Watch the full episode here: ua-cam.com/video/XZ2xjnXYfm8/v-deo.html To see the entire series go to: ua-cam.com/play/PLUaRlPOu98p0clsG0U0jGoU91tl5q3-sK.html
The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing well-being and creating disaster; I am the Lord who does all these things. Isaiah 45:7 If a trumpet is blown in a city, will the people not tremble? If a disaster occurs in a city, has the Lord not brought it about? Amos 3:6 Is it not from the mouth of the Most High That both adversity and good proceed? Lamentations 3:38
I love these verses but they do need to be understood in the context of who he is, because lamentations 3:3 says For He does not afflict willingly, Nor grieve the children of men And the verse that was quoted in the video, God is not willing that any should perish. So it’s Gods justice that has to bring about disaster when people walk outside of his will, but it’s also that he created us with power to invite that disaster with disobedience as well as invite peace and safety from fear of evil in the fear of the lord proverbs 1:33 So it’s not just, God is in control it’s all him, it’s he made us so that we could have what we say the way Jesus said, and the people that choose cursing get cursing. I put before you life and death blessing and cursing, choose life.Deuteronomy 30:19 Look at Paul the apostle who hands over someone to the devil for the destruction of the flesh that the spirit might be saved in 1 Corinthians 5:5 it’s the same with God, he says here I put a choice before you if you disobey justice with be the equal and opposite reaction, if you obey justice will be the opposite reaction which would be a reward. But He is so merciful that he takes responsibility for creating evil and gives us a way of taking our justice on himself. so good. That’s how he is in control, his way is always superior and nothing has leverage on him ever so he can do whatever he wants but what he does is always Good and he has given us a level of authority and sovereignty by following and being one with his way
Yes disasters of Nature. Of course He is 100% in control of the the natural which includes everything but humans' decisions. Its how He designed it for his pleasure. He chooses to not control or know our choices every time. He likes to be surprised and it delights him when we choose Him.
@@jonathanchaney5896 God is always good and always has our back. Middle Knowledge? Don't complicate it. After 65 years I have learned God is no slow leak. He wants relationship. He's not interested in our religious mumbo jumbo. He just tolerates it.
@@jonathanchaney5896 If God knew for example that I would become horribly disabled, my wife would run off with her girlfriend, my daughter would become a hooker and my son would die of an overdose, if He knew this would absolutely happen and He still allowed me to be born, frankly I have no use for a god like that. But if in what He chooses to know beforehand what can happen and set a provision to rescue me, that God is watching over me. The word says He declares the end from the beginning. He declares His desired end, how we get there and if we get there is our choice. My belief is He chooses not to know what we will do but knows what we can do and makes provision to rescue us. It answers that question, If God is loving and knows all things, then why does He allow... You fill in the blank. If He knew my Daddy was absolutely going to rape me that why didn't He get me out of harms way, I and the rest of the world have a problem with that narrative. As Jesus laid down His divinity, the Father laid down the knowledge of what we would do and made provision for every crazy twist and turn we could possibly make. That is extreme attention to detail. That's the One I serve.
@@mikedavis1069 you want to argue that the God of the universe “lays down His knowledge”? In other words, there are things an omniscient God doesn’t know, which is open theism? With the examples you give, have you read Job and Joseph? In both cases, we have the testimony of Scripture of God allowing evil for His purposes. You quote Isaiah 46. Look at the following verses: “declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, ‘My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose,’ calling a bird of prey from the east, the man of my counsel from a far country. I have spoken, and I will bring it to pass; I have purposed, and I will do it.” - Isaiah 46:10-11 ESV God speaks, God brings it to pass, He purposes, and He does it. He doesn’t leave options up to us and then He is hands off. No, as one pastor said: He makes the plan a s then makes the plan happen. It is much different than what you propose. Here’s the bottom line: if you want to protect human choice above all, you will as a result limit God’s power every time. It becomes man-centered rather than God-centered.
God is sovereign, I rather live in a world knowing God is ultimately in control whether He's indirect of what's going on or not, then live in a world where God doesn't have the power too stop things from happening ,we have a perfect God that can stop anything He wants at anytime, pain and suffering even if it's not directly from God has purpose, remember God didn't create sin,but sin sure has a huge impact on this world ,even not sin, some people hurting naturally and God sovereignty chooses not too heal cause like Paul or Job it's for there greater good in "future"but God didn't create sin but created Satan, everything comes around for God's Glory at the end of the day,God use sacrifice the highest thing God used human death for his Glory, there is no pain,no sickness, no death in heaven, we are living in a fallen world,pray for righteous discernment,God Bless ✝️🙏
“If there is one single molecule in this universe running around loose, totally free of God’s sovereignty, then we have no guarantee that a single promise of God will ever be fulfilled.” R.C. Sproul
@@brandonmalone5758 Nothing is totally free of God's control. But he allows the freedom. He chooses a hands off approach when he pleases knowing He will end it all and bring his Kingdom here. Alpha yes. Omega soon.
I love I find it Interesting that he has a Bible sitting on the table & doesn't even open it to back up what he's saying, He really does need to read what scripture actually teaches about the sovereignty of God.
God is so sovereign He decided He is in control of what He wants to be and not in control of what He doesn’t want to be. He is not in control of your soul unless He then wants to be (He hardened Pharaoh’s heart, Saul afflicted by a spirit from God, Satan enters Judas and Jesus tells him go and do what you are about to do, do quickly). Heard that today. Thought it helpful. Wanted to share, thought you might enjoy and be intrigued. Just adds Words to perhaps what I am trying to believe and understand as I journey this Christ like life out. Come Holy Spirit, by our faith in Jesus Christ, more wisdom, more revelation/knowledge, more understanding, more of your counsel, more of your power (authority)/might. May we delight in the Fear of the Lord as King Jesus demonstrates and may the Spirit of the Lord rest upon us willing souls. In us and through us LORD do a mighty demonstration (work) of your power. Glory to God, Father, Son, Holy Ghost. Amen.
It would be more correct to say that God is in control but is not controlling in the sense of being personally domineering and manipulative towards us.
A couple of thoughts on the subject and God's will. Psalm 8 shows the dominion of humanity over God's creation. Also concerning God's will, i.e. that all be saved, I think we err if we limit the opportunity for repentance (changing our thinking) to this temporal life alone. When we enter into eternity (immortality), we can see, hear and perceive more clearly and can make much more informed decisions than we can in this temporal environment. To me, that is not only good news, it is great news. After all, at some point in time, every knee will bow and every tongue confess.
That would be universalism. Entirely not supported by the Bible. There are real consequences to unbelief in this life. And all the consequences are described as eternal. Like the judgment of the sheep and the goats. The unbelievers are sent to Everlasting fire.
@@zacharybaker695 a misunderstanding of the word aion, which is an age or period of time. Certainly there are consequences to our belief and behavior but scripture teaches and the early church believed that ultimately all will be reconciled. Spiritual reality will become natural reality. All died with Christ, all were raised with Christ. Every knee will bow and every tongue will confess Jesus as Lord to the glory of the Father. It is a done deal that will be worked out throughout the current age and the ages to come. God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself. Jesus came to seek and to save that which was lost. He succeeded in Him mission. We have been bought with a price, we don't get a vote in the matter and God will work out the details in ages to come. That is the GOOD NEWS.
@@bradharford6052 All who are in Christ have died with Him and are raised with Him. Not all the world. If all are reconciled to Christ eventually in eternity then our calls to live a life of holiness, faith and service to God are meaningless. The root word Aion is used often to describe Gods eternal Glory(Philipians 4:20), His Throne(Hebrews 1:8), and His existence (Revelation 1:6, 1 Peter 1:23). Are we then to infer that all those things are not eternal? Will God come to an end? Will His Glory? His Throne? Roots of that word are also used to describe our eternal life in Christ. Will that Eternal life come to an end? If we interpret the word the way you describe it undermines our entire Theology and understanding of God. The fact is that lexicons acknowledge that Greek and Hebrew cultures both had a belief in an endless afterlife and used terms based on aion and olam to refer to it. He saves the lost that come to Him in faith. That is why no one comes to the Father except through Jesus. And we come to Jesus how? What instructions are given in scripture to fulfill the very narrow requirements for salvation aka eternal life? Belief in Jesus and obedience to His commandments. All things that we must do in this life, not the next. John 3:36 Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him. The Holy Bible: English Standard Version. (2016). (Jn 3:36). Wheaton, IL: Crossway Bibles. Not see life. Not, he will see it eventually. He will not see it. Ever. The wrath of God remains on Him. If we sin, which we all do, we are trespassing against a Eternal, Everlasting God. Therefore our sins are eternally grievous to Him and require eternal punishment if not atoned for. Jesus does atone for our sins, IF we accept his sacrifice and obey his commands. I would challenge you to find scriptural support for your ideas. The common reading and understanding of scripture is that there are eternal consequences to our obedience or rebellion. The one who conquers will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father and before his angels The Holy Bible: English Standard Version. (2016). (Re 3:5). Wheaton, IL: Crossway Bibles. Some names are blotted out. Meaning no life is given to them. If anyone worships the beast and its image and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10 he also will drink the wine of God’s wrath, poured full strength into the cup of his anger, and he will be tormented with fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. 11 And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.” The Holy Bible: English Standard Version. (2016). (Re 14:9-11). Wheaton, IL: Crossway Bibles. No rest, torment forever and ever. There are verses like these aplenty. Prayerfully reconsider your idea of universalism and seek the Holy Spirit. I will do likewise. Peace
@@zacharybaker695 I have been set free from that kind of theology and have entered into God's rest. I don't argue or debate about it, but am open to help those who are coming out of bondage and darkness into the light. Your Father is so much more loving and merciful and patient and I hope you see that some day. All of scripture in its totality and in context with itself points to a God who will all His creation to be saved and is well able to see His will accomplished. Humans tend to want to think they have earned something from God or met some criteria to be accepted. God chose us, we didn't choose Him. And when He says ALL died and ALL rose, all means all. We were bought with a price and we are not our own. As His children and His bought and paid for property His will overrides ours when it comes to our destiny. He did (past tense) reconcile the world (cosmos) to Himself. Done, finished. Our part is to receive in earth what has already been done in heaven. You can choose to deny Christ before men but He will deny your denial. One last comment, scripture doesn't teach that repentance stops at physical death. God's mercy and His demonstration of His grace, goes on forever. Choose life, be free.
@@zacharybaker695 oh, one other observation, everyone and everything is in Christ because not only in Him do we live and move and have our being, but in Him, all things consist. Nothing can exist outside of Christ.
Love these guys! Great teaching. Thought provoking. Prepared to explain himself, with humility, humour, using scripture and he lives the life, walks the walk.
“The lot is cast into the lap, But its every decision is from the Lord.” Proverbs 16:33 NKJV A seemingly “random” thing is DETERMINED by God. Bill needs to consider God’s will of command vs his will of decree. This is shown perfectly on the cross. Was the cross a result of the sin of people hating Jesus and rejecting Him as Messiah? Yes. Does God hate sin? Yes. So in one sense the cross was not Gods will (of command). But was it Gods will for Jesus to die on the cross. Yes. Did God ordain it before the foundation of the world. Yes. It was His will (of decree)
What pastor Bill is missing is the judgement of God. He says disasters are out of his control, but yet he is the one who sends disaster throughout the whole Bible.
Where in bible Jesus brought disaster or sickness to sinful people ?? Something has changed after the cross. God will Judge sinner but he is not the reason we have disaster in this world
@@SandeepsinghSandy893 It's crazy how God gets blamed for what the devil does, and the devil gets credit for what God does. If that's not by design, I don't know what is.
@@SandeepsinghSandy893 that makes sense. God brought the flood and destroyed sodom for judgement of sin. Jesus came to satisfy that judgment for this time of grace until The Day of judgment. Am I believing right?
@@takingupmycross9869 are you sure about that? Look at Job 1, Satan has to get permission to attack Job. Look at the unclean spirits that came in contact with Jesus. He commanded them and they obey. Satan has to get permission to do whatever he does. If Satan can do things outside of God’s control, then Satan is equal to or greater than God. Unless God has a plan for everything that happens, even the evil…
I don’t agree with the view of God’s sovereignty here, you say he is in charge but not in control….. essentially you strip God of his ability and power to govern the world. Yet, you contradict, where you acknowledge that one cannot do anything without grace….. he is either omnipotent or not…..rather doesn’t man unwittingly serve God to fulfil his plans…..
The worrisome and grievous problem with Bill Johnsons statement regarding his struggling with God's sovereignty is his stating "this is the plan of God to devise wickedness so that His glory can be seen’. For me this is absolute nonsense.” This reveals a distorted and unbiblical view of what it means to see God as the one who is, indeed, over all decisions, actions, courses, consequences, and events; that he "divises wickedness". I know that Bill thinks through everything he says, so it is concerning to me that THAT would trip him up in his understanding since God does not divise wickedness. "GOD cannot be tempted by evil". Unfortunately, Bill uses an unbiblical foundation to formulate a view about God which is why he struggles through seeking to understand God's pursuit of glory in the midst of His permitting evil.
How dare one say they worship a Holy God and then dumb down His holiness at the same time! blasphemy! Read a Bible other than your own heretical translation!
Complete disregard for most of God’s interaction with humanity in the OT. God did set up evil kings and destroy Israel and many nations through those kings as well as famines and calamities. So, is this theology specific to post resurrection only? Obviously some things did shift but I can’t reconcile this theology with OT reality.
Watch the full episode here: ua-cam.com/video/XZ2xjnXYfm8/v-deo.html
To see the entire series go to: ua-cam.com/play/PLUaRlPOu98p0clsG0U0jGoU91tl5q3-sK.html
The One forming light and creating darkness,
Causing well-being and creating disaster;
I am the Lord who does all these things.
Isaiah 45:7
If a trumpet is blown in a city, will the people not tremble?
If a disaster occurs in a city, has the Lord not brought it about?
Amos 3:6
Is it not from the mouth of the Most High
That both adversity and good proceed?
Lamentations 3:38
Yup. Those who seek to protect human freedom will ultimately diminish God’s sovereignty every time.
I love these verses but they do need to be understood in the context of who he is, because lamentations 3:3 says For He does not afflict willingly, Nor grieve the children of men
And the verse that was quoted in the video, God is not willing that any should perish. So it’s Gods justice that has to bring about disaster when people walk outside of his will, but it’s also that he created us with power to invite that disaster with disobedience as well as invite peace and safety from fear of evil in the fear of the lord proverbs 1:33
So it’s not just, God is in control it’s all him, it’s he made us so that we could have what we say the way Jesus said, and the people that choose cursing get cursing. I put before you life and death blessing and cursing, choose life.Deuteronomy 30:19
Look at Paul the apostle who hands over someone to the devil for the destruction of the flesh that the spirit might be saved in 1 Corinthians 5:5 it’s the same with God, he says here I put a choice before you if you disobey justice with be the equal and opposite reaction, if you obey justice will be the opposite reaction which would be a reward. But He is so merciful that he takes responsibility for creating evil and gives us a way of taking our justice on himself. so good. That’s how he is in control, his way is always superior and nothing has leverage on him ever so he can do whatever he wants but what he does is always Good and he has given us a level of authority and sovereignty by following and being one with his way
Yes disasters of Nature. Of course He is 100% in control of the the natural which includes everything but humans' decisions. Its how He designed it for his pleasure. He chooses to not control or know our choices every time. He likes to be surprised and it delights him when we choose Him.
Because God is sovereign He knows every twist and turn our lives can take and He has set in place a provision for every choice we can make.
Middle Knowledge, eh?
@@jonathanchaney5896 God is always good and always has our back. Middle Knowledge? Don't complicate it. After 65 years I have learned God is no slow leak. He wants relationship. He's not interested in our religious mumbo jumbo. He just tolerates it.
@@mikedavis1069 so it’s not about His decree, just thousands of forking roads? Does He know the choices we’ll make?
@@jonathanchaney5896 If God knew for example that I would become horribly disabled, my wife would run off with her girlfriend, my daughter would become a hooker and my son would die of an overdose, if He knew this would absolutely happen and He still allowed me to be born, frankly I have no use for a god like that. But if in what He chooses to know beforehand what can happen and set a provision to rescue me, that God is watching over me. The word says He declares the end from the beginning. He declares His desired end, how we get there and if we get there is our choice.
My belief is He chooses not to know what we will do but knows what we can do and makes provision to rescue us. It answers that question, If God is loving and knows all things, then why does He allow... You fill in the blank. If He knew my Daddy was absolutely going to rape me that why didn't He get me out of harms way, I and the rest of the world have a problem with that narrative. As Jesus laid down His divinity, the Father laid down the knowledge of what we would do and made provision for every crazy twist and turn we could possibly make. That is extreme attention to detail. That's the One I serve.
@@mikedavis1069 you want to argue that the God of the universe “lays down His knowledge”? In other words, there are things an omniscient God doesn’t know, which is open theism? With the examples you give, have you read Job and Joseph? In both cases, we have the testimony of Scripture of God allowing evil for His purposes. You quote Isaiah 46. Look at the following verses:
“declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, ‘My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose,’ calling a bird of prey from the east, the man of my counsel from a far country. I have spoken, and I will bring it to pass; I have purposed, and I will do it.” - Isaiah 46:10-11 ESV
God speaks, God brings it to pass, He purposes, and He does it. He doesn’t leave options up to us and then He is hands off. No, as one pastor said: He makes the plan a s then makes the plan happen. It is much different than what you propose.
Here’s the bottom line: if you want to protect human choice above all, you will as a result limit God’s power every time. It becomes man-centered rather than God-centered.
So much glory.
Glory!
If there are things outside of God’s control, then He’s not sovereign. Simple as that. You can’t have it both ways.
Love this
I love Pastor Bill's perspective about the sovereignty of God. It's so scripturally balanced.
Is it though? If it is can’t you explain it scripturally as you say? He’s not as clear as he thinks he is.
Which scripture are you talking about?
I agree with Ps. Johnson, and I hope I find a local Church like his.
The dices are cast, but the numbers are determined by the Lord.
God is sovereign, I rather live in a world knowing God is ultimately in control whether He's indirect of what's going on or not, then live in a world where God doesn't have the power too stop things from happening ,we have a perfect God that can stop anything He wants at anytime, pain and suffering even if it's not directly from God has purpose, remember God didn't create sin,but sin sure has a huge impact on this world ,even not sin, some people hurting naturally and God sovereignty chooses not too heal cause like Paul or Job it's for there greater good in "future"but God didn't create sin but created Satan, everything comes around for God's Glory at the end of the day,God use sacrifice the highest thing God used human death for his Glory, there is no pain,no sickness, no death in heaven, we are living in a fallen world,pray for righteous discernment,God Bless ✝️🙏
“If there is one single molecule in this universe running around loose, totally free of God’s sovereignty, then we have no guarantee that a single promise of God will ever be fulfilled.”
R.C. Sproul
@@brandonmalone5758 Nothing is totally free of God's control. But he allows the freedom. He chooses a hands off approach when he pleases knowing He will end it all and bring his Kingdom here. Alpha yes. Omega soon.
Surly the interplay of God’s will and man’s will is mysterious, but it’s certain, they are NOT equal
I love
I find it Interesting that he has a Bible sitting on the table & doesn't even open it to back up what he's saying, He really does need to read what scripture actually teaches about the sovereignty of God.
God is so sovereign He decided He is in control of what He wants to be and not in control of what He doesn’t want to be.
He is not in control of your soul unless He then wants to be (He hardened Pharaoh’s heart, Saul afflicted by a spirit from God, Satan enters Judas and Jesus tells him go and do what you are about to do, do quickly).
Heard that today. Thought it helpful. Wanted to share, thought you might enjoy and be intrigued.
Just adds Words to perhaps what I am trying to believe and understand as I journey this Christ like life out.
Come Holy Spirit, by our faith in Jesus Christ, more wisdom, more revelation/knowledge, more understanding, more of your counsel, more of your power (authority)/might. May we delight in the Fear of the Lord as King Jesus demonstrates and may the Spirit of the Lord rest upon us willing souls.
In us and through us LORD do a mighty demonstration (work) of your power.
Glory to God, Father, Son, Holy Ghost.
Amen.
More... It embodies the true nature of Papa. ❤️😃
A God who is in charge but not in control? Is that the God we find in scripture, really?
Wonderful understanding 😊 thank you bethel and Pastor bill
Bill Johnson: God’s sovereign and also no.
Haha. I just laughed so loud at that.
Bill Johnson should stop preaching.
Love this series!! Thankful in Ohio! Abundant blessings
Glad you enjoy it!
Matthew 28:19. BJ is a general of the faith. John 15:5. Abide In Him ❣️ Yeshua Hamashiach
Good on ya Bill, spot on!
It would be more correct to say that God is in control but is not controlling in the sense of being personally domineering and manipulative towards us.
Good food for thought.
Also... all totally means all.
A couple of thoughts on the subject and God's will. Psalm 8 shows the dominion of humanity over God's creation. Also concerning God's will, i.e. that all be saved, I think we err if we limit the opportunity for repentance (changing our thinking) to this temporal life alone. When we enter into eternity (immortality), we can see, hear and perceive more clearly and can make much more informed decisions than we can in this temporal environment. To me, that is not only good news, it is great news. After all, at some point in time, every knee will bow and every tongue confess.
That would be universalism. Entirely not supported by the Bible. There are real consequences to unbelief in this life. And all the consequences are described as eternal. Like the judgment of the sheep and the goats. The unbelievers are sent to Everlasting fire.
@@zacharybaker695 a misunderstanding of the word aion, which is an age or period of time. Certainly there are consequences to our belief and behavior but scripture teaches and the early church believed that ultimately all will be reconciled. Spiritual reality will become natural reality. All died with Christ, all were raised with Christ. Every knee will bow and every tongue will confess Jesus as Lord to the glory of the Father. It is a done deal that will be worked out throughout the current age and the ages to come. God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself. Jesus came to seek and to save that which was lost. He succeeded in Him mission. We have been bought with a price, we don't get a vote in the matter and God will work out the details in ages to come. That is the GOOD NEWS.
@@bradharford6052 All who are in Christ have died with Him and are raised with Him. Not all the world. If all are reconciled to Christ eventually in eternity then our calls to live a life of holiness, faith and service to God are meaningless.
The root word Aion is used often to describe Gods eternal Glory(Philipians 4:20), His Throne(Hebrews 1:8), and His existence (Revelation 1:6, 1 Peter 1:23). Are we then to infer that all those things are not eternal? Will God come to an end? Will His Glory? His Throne? Roots of that word are also used to describe our eternal life in Christ. Will that Eternal life come to an end? If we interpret the word the way you describe it undermines our entire Theology and understanding of God. The fact is that lexicons acknowledge that Greek and Hebrew cultures both had a belief in an endless afterlife and used terms based on aion and olam to refer to it.
He saves the lost that come to Him in faith. That is why no one comes to the Father except through Jesus. And we come to Jesus how? What instructions are given in scripture to fulfill the very narrow requirements for salvation aka eternal life? Belief in Jesus and obedience to His commandments. All things that we must do in this life, not the next.
John 3:36 Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.
The Holy Bible: English Standard Version. (2016). (Jn 3:36). Wheaton, IL: Crossway Bibles.
Not see life. Not, he will see it eventually. He will not see it. Ever. The wrath of God remains on Him. If we sin, which we all do, we are trespassing against a Eternal, Everlasting God. Therefore our sins are eternally grievous to Him and require eternal punishment if not atoned for. Jesus does atone for our sins, IF we accept his sacrifice and obey his commands. I would challenge you to find scriptural support for your ideas. The common reading and understanding of scripture is that there are eternal consequences to our obedience or rebellion.
The one who conquers will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father and before his angels
The Holy Bible: English Standard Version. (2016). (Re 3:5). Wheaton, IL: Crossway Bibles.
Some names are blotted out. Meaning no life is given to them.
If anyone worships the beast and its image and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10 he also will drink the wine of God’s wrath, poured full strength into the cup of his anger, and he will be tormented with fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. 11 And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.”
The Holy Bible: English Standard Version. (2016). (Re 14:9-11). Wheaton, IL: Crossway Bibles.
No rest, torment forever and ever. There are verses like these aplenty. Prayerfully reconsider your idea of universalism and seek the Holy Spirit. I will do likewise. Peace
@@zacharybaker695 I have been set free from that kind of theology and have entered into God's rest. I don't argue or debate about it, but am open to help those who are coming out of bondage and darkness into the light. Your Father is so much more loving and merciful and patient and I hope you see that some day. All of scripture in its totality and in context with itself points to a God who will all His creation to be saved and is well able to see His will accomplished. Humans tend to want to think they have earned something from God or met some criteria to be accepted. God chose us, we didn't choose Him. And when He says ALL died and ALL rose, all means all. We were bought with a price and we are not our own. As His children and His bought and paid for property His will overrides ours when it comes to our destiny. He did (past tense) reconcile the world (cosmos) to Himself. Done, finished. Our part is to receive in earth what has already been done in heaven. You can choose to deny Christ before men but He will deny your denial. One last comment, scripture doesn't teach that repentance stops at physical death. God's mercy and His demonstration of His grace, goes on forever. Choose life, be free.
@@zacharybaker695 oh, one other observation, everyone and everything is in Christ because not only in Him do we live and move and have our being, but in Him, all things consist. Nothing can exist outside of Christ.
Jacob he loved, Esau he hated.
@@mtlicq read romans to find out
Love these guys! Great teaching. Thought provoking. Prepared to explain himself, with humility, humour, using scripture and he lives the life, walks the walk.
1 Samuel 5:6…also Job
“The lot is cast into the lap, But its every decision is from the Lord.”
Proverbs 16:33 NKJV
A seemingly “random” thing is DETERMINED by God. Bill needs to consider God’s will of command vs his will of decree. This is shown perfectly on the cross. Was the cross a result of the sin of people hating Jesus and rejecting Him as Messiah? Yes. Does God hate sin? Yes. So in one sense the cross was not Gods will (of command). But was it Gods will for Jesus to die on the cross. Yes. Did God ordain it before the foundation of the world. Yes. It was His will (of decree)
Can you please break this down. Maybe it's my English that is lacking.
God will of command and will of decree?
What pastor Bill is missing is the judgement of God. He says disasters are out of his control, but yet he is the one who sends disaster throughout the whole Bible.
Where in bible Jesus brought disaster or sickness to sinful people ??
Something has changed after the cross.
God will Judge sinner but he is not the reason we have disaster in this world
@@SandeepsinghSandy893 It's crazy how God gets blamed for what the devil does, and the devil gets credit for what God does. If that's not by design, I don't know what is.
@@SandeepsinghSandy893 that makes sense. God brought the flood and destroyed sodom for judgement of sin. Jesus came to satisfy that judgment for this time of grace until The Day of judgment. Am I believing right?
@@takingupmycross9869 are you sure about that? Look at Job 1, Satan has to get permission to attack Job. Look at the unclean spirits that came in contact with Jesus. He commanded them and they obey. Satan has to get permission to do whatever he does. If Satan can do things outside of God’s control, then Satan is equal to or greater than God. Unless God has a plan for everything that happens, even the evil…
@@jonathanchaney5896 Not sure what your comment has to do with mine. Perhaps you posted it under the wrong one?
Doesn’t God have say so on the pottery, one for honourable use and the other for dishonourable?
I don’t agree with the view of God’s sovereignty here, you say he is in charge but not in control….. essentially you strip God of his ability and power to govern the world. Yet, you contradict, where you acknowledge that one cannot do anything without grace….. he is either omnipotent or not…..rather doesn’t man unwittingly serve God to fulfil his plans…..
The worrisome and grievous problem with Bill Johnsons statement regarding his struggling with God's sovereignty is his stating "this is the plan of God to devise wickedness so that His glory can be seen’. For me this is absolute nonsense.” This reveals a distorted and unbiblical view of what it means to see God as the one who is, indeed, over all decisions, actions, courses, consequences, and events; that he "divises wickedness". I know that Bill thinks through everything he says, so it is concerning to me that THAT would trip him up in his understanding since God does not divise wickedness. "GOD cannot be tempted by evil". Unfortunately, Bill uses an unbiblical foundation to formulate a view about God which is why he struggles through seeking to understand God's pursuit of glory in the midst of His permitting evil.
This is a point blank reason that Bethel is not a Biblical church, for something so fundamental to the Bible.
How dare one say they worship a Holy God and then dumb down His holiness at the same time! blasphemy! Read a Bible other than your own heretical translation!
Complete disregard for most of God’s interaction with humanity in the OT. God did set up evil kings and destroy Israel and many nations through those kings as well as famines and calamities. So, is this theology specific to post resurrection only? Obviously some things did shift but I can’t reconcile this theology with OT reality.