Even though lots of people do it, pro set up guys will be the first to tell you to never stretch the strings in that fashion, just tune them, play them, tune them up a half step sharp, play them, and then back to standard. Any stretch needs to be LINEAR. Here is why this matters. If you just take up most of the slack and then pull the string away from the fretboard to stretch them, for one thing, even a strong person isn’t actually stretching them the way that is actually linear, and are actually stressing the truss rod temporarily and making more neck relief, or concave bow, and if any other strings are already at near tuned tension, they can actually keep that bow from returning FULLY to the shape it was before that stretch, which effectively was trying to pull the nut and bridge closer together, like King Kong would. As an example, the cumulative in-tune tension from nut to bridge, of four or five bass strings, is substantial, and honestly more than the average person could exert by trying to take the place of the tuning machines. But when we pull on the strings AWAY from and perpendicular to the fretboard, we are putting more concave bow stress on the neck than even the in-tune tension, by far, as we have a distinct mechanical advantage pulling from this direction, which in turn puts a slight kink in the string, most notably at the saddle, in a place which will creep into the free standing string space once tuned. And that is very bad. Imagine having the bridge end of your new strings held back an inch or so more than the usual distance from back of bridge to saddle, and then playing them like that for awhile. THEN, release whatever was holding them back, and retune. You will now be pulling that bend in the string which is clearly shown when we replace strings, the old ones will have a little kink where they had crossed the saddle. Through- body type bridge set-ups make that kink even more pronounced. Now imagine if that kink was between your saddle and nut. Do you think that will do us any favors? Nope. In fact, if it were literally simply pulled forward, it would leave a slight “bump” in the string, effectively raising string height, AND cause instability in the intonation or worse, inability, as the tension is trying to straighten out the “bump”, but it’s now bent steel, and will resist till the bitter end. If the string were to roll in the bridge while slackening and retuning, that “bump” could now be a “dip” and cause fret buzz, effectively lowering the string to lower than the saddle. It might be hard to see this imperfection while tuned, but it would be there nonetheless, and cause several problems, not just one. Stretching them as such, as if drawing a bow and arrow, puts even MORE pressure on the string at the saddle, and creates slightly more of a kink than when simply tuning them. Tuning them sharp initially will assist in a quicker stretch to break in duration, but even a whole step may be too much. The relationship between the core of the strings and the wire wrapped around that core is crucial to the performance of the string, and altering that too much can result in “dead strings”, strings which are quiet at certain fret positions, prevent proper intonation, playability, and even action. Stretching them as a bow and arrow is also rough on the nut. And honestly, this may all sound like splitting hairs, but then again, the difference between a bass that seems to play itself and a bass that never seems quite “right” is because of a few split hairs combing and conspiring to ruin your day. Sweat the details. The rest will sort itself.
I've had one of these for years. It was my first bass. Mine has the Ebonol fretboard, which I really like and don't see any more. I put a Carvin J pickup in, fitted Graphtek Tusq saddles and nut, and rewired it for single volume, blend pot, and phase reversal switch. DiMarzio pickups are planned for the nearish future. I had to shim the neck, but the action is reasonably low and it's a fun bass to play! If anyone wants to learn setup I'd have no problem recommending as a first fretless that won't break the bank.
Couple of questions 1. did you adjust the truss rod before changing the string height? 2. how could the "intonation be bad"? - its a fretless!! :-) and presumably the bridge has adjustable saddles to match "12th fret" harmonic with string pressed on fingerboard Thanks for interesting review on dirt cheap but obviously serviceable fretless - the major manufacturers don't do many fretless options these days
Thanks! I didn't make any adjustments other than raising the action. You're right, intonation isn't the right word. I said it in the moment and it slipped through the edits. I think it's a serviceable instrument, other folks have mentioned to me that I should mod it or go get it properly setup but I picked this up just to scratch the fretless itch I've had for a few months.
On the contrary, intonation is still important. As you learn to play a fretless instrument, you'll develop finger-placement muscle memory. Bad intonation will still result in sour notes.
Sweet, I just ordered one of these. Played on a buddy's about 15 years ago, kinda liked it. Saw they were on sale, $99! I paid more than $6 , lol, but still thought it was well worth it. Thanks for the review. Liked your jam at the end btw..
Dudester I wish I had your GK amp. Ooooh love em. We have a red Rogue fretted bass. A 2021. Big bass. I call it the Aircraft Carrier. No fret buzz. Played it on a big casino Disco gig last Summer. Sounds ok. Looks great. I mostly play an inexpensive short scale Mitchell 4 string in Grey matte. 30 inch scale. Cheers!
I like the body shape and the color of the fretboard. it does always seem they have trouble with the jazz pick up on the budget basses, but it also makes some sense
I purchased the Rogue Fretless on sale for $99. At first glance, it's as cheap as its price. There are a couple of finish blems, the plastic controls cover was rough-cut, and original pickups were noisy. I could not plug a cable into it because of a defective jack, and had to do solder work before I could play it. The neck surface feels like cheap furniture, IMHO, but I like satin or glossy necks. The fretboard is far from smooth, and there are some grain gaps. With that said, I jumped on the chance to own a fretless for $100. (I have a half dozen fretted basses: Fender P, Fender J, Gibson EB-0 and a Hagstrom among others). Like many replies in this post, the first thing I did was start working on it. Upgraded both pickups, rewired it, replaced pots, sanded the fretboard, sanded the neck, shielded the control cavity and replaced the black knurled knobs. It has good bones, essentially (so far), and it's coming along. But as you can see, it took me another $200 and twenty hours of shop work to get it to here, and it still says "Rogue" on the headstock, still has those finish blems, and is still a kinda cheap bass. Good first start, probably great for anyone that has never owned a bass. I started with Fender Rumble 25 amp at one time, and upgraded that. Next will be to sell this thing at a little loss and buy a good fretless bass. I shoulda known better.
I'm not too bothered by finish blemishes. My Pedulla MVP4 was perfect when I got it in the 90s, but looks like it's been through a meat grinder now. Still sounds and plays awesome. I'm looking for a cheap fretless, so I landed here. I actually liked the bridge pickup sound Reve got in this video. But what's the sustain like? Haven't found any videos so far that really show it.
@@craigparker1146 Thanks for your reply. Re-reading my comment, it sounds a little like bashing, but I meant to imply it was as good or better than one might expect for $99. Being a guitar mechanic (and guitar snob) of course I had to upgrade a bunch of parts, but the bass is pretty good out of the box. As a musician, we like names on headstocks, like the way you mention you have a Pedulla (Sweet!). I feel I'd need to explain myself at the jam for the Walmart bass, but also I like to say "the proof is in the playing", and when they stopped chuckling and heard a fretless, they could get back to playing. Snobbery, I know. Best thing about the Rogue: I found out I love the fretless bass, and it enabled me to buy my Carvin LB-20 without hesitation! (To answer your question: I think the sustain was pretty good to begin with, but I upgraded it pretty quickly to a hi-mass (Kluson BBS-4). It has really good sustain now, but I'm not sure how much is owed to that bridge) If you're wavering, I'd say pull the trigger. It's cheap, but not junk!
@@armchairzen I've got a 5-string jazz fretless kit my wife got me for Christmas a few years back. Plays/sounds fine, but weighs a ton, and I'm not sure I really need a low B on a fretless anyway. I barely hit it on my fretted one. Walking that low is muddy, and I'm looking at a new fretless for a couple jazz duo gigs I've got coming up. Unrelated... I got a chuckle at your cassette cut scenes.
Well done demo Does anyone else have a constant buzz if you're not touching the strings? How can that be fixed? It doesn't do it on Any of my other guitars. Thanks
Seems to me these Rogue basses sound a little bit like a Ric 4001. Just a little bit. I think I'll get a fretless when they go on sale again. Very smooth! Cheers!
Even though lots of people do it, pro set up guys will be the first to tell you to never stretch the strings in that fashion, just tune them, play them, tune them up a half step sharp, play them, and then back to standard. Any stretch needs to be LINEAR. Here is why this matters. If you just take up most of the slack and then pull the string away from the fretboard to stretch them, for one thing, even a strong person isn’t actually stretching them the way that is actually linear, and are actually stressing the truss rod temporarily and making more neck relief, or concave bow, and if any other strings are already at near tuned tension, they can actually keep that bow from returning FULLY to the shape it was before that stretch, which effectively was trying to pull the nut and bridge closer together, like King Kong would. As an example, the cumulative in-tune tension from nut to bridge, of four or five bass strings, is substantial, and honestly more than the average person could exert by trying to take the place of the tuning machines. But when we pull on the strings AWAY from and perpendicular to the fretboard, we are putting more concave bow stress on the neck than even the in-tune tension, by far, as we have a distinct mechanical advantage pulling from this direction, which in turn puts a slight kink in the string, most notably at the saddle, in a place which will creep into the free standing string space once tuned. And that is very bad. Imagine having the bridge end of your new strings held back an inch or so more than the usual distance from back of bridge to saddle, and then playing them like that for awhile. THEN, release whatever was holding them back, and retune. You will now be pulling that bend in the string which is clearly shown when we replace strings, the old ones will have a little kink where they had crossed the saddle. Through- body type bridge set-ups make that kink even more pronounced. Now imagine if that kink was between your saddle and nut. Do you think that will do us any favors? Nope. In fact, if it were literally simply pulled forward, it would leave a slight “bump” in the string, effectively raising string height, AND cause instability in the intonation or worse, inability, as the tension is trying to straighten out the “bump”, but it’s now bent steel, and will resist till the bitter end. If the string were to roll in the bridge while slackening and retuning, that “bump” could now be a “dip” and cause fret buzz, effectively lowering the string to lower than the saddle. It might be hard to see this imperfection while tuned, but it would be there nonetheless, and cause several problems, not just one. Stretching them as such, as if drawing a bow and arrow, puts even MORE pressure on the string at the saddle, and creates slightly more of a kink than when simply tuning them. Tuning them sharp initially will assist in a quicker stretch to break in duration, but even a whole step may be too much. The relationship between the core of the strings and the wire wrapped around that core is crucial to the performance of the string, and altering that too much can result in “dead strings”, strings which are quiet at certain fret positions, prevent proper intonation, playability, and even action. Stretching them as a bow and arrow is also rough on the nut. And honestly, this may all sound like splitting hairs, but then again, the difference between a bass that seems to play itself and a bass that never seems quite “right” is because of a few split hairs combing and conspiring to ruin your day. Sweat the details. The rest will sort itself.
Good to know, thanks!
I've had one of these for years. It was my first bass. Mine has the Ebonol fretboard, which I really like and don't see any more. I put a Carvin J pickup in, fitted Graphtek Tusq saddles and nut, and rewired it for single volume, blend pot, and phase reversal switch. DiMarzio pickups are planned for the nearish future. I had to shim the neck, but the action is reasonably low and it's a fun bass to play! If anyone wants to learn setup I'd have no problem recommending as a first fretless that won't break the bank.
Nice!
Im getting one of these on Saturday and im ordering a set of dimarzio pj and new pots and turn it into a beast
Sounds awesome!
I've settles on Diarzio pups too... just can;'t get them yet. But I've done other stuff to mine.
Couple of questions
1. did you adjust the truss rod before changing the string height?
2. how could the "intonation be bad"? - its a fretless!! :-) and presumably the bridge has adjustable saddles to match "12th fret" harmonic with string pressed on fingerboard
Thanks for interesting review on dirt cheap but obviously serviceable fretless - the major manufacturers don't do many fretless options these days
Thanks! I didn't make any adjustments other than raising the action. You're right, intonation isn't the right word. I said it in the moment and it slipped through the edits. I think it's a serviceable instrument, other folks have mentioned to me that I should mod it or go get it properly setup but I picked this up just to scratch the fretless itch I've had for a few months.
@@revevague6256 yep.
On the contrary, intonation is still important. As you learn to play a fretless instrument, you'll develop finger-placement muscle memory. Bad intonation will still result in sour notes.
Sweet, I just ordered one of these. Played on a buddy's about 15 years ago, kinda liked it. Saw they were on sale, $99! I paid more than $6 , lol, but still thought it was well worth it. Thanks for the review. Liked your jam at the end btw..
Thanks! Enjoy your bass!
Tape wound strings and that jazz pick up would but a fun combo in my opinion
I tried tape wound strings years ago, a dark sound, but really cool.
Dudester I wish I had your GK amp. Ooooh love em. We have a red Rogue fretted bass. A 2021. Big bass. I call it the Aircraft Carrier. No fret buzz. Played it on a big casino Disco gig last Summer. Sounds ok. Looks great. I mostly play an inexpensive short scale Mitchell 4 string in Grey matte. 30 inch scale. Cheers!
Sounds like a decent instrument. The GK is a great amp. Small and light, mostly use it with my upright.
Great review.
Thanks!
Every video ive seen on this Bass shows the tip of the headstock chiped! No surprise mine was chipped as well
I like the body shape and the color of the fretboard. it does always seem they have trouble with the jazz pick up on the budget basses, but it also makes some sense
I’m mostly an upright player but I think it’s a fun axe. An nice foray into fretless territory for players like myself.
I purchased the Rogue Fretless on sale for $99. At first glance, it's as cheap as its price. There are a couple of finish blems, the plastic controls cover was rough-cut, and original pickups were noisy. I could not plug a cable into it because of a defective jack, and had to do solder work before I could play it. The neck surface feels like cheap furniture, IMHO, but I like satin or glossy necks. The fretboard is far from smooth, and there are some grain gaps. With that said, I jumped on the chance to own a fretless for $100. (I have a half dozen fretted basses: Fender P, Fender J, Gibson EB-0 and a Hagstrom among others). Like many replies in this post, the first thing I did was start working on it. Upgraded both pickups, rewired it, replaced pots, sanded the fretboard, sanded the neck, shielded the control cavity and replaced the black knurled knobs. It has good bones, essentially (so far), and it's coming along. But as you can see, it took me another $200 and twenty hours of shop work to get it to here, and it still says "Rogue" on the headstock, still has those finish blems, and is still a kinda cheap bass. Good first start, probably great for anyone that has never owned a bass. I started with Fender Rumble 25 amp at one time, and upgraded that. Next will be to sell this thing at a little loss and buy a good fretless bass. I shoulda known better.
I'm not too bothered by finish blemishes. My Pedulla MVP4 was perfect when I got it in the 90s, but looks like it's been through a meat grinder now. Still sounds and plays awesome. I'm looking for a cheap fretless, so I landed here. I actually liked the bridge pickup sound Reve got in this video. But what's the sustain like? Haven't found any videos so far that really show it.
@@craigparker1146 Thanks for your reply. Re-reading my comment, it sounds a little like bashing, but I meant to imply it was as good or better than one might expect for $99. Being a guitar mechanic (and guitar snob) of course I had to upgrade a bunch of parts, but the bass is pretty good out of the box. As a musician, we like names on headstocks, like the way you mention you have a Pedulla (Sweet!). I feel I'd need to explain myself at the jam for the Walmart bass, but also I like to say "the proof is in the playing", and when they stopped chuckling and heard a fretless, they could get back to playing. Snobbery, I know. Best thing about the Rogue: I found out I love the fretless bass, and it enabled me to buy my Carvin LB-20 without hesitation! (To answer your question: I think the sustain was pretty good to begin with, but I upgraded it pretty quickly to a hi-mass (Kluson BBS-4). It has really good sustain now, but I'm not sure how much is owed to that bridge) If you're wavering, I'd say pull the trigger. It's cheap, but not junk!
@@armchairzen I've got a 5-string jazz fretless kit my wife got me for Christmas a few years back. Plays/sounds fine, but weighs a ton, and I'm not sure I really need a low B on a fretless anyway. I barely hit it on my fretted one. Walking that low is muddy, and I'm looking at a new fretless for a couple jazz duo gigs I've got coming up.
Unrelated... I got a chuckle at your cassette cut scenes.
Well done demo
Does anyone else have a constant buzz if you're not touching the strings? How can that be fixed? It doesn't do it on Any of my other guitars. Thanks
Thanks. Sorry not sure about that, is the power noisy in your spot?
Seems to me these Rogue basses sound a little bit like a Ric 4001. Just a little bit. I think I'll get a fretless when they go on sale again. Very smooth! Cheers!
Surprisingly good bass!
Id be careful of getting them while on sale…got a 12 string from them once while on sale and the damn thing was awful!
It sounds good, even at twice the price.
I agree! The price seems to fluctuate, Guitar Center seems to run it on sale every couple months. Keep an eye out for deals!
Nice ✌
Thanks!
Fun
I think so too!
yep. gonna get one soon. cheers!