Sophie Okonedo stole every scene she was in, which is saying A LOT considering that she shared them with Rosamund Pike. They could not have cast a better Siuan
The story of the Ways is a pretty sad one. They were a gift from the male Aes Sedai to the Ogier. After the breaking, the male Aes Sedai who hadnt succumbed to madness yet sought shelter in Ogier steddings, hoping they could wait out the taint on the male half of the power. You cant channel or even sense the One Power in a stedding so they were very safe there. Eventually they all decided to leave, for to live without the power after having tasted it is no life at all. But they created to Ways to thank the Ogier for their hospitality. Ogier get sick if out of a stedding for too long (Explained in this week's origin video) so the Ways was a way for them to get from Stedding to Stedding in no time at all. Its why Moiraine asked for Loial's help, not only would he have a good idea where the Waygates are he would also have the knowledge to navigate them. The Ways are alive, in their own way, in the books the Waygates look like theyre made of vines and new ones can be "grown" using an artifact the Ogier have (It goes with the Ogier's strong affinity for nature, also explained in the origin video). Unfortunately that same semblance of life also made the Ways vulnerable to the taint, and theyve become dark and dangerous. Despite that, the Ogier care a lot about the Ways and there have been attempts to make them safe again. Though theyve all failed
Because you asked, “Pillow friends” was a term Robert Jordan used to describe lesbian relationships for Aes Sedai because publishers were hesitant to publish books with openly gay characters in the 1980s. In the books Moraine and Suian were “pillow friends” when they were younger, but had drifted apart since then by the time the books started.
The book where it's mentioned they are pillow friends was published in 2004. I still think you might be right about the publishers pushing it still, or maybe it was RJ being afraid of how the fans would take it.
@@Plexsusmax They mentioned pillow friends earlier in the books in passing, so I think at that point it was mainly just keeping it consistent. Jorden himself confirmed pillow friends = sexual partners.
@@davinitall I meant the first time they mentioned pillow friends in reference to Moiraine and Siuan. About RJ confirming it I haven't seen a source on it? I've heard people say that he never confirmed it and some that say he did. Do you have a link to it so I can settle this lol
@@davinitall no he did not, he explained that pillow freinds meant an intimate relationship that happens under isolation and stress like what happens in single sex schools primarily female. they are not lesbian as both go on to have male relationships, siuan with her warder before becoming amerrilyne or however you spell it lol it was rjs own misgivings about writing sex in general that is why he only hints and fades to grey about it in the books.
@@Plexsusmax he said in an interview that pillow freind did not mean lesbian it meant a temporary intimate relationship brought about by stress and isolation, like an all girls school. only reds don't take warders but most other Aes sedai do and they are usually intimate often married, siuan was married before becoming the amerrilyn.
as a book reader, I love how they introduced Siuan Sanche! It's 100% true to the book backstory of her. In her country, channeling is outlawed and seen as something to fear, something to hate. So she had to leave. and it's heartbreaking! They did a great job and Sophie is PERFECT for the role!! Also important to note that "Pillow Friends" is the in world name for Lesbian Lovers. It's far more than just bicurious college girls experimenting, which some fans try to claim. They're in training sometimes for two decades or more before they become full Sisters. Those relationships are real, they're intimate, and they can be long lasting. Moiraine and Siuan really love each other deeply. All the show did was put it on screen, where the author had all of it implied but off-page. In 1990's, it was still incredibly difficult to get publishers to print lgbt stories. So Robert Jordan used different words to mean the same thing, to get around the censors.
also, Robert Jordan wrote almost all sexual relationships to be off-page. not just lgbt ones. Romance was his weakest point as a writer, to be perfectly honest. Sex is implied but never shown. It's like the anti-GoT that way. Notice how in the show, places where they could have shown sex like Game of Thrones, they don't fully go there. They don't need sexposition to advance the plot like Game of Thrones did.
It's not what some fans try to claim. It's word for word in the Companion book that they're not actually lesbians. Some Aes Sedai are explicitly lesbians, notably Elaida and Galina, although lesbians may not want to claim those two.
@@Bacchian the bisexual erasure is strong with you. it's amazing how many people assume there are only two choices. Some Pillow Friends only love women. Some, like Siuan and Moiraine, find love with men later on. That doesn't mean their relationship was any less meaningful, intimate, or real. the idea that it's just college girls experimenting is ridiculous, considering how long they spend as novices and accepted. that's one heck of an experimental phase, don't ya think? Also, the Companion contradicts many things in the text of the story. they are imperfect collections of his some 100,000 pages of notes. Example: Bela and Tuon. If you have the companion and the books, you can look up the difference. If you want to read it as flippant as experimenting, that's fine. But it's far more than that. Also remember that in the early 90's, publishers still wouldn't print LGBT stories that weren't tragedies. So he used euphamisms and alluded to things rather than make them explicit. I'm really tired of whitecloak type fans who insist their cishet interpretation of the text is the only valid one.
@@TheDevler23 This is ridiculous. I'm literally reading from an official source that completely contradicts what you're saying. What you said is 100% made up. Don't tell me I'm hating on bisexual people because I'm gainsaying you; bi people aren't your human shields against criticism. You want to say it's you're interpretation that they were romantically in love; go ahead. Don't mislead people, though. New Spring -- the book where Moiraine and Siuan's backstory is explored -- was published in 2004, BTW, and the Companion was 2015. Cishet? I'm gay. Most of the people I've ever met who read these books were gay or women. And you're doing exactly what you're criticizing: your way is the only interpretation, no matter what the source material says. (Whitecloak??)
@@Bacchian i literally pointed out to you that the material you're citing is rife with contradictions to the actual text. it's a great resource. but it isn't a bible. but if you wanna fight on the internet, go do it with someone else.
That moment where Egwene thinks the Amyrlin is talking to her - well, that is pretty much who Egwene is. She thinks she's the best. With that said, she is presented pretty well depicted in the show. She was more know-it-all in the books. She is many readers' favorite character. And she is many readers' least favorite. I have heard several people say they hate her. She is so much more likable in the show. So I was surprised they showed this trait.
A lot of it is more like she wants to be the best, and not that she thinks that she already is. At least at first. Such people (myself included) do tend to fall into the trap of over-estimating themselves. She does often think that she knows best, but that is literally every other character too, lol.
I only like Egwene one time in the books. The rest of the time I don’t like her. I wouldn’t say hate thats too strong of the word. In the books there are some hypocrites she is the biggest of all. Also let’s say there is one things she does that is unforgivable in my eyes but they won’t put that in the show.
I recently read the series for the first time in the first half of this year. Egwene didn’t really come off as “know-it-all” to me till late in the series. There was one scene with her Rand and Gawyn in her pov where she was just like “yeah I already knew that” in her head where there’s no logical connection for her to come to that conclusion but that she just knows. Kinda just rolled my eyes at that.
I love watching you two and your reactions. I want to watch with you so badly. I love the series, it holds a very special place in my heart. It actually gave me the strength to come out to my close friends in highschool and every video game character I pick is always a woman and I name her Nynaeve lol. I love the series because even as a book reader I don't know what they are going to show next because a lot of the show has things that happen but it happens off the page and we aren't present in the action. The Ways were built by men and women using the one power after the male half was tainted. Ogier used the ways to travel to all the major villages to build buildings and tend the groves they planted outside the cities. The ways used to be lit and it was like a blue clear sky above, but eventually the taint on the male half of the source corrupted the ways and now they are dark and most people who go in don't come out again and the few that do come out are drained. Like a body without a soul. They are pretty much forbidden to be used now but their need to get to the Eye of the World outweighs the danger the ways pose. Moraine and Siuan are good For sure, that is why they hold their plans so closely and won't confide in anyone. Anyone could be a dark friend and even good people would kill the Dragon Reborn and think they were doing the world a favor. Right now, whoever the Dragon is, they are too weak to protect themselves from that many potential enemies that want to kill them. Hope this helps and look forward to reliving my first time through this story thru your reactions!❤️🍷
Oh my goodness, thank you for sharing your experience with us 💛 WoT has the BEST fans! We will be having a live Twitch Watch Party for the finale, so you can watch with us in some capacity 😊 Thank you again! -Tori :)
Gitara’s Prophecy: she prophecised in front of a young Moiraine & Siun Sanche that the Dragon was being reborn. She then dies, so only Moiraine & Siun know for a fact that the Dragon has in fact been reborn. This marks the beginning of their partnership in finding the Dragon.
I'm not going to say whether you're right or wrong about the Dragon, but I will say that for all the characters who aren't the Dragon, they still have their own arcs and journeys to go through that are worth following.
Siuan and Moiraine were definitely coded Bi in the books (especially the prequel) and "pillow friends" was definitely a more intimate relationship than some have interpreted (Jordan spoke about this IIRC). Their relationship in the book however was cut off because of their mission and the need for secrecy (and they didn't have those nifty little doors and the secret magic room for their rendezvous). This is a nice mechanism for the show to replace pages and pages of close friends' dialogue with something else that shows the depth of their bond.
Thank you for your comment! It must be so rewarding for you to note how pages and pages of story are translated to a new medium. I love that you describe the little doors as "nifty" lol. But seriously, they are. -Dr. S
You two are always fun to watch. I love the balance of your energy and your takes on each episode. 👍🏾 You both realized how fun the scene with Siuan, Nynaeve, Egwene, and Moiraine was supposed to be (so much power in that one room) unlike a couple other channels I’ve seen that keep telling Nynaeve to chill. Nynaeve has no reason to trust the Amyrlin Seat and wants to protect her people from agendas they might have. I love that she is cautious with the Aes Sedai.
Love getting your perspectives as fans who haven't read the books. Please keep up the good work. And understand as interesting as it was to those watching the show, the fact that Matt got left behind has just blown the collective mind of all of us book readers.
The structure/ portal is called a Waygate. It is an entrance into the Ways, which is like a seperate world. There are Waygates throughout the Earth and the Ways but they are much closer together in the Ways than they are on Earth. So a journey between 2 Waygates might take 1 month on Earth, but only a couple days through the Ways. Hope that helps clarify things.
I love the depth to that interaction between Suian and Moiraine in the hall. Once you see them getting up to shenanigans later... it changes the context.
So a bit of historical background to The Ways that they may/May not give in the next episode due to time constraints. The Ways were created during the Breaking- a time period where the men channelling the male part of the One Power, Saidin started going mad and were destroying the world. A few of the last remaining sane male AES Sedai constructed a medium of safe travel by jumping to a parallel universe to ours through portal gates called Waygates. By traveling through these gates they could traverse large distances more quickly and safely, in a different reality to the rampaging insane male AES Sedai. Unfortunately, though The Ways were constructed with the male one power which as previously mentioned was tainted by The Dark One thus The Ways ‘nowadays’ doesn’t look particularly welcoming (or safe). I hope I gave enough welcome information without giving too much!! Really enjoying watching non reader reactions from you guys. Keep up the great work :)
The Ways are basically a network of wormholes. Spacetime behaves differently there in several ways, but they definitely act as shortcuts. It is possible to journey from one end of the map to the other within a few days, as reckoned by the travellers' clocks. [Edited in order to answer your later questions: The stone structure that Moiraine channels on and where the entrance/exit forms is a Waygate. It is basically the doorway. The Ways is/are the spacetime region beyond the this doorways, outside of our normal spacetime. Think of the Ways as being a bunch of roads which come together and lead all over the place - but there is nothing other than the roads and the air surrounding them. A person enters the Ways at one Waygate and leaves at, usually, a different Waygate after travelling through the Ways for a little while. In a world without airplanes, the Ways would be a pretty efficient means of transport, if one can/could use them]
It seems like the reason that last scene was so weird is that was the last scene they filmed before the first COVID shutdown. Barney Harris never came back. So I don't think it was planned that way, they had to improvise as best they could.
I heard on another WoT content provider, seems like it was the Dusty Wheel, that Barney did come back after the first covid19 shut down; that it was after the second that he did not return. Not sure that would make a difference though.
The best way to describe what the Ways are would be paths on the outside of reality that connect with the world in various places (outside of ogier Steddings and groves, built to help them travel quickly so they don't fall to the Longing). They are essentially floating islands and bridges that connect in a network, though thanks to the corruption of the power that was used to make them they have gone dark and been abandoned due to the inherent dangers within. Worlds overlapping worlds and others existing between those spaces, all while being nestled inside other worlds is a pretty common theme in the books. It's all part of the Age Lace woven by the Pattern.
The door is called a Waygate. The Ways let you travel to other parts of the world but not other planets, etc. They are dangerous which why they are portrayed to look haunted.
There are nearly 3,000 named characters in the books. Most have brief appearances and disappear like the darkfriend killed by Thom. Some may disappear for 1 or more books and reappear in later books
I agree, the best way for them to deal with it is for to have Matt retrieve the dagger, get infected harder than before so he requires massive healing which would change him physically and would put Matt back on his story arc after that poor excuse for an ending (I know it was caused by Barney Harris suddenly leaving the show at that point, but still). Scene; Cue Egwene, "Matt's not coming" Moraine " then I'll just open the door again ask him what the hell he thinks he's doing and drag his butt through it". One of my favourite 'sayings is "When one door closes just open it again, that's how doors work'
@@robbynellis4764 Yes, no one seems to know why Barney Harris left the show suddenly, he apparently deleted his social media accounts too . Donal Finn has been cast as his replacement.
Here is my take on Moiraine going through "the door". I don't think she is going to Suains room as such. I think that the terangreals (magical artifacts) in both their rooms lead to an extraplanar space, that suian has created to look like her childhood cabin. It's like the room of requirement in Harry Potter! Because if they actually meet in any of their rooms, it would be know.
the device she uses which is not a door in the books allows her to dream walk to siuan to talk with her. it's a way of communication. this was just to appeal to GOT fans.
@@joshuatempleton9556 I am guessing "dreamwalking" wasn't good enough for "sexy stuff", so they made it physical transportation instead. It does set a bad president, as I remember dream communication being an ongoing thing in the series.
I imagine I'm the 1000th person to ask this but I hope you all are watching the animated bonus clips that come with each episode, (you pause go to bonus and they're there one for each episode) They explain a bit about history etc that usually has to do with the topic of that episode. they're really beautifully done and just a few minutes a piece, and help answer a lot of questions for non book readers.
You do have reason to believe that Egwene is strong in the Power, irrespective of her personality traits. Moiraine and Lan compare Logain to her, and she surely has some expectation in that scene that Siuan is addressing her, until disabused of that notion. Now, it could just be that her attitude is always "I'm going to be the very best, like no-one ever was" and she is applying it to the little channelling which she has demonstrated, but Moiraine certainly believes that she has much potential. Very funny scene though. And great characterwork and, potentially, set-up. (I give no spoilers about such things)
There's also the fact that she HAS channeled, with only the most minimal amount of training, and while tied up without moving her hands. Plus, she's been told that she's potentially the Dragon Reborn. She had no reason to think Siuan wasn't talking about her.
@@rfresa: Absolutely correct! Moiraine has seen her channel, and so the Amyrlin may know about it too. Meanwhile, she has already done some impressive channelling away from Moiraine; so, in her mind, she is justified in her initial assessment/take. Oh, also, Nynaeve has NOT demonstrated channelling in front of her, such that she recognized it, and Egwene has not been around others long enough to hear the story of the mass healing.
She CAN do things no other channeller can do. Splitting the weaves dozens of ways simultaneously, while most others can only split it 3 or 4 ways. In the Valda scene she split it two ways without any training at all. She's not as powerful as Nynaeve, but Nyn is a freight train of power while Eg is a maestro.
(Spoilers) . . . . . . @@spacechampi0n: I kinda agree. I am not sure of a few things though. (1) In the books, she struggles to split her weaves in even two ways until the third or fourth book. But, yes, when she eventually does do what you say, it is an incredible feat because it was already framed for us as mindblowingly difficult in the fourth book. (2) I am not sure that Nynaeve cannot match her dexterity/multi-tasking in the books. I would have to review my memories. (3) The show is what matters here though, and I am not sure that Egwene actually did two different weaves at once, or that Nynaeve did not do dozens at once in her healing scene. On the former, it certainly looks like she split it three or four different ways, or at least two, but the book knowledge is making me hesitate to instantly buy into that. Anyway, agreed on her being a maestro.
Haven't looked at your review yet, but in case you missed it, 42:00 in the episode is hilarious. So much for keeping things secret, Moiraine Sedai! Second, the tattoos look very much like Pacific Islander tattoos to me. Okay, I'll go look at your review and see what you caught there.
-I am glad you are excited about whole new characters because the books have a lot of them. It really is a true ensemble series where I want to say practically everyone you've seen has an important role and/or big moments. Another streamer had a top 10 of the best or favorite Wheel of Time characters and while it does contain the expected leads, anyone who's read the books knows how ridiculously incomplete a top 10 list is for characters in this series. Many book readers new and old can immediately name 10 critical characters not listed and a further 10 would barely take more thought. (even for someone like me who hasn't read the books in 15+ years) -Now, that being said, sometimes the books suffer from having a huge loveable and critical bunch of characters. There are at least two instances where a different lead character is completely absent from a book. I think the compression of the books in the show will alleviate this, thankfully. There just needs to be some patience as characters are introduced abruptly and it won't always be clear how they fit into the picture until the next episode or two. Think of how Eamon Valda (the white cloak with the Aes Sedai rings that Egwene stabbed) was first introduced and then developed two episodes later. Liandrin too for that matter as she was in the opening of the first episode and then gets more screen time in episode three or four. - Regarding the ending scene with Matt, they patched it up good enough. However, I suspect that the close up shots of him are just different camera/angle shots from a scene already shown. And those scenes where everyone is looking at him from the gate, is probably a stand in wearing his wardrobe. He is pretty blurry and it is far enough away that everyone would easily just assume its him based on the dialogue and the wardrobe. - Also regarding good and bad, they are people. There are certainly bad bad, like darkfriends, the forsaken, and monsters like trollocs. But everyone else are people dealing with the wait of high consequences being thrust upon them. There are good people that make bad decisions or are crushed under the weight of heavy consequences. There are good people with secrets because they have to weight the day to day with the big picture or prophecy. There are bad people that try to have more direct effect but can only obstruct or delay the good. Oh, Sorry for the novel :D
Siuan and Moiraine were novices together and shared the same room. They were lovers or "pillowfriends" when they went through the Aes Sedai training. They were raised together to full Aes Sedai holding hands, thing other Aes Sedai arranged for them. They have been searching the dragon reborn together for 20 years, Siuan whos job was to climb the Aes Sedai political ladder, and Moiraine running around the countryside, all the while making sure no other sisters figure out they are working together.
I'm enjoying your reviews and reactions. Thanks for all of the hard work to you and your editor(s?). Keep on keeping on. I'm here till the end of the Wheel of Time series, and looking forward to discovering other reactions and reviews of your as you continue to do them. Checking out the backlist of your reactions now. :)
I really like that the Tower is a bit of a meritocracy. Yes, it depends a bit on innate power and skill with the One Power (still arguably a 'merit'), but Siuan is also a world-class, naturally-gifted political operator. She did not ascend to become the youngest Amyrlin in history for no good reason. And, in general, anyone of any background (even a poor fisherman's daughter) can achieve prestige in the Tower. Some people carry chips on their shoulders though (Liandrin seems to be doing so in the show, for example). Meanwhile, noblewomen (such as Moiraine and two other book characters whom we have not yet met in the show) are treated no better than anyone else.
The Aes Sedai pecking order is based largely on strength in the Power. Something other channeling institutions like the Wise Ones find ludicrous. For every Siuan and Cadsuane you get an Elaida and Romanda.
@@Bacchian: Yes, ish. It is still a merit, first of all. More importantly, the choice of Amyrlin is far more complicated than mere strength, and Siuan would not have been chosen at her age for that role if she were not able to play the politics. I absolutely agree that a lot of it natural ability in the Power. But much of it is also talent and Talent, experience/age, personality, and ability to maneuver.
"Is she [Siuan] good or bad?" As I have said already, you should generally be asking this question of everyone, especially people in power/Aes Sedai. And then, even if they are 'good', you should ask whether you agree with their motives, methods, etc., and whether agreement with them is 'worth' the cost to other characters whom you like. No to mention conflicting or mixed allegiances even within the same character, for each of them in turn. I think that it is less noticeable than GoT in some ways, but this series does not have simple morality. You never know anyone or what they may become or do. And I mean "anyone".
As a book reader I thought the relationship between Moraine and Siuan was a great change. 🤷♂️ It kind of also answers all the questions about her and Lan that new viewers might have.
It’s not really changed doe they just haven’t drifted apart in the show where as in the books they aren’t pillow friends anymore by the start of book one
@@manuelp6791 really? What page in the book do they make out, let alone have sex, as Aes Sedai? I think we have VERY different definitions of the word change. There is a significant difference between a full on sexual relationship in the present and what is often played down as friends with benefits during a very stressful period over 20 years ago. Edit: From the Wheel of Time wiki on pillow friends. "Novices and Accepted commonly enjoy these relationships as comfort during the hardships of White Tower training, but are viewed as a thing of girlhood[1] and are almost universally abandoned upon gaining the shawl."🤷♂️ The framework being there is what makes the shows changes work. But it absolutely is a change and a significant one. It's strengthens the lgbtq representation in the story. It's huge.
@@pinklefoo Lol. Read New Spring. They are both bisexual. Heterosexual people dont have gay sex and relationships with each other in boarding school. Experimentation? Sure probably very common, but full blown in love with other sex. Nah. Jordan knew what he was writing, didnt want controversy of having the gays in his books during the time when Harry Potter was getting burned as satanic book. Unless the people arent actual real people then you have to read between the lines a lot of things in the books. You cannot think 600 aes sedai are all asexual nuns just because Jordan didnt write all the freaky things the Aes Sedai do in the bedroom.
7:00 in the book. Mat is cursed for 2 whole books, and it takes a full circle of sisters (13) to remove the curse. They definitely sped it up and made it inconsequential in the show. But I can see why, no one would want sad, depressed , useless mat for 2 seasons.
@@katarinawikholm5873 Yeah, in Caemlyn but she knew she had to bring him as soon as possible at Tar Valon to completely heal him. I guess they can use Barney's departure to expand on it despite what the initial plan may have been?
Looking forward to how they portray one of my fave (spoiler not shown) from the books. I read whispering the relevant quote to my show-only teen kids and watched them twitch. 😈
The Ways were built by male Aes Sedai during the breaking of the world after Saidin ( the male half of the source) was corrupted. I’ll leave out the reason why they were made to try to keep this comment brief. They were sunlit and beautiful “ways” to travel great distances in a short span of time...BUT... everything made with Saidin eventually falls into darkness. Get ready, it’s about to get interesting.
It is true, Mat was affected by the dagger. In the adaptation, we do not know yet whether he is fully healed nor whether he will try to pick up the dagger again. Twenty years past Morraine and Suane were pillow friends, but agreed to break contact in public because they both knew Suane will lead the Tower, and they couldn't continue to associate that way. Morraine knew certain details from the Karaethon Cycle + Gitara foretelling to begin searching towns and cities for the Dragon. Finally, the ways can be thought of as a underground system connecting points. They are portrayed differently here, but it remains to see if there will be any ramifications from the change.
Egwene is my favorite female character in the books. I love her ambition and determination! Nynaeve always irritated me, lol. But both actresses are nailing it in the show.
I felt the opposite. Egwene’s attitude continuously irked me and I wanted her given the smack-down she deserved. Where Nyneave’s grit and strength of character spoke to me.
@@katarinawikholm5873 Nynaeve is often very annoying but i actually always found it fun, like she completely lacks self awareness? - "I won't shout at you!" Nynaeve shouted - lmao But i love how loving and protective she actually is, her relationship with Rand is one of my favorites.
It was easy for Robert Jordan to suggest queer relationships but not make them canon. I think that you are a tad younger than I am, but you absolutely remember the norm of even the 90's, my heyday, when these books were written. I wish he was bolder and took some of the steps the show is making, in my head cannon I think he wanted to do that. He may be the origin of a well intentioned queer coding. That's why I love a lot of the changes to the show so far.
When I watched the pilot episode as a non-book reader I became about 90% sure Rand was the dragon. Because I watched so many shows in my life, I knew it had to be a male because so many women already had so much power in this world and the show needs to be balanced. I picked Rand because of how early we followed him and his hair color was just too unique. That is where I landed from ep 1. 🤷🏾♀️
Between the mysterious background and being pretty much the leader figure of the group Rand smells of being the "hidden chosen one". Plus the name, the guy is literally called after a god. 😄
Episode 3 in the mining town Rand breaks down that really heavy steel reinforced wood plant door. The Darkfriend Bartender laughed at him and said 3 men bigger than Rand couldn't break it down, then Rand is all "Hold my ale!" The bartender was legit shocked and just kinda froze for a moment. My favorite show-only watcher theory about Rand is that he is already bonded to Egwene though imperfectly, and has been going back to before Moraine ever set foot in the Two Rivers. Egwene didn't intend to or even know what bonding was, that they were being intimate and she was praying & wishing for Rand to always *be strong* and always find his way back to her if begin the drift apart. So her imperfect bond gave him "super strength" which is probably just huge boost of adrenaline in stressful situations.
Good question! Especially since the house appears to be destroyed. There must be a reason, like he’s not allowed 🤷🏻♀️. Thanks for watching our video!! -Dr. S
He used Pillow Friends because of the time when the books were written. It wasn’t quite as cool to have lesbian/bi/gay relationships in literature at the time. But in the prequel it seems to hint at a close relationship.
Ways are a path outside the time and space ... but not a portal you still have to walk through it, except time moves differently inside of ways ... so let's say whilst inside the ways you walk towards the north for about an hour, but in real-world you have walked a whole month .... it's kind of like a wormhole used in Science fiction movies when a spaceship flies through it but cover much larger distance ...
So I'll say this....if you think about channeling and what's been revealed about it..the answer becomes obvious. Also you'll find out in the next episode! Watch and find out!
The window frame portal in Moiraine's room is called a Ter'angreal. They are devices left over from the Age of Legends the use the one power for some type of function. There are many different types of Ter'angreal (Oath Rod is one). In this case, the function opens up a portal to somewhere. If you look in the background of Suian Sanche's room when she is talking to Egwene and Nynaeve, you can also see a matching window frame portal. Where the two frames open the portal to is up for debate in the fandom. This exact scene doesn't happen in the books. It could be a physical location somewhere in the world, or it could be a location in an area called Tel’aran’rhiod. I won't get into details about that as it hasn't been introduced officially in the TV series yet. As for devices that are associated with the power, there are also things called Angreal and Sa'angreal. These increase the amount of power a channeler can use. We see an Angreal briefly shown in the very first scene of the series when Moiraine is getting dressed. It is a little statuette that she wraps up. We haven't seen her use it directly yet. A Sa'angreal is much more powerful and rare than Angreal. In the books, it was not so easy to cure Mat from the dagger as shown in the show. There was a great deal to it and occurred later in the series. They may revisit this later but hard to tell how they are going to redo Mat's part with the recasting. The fandom is wondering how this will proceed going forward as well. The Ways were originally crafted by male Aes Sedai for Ogier to travel. Over time, it became corrupted because of the same taint that corrupts Saidin (male half of the power). The signposts in the ways are written in the Ogier language and so helps to have an Ogier guide. In the books, the ways didn't require channeling. Instead, there was a carved Avendorsa leaf that you use to open. This was subtly hinted to in the weaves that Moiraine uses to open the gate as they make a similar trefoil leaf shape. This change of using the power to open the ways has the fandom in an uproar as it has lots of consequences to some things in the series that have happened (off screen) and have yet to happen. Fans are wondering how this will play out.
As for the "place" where Suan and Moiraine meet, there are a few theories about this, especially since it didn't happen in the books. I looks like her home inn Tear when she was a girl, but that was destroyed in the fire. (No spoilers please for Tori and Dr S....I've read the books so I have my theories)
@@Ailthas There’s no fast costume change. Moiraine arrives as she was dressed in her room and after they have sex they each have another “costume”. The extras on the Prime site say that they are using a pair of ter’angreal that opens a Gateway to a secluded hut located in Tear.
what you saw on the show was called a waygate, the ways are inside, in the books the waygates are very different, they have actual doors that anyone can open, they do not require magic to open
Loved Tori's face when the black ooze was coming out of Mat's face LOL. To answer Dr S' question of who says "I'm bad": Michael Jackson, DUH! Great insights on the Siuan/Egwene/Nynaeve scene from both of you. Oh, and the Ways was not based on the navigation app Waze just FYI. Keep up the good work!
Moiraine cured Mat's connection to the dagger, but not all of his physical illness. In the books there is more focus on Mat's physical illness as opposed to his mental illness.
it took several sister and some time to finally cure him. "Moiraine cured Mat's connection to the dagger, but not all of his physical illness" might be so, but nothing in the show made that clear. Although Moiraine didn't cure the connection in the books, she only stemmed the darkness from consuming Mat.
You guys have been surprisingly insightful about certain things to come. And I find myself actually enjoying these kind of episode reactions you’re doing here. I hope they increase the number of episodes to at least 10 per season. Would feel less rushed in certain scenes. Over all a great episode. Very sad about the actor Barney. No one pulls such a stunt just for the heck of it. I’m sure there must have been a legit reason. Hopefully everything’s ok with him and his family.
It's not obvious in the show who the Dragon is. It's only obvious to viewers who are already aware of the central themes and where the narrative is headed (and if you know in which way the story is classical and in which ways it's really not).
Your comment is great. It clarifies nothing and everything. I am not entirely sure if anyone can know who the DR is at this point lol. But I love that. -Dr. S
In-book it took two healings. One Moiraine only and off-screen while they were in Caemlyn, and a rather more complicated one with a circle of multiple Aes Sedai when the Amyrlin has hunted Moiraine down to ask her some tough questions about what she's been doing with the Dragon at the start of Book 2. Not sure exactly what they were planning, but would not be surprised if it fell victim to the actor change. Maybe Mat'll re-appear in the plot, re-connected to the dagger, next year and need healing again...
My impression reading the books is that being pillow friends is normal, happening naturally early on as Novices and Accepted as they are too busy learning to get involved with men. They kind of only had each other. That and they could spend years advancing. And there aren't available men in the white tower. That and not being at a high enough level to have Warders. Many would put off the pillow friends relationships when they became full Aes Sadie and got Warders. Some lost there pillow friends when they chose their color. And some kept their pillow friends. No big deal is made about it one why or the other. It's kind of a theme and variations, without expectations or judgment. It just was.
That Aes Sedai novices and accepted would be temporary pillow friends is perfectly reasonable. It happens in college all the time. They become LUG's (lesbians until graduation). Jordan's sex scenes were rare in the books, probably because they rarely mattered. I know he didn't insinuate that Warders who shared an Aes Sedai were gay, though -- that's something the writers of the series threw in. Rafe said that the series would be "updated" and LGBT friendly, and it certainly is.
I don't see this question answered- "what is that thing on the wall that she walks though?" This exact device isn't in the book but it's clearly what they call a Ter'angreal. A magical artifact from the Age of Legends that has a specific purpose (there are others that don't have a specific purpose). Some need channeling to work, some do not. So this one takes a weave of the one power and opens a magical doorway to a specific place. You can see that the picture is of the Amyrlin's quarters. When Egwene and Nynaeve meet Siuan you can see another identical Ter'angreal on the wall with a picture of her hut in Tear. Siuan probably went to Siuan's quarters and from there through Siuan's Ter'angreal to the hut in Tear. There are many Ter'angreal in the world and the function of many has been lost to the current generation of Aes Sedai. They even have a storeroom full of unknown Ter'angreal. The making of Ter'angreal is a lost art though some Aes Sedai can have an intuitive but very vague idea of what an individual Ter'angreal does. They are considered very dangerous to experiment with. I have no idea what happens with these two gateway Ter'angreal later on but I can tell you that having one in the world leading to your sleeping chambers is exceedingly dangerous! It shows how naive everybody is at this point in the story.
Yes! My other brother, who also read the books, said he is totally down to do a round-table discussion after the season 1 finale, but Mr. Dr. S is a little shy and we are still trying to convince. -Tori :)
What “fans” are telling you the Dragon can’t be a woman? The show explicitly states otherwise. They are not fans but dark friends who simply can’t reconcile that this show is an “adaptation” and not a one to one mirror image of the book series. If they were true fans they’d understand the importance of allowing you two to experience and enjoy the story for yourselves; knowing that piqued interest will eventually lead you to reading the books, if you are so inclined.
Thank you, luckily there have already been enough changes (adaptations) that I believe anything can happen! I’m trying to avoid spoilers in comments, but if I accidentally read something, I’ll keep in mind that even book fans don’t know exactly how things will play out. Thanks so much for your comment! I hope we will all enjoy where the show takes us together and that book fans continue to add depth to non book readers’ understanding. Your comments about backstory not included in the tv show is so interesting! -Dr. S
I will not at all comment on your guesses/commentary concerning the identity of the Dragon Reborn. You may be right, wrong but close, or totally off the mark. My lips are sealed. I hint nothing.
In the books, it was much more of an ordeal to separate Mat from the dagger. Moiraine was able to restore Mat a bit, but to break the link it took several powerful sisters linked to accomplish this.
☯️ yin is the female symbol yang is the male symbol. Jordan heavily borrowed from Asian cultures, symbolism, and myth. But he didn't always understand what he was using or how the native culture view it. There's a lot of actual gender nuance that he missed. Pillow friends is the term he used because he couldn't call them bisexual or Lesbian in the books when he started writing them in the 90s. There are several queer (male and female) character's. As for myself I personally read every character in every book, show, movie, as bi unless explicitly stated otherwise.
In the books siuan and mo we ere very intimate. In 1990 the book wouldn't have been published with openly gay characters so it was all coded but Robert Jordan said in am interview back in the day that fully one third to one half of the tower women were bisexual or gray which tracked with the data at the time
Don’t listen to the comments on who is the dragon reborn and if it can be a man or a woman. The show is soooo different, I read the books and I don’t know. Yea, Dr. S nailed it on The Ways. There are many Waygates, and you can navigate to any of them. The Moiraine and Siuan romance was hinted at, but we didn’t get scenes like that! We are here for it! They are only keeping it a secret because The Amyrlin isn’t supposed to have favorites and being in a relationship would definitely be considered favoritism. That’s why they’ve “always broke the rules.” We partly, they were also pranksters while they were in training at The White Tower.
My husband also told me not to listen to the comments about who the dragon reborn is. I think it was stated in the opening scene of ep 1 and restated in ep 6 clearly that they don’t know who it is, what form it will take. I think all the changes that have been made have set the stage for book readers to have surprises, and I think that’s pretty amazing that they’re pulling it off, and that most books are good with it! Waygates seem pretty cool! Thanks for your comment! -Dr. S
Moraine and Suian entered the Tower the same time and they were both Accepted together. The book does describe them as Pillow friends but when I read it in the 90's I assumed they were lovers.. This world uses Sangreal and Tangreal items that enhance a users use of the one Power. The Picture Moraine used to enter Suian's bedroom was a Sangreal object. each Tangreal and sangreal have unique and specific powers.
Now you know Moraine and Siuan were performing, and I am a book reader and I was telling at the screen What's HAPPENING??? Because they really scared me anyway that Morgaine was in deep trouble. Good job actors!
That makes me so happy to hear that the adaptations are getting you engaged as a nonbook reader! I honestly feel that 1) tv adaptation cannot make a reader happy if they expect 1-1 correspondence; 2) the changes are a reward for book readers, as opposed to a negative. You get to enjoy on two levels, discovering new material and being able to compare to the books. I think if the unhappy book fans were more open to this level of enjoyment, they would be able to appreciate the TV show without being so protective of the books (to which no harm is being done, lol). Anyways, we appreciate all your comments! Thanks so much for watching our reviews! -Dr. S
I also felt Egwene didn't know Nyneave could channel at all and that was some of her surprise. They haven't really had a chance to catch up yet. " The Ways" are inside and the structure a "Waygate" though the adaptation changed a lot of how they work and look. Also pillow friends when they were younger was code for a female-female relationship which was common among girls training to be Aes Sedai. That being said I'm not sure that the relationship didn't continue as Moirane and Siuan remained confidants and friends and we don't get to see their POV in the books much so not seeing the relationship doesn't mean it didn't exist, at least at the beginning of the story.
They are not like the White Cloaks! Siuan and Moraine are good, but they are not always right. We don't yet know Egwene's powers so it's not just Rand we have to learn more about. Keep that in mind.
(Arguably spoilery hints. Spoilers about characters who survive for at least a few books. Maybe also spoilers about PoVs) . . . . . . . @@gabnel1000: The show has developed some of them more than the books did, I think. Mat readily comes to mind, especially if we consider the fact that Mat acquires the dagger by the end of the second episode (unlike the hundreds of pages prior to that point in the books). Rand too has demonstrated some personality traits that do not become apparent in him until TSR. The characterizations of Nynaeve, Perrin, and Egwene are just different in subtle ways. Notice the characters from whom we receive an internal monologue up to this point in the first book too. Background characters (Liandrin, Alanna, and Valda come to mind) receive a lot more attention in the show than in even the first three books combined. I will say that we have spent a lot of time with the Aes Sedai in the show. Moirine is definitely taking center stage. And that means that we have less time with the others, and thus less time to work in hints about which of them (if any) are the DR. So, your opinion is not unfounded. But I do think that it is a little incomplete.
Mat didn't go through the ways I don't think, even in the books. He was sick in the tower after 9 sisters healed him of the dagger attachment. That's how I remember it.
In the books the dragon is always a male channeler but the show canon is different in that a women can be the dragon, as long as she can channel. The issue with Nyneave is her age. Mat is out due to him not going with the group through the ways. Perrin hasn’t shown to be able to channel and his wolf powers are separate from channeling. We know Egwene can channel so she is still a candidate for the dragon. Rand hasn’t been seen channeling per say but remember he busted down that door in episode 3 which might have been channeling. So without spoiling the books I’d say it’s between Egwene and Rand, unless they go with the multi-headed “power rangers” dragon idea.
Thank you! I got the sense from this episode that all 5 are still in play…at least in the show version! So yeah my vote is for the “power ranger” (well my cultural reference is the “Voltron”) model! I’m kind of excited that it’s up in the air whether DR will be same as or different from books! Now we all (book readers and non book readers alike) get to play and guess! Thanks for your comments! Dr. S
Another thing: in the books a Waygate is opened my moving a stone leaf by hand. Ogier don't use the One Power. So if the One Power was the only way to open a Waygate then it would be useless to the Ogier for whom they were created. Not sure why they changed it but it seems odd to me.
An interesting fact is that strength in the One Power delineates hierarchy. A weaker Sister with Saidar has to defer to a stronger Sister. Even if the weaker Sister has been Aes Sedai for 100 years she defers to the stronger, even if she's only been raised to Aes Sedai for a few years.
My daughter introduced me to the series. And, I don’t think we both had a clue what pillow friends were right away. Robert Jordan either made the term up or it was somewhere in history. I think some where in future books I learned that this was intimacy. The sex Robert put in was a part of the story not for just any occurrence
Thank you!! I love that your daughter introduced you to the series. How great it must be to enjoy reading the same books and watching the same shows as your kids! Mine are currently in elementary school, but I hope one day we will be enjoying the same books too! -Dr. S
Just to reiterate on the pillow friends thing, its not really a change as much as an expansion :) pillow friends was basically a coded way of saying lesbian, or at the least experimenting, but siuan and moiraine were always exceptionally close (they do kiss at one point, and know everything about one another)
I don't know about other comments, but I would note that it is really obvious who the dragon is *in the books*. The show is specifically changing things on that. Of course, I would say this regardless of whether your pick was correct, just to generate a smidgen of doubt :P
Please also check out our full Episode 6 Review: ua-cam.com/video/2XkprVpkpYg/v-deo.html
Sophie Okonedo stole every scene she was in, which is saying A LOT considering that she shared them with Rosamund Pike. They could not have cast a better Siuan
I was super worried about Sophie's casting.. I love her, but I wasn't sure she could radiate the "prickliness" of Siuan. Pleased to be wrong!!
In the background of the cold-open flashback, you can see a huge building or structure in the distance. It made me happy.
The story of the Ways is a pretty sad one. They were a gift from the male Aes Sedai to the Ogier. After the breaking, the male Aes Sedai who hadnt succumbed to madness yet sought shelter in Ogier steddings, hoping they could wait out the taint on the male half of the power. You cant channel or even sense the One Power in a stedding so they were very safe there.
Eventually they all decided to leave, for to live without the power after having tasted it is no life at all. But they created to Ways to thank the Ogier for their hospitality. Ogier get sick if out of a stedding for too long (Explained in this week's origin video) so the Ways was a way for them to get from Stedding to Stedding in no time at all. Its why Moiraine asked for Loial's help, not only would he have a good idea where the Waygates are he would also have the knowledge to navigate them.
The Ways are alive, in their own way, in the books the Waygates look like theyre made of vines and new ones can be "grown" using an artifact the Ogier have (It goes with the Ogier's strong affinity for nature, also explained in the origin video). Unfortunately that same semblance of life also made the Ways vulnerable to the taint, and theyve become dark and dangerous. Despite that, the Ogier care a lot about the Ways and there have been attempts to make them safe again. Though theyve all failed
Because you asked, “Pillow friends” was a term Robert Jordan used to describe lesbian relationships for Aes Sedai because publishers were hesitant to publish books with openly gay characters in the 1980s.
In the books Moraine and Suian were “pillow friends” when they were younger, but had drifted apart since then by the time the books started.
The book where it's mentioned they are pillow friends was published in 2004. I still think you might be right about the publishers pushing it still, or maybe it was RJ being afraid of how the fans would take it.
@@Plexsusmax They mentioned pillow friends earlier in the books in passing, so I think at that point it was mainly just keeping it consistent.
Jorden himself confirmed pillow friends = sexual partners.
@@davinitall I meant the first time they mentioned pillow friends in reference to Moiraine and Siuan. About RJ confirming it I haven't seen a source on it? I've heard people say that he never confirmed it and some that say he did. Do you have a link to it so I can settle this lol
@@davinitall no he did not, he explained that pillow freinds meant an intimate relationship that happens under isolation and stress like what happens in single sex schools primarily female. they are not lesbian as both go on to have male relationships, siuan with her warder before becoming amerrilyne or however you spell it lol
it was rjs own misgivings about writing sex in general that is why he only hints and fades to grey about it in the books.
@@Plexsusmax he said in an interview that pillow freind did not mean lesbian it meant a temporary intimate relationship brought about by stress and isolation, like an all girls school. only reds don't take warders but most other Aes sedai do and they are usually intimate often married, siuan was married before becoming the amerrilyn.
Thanks for this great content, so glad I found your channel. I'm really enjoying new fans reacting to this amazing story.
Thank YOU! We are so happy to have you 💛 -Tori :)
Nice username.
I really like your format with a bit of discussion/reflection between your reactions!
Thank you so much!! -Tori :)
When Suan was talking to the girls in the tower at 10:58, you can see she has a picture frame on her wall too.
as a book reader, I love how they introduced Siuan Sanche! It's 100% true to the book backstory of her. In her country, channeling is outlawed and seen as something to fear, something to hate. So she had to leave. and it's heartbreaking! They did a great job and Sophie is PERFECT for the role!! Also important to note that "Pillow Friends" is the in world name for Lesbian Lovers. It's far more than just bicurious college girls experimenting, which some fans try to claim. They're in training sometimes for two decades or more before they become full Sisters. Those relationships are real, they're intimate, and they can be long lasting. Moiraine and Siuan really love each other deeply. All the show did was put it on screen, where the author had all of it implied but off-page. In 1990's, it was still incredibly difficult to get publishers to print lgbt stories. So Robert Jordan used different words to mean the same thing, to get around the censors.
also, Robert Jordan wrote almost all sexual relationships to be off-page. not just lgbt ones. Romance was his weakest point as a writer, to be perfectly honest. Sex is implied but never shown. It's like the anti-GoT that way. Notice how in the show, places where they could have shown sex like Game of Thrones, they don't fully go there. They don't need sexposition to advance the plot like Game of Thrones did.
It's not what some fans try to claim. It's word for word in the Companion book that they're not actually lesbians. Some Aes Sedai are explicitly lesbians, notably Elaida and Galina, although lesbians may not want to claim those two.
@@Bacchian the bisexual erasure is strong with you. it's amazing how many people assume there are only two choices. Some Pillow Friends only love women. Some, like Siuan and Moiraine, find love with men later on. That doesn't mean their relationship was any less meaningful, intimate, or real. the idea that it's just college girls experimenting is ridiculous, considering how long they spend as novices and accepted. that's one heck of an experimental phase, don't ya think?
Also, the Companion contradicts many things in the text of the story. they are imperfect collections of his some 100,000 pages of notes. Example: Bela and Tuon. If you have the companion and the books, you can look up the difference.
If you want to read it as flippant as experimenting, that's fine. But it's far more than that. Also remember that in the early 90's, publishers still wouldn't print LGBT stories that weren't tragedies. So he used euphamisms and alluded to things rather than make them explicit. I'm really tired of whitecloak type fans who insist their cishet interpretation of the text is the only valid one.
@@TheDevler23 This is ridiculous. I'm literally reading from an official source that completely contradicts what you're saying. What you said is 100% made up. Don't tell me I'm hating on bisexual people because I'm gainsaying you; bi people aren't your human shields against criticism. You want to say it's you're interpretation that they were romantically in love; go ahead. Don't mislead people, though. New Spring -- the book where Moiraine and Siuan's backstory is explored -- was published in 2004, BTW, and the Companion was 2015.
Cishet? I'm gay. Most of the people I've ever met who read these books were gay or women. And you're doing exactly what you're criticizing: your way is the only interpretation, no matter what the source material says. (Whitecloak??)
@@Bacchian i literally pointed out to you that the material you're citing is rife with contradictions to the actual text. it's a great resource. but it isn't a bible. but if you wanna fight on the internet, go do it with someone else.
That moment where Egwene thinks the Amyrlin is talking to her - well, that is pretty much who Egwene is. She thinks she's the best. With that said, she is presented pretty well depicted in the show. She was more know-it-all in the books. She is many readers' favorite character. And she is many readers' least favorite. I have heard several people say they hate her. She is so much more likable in the show. So I was surprised they showed this trait.
This is so interesting! I am neutral about her. Thank you so much! -Tori :)
A lot of it is more like she wants to be the best, and not that she thinks that she already is. At least at first. Such people (myself included) do tend to fall into the trap of over-estimating themselves. She does often think that she knows best, but that is literally every other character too, lol.
I only like Egwene one time in the books. The rest of the time I don’t like her. I wouldn’t say hate thats too strong of the word. In the books there are some hypocrites she is the biggest of all. Also let’s say there is one things she does that is unforgivable in my eyes but they won’t put that in the show.
I always hated her because she suffers from smartest person in the room syndrome and it comes to bite everyone a few times.
I recently read the series for the first time in the first half of this year. Egwene didn’t really come off as “know-it-all” to me till late in the series. There was one scene with her Rand and Gawyn in her pov where she was just like “yeah I already knew that” in her head where there’s no logical connection for her to come to that conclusion but that she just knows. Kinda just rolled my eyes at that.
I love watching you two and your reactions. I want to watch with you so badly. I love the series, it holds a very special place in my heart. It actually gave me the strength to come out to my close friends in highschool and every video game character I pick is always a woman and I name her Nynaeve lol. I love the series because even as a book reader I don't know what they are going to show next because a lot of the show has things that happen but it happens off the page and we aren't present in the action. The Ways were built by men and women using the one power after the male half was tainted. Ogier used the ways to travel to all the major villages to build buildings and tend the groves they planted outside the cities. The ways used to be lit and it was like a blue clear sky above, but eventually the taint on the male half of the source corrupted the ways and now they are dark and most people who go in don't come out again and the few that do come out are drained. Like a body without a soul. They are pretty much forbidden to be used now but their need to get to the Eye of the World outweighs the danger the ways pose. Moraine and Siuan are good For sure, that is why they hold their plans so closely and won't confide in anyone. Anyone could be a dark friend and even good people would kill the Dragon Reborn and think they were doing the world a favor. Right now, whoever the Dragon is, they are too weak to protect themselves from that many potential enemies that want to kill them. Hope this helps and look forward to reliving my first time through this story thru your reactions!❤️🍷
Oh my goodness, thank you for sharing your experience with us 💛 WoT has the BEST fans! We will be having a live Twitch Watch Party for the finale, so you can watch with us in some capacity 😊 Thank you again! -Tori :)
Gitara’s Prophecy: she prophecised in front of a young Moiraine & Siun Sanche that the Dragon was being reborn. She then dies, so only Moiraine & Siun know for a fact that the Dragon has in fact been reborn. This marks the beginning of their partnership in finding the Dragon.
I'm not going to say whether you're right or wrong about the Dragon, but I will say that for all the characters who aren't the Dragon, they still have their own arcs and journeys to go through that are worth following.
All the characters are important and great to follow.
Siuan and Moiraine were definitely coded Bi in the books (especially the prequel) and "pillow friends" was definitely a more intimate relationship than some have interpreted (Jordan spoke about this IIRC). Their relationship in the book however was cut off because of their mission and the need for secrecy (and they didn't have those nifty little doors and the secret magic room for their rendezvous).
This is a nice mechanism for the show to replace pages and pages of close friends' dialogue with something else that shows the depth of their bond.
Thank you for your comment! It must be so rewarding for you to note how pages and pages of story are translated to a new medium. I love that you describe the little doors as "nifty" lol. But seriously, they are. -Dr. S
You two are always fun to watch. I love the balance of your energy and your takes on each episode. 👍🏾
You both realized how fun the scene with Siuan, Nynaeve, Egwene, and Moiraine was supposed to be (so much power in that one room) unlike a couple other channels I’ve seen that keep telling Nynaeve to chill. Nynaeve has no reason to trust the Amyrlin Seat and wants to protect her people from agendas they might have. I love that she is cautious with the Aes Sedai.
Love getting your perspectives as fans who haven't read the books. Please keep up the good work. And understand as interesting as it was to those watching the show, the fact that Matt got left behind has just blown the collective mind of all of us book readers.
You are so kind! Thank you!! I’m glad the book readers get some surprises too 💛 -Tori :)
The structure/ portal is called a Waygate. It is an entrance into the Ways, which is like a seperate world. There are Waygates throughout the Earth and the Ways but they are much closer together in the Ways than they are on Earth. So a journey between 2 Waygates might take 1 month on Earth, but only a couple days through the Ways. Hope that helps clarify things.
That helps so much! Thank you!! -Tori :)
Exactly this. The Ways was the Hyperloop of its time.
@@ToriTalksTV you could just ... wait for the next episode to explain it.
@@georgevelis4651 True. I’m so impatient! -Tori :)
I love the depth to that interaction between Suian and Moiraine in the hall.
Once you see them getting up to shenanigans later... it changes the context.
So a bit of historical background to The Ways that they may/May not give in the next episode due to time constraints. The Ways were created during the Breaking- a time period where the men channelling the male part of the One Power, Saidin started going mad and were destroying the world. A few of the last remaining sane male AES Sedai constructed a medium of safe travel by jumping to a parallel universe to ours through portal gates called Waygates. By traveling through these gates they could traverse large distances more quickly and safely, in a different reality to the rampaging insane male AES Sedai. Unfortunately, though The Ways were constructed with the male one power which as previously mentioned was tainted by The Dark One thus The Ways ‘nowadays’ doesn’t look particularly welcoming (or safe). I hope I gave enough welcome information without giving too much!! Really enjoying watching non reader reactions from you guys. Keep up the great work :)
This is so fun to learn about! Thank you for your love and support! 💛 -Tori :)
The Ways are basically a network of wormholes. Spacetime behaves differently there in several ways, but they definitely act as shortcuts. It is possible to journey from one end of the map to the other within a few days, as reckoned by the travellers' clocks.
[Edited in order to answer your later questions:
The stone structure that Moiraine channels on and where the entrance/exit forms is a Waygate. It is basically the doorway. The Ways is/are the spacetime region beyond the this doorways, outside of our normal spacetime. Think of the Ways as being a bunch of roads which come together and lead all over the place - but there is nothing other than the roads and the air surrounding them. A person enters the Ways at one Waygate and leaves at, usually, a different Waygate after travelling through the Ways for a little while. In a world without airplanes, the Ways would be a pretty efficient means of transport, if one can/could use them]
It seems like the reason that last scene was so weird is that was the last scene they filmed before the first COVID shutdown. Barney Harris never came back. So I don't think it was planned that way, they had to improvise as best they could.
I heard on another WoT content provider, seems like it was the Dusty Wheel, that Barney did come back after the first covid19 shut down; that it was after the second that he did not return. Not sure that would make a difference though.
The best way to describe what the Ways are would be paths on the outside of reality that connect with the world in various places (outside of ogier Steddings and groves, built to help them travel quickly so they don't fall to the Longing). They are essentially floating islands and bridges that connect in a network, though thanks to the corruption of the power that was used to make them they have gone dark and been abandoned due to the inherent dangers within. Worlds overlapping worlds and others existing between those spaces, all while being nestled inside other worlds is a pretty common theme in the books. It's all part of the Age Lace woven by the Pattern.
I like to think of it as sort of like tunnels that you attach to a hamster cage.
The door is called a Waygate. The Ways let you travel to other parts of the world but not other planets, etc. They are dangerous which why they are portrayed to look haunted.
amazing as always.
love your reactions
YOU are amazing! Thank you 💛 -Tori :)
There are nearly 3,000 named characters in the books. Most have brief appearances and disappear like the darkfriend killed by Thom. Some may disappear for 1 or more books and reappear in later books
Almost 3000! That’s really impressive! -Dr. S
~"We always see Nynaeve in something with a high neck[line]" (paraphrased)
^^ lmao
I mean, you are right for the show so far. So far.
Lol! -Tori :)
I think that nugget is sorted under WAFO w a snigger
In the books she does have.... Opinions about clothing, hehehe
I predict they will coincide the recasting of Mat with when he gets physically healed from the dagger. It's a big change for him
I don’t think they will even acknowledge it. It will just happen.
I agree, the best way for them to deal with it is for to have Matt retrieve the dagger, get infected harder than before so he requires massive healing which would change him physically and would put Matt back on his story arc after that poor excuse for an ending (I know it was caused by Barney Harris suddenly leaving the show at that point, but still). Scene; Cue Egwene, "Matt's not coming" Moraine " then I'll just open the door again ask him what the hell he thinks he's doing and drag his butt through it". One of my favourite 'sayings is "When one door closes just open it again, that's how doors work'
They’re recasting Mat already?! 🤦🏼♀️
@@robbynellis4764 Yes, no one seems to know why Barney Harris left the show suddenly, he apparently deleted his social media accounts too . Donal Finn has been cast as his replacement.
Here is my take on Moiraine going through "the door". I don't think she is going to Suains room as such. I think that the terangreals (magical artifacts) in both their rooms lead to an extraplanar space, that suian has created to look like her childhood cabin. It's like the room of requirement in Harry Potter! Because if they actually meet in any of their rooms, it would be know.
Totally agree!
the device she uses which is not a door in the books allows her to dream walk to siuan to talk with her. it's a way of communication. this was just to appeal to GOT fans.
@@joshuatempleton9556 I am guessing "dreamwalking" wasn't good enough for "sexy stuff", so they made it physical transportation instead. It does set a bad president, as I remember dream communication being an ongoing thing in the series.
@@Accolonian exactly ntm it demonstrates a lvl of ability they didn't have .
I really like this react/review format
Thank you so much!! -Tori :)
I imagine I'm the 1000th person to ask this but I hope you all are watching the animated bonus clips that come with each episode, (you pause go to bonus and they're there one for each episode) They explain a bit about history etc that usually has to do with the topic of that episode. they're really beautifully done and just a few minutes a piece, and help answer a lot of questions for non book readers.
I tried for about 10 minutes to find them! I will try again. Thanks for the reminder! -Dr. S
You do have reason to believe that Egwene is strong in the Power, irrespective of her personality traits. Moiraine and Lan compare Logain to her, and she surely has some expectation in that scene that Siuan is addressing her, until disabused of that notion. Now, it could just be that her attitude is always "I'm going to be the very best, like no-one ever was" and she is applying it to the little channelling which she has demonstrated, but Moiraine certainly believes that she has much potential.
Very funny scene though. And great characterwork and, potentially, set-up. (I give no spoilers about such things)
There's also the fact that she HAS channeled, with only the most minimal amount of training, and while tied up without moving her hands. Plus, she's been told that she's potentially the Dragon Reborn. She had no reason to think Siuan wasn't talking about her.
@@rfresa: Absolutely correct! Moiraine has seen her channel, and so the Amyrlin may know about it too. Meanwhile, she has already done some impressive channelling away from Moiraine; so, in her mind, she is justified in her initial assessment/take. Oh, also, Nynaeve has NOT demonstrated channelling in front of her, such that she recognized it, and Egwene has not been around others long enough to hear the story of the mass healing.
She CAN do things no other channeller can do. Splitting the weaves dozens of ways simultaneously, while most others can only split it 3 or 4 ways. In the Valda scene she split it two ways without any training at all. She's not as powerful as Nynaeve, but Nyn is a freight train of power while Eg is a maestro.
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@@spacechampi0n: I kinda agree. I am not sure of a few things though. (1) In the books, she struggles to split her weaves in even two ways until the third or fourth book. But, yes, when she eventually does do what you say, it is an incredible feat because it was already framed for us as mindblowingly difficult in the fourth book. (2) I am not sure that Nynaeve cannot match her dexterity/multi-tasking in the books. I would have to review my memories. (3) The show is what matters here though, and I am not sure that Egwene actually did two different weaves at once, or that Nynaeve did not do dozens at once in her healing scene. On the former, it certainly looks like she split it three or four different ways, or at least two, but the book knowledge is making me hesitate to instantly buy into that.
Anyway, agreed on her being a maestro.
Haven't looked at your review yet, but in case you missed it, 42:00 in the episode is hilarious. So much for keeping things secret, Moiraine Sedai! Second, the tattoos look very much like Pacific Islander tattoos to me. Okay, I'll go look at your review and see what you caught there.
-I am glad you are excited about whole new characters because the books have a lot of them. It really is a true ensemble series where I want to say practically everyone you've seen has an important role and/or big moments. Another streamer had a top 10 of the best or favorite Wheel of Time characters and while it does contain the expected leads, anyone who's read the books knows how ridiculously incomplete a top 10 list is for characters in this series. Many book readers new and old can immediately name 10 critical characters not listed and a further 10 would barely take more thought. (even for someone like me who hasn't read the books in 15+ years)
-Now, that being said, sometimes the books suffer from having a huge loveable and critical bunch of characters. There are at least two instances where a different lead character is completely absent from a book. I think the compression of the books in the show will alleviate this, thankfully. There just needs to be some patience as characters are introduced abruptly and it won't always be clear how they fit into the picture until the next episode or two. Think of how Eamon Valda (the white cloak with the Aes Sedai rings that Egwene stabbed) was first introduced and then developed two episodes later. Liandrin too for that matter as she was in the opening of the first episode and then gets more screen time in episode three or four.
- Regarding the ending scene with Matt, they patched it up good enough. However, I suspect that the close up shots of him are just different camera/angle shots from a scene already shown. And those scenes where everyone is looking at him from the gate, is probably a stand in wearing his wardrobe. He is pretty blurry and it is far enough away that everyone would easily just assume its him based on the dialogue and the wardrobe.
- Also regarding good and bad, they are people. There are certainly bad bad, like darkfriends, the forsaken, and monsters like trollocs. But everyone else are people dealing with the wait of high consequences being thrust upon them. There are good people that make bad decisions or are crushed under the weight of heavy consequences. There are good people with secrets because they have to weight the day to day with the big picture or prophecy. There are bad people that try to have more direct effect but can only obstruct or delay the good. Oh, Sorry for the novel :D
Don’t be sorry - this is wonderful!! Thank you so much for taking the time to provide such an insightful comment! -Tori :)
Suian is the Flame of Tar Valon and the Watcher of the Seals. She is the White Tower
Siuan and Moiraine were novices together and shared the same room. They were lovers or "pillowfriends" when they went through the Aes Sedai training. They were raised together to full Aes Sedai holding hands, thing other Aes Sedai arranged for them. They have been searching the dragon reborn together for 20 years, Siuan whos job was to climb the Aes Sedai political ladder, and Moiraine running around the countryside, all the while making sure no other sisters figure out they are working together.
This is so fascinating! Thank you!! -Tori :)
I'm enjoying your reviews and reactions. Thanks for all of the hard work to you and your editor(s?). Keep on keeping on. I'm here till the end of the Wheel of Time series, and looking forward to discovering other reactions and reviews of your as you continue to do them. Checking out the backlist of your reactions now. :)
You are so kind! We appreciate the support and encouragement! It is actually Tori who does all of the editing! :) -Dr. S
The ways is the actual space they travel through. The door way they entered is called a waygate
Thank you!! -Tori :)
Just here to say that I love your reactions! So excited to see what happens next in this show :)
Thank you so much!! -Tori :)
I really like that the Tower is a bit of a meritocracy. Yes, it depends a bit on innate power and skill with the One Power (still arguably a 'merit'), but Siuan is also a world-class, naturally-gifted political operator. She did not ascend to become the youngest Amyrlin in history for no good reason.
And, in general, anyone of any background (even a poor fisherman's daughter) can achieve prestige in the Tower. Some people carry chips on their shoulders though (Liandrin seems to be doing so in the show, for example). Meanwhile, noblewomen (such as Moiraine and two other book characters whom we have not yet met in the show) are treated no better than anyone else.
The Aes Sedai pecking order is based largely on strength in the Power. Something other channeling institutions like the Wise Ones find ludicrous. For every Siuan and Cadsuane you get an Elaida and Romanda.
@@Bacchian: Yes, ish. It is still a merit, first of all. More importantly, the choice of Amyrlin is far more complicated than mere strength, and Siuan would not have been chosen at her age for that role if she were not able to play the politics. I absolutely agree that a lot of it natural ability in the Power. But much of it is also talent and Talent, experience/age, personality, and ability to maneuver.
Amyrlin Seat is more similar to the Pope, elected by the women in that hall, and is serving all through her life.
"Is she [Siuan] good or bad?"
As I have said already, you should generally be asking this question of everyone, especially people in power/Aes Sedai. And then, even if they are 'good', you should ask whether you agree with their motives, methods, etc., and whether agreement with them is 'worth' the cost to other characters whom you like. No to mention conflicting or mixed allegiances even within the same character, for each of them in turn. I think that it is less noticeable than GoT in some ways, but this series does not have simple morality. You never know anyone or what they may become or do. And I mean "anyone".
That’s right, you have said that before. I should stop questioning everyone, lol. Thank you so much again!! -Tori :)
@@ToriTalksTV: Well, you should continue questioning them all, but do not settle on any given answer! :)
@@curtiswfranks Gotcha, thank you! -Tori :)
Well done once again ladies. I would recommend going back to episode 3 and reviewing the interactions of Rand with the dark friend.
Will do! Thank you!!! -Tori :)
As a book reader I thought the relationship between Moraine and Siuan was a great change. 🤷♂️ It kind of also answers all the questions about her and Lan that new viewers might have.
It’s not really changed doe they just haven’t drifted apart in the show where as in the books they aren’t pillow friends anymore by the start of book one
@@manuelp6791 really? What page in the book do they make out, let alone have sex, as Aes Sedai? I think we have VERY different definitions of the word change. There is a significant difference between a full on sexual relationship in the present and what is often played down as friends with benefits during a very stressful period over 20 years ago.
Edit:
From the Wheel of Time wiki on pillow friends.
"Novices and Accepted commonly enjoy these relationships as comfort during the hardships of White Tower training, but are viewed as a thing of girlhood[1] and are almost universally abandoned upon gaining the shawl."🤷♂️
The framework being there is what makes the shows changes work. But it absolutely is a change and a significant one. It's strengthens the lgbtq representation in the story. It's huge.
@@pinklefoo Lol. Read New Spring. They are both bisexual. Heterosexual people dont have gay sex and relationships with each other in boarding school. Experimentation? Sure probably very common, but full blown in love with other sex. Nah. Jordan knew what he was writing, didnt want controversy of having the gays in his books during the time when Harry Potter was getting burned as satanic book. Unless the people arent actual real people then you have to read between the lines a lot of things in the books. You cannot think 600 aes sedai are all asexual nuns just because Jordan didnt write all the freaky things the Aes Sedai do in the bedroom.
Did you notice how jerky the motion of the darkness from the dagger was compared how the corruption flows over male channeler weaves?
7:00 in the book. Mat is cursed for 2 whole books, and it takes a full circle of sisters (13) to remove the curse. They definitely sped it up and made it inconsequential in the show. But I can see why, no one would want sad, depressed , useless mat for 2 seasons.
Iirc Mat was healed in two steps in the books, first time by Moiraine, so they still have room to manouver in S2 about Mat’s arc
@@katarinawikholm5873 Yeah, in Caemlyn but she knew she had to bring him as soon as possible at Tar Valon to completely heal him. I guess they can use Barney's departure to expand on it despite what the initial plan may have been?
The name of the next episode is titled "the darkness among the ways"
Looking forward to how they portray one of my fave (spoiler not shown) from the books.
I read whispering the relevant quote to my show-only teen kids and watched them twitch. 😈
I am so curious to know what it is you speak of! I hope I will be able to guess. -Dr. S
The opening is the Waygate and the path is the Ways.
Thank you! I'll try to get it right lol - Dr. S
The Ways were built by male Aes Sedai during the breaking of the world after Saidin ( the male half of the source) was corrupted. I’ll leave out the reason why they were made to try to keep this comment brief. They were sunlit and beautiful “ways” to travel great distances in a short span of time...BUT... everything made with Saidin eventually falls into darkness. Get ready, it’s about to get interesting.
It is true, Mat was affected by the dagger. In the adaptation, we do not know yet whether he is fully healed nor whether he will try to pick up the dagger again. Twenty years past Morraine and Suane were pillow friends, but agreed to break contact in public because they both knew Suane will lead the Tower, and they couldn't continue to associate that way. Morraine knew certain details from the Karaethon Cycle + Gitara foretelling to begin searching towns and cities for the Dragon. Finally, the ways can be thought of as a underground system connecting points. They are portrayed differently here, but it remains to see if there will be any ramifications from the change.
Egwene is my favorite female character in the books. I love her ambition and determination! Nynaeve always irritated me, lol. But both actresses are nailing it in the show.
I felt the opposite. Egwene’s attitude continuously irked me and I wanted her given the smack-down she deserved. Where Nyneave’s grit and strength of character spoke to me.
@@katarinawikholm5873 Nynaeve is often very annoying but i actually always found it fun, like she completely lacks self awareness? - "I won't shout at you!" Nynaeve shouted - lmao But i love how loving and protective she actually is, her relationship with Rand is one of my favorites.
It was easy for Robert Jordan to suggest queer relationships but not make them canon. I think that you are a tad younger than I am, but you absolutely remember the norm of even the 90's, my heyday, when these books were written. I wish he was bolder and took some of the steps the show is making, in my head cannon I think he wanted to do that. He may be the origin of a well intentioned queer coding. That's why I love a lot of the changes to the show so far.
When I watched the pilot episode as a non-book reader I became about 90% sure Rand was the dragon. Because I watched so many shows in my life, I knew it had to be a male because so many women already had so much power in this world and the show needs to be balanced. I picked Rand because of how early we followed him and his hair color was just too unique. That is where I landed from ep 1. 🤷🏾♀️
Rumour has it that episode 7 (the next one) will reveal Rand's part to play in the story.
Between the mysterious background and being pretty much the leader figure of the group Rand smells of being the "hidden chosen one". Plus the name, the guy is literally called after a god. 😄
Morraine and Suian will do whatever they have to in order to stop the Shadow
Everyone of the 5 have interesting stories and are important. They've hinted at Rand's purpose and story as well. Go back and watch if you have time.
Will do - thank you!! -Tori :)
Episode 3 in the mining town Rand breaks down that really heavy steel reinforced wood plant door. The Darkfriend Bartender laughed at him and said 3 men bigger than Rand couldn't break it down, then Rand is all "Hold my ale!" The bartender was legit shocked and just kinda froze for a moment.
My favorite show-only watcher theory about Rand is that he is already bonded to Egwene though imperfectly, and has been going back to before Moraine ever set foot in the Two Rivers. Egwene didn't intend to or even know what bonding was, that they were being intimate and she was praying & wishing for Rand to always *be strong* and always find his way back to her if begin the drift apart. So her imperfect bond gave him "super strength" which is probably just huge boost of adrenaline in stressful situations.
Yes! The men are only given strength through the women! The writers really know their audience.
@@SeanHillaby They said it’s their friend’s theory. Nothing fundamental about Rand has been changed from the books.
The ways are an Escher drawing outside of time and space that you can use to travel more quickly from gate to gate than you could in reality
They sounds really cool! -Dr. S
I felt bad for little Siuan. Why isn't her father escorting her to the Tower?
Good question! Especially since the house appears to be destroyed. There must be a reason, like he’s not allowed 🤷🏻♀️. Thanks for watching our video!! -Dr. S
One of fave episodes, stoked for season 2 😎
He used Pillow Friends because of the time when the books were written. It wasn’t quite as cool to have lesbian/bi/gay relationships in literature at the time. But in the prequel it seems to hint at a close relationship.
Thank you! We appreciate the comment! I think it’s very clever how Jordan got around societal norms with this pillow friends concept! -Dr. S
Ways are a path outside the time and space ... but not a portal you still have to walk through it, except time moves differently inside of ways ... so let's say whilst inside the ways you walk towards the north for about an hour, but in real-world you have walked a whole month .... it's kind of like a wormhole used in Science fiction movies when a spaceship flies through it but cover much larger distance ...
So I'll say this....if you think about channeling and what's been revealed about it..the answer becomes obvious. Also you'll find out in the next episode! Watch and find out!
Aaahh, I’m so excited! Thank you! -Tori :)
The window frame portal in Moiraine's room is called a Ter'angreal. They are devices left over from the Age of Legends the use the one power for some type of function. There are many different types of Ter'angreal (Oath Rod is one). In this case, the function opens up a portal to somewhere. If you look in the background of Suian Sanche's room when she is talking to Egwene and Nynaeve, you can also see a matching window frame portal. Where the two frames open the portal to is up for debate in the fandom. This exact scene doesn't happen in the books. It could be a physical location somewhere in the world, or it could be a location in an area called Tel’aran’rhiod. I won't get into details about that as it hasn't been introduced officially in the TV series yet.
As for devices that are associated with the power, there are also things called Angreal and Sa'angreal. These increase the amount of power a channeler can use. We see an Angreal briefly shown in the very first scene of the series when Moiraine is getting dressed. It is a little statuette that she wraps up. We haven't seen her use it directly yet. A Sa'angreal is much more powerful and rare than Angreal.
In the books, it was not so easy to cure Mat from the dagger as shown in the show. There was a great deal to it and occurred later in the series. They may revisit this later but hard to tell how they are going to redo Mat's part with the recasting. The fandom is wondering how this will proceed going forward as well.
The Ways were originally crafted by male Aes Sedai for Ogier to travel. Over time, it became corrupted because of the same taint that corrupts Saidin (male half of the power). The signposts in the ways are written in the Ogier language and so helps to have an Ogier guide. In the books, the ways didn't require channeling. Instead, there was a carved Avendorsa leaf that you use to open. This was subtly hinted to in the weaves that Moiraine uses to open the gate as they make a similar trefoil leaf shape. This change of using the power to open the ways has the fandom in an uproar as it has lots of consequences to some things in the series that have happened (off screen) and have yet to happen. Fans are wondering how this will play out.
Btw, I really like the way you have chosen to cover your reactions.
Thank you!! That means a lot! -Tori :)
As for the "place" where Suan and Moiraine meet, there are a few theories about this, especially since it didn't happen in the books. I looks like her home inn Tear when she was a girl, but that was destroyed in the fire. (No spoilers please for Tori and Dr S....I've read the books so I have my theories)
Well, book readers should figure it out because of the fast costume changes.
@@Ailthas There’s no fast costume change. Moiraine arrives as she was dressed in her room and after they have sex they each have another “costume”. The extras on the Prime site say that they are using a pair of ter’angreal that opens a Gateway to a secluded hut located in Tear.
what you saw on the show was called a waygate, the ways are inside, in the books the waygates are very different, they have actual doors that anyone can open, they do not require magic to open
Thank you!! -Tori :)
Loved Tori's face when the black ooze was coming out of Mat's face LOL. To answer Dr S' question of who says "I'm bad": Michael Jackson, DUH! Great insights on the Siuan/Egwene/Nynaeve scene from both of you. Oh, and the Ways was not based on the navigation app Waze just FYI. Keep up the good work!
Lol, I love this comment! Thank you so much! -Tori :)
Moiraine cured Mat's connection to the dagger, but not all of his physical illness. In the books there is more focus on Mat's physical illness as opposed to his mental illness.
Oooh ok, thank you!! -Tori :)
it took several sister and some time to finally cure him.
"Moiraine cured Mat's connection to the dagger, but not all of his physical illness" might be so, but nothing in the show made that clear. Although Moiraine didn't cure the connection in the books, she only stemmed the darkness from consuming Mat.
Yes, this was very quick when compared to the books. Much of Book two is related to Matt and the dagger.
You guys have been surprisingly insightful about certain things to come. And I find myself actually enjoying these kind of episode reactions you’re doing here. I hope they increase the number of episodes to at least 10 per season. Would feel less rushed in certain scenes. Over all a great episode. Very sad about the actor Barney. No one pulls such a stunt just for the heck of it. I’m sure there must have been a legit reason. Hopefully everything’s ok with him and his family.
It's not obvious in the show who the Dragon is. It's only obvious to viewers who are already aware of the central themes and where the narrative is headed (and if you know in which way the story is classical and in which ways it's really not).
Your comment is great. It clarifies nothing and everything. I am not entirely sure if anyone can know who the DR is at this point lol. But I love that. -Dr. S
The way's are the pathways between two portals.
In-book it took two healings. One Moiraine only and off-screen while they were in Caemlyn, and a rather more complicated one with a circle of multiple Aes Sedai when the Amyrlin has hunted Moiraine down to ask her some tough questions about what she's been doing with the Dragon at the start of Book 2. Not sure exactly what they were planning, but would not be surprised if it fell victim to the actor change. Maybe Mat'll re-appear in the plot, re-connected to the dagger, next year and need healing again...
My impression reading the books is that being pillow friends is normal, happening naturally early on as Novices and Accepted as they are too busy learning to get involved with men. They kind of only had each other. That and they could spend years advancing. And there aren't available men in the white tower. That and not being at a high enough level to have Warders. Many would put off the pillow friends relationships when they became full Aes Sadie and got Warders. Some lost there pillow friends when they chose their color. And some kept their pillow friends. No big deal is made about it one why or the other. It's kind of a theme and variations, without expectations or judgment. It just was.
Thank you for this explanation! We really appreciate it! -Dr. S
That Aes Sedai novices and accepted would be temporary pillow friends is perfectly reasonable. It happens in college all the time. They become LUG's (lesbians until graduation). Jordan's sex scenes were rare in the books, probably because they rarely mattered. I know he didn't insinuate that Warders who shared an Aes Sedai were gay, though -- that's something the writers of the series threw in. Rafe said that the series would be "updated" and LGBT friendly, and it certainly is.
I don't see this question answered- "what is that thing on the wall that she walks though?"
This exact device isn't in the book but it's clearly what they call a Ter'angreal. A magical artifact from the Age of Legends that has a specific purpose (there are others that don't have a specific purpose). Some need channeling to work, some do not. So this one takes a weave of the one power and opens a magical doorway to a specific place. You can see that the picture is of the Amyrlin's quarters. When Egwene and Nynaeve meet Siuan you can see another identical Ter'angreal on the wall with a picture of her hut in Tear. Siuan probably went to Siuan's quarters and from there through Siuan's Ter'angreal to the hut in Tear.
There are many Ter'angreal in the world and the function of many has been lost to the current generation of Aes Sedai. They even have a storeroom full of unknown Ter'angreal. The making of Ter'angreal is a lost art though some Aes Sedai can have an intuitive but very vague idea of what an individual Ter'angreal does. They are considered very dangerous to experiment with.
I have no idea what happens with these two gateway Ter'angreal later on but I can tell you that having one in the world leading to your sleeping chambers is exceedingly dangerous! It shows how naive everybody is at this point in the story.
Are we going to get to hear what Mr. Dr. S and Brother 2 think about the show?
Yes! My other brother, who also read the books, said he is totally down to do a round-table discussion after the season 1 finale, but Mr. Dr. S is a little shy and we are still trying to convince. -Tori :)
What “fans” are telling you the Dragon can’t be a woman? The show explicitly states otherwise. They are not fans but dark friends who simply can’t reconcile that this show is an “adaptation” and not a one to one mirror image of the book series. If they were true fans they’d understand the importance of allowing you two to experience and enjoy the story for yourselves; knowing that piqued interest will eventually lead you to reading the books, if you are so inclined.
This!
Well said.
Thank you, luckily there have already been enough changes (adaptations) that I believe anything can happen! I’m trying to avoid spoilers in comments, but if I accidentally read something, I’ll keep in mind that even book fans don’t know exactly how things will play out. Thanks so much for your comment! I hope we will all enjoy where the show takes us together and that book fans continue to add depth to non book readers’ understanding. Your comments about backstory not included in the tv show is so interesting! -Dr. S
I will not at all comment on your guesses/commentary concerning the identity of the Dragon Reborn. You may be right, wrong but close, or totally off the mark. My lips are sealed. I hint nothing.
And I thank you for this!! -Tori :)
I you want to know... Morriane isn't just a good one, she's among one of the best ones.
I love that - thank you! -Tori :)
In the books, it was much more of an ordeal to separate Mat from the dagger. Moiraine was able to restore Mat a bit, but to break the link it took several powerful sisters linked to accomplish this.
☯️ yin is the female symbol yang is the male symbol. Jordan heavily borrowed from Asian cultures, symbolism, and myth. But he didn't always understand what he was using or how the native culture view it. There's a lot of actual gender nuance that he missed.
Pillow friends is the term he used because he couldn't call them bisexual or Lesbian in the books when he started writing them in the 90s. There are several queer (male and female) character's.
As for myself I personally read every character in every book, show, movie, as bi unless explicitly stated otherwise.
Great video!
Thank you so much! -Tori :)
The structure for entering the ways is called a waygate… (although it looks and operates totally different in the books lol)
In the books siuan and mo we ere very intimate. In 1990 the book wouldn't have been published with openly gay characters so it was all coded but Robert Jordan said in am interview back in the day that fully one third to one half of the tower women were bisexual or gray which tracked with the data at the time
Don’t listen to the comments on who is the dragon reborn and if it can be a man or a woman. The show is soooo different, I read the books and I don’t know.
Yea, Dr. S nailed it on The Ways. There are many Waygates, and you can navigate to any of them.
The Moiraine and Siuan romance was hinted at, but we didn’t get scenes like that! We are here for it! They are only keeping it a secret because The Amyrlin isn’t supposed to have favorites and being in a relationship would definitely be considered favoritism. That’s why they’ve “always broke the rules.” We partly, they were also pranksters while they were in training at The White Tower.
My husband also told me not to listen to the comments about who the dragon reborn is. I think it was stated in the opening scene of ep 1 and restated in ep 6 clearly that they don’t know who it is, what form it will take. I think all the changes that have been made have set the stage for book readers to have surprises, and I think that’s pretty amazing that they’re pulling it off, and that most books are good with it! Waygates seem pretty cool! Thanks for your comment! -Dr. S
"Is she dreaming?" .... Maybe? Don't want to spoil anything, not sure what show will do, but maybe.
Moraine and Suian entered the Tower the same time and they were both Accepted together. The book does describe them as Pillow friends but when I read it in the 90's I assumed they were lovers.. This world uses Sangreal and Tangreal items that enhance a users use of the one Power. The Picture Moraine used to enter Suian's bedroom was a Sangreal object. each Tangreal and sangreal have unique and specific powers.
The funniest thing is Egwene probably is also the most powerful channeler they've seen in 1000 years. Just Nynaeve is even more so.
Whoa 🤯-Dr. S
I read somewhere about Jordan's interview that he meant pillow friends are more than friends and they have kind of relationship together..
Yes, that seems to be what people are saying! I think that is pretty cool! -Dr. S
Now you know Moraine and Siuan were performing, and I am a book reader and I was telling at the screen What's HAPPENING??? Because they really scared me anyway that Morgaine was in deep trouble. Good job actors!
That makes me so happy to hear that the adaptations are getting you engaged as a nonbook reader! I honestly feel that 1) tv adaptation cannot make a reader happy if they expect 1-1 correspondence; 2) the changes are a reward for book readers, as opposed to a negative. You get to enjoy on two levels, discovering new material and being able to compare to the books. I think if the unhappy book fans were more open to this level of enjoyment, they would be able to appreciate the TV show without being so protective of the books (to which no harm is being done, lol). Anyways, we appreciate all your comments! Thanks so much for watching our reviews! -Dr. S
I also felt Egwene didn't know Nyneave could channel at all and that was some of her surprise. They haven't really had a chance to catch up yet. " The Ways" are inside and the structure a "Waygate" though the adaptation changed a lot of how they work and look. Also pillow friends when they were younger was code for a female-female relationship which was common among girls training to be Aes Sedai. That being said I'm not sure that the relationship didn't continue as Moirane and Siuan remained confidants and friends and we don't get to see their POV in the books much so not seeing the relationship doesn't mean it didn't exist, at least at the beginning of the story.
Oh yeah, I see what you mean about Egwene not knowing about Nyneave’s channeling. Thank you for taking the time to explain all of this! -Tori :)
That whole move into Siuans room in a just a show thing. At least I don't remember that.
They are not like the White Cloaks! Siuan and Moraine are good, but they are not always right. We don't yet know Egwene's powers so it's not just Rand we have to learn more about. Keep that in mind.
I am very excited to learn more about Egwene, and especially Rang now too! We definitely know the least about him at this point in the tv show! -Dr. S
Idk if it’s been too obvious, who the Dragon is. I’ve read the books, it’s obvious in the books.
Hmmm, then maybe I put too much thought on the “too obvious” comments. -Tori :)
Definitely obvious in the books. I think that the show is much more subtle. I am not sure that I could have pieced it together.
@@curtiswfranks i feel their need to make the dragon a mystery has lead to the min characters not getting the development they need.
(Arguably spoilery hints. Spoilers about characters who survive for at least a few books. Maybe also spoilers about PoVs)
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@@gabnel1000: The show has developed some of them more than the books did, I think. Mat readily comes to mind, especially if we consider the fact that Mat acquires the dagger by the end of the second episode (unlike the hundreds of pages prior to that point in the books). Rand too has demonstrated some personality traits that do not become apparent in him until TSR. The characterizations of Nynaeve, Perrin, and Egwene are just different in subtle ways. Notice the characters from whom we receive an internal monologue up to this point in the first book too. Background characters (Liandrin, Alanna, and Valda come to mind) receive a lot more attention in the show than in even the first three books combined.
I will say that we have spent a lot of time with the Aes Sedai in the show. Moirine is definitely taking center stage. And that means that we have less time with the others, and thus less time to work in hints about which of them (if any) are the DR. So, your opinion is not unfounded. But I do think that it is a little incomplete.
Mat didn't go through the ways I don't think, even in the books. He was sick in the tower after 9 sisters healed him of the dagger attachment. That's how I remember it.
He did go in the Ways. Moiraine partially healed him in Caemlyn but he wasn't completely healed until book 3 in Tar Valon.
Hmmm. Good theory about Rand.
In the books the dragon is always a male channeler but the show canon is different in that a women can be the dragon, as long as she can channel. The issue with Nyneave is her age. Mat is out due to him not going with the group through the ways. Perrin hasn’t shown to be able to channel and his wolf powers are separate from channeling. We know Egwene can channel so she is still a candidate for the dragon. Rand hasn’t been seen channeling per say but remember he busted down that door in episode 3 which might have been channeling. So without spoiling the books I’d say it’s between Egwene and Rand, unless they go with the multi-headed “power rangers” dragon idea.
Thank you! I got the sense from this episode that all 5 are still in play…at least in the show version! So yeah my vote is for the “power ranger” (well my cultural reference is the “Voltron”) model! I’m kind of excited that it’s up in the air whether DR will be same as or different from books! Now we all (book readers and non book readers alike) get to play and guess! Thanks for your comments! Dr. S
Another thing: in the books a Waygate is opened my moving a stone leaf by hand. Ogier don't use the One Power. So if the One Power was the only way to open a Waygate then it would be useless to the Ogier for whom they were created. Not sure why they changed it but it seems odd to me.
An interesting fact is that strength in the One Power delineates hierarchy. A weaker Sister with Saidar has to defer to a stronger Sister. Even if the weaker Sister has been Aes Sedai for 100 years she defers to the stronger, even if she's only been raised to Aes Sedai for a few years.
10:40 narrative on Padan Fain - Foreshadowing.
My daughter introduced me to the series. And, I don’t think we both had a clue what pillow friends were right away. Robert Jordan either made the term up or it was somewhere in history. I think some where in future books I learned that this was intimacy. The sex Robert put in was a part of the story not for just any occurrence
Thank you!! I love that your daughter introduced you to the series. How great it must be to enjoy reading the same books and watching the same shows as your kids! Mine are currently in elementary school, but I hope one day we will be enjoying the same books too! -Dr. S
Just to reiterate on the pillow friends thing, its not really a change as much as an expansion :) pillow friends was basically a coded way of saying lesbian, or at the least experimenting, but siuan and moiraine were always exceptionally close (they do kiss at one point, and know everything about one another)
I don't know about other comments, but I would note that it is really obvious who the dragon is *in the books*. The show is specifically changing things on that.
Of course, I would say this regardless of whether your pick was correct, just to generate a smidgen of doubt :P
You two should watch and react to the animated shorts for wheel of time. They're fantastic ways to understand the world better.