What's Next for 343 Industries and Halo?
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- Опубліковано 27 лип 2024
- After the September update, morale within the Halo community has never felt lower. A far more vocal portion of people are hoping to see 343 Industries shown the door after their numerous stuff ups while being the caretakers of the Halo brand, whereas some are hoping to see a change in leadership. Which of these is most likely to happen? What's next for 343 Industries? And what does the future hold for Halo? In this video I theorise some of the potential outcomes.
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Twitter: @LaperLarden
Timestamps:
0:00 Halo is Down Bad
1:17 A Disclaimer
2:54 The Worst Case Scenario
4:59 Restructure 343
7:48 Start Fresh
11:12 Fire 343
13:02 We Need Change
Music Credit
-The End by EVA - joshlis.bandcamp.com
Promoted by @RoyaltyFreePlanet - royaltyfreeplanet.com
Creative Commons Attribution 3.0
bit.ly/RFP_CClicense
#haloinfinite #halo #343industries - Ігри
Whether you believe 343 should be given the sack, you'd like to see a restructuring of the studio, or for Halo to be handed off to a new developer, I think we can all agree that what Halo needs right now is change. The last ten years are enough to prove that something isn't working.
That helmet is becoming my nightmare fuel
I support #fire343. in the sense that the current iteration of 343 needs to fucking go, get someone from the outside to poke through the mess that is 343, take the parts that do work like the MCC team, joe, and the other bungie folks there, say goodbye to the rest, and rebuild the company from scratch with those poeple.
Now, sadly, what I think is most likley is halo continues to decline untill it stops making money and the shareholders get mad, and at that point the series is put to bed for a while untill being revived with a new studio 10-15 years down the line like what happened recently with age of empires.
this is honestly the best video ive found on the topic, its not too long, your points are clear, and you dont pull punches while at the same time being fair, non-toxic, and as objective as possible.
#fire343 there name just means failure. Give it to a new studio. And a new Engine.
Worst part is the small portion of the community has let it go. They are praising that horrible event full of game modes majority of us stated we didn’t like. Now all of sudden simply because it’s “content” they all praise the Industry again straight spineless individuals my dude.
“Caring is not competency” is a statement I love. It doesn’t matter how much they care if they can’t get it right. The idea that “no other studio is capable” confuses and frightens me
I'm sure other studios are capable of making a Halo game, and no doubt there are plenty who could probably do it better than 343, but a lot of them have their own problems and games to work on. It might be easier to get a co-studio onboard to help.
@@LaperLarden See I disagree with that idea because unless theirs a restructure alongside it, it still suffers from the current apathetic management. Those other studios still have to work under 343s leadership which as you saw is known to be terrible. Just piling more men at the issue isn’t gonna solve it
I heavily agree on that, you need to show you can both be passionate/caring and also be competent
They didn't care either, they specifically hired people who, and I quote, "hated halo and wanted to change it to be something they'd like" as part of their hiring process
Reply 5
Years of severe underservice and constant disappointment has come to this. Infinite's disgraceful state was more-or-less merely the straw that broke the camel's back.
Wow. I never thought I'd say this, but I wish we had Halo 4 back. At least the multiplayer in that game was actually fun.
A moment of silence for the people in a parallel universe where Halo infinite is a hero Shooter.
Poor bastards.
Their suffering is beyond our comprehension.
As terrible as that sounds, is it really any worse than what we have now?
The current state of the Halo franchise is like watching a terminally ill friend die slowly. The doctor says they could maybe survive if they would just stop living such an unhealthy life style, but you know they won't change. Now you're burdened with watching one of you're oldest friends die solely because of their piss poor decision making
You buggin. Good chance they eating a million times better than this universe's Halo. Like... bruh... We got Master Cheeks
That would be the good timeline considering we are living in a worst timeline.
You could dissolve 343, start a new company in the same headquarters, move all the devs to new permanent contracts, but completely gut upper & mid management. Firing 343 doesn’t have to be as disruptive as people claim.
As a hashtag, it's used quite broadly by people, which is what I've learnt recently. Though from what I have seen, the majority of people who use it think the studio and everyone in it should just be Thanos snapped and gone.
But then again #FireSOMEOf343 doesn't quite have the same ring to it, aye?
Craig please save the game you beautiful brute
@@LaperLarden #fire343management is fine
and that would be no better; a bunch of talentless part time contractors arent going to be any use regardless of what management they have
You could also keep the name 343 but make it EXTREMELY CLEAR it's in name only
The sad truth is, 343i has had the reigns over the Halo franchise for longer than Bungie has (minus early Halo CE pre production.) In the nearly 12 years that have been developing Halo titles, they have yet to make a game mainline title that even meets the minimum quality standards from the Bungie years.
The larger problem of the whole situation is that 343 was not an experienced developer, they are a studio created for a single corporate reason, to keep making more Halo content, not because they had they creative drive and talent to continue saga of Halo.
Kind of crazy to think about that Microsoft would fund an entirely new studio just to develop a competent Halo.
Proves once again that a lot of Money doesn't equal a lot of passion or creativity.
Nice kino fabino reference at the start.
343i should've stayed as a publishing firm for all things Halo under Microsoft - it itself not hands-on involved with the development process.
They should've let studios internally (e.g. Xbox Game Studios) and externally (e.g. Ensemble Studios) handle development with minimal oversight.
If one studio royally messed up you could take sollace in only seeing their name on a single Halo title.
Now, seeing '343 Industries' plastered at the start of EVERY HALO GAME'S start-up is a PR Nightmare.
They need new leadership, and a new name for the company. If I see 343i on anything it's automatically disqualified from my life. Yeah I'd like the entire company to be cleaned out, not all at once. Piece by piece, team by team. Part of infinites issues are the contractors who worked for a year and had to leave. Someone else gets the next contract and doesn't know what the other person coded so they have to deal with bugs they don't know exist. Proper team transition is super important, it needs to be done slowly and carefully so nothing gets lost in translation. I want halo to be something again. 343 will never be capable of achieving that.
really i think the best thing would be a change in management and possibly a rebranding to reflect this, while drastic its nowhere near the nuclear option that completely getting rid of 343 would be. priority should be hiring staff for long term employment rather than using rotating contractors as this model has massively stunted infinites growth, hiring people for the long term so that they can better familiarise themselves with working with the slipspace engine would help the game get content made for it quicker
I agree. I understand why people want to burn 343 down..I'm not going to lie, the part of me that holds grudges kinda does too...but I know people who have done little wrong will suffer and that is very wrong. Something drastic needs to be done though and I think a restructure AND rebrand would be the best we can hope for
Also they need to stop this contractor bs it ruined their entire game’s development. Hire some damn people
@@thetruestar6348 100% agree, it is so abusive and also inefficient for both the game and the workers
I gave up on Infinite well before Season 2 came out, way too many glaring issues that made it clear that 343 and Mircosoft didn't care about Halo as a legacy, just as a generic product and time has proven that I as right. Perhaps it wasn't coincedental that the studio is named after a character who tries to kill MC in the games.
I think scrapping the three prophets of 343 and giving Joe Staten leadership would be a good start and then we wait to see what he can do before making even more drastic changes.
The main issue I have with most of the solutions you laid out is that we can't trust 343 anymore. They said things would be better several times now and they haven't delivered. There is no faith or reason to trust them on their word anymore, so unless there's physical changes, their promises won't hold water.
It’s funny you say ‘Nothing’ is the worst case scenario seeing as it’s the most likely as well
Edit: Well, this comment aged…well?
The more days that pass, the more likely it seems unfortunately.
1. Thankfully the PC port of MCC was successful and it's now in a pretty great place. Now I can always return to the games that have had a huge impact on me without needing to pay for XBL or buy a new console every 5-10 years.
2. There are so many other great games that deserve our attention. I recommend Deep Rock Galactic to my fellow Halo fans. I took a break from Infinite at the start of season 2 to play it and it's been amazing so far. Great replayability, PvE content, fun solo or coop, and lots of SOUL. If you're feeling frustrated at 343 it's probably best to just move on for a while rather than stew in disappointment. Maybe in a year or two Infinite will be worth revisiting.
Rock and Stone baby
The modding scene at halo mcc is what I'm excited about. If they keep polishing and making modding for halo mcc for robust, then im happy
You know what is most crazy? Is that Halo didnt need anything. They could have taken the core model of the first games and literally just continued on. It only requires 343 keeps the basic essentials of the game we all love. At it's heart, Halo is basic fun in the sandbox levels they drop you in and giving you modes to customize, play co-op, and have mindless endless fun. It's INSANE how 343 has utterly never understood how basic and simple to please Halo fans would be... 343 since the beginning always has this perspective and focus that "they gotta keep adding new things, making things more and more over the top Micheal Bay movie esc vibes in the storylines. And on top of that, they've added such a mess with their direction that they neglected the core of what mattered most. (Just keeping the same basic functions of Halo 1 and 2..) yet they got so side tracked that they lost track of all the core backbone that keeps players so in love with jumping in to boot up the game. They now lack so many features and modes and abilities to customize, have creative freedom, have options, nope (guess they didn't have the time and resources) then add the A.I. of the first game, the amount of freedom the players had even in the menu before starting anything. The sandbox physics effects we all dorked around with our friends in split screen modes to see what wacky things we could make happen.. it's literally that simple. *Yet 343 made a simple handoff, turn into a fumble leading to a return for a game losing touchdown.. 343 lost.. and this is nearly a handful of 343 Halo games now that are so not what the Halo fans have ever wanted. (once we got our hands on it and played the games ourselves) it's utterly sad, just how much more the older games offered and the effort that was put in for the experience to be FUN for the player. I don't understand how a video game company can ever lose sight of that "At the core of everything. The games have to be Fun or the players aren't going to support any of your other "marketing points" ~ there has been a couples video game companies that have drastically failed at providing even the basic essentials of games. Which is FUN. To escape from reality in mindless fun. I'm hoping the feedback is becoming so widespread universally across the board with customers, that the game companies Actually Start Making Fun Games Again! Geez. I can't believe we have to hope and beg that that would be occuring, especially in today's era with all the most advanced hardware and software capabilities we now currently have... It's just up to the game companies to make plain and simple fun games. Not everything has to be super complicated, or over the top. Just Make Fun Games.
343 were too busy trying to adapt Halo for a modern audience that they lost the core part of what made it so fun in the first place, which I'd argue was it's simplicity and like you said, the FUN factor. There's too many hands at play and stupid systems being implemented that needlessly complicates things, especially Skill-Based Matchmaking. Seems like more and more studios these days prioritise fun second or third on the list after other crap.
good timing on talking about a restructuring
A fantastic video man, glad to have discovered your channel
13:30 Until 343 needed nostalgia bait to bring fans back after the mess that was Halo 5**. It's no coincidence they launched Reach as the first game on PC, nor that their first season for Infinite was entirely based around Reach cosmetics. Their internal data probably shows Reach was the last time there was mass interest in the series, so they pushed the bait hard.
Very true. There's a lot more love for Reach nowadays than there seemingly was when the game first came out and when I was first playing it.
10 years of lies. 10 years of horrible, broken, incomplete video games. 10 years of mismanagement and lack of communication. They don't get anymore chances. I don't have enough words to describe my hatred of the studio.
#fire343
Bro the timing of this and Bonnie leaving 343 😂💀
I feel that it's gone beyond even just endlessly disappointing the fans, its like a business thing at this stage. It does not look good for Microsoft to have the developer of their flagship franchise be constantly causing controversy over not being able to put out a quality, complete game in 10 years. If I was in charge at Microsoft I would honestly be embarrassed. Literally the only reason 343 haven't been shut down is because Bonnie Ross is on the board of directors at Xbox. 🤷♂🤷♂🤷♂
She’s left apparently
I've been saying this for a long time now, 343 is a stupid ass name for a company, they're literally living up to their namesake, cuz like guilty spark, they're bat shit insane and are also liars.
btw ur vids always make my week man, cheers and keep it up, good work spartan
(edit)
Also I kind of get it why they named it 343 cuz technically monitors were made for the sole purpose of being the caretakers of the halo rings, but at the same time, why choose the name of the SCUMBAG WHO KILLED MY BOY JOHNSON....WHY!
It's a bit of a slipup, for sure 😂 And thanks for watching dude!
I said this in a tweet at one point. 343 is a name for someone whose job it was to safeguard halo, only for them to fail multiple times after antagonising the player. Now am I talking about the character or the company?
Should’ve named it 117 industries💀
@@jackygemme863 too bad the folks at Microsoft were probably smoking pot
Looks like we got the Restructure ending
FIRST. Also, your intro music soothes my soul.
Exactly why I chose it! Thank you!
I'm tired of waiting for the game to be good. It should've been good at launch, not a year later. But I still wouldn't want to see the game in the hands of anyone other than 343. Bonnie has gotta get outta there.
If the games being duds wasn't enough to prove that their leadership isn't doing something right, then it was the treatment of workers. No way this just slipped under Bonnie's radar.
She left
i hope a new developer makes a halo 4 reboot and scraps all 343's games.. that would be so refreshing!
Ironically, I was watching this as a friend shared that Bonnie Ross is leaving effective immediatly.
Incredibly well articulated. Subbed
"It's gonna get way worse."
Please, god, no.
Nice timing
Im so sorry guys i never been this desapointed with halo my whole life im 18 been playing halo since i was 3 well im not going to give up on this franshise any time soon im ready to wait longer and longer i will just accept small things even tho i have dépression because of 343 i'll never give up on my game there is nothing else for me like halo guys hopefully the game will be Amazing one day just be patient alot more and more brave the game is getting better and Better very slowly im so sad that im wasting years and years and months waiting for halo to come back 😕😓💔😭 btw this Channel is Amazing its so so underated sadly thank you if anybody read this love your content keep it up 💖
Alright, let’s weigh our options if hypothetically 343 was to get fired from Halo. There are four studios that Microsoft owns whom I think are most qualified and have been known for consistently putting out good games (for the most part).
Infinity Ward, Obsidian, The Coalition, and id Software.
Let’s look at pedigree:
1. Infinity Ward: the OG Call of Duty, Call of Duty 2, the original Modern Warfare Trilogy, the Modern Warfare reboot, and COD Warzone.
2. Obsidian Entertainment: Fallout New Vegas, The Outer Worlds, The Outer Worlds 2, KOTOR 2, South Park: The Stick of Truth, and Grounded
3. The Coalition: Gears of War Ultimate Edition, Gears of War 4, Gears 5, and Microsoft Flight
4. id Software: Commander Keen, Wolfenstein 3D, Doom, Doom 2, Doom 64, Quake, Quake 2, Quake 3 Arena, Quake 4, Doom 3, Return to Castle Wolfenstein, Wolfenstein 2009, Rage, Doom 2016, Rage 2, and Doom Eternal
I don’t think Infinity Ward would be a good pick because they’re a COD developer and we’ve had enough of Halo trying to be COD to last a whole lifetime.
Obsidian might be able to do something good with infinite’s open world formula but they’ve mostly done RPGs and survival games, not FPSs. So I’m not sure if they would be a good fit either.
Now the Coalition is where it gets interesting: The Coalition has done a really good job of running Gears of War over the last few years, sure we haven’t gotten that many gears games but the ones we have gotten are of superb quality and technical polish with very little complaints that I’ve seen.
Now we come to the big boys... id Software. They have consistently put out quality games since their inception, sometimes the games couldn’t live up to their ambitions (I.e. Rage 1), but for the most part it’s been non stop bangers. Imagine what id could do if they were put in charge of Halo after what they’ve done with Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal. Just bring in some Bungie era devs to work with them on it and viola! We could potentially have the greatest Halo game since Reach.
But, it’ll probably never happen. But it’d be interesting if it did...
I could see someone like Raven being put on to help Halo, I can't see one of the bigger devs. Obsidian would be a horrible choice for a mainline halo game and they are already busy on multiple other projects.
100% agree with ya man. I'd like to see new management and a paradigm shift from the corporate/marketing bros in Microsoft. Torching 343 completely would severely cripple MCC and Infinite for a long time
With Bonnie Ross leaving first, does that make her the Profit of Regret?
If they dropped 6 classic maps i.e. The Pit, Lockout, Guardian, Ascension, Contamination, and Headlong. Implemented a H3/HR veto system and 2 fun modes like Infection and Grifball. They’d buy themselves plenty of time till the next huge update. It’s honestly not a lot to ask for considering how fast and accurate non-developers remade classic maps and scripted game modes.
The pit is a perfect map to implement with the house of reckoning redesign from the campaign.
Im a csgo player and Valve is often accused for not caring about their games but seeing 343 and halo literally makes me want to respect Valve :p
Everytime u make a video it couldn't hit the nail on the head any harder, all this was straight facts and honestly I wish Microsoft would watch this and actually do something
Crossing my fingers that they do!
@@LaperLarden It look like they did. This video is crazy accurate for what happened yesterday.
for a person to get so up set over a video game to actually attack or visit the headquarters is mind blowing. if they do, that nerd needs to seriously grow up.
Great video, fun to watch, subscribed!
I was so hyped for this game! THE ONLY REASON I OWN A XBOX IN THE FIRST PLACE, IS HALO. To see it crumble just hurts. I rather had them tell us, that it needs 2 more years of work...instead they cyberpunked us
im the kind of person who goes by "actions speak louder then words" and 343 has dont shit all for action id say boot the higher ups that fucked up and maybe some of the middle end and get some fresh blood in to get this game back on track to make new stuff
but id also wanna see more studios doing halo games to take the heat off 343
all I can say Is thank you laper larden
I would really like to see a Halo game made in Unreal Engine 5. The main issue would be getting the floatiness and physics of Halo down, but apart from that I imagine it would be far better.
They will keep working on and developing halo and adding content pretty straight forward
"343 is just too big of a studio to pull the plug on it" Ugh love it when "too big to fail" leaks into video games.
Solid video pal
Give me forge, give me scriptable AI banished. Then let the community do 343 job when it comes to content in the moment. Let them fix all the back end stuff..let us help you 343. Give us the ability to make a BR, Firefight, a warzone.
Let us make campaign missions (more in the style of older game where it's mission by mission).
Let us forge on the campaign map.
I just wish the Give us the tools to fix things
Then and only then can halo truly be infinite...
i don't let the negative or bad drama ruin my love for the halo series.
They fucked up my game 4 times 😞
10 years to become a complete game.
Given up on Halo for now. Forge might be the only thing that brings me back.
Correction:
Destiny 2 too uses a modified version of the BLAM! Engine.
Makes sense, since they come from the same mommy.
But at least one brother is treated fairly by his biological mom, the other? Not so much by his adoptive one.
Yeah destiny 2 is in so much better state then Halo infinite
Gettin' really sick of 343, but even I can admit that firing them would be kinda stupid. Who would you give the franchise to? What other triple-A studio in Microsoft's backpocket would have enough people to take on something like halo? I still like your idea from the last video of getting certain affinity on board to help some more.
A lot of studios actually.
The problem is that they already have their own games to worry about, some of them openly dislike Halo too
Someone mentioned ID Software and I have to say... I feel like they could do an amazing job with Halo after seeing the success they had with DOOM.
Their priorities are very squarely focussed on the next Doom or potentially a Quake sequel though. It'd be interesting to see what they'd do with it if they had the time.
@@LaperLarden that’s a fair assessment. Also they’re working on Quake??? I’m excited to see that
I was thinking Certain Affinity wouldn't be a bad choice. They've got alot of Bungie vets and Max Hoberman (CEO) has been very accurate about Infinite's issue and he seems to have a better understanding of what Halo is compared to 343. They're making Halo's BR or w.e. that mode is so lets see how that turns out, if it's good then given CA a huge contract to hire more employees and make a Halo game.
That was some pretty good voice acting at the beginning. Hopefully 343 moves on to a different franchise.
are you planing on doing an evolution of the banshee like you have done with alot of other halo vehicles
Id Software could be given Halo's IP, and 343 could be kept on to do back-end technical work and spillover tasks, and to maintain the MCC. I don't think anyone who works for 343 would lose their jobs entirely, just that they'd be reassigned to one of Microsoft's many other studios. Many of them only work for 343 on a temporary contractor basis in any event.
Yeah I have always hoped that Staten would be made head of 343 or halo.
I think that a restructure of 343 Industries has a significant chance of happening, but I imagine the change would be very gradual and subtle. If the restructuring of 343 Industries does happen, I am concerned that regaining the trust of the Halo community and the rebuilding of Halo's reputation will take a long time, if ever. Also I am uncertain about the future of Halo: Infinite in that scenario as restructuring an organization takes time, and Halo: Infinite requires immediate attention if 343 Industries desires the game to last even half of the intended ten year plan. The lack of change is definitely the worst situation, and I fear that it is a real possibility. Microsoft has acquired several famous game series. So, what if Microsoft no longer sees Halo as the flagship title for the Xbox as it now has game series such as Call of Duty, Doom, and Elder Scrolls that are more popular than Halo? Giving the Halo series to another developer could work, but I would want the developer to evolve Halo's signature game play for the main titles and create spinoffs that adopt different kinds of play styles and mechanics (i.e. Action/Survival-Horror, RPG, RTS, etc.). The branching out content sounds great! I would love to see you analyze some of the mods that are being made for Halo: The Master Chief Collection - especially the mods that are restoring cut content. Also, I would love to listen to another episode of the Infinite Show where you, Footed Ghost, and Shredded Nerd talk about the the current state of 343 Industries and Halo.
AGED LIKE A FINE WINE
I think the council will have to assemble after today's news. Seems like you called it, Reclaimer!
Laper- I'll likely be in my 30s by the time Infinite will be a functional game."
Me (in my 30s)- "Well shit.""
Halo being the cause of a mid-life crisis sounds like a good time to me.
As someone who wants the game to thrive, I feel like a management change is what the game deserves
The devs are giving all that we want, forge, maps, etc.
It's the higher ups that are unfortunately screwing them over
Nothing will change.
What a great video
Glad you enjoyed it
found actually helpful for people started from scratch
2:25 As a creator of Titanfall III fanon, I do care about Titanfall franchise and however, I'm not competent enough to make a compelling fanfic that Respawn couldn't
So your quote "care is not the same as competency" is true
I like this video more than any of the 343 Halo games
I liked the B roll of carrying a skull through off of sierra117
#Fire343 is not saying liquidate 343. Let them go to another project. It's only saying give Halo to another studio
There's a lot of conflicting opinions about it's use, however. Some people use it a little more leniently whereas others genuinely just want 343 to fall of the face of the Earth. For example, I've seen people use #Fire343 in regards to the management of the company. I've seen people like yourself use it to insinuate 343 moving onto other projects. It's hard to keep tabs on all the ways it's being used.
Enjoyed the video. Personally for me now the only thing I’ll actually come back to halo to play is the campaign. Other than the story I’m completely divorced from the game and don’t have any intention of coming back.
I’m not ready to take it from them yet. The MCC is in an amazing state right now. Personally they’ve got the end of 2023 to nail Halo infinite or I think it’s time. I think there are some really good people at 343. Look at the Forge Team. Joe Staten is in there fighting for Halo to remain a Halo game. What they need is to let Max Hoberman and Certain Affinity’s take the bulk of MP work. He knows how to make Halo fun.
Aside from the comment I just posted, This one is my general thing for Halo rn. My hope isn't very high. I will continue playing Halo MCC but I have barely a slimmer of hope which isn't really holding well.
I see absolutely every one of these videos saying yeah 343 is full of passionate people who love Halo and want the best for it but it’s common knowledge at this point that they hired people who hated or felt indifferent words Halo, when making Halo 4.
Good video
More disappointment, more lies, more false hope, and more incompetence. That’s what’s the future for 343 and halo. Microsoft simply doesn’t care enough about halo to step in and fix 343 and 343 thinks they are always in the right. Halo will keep declining until Microsoft pulls the plug and makes cod the new mascot. Halo only exists to make Microsoft a quick buck now and it’s been doing that pretty good despite the bad quality
Unfortunately this is true.
Let's not forget btb was broken for a literal month. I would want a restructure and then another company also working on halo. 343i can have the overall day so but having another company to put out other spin offs I feel would take pressure off the team.
In Certain Affinity we trust
That guy with glasses 😠
If I remember correctly, Microsoft was pushing to launch Halo Infinite in 2020 but 343 managed to get a delay for the game. Not 100% sure on this though, it
it's just something I heard around the time so I'm not sure if it's true or not. I just think that not every ounce of blame should be placed on 343. Microsoft seems to also be part of the issue here too. Well worded video though, and I completely understand all of your points.
Rumour has it that it was something that Jo Staten initially pushed for. He was brought in as Infinite's creative lead a little before Chris Lee announced that he was leaving the studio. There's no way that 343 could've pushed for another year long delay, so you're probably right. MS probably wanted to take advantage of Halo's 20th anniversary in 2021 as well.
Halo 3 released three years after Halo 2 with at least triple the amount of content and replayability than Infinite and on inferior hardware no less. Halo Infinite was initially scheduled to launch five whole years after Halo 5, and even with an additional year of development time on top of that, they still couldn’t launch a working content complete game. I don’t want to absolve Microsoft of any responsibility, but 343 definitely shares at least part, if not most of the blame. The only blame I put on Microsoft is not having canned 343 after MMC and Halo 5.
It was bad management. Lack of direction and a lot of pre production where ideas get tossed around but a vision not yet cemented. So the work done during that time rarely makes its way to the finished product.
I'm too tired to care anymore.
Everytime 343 makes a release of a main line HALO game, it just continues to degrade.
1. Halo 4 with its lagcluster gameplay and sudden esthetic changes.
2. MCC's absolute abhorrent release state, with multiplayer and campain being broken for months.
3.Halo 5's campain being a incoherent mess of a story and multiplayer missing staple content at release.
4.Halo Infinite's missing staple multiplayer content if not being unstable, and charging $60 for just campain w/ no splits screen co op or a way to replay specific story missions.
And these are just the tip of the ice berg, never mind their sleazy monetary practices and straight up lies to the halo community.
While they have done some good like MCC and Halo 5 multiplayer content being added and stabilized. I believe 343's mistakes and broken promises just out weigh the good.
My uncle introduce me to halo when I was 10 years of age with HALO 3 on split screen co op while eating pizza and playing all night long, greatest memories of my life. I wanted to do the same for my nephew with HALO INFINITE. But 343 made sure that won't happen.
343 has had too many chances from me as far as I am concerned. I will no longer hold hope nor support 343's stewardship of the HALO franchise...with their lies, business practices, and broken promises.
I'm just too tired.
Yeah, me too man. I'm struggling to find the good in this situation. I'm tired of waiting for Infinite to be a good game, especially after years of hype. But I'm still cautiously looking forward to the future.
12:25 holy shit ive never seen you get aggressive damn. I feel you though
Context
For anyone who doesn't know about my comments, before reading this, I want to say that anything I don't talk about from the video, I either have nothing to comment about or I agree with the statement, so yes, I can accept criticism toward 343 as long as it is isn't _343 bad_ or similar
Halo is Down Bad
0:01 - quite contrary, when you're at rock bottom, you can only go up, even if that going up takes a very long time, or you can stay exactly where you are, which doesn't seem to be the case, even if it doesn't seem to be that way
A Disclaimer
2:25 - This a point that you sort of cover later on with technical debt, though I will link a source explaining that relation at the end of the comment
The Worst Case Scenario
Not really any time stamps here, but I consider _nothing_ to be the most likely option going forward. Alternatively, I think the firing of 343 would actually be the worst case scenario purely due to how much of a learning curve halo is, both for making the game and understanding its community. That's alongside even more community division
Restructure 343
5:20 - I believe that purely to be because Joe Staten is viewed as the Gabe Newell of halo (if you understand what I mean by that). While I think it would be best to see other employees come forward and discuss things, the community just doesn't seem to want anyone else presenting halo topics, at all
Start Fresh
No time stamps once again here (except a few here and there), but on this, I'd argue that due to some of the points you discussed such as at 7:07 and 10:06 kind of show that this is 343's last real attempt. Unfortunately, 343 has to go big or go home on this one, because their reputation with a lot of the community is (justifiably) tarnished. In relation to stuff like how long it takes to do stuff, such as squish bugs, push content out the door, the link at the bottom of my comment should help with that if you'd like some further reading (or listening in this instance)
#Fire343
I kinda went into a tangent in my _The Worst Case Scenario_ section, but it's the same notes here
12:25 - They did learn their lessons, just not in the right way. I can't say they didn't take on feedback from previous games, such as the art style and gameplay (you know, actually settling the sprint debate). What they didn't learn from halo 5 was getting MP content out the door at the very start. The lack of infection is probably one of the biggest mistakes you could make currently, considering how much you can do with it.
In short, 343 learnt from their mistakes, they just didn't learn from enough of their mistakes
We Need Change
13:57 - And thank goodness 343 hadn't gone through with this
16:07 - I came for the infinite content, and I'll stay for the everything content (of course, I still wanna see those evolution videos that you started a small while ago, I quite enjoyed them)
Sources:
1- ua-cam.com/video/iPyv3s7bqZE/v-deo.html
Edit: some gramatical changes and fixing some placeholder time stamps
Well, recent events have very much surprised me. We got the change that many people wanted. So, I'll just throw half my comment out (not really, but yeah, half my comment was me saying how nothing would change, so yeah)
I am guessing that the Slipspace engine was not easy to work with compared to the original engine used that has been optimized until it was too old to continue with. Also, contracting a pile of employees and COVID separation did not help either. Halo 5s firefight mode was and is awesome.
With Bonnie out of the picture I sincerely hope there will be a top to bottom reevaluation of what everyone there has achieved to figure out who should stay and who needs to go. I think anyone who has contributed positively should stay, and then they should rebrand and leave the 343 name in the dirt where it belongs. They named themselves after a manipulative villain character and they've only lived up to that name. It's time for a complete reboot of the studio.
Look up Chris Lee and what he did as the lead. It explains a lot of the development and why they can’t go public with it
I think the three big points is fire upper management, abandon the live service model and establish a new engine that allows easier content updating. You can keep 343 but the big points is what needs to be done if we're gonna go anywhere. Those 3 are Infinite's problems, and it cannot be fixed without addressing all 3. The...three for three points. :P
The problem is that 343i was a corporativism creation aimed to milk a single IP, I always felt a bad idea from the start because you can see many games that switched developers without quality reason suffered under new management to event get at the toes of previous titles (Ex: Crash, Spyro, Silent Hill on PS360, even Gears in a lesser case). The higher ups focused entirely on copy what is trending rather than understand Halo is the trendsetter, you can notice by their acts is that they try to do everything to make the IP as a multi media billion dollar franchise and fails. And when the higher ups at the parent company ask you to delay the game because shipping both modes separately was an awful idea, you get yourself into the lowest of the low in the industry since they would almost always force for the opposite.
BONNIE ROSS IS OUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUTTT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Methinks 343 has a great opportunity with Infinite. The core gameplay is there, the design and aesthetics are there, the foundation for expansions in the form of story, open world etc is there. They just gotta buckle down and start feeding the rightfully rabid fan base.
Edit: it's been pointed out that 343 betrayed Chief. Maybe after firing the prophets and restructuring the company, they should change the name of their studio to something/one more friendly towards the Chief.
fr man that's what's so frustrating, is that infinite should be a good game but either 343 or Microsofts mismanagement has made it just not up to snuff, they had six years, and then another year. from my years of gaming and my some what limited knowledge of gaming companies and development any other company would have made infinite an absolutely stellar game
@@fulcrum7455
It would have been nice if they were just up front with everyone before releasing the game. "It's unfinished, we have a lot of work to do, this is our plan, live service, free expansions, this is why we're doing this, this is why we're not doing that" etc.
Everyone would have been incredibly understanding. A little communication, honesty and transparency goes a long way in building a trusting relationship with anyone. From friends, to clients, customers and consumers.
Honestly bro I don’t gaf about Halo, but this last week of news has had me really invested and from an outside perspective I think it is time for them to no longer touch Halo. This is actually sad to watch and see a game I used to get into fight about being worse than cod is actually just dog water now. Not at all able to compete with todays standards under 343. This has been a constant problem for 10+ years now and it’s ridiculous you site that people will lose there job as grounds to not fire them. If management at a restaurant doesn’t care and let’s rats live in the restaurant ofc the waiter will lose his job because of incompetence from the higher ups. If you build a weak base to begin with such as 343 you literally can’t put any weight or growth upon such a faulty bade.
Everyone I’ve seen lending a little credit to 343 about “The Yappening” has stated “at least it’s fun!” My brother in Christ this is literally an Easter themed battle pass releasing in fucking autumn.
Where is the cool, witty grunt cosmetics? Like a coating resembling a CE grunt? Aviator helmet getting a grunt mask attachment? All of this shit we got is just recycled spring gear. I can’t believe this.
Man, just imagine if Halo 11 years back was left to a company of passionate nerds that actually loved and cared for the franchise. Imagine how amazing it would have been by this time. Microsoft could have made so much more money if they actually cared, but nope, they squandered it of course.
@Laper Larden. You said that the scorched earth, fire everybody is not the way to go, but in this entire vid, you literally proved that scorched earth IS the way to go. Seriously, all the the failures over all of these years...
as soon as you all stop playing we get the change we need and want
I honestly don't think they care as a whole, They care about how big the brand is and how much money they can make off the fans while 343i ignores them and insults them for criticizing their choices and directions of development. If they cared about Halo as a franchise and were passionate about making Halo games they would listen to what the fans want not create a game completely for a different audience or in their words a "broader audience" They're simply not making Halo games for the long time fans anymore but for a group of people that simply don't exist but they time after time try to target. I just really don't understand why they can't listen to fans and and take their ideas and make it into a reality. Instead for some reason they're so egotistical they refuse to take any advice from anyone apart from themselves. In the end they're making Halo in their vision and no one else's and that is why it will continue to fail.
It's been 10yrs and nothing has changed, if they haven't done anything by now they never will
I would like to see any response to be honest
Having done a fair bit research on this, ironically part of the problem seems to be massive rate of turnover in all departments. Have a look as far back as Halo 4, it wasn't just devs being replaced. Directors and producers were being replaced, that has to affect your creative and business aspects badly. So yeah unfortunately anyone who's still at the company might be the problem, which sucks because at least with Frank you know he genuinely lives and loves Halo, wouldn't be so sure about Bonnie and Kiki but we'll see with the new guy in charge where things go
Microsoft reqlly needs to get their head out of their ass and fire some people at 343. They stand to lose a lot more in the long run if they keep doing nothing.
I really don't know...what the heck 343 is gonna do. I feel like at this point no matter what they do or say it's not going to be enough. With cosmicly bad they messed this all up they either ignore all the backlash and just "try" to keep working on their "roadmap." Or cave in like a stressed teenager and breakdown in the form of them finishing up season 2 and 3. Releasing forge and just saying fuck it were done and abandon Halo Infinite. I would not be surprised if Halo Infinite stops getting support by them after season 4s release. Genuinely
A failure of this magnitude means heads roll and that is the leadership. A new studio is created and is given the IP to develop. Technical employees don't get put under the bus, they get re-hired. As a fan I want a studio that isn't named after an AI that thinks it owns an installation of the name sake but tried to kill John 117. This was a studio that hated the core of what Halo was about - not the installation but the John 117 and the Spartans. They destroyed the core of Halo - the forerunners, cortana, covenant, and didn't know what made Halo great for the players and fans. As a fan I want a studio named after the Spartans like Spartans Industries, that gets what made Halo great and unique for the players and fans. Clearly some of the people that worked there got it but the leadership and those responsible for very horrible decisions didn't.
By moving 343 to a project like gears or heck even mario, it could destroy that franchise in one day, seeing the disgust 343 has gained
Bonnie is gone!
The problem that Halo has right now is that 343 would have to completely knuckle down like Bungie did after they finally cut ties from Activision, and just dedicate all their resources to making the game work. They might be able to make a few updates along the way, but the majority of work would need to be on hammering out the issues that plague Infinite. Once that was finally done, they'd be able to properly maintain it. But from what I understand about the engine, it's kinda like D1's engine which takes way too much effort to effect good change. They would HAVE to jump ship and try again, but with a better engine. But that could then lead to where Bungie was prior to its acquisition by Sony, where they can't do much more than keep funneling more content into a slowly aging system with very little variety.
I don't know if 343 has it in them to do that. With their track record (and their seeming desperation to distance themselves from the Bungie era of Halo), I just don't know what they could or would do. All I see is more hurt for the franchise until something breaks.