DUCATI Engine Comparison 999S + '06 WSBK
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- Опубліковано 4 жов 2024
- In this episode we deep dive into a World Super Bike engine from 2006 and compare it to a road going 999S.
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If Andy is willing to pin this post on the top.. I do regular live streaming on my Facebook account ( personal one not the shop) when I am working. This way people who are interested could have a look over my shoulders and even ask questions in the comments section, the material I do and information I share there are very different to what Andy is sharing on his channel that I send him. He will share the content that is mostly much more detailed and usually on a certain topic requested by you the viewers . My stream is more like a shop chat thing and just follows me when I am working and is not detailed in depth coverage.
Thats legendary. Thanks Toine!!
Toine you are a legend...please move to Melbourne Australia. We need you to restore my factory race bikes. Andy keep this Biggelaar collab going its brilliant. Will subscribe to your patron thingy.
Nuts.
Those cams!
And lobe profile!
Pardon my French but i've never seen anything fucking like it!
The lightened and balanced crank is unreal. Nothing there!
Absolutely fascinating.
Brilliant, thank you.
Nuts.
I don't know if it's interesting enough to make a video of it, but Toine is a real fan of the Ducati ST3 engine. He even built several racers with this type of engine, maybe he can tell us what is so special about this type of engine.
In any case, I’am very happy with my big-bore ST3 engine that Toine built for me 💪🏼 Cheers
I love the way it's spread out over the bench, it's scary and exciting all at the same time!
Toine and Andy have come together, worth sharing, you can tell he really knows his business, a little nervous however he really got into the groove and made a no BS video, congratulations to both of you.
Great info!!! Thank you for taking the time.
I had a few Ducati's and still ride my M900 and '06 999 regularly.
I never understand the 999 haters. That era gave us some of the best WSBK races.
Absolutely fantastic , my brain speed is maybe one quarter of toine, I can see me rewatching this over and over again !! Thank you and thank him , it's just so interesting , honestly mind blowing stuff to me .
What could be interesting as well is some off the history of Biggelaar and Ducati. How did they get involved with Ducati. Some technical stuff about the development of the mechanical and electrical parts of Ducati.
If there is enough interest I would gladly do that topic.. but dont want to force it on to viewers.
@@toinevandenbiggelaar6083 I doubt force would be necessary no matter what topic you choose to do on any part of these Ducatis, just about anything from the design, manufacture, durability etc of any part of these bikes, i.e. wheels, frame, forks, brakes swingarm, etc. newer and earlier models even going back to the bevel drives (I believe the real Ducati's and the most beautiful pieces of art to look at and ride especially the round case V-Twins) though I know you appear to concentrate on race and performance. Anything Ducati will always draw great interest.
Great stuff ! not all days you can get inside a performance shop and see this things shown and explained , thanks Toine & Andy,, cheers!!
Thanks Toine & Andy 👍🏼
These guys have modified my 999 2005 with new race pistons, adjusted the ECU and tuned the bike a couple year ago. It’s been running great ever since! Greetings from the Netherlands.
i like to see the insides of things, nice upload from you both! many thanks.
Thanks so much for this, it's not every day you see inside a top line factory engine with their crazy cam timing 😱. I would love to see some basic stage one porting for the old 748-916-996 cylinder head. Nothing too drastic.
Excellent video, I have learned a lot. Toine certainly knows his stuff and I look forward to seeing more of him, many thanks to you both
But really bloody cool that you are doing this Toine and Andy!! Great footage to watch!!
wow what a fantastic vid. i had no idea about refresh costs or service intervals. the japanese factories would never had done this in modern times. possibly in the 60s they would but not now. the passion ducati have for racing is incredible. looking forward to more of these vids
Great video Andy, thanks for that mate! And Thank you to Toine for showing us all this information 🙌🙌
Thanks for this upload I love Ducati and Aprilia
This is class. Very interesting. Love this stuff . Thanks for making
😁 Thoroughly enjoyed watching this Andy , I've always wanted to know the difference between road and race engines...now I know ...Toine done a awesome job
Thank you for the Great Insight into the world of Race vs Road !!
Much appreciated :) !!
Nice to hear him talk about the dramatic drop in mileage due to increasing revs . I discovered very early on that you can make the titanium valves in a motorcross bike last twice as long by just not using the last 500 rpm before the rev limiter. That 500rpm will double your engine life ( and probably the 500 after that will double that as well - and remember that’s still past the peak torque rpm )
Brilliant content guys 👍 I reckon Toine's brain works at 14,000 revs plus ! A very knowledgeable guy with true race passion ... an 1155cc twin with 208 hp at the wheel !!
This was really interesting. I always wanted to see a comparison like this one. Really good
Interesting!! Wow. 188hp vs 137hp is a big difference!
Very informative.Thats some horsepower out of a 15 year old lump,though Im glad I dont have to pay the service bill!All the best.
Pure gold and knowledge, thanks 🙂
That was pure gold Andy & Toine! That cam profile and service manual info 😲🤓
You have even convinced me I need the clutch mod too lol.
Your sub count just went up by 1 👇 😁
Thanks you pair of legends that was truly informative ♥️
Really interesting stuff, would like too see the engines going back together.
Great information about the component life its why the inherently simpler two stroke make so much sense as a race engine .
Andy/Toine ..... Excellent presentation, well done. Could be of interest if possible showing the tools used (including the special tools) involved in rebuild etc ..... again thanks 👍👍👍
Hey Toine thank you for the video! And thank you Andy again. Cheers mates!
Great explanation. Really enjoyed that. Would be interested in understand the weight differences between assembled road/race engine.
Just love to se the work of Mr Biggelaar. And thanks to Toine for share his knowledge, and spend the time to line up and explain us humans😁 an engine this rare. Looking forward to seeing another video of this kind.
Absolutely fantastic and thanks to both of you.
Nicely done guys. I'd like to see more on the transmission, once the cases are apart the removal and breakdown of the gears sets, shifter drum and forks and how to check for problems/ tolerances.... AND reinstall, ready for the critical case realignment surgery 😀👍👊
Great Video Andy & Toine. Loved it.
Cheers fellas, nice to watch a collaboration that isn't shit. Properly interesting video.
Thank you Toine, and thank you Andy!
good grief , that workshop is amazing.
Really good Video and it drove home the difference between a "Road Bike" and a "Race Bike"..CUBIC DOLLARS!!!
bloody fantastic Bro top vid well done to you both great effort
Amazing just amazing. I have 43k on my 08 GT 1,000 so far so good.
Fascinating topic.
Thanks.
Fascinating to watch lol didn't understand a word of it , apart from its bloody expensive to maintain a race engine for sure . Great insight though keep them coming. Lol loved the dig at Dell blocks though brilliant
Now I am worried about my 749r...as the previous owner terrorized western sydney roads treating them like a Government funded racetrack...it says low kms on the odo,but the RPM factor may be high 😆
Thanks Andy and Toine..informative and a credit to Biggelar performance...he is a true "Bevel Head"..thanks guys,seriously great stuff
Great presentation.
Amazing/enlightening thank you, 👍
Awesome Andy you making me drool. Lol great vedio. Mate. Tony
Fantastic, informative video. Thanks
Can you make an episode about the DUCATI SUPERMONO, the history and the engine tec.
Be interesting to just film Toine on an average day for him, what he is working on etc and some explanation along the way
Then you need to check my Facebook page regularly as I do live streams regularly since shortly.. its usually in the evening my time and most are afterwards available to look when it suits you best ..
Regularly mixing up the comparison, starting with the 999s and then the 999r (the homologation special, essentially a different bike, with different frame, engine, etc).
Comparison between the 999s and the 999 f is irrelevant, the 999s shares more with the 996r/998, the 998r and 999r have more in common with the 999 factory bikes.
they have similarities, but nothing is the same.
A look at some of his performance bikes he has built. Anything Ducati Andy boom boom
Thank you verry much !
Given the effort involved in creating content, I think T should film stuff he has to do in the workshop anyway.
I’m sure it will all be interesting - and I’m not even a Duc-Nut!
See my other post Haha Andy is my UA-cam man and here we make detailed coverage of certain topics . On my Facebook page I do regularly live streaming when I work on a interesting subject without to much explanation or detailed coverage
Thx andy.facinating vid.
The engine is the same price has a top fuel dragster that makes 11000hp.
Maybe more with rebuilds . Just less rebuilds.
Lovely
Please do a full desmo service on a 2 valve, thanks
Interesting stuff 👍🏻
Fantastic!
Great stuff.. Toine is a great guy.
Amazing video…!!!
How many horse power had the 999rs …
An ex owner of 999s
The best bike ever made ….!!!
Could we please see more from BIGGELAAR ? for example I would like to know what type of maintenance I need to do to my panigale if I only use it on track days. how often and what to do on it. Thanks
Jeez, becoming more and more reluctant to race my freshly rebuilt 748RS. Should probably just frame it and stick it on the wall of my workshop. Any buyers?...
Just don't get the rev limiter to high and your good, 748RS in full race mode was around 12.8 k I think just limit it at around 11.8 and it will last if build correctly 😇
awesome.
The motors i build are big pushrod twins, i'm scared they go bang @ 8000rpm, 7k and i'm actually feeling apologetic to my rods....
Could you tell me how much horsepower gain an Aprilla would make with just head work?
Nice one Andy 😳👍
Andy / Toine can you make a video in Tamburini series?
Which oil viscosity and brand do you suggest for Ducati engine?
15W50 Motul 300V is what we use
Gooday mate, Thanks for posting a video, came here to get away from all the covid bull. Time for some normality.
Really interesting stuff. Kinda scary when you said “If Ducati built it properly”
I just listen eeee !
Very interesting stuff! How about a video on headwork, flowing etc
That is something for the near future, it will be on my Facebook stream probably next week but not with in depth information or explanation
I like 999 ,, but the 916 ... I've always liked it, but now the new ones .. I don't like them ,,
I made the mistake of my life, buying a fat and slow Harley when I could have bought a 916 which is the one I have always liked, I have always had Suzukis and Kawasaki .. and when I bought the fat Harley, I bought myself more years spirit
and now I want to sell it, it was already devalued ,,
Cam belt tension on 2 valve Ducati engine. Not using Hz!
5mm allankey between fixed roller and belt that must go trough it with a bit of force
This is a video of me fitting the belts on my 900 ua-cam.com/video/mq4l2Yr9egM/v-deo.html
@@ANDY5 Thanks Andy.
I have a 2005 999S and a deep sump sand cast engine cased 998S and the 998 feels stronger
👍👍👍
Just wondering, and knowing that they are unubtianium.
Any Super-monos in his shop. Has he had any experiences, racing or otherwise with them ?
We have build own even before Ducati did, 1985 my dad build the first belt based supermono with horizontal cylinder . I have a engine I build 3 years ago to make a project wich for sure is way more powerful then the original one, and have rest 4 homemade versions
And my business companion has a original one, he also owns the 1993 888 corse championship winning bike from Fogarty and he has the 1998 BSB 996RS Bayliss championship bike in his living room
@@toinevandenbiggelaar6083 videos on those singles including your dad's engines would be very interesting.
What can I say Wahhhhhhhhooo
Interesting, but my god, did he really need to clank all those parts together like that? And when he rested the camshafts on the seats I became almost homicidal! WTF is he playing at? I take more care with a Honda 125 rebuild. But these are top performance engines!
No more of this careless one handed nonsense please.
You mean the way I handled these parts that are mostly over there usable limit in millage or need to be restored before they could ever be used again ? like the heads that would new valve seats before you could use them again ? and also the valve seats that endure a beating at 14000 rpm of a 44 MM valve banging in to it with incredible forces ? is that what you mean, the clanking etc that these parts now endured by me touching them ? these parts that where designed to withstand stress and forces we can hardly wrap our heads around how much that is, I think that is what you mean ? Sarcastic mode off, The heads are a set of similar ones as the Bayliss ones wich are fully assembled in my RS and Factory vault, similar to the cylinders and pistons, the Rods both road and the Factory ones need to be crack checked and refurbished at both small and biggend side on size and roundness and the small end site need to be fitted with new bushes also, the valves are officially over there running time, but as those also did not come from the Bayliss engine but out of a stock of used parts I bought that had parts that could be used again but also parts that where probally not wise to use them again. Did you really think I would strip 2 engines just to make a video for you and others to watch ? while I have a used parts inventory wich is so big I could build maybe 50 engine`s and even 10 Factory or RS engines just from the parts ? instead of enjoying and appreciating the time and effort Andy and me put in to this to share information and things with his viewers you seem to have a little tendency to comment in a negative manner like your response on the cost of the 900 SS rebuild . Wich is also your right to do as its a public platform to respond as you like dont get me wrong sir, but this tells me also a bit about you . No hard feelings I am not easy offended specially when I know more about how this video was made and what I used, so in my eyes your response was based on incomplete information ..Maybe next time first try to get the full details before you form your opinion ? anyway no hard feelings and I hope you will enjoy our next False Neutral topic . best regards Toine aka Crashingbiggel that guy strangely enough that guy that builds Factory engines and even did GP engines for collectors etc all over the world .. must be my good looks then they come for
Yep, it’s your good looks for sure bro, but also your great sense of humour. ;))
Okay, perhaps I didn’t have sufficient information about your project and the sources of the parts you used. But no I didn’t imagine you’d stripped the engines just for our benefit or your ego either. We have Matt at the workshop for that.
However, we all have insufficient information about most things don’t we? Currently we are all sheltering in place because we’ve been told that there’s a deadly virus trying to kill us...! But unless we are virologists, perhaps we are easily duped by the powers that shouldn’t be and the their propaganda department: the mainstream media. But I digress.
My background is in experimental aero engineering, and I own and work on all my 12 bikes, so not only can I imagine the forces involved, I’m also aware of the origins of most mechanical failures under great stress. They are often those (mostly invisible to the naked eye) blemishes to the surfaces of machined parts, caused by impact by the sharp edges of other, hard steel parts.
If you bump up a sharp edge against the smooth shaft of a machined component, with no more force than the weight of either component dropped just 50mm, that sharp edge WILL cause damage which is visible through a microscope. If that component is then subjected to destructive testing, the likelihood that it will fail is increased exponentially, and such failure is most likely to occur at the point of impact.
One of the most common causes of component failure not ascribed to impact damage, is the use of cutting tools with too sharp a radius on the leading edge. Most companies subcontract the manufacture of their components. The subcontractor is looking to make the most out of the deal which he’s won via competitive tendering. Therefore he will use the fastest cutting methods in order to reduce his costs in machining and operator man hours. The smaller the radius on the leading edge of the tool, the less friction, and therefore the less heat and in turn the most efficient cutting process. But also, the smaller the radius on the leading edge of the tool, the rougher the machined surface. These are also potential fail points of components under stress.
For all these reasons, I am intimately aware of the inherent risks of even getting into the habit of allowing components to clang together. Hence my comment. I’m literally allergic to the sound of machined metal components coming together in any fashion other than the gods of internal combustion intended.
I used to be popular for my looks too. But now I’m mostly admired for my great wisdom ;)
Peace
@@G58 no worries m8 and glad you liked my sence of humor, I am aware of most things related to my beloved brand, I dont have a degree in engineering but I have 30 years of hands on experience under my belt with Ducati. And my love and interest in for the brand and my twisted mind to create things that are sometimes deemed impossible by others have brought me where I am now, I will not claim that I am the best in the world far from it, but as it seems there are not a lot of people with my experience that take the time and effort to share this with other Ducati lunatics. Also I am not easily offend or buthurt when I get criticism as this could also be a learning moment for me as I learn new things every day . But it seems I am doing some things right as more and more people find there way to my shop for these kind of special projects and restorations for these unique engines. Also my interest for the mechanical side keeps me willing and motivated to keep on learning and gathering knowledge to get a little bit better and smarter every day .. cheers
Toine van den biggelaar Thank you. Great response. I’ve watched the rest of your vid now, so I’m up to speed on your experience. Huge respect mate. The numbers alone are enough to tell me you’re a bit special. I’ve always been interested in Ducati bikes, ever since I saw my first 250 Desmo, just stunningly beautiful. I’d like to own a 450 Desmo just for Keira Knightly to come around and sit on... clothes optional ;)
My main interests are in Hondas, Bultaco trials, and BMW’s Rotax engined bikes.
I’m currently researching a dual sport custom based upon a 1998 CCM Dakar entry (traditional chrome molly frame) with a mildly tuned water cooled BMW F650 Dakar engine, but converted to single Mikuni carb for maximum simplicity and tuneability without electronics. This is the sort of bike that’s impossible to buy today.
Getting the tank (probably off a Yamaha Tenere) back where it belongs will improve the balance. 21” front wheel will improve off road efficiency.
The effects of my bike smashes when I was much younger have left me with spinal issues. So what I want is a lightweight 650 with decent range and respectable off road ability. I can still pick up any bike I might drop, but all adventure bikes today are far heavier than they need to be IMO. I’m not really impressed by the Himalayan power to weight ratio, even though it’s very cheap.
Thank you again for sharing your experience here. I will probably watch again to process the awesome data dump you imparted. That bit about the piston crowns going soft really alarmed me. And I’m struggling to figure out why they use such thin bearing shells. Is being Italian sufficient explanation?
Ride safe
@@G58 the shells in the Corse engines are already much thicker then road ones, compared to say Japanese bikes even the road Ducati engines are at the top range of thickness. Also the Corse types are different in material compared to road ones, we have found a alternative shell for the road generation which are similar to the Corse types in materials and then are officially designed for 4 cylinder 2 liter car engine in stage 2 turbo tune that reach around 500 HP .. the crow deformation is to be expected with a compression ratio from 15,7 to 1 for a gasoline engine.. its close to early generation diesel compression values haha 😄
😍😍😍😍
you are dragging that camshaft all over the beryllium bronze valve seats ! = what the F--- !
The factory parts shown are parts over there service/replace intervals, if these parts would ever be used again it would take a fortune to get them back to working spec .. basically its scrap metal in the condition they are now .. remember before making assumptions better know the full details..
Why does he keep banging everything.
P.S UA-cam adds are ruining UA-cam...greedy greed.
he didnt mention the massive handling improvement that light crankshaft gives due to less gyroscopic effect