Common Mistakes New Watchmakers make Using a Timegrapher
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- Опубліковано 11 лип 2022
- In Watch Repair, a timegrapher is a requirement, if you are seriously wanting to fix or service broken watches.
In this video, I continue the basic watch repair series, by giving you a head start of the fundamentals of using the timegrapher.
DISCLOSURE: My content may include affiliate links for products and/or services I personally use, recommend, and/or believe would be helpful for you, our followers. If you take action (i.e., subscribe, make a purchase) after clicking one of these links, I will earn a small referral fee.
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I am a super noobie into watchmaking. I thought to pick it up as a hobby and am slowly acquiring the tools needed. Still have a ways to go but I recently stumbled across your channel and immediately gravitated towards your teaching style. Slow, methodical, technical, with diagrams and microscope closeups. If only 5% of the world knew what went into watchmaking perfection. People with money simply buy what's expensive and have zero appreciation for the little engineering marvels that they are. Cheers!
You got that right Tyler. Good to have you with us.
Make sure you make lubrication one of your main priorities! I talked to a watchmaker today who told me he only uses 1 grease, and 1 oil (9010). Don’t be that guy. Theres a lot of those guys.
Watch his first video. 7 tools for complete noobs. Jk. But really watch it
Even as an amateur watchmaker and now half decent having worked on quite a number of vintage watches and pocket watches I have never failed to learn something really worthwhile or what I think is valuable information on every single one of your videos. Your short lessons are always relevant and of the highest standard - you are a gifted teacher.
Thanks for sharing! That's all I can hope for. Hell I learn new things talking to other watchmakers, all of which have different work experiences. Keeping an open mind and being able to continuously learn is what makes horology so interesting.
Your explanation cleared up the mystery of how a timegrapher measures amplitude. Thank you.
Glad it was helpful Terry.
Thank you for a clear and careful presentation without trying to sell me on something. I truly appreciate it.
I have nothing to sell brother. Thanks for watching
Best one yet on timegraphers. And I've watched alot of em over the years. Life member of the ADD/Dyslexia club, I understood this one easily. Thanks.
As per usual, this was an excellent video. The explanation of amplitude, beat error, etc. was all incredibly interesting! Thanks for the deep dive!
Yea man, thank you
Thank you dear, very informative video. It is delightful to see a person who actually knows and shares freely knowledge. Please keep up the good work!
Thank you may friend
I really love this channel. We can get tones of information the factory way for free. This is the same way how the high-end watch manufacturer discusses things during training. Soooo Swiss...
Are you in school right now ?
Good stuff. Thanks for sharing your knowledge. Love the lift angle tip.
You got it Supercruze
Loads of information. Brilliant. Thankyou.
Thank you for your time. Much appreciated.
As a 61yr lifelong watch lover. you have a new subscriber. I am finally going to learn how to repair and tune my large selection of watches I haven't used for years. Thank you so much for sharing your valuable knowledge that will help me with going into the other side of my mechanical watch love.
Welcome aboard!
Well, I learned something today! I didn't know about the manufacturer's beat error tolerances, and I didn't know that anything under 1ms didn't affect the time keeping. Interesting stuff! Great informative video as always
Let me say that it obviously has to a lot to do with the grade of the movement. These are minimum allowances that would be allowed, but with the ease of adjusting BE in modern movements as opposed to adjusting BE at the collet on older movements, there really is no reason that it should not be perfect in the dial positions.
Another nugget of gold. I am now going to stop obsessing with beat error. Thank you sir!
Hey Stephen,
If you are on a modern movement, you should be able to get it to 0.0 but when you are working on a movement that needs to be adjusted at the collet, it’s ok to get it close and be done. Less chance of screwing up the hairspring.
Thanks again Alex! Awesome tip on calculating lift angle - it's obvious now that you've explained it haha
What’s up my friend, thanks for watching
Great video! Happy I came across your channel. Keep it up!
Another awesome video. Thanks for making them, I am learning a ton!
Thanks KW
Thanks for the great tips, Alex.
My pleasure!
Great video Alex. I hiervan more and more vind faults in the movement by using my Timegrapher. Before using your bonus tip, I search the internet to find a lift angle list of movements.
The bonus tip is so helpful! Thanks!
You're so welcome!
Another home run topic. Thanks!
Thanks John
an excellent video,I'm am to new to understanding everything.
Clear and concise!
Thank you sir.
Great stuff. I learned this the hard way.
Thank you, my friend. Come back and see us again.
This is all very interesting. I am certain that I will be returning to this video many times as I progress through my watchmaking journey. Thank you for sharing your knowledge with us, it is greatly appreciated! 👍
Great to have you!
Thank you very, very much. Excellent explanations in such a clear way. So calm and cool, simply wonderful!
You're very welcome Fred.
Thank you for the advice
No problem!
Thank you for the video, your video is utmost helpful🍻🍻
No problem Hugo. 👌
Absolutely fascinating.
Thank you my friend.
Thanks! This is an amazingly clear and comprehensible explanation of principles I’ve been wondering about for a while.
You're very welcome and Thank You for your support.
Thanks, been told so much about the time grapher, when all thats required was detail and myths explained. cheers.
Thanks again Billy G
Very informative explanation learned a lot thank you
Very welcome my friend
I am so glad I came across your videos. You explain things in a very understandable way. I used your affiliate links to reorder some cleaning supplies as a thank you.
Well Mr HVAC we appreciate you brother. Let me know if you need anything.
Alex
Very good explanations, thanx!
Thanks Ernest. I hope it helps you in some way.
@@watchrepairtutorials yeah. I am no watch maker in any sense, and at this point I would not dare to disassemble the movement. I have this old watch from my dad, that passed away back in 1993. The watch is from the 70's I think. It is a known brand in ex-Yugoslavia, but otherwise I don't think so... Omikron. It has a Unitas 6325 movement with 21 jewels (Swiss made). The watch was never ever serviced to my knowledge. The front plate was in a very bad condition with some yellow stains, that I took it apart a take off the coating from the plate and used some black spray and then cleaned the digits. I polished the plexiglass. So then I was looking for some knowledge about how does it work in the first place. Very interesting invention, once you understand the basics. And now I was trying to make the watch run as true as possible. I found this phone App called Watch Accuracy Meter. It seems it works just fine. I was able to reduce the beat error to the minimum of about +0.2 BUT I see big differences in the speed between: 1) Half winded vs. Full winded (-731 vs. +71 s/day), and 2) Orientation, Face Up vs. Face Down (+71 vs. +2 s/day). I did adjusted it Face Down and fully winded. So that is consistent and watch would be true in that position... BUT, probably because the watch is never serviced in it's 50 years of life it will not be possible to adjust it "right" for all positions....?? Sorry for the long story, 🙂you probably have better things to do then to read this layman details. Haha. Cheers I will watch more of your vides and who knows...
Excellent video- Thanks!
Good to see you again Mike, thanks for watching
Excellent educational video. Thanks for sharing.
Glad you enjoyed it!
We’ll done, we’ll explained, clear and patient. I like it. Good job, thank you.
Thank you my friend. I hope it can help in some small way.
Only just found your video's, really really good, great information very well explained. Working my way through them all, please keep them coming beginners like myself are benefiting enormously.
Hey Graham,
My channel is designed for new watchmakers and I am making videos kind of a specific order to build skills as needed.
Glad you like it.
That was freaking awesome!!!!
Good stuff. I will listening to these again. Need to retain it sll.
Thanks for listening. Keep on keeping on Chip
Thank you
Great tips, thanks Alex!!
My pleasure Francisco.
I love your style and learning from you, please keep it going! I’m a hobbyist watchmaker learning it all on UA-cam
That’s awesome man. UA-cam is great but there’s just so much information on watchmaking that’s not out there. It will never be on the internet. If you ever find yourself needing to fill in the blanks, you should consider taking my watchmaking course which will be the closest thing to watch making school as you can find.-Alex
Thank you so much for imparting your experience in watchmaking on a hobbyist like myself. Your ability to make things I never even considered, seem so obvious and easy to understand is great. You were born to teach! I've just discovered your channel, and i'm eating this up. Great stuff!
My pleasure!
These are some of the best watchmaking videos on UA-cam. And I've watched a LOT of them. The information is so well-delivered and clear that I am learning 100X more than I've learned watching other channels. Thank you!
Wow Mike that’s really nice to hear. That’s what I am going for.
I love your teaching style it’s so clear and makes perfect sense, thank you
You are so welcome!
Why have I not spotted your channel yet 😣
Just purchased a timegrapher to check my watches, so this video is invaluable.
Great presentation and info.
Thanks for sharing this with us.
I’ve subscribed now so I don’t miss any more of your videos.
All the best
Fantastic I hope to see you here in the comment section again. Let me know if there’s anything I can do to help you, Alex.
Awesome, this video earned you a subscriber! Your explanation of the physics involved in using a time graph machine is extremely helpful. Many people may not even know why the microphone stand rotates! Thanks for your detailed explanation of how it all works.
Thank you Dennis. I’m glad to have you as part of the community.
Excellent, very helpful
Hey Kevin, glad I could help
Wow now I know what separates a good regulation from a great one. You’re truly a pro. 👍
Thanks Frank.
great tip. TY
Glad it was helpful!
Hi ! Wow just came across your video, amazing ! Loved it ! I Subscribed , Thank you
Thanks for the sub!
Absolutely a video i will return to once i get a timegrapher.
There are deals out there from time to time.
excellent, very informative
Thanks Patrick, glad to have you
Excellent. now i know the correct principles.
What’s up Billy. I am glad you found it helpful brother.
Great informative & clear video with lots of tips, thank you very much.
You're very welcome Robert.
I wish you were my teacher!
@@robertproctor198 I am . Let me know if I can help
Great video,,,THANKS
Thanks for watching Greg. let me know if you need anything or have a subject you would like to see in a video
Thank you for sharing your expertise. I've been sequentially watching your video series and look forward to watching all of them.
Awesome, thank you! Let me know if you have any questions
@@watchrepairtutorials In addition to watching your videos (and a handful of others), I'm reading Maintaining & Repairing Mechanical Watches: A Practical Guide by Mark W. Wiles. It's laid out well and I like that it was published in 2016. Bookwise, I am wondering where to go from here. Today, I visited an excellent used book store to assess their selection of horology books, and they had several interesting titles but they were all published in 1945 or earlier. Can you recommend titles that have aged well? I mostly collect vintage military field type watches with basic movements that I'm wanting to service. I'm also becoming fascinated by 1930s-50s chronographs and would love find books on this subject as well. Thanks again for sharing your expertise and I apologize if you've already done a video on must-have books that I have not watched yet.
@@chrishughes24x7 I would recommend the Bulova school of watchmaking.
Written around 1945. It’s full of information that’s useful even today.
@@watchrepairtutorials I'll check it out. Thanks again!
Thank-you.
You’re very welcome Bruno
Advanced clarity!
"Thank you, I try to be as crystal clear.
You da man! Love these videos thanks!
Hey Rick,
How are you?
Busy as a one legged man in an ass kicking contest?
@@watchrepairtutorials ya I'm hanging in there, thanks! How about you?
@@rickhufnagel6984 feeling good and staying busy
Sir, your depth of knowledge is awesome. It looks as if you have done your PhD in watch technology. You keep me spellbound when I watch your videos. At times, I feel I know nothing. But please continue with these videos. I gave so much to learn. Thanks and God bless.
Sorry, it should read I have so much to learn.
I appreciate you my friend. Keep striving for improvement in every way.
Thank you - very helpful for noobies as me ❤😊
You are so welcome. Good luck to you.
Excellent video Alex, you gave us 100s of tips! How long have you been working with watches?
Well I started at 18 and am getting ready to turn 62 so, a couple years I guess.😄
Awesome 👌
“Just what I needed “ -The Cars
Thank you
Your channel is amazing 😍
I just got two of my watches from service from a local watchmaker and both are around 180 degrees amplitude. I told that to the watchmaker and he said it was "fine". Both are running slow. One has VERY different rates between different positions from -50s to +5s, while the other seems pretty consistent with 5s delta ~ -5s to -10s.
Its disappointing... Not sure whether to take them back and keep pushing or accept a big waste of money and go elsewhere...
That’s totally unacceptable from a watchmaker. Sorry to hear that was your experience.
Of course the real measure is the accuracy on your wrist .
Finally a no-nonsense explanation. There's so many 'unboxing and review' videos which essentially are just an unboxing (what's the point in that?) and ooh, isn't it nice?
As a heating engineer, I like to explain to my customers what's happening inside their boiler in order so that they understand what needs doing/repairing.
To me at least, this video is just that.
Defo subscribing. Many, many thanks for that detailed explanation of the details of the function of the watch. Now I can release the grip on watchmakers charging a fortune (several times the original purchase cost) of servicing my Raketas.
My better watches will come once I've built up a bit of experience.
With an analytical mind, horology is a natural hobby for you. Let me know if I can help.
@@watchrepairtutorials Many thanks, I'll try and figure it for myself, but will come back if needed.
Thank you, thank you, thank you, Sir!! 👌👍☺️✌️🙏🌻☀️
You are very welcome Pete.
✨✨ Get Your Copy of my eBook, The Secrets for Adjusting Watch Rates ✨✨
➡➡PDF DOWNLOAD watchrepairtutorials.com/ebook/ ⬅⬅
➡➡Available on Kindle & Soft Cover @ geni.us/4x8C (Amazon)
✨✨Watchmaking Courses and Training ✨✨
➡➡ watchrepairtutorials.com/watchmaker-course/ ⬅⬅
Thank for sharing this info. As a (absolute) beginner is was wondering what my new bought Weishi 1000 could tell me about my mechanical watch and what's behind those readings.
Well, first and foremost, you need to look up to see what the lift angle is and adjust that for your watch movement. The correct lift angle in the timegrapher will tell you what the amplitude is. The amplitude is basically how far or the angle that the balance will isolates during two vibrations. This is an indication of the health of your watch movement amplitude of 270° in the horizontal position is kind of the benchmark for a movement that’s running well.
The rate is just what it sounds like it is the time gain or lost over a 24 hour period when the watches in that position. The six main positions are dial up and dial down, and then the vertical positions are crown up crown down crown left and crown right. You will notice the amplitude drops 30 to 40° when you move from the horizontal position to the vertical positions.
Beat error is the measurement of the difference of each vibration during one oscillation of the balance wheel. Your time Grapher is measuring how long one vibration is when the balance wheel spins to the left, and it’s comparing it to the vibration when it spins to the right, and that difference is the beat error.
Beat error is really only important when it’s over 1.0 ms as that will affect the timing but anything under that does not affect timing. What it does affect is how easily a movement will start up once power is put into the main spring barrel.
And that my friend is a general overview of what the timegrapher will tell you
@@watchrepairtutorials Thank you!
Very, very, good video how can I get to number one and watch the whole series 👍🏻👍🏻
Hey Peter,
Glad you find some value in it.
Here is a link to the playlist.
ua-cam.com/play/PLvMdYdz6a-tFD_GIFjiV4zj48nSfFOOky.html
Another great video Alex! Thanks! On a different note, I just got a set of 9 screwdrivers, made in South Korea, brand isTimelab...I would gladly send the set to you if you would be so kind to do a review on them...
JD that’s awesome. I am actually planning a video on the difference between lower cost screwdrivers and Bergeon screwdrivers. What is the real difference.
If you think they are a contender I would love a set. If you go to the about me page my email is there.
Добрый день, Вы делитесь такими тонкостями, о которых многие умалчивают! Благодарю Вас!
Спасибо, мой друг. Я стараюсь освещать темы, которые не интересуют другие каналы, потому что они не набирают много просмотров. Я ценю тебя.
Than you for this video! By far, it’s tge best video on the subject! All purposes we didn’t know about it, ask in one video!! One question I have I’d about the timegrapher. Being that it is such a crucial tool and it’s accuracy should be of major importance to the results off out adjustments! I see you use the Weishi 1900 model, how does that compare to the 1000? And I’d like to know if we need to be aware of fake machines? Amazon, eBay, etc have them at different price ranges and raised my fear level about the chance of fakes being a problem. Are all of them are made in China?
I’ve never owned the 1000 but it is my understanding that the screen resolution is not as sharp. I also believe the 1000 does not have the ability to input custom BPH.
Most of these machines are made by the same manufacture, and just re-branded with different names. As far as I know, they all work the same.
Thanks Alex. You show things not many do in other watchmaking videos. Say I service the watch and put it on the timegrapher. My biggest problem is they run fast. Every dang time running super-fast. Like 10 minutes per day, at least, fast. Something besides magnetism. Hairspring, poising, whatever it takes to adjust the watch across positions. How to poise a balance, baby-step by baby-step, and how to get the watch in acceptable tolerances in different positions. Does your Journeyman course show how to do all this stuff?. If so, then that is what I need. The next step in this aggravating "hobby" I have a love-hate relationship with.
Yes, I will be including regulation as well as dynamic poising in the course. It also includes how to adjust the escapement and I will be adding setting and adjusting pallet stones.
Hi there. Learning so much from your videos. Thank you 😊 When using a dot of white out on balance wheel to determine lift angle, would the balance wheel need to be cleaned afterwards? Wouldn't the added weight from the white out cause a positional error, i.e. a heavy spot?
Yes it needs to be cleaned off. Poise errors in a balance wheel do not affect dial or horizontal positions. They only affect vertical positions.
FYI, you can use any kind of marker as long as you can see it clearly.
I remember the day I saw the 'delta' was more than 1 minute, I never knew the exact reason. My question is solved by this video, I was complacent on lubricating end stones (I was afraid of losing it😂).
That 8 o'clock regulating position tip is just awesome.
It’s where we all start from. It’s shocking when you first see how small and like that in stone it is.
Nice to see Jeff Bridges also enjoys watch repair.
The Dude abides. 😊
Hi Alex. This video is great. Love your style. But...I wonder when you get a moment if you wouldn't also tell us a bit more about those two lines on the grapher. I have done some experimenting with this device. Playing drums on the countertop from which it sits. Also, tapped a wood peg on the microphone. Played load music near it. It would have been interesting to see what it picks up at a Monster Truck Rally! But, some watches I record seem to show those lines are all but one line. So close that they're on top of one another. What does that mean? Other times the grapher just shows dots all over the place. Looks like snow. Figured out if those lines are going downhill the movement is slower then zero. If lines are going uphill it's running fast. Straight is zero. Also, on the 1900 those lines are two different colors. Which one is what? Perhaps put a dirty watch on the microphone. Then place an overhauled one (or brand new) on the microphone. There seems to be no manual that really gets into the 1000/1900 as much as you have in this video. Thank you so much.
I plan on doing more troubleshooting videos with explanations of patterns and what they mean. The answer to your question is quite long and there is a lot of context and nuances that need to be understood to interpret the lines correctly.
Basicly, each line represents one half- cycle or one swing in one direction. A complete oscillation consists of two swings or half cycles. The timegrapher detects the movement of the balance wheel by sensing the vibrations generated by the watch's escapement.
The timegrapher precisely measures the duration of each oscillation cycle, usually in milliseconds and establishes a reference time based on a known and consistent oscillation rate. This reference time represents the ideal duration for each oscillation cycle.
Then the timegrapher compares the measured duration of each oscillation cycle to the reference time. The difference between the measured duration and the reference time is the beat error. When those lines are together the beat error is 0.0ms and as the beat error increases the lines separate.
Wonderful video, as always. Just one question - does adding the drop of whiteout change the poise this skewing the result? How sensitive are the wheels and springs to the extra weight?
Good question. Not for the purpose of determining lift angle. Poise error's do not effect a balance wheel in the horizontal positions, only vertical positions. Of course after the lift angle is determined, you would clean off the white out or marker, whatever you use.
This is the best video I’ve seen in explaining the time grapher! Think you could explain the function of the GAIN setting? I’ve always kept it on medium and never ran into any issue but recently purchased a watch that it needed to be turned up (more sensitive) to get a clean reading. If you have it set too high could it not make unclean readings look better then they actually are? THANKS!
A higher gain setting will amplify the ticking sound of the watch, making it easier for the timegrapher to pick up on subtle variations in the watch's performance. This can be helpful when analyzing watches with low amplitudes or when attempting to detect problems with the watch's balance wheel or escapement. Going to a lower gain would probably have a more masking effect than to a higher setting.
Medium is a good place to be.
@@watchrepairtutorials Thanks for taking the time to answer!
Great video Alex. Could you talk about what if you see a snow storm even after a service what you may have miss or what to check first.
Give me some context. What’s the rate and amplitude showing up. Did you demagnetize the movement?
@@watchrepairtutorials Alex this is a Waltham grade 620 pocket watch. Had a busted mainspring which I replace. Did my normal service and adjustments got the rate down to + 4 sec per day and the amplitude is at 272 this is taken with the watch in the face up position. I did demagnetize as I always do as part of a service and I check with a app on have on my phone. But the traces are very noisy which tells me there extraneous noise coming from the movement. I put this on the back burner for now will strip down when I get time.
@@PMELKUS if you have 2 distinct trace lines, it is an escapement issue.
Could be wear on escape wheel teeth, a pallet stone chip or incorrect position, a problem with divisions or a banking pin issue.
Pretty common in these old girls.
Do you Service or overhaul Ball Watches? I'm in need of my Roadmaster Challenger 18 Day/Date RR1102-C movement, and I been watching your content and I admire your knowledge and desire to be as perfect as possible.
I only take care of a small amount of work from some collectors that I’ve worked with for many years, but I do have a lot of watch making friends if you need a name
The American Watchmakers-Clockmakers Institute (AWCI) - ROLEX "What delta really means to your customer is this: It doesn’t matter if they wear their watch on the right wrist or the left, if they sleep in it or not, or if they lay it down the “wrong way” at night. It doesn’t matter, because the watch will only vary in timekeeping as much as the delta value (and often even less). So knowing the delta and having a low delta is a very desirably thing." / OMEGA "The same applies as above; a very low delta often keeps even the pickiest customer satisfied."
That’s a good way to look at it.
Props
Thank you my friend
Hi Alex, I often come back to your video's for reference, I have a simple question if you could clear up for me please. Are the dots on the timegrapher the palate fork hitting the banking pins or the palate stones on the escape wheel? Hope you can enlighten me "to become a better watchmaker " 😉
It’s not quite that simple. These dots are called indications and indications are caused by the tick sounds of the escapement. All 3 of them together because they happen about 100th of a second from EACH other.
@@watchrepairtutorials Thanks, for your response. Impulse jewels/banking pin/escape wheel hitting stone. Am I now a better watchmaker? Thanks again.
Thank you for sharing your life long learning with new generations of enthusiasts. I have a question regarding my Rolex two tone Submariner; I purchased the watch new from a Rolex dealer in the mid 80’s. The watch is in excellent condition and has never been serviced or opened. I have not worn the watch in many years and it’s not running. Do I send it to Rolex, knowing they will replace original parts as they deem necessary, how can I have it serviced while keeping it as intact to its original parts as possible? Thank you, Will
You can request that certain parts are not changed although some things like the mainspring are not going to be an option with them and you will want that changed out anyway.
Other than that you can find a Rolex certified independent watchmaker who will be much easier to communicate you wishes to.
I would contact the AWCI for a list of watchmakers close to you and then make some phone calls.
@@watchrepairtutorials thank you - very much enjoy you channel
Hey Alex I noticed that you show the st36 with a lift angle of 50°, I thought they were the same as the eta 6497, 44°?
Clones are not exact copies. As a matter of fact, there are differences between the ETA 6497-1 and the ETA 6497-2. Even though they look the same, they have two different beats, 18000 and 19800. The mainsprings are different and even though a lot of parts would be interchangeable, things like the train wheels, pallet fork and balance wheel are not.
It doesn't take much of a change in the escapement geometry to change the lift angle. The Lift angle of an escapement is determined by the start of TOTAL UNLOCKING on the receiving side and the end of the RUN TO THE BANKING on the let off side.
In the example I showed on the ST36, the rotation of the balance wheel is right at I80 degrees. It actual swings a little past the dot on the main plate. So if the timegrapher is showing 185 degrees, with the lift angle set to 50, then I'm pretty confident that its correct because its a lot easier to see the motion of the balance wheel than the RUN to the BANKING.
I don't have a 6497 to check right now.
An easier way to check lift angle is use a black dot from a dry erase pen and slowly wind the watch till you can see a solid black dot at the 180° position. This is because the dot it lining up with it’s self on each cycle at the 180° position. The cycle is so fast that once you hit the 180° the dot stands out. Then change your lift angle on your time grapher till it reads 180° amplitude.
Use a black dot where, though? On the plate? Or the balance wheel?
@@libindaniel2000on the balance wheel
@@libindaniel2000 You've probably figured it out but anyone who hasn't, the wheel. The plate isn't moving. The wheel is what's lining up with itself.
In that bonus tip for determining the lift angle, doesn't the white out affect the balance wheel's poise or is it negligible?
That’s a great question. It would absolutely create a poise error, but horizontal positions are not affected by poise errors only vertical positions.
Of course you would need to clean it off after the lift angle is determined. The white out comes right off.
If the lift angle is too low can I swap the camshaft?
Oh sorry, got my hobbies crossed :D
I two am very new to this hobby, but am just continually in amazement of the mechanical watch movements of any kind. I have a Glycine airman that is very out of time , its only about 6 mo old and was good but now its not. I have a timegrapher , and have had good from it, however not so with the Glycine witch has a Sellita cw200-1 movement but the rate is +619 with an amp of153 full wind beat error of 9.2. I have not done anything to watch. But thought i could see if anyone had a clue? thx SteveO 63
First thing to check would be magnetism
I have watched all of your great lessons and a couple of them more than once. I looked up your web site and to my amazement, you are close to my town. I did not know that there were any watchmakers even close to the area. My question for this lesson. What app are you using for the slow-motion video? I have tried several and I am not able to get the visual results that you are showing. Thank you.
Hey neighbor.
What city are you in.
I used the super slow motion on my IPhone.
@@watchrepairtutorials I am in J'ville near the MCAS. Figures it would be the iPhone. I use Android so I guess I will keep trying different apps until I find one that I like. Kinda of like watching different watchmakers' videos to find the ones I like and can learn from. I like your instructive style, common sense approach and the occasional subtly sarcastic humorous expression or comment. Thanks for the fun learning curve.
@@jaymorton362 are you active military?
@@watchrepairtutorials No. I'm local. Born here, traveled and lived around the country but came back about 22 years ago. Own and operate an apparel and jewelry store in Cape Carteret. Also repair clocks for resale. Been diving into the watches lately.
@@jaymorton362 your clock experience will serve you well. I hope to see again here.
You mentioned swiss watchmaking school textbooks, any recommendations?
In the book “The Theory of Horology, on page 158 is where the information about the 8 o’clock position is. This is not a book I would recommend if you’re just starting out as it’s not really how to book but more technical stuff that really would be kind of pointless for someone new.
If you are looking for a book on watchrepair I would highly recommend the “Bulova school watchmaking”.
This book was written in the middle 40s for servicemen returning after WWII because there was a lack of watchmakers in the country.
It was one of the first books written in plain English, so it was easy to understand. Even though it’s 75 years old not a whole lot is changed and watchmaking and it covers so much information it would be a valuable resource.
@@watchrepairtutorials Thank you!!
I can’t find the lift angle for Bulova 10BPAC or other Bulova 23 movements. What should I use?
Thanks, Scott
Watch the bonus tip at the end. You’ll never have to wonder again
@@watchrepairtutorials Yes, thank you very much!
Wouldn't the liquid paper throw the balance of the balance wheel off on that trick that you showed at the end?
Not for the purpose of establishing the 180-degree rotation of the balance wheel. When you can see a wheel turning 180 degrees it IS turning 180 degrees. Now if you didn't clean it off, it would cause an poise error when the watch is vertical.
What book or articles you reading from, I want that book.
😜
Hi! I'm working on a Seiko 6139A. After the service, the timegrapher shows me a big difference between de back position, and the vertical position, about 30 seconds. Could you help me know where to start?
I assume it could be play in some part, but I can't imagine which one.
Thank you!
What is the amplitude and rate for the dial up and dial down positions?
@@watchrepairtutorials dial up, 172° and 0.2ms. Dial down 190° and 0.1ms. Maybe is there a difference with the balance wheel lubrication?
@@hansolo32 perfect. Start there and clean and relubricate the end stones. Clean the balance pivots as well
I understand what lift angle is but not sure how I can figure out what it would be on a vintage ww2 Elgin A11 580 movement with 7 jewels. I wanted to ask if you had a clue on the lift angle?
It's very simple to figure out. Start with the movement with no power. Mark the balance wheel with a sharpie near the top somewhere by the center wheel and then put another dot 180° or half the balance wheel somewhere on the main plate where you you'll be able to see it. Now you have one sharpie mark on the top of the balance wheel and you have mark 180° from it on the plate or bridge.
Then you add a couple winds to the mainspring and you watch the dot on the balance wheel. The idea here is that you want the mark on the balance wheel to line up with the other mark that's 180° away from it. Once it starts getting close or hard to see, film it with your slomo on your phone so you can see when the dot on the balance wheel lines up with the reference dot on the main plate. Just add a few winds at a time, film it and add winds to the mainspring as needed. Once those two dots line up, the amplitude is 180°. Then just adjust the lift angle on your timegrapher until the amplitude is reading 180° and whatever the left angle that you are set at is the actual lift angle for that movement.
I showed it in a video but I don't know which one it's in.
Thank you very much I will try my best with this
@@jaymopar if you’re going to be working on vintage watches, this is a very good thing to know how to do it. Often times the angles on the Internet are not correct. If you start off with an incorrect lift angle, it makes it really hard to judge what your actual amplitude is.