I think the main point of this discussion was said by Steven Um: focus on Christ and he will bring the nations. We are to preach the gospel to every tribe and tongue but ultimately it's Jesus who does the saving. Focus on reaching everyone that Jesus put's in front of you, wherever you're at. The more you focus on Christ, the more racial diversity will take care of itself. If it's reversed, racial tolerance becomes the focus and Christ is diminished. Great talk guy's. I honestly think this channel has been the most rational and righteous when discussing race. More so than any other cultural platform that i've seen in our day. I praise God for you.
More Churches need to be having this conversation. But a lot of them aren't having these discussions. We need to start getting bold in this area. The Church, leaders and the Body of Christ needs to wake up.
Well, I have to commend Trip Lee on asserting consistency on this issue, if we want multi ethnic churches, you cant just say white churches need to be less white but black churches can stay homogeneous, no, he said this should be applicable to everyone, which is genuinely fair and just. However, I do have 2 problems, 1 is preferring other races in leadership, the leadership position should be who is most qualified simple as that and 2, they hinted at this, but ethnic diversity is not the only or even most important diversity.
My concern for what you're saying concerning black churches needing to be less black is that white people have historical been in power outside of the four walls of the church, whether we like it or not, it's the history of this country. It was set up that way, no denying so oftentimes, black people are less apt to open up their sacred space as white churches rarely have black leadership but are always welcoming when black come just to be lead
The black prpvoded safely for 150 years or more from physical oppresion. And even yet black people are murdered in their won congregations in Charelstown, South Carolina.@756Attitude
I so agree with the Asian guy, maybe its coz I am African, and as you know, we are made of many many different ethnicities, each with their own language and culture. It is said that there are between 1500-200 languages in Africa. Maybe even more, cz we can have so many sub tribes and dialects, under one tribe. Maybe you can come to Africa and study this phenomena in our churches. First all, know that almost each tribe in Africa has the Bible translated in its language. Same to hymn books. And so when you go to the rural areas where you are most likely to find people of one tribe living together in a region, then the churches will be composed of people from that tribe, they will read the Bible written in their local language, they will sing songs in their local dialects. When you move to the urban areas though, where people from different tribes live in the same region, you'll find the church composition to be made of people from different tribes who speak different languages. The preaching and singing will most likely be done in the national language of he country, so that everybody participates. And the leadership of the church will be composed of people from the different tribes represented in the church. There are many variations of this phenomena though, it the practice varies from region to region, but I think I am explaining from the extremely rural case, to the most cosmopolitan church you can think of in Africa. I know thats the case in my church in Kenya. In the same denomination, in Nairobi, I worship either in Kiswahili or English. When I travel home to the rural are, I will worship in DhoLuo. My fellow church members in Nairobi are most likely to be Kisiis, and when they travel home, they will be worshipping in the Abagusii dialect. But when we meet in our respective Nairobi churches, we will worship in our national languages, either Kiswahili or English. And, there are English churches, and Kiswahili churches. You choose which church to attend depending to proximity to your home, and how comfortable you are with the services. There are certain denominations in the very urban areas that conduct their services in the African languages and so you'll find these churches basically serving one specific tribe, even though they are located in a cosmopolitan area with people from all over the country and the world. Having said so, we still have challenges even in the cosmopolitan churches, coz we have tribal issues and prejudices between different tribes, and so the top church leaders have to do a very careful balancing act to make sure all tribes are well represented at the leadership level of each individual church while lifting up the name of Jesus at the same time.
+tamething1 For those advocating multi-ethnic church Galatians 3:28-29 is a goto verse. However, proper exegesis will prove an point. I will layout the context of Gal 3 first. Galatians 3:28-29 is set within a context of Paul’s defense of the doctrine of justification by faith apart from the Law (3:1-4:31). In the previous section (3:10-14), Paul is discussing how those who are righteous shall only live by faith. Then in the immediate context, Paul is referring to the promise of the 'nomos' (Law) and how “before faith came, we were held captive under the Law.” The misunderstood phrase is v. 28, “There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.” However, this is not referring to ecclesiology. Rather, it is referring to how one is justified. It was understood at one time that you were justified by the Law, but now, because of Christ, we are justified by faith. This does not mean that someone becomes an ethnic Jew, just that all (ethnic people) are justified by faith alone in Christ. “Paul’s gospel calls for a mixing and inclusion of different races in the church, but it especially calls for Jews and Gentiles to live with one another in love as God’s family even if a church might not be able to ethnically diverse because everyone in the community is from the same homogeneous unit” (Jarvis J. Williams, One New Man, 136). Therefore, since this passage is referring to how one is justified we can no longer use this in the ecclesiological way that most consider it.
This is a pretty good discussion. Unfortunately, the reality is that a number of people, even in church, tend to listen to and respect those of a certain racial and/or socioeconomic background(s) and tend to be dismissive of people of certain other racial and/or socioeconomic background(s). I know this because I've seen this first-hand. This is something I believe Jesus would not be proud of.
I see some good points being made here, my 2 cents is this, Jesus said to love your neighbor, if we are following Jesus' commands and example, then we have to end the walls of diversity, and have leadership in our churches who are different races or differ in ethnicity, our neighbors are black, white, brown, yellow, and other, we must reach out to ALL people.
What a flesh driven question...any identity(black, white, yellow, male, female etc) is left at the door. We are all ONE in Christ, whoever the Lord brings into the Church is who He brings in, their color is totally irrelevant.
I come frpm a multilingual church in Jerusalem. We have both hebrew and english from the pulpit and during our main service there are also headphones with translation to other languages. The reason we are about half foreign is that most evangelical churches here don't welcome the short-term visitors who come for a few years as students, by not having any translation availble, and so many of thoose visitors find their way to us. Unfortunately we don't have any Arabs in our church, the few christians thete have their'e own churches. However I am not even sure how a tri-lingual church would work, so... yeah
Every individual church doesn't need to be multi-ethnic, but every church needs to understand that THE CHURCH aka The Body of Believers under Christ is in fact multi-ethnic, multi-national, multi-cultural, and yes multi-racial. I have no expectations of local churches in Vermont which is a 94% White state to somehow be 30% Black, 30% White, 30% Asian, etc...However what every single church in every single community should do is look at its congregation, look at its community and ask itself what are they doing to be reflective of that community and connected to that community. I've been in largely Black churches my entire life. I know why those churches are largely Black. I understand the history of the Black church-why it was created, how, and why it is largely Black today across cities and across states. Why I visit white churches and churches in more diverse neighborhoods and talk to people who are members of those churches the conversations about why and how they got to where they are in terms of make-up and who they attract and why is... in a word: sad. not in every case, but it's most often-not always-but quite often a willful choice to insulate from people not like them unless there's some missionary work to be done or unless there's selective connections between individual members of diverse communities. we got a ways to go and some honest convos need to be had once and for all. this is a good start tho.
+Hadji W I could not agree more with you more. This was my frame of thought throughout the video. However, there were quite a few things they did not even touch. How can the church minister to all ethnic groups effectively. How can the church effectively minister to one ethnic group with, singling out another in a single service? Does the church teach in one language and have translators? Different services? What about if there are conflicting cultural views (i.e., pork to Muslims and american fascination for bacon on everything)? These are only a few of the questions that can begin to make this topic more strenuous. The bottom line is that multi-ethnic like you stand not effective for every culture and context. I would even propose that multi-ethnic church is NOT biblically mandated (though this is controversial to some and I will leave that alone). Thoughtful discussion is key to understanding the best approach for a church to be multi-ethnic or not.
+Jake Kersh they didn't ouch on those issues... woulda been a 5 hour video if they had LOL... I would contend that the church was multi-ethnic from jump. In Christ's time, believers crossed ethnic lines. in many cities Romans, Jews, Egyptians, Syrians, etc. were eighbors in various communities as people moved around from different tribes and cities constantly. And of course as Greeks, Romans and other conquered different countries many moved around creating lots of multi-ethnic communities. As the Word of God spread, it's likely people wherever they were from followed as they saw fit. that alone makes the church-the body of believers-multi-ethnic and multicultural. Also to consider-many of the 13 original apostles were not ethnic Jews. Many of the following apostles weren't either. So Christ created a multi-ethnic church right out the gate, not just Jew and Gentile, but of different tribes nations among the gentiles. Our divisions here in the US are a series of ugly, largely willful choices rooted in bias.
+Hadji W A 5 hour video that would be Entertaining. Lol. I would again agree with you. The early church (i.e., body of believers) began multi-ethnic. However, this is not to say that the house churches, organized church bodies were all multi-ethnic. I am sure there were congregations of believers who where multi-cultural. But I would also admit their were mono-ethnic congregations as well. Good stuff.
When listening to all this stuff remember one thing. Man’s opinion verses God’s revelation! That thought alone will steer you clear of all this unnecessary drama
the evidence of the unifying and transcendent power of the gospel should not be measured by the apparent racial/ ethnic diversity in the church but rather their shared commitment to the gospel. period.
another thing I heard from the Asian gentlemen, he said that we have blind spots culturally, blind spots culturally is sin and needs to be dealt with in order to grow as believers and as people.
Cultural blindspots are a sin? What? How do you support that with Scripture? It's one thing to be willfully ignorant and insensitive towards other cultures but we all have blind spots that we may not know about. There are thousands of cultures and until one learns them is that person in sin?
Its not about "must every church be multi ethnic",but all races of people should be embraced !Not to do this, is to show partiality.That is sin !That said,everyone needs to go where they can relate best.As Christians grow in Christ,the walls of differences will come down !
You shouldn't look it as my church is this color or that color it should preaching to anyone and everyone there is too much of people trying to change the God thinks about people. In a certain neighborhood or area you are going to have most likely a dominant type of people because of that area. But you shouldn't act weird if someone from a different cultures walks in your church. Too much of that going around , we need to see them as christ sees them.
No. It should happen naturally, and it should never forced. Diversity has nothing to do with the tenants of Christianity. It's about a personal relationship with the Lord.
@@egdunc1152 Social engineering has nothing to do with the Gospel. It should never be an issue. Jesus never said we had to force diversity. He only said to preach the Gospel near and wide. He spoke to people of different backgrounds. This is not the same thing. It's an anti white agenda.
@@MeadeSkeltonMusic so, the answer to my question is No, you don't have theological training and it shows. I'm not sure you have ever been to college for that fact or ever took a history class. "Social engineer lring" and "Anti-white agenda" should be discussed between educated people and it's clear you are not. I would welcome your opinion, because it'd be just that an opinion, but it's uninformed obviously, so I'd rather not engage. You're in the South. Richmond Virginia of all places. I lived there for 12 years. I understand your perspective.
@@egdunc1152 I don't see what being from Richmond has to do with anything. I just know the truth about the Bible. They are twisting scripture and using it for political purposes. Bless your heart.
The fact you've even raised that question shows you have failed. Christianity is loving people - flesh & blood. Beauty should consist of ones true inner-self, not by outward appearances, aids or race. The problem is ethnic groups closing in on the church as St benedict said. The pushing & forcing of an ethnic groups culture into the Church of Christ is wrong. Hence, ethnic is a worldy issue which Christianity isn't part of. Unfortunately, a lot of church buildings now have ethinic idolatry. Consequently, this has defiled the houses of Prayer & no true Christians enter those church buildings. Your only left with non-Christians, victims of ethnic idolatry & racial aggression if its opposed. Funny that.
Search YT for black church. Now you're telling me that white people could attend a service like that every sunday? No. They would leave. They would white flight outta there on the double. Im white I love black churches. Do I wanna be a member of one? Hellll no.
Race matters. God confused the languages at Babel so that humanity wouldn't become "one people." God gets glory in Revelation from the diversity of the nations (ethnos, or races).
Because God made ethnicity and it is part of GOD. So unity in diversity needs to be embrace and protected. Evil totally knows that this matters so Satan does anything he can to currupt unity and cause division among ethnic groups. Without Love there cannot be unity, but certainly will be racism because that comes from hate. And love comes from GOD
Preach Christ and Him crucified, and God will build His church. That's your strategy. Rick Warren's heresy is rubbing off on you John Piper. "Evil communications corrupt good manners".
Matthew 15:24 "But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel." So, who are the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel? It isn't everybody. It is one race of people. So Jesus came only for His people, the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel. The LAW, Commandments, Ordinances and Judgments were NOT given to ALL the races on the earth. Psalms 147:19 "He sheweth his word unto Jacob, his statutes and his judgments unto Israel." Psalms 147:20 "He hath not dealt so with any nation: and as for his judgments, they have not known them. Praise ye the LORD." See, only Israel was given the LAW. Not the other races. Only one race. The Israelites. So why are churches lying to all the races? For money? I think so. Just plain greed. The answer is given in Genesis 5:1. But you have to use a Strong's Concordance to translate the verse from English back to Hebrew. In Genesis 5:1 the word "generations" means "descendants, families, genealogies, to beget, race" and the word ADAM means "rosy, ruddy, able to show blood in the face; able to blush." That is your CLUE as to who the generations of Adam are. The generations of Adam are only ONE race of people. The children of Yahwah are the CHILDREN of Israel. Adam was the son of Yahwah God (Luke 3:38) so all of Adam's descendants are children of Yahwah God. The Israelites would become a great nation and a company of nations. Only one race has done this. The White European, Germanic, Scandinavian, Celtic, Nordic, Slavic and kindred people. The Adamic White race. To make churches multi racial is going against God and the clear teachings of the bible verses. Segregation for the Israelites was a command. You are doing the White Race who attends church a great injustice. They don't know who they are, because of the lies being told that ALL the races are from one source. That is a lie. All races survived Noah's flood. 8 white people could NOT create the other races, Impossible. DNA replicates itself and 8 white people could only create more white people. Nobody morphed into another race. How naive and gullible people must be. And dumb too.
This is a Marxist conversation. Shouldn’t even have to have this discussion if you’re already doing what you’re supposed to be doing. Obviously you are a worldly church I will be unsubscribing
Its dancing with the idea of ethnic gnosticism and standpoint epistemology. It's an over realized eschatology of Rev 7:9. The main point in that passage is not about trying to diversify every local church but that all tribes and nations will bow and worship Jesus Christ because the Gospel crosses all sorts of barriers. The spiritual body of Christ is already diverse across the globe.
I think the main point of this discussion was said by Steven Um: focus on Christ and he will bring the nations. We are to preach the gospel to every tribe and tongue but ultimately it's Jesus who does the saving. Focus on reaching everyone that Jesus put's in front of you, wherever you're at. The more you focus on Christ, the more racial diversity will take care of itself. If it's reversed, racial tolerance becomes the focus and Christ is diminished. Great talk guy's. I honestly think this channel has been the most rational and righteous when discussing race. More so than any other cultural platform that i've seen in our day. I praise God for you.
THIS WAS SO GOOD, More churches need to be having this conversation!
This conversation is desperately needed in Christian churches today.
Great
Preach Christ, the whole Christ, to the Glory of Christ
And let God draw all men as He pleases. Amen.
More Churches need to be having this conversation. But a lot of them aren't having these discussions. We need to start getting bold in this area. The Church, leaders and the Body of Christ needs to wake up.
Well, I have to commend Trip Lee on asserting consistency on this issue, if we want multi ethnic churches, you cant just say white churches need to be less white but black churches can stay homogeneous, no, he said this should be applicable to everyone, which is genuinely fair and just. However, I do have 2 problems, 1 is preferring other races in leadership, the leadership position should be who is most qualified simple as that and 2, they hinted at this, but ethnic diversity is not the only or even most important diversity.
My concern for what you're saying concerning black churches needing to be less black is that white people have historical been in power outside of the four walls of the church, whether we like it or not, it's the history of this country. It was set up that way, no denying so oftentimes, black people are less apt to open up their sacred space as white churches rarely have black leadership but are always welcoming when black come just to be lead
Yeah, you moving the goal post
The black prpvoded safely for 150 years or more from physical oppresion. And even yet black people are murdered in their won congregations in Charelstown, South Carolina.@756Attitude
I so agree with the Asian guy, maybe its coz I am African, and as you know, we are made of many many different ethnicities, each with their own language and culture. It is said that there are between 1500-200 languages in Africa. Maybe even more, cz we can have so many sub tribes and dialects, under one tribe. Maybe you can come to Africa and study this phenomena in our churches.
First all, know that almost each tribe in Africa has the Bible translated in its language. Same to hymn books. And so when you go to the rural areas where you are most likely to find people of one tribe living together in a region, then the churches will be composed of people from that tribe, they will read the Bible written in their local language, they will sing songs in their local dialects.
When you move to the urban areas though, where people from different tribes live in the same region, you'll find the church composition to be made of people from different tribes who speak different languages. The preaching and singing will most likely be done in the national language of he country, so that everybody participates. And the leadership of the church will be composed of people from the different tribes represented in the church.
There are many variations of this phenomena though, it the practice varies from region to region, but I think I am explaining from the extremely rural case, to the most cosmopolitan church you can think of in Africa.
I know thats the case in my church in Kenya. In the same denomination, in Nairobi, I worship either in Kiswahili or English. When I travel home to the rural are, I will worship in DhoLuo. My fellow church members in Nairobi are most likely to be Kisiis, and when they travel home, they will be worshipping in the Abagusii dialect. But when we meet in our respective Nairobi churches, we will worship in our national languages, either Kiswahili or English.
And, there are English churches, and Kiswahili churches. You choose which church to attend depending to proximity to your home, and how comfortable you are with the services.
There are certain denominations in the very urban areas that conduct their services in the African languages and so you'll find these churches basically serving one specific tribe, even though they are located in a cosmopolitan area with people from all over the country and the world.
Having said so, we still have challenges even in the cosmopolitan churches, coz we have tribal issues and prejudices between different tribes, and so the top church leaders have to do a very careful balancing act to make sure all tribes are well represented at the leadership level of each individual church while lifting up the name of Jesus at the same time.
Galatians 3:28 : "There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Jesus Christ."
+tamething1 For those advocating multi-ethnic church Galatians 3:28-29 is a goto verse. However, proper exegesis will prove an point.
I will layout the context of Gal 3 first. Galatians 3:28-29 is set within a context of Paul’s defense of the doctrine of justification by faith apart from the Law (3:1-4:31). In the previous section (3:10-14), Paul is discussing how those who are righteous shall only live by faith. Then in the immediate context, Paul is referring to the promise of the 'nomos' (Law) and how “before faith came, we were held captive under the Law.” The misunderstood phrase is v. 28, “There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.” However, this is not referring to ecclesiology. Rather, it is referring to how one is justified. It was understood at one time that you were justified by the Law, but now, because of Christ, we are justified by faith.
This does not mean that someone becomes an ethnic Jew, just that all (ethnic people) are justified by faith alone in Christ. “Paul’s gospel calls for a mixing and inclusion of different races in the church, but it especially calls for Jews and Gentiles to live with one another in love as God’s family even if a church might not be able to ethnically diverse because everyone in the community is from the same homogeneous unit” (Jarvis J. Williams, One New Man, 136).
Therefore, since this passage is referring to how one is justified we can no longer use this in the ecclesiological way that most consider it.
so I guess gender doesn't exist anymore? Paul was saying Christ was pre-eminent, not that current distinctions cease to exist.
This is a pretty good discussion. Unfortunately, the reality is that a number of people, even in church, tend to listen to and respect those of a certain racial and/or socioeconomic background(s) and tend to be dismissive of people of certain other racial and/or socioeconomic background(s). I know this because I've seen this first-hand. This is something I believe Jesus would not be proud of.
I see some good points being made here, my 2 cents is this, Jesus said to love your neighbor, if we are following Jesus' commands and example, then we have to end the walls of diversity, and have leadership in our churches who are different races or differ in ethnicity, our neighbors are black, white, brown, yellow, and other, we must reach out to ALL people.
What a flesh driven question...any identity(black, white, yellow, male, female etc) is left at the door. We are all ONE in Christ, whoever the Lord brings into the Church is who He brings in, their color is totally irrelevant.
Interesting...good discussion...⚘
I come frpm a multilingual church in Jerusalem. We have both hebrew and english from the pulpit and during our main service there are also headphones with translation to other languages. The reason we are about half foreign is that most evangelical churches here don't welcome the short-term visitors who come for a few years as students, by not having any translation availble, and so many of thoose visitors find their way to us. Unfortunately we don't have any Arabs in our church, the few christians thete have their'e own churches. However I am not even sure how a tri-lingual church would work, so... yeah
Carla Linton. Yes. Every Church should be Multi Ethic.
Carla Linton. Yes Every Church should be Multi ethnic.
THE CHURCHES STARTED IN THIS COUNTRY SEPARATE. My church is very multi ethnic. GLIDE MEMORIAL
Every individual church doesn't need to be multi-ethnic, but every church needs to understand that THE CHURCH aka The Body of Believers under Christ is in fact multi-ethnic, multi-national, multi-cultural, and yes multi-racial.
I have no expectations of local churches in Vermont which is a 94% White state to somehow be 30% Black, 30% White, 30% Asian, etc...However what every single church in every single community should do is look at its congregation, look at its community and ask itself what are they doing to be reflective of that community and connected to that community.
I've been in largely Black churches my entire life. I know why those churches are largely Black. I understand the history of the Black church-why it was created, how, and
why it is largely Black today across cities and across states. Why I visit white churches and churches in more diverse neighborhoods and talk to people who are members of those churches the conversations about why and how they got to where they are in terms of make-up and who they attract and why is... in a word:
sad.
not in every case, but it's most often-not always-but quite often a willful choice to insulate from people not like them unless there's some missionary work to be done
or unless there's selective connections between individual members of diverse communities.
we got a ways to go and some honest convos need to be had once and for all. this is a good start tho.
+Hadji W I could not agree more with you more. This was my frame of thought throughout the video.
However, there were quite a few things they did not even touch. How can the church minister to all ethnic groups effectively. How can the church effectively minister to one ethnic group with, singling out another in a single service? Does the church teach in one language and have translators? Different services? What about if there are conflicting cultural views (i.e., pork to Muslims and american fascination for bacon on everything)? These are only a few of the questions that can begin to make this topic more strenuous.
The bottom line is that multi-ethnic like you stand not effective for every culture and context. I would even propose that multi-ethnic church is NOT biblically mandated (though this is controversial to some and I will leave that alone). Thoughtful discussion is key to understanding the best approach for a church to be multi-ethnic or not.
+Jake Kersh they didn't ouch on those issues... woulda been a 5 hour video if they had LOL...
I would contend that the church was multi-ethnic from jump. In Christ's time, believers crossed ethnic lines. in many cities Romans, Jews, Egyptians, Syrians, etc. were eighbors in various communities as people moved around from different tribes and cities constantly. And of course as Greeks, Romans and other conquered different countries many moved around creating lots of multi-ethnic communities. As the Word of God spread, it's likely people wherever they were from followed as they saw fit. that alone makes the church-the body of believers-multi-ethnic and multicultural.
Also to consider-many of the 13 original apostles were not ethnic Jews. Many of the following apostles weren't either. So Christ created a multi-ethnic church right out the gate, not just Jew and Gentile, but of different tribes nations among the gentiles.
Our divisions here in the US are a series of ugly, largely willful choices rooted in bias.
+Hadji W
A 5 hour video that would be Entertaining. Lol.
I would again agree with you. The early church (i.e., body of believers) began multi-ethnic. However, this is not to say that the house churches, organized church bodies were all multi-ethnic. I am sure there were congregations of believers who where multi-cultural. But I would also admit their were mono-ethnic congregations as well.
Good stuff.
+Jake Kersh +Hadji W Great thoughts guys.
thx! hope it helps.
When listening to all this stuff remember one thing. Man’s opinion verses God’s revelation! That thought alone will steer you clear of all this unnecessary drama
the evidence of the unifying and transcendent power of the gospel should not be measured by the apparent racial/ ethnic diversity in the church but rather their shared commitment to the gospel. period.
It is absolutely never people of color that make comments like this one, John 17
Its about stepping outside of your comfort zone. Everyone struggles with the same variations of spiritual warfare. Character issues dont discriminate.
Maybe to even have a multicultural service once or twice a year would help as well. With other churches in the community.
another thing I heard from the Asian gentlemen, he said that we have blind spots culturally, blind spots culturally is sin and needs to be dealt with in order to grow as believers and as people.
Cultural blindspots are a sin? What? How do you support that with Scripture? It's one thing to be willfully ignorant and insensitive towards other cultures but we all have blind spots that we may not know about. There are thousands of cultures and until one learns them is that person in sin?
No. Churches are a family. So are our races. We are all unique. God created the races.
Its not about "must every church be multi ethnic",but all races of people should be embraced !Not to do this, is to show partiality.That is sin !That said,everyone needs to go where they can relate best.As Christians grow in Christ,the walls of differences will come down !
Tripp Amen, culture of everyone in the congregation sharing the gospel
6:30 hiring based on race is the same sin of partiality you claim to be against.
But we got here because of the sin of racism, so how to we correct it
Is it me or is John piper avoiding eye contact with Trip?
You know what, I think he is! Or was. This video is a few years old.
You shouldn't look it as my church is this color or that color it should preaching to anyone and everyone there is too much of people trying to change the God thinks about people. In a certain neighborhood or area you are going to have most likely a dominant type of people because of that area. But you shouldn't act weird if someone from a different cultures walks in your church. Too much of that going around , we need to see them as christ sees them.
But why do we have a dominant area........redlining, stirring...?!
my church is
No. It should happen naturally, and it should never forced. Diversity has nothing to do with the tenants of Christianity. It's about a personal relationship with the Lord.
The problem is that it isn't happening naturally. Diversity has everything to do with Christ. Have you ever attended a theology class?
@@egdunc1152 Social engineering has nothing to do with the Gospel. It should never be an issue. Jesus never said we had to force diversity. He only said to preach the Gospel near and wide. He spoke to people of different backgrounds. This is not the same thing. It's an anti white agenda.
@@MeadeSkeltonMusic so, the answer to my question is No, you don't have theological training and it shows. I'm not sure you have ever been to college for that fact or ever took a history class. "Social engineer lring" and "Anti-white agenda" should be discussed between educated people and it's clear you are not. I would welcome your opinion, because it'd be just that an opinion, but it's uninformed obviously, so I'd rather not engage.
You're in the South. Richmond Virginia of all places. I lived there for 12 years. I understand your perspective.
@@egdunc1152 I don't see what being from Richmond has to do with anything. I just know the truth about the Bible. They are twisting scripture and using it for political purposes. Bless your heart.
The fact you've even raised that question shows you have failed. Christianity is loving people - flesh & blood. Beauty should consist of ones true inner-self, not by outward appearances, aids or race.
The problem is ethnic groups closing in on the church as St benedict said. The pushing & forcing of an ethnic groups culture into the Church of Christ is wrong. Hence, ethnic is a worldy issue which Christianity isn't part of. Unfortunately, a lot of church buildings now have ethinic idolatry. Consequently, this has defiled the houses of Prayer & no true Christians enter those church buildings. Your only left with non-Christians, victims of ethnic idolatry & racial aggression if its opposed. Funny that.
okay so god created the jewish people only to have them be gone?
Search YT for black church. Now you're telling me that white people could attend a service like that every sunday? No. They would leave. They would white flight outta there on the double. Im white I love black churches. Do I wanna be a member of one? Hellll no.
"diversity" is irrelevant. We just need to follow Jesus and love others.. Why are we even talking about "race" here?
Race matters. God confused the languages at Babel so that humanity wouldn't become "one people." God gets glory in Revelation from the diversity of the nations (ethnos, or races).
Because God made ethnicity and it is part of GOD. So unity in diversity needs to be embrace and protected. Evil totally knows that this matters so Satan does anything he can to currupt unity and cause division among ethnic groups. Without Love there cannot be unity, but certainly will be racism because that comes from hate. And love comes from GOD
Preach Christ and Him crucified, and God will build His church. That's your strategy. Rick Warren's heresy is rubbing off on you John Piper. "Evil communications corrupt good manners".
I wish it were that easy. That's a very elementary interpretation of scripture
Matthew 15:24 "But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel."
So, who are the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel? It isn't everybody.
It is one race of people. So Jesus came only for His people, the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel.
The LAW, Commandments, Ordinances and Judgments were NOT given to ALL the races on the earth.
Psalms 147:19 "He sheweth his word unto Jacob, his statutes and his judgments unto Israel."
Psalms 147:20 "He hath not dealt so with any nation: and as for his judgments, they have not known them. Praise ye the LORD."
See, only Israel was given the LAW. Not the other races. Only one race. The Israelites. So why are churches lying to all the races? For money? I think so. Just plain greed.
The answer is given in Genesis 5:1. But you have to use a Strong's Concordance to translate the verse from English back to Hebrew.
In Genesis 5:1 the word "generations" means "descendants, families, genealogies, to beget, race" and the word ADAM means "rosy, ruddy, able to show blood in the face; able to blush."
That is your CLUE as to who the generations of Adam are. The generations of Adam are only ONE race of people.
The children of Yahwah are the CHILDREN of Israel. Adam was the son of Yahwah God (Luke 3:38) so all of Adam's descendants are children of Yahwah God.
The Israelites would become a great nation and a company of nations. Only one race has done this. The White European, Germanic, Scandinavian, Celtic, Nordic, Slavic and kindred people. The Adamic White race.
To make churches multi racial is going against God and the clear teachings of the bible verses. Segregation for the Israelites was a command. You are doing the White Race who attends church a great injustice. They don't know who they are, because of the lies being told that ALL the races are from one source. That is a lie. All races survived Noah's flood. 8 white people could NOT create the other races, Impossible. DNA replicates itself and 8 white people could only create more white people. Nobody morphed into another race. How naive and gullible people must be. And dumb too.
Heresy. You are preaching 'Christian Identity.' This is as dangerous and false as 'Christian Zionism.'
This is a Marxist conversation. Shouldn’t even have to have this discussion if you’re already doing what you’re supposed to be doing.
Obviously you are a worldly church I will be unsubscribing
Its dancing with the idea of ethnic gnosticism and standpoint epistemology. It's an over realized eschatology of Rev 7:9. The main point in that passage is not about trying to diversify every local church but that all tribes and nations will bow and worship Jesus Christ because the Gospel crosses all sorts of barriers. The spiritual body of Christ is already diverse across the globe.
I love how everything is Marxist now. It’s just a meaningless word people use to discredit people.
JS Stuart, This is a needed conversation.