need no man" is. She starts being trapped in her role as a daughter of a wealthy man whose only purpose is to be married to someone powerful for the sake of her family, but due to her strenght of character and intelligence, she ends up being a vital character, and not just a damsel in distress. And though she's not the greatest fighter (iirc, she learns how to fight after the first movie, but can't recall a single major duel of her), she never yields to the wims of others. In fact, all the female characters of the trilogy are pretty great (and yes, I said trilogy, the other movies don't exist), and if Hollyweird wasn't so fixated nowadays in turning women into disguised men, they would use characters like her more in their movies.
She was so fun as well 😭 she was just as involved in the goofy antics as Jack and Will
Elizabeth Swan is a great character. But everyone in Pirates have amazing and satisfying arcs from top to bottom from Jack Sparrow to Capt Barbosa to even James Norrington. Love the scriptwriting in this trilogy (yep trilogy) overall
@@icupnibba3533 one of the best trilogies ever.
They aren't even turning them into disguised men. They are turning them into unlikeable abominations.
A very good example of how men are written good is in, say, Saving Private Ryan. This movie shows that all of the soldiers have their problems and flaws. They try to act tough at times, but at others their hold on their emotions breaks and they show how vulnerable they actually are. Captain Miller with his hand tremors from PTSD, the medic calling out for his mother when fatally wounded, Vin Diesel trying to save the girl, and getting killed for it, the translator that has to overcome his cowardice. It shows that, while men may be acting more stoic or seem emotionless at times, that they still do have emotions and the vulnerabilities that come with it.
With T2, I like that they made Sara Connor more of a desperate character than a strong character. It shows how she took the time between 1984 and 1997 to prepare, and she didn't just magically have all these inhuman strengths to start with.
And how she was terrified of the Terminator when she first saw him in T2, but she would power her way through fear to fight: like Ripley in Alien/s.
Indeed. But wasn't it between '84 and '91? Or was T2 set in 1997?
She was also a very active character. By that I mean, , whatever stuff gets inflicted upon her, how Sarah react to said-things, instead of actively making them happen, is what defines her character. She also had a defining personality, especially shown very well in the first film.
Plus the two films manage to create some of the greatest instances of set up-&-payoff and dramatic irony to it's effect with her character.
Right. Only male white characters, similar to me and you can acquire magically such great traits!
We want movies with no females at all or at least in totally submissive roles! 🙃
@@reedr7142 I think it's set in 95, because Sarah was pregnant when she drove off at the end of T1, and John is listed as 10 years old in the police computer at the start of T2. It's reasonable to assume that he was born sometime in 85. However, the movie came out in 91.
That's why a movie like "Gone with the Wind" is a masterpiece. Scarlet starts being frivolous & spoiled & lives, grows & changes through her trials. The character has depth & difference facets to it. This relentless & stubborn feminism is not only tiring but a pure scam
Emily Blunt is probably the last good female action star, even in A Quiet Place, she's shown to be a caring loving mother but she's also still a badass momma bear who takes on horrifying aliens to save her kids. And she's believable at it too. John Krasinski hit the jackpot with her.
She is my favorite actress
And she's a funny, intelligent, gorgeous woman to boot.
And has an amazing accent
Not to say she's a bad person, but Emily blunt isn't the characters she plays.
She stood on a nail and sucked it up because she had too
I think agent Clarice Starling from "Silence of the Lambs" is a really good example of strong character. The way she fights and overcome her inner demons to save the hostage in the final sequence makes her strong in a very credible way.
My favourite female character in cinema
She's also based on an ancient European storytelling trope: The virgin offered to the demon sealed in the cave to appease its hunger. MAN I love that movie...
She canonically ends up Hannibal's lover and they dine on brains together.
@@bitwize that’s the book serious, not the movies.
@@bitwize Good point. But not in the movie.
I'd like to nominate Jessica Fletcher from Murder She Wrote as a great example of an actual strong female character. She's highly intelligent without bring condescending. She's thoughtful, charming, graceful, forgiving, resourceful, and funny. The fact that I, as a thirty year old man, can relate to and respect a middle aged female character more than any modern day "hero" says a lot.
I loved Murder She Wrote as a kid. Such a great show and character
Love Jessica. She was so very classy, a real lady.
Without fail, everywhere Jessica went, someone died. That's power! Love how a novelist with no forensic training was able to walk through crime scenes contaminating evidence yet still gets the killer. Put realistic procedure aside, this show was so well written to the point where Jessica's strength as a character never needed to be acted at all. It solely came through in the writing.
Yeah, spot on
She was awesome! Great example 😀👍
Strength is a lot like bravery, it’s doing something in the face of an adversarial force and using your whole being to overcome it no matter the difficulty, or not faltering in the face of it.
As a black female growing up (41 now) I never felt that I wasn't represented in films! I loved seeing women in films that made me want to be like them. Not because they were white, black, asian, whatever race but because of what they over came in the story or how the raised above a hardship and the strength it took for them to accomplish it.
I'm not saying that it isn't nice be diverse in films but don't do it for just to say you are being inclusive. Do it because this actor has something to add to the film. He or she is well fitted for the role.
Now a days it feels so forced that it makes the film bad!
I'm a white guy from a rural area, growing up on a farm I loved to watch Fat Albert it provided a glimpse into the world of city life and it was fun to relate to characters from a completely different background, and they were relatable because they were human and humanity relates to it's own story
~ Mic drop!
@@johntabler349 Normal people appreciate and are intrigued by different cultures and people groups. Society tries to indoctrinate us into being "threatened" by them.
Divide and Conquer.
@@D2Kprime well said
100% agreed!!
The days of Ellen Ripley, Sarah Connor, Clarice Starling and Thelma & Louise were a golden age for truly good female film characters.
Ripley was a woman, which was obviously invented by a male. It suited the plot, as the feminist woke shit was already running in the US, which was the most important market. People knew, it was just a quota woman. But a man wouldn't be able to destroy "Mother" and kill an "Alien Queen" as it was politically incorrect in regard to liberals.
Not really, but you have to go outside the mainstream to find them.
So were the 1950s in fact. Western heroines Annie Oakley, Dale Evans, Frankie Adams and Police Officer Casey Jones all ruled the TV while the movies had the actresses Grace Kelly, Maureen O'Hara and ESPECIALLY Barbara Stanwyck in multiple action or other strong roles. Can't believe he didn't mention any of them here.
And Cynthia Rothrock from the action movies
@@lemonacidrounds7293 Yes I remember Cynthia too. Thanks for mentioning her.
Traits like arrogance, self-entitlement, know it all, stoic, bluntness, rudeness, ruthlessness, confidence, self-respect, and aggressiveness
For males, they’re flaws
But for females, they’re “strengths”.
Double standards
Yep. According to modern "progressivism", women mist be toxic men, and men must be subservient and fawning.
this is what you get from your hate filled sis feminist writers. I wrote a funny.
Very *_TRUE_*
Being stoic is not a flaw, especially in men, but there's a time and place for stoicism, and a time and place for compassion and empathy.
Right-on brother!
"and yet, there she is. Takiny them like balboa"
😂😂 Had me laughing my butt off
Some of Aragorn's most powerful scenes were when he displayed utter humility: closing Frodo's hand around the ring and telling him he would have followed him into the very fires of Mordor, consoling Boromir on his deathbed, and bowing to the hobbits.
Then after showing signs of humility and superiority over Bomori who had been overcome of his "white man's greed"... His skin turned black. Now she is Aragon the black.
Pretty sure that is how it will go in next lotr movie when progressives make it.
@@Tespri exactly, my grandmother told me that Aragorn was a powerful black queen, and noone can tell me otherwise
Yo I've never cried so much in a movie than the first time I saw everyone in Gordor bowing to those Hobbits.
I saw it in IMax the first time and it was unreal.
@@MrHungrySimon 🤣
@@MrHungrySimon wow, my granny told me your grandma is a lair. She's dyslexic so I think she meant liar. That is, of course, if she isn't a rail.
I'm glad you included Clarice Starling. When she relates the story of her trying to save one lamb from the slaughter, it was chilling, and yet you could feel her sorrow and pain. Even Hannibal is moved by it, so much that he won't kill and eat her. That's saying something.
Silence Of The Lambs is a classic. She was perfect with her performance.
There was an element of "luck" to it too, in that if Hannibal's cell neighbour Miggs hadn't Spidermanned his jizz at Clarice, Hannibal wouldn't have opened up to her. He was combative and dismissive until that happened. In his words, "discourtesy is unspeakably ugly to me" - he felt that he owed Clarice his time because of this incident. Then he also convinces Miggs to kill himself as a perverse "gift" to Clarice, too.
Hannibal Lecter was in love with Starling. He didn't feel sorry for her. He wanted her for himself. At the end of the novel Hannibal, sequel to Silence...he gets his wish. The movie changed it to a more stupid, less interesting end.
@@Marss13z The book is even weirder than just love, he sees Clarice as a vessel he can somehow channel his dead sister into. The chapters when he's genuinely trying to figure out a mathematical equation to reverse time and bring his sister back really illustrate how batshit insane he is, underneath the calculating genius. Although his origin story did hurt his mystique a fair bit.
Amazing movie
Emily Blunt has portrayed probably the most actually true "strong female characters" in the last decade between Rita Vrataski, Kate Macer, and Evelyn Abbott, all flawed characters dedicated and relentless in the pursuit of their duties in the face of massive challenges.
And, ironically considering 'the message', her character arc in Edge of Tomorrow is that she softens/opens up more as the movie goes along and the challenges increase, never not being a badass as a result.
She's also fantastic in Looper. Play's the typical "strong female character" at the start, but we quickly realise that it's an act the character herself is putting on as a bluff to survive, and she is actually far more vulnerable and complex and relatable than she appears at first, while still being a badass.
It's really mind boggling to me that there are weirdos who are so obsessed with stahng whamen that they don't seem to judge a movie by any other standard than that.
Like imagine someone being that obsessed with strog male characters in movies. Literally what does the sex of a character has to do with anything? Grow up.
DON'T GO IN THE BANK KATE
Not familiar with the other ones, but her performance in Sicario is one of my favorites by any actress ever. Glad to see her speaking out against this nonsense.
@@candide1065 It is even more mind blowing that you don't realize that the depiction of a character is tied to the narrative, and thus impacts the quality of a production, its reach, and the story.
That ending clip where Sarah Connor is comforting her son is the most badass womanly scene I can imagine. After John's idealized father figure, The Terminator, sacrifices himself to prevent the future from repeating itself, John is grieving because of his feelings towards the inanimate machine. John's mother provides him a shoulder to experience and release that emotion, an astounding feat given her personal animus against all things Skynet.
The character of Sarah Connor isn't tough because she says "I AM WAMEN HEAR ME ROAR'. Sarah Connor is tough because she HAS to be to protect her only child from a deadly threat in the future. Yet, at the end of the movie, she turns that all off because the threat is over, and she returns to being a mother who needs to comfort her own son in his deep sadness.
A loving mother--there's nothing more badass and feminine than that.
Well said
Agreed... although I would add that she was tough and strong because at the end of the movie the t1000 was no more and she was still standing (barely) .... she outlasted the machine. Anyone else would have broken, run, died, pick your poison. Because she was a trained operator AND a mum... take away either of those ingredients and that cake dont bake
Good chat
It turns out that there is absolutely nothing inherently wrong with women being feminine and men being masculine.
And then Dark Fate destroyed everything
"failure itself does not define a character, its how they react to it that matters" - The Drinker
“Why do we fall, Bruce? So we can learn to pick ourselves up.” - Thomas Wayne
I wrestled in high school and in the US military. Served in two wars. Have been in countless fights. I lost every fight until I was 16, and most wrestling matches until I was 15. Still lost matches until my very last one, but have not lost a fight in nearly 40 years. I learned how to fight and defend myself by losing... a lot.
Now I drag race, build my cars and compete against others. I learn more from losing than I do by winning, because it means someone has figured out how to do it better, go faster, or whatever else they did to win. Losing makes me better at everything I do. It teaches me where I need to improve, what I need to learn, and motivates me to put in the work required to win.
When life beats you down, you have a choice. Lay there and take it, give up and expire, or get up and fight back. I have always gotten up and fought back, even when I would just get knocked down again and again.
There was a judge that often said to some people: "It is not a crime to fail and tumble. The crime is to notvtrying to get up again"
I like how you explained that being physically strong, doesn’t make them a strong person.
I think a great example of that is Captain America The First Avenger, before he got the serum he was already strong in his ideals and always did the right thing. Regardless of his size, it made him strong to me and I empathized and idolized him.
Exactly, this is true of male characters as well. Physical strength is merely the surface level of strength and generally shown to be a guise for internal weakness. Yes, it’s more believable for men but still shallow if that’s all there is too it.
Another example is Homelander. His physical strength fractures his mental state and drives him absolutely mad with his power. While he is nearly invincible and stronger than the entirety of the human race, he's a psychotic freak who literally loves murdering people. Captain America already had the morals, Homelander didn't. The two are foils of each other. One is likeable because of his character and values, and the other is hateable because of his lack of morals and values. Taking out the strength and physical aspect, nothing really changes. One is already strong, while the other is immature, weak, and insecure.
@@beastpatriots9569 exactly. In any sense, if we remove the physical danger, homelander will be the weakest of them all
frr
women dont need to be "strong" or "masculine" in any way to be empowered tbh
That's why I've always preferred him to Iron Man
Quote from the movie "The Hunt For The Wilderpeople"; "Im the Terminator, you're Sarah Conner. No, I'm the terminator and you're Sarah Conner, the first one not the second one, before she could do chin-ups!😄
What I love about Ripley in Aliens is during the opening scenes she is totally traumatised by her experience in Alien. Then throughout the film she is continually facing her fear, pushing through and doing what needs to be done. Then at the end, that moment in the lift as she is prepping her weapons about to dive into the alien hive to get Newt, you can tell she is terrified but psyching herself up, breathing, focusing, getting through that terror. It's so engaging to watch and grounds the character and film, and makes the win at the end well and truly earnt. I've watched the film countless times, but that level of humanity draws me in every time, so despite knowing the end by heart, it always makes me feel tense as to whether she can or will survive that literal nightmare.
True, but horror movies also historically have a young women be the main character and only survivor. I think horror suffers from an entire different issue when it comes to gender stuff.
Plus sigourney weaver was an excellent actress
@@cancerino666 I was going to post about this very thing. The "Final Girls" in horror films were always dismissed by the horror hating critics of the time, but they were almost always resourceful and survived in the end, in spite of being in terrifying situations where all of their friends have died. They were true "empowered women", before it was even a thing. Kirsty from Hellraiser is probably my favorite of these as she managed to negotiate her survival with the demonic Cenobites, crafting a deal to give them her uncle Frank who escaped them in exchange for her own survival.
Long Kiss Goodnight too
@@vampyretime177 Love that movie!
This is why I like Mr. and Mrs. Smith fight scenes: Angelina uses weapons and tries to keep her distance to even her odds but loses that advantage when Brad gets into close range not to mention how she’s great with protocol but bad with improv. It shows that she has strengths and weaknesses and how she tries to negate the weaknesses
Pretty sure a modern remake would make Angelina's character some all perfect battle machine and make her save Brad's character constantly so that people can get the Message™.
Movie was shit.
those actors had great chemistry too but we know the reason why…
Good example
The Secret of Nimh features a widowed mother as its main character. She grieves her husband, struggles with her children, and faces all manner of fears and obstacles along the way, aided by friends whom she expresses gratitude towards.
THAT is a strong, female character AND a positive role model!
Great example
Ya I think a good mother is the best example of a true strong female not the fakes being used now a days weather it's just a character or a real woman
My 30yo kid's favorite movie of all time. My Mom insisted we have that movie for my daughters. We didn't have regular TV, I'm a music/radio person--tunes from daybreak to bedtime. Thus, so were my kids. But my Mom sent two VCRs for their bedtimes and provided the movies that they watched. Generational Wisdom is crucial. My grandchildren live with me/next door. They are not like other children. Critical thinkers.
One of the best animated movies of all time , bests 95% of Disney's classics ìmho. And it's not full of musical numbers, which is a massive bonus!
@@dragonlord498 Remember that woke people (especially feminists) demonize motherhood.
They should watch Yor Forger from SpyxFamily.
A badass assassin who can kill armies of enemies in seconds but still deals with physical defeat at times and emotional issues for her family.
Ladies and Gentleman, this is how you get a great female character that you just want more of.
If I were an actress I’d be VERY careful about the work I take because being the next Rey or Captain Marvel could kill your career and cause audiences to dislike the actress instead of dislike the ones who truly destroyed that character: the writers.
To be fair, Brie Larson being a racist and sexist bitch who lashes out at white men in real life didn't help.
Maybe, they choose to actively antagonize potentially paying customers off the screen. They could have just said that yeah, "maybe my character is a bit OP" and taken some flak for it. Instead they go out very publicly saying "this movie wasn't made for you". These roles aren't killing their careers (though certainly not helping), their behavior off screen is.
@@TravisHi_YT true however many of them don’t know what the final product is going to be until right before it release. The writers and producers are directly responsible for the story. The actors go out and do their best to make a believable character. Bree Larson and the Charlie’s Angels crew is kinda the exception. I’m not sticking up for the actors per say but instead just want to put the blame where it really belongs.
@@TravisHi_YT yep in those cases 100% agree with you.
It could also provide you with enough money to never have to work again. Lol
"You're perfect the way you are and it's the world that has to change"- this is the same message as in female self-help
Blame others for your own convictions...
Deflection of truths seems to only make them gather.... Like a Murder of crows.
Bolshevism. Simple as that.
Haha! It sure is! It really makes you wonder what exactly these writers are basing their characters off of. Obvious absence of any real-world reference other than... probably a male character from something else.
shitty advice no matter where it's coming from, just sucks. blegh.
So f**king true
Leelu in The 5th Element was a badass female done relatively well, she WAS imposing in her combat abilities but just because she was more powerful than everyone else didn't mean that she didn't face hardships. In fact she spent the majority of the movie as a fish out of water, despite being a superior being she was confused about the world she found herself in, and without a means of communication that everyone could understand she had to struggle to get her wants across and to understand why people were chasing her to begin with. She overcomes that by studying her futuristic computer to learn English and almost immediately during learning she also realizes the shit humans do and is torn on whether we're even worth saving to begin with. She hasn't completed her education, but it's so bleak that she nearly lost hope entirely...then of course she is shown "love" (cheese) and releases her power to save the world. But even during bouts of kicking all of the ass available for kicking, she STILL lost and still failed, despite her advantages. It made her relatable, it made her vulnerable when she's crying in an air vent doing her best to avoid being shot to pieces. She has all that power, but she's also not invincible and unflappable...in short, she was believable as a character within the context of her story. She couldn't have completed her task without the help from Bruce Willis's character and a few other guys also pitching in to help along the way. Despite having all the required power and being the only being capable of defeating Evil, she wouldn't have succeeded all by herself.
Plus that opera scene is dope as fuck. I even get a kick out of the inserts and shifts to her kicking the Mangalores asses while the music is still going. Even matches up to it a few times.
Drinker, please pin this comment.
I couldn't agree more
Multipass
One of the best Movies Ever, Absolute favorite of mine
It's the one movie I would take if I couldn't watch anything else ever again. The world building is amazing as well.
Leelu Dallas mulitpass
Fantastic analysis. Every time I was about to stop the clip and say "Yeah, BUT..." you anticipated and answered my objections a few seconds later.
I've always looked at it from this point of view:
Most of these writers work under a grave misconception. They seem to belief that power and strength (of character) are the same thing.
As an example, let's take a look at Luke and Rey from Star Wars: Both of them are quite powerful by the end of their respective trilogies. However, whereas Luke by then has also demonstrated great strength of character, Rey has not.
Over the course of the original trilogy Luke starts out as a cocky and arrogant teenage "boy" who gets humbled almost immediately after he leaves the small, secluded world he grew up in. And from the moment he learns of his uncle's and aunt's fate as well as coming across many tough and scary people in the cantina, he realizes just how dangerous of a place the galaxy is and how much he needs Ben moving forward to protect and guide him. By this point of the story Luke is still just a "weak" boy. But through all the trails and tribulations he faces, losing Ben, losing to Vader, finding out the truth about his father and being unable to rescue his friend Han, he never gives in to despair, he perserveres and rights the wrongs of the past. He helps free Han, free his father from the darkness and frees the galaxy from the tyrannical empire. What makes Luke so inspiring is not his power with the force, it is the strength of character he developed throughout his journey.
Rey on the other hand doesn't have these defining moments. She beats Kylo and basically every step of their journey. She develops force powers of extreme potency without putting the work into it or struggling with it. For crying out loud, from the start of her trilogy, at which point she doesn't even believe the force to be a real thing, to the end of episode 8 she somehow learns to do feats of power with the force that take jedi masters years of dedicated training and struggle to match. To show how ridiculous this is, between the start of episode 7 and the end of episode 8 just a short few days have passed. She however doesn't need to train for any of this. She never falls short at anything. She never yearns for anything because she already has everything the writers want or need her to have for the plot to move forward. By the end of her trilogy she has never once shown any strength of character because she never had to struggle for anything or fail at doing anything. She only ever shows feats of power and might. To me that is just not compelling though.
Anyway, that was my two cents on the matter.
Go away now.
The great aspect of Sarah Connor to me was the transformation from T1 to T2.
In T1 she was a waitress. An ordinary girl. Pretty physically helpless against violence. By the end of T1 she'd toughened and started her journey. In T2 she'd transformed herself. You could believe it. And her backstory was told. The alliances she'd made. Learning from anyone who could teach her. She didn't simply arrive ready made.
I’ll add that it was her mothering instincts that motivated the transformation. She’s grows tough as nails because that’s what it takes to protect her child. It’s very feminine at its core.
Her transformation from T1 to T2 was the worst thing. Her change from the beginning of T1 to the end was good, but jumping from that to the ugly lunatic in T2 was a huge disservice to that character.
@@mattstorm6568 Why? She had terrible knowledge of Judgement Day, and got locked in an asylum, and essentially tortured. Her change is precisely what happens to people in the system.
And then she got killed of and has disappeared from 3.
@@thomasbecker9676 exactly. She sublimated her traumatic experiences and continued to develop into an absolute badass to protect her son.
I was a big fan of Pam Grier; she was a pioneer of the modern tough, independent female, but she was never seen beating up men larger than her. She was smart and determined and she came out on top.
even if she had in a movie, i’m sure they would’ve found a way to make it tense and believable
Except she *wasn't* a pioneer of anything because there always have been tough and independent women in films. Like everything feminists say, it's a feminist lie that women have always been portrayed negatively by Hollywood. Dorothy Gale in The Wizard of Oz (1939) is one that immediately springs to my mind.
It's the commun|st goal 22
Foxy Brown, Coffy, Jackie Brown…oh yeah!
Not to mention she was sexy as hell.
I remember the cop lady from season 2 of true detective she carried lots of knifes because she knows most of the criminals she has to deal with can over power her seems way more realistic then always been good at fighting
Can someone tell Hollywood that the ‘monkeys on typewriters' idea was a thought experiment, not a plan.
And then, pray tell, what will they do with all those monkeys? 🤣
They must have dozens of rooms full of them, where will they put them?
@@tremor230The inclusion department is where the monkeys with typewriters are.
Vasquez in aliens didn't need to beat up one of the male marines to pander, instead they made her witty, cool and a part of her team and you will probably get more enjoyment out of just her scenes than the entirety of captain marvel
"Hey Vasquez, have you ever been mistaken for a man?". "No. Have you?".
True, then Jenette Goldstein is a far better actor on top of that.
Her scant scenes as John Connor's foster mother were better than all of Captain Marvel also.
Especially when she was playing the T-1000 in her form, that was damn scary 😅
@@mnomadvfx Yeah totally! My mind was blown when I realised they were the same person haha
It's like she knew they were just a bunch of immature kids but she had earned her place by being one of them throwing back the jokes and even making jokes but when it came down to it, they had each other's backs and she was just as equal as anyone else on the team.
She was so freakin' cool.
Ripley was such an amazing, complex character... saw the original film in the theatre when I was much younger and the film/character still sticks in my mind today.
Years ago, one of my Karate sensei’s was a woman. She was smaller than me, but much more experienced. She knew how to use her size to her advantage. It wasn’t about strength, it was about leverage, cunning, strategy, and patience.
Did you ever see her fight a man who was as skilled as she was, or did her karate only work on her students? A 6'5", 280lb male Black Belt will beat the piss out of a 5'2, 115 lb female Black Belt.
Sensei wisdom, just like old Star Wars Jedi wisdom: priceless.
And would have happened if you had picked her up and body slammed her? Karate nerds watch far too many films. Traditional martial arts have been proven to be ineffective when tried against or fighting styles. Far too much focus on forms and not enough focus on real sparring and pressure testing. I can almost guarantee if she got into an actual fight against a man he would absolutely flatten her.
@@RedHeadKevin All other things being equal a man will have a strength advantage over a woman but that is hardly an insurmountable advantage for a skilled martial artist. In HEMA for example women have won entire tournaments against men. Now that's not to say women are the optimal choice for combat but the argument that woman can't beat men is objectively incorrect.
William Johnson against a man with similar skills, yes. Against a weak keyboard warrior, he’s going to eat dirt.
Modern strong female movies make me appreciate Sarah Connor and Ellen Ripley even more 🙌
Leeloo was good too even if she was supposed to be the strongest
Or some anime characters like nami from one piece she is one of the weakest physically but mentally strong
@@sarov7658 anime characters rarely have this problem, if a show has a well written male cast, then the female characters will also be well written.
@@takeuchi5760 Though Nami is really annoying most of the time, which is a shame cause the mugiwara's background is often interesting
Fun fact: Ripley was originally written as a male character, but was changed to female for I think shock value
Sarah Connor was the coolest female protagonist in any movie ever. She was tough, smart, strong, and brave… but she still showed love for her son, and compassion to Miles Dyson’s family. And she never had to be pandered to, or have a male role put down to prove that she was capable.
Don't forget. She was also slightly, how do you say it?, unhinged.
@@remowilliams7569 just the right amount of unhinged though.
I'm partial to Lieutenant Ellen J. Ripley muh'self.
But I wouldn't kick Sarah out of bed, either. 😝
@@Silence_Duder_Gooder Ellen Ripley is wonderfully written.
There's a voice message by her in _Alien: Isolation_ read by none other than Sigourney Weaver. That 2 minutes made better characterization of Ellen Ripley than most writers in a whole movie.
@@ItsukaShimotsuki, I don't believe I've seen that movie. Or is it a video game?
You basically explains how I feel about the ahsoka series in the characters in it.
It should be noted that Eowyn was severely depressed, having suffered under Wormtongue almost as much as Theoden, and losing her cousin Theodred in battle only a couple weeks earlier (who she was raised with & would have considered a brother). She believed self-deletion to be dishonorable, but saw "a way out" and went to the Battle of the Pelennor Fields fully expecting not to survive, only searching for one moment of lasting glory to finally give her life meaning before she died.
Plus, she was in love with Aragorn and was upset that he didn't feel the same way toward her. She begged him to let her go with him, but he refused her. She then begged Theoden to join the fight, and was refused again. The Witch-king's greatest weapon was fear, but Eowyn was too depressed to let that get to her when she faced him.
@@witteafval She also has the "happiest" ending in the entire story, considering the movies that is, what makes it even more deserved. Great character!
I’d dispute ‘depressed’. Eowyn was filled with despair and Aragorn represented the hope she’d lost (you know, because he’s called Estel?), so fixated her love on him. When she thought that hope lost, she went to die in the only way she saw as honourable, on the battlefield.
Eowyn is a classic Anglo-Saxon heroine.
I knew a guy with a similar death wish. Far too crazy for the military, he got himself attached as a journalist to a front line combat group in Iraq. Before he went he got a tattoo of a dotted line around his neck. In front it said 'cut here', in back it said the same thing, in Arabic. He survived the war, then put a shotgun in his mouth. Eowyn's struggle was real. RIP, Caleb.
Tolkien understood all of what the Drinker was saying, somewhere deep in his writing bones. That's why it wasn't Eowyn alone who took down the Witch King--Merry and also a magic blade were needed. Tolkien for sure knew that the Witch King was too powerful for any one mortal. Even subtracting Glorfindel's prophecy, I doubt that, say, Eomer or Faramir or Boromir alone could take the WK. MAYBE Aragorn, but that brings in the whole other matter of the true king of the line of Elendil and what power and destiny might be in that.
True story: when I first started Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, my gym tossed all newbies to a female black belt they had on staff because she couldn't really hurt you. When she was showing me guard and different holds she'd always say, "Remember, this is gonna be really different sparring with a guy. Doesn't matter what I do, you could just muscle me around. But equal size and strength is a whole other thing".
Why would you train in something that doesnt teach you to take on stronger opponents?
@@absoluteai41 What does? Krav Maga I suppose.
@@absoluteai41 When they start out, you don't want to punish their inexperience, you want to let them know what they can do and what they can grow into.
@@absoluteai41 I've trained various martial arts for more than a decade, and the sad thing is weight and size are the biggest factors in a lot of fights. Proper technique and the right mindset helps a lot to even those odds, but if you take two fighters with relatively equal experience, but different sizes, the odds are in favor of the bigger one, this is the exact reason most fighting sports have different weight divisions.
Another factor people tend to disregard is the willing to hurt the other. If someone wants to hurt you, they will and that's fucking scary.
Also most martial arts and fighting sports spare the weak parts of the body, like eyes, crotch, throat etc.
Self defense systems like Krav Maga are specifically designed for, well, self defense.
Did you and the hot brazilian chick kiss on the lips
I was lucky enough to have a creative writing class at my school and an incredible creative writing teacher. One of the things he did was show us one of your videos to explain the issues with character writing in modern movies. Every time I watch one of your videos, I always learn something valuable and important about writing. As someone who eventually wants to put a book out there with well-written characters and an interesting plot, thank you Drinker for this channel and your videos.
Your teacher is a blessing to the craft. I hope you have much success in your writing career!
This analysis of the present state of current movie making says it all. Thankyou Critical Drinker for revealing the stupidity and ineptitude of those who run the entertainment industry!!! Well done.
Case in point: Sarah Connor was tough as nails in T2, yet there is that pivotal scene during the escape from the mental hospital where she is briefly but absolutely terrified as the Terminator walks in. The trauma and total loss of composure shown by Linda comes through so effectively; yes she has a moment of weakness but it makes so much sense. Proof that tough female characters can show weakness at understandable points and it makes them more endearing.
Also I feel it doesn’t matter who you are if you know what a terminator is your pants will be shidded
That's some weird obsession that you have there. Why is it of any importace how """""tough"""""" a (FEMALE) character is? Can movies not be good if a - explicitly FEMALE - character isn't """""tough"""""". Are movies like American Psycho or No country of old men bad because they "lack" """"""tough""""" women? How about """""tough""""" men? Do they trigger you? And is the sex of any """""tough"""" character so important for you?
Another thing, the actress actually trained to be able of doing all physical stunts on screen
T2 is probably one of the greatest films ever made.
Tough *characters,* male or female, can do that. Watch Dr. No sometime. Watch the scene where the bad guys slip a tarantula in to James Bond's bed while he's sleeping. He wakes up just in time and is able to smash it, but Connery looks absolutely terrified. Good scene.
One of my all time favorite characters is Trinity from The Matrix. A strong character who, without having to say a million lines about how badass she is, is a badass. She’s driven, has a set of beliefs, and actually has some inner turmoil about it those beliefs. And best of all, it never comes off as forced. You believe it, because it was well written and phenomenally well acted.
We all have our favourites like that. Mine's Eryn Sun from Farscape. In the show, she's an alien and stronger than an Earth-man (the shows protagonist), but with enough inner turmoil and growth through the show to keep her interesting.
Well, until the continuation they made just recently
and best of all when she ccame up against the agents....she RAN!!!.
She knew her limits. had that moment been in current day she would have stayed Stared them down "bravely", (looking at you peach) and attacked them 🙄🙄🙄 and almost certainly "beat" them. The hardest bosses in the movie.
@@JennySparkz Yep and then the audience would've been told how stunning and brave it was in every professional critic review.
Oh please. Carrie Ann Moss was about as stiff and wooden as Keanu Reeves in that film
I watched Alita Battle Angel yesterday, this female character is a warrior but also a realistic female who can fail time to time, can be arrogant and is punished for that, and is at several occasions saved by males. She is thankful for these characters and shows herself emotionnally vulnerable at several occasions. Despite her abilities she is not in competition with the males around her, she CARES for THEM and tries constantly to use her abilities TO HELP THEM. She is a great example of a physically strong but realistic, and lovely female character.
Funny to think a character who's body is mostly robotic behaves more "human" than the vast majority of "Strong Female Characters".
@@louisduarte8763 EXACTLY ! This was the worse setup for a good female character... and they did it !
Ironic how that movie came out around the same time as Captain Marvel, yet audiences were responding way more to Alita than Carol Danvers….
A criminally underrated film! Love Alita Battle Angel ❤❤❤
But why are her eyes so God damn large and ridiculous... ruined the film for me
5:50 I think we all leaned this lesson with the Olympics this week when a DSD intersex biological male took out a skilled Olympic female boxer in less than 46 seconds.
I re-watched Dredd (2012) last week and realised that Judge Anderson is overlooked by most as a good female character, I liked her development from naive rookie to capable Judge through the film. She wasn't obnoxious, invincible or trying to out-do Judge Dredd all the time, she just earnestly tries to do what's right and they made a good team that can compensate for each other's weaknesses.
Yeah, that's a good example :) "You look ready"
Ma-Ma was an excellent female villain, as well: smart, tough, ruthless and downright scary. She was the undisputed ruler of Peach Trees {at least, until the Judges showed up} not because the plot required it, but because she was the strongest and most dangerous. Her gender wasn't even an issue.
Excellent movie 🤙
@@JonahsWail Agreed, I always thought it was a pity that it didn't get the full reboot treatment but they catered the marketing too much to the original audience for the little bit they did put out.
@@ericwolf9664 The movie also had bad release timing, which is typically the biggest nail in the coffin for any chance of a sequel.
Amanda Tapping as Samantha Carter in SG1 was so amazing and had a big effect on me. Not only because she was a total badass in the show when she was called into action. But for the episode where she learned that her father had developed cancer. Let's just say it came very close to the mark with me in what I had to deal with in real life. Her character had such an amazing journey in the show and Samantha in the show got something I didn't get, more time with her father.
Ive been rewatching SG1 lately (up to S7) and really enjoy her character and what they did. Even Dr. Frasier in a smaller role, has a better character than modern female characters.
And just because her reproductive organs are on the inside instead of the outside doesn't mean she can't handle whatever the men can handle 😂
As T would say "Indeed".
@@buzzcomber Frasier was one of the most heroic characters in the series. Loved every episode where she got the spotlight. Teryl Rothery played her brilliantly and added strength and warmth to her character in equal measure.
@@jaffarebellion292 couldn’t agree more!
Watching 'Aliens' at the cinema a few weeks ago, I realised how great films contain little moments that build their characters. There is a moment where Hicks is showing Ripley how to use the pump-action gun thing. As he does so, she flinches - very brief, but enough to show that this was a real person who wasn't used to this environment and was genuinely unsettled. And this made her heroism all the more remarkable and relatable.
Ellen Ripley is perhaps the all time best example of a strong female character. Aliens is a masterclass in how to portray a woman that is strong yet feminine. She is vulnerable yet brave, afraid yet courageous. She is compassionate, empathetic and nurturing yet competent and decisive when relied upon. She is terrified to an almost debilitating state yet refuses to give up. She doesn’t try to compete with the marines or other men. Instead she adds value and attempts to think of things they may have missed. Thus she gains their respect.
Yes and when she fires it for the first time it nearly knocks her over - great movie great character
I love Aliens. It’s one of my all-time favorite movies. I love Ripley. I think she is one of the best fictional characters ever. Her progression throughout the movie is phenomenal. But every time I watch it, during the scene where she has rescued Newt and it seems the Queen is going to let them go, when one of the eggs hatches and Ripley does that little head tilt, I want to scream, “Don’t do it, just get the f**k out of there, IT’S GONNA BLOW THEM ALL UP ANYWAY !!!!” And every time, she opens fire on the eggs, pissing off the Queen, starting the (admittedly awesome) battle resulting in the Queen hitching a ride on their escape shuttle, etc etc etc. I understand the drama and tension and excitement and whatever. But, damn, if ever there was a time to just…walk away, Renee, er, Ripley. 🤷♀️
We connect with a hero who overcomes their weaknesses to stand up when they are needed.
OMG 🤯 my brain exploded within the first 20 seconds as so many Awesome female characters were listed so quickly... almost ODed from sheer awesomeness!
Uma Thurman in kill bill was a great example of a female protagonist, you see the struggles she went through and see how badass she is now, it really makes you appreciate her more when you see her training
She is incredible, love that movie series.
I don’t remember any struggles. She went from badass to winning. Very little challenge for her.
Only struggle was before the movie. That’s the same as Rey. All her struggles were before the movie.
@@TeensierPython Before the movie? Lol.. I won't spoil for others what her struggle was but you're seriously either trolling or straight up joking right now.
@@TeensierPython Let’s see, she spent years learning how to fight, studying under a brutal master. She killed mercilessly until she became pregnant and realized life is precious and so on. Watch the movie.
Tarantino is a king 🤴🏼
Speaking about characters facing failures and backtracks on their path, I remember there was a webcomic about mercenaries that had this particular line: "Failure is not an option. It is mandatory. The option is whether or not to let failure be the last thing you do."
It seems that Hollywood has forgotten that.
and indeed failing *upward* is the way to go in Hollywood
Maxim 70.
Failure doesn't pay the bills. Of course they aren't willing to fail for the sake of creating actually good art.
I bet they took it from Andromeda series.
Because when you fail in Hollywood, that's the end of you forever.
I remember that scene from _Sicario._ I was like, "Don't do it, don't do it, don't make this 'that kind of movie'....!" And then she got smacked down like almost anyone would going up against a seasoned professional trained to dispense violence. That's a great movie.
Great movie
And the scene in Andor when Bix was easily overpowered by the Imperial. I was like WTF? In this era?
While it should be a normal thing.
Sicario was a great, gritty movie that absolutely did not fuck around with fantasy wish fulfillment in many, many ways, including but not limited to the realities of being a woman on the force.
Yeh it's a great film - Love Emily Blunt - she's great in 'The English'
He's a CIA dog, not even remotely that kind of seasoned professional.
I'm sure that the people around him were though.
Not that he even needed to be that to put her down, just big, strong and kind of expecting it anyway.
They were not unaware that she was tricked into it - that knowledge brings an expectation of, er... bad feelings when it gets found out later, unless they happened to be a simpleton which does not jive with a CIA operative, dog or not.
7:40 yes - also related to why Frodo (on his quest against Sauron) and Sam vs Shelob is so compelling.
The same could be applied to Trinity in Matrix 4, where she suddenly could use all the powers and skill in a blink of en eye that Neo died to attain... Modern "strong female characters" uses cheat code to make them look superficially strong. There is no struggle, no learning curve, apathy...
I think that the more powerful the end point, the more painful the initial struggle has to be. My headcanon of Dovahkiin is destined to become a force that even Gods fear, but starts out on death's door because she's overdosed on her own healing magic so hard that her organs are failing.
don't remind me of that trash
@@marko6947 what if I told you, it was rumoured to be made bad to piss off Hollywood.
For me these female characters are very cartoony. Very over the top comic strip. That is ok in that genre, but does not translate to live action at all. Live action implies live people (IMO)
@@silo_fx3182 There have always been live action males who are written as powerful characters from the start, and no one complained. Just look at any 80's action hero, or James Bond, even Indiana Jones. But God forbid they make a strong female character and all of a sudden the insecure guys come out of the woodworks complaining about what's real life or not. 🙄