but... no, really. what if Tiana was white...?
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- Опубліковано 13 тра 2024
- #claireimitatingart #disney #theprincessandthefrog #princesstiana #whitetiana
I got a copyright claim so watch while you can!
Tiana is supposed to be a Black American woman and... she's not. Without her skin color distracting you, you can now see how she's culturally blank.
Thanks for watching!
End all wars.
End all genocides.
New York Post has a quick rundown of the Red Summer:
• Elaine Massacre: The b...
This mainly highlights one of many massacres that happened that summer. - Фільми й анімація
Honestly, I don't think every character in every movie should be heavily influenced by their culture. Tiana's main motivation is her father and dreams of owning a restaurant and doing what she loves. While yes, in the times the movie portrays IN REAL LIFE there were many major issues and a lot of racism, but REAL LIFE doesn't have talking frogs and aligators playing trumpet. I think sometimes, characters can just be of other race while not making it a major part of their personality or motives. While representing certain cultures and problems they face is beautiful and inportant, I dont think it HAS to be represented for the representation of said race/gender/whatever else to be valid. Sometimes, character can just be black, aisan or white. Plus, its a movie, an animated one at that, and it has limited time and resources to present its story, so sometimes not everything makes the cut. As a white girl, european, I always loved Tiana, and she was just another aspirational, hard working, beautiful princess to me. I loved the movie, the songs and the story, and for a country with very few black people seeing representation as just existing as any normal human being was a positive expirience for little me and it then encouraged me to research black culture and in later, older years, also the issues it faced.
Did you forget the part with Tiana at the end tries to buy way and she has enough money for the restaurant but the two men refuse her away? That wasn’t because of racism?
EXACTLY! They literally said 'a woman of her background' couldn't handle the restaurant. Implying that they think a black woman can't handle owning a buisness.
@@chlorine5818 I remember those words, clear as day, as well. Although they likely still microaggressed her over her gender when she urged them to reconsider selling the place to a higher bidder.
@@chlorine5818which of crazy because I could’ve sworn they called her the n-word
Disney needs to stop the Live action all together. I'm not fan of neither white washing and black washing. Give us original Afroamerican, latina, asian princesses.
tiana is poor because she works at a restrurant, until she met naveen a prince who was from a place called maldona and i won't change her race from black to white i like her like that.
i love her being different.
It's to make a point about her not having any culture.
Thanks for watching!
@@claireimitatingart oh ok thanks for replying.
i don't really get the point of this video? you didn't explain your points very well. i didn't understand why you turned tiana white or what your commentary was supposed to be. also you kinda went off topic and started making fun of the movie which is a bit silly coz it's a kids film lol
I agree except for the “it’s a kids film” because just because something is a kids movie doesn’t mean it’s not allowed to have any criticism, if it were something like peppa pig then yeah it’d be pretty silly to start harshly criticising it but the movie seems to be more of a family movie rather than a kids movie
I think some of the points were perhaps a bit unfair. Her criticising Tiana and Naveen for going to Ray's funeral, for example, her logic being that since they only met him three days ago, his death shouldn't matter to them.Yet in many other shows, characters bond over the course of only a few days, and are willing to give up important things and even risk death for each others' sakes.
Yep, I agree. I'm really trying to wrap my head around this video. To understand why chiana really had to be white and her point, just keeps going off and on topic and I just can't really understand what's going on
She's just hating
Huh?? That made no sense. I would've understood your point if you said that Princess and the frog is a german fairytale and thus they should be white and it should be set in Germany because that makes sense but what you said is just.... Unnecessary.
Im only 8 minutes in but i think Tiana wanted to provide jobs for people in her community. She probably would've paid them well. Idk that just what i assume.
Honestly, this video just makes no sense to me because in the time period and I understand that they're trying Explain how Different race can come together in harmony. But there's still a different social class from different race. Honestly, changing tianana's race will be ridiculous. Yes, she was a frog 90% of the movie, but it's the fact that when The Times we did see how it made sense why she was black. Honestly, your point in this video just kept going on and off. And I just can't wrap my Hand around it. Or maybe it's because if they decide to make a live action princes in a frog, they might cast a white person to play tianana, and that actually would be ridiculous😂😂😂
Actively implying that being quote un-quote ghetto is a part of African American culture and being tilted that a corporate driven children's movie company isn't reflecting that is incredibly petty and quite rude. Not every African American has to be ghetto or impoverished to be African American. Some people may seem "culturally blank" depending on how, where and when they were brought up. Everyone is different as life is a massive spectrum. Don't marginalize an entire other part of your culture for the sake of some white knight railing against a million dollar company. Maybe you feel alienated by the fact that there are folks in every class level within an already marginalized group, but just because you don't want to believe that does not mean that subsection of the culture doesn't exist. We can't wipe away people so easily when they don't fit into a nice tightly wrapped stereotyped box.
The sad irony is that African Americans were fooled into believing that rap, ghetto and everything related to such an experience is the core/heart of African American cultural identity when in reality it isn't. What's truly sad is that people such as the author of the video full-heartedly believe that they are critiquing the misrepresentation of their culture which is a lie because it is not really your culture.
@denniszaychik8625
I know exactly what I'm talking about.
I never said anything about "rap, ghetto and everything related" so thanks for your casual racism! You also don't seem to know what Black culture is so please do your own research.
Thanks for watching!
YOU implied that "ghetto" is part of AA culture. I did not. You seem to be rather unfamiliar with Black American culture and your casual racism is unappreciated. Please do your own research.
Thanks for watching!
@@claireimitatingart Funny thing is that I am not a casual racist at all. You on the other hand are an ideology lap dog that doesn't understand even realize it. Also you twisted my words around. I am not saying that this is the essence of black culture or believe it to be so.Reread it.
@@claireimitatingartYou're the one who needs to do research not me cause judging by your videos propaganda has rotted your brain.
I'm sorry, but you have to be kidding me, this is a fantasy movie set in the 20s. Tiana's family might not match the "Modern" black culture of today, but family values are still a solid part of healthy black culture from my observation of families in non-ghetto communities. Also, it's a loving depiction of a hard-working black family so why are you mad? Our biggest issue is actually class-driven, though, yes, racism occurs, especially in poorer areas. In fact, racism occurs in ALL groups among the uneducated and simple-minded of those respective groups; White, Black, Asian, Hispanic, and so on. People naturally fear what they do not understand, what is different, and our media is keen to keep us fighting rather than focusing on the leadership in this county that is taking ALL our money and not fixing the issues of poverty, poor education, poor healthcare and so on.
"So why are you mad?" You want a genuine answer it seems! She wasn't asking for flawless representation of modern black culture, in fact she didn't really ask for that specifically at all..? She was mostly talking about how any struggle in this is related to class and not race when people want to act like it is good representation for the struggles black people face in society. Anyone can be poor, yes, that's part of the reason why its not good representation for racism and how *it* affects class. It doesn't make people of color in general feel seen when it never acknowledges racial bias and only financial. "Our biggest issue is actually class-driven," you have no place to say what "our" biggest issue is when people stop killing people just for the skin tone they were born with, when the beauty standard stops being pale skin. You really have no place in general to say what our biggest issues and struggles are when, if you are the very white girl in your profile picture since that's what your name suggests, you wouldn't know much about how it feels to experience racism in the first place.
It can be a fantasy movie, it makes it unrealistic, and thus not good representation. It doesn't have to be, it'd be nice, but we can't act like it is, okay? The words "but family values are still a solid part of healthy black culture from my observation of families in non-ghetto communities." came out of your brain, into text, you read it back, and thought it was perfectly fine and okay and normal to say about fellow human beings!!! You have no place at all to speak about this matter whatsoever if you refer to it as "observation" like we're creatures??? Hello??? You don't have any experience or even black friends from the way you talk about us and act like this video doesn't make sense?? "People naturally fear what they do not understand," yeah, like the truth, and the truth is: you're sounding really bad right now. You, white, talking about black experiences and struggles like you'd know, saying things like "observing" and "non-ghetto" is actually kind of fucking crazy when you're trying to say what you're trying to say here man.
"family values are still a solid part of healthy black culture" This has a strange implication that other healthy cultures do not like their families as much btw??? I don't think you meant it that way I just think its kind of wild the way we're still like tightly knit pack animals to you in the way you talk about us lol
"racism occurs in ALL groups among the uneducated and simple-minded" Oh hell yeah dude, we know that shit like the back of our hands, like you out here speaking over black people's struggles?? Racism happens everywhere, and its NOT seen here in this movie. That's why its bad representation. It doesn't need to be representing racism, again it'd be fucken great if it was, the issue still is people acting like it does and throwing it around in debates or praise or whatever other shit like its even about us at all because its not
I'm glad you can have fantasies about the 1920s but that is not how *I* a Black American feel about it. It's erasure. You wouldn't have a happy re-imagining of the Holocaust, would you? I'm not saying there wasn't happiness. I'm saying this is a lie. An albeit hurtful lie for me.
It's not any Black culture. I can tell that you are also unaware of what exactly Black culture is since you think I want Tiana to "act ghetto." Whatever that means. Please. Go do some research.
Systemic racism is not affecting all groups.
Thanks for watching!
Nailed it. Edit: Not sure what happened to the other reply but let history know that it was epic.
@@claireimitatingart Thank you!!! UA-cam hates when we speak the truth I guess
@@claireimitatingart How does it hurt you? You were not alive then. You live today. If I sat around evaluating the pain of my family or cultural history I KNOW I sure could come up with traumas too. You didn't live then.. your parents did not either. You are projecting what you think happened and that only causes you imaginary pain. Move on and stop fixating on negativity.
Ngl I do not care about the skin colour. I love a fictional character for their personality, not cause she's white or black 💀
excactly tiana would still be an amazing character white or black
Had to stop at "This movie sucks" Like WTF???? This is the best Disney movie!!!!!Hardly about Tiana??? It's entirely about her and all!!!! You didn't get it at all.
Loved this video, very cool idea to analyse the changes. Unsure about the point that the white princesses have personalities that can't be enmeshed different ethnicities; I think most disney princesses are pretty basic conceptually so that more children can see themselves as that princess. The example of Snow White not working if we remade her to be a black woman I definitely agree with, but would Cinderella having implications, or flat out representation, of slavery be a bad thing? It would add a deeper meaning to the movie and could deal with race in a more nuanced way than The Princess and the Frog. Other than the poor treatment she receives from her step-family now having racist connotations, the rest of Cinderella's personality would work for a different ethnicity, I think. There's a great point for these movies not being remade and just writing original black characters, but in terms of the argument that these princesses *can't* be remade, I'm not sure I agree.
TLDR: the white princesses don't have so much white personality that they can't have their ethnicity changed
It's not really that there's a problem with having changes in the ethnic swaps, it's that there WOULD BE changes. That's all I want. I just want there to be a difference. 🥲
Black Cinderella (other than Rodger and Hammerstein's 🩷), would be verrrrrry interesting. I'm not gonna lie. 😏😅
The white princesses are defaulted but I think that's just us often overlooking the very American culture that they exhibit. I mean, all the princesses display American culture in some aspect but Snow White, Cinderella, Ariel, they are quite American to the point where they showcase exactly our trends of the time and how our teenagers acted but... in a white Christian American sort of way, you know? 🤔
At least that's my thought.
Thanks for watching!
@@claireimitatingart All Disney Princess characters have a connection to Puritan American Christianity in one way or another for that is one of the core foundations of American mythology.
@@claireimitatingart Very good points, thank you for replying!
17:40 Whaaa I always assumed they were married in New Orleans as a kid how did I not catch that T_T
Then again I also thought the Fenner brothers didn't give her the restaurant because they didn't like her costume, not because outbid/racism/sexism. Nope! Because of her costume! For some reason...
"...Aye why this gumbo got raisins in it?"
i love your voice and your way of talking is very calm and comforting. the only thing the video couldve been shorter or more concise. the background could have a bit more colourful (a vibrant color) just some constructive criticism but i would love to watch more of you and what you have to say!
It was an awkward princess movie all around to be certain. But not because Tiana is a whitey in disguise. They tried to do too much. Plot should've been flushed out more. Way too many characters for a story that's all too simple. That's like making Princess and the Pea an epic with fifty characters. It tries to take on too much is what I'm saying.
yeeaaah im so glad the majority of the world isnt gon be worried about this video let alone see it 💀 too much controversy
I’m glad you said something about the line a woman of your background.like that sentence doesn’t mean he was talking about her race, he was talking about her background as being a poor woman.
Have been waiting for this video and really enjoyed it. Only criticism is that to me you looked at the film a bit too much through a modern lens.
Regardless a lot of really good takes.
I also want to add, most movies don't truly reflect real life. That's why it's called Hollywood.
1 minute into the video and deciding not to watch. Not all black people have the same culture/experiances. We are talking about 1920’s New Orleans Black Americans, not 2020 New York City Americans
True tho. Does it count as representation if it doesn't change the story in any significant way
Yeah I'd say so. Representation, in my opinion is better sometimes when the character just happens to be xyz and it isn't the point of the character or the forefront of the story.
@@bigclitenergy Yeah, why does there have to be a reason WHY a character is xyz? Especially in a fantasy setting? Some people just are, and that's okay.
Tbh implying that their race would significantly change the story sounds kinda racist "oh you're XYZ skin color? Well you'll have to act like this and follow these tropes, otherwise it doesn't count"
@@sparkls4492 And it's not like a character's identity doesn't have significance in a character's story and or identity, but that depends on said presentation on the character and whether it's what makes them, them
why do we need a reason to just exist??
Ok i get your point she doesn't have that much culture, but the men that didnt let her get the job was because of racism, for maybe for the plot? plus its nice to have a black character cuz literally most disney princesses back then were white so i think maybe thats why they did it?
If live-action Ariel was played by a white or Asian woman, would they _really_ have had the movie take place in the Caribbean? There's a castle in the Western Hemisphere with European architecture and everyone inside is wearing European clothing, yet it has an African queen? The whole cast looks like DEI nonsense. It doesn't look believable, it looks fake, forced, and soulless.
All the Little mermaid changed was the setting. Princess and the frog live action can take place in Europe and issue solved.
@@risaswonderland1751 A setting that doesn't make sense. Since when are castles a Western hemisphere thing?
@@risaswonderland1751 I don't think it could take place in Europe because of the kind of cuisine Tiana makes is specifically American.
I also think it would’ve been better to have the prince be black or have him at least be mixed like prince Navven is
*sigh*
I disagree strongly
From a white guy that only saw the movie once, and of course just thinking "Wow, what a cool movie" when I watched it... This is astonishing just how bad Disney did Tiana... It isn't even until you peel back the, rather thin, layers that you see just how yikes they did it. Really glad UA-cam recommended this video!
i get icky vibes from you
I'll be honest, I'm about as white as I can be, not racist, never quite understood how you decide something about somebody based on their skin tone. However, I initially looked into this video with the thought you were finally gonna comment on the fact that, people are remaking movies wrong. We shouldn't just change characters because it adds diversity. If you did the reverse to anyone else, like get The Rock, to play Blade, or George Lopez and Garland (I think thats his name the newest spiderman actor.) to play the main characters of rush hour. It doesn't work, I'm not against changing the role or going with a similar idea. But if you're gonna do a live action, don't change the characters. It's highly disrespectful to the people who wrote the story. I honestly never read the original that disney probably changed. (honestly dark brown and green do go together pretty well.) I could be in the wrong, perhaps ariel was as dark as the depths of the ocean. Heck I bet the movie is fantastic, I just, we can't rewrite old things to favor a new time. We need to write new things, build new ideas that use new characters. There are black superheroes, (actually there are alot of superheroes in different ethnicities. Kinda want a firestorm movie) And the numbers of stories and ideas are filling entire buildings with books all of which people read at different times. old books no one have read in so long. ...and I'm ranting, realistically I'm upset just because, people are now turning...and no one wants to see it, the greater number of people from this generation just want to live in peace...but as it stands, people want revenge for a crime we never committed. I'm sure you are gonna say something along the lines, "The whites have attacked us for years...and while that might be true, people from this generation just wanna live peacefully without the attack and assault. Sadly high corporations can't make money if it's peaceful. so they have to target what people are frustrated over. And to repeat myself, I'm not racist, autistic sure, easily distracted definitely, but in the same way you wouldn't fill a black role with a white character it should be just as wrong to fill a white role with a black person. I dunno, I could be wrong, but if racism is when you target another race due to their skin color...isn't white a skin color too?...anyways, I appologise if I've offended anyone, or gotten too far out of hand.
But if you actually read this past the part that says, I'm white (congrats on hearing what I have to say and not judging based on color.) TLDR there's no reason to change an old character when you can make a new one.
I hear you. My point was mainly the importance of culture to a character but that also plays into what you're saying. The identity should be intrinsic to the character. It should inform their actions.
I and many others are tired of race-swaps and gender-swaps. They are soulless. Despite Tiana not actually being a race-swap, she feels like the product of one to me. The character is unchanged and not written for any particular cultural identity (though most race and gender swaps are much worse in their handling).
But let's hope for new IPs, nevertheless!
Thanks for watching!
Of course, I'm always happy to listen to people's stories and appreciate your open mindedness to ideas.
Ok lets see here... Gonna press
-Dislike
-back
-"Not interested in channel"
get a life