Thanks for this. I was struggling to figure this out and came across your FOG post. No one else seems to offer best practices for aligning both sides. Thanks for sharing.
Great video Ben , I just bought my very first festool last weekend . Just so happens to be the df500q jointer . There is so much more to this tool then I expected lol I’ve been watching UA-cam videos none stop to get a better handle on how to use it , which I plan on this weekend. Thanks for the great video it’s been a huge help
Don't know if you guys do the same thing but I just got to the point in a project where I start to procrastinate because I'm worried about fucking up the next step of the process. Right now the next step is doing butt Joints with the domino and because of the nature of the table I'm doing they have to be absolutely exact. This video is exactly what I need to get me going again. Thanks Ben. It's nice to be using youtube to be productive for once.
With the procrastination piece, I'd say that if there's a certain technique that worries you, or you're not sure how to move forward with joining some pieces or you're inexperienced with a method - practice on some scrap pieces first. Create a mock up of whatever it is you're trying to do: joint, glue up, cut, design feature, etc. No need to ruin your piece due to inexperience - and never rush to failure. Take your time with new techniques, do them over and over until you're confident in your skill. It'll make you excited to use that skill set again. Let us know how your project pans out - and if it doesn't, there's always more wood!!!
This is awesome. Every video i've seen doing butt joints in the middle of a panel doesn't seem to care where on the panel the joint sits, never would have thought to use it with the fence at 90 for both parts.
Hey thanks for watching! Glad you found it helpful. I had so many failed pieces that now have "domino accents" because I kept messing up which side of the panel I referenced the fence. Using this marking method removes that error all together.
Awesome! Glad it helped! I recently made a small book case....but before figuring out this method 😂I have a few visible "domino" accents 😂😂😂I appreciate the feedback!
Thanks for this explanation, very helpful. I was wondering how to do a precise butt join with plywood panels and ensure they are placed precisely where I need them, this technique helps a lot, thanks.
Awesome. Thank you for this tip. One thing I did notice... It doesn't apply in this scenario, but it would be good to indicate a line where the Domino will plunge on one board, and have that as a reference for the next board. In this case you used the fold out tabs of the Domino machine, however, if working with wide, flat stock like plywood, those tabs would not keep repeatable reference. Its just a thought. I'm not certain if my explanation is understandable.
Yeah sometimes multi-step procedures can be bard to follow in text lol! Depending on the width of the stock, you could use the positioning pins as a reference for each of the stock you're plunging.
Great video! Got a domino last year and haven’t really got a chance to mess with it much. The stock I am fixing to do is narrower than then what side pins will allow to reference off of so I am trying to figure that out.
Nice!!! Domino is a game changer in the shop. What stock are you working with? TheDF500 and 700 both come with great accessories to handle narrow stock
@@BenMarshallDesigns it’s about 2x3 inches with butt joint. I kinda figure out how to use the narrow stock tool for the end grain mortise but not side how to line up the other mortise because it’s not wide enough for pin reference. I am thinking I will just have to mark it and line up the mark.
Loved the video, thank you! When drilling the mortises did you reference off both paddles to get 2 holes or was one referenced off a paddle and the other referenced off the edge of the domino. It was too fast to notice.
Hey John, great question. Yes, I used the indexing stops on both sides of the stock material for this project. The stock width was 400mm, more than enough room to utilize the 37mm offset the indexing stops provide.
Thanks Brett!! I recently had to scrap an entire carcass on a bed build because of this exact issue. Whole frame was out of square except for one corner - an expensive mistake at that! Glad you found it helpful and share the struggle!! Appreciate the comment!
Thanks! Very true. I've found that sometimes plunges can be off (user error), and it helps to mark plunges, that way you can tell if the bit is going to plunge in the wrong location. Just depends on the work piece!
Great Tip. What width mortise do you use? Narrow or medium and which holes use witch? Thanks, I have used this method before on shelving for a wall unit I did.
on this particular build I used narrow on each as the stock was only 100mm wide. On larger panels, like on my most recent video, I do one narrow and the rest are medium. Marking before joining is such a huge time and patience saver. Of all my mistakes, it usually revolves around me not paying attention - marking keeps me in check! Appreciate your time to watch the video!
The dominos seem pretty close together, when would you decide to use 1 larger domino versus the two that you went with? thanks so much for sharing, appreciate it
I used two in this instance because of the width of the material. No matter which domino sizes you use, they all have the same width. Typically you only need the domino to be a 1/3 the thickness of the material you're using, so in this case, I could afford to use two smaller dominos. The dominos can be close or further apart, this does not impact the strength of the joint. As long as I have enough material on the substrate, it will be strong - the distance of separation of the dominos has no effect on strength.
Good video, thank you. I'd say that for the base of a cabinet where the actual strength of the glue joint is not an issue, since the cabinet probably will be screwed to the base and thereby holding the whole "package" together, this is adequate. However, if this was part of, let's say a piece of furniture, like a leg and a rail for a table, I'd strongly suggest that the grain direction would be taken into account when orienting the dominos. When possible, you should always glue long grain to long grain. You could chose to do so also here by marking the centres instead and used the center line on the machine, which would have increased the strength considerably. As I said initially, for this application I have no objection, but it is important to be aware of the different aspects of how wood works. Kind regards. / Peter
Peter, thanks for taking the time to watch AND give such a detailed comment. This project was the base/toekick for a modular bed build. Appreciate the tips! You seem quite knowledgable!
@@BenMarshallDesigns Thank you, Ben. I guess forty-five years in the trade does that to you. I contemplating buying a domino myself, but I can't decide which of the two to get; that's why I was watching your video. Keep up the good work... Cheers
@@whoisathome wow!! Maybe you should start a youtube channel! I'm sure you've got tons of knowledge! Yeah it's a hard to decide with the 500 or 700. I knew that I would mainly be working with 18mm sheet goods, so it was an easy decision. If you plan on doing thicker stock pieces (or heavy furniture/doors) then go with the 700. Thanks for the convo!
@@BenMarshallDesigns Good idea, Ben; I've thought about starting a UA-cam channel for a while - and I think I will do that some time. I've actually made an attempt already with a couple of videos about a saw sled for resawing on the band saw. Besides making furniture and other wooden objects, I mainly make guitars now and this sled is aimed at resawing backs and sides for guitars. These videos are shot with an iphone 5 and I realise that I need better gear for doing a proper job filming. Hopefully I will take the plunge in the future. Here are a couple of links to these video clips: ua-cam.com/video/pRAJRUNzDYM/v-deo.html ua-cam.com/video/ZyXvvORhTkE/v-deo.html Right now I'm about to make three doors on commission and just as you say, I know that the XL700 would be best suited for the job. Most of the time, though, I would prefer the smaller and lighter DF500 for making furniture and workshop equipment. The American company Seneca Woodworking is selling an adapter for using the DF500 router bits in the XL700. This would perhaps be a good option, but I would be stuck with the heavy machine always (unless I'd purchase both), and this is why i hesitate. - And I guess I could get by with a handheld router for making the doors. After all, we were making doors before the domino was invented... /Peter
@@whoisathome no no no, never think that you have to get special gear JUST to make youtube videos - content is king! If your video provides value in its subject matter, then quality always comes second. There are plenty of 4K woodworking videos out on the web that provide no value whatsoever. Sounds like you already have a niche subject in mind - guitars. There's certainly a community and an audience that would find that your insights quite helpful. I encourage you to get started on that journey and not let your decades of experience be lost! If you get a channel started, make sure you drop a link here in the comments, would love to check it out!
Around the 8 minute mark, you mention something that I was wondering about early on: maintaining the squareness of the cross-piece to the frame while plunging your Domino. Seems to me that with some tall dogs in your workbench would provide an edge that you could align both pieces to, negating the need for checking with a square. That assumes they are cut square in the first place, but I figure you already got that sorted.
I had a saying when I was in the military that “something that only takes a few seconds to check can save you hours of pain”. Granted, with this particular build, a domino being slightly out of alignment wouldn’t be that big of a hassle to correct, it’s still an additional step I would have to come back and correct. Having said all that, I’d still check for a square reference, no matter the system in place (dogs or butt of board). This video and technique is centered on preventing mistakes (because I made so many prior 😂) and having checks to ensure that. I think if anyone can figure out a way to have redundancies in their shop, that’s what I hope they gain from the video apart from the mentioned technique. I appreciate your insights!!
Yes it does as the joint will be stronger with the dominoes centered, but only near the breaking point. Mr. Marshal might have neglected to adjust the Domino for the thickness of his material. So the domino was likely set for 3/4" stock instead of whatever thickness he is actually using.
Yep, I agree! This was the first upload. If you are on instagram, find me and send a DM - @benmarshalldesigns. I'd be more than happy to send you a video of the process - and with less head movement 😫!!!
If you're going to wear a head-cam, you should get a neck brace. All the sudden, jerky motion (which would be perfectly natural without the camera) tends to give your viewers motion sickness. Good content, but I just can't watch more than a couple of minutes.
@@BenMarshallDesigns I have a small Veritas that I usually keep in my apron. It's great for transferring a mark from one side to an adjacent side. ua-cam.com/video/R4b1AaaCC-o/v-deo.html
UA-cam shows a black screen for 30-45 seconds. Check your options. If you set high lag options, you’re dead. On substance, weak. Way weak. Anyone who owns this gear, is a light year ahead of you. Try hard to find what you do differently. Check Bourbon Moth. Sorry. I’m never a fanboy. I tell the truth. This video was not at all worth watching.
I have heeded your words, ye olde wise and kind sage. I have traveled to the lands of Oregon, and have spoken the Bailey bardsman known as 'Jason Hibbs'. At first glance, our beards became entangled in a vicious battle the region had not seen for eons - two sexual beasts in their prime, tearing and lashing at each other to the death. Legend has it that in an instant, every person became pregnant within a 25 mile radius of our deathmatch. As the dust settled in the arena battle - our blood, sweat, and man juice dribbled off our cobble stone abs and chiseled square jaws. A lemur named Dodson let from the stadium and declared that day - there would be no victor. It was in that moment, a man named Victor stood from the silent crowd, and said "But my name is Victor, can I still be Victor or do I have to change my name to something else?" Dodson gazed puzzling at Victor, their eyes locked in a grid of pure hatred and angst - Dodson hurled his furry yet potent body at Victor - slashing and clawing at Victors face. Victors hand rose to his face, he pulled at the skin on his forehead, underneath a zippered flesh hood were two other lemurs - one atop the other. They both leaped from the flappy carcass formerly known as Victor. Who were they you ask??!?! Find out next time on "WORTHLESS COMMENTS FOUND ON YOUTUBBBEEEEEEE!!!!!!!"
Thanks for this. I was struggling to figure this out and came across your FOG post. No one else seems to offer best practices for aligning both sides. Thanks for sharing.
Right on!! I know EXACTLY how frustrating it can be to alight these up across a span! I'm glad you found it helpful and great to see a fellow FOG'r!
Well presented, but this is well covered in the expanded owners manual available on the Festool site.
@@fotopdo thanks! not many people know about the supplemental manual!! Thanks for sharing about it!
I guess Im kinda off topic but do anybody know a good site to stream newly released series online?
@Asa Ryland I would suggest Flixzone. You can find it on google :)
Thanks so much, I've seen a few videos with the domino, but this one really helped me to understand how to actually use it well
Nice! Glad it helped! Anything else that escapes you with the domino?
Great video Ben , I just bought my very first festool last weekend . Just so happens to be the df500q jointer . There is so much more to this tool then I expected lol I’ve been watching UA-cam videos none stop to get a better handle on how to use it , which I plan on this weekend. Thanks for the great video it’s been a huge help
Have fun!
Don't know if you guys do the same thing but I just got to the point in a project where I start to procrastinate because I'm worried about fucking up the next step of the process. Right now the next step is doing butt Joints with the domino and because of the nature of the table I'm doing they have to be absolutely exact. This video is exactly what I need to get me going again. Thanks Ben. It's nice to be using youtube to be productive for once.
Right on, Thomas!! Glad you're squared away for your current project! Good luck!
With the procrastination piece, I'd say that if there's a certain technique that worries you, or you're not sure how to move forward with joining some pieces or you're inexperienced with a method - practice on some scrap pieces first. Create a mock up of whatever it is you're trying to do: joint, glue up, cut, design feature, etc. No need to ruin your piece due to inexperience - and never rush to failure. Take your time with new techniques, do them over and over until you're confident in your skill. It'll make you excited to use that skill set again. Let us know how your project pans out - and if it doesn't, there's always more wood!!!
Down to earth lesson. Will save me
some frustration with the new Domino joiner. Thanks 👍
You're about to enter the world of "Domino everything!!!" Glad you found it helpful!
This is awesome. Every video i've seen doing butt joints in the middle of a panel doesn't seem to care where on the panel the joint sits, never would have thought to use it with the fence at 90 for both parts.
Hey thanks for watching! Glad you found it helpful. I had so many failed pieces that now have "domino accents" because I kept messing up which side of the panel I referenced the fence. Using this marking method removes that error all together.
@@BenMarshallDesigns Haha, my (relatively) well aligned cabinets are officially standing on the shoulders of Domino giants now. Thanks again!
@@brianbelgard5988 hey that's awesome!! You should throw in some domino accents just for old times sake!!!
Always tricky to line up all those butts for jointing but you make it look easy man! 😂 great tips!
Thanks Ben!
This was a great video and presentation of a good way to layout a project! Thanks for doing this!
Thanks, Tuan! Glad you found it helpful!
Great tip! Really helped with a book case project.
Awesome! Glad it helped! I recently made a small book case....but before figuring out this method 😂I have a few visible "domino" accents 😂😂😂I appreciate the feedback!
Thanks for this explanation, very helpful. I was wondering how to do a precise butt join with plywood panels and ensure they are placed precisely where I need them, this technique helps a lot, thanks.
Great!! Glad to have helped out and good luck on your project!
Awesome. Thank you for this tip. One thing I did notice... It doesn't apply in this scenario, but it would be good to indicate a line where the Domino will plunge on one board, and have that as a reference for the next board. In this case you used the fold out tabs of the Domino machine, however, if working with wide, flat stock like plywood, those tabs would not keep repeatable reference. Its just a thought. I'm not certain if my explanation is understandable.
Yeah sometimes multi-step procedures can be bard to follow in text lol! Depending on the width of the stock, you could use the positioning pins as a reference for each of the stock you're plunging.
Great video! Got a domino last year and haven’t really got a chance to mess with it much. The stock I am fixing to do is narrower than then what side pins will allow to reference off of so I am trying to figure that out.
Nice!!! Domino is a game changer in the shop. What stock are you working with? TheDF500 and 700 both come with great accessories to handle narrow stock
@@BenMarshallDesigns it’s about 2x3 inches with butt joint. I kinda figure out how to use the narrow stock tool for the end grain mortise but not side how to line up the other mortise because it’s not wide enough for pin reference. I am thinking I will just have to mark it and line up the mark.
@@iisreset yep, was going to recommend the narrow stock guide. There’s a lot of capabilities the domino has, just gotta keep playing with it!!
Loved the video, thank you!
When drilling the mortises did you reference off both paddles to get 2 holes or was one referenced off a paddle and the other referenced off the edge of the domino. It was too fast to notice.
Hey John, great question. Yes, I used the indexing stops on both sides of the stock material for this project. The stock width was 400mm, more than enough room to utilize the 37mm offset the indexing stops provide.
Too cool! Thank you!
Nice trick of the trade 👍
Glad you liked it!
Great tips, I've struggled with that myself
Thanks Brett!! I recently had to scrap an entire carcass on a bed build because of this exact issue. Whole frame was out of square except for one corner - an expensive mistake at that! Glad you found it helpful and share the struggle!! Appreciate the comment!
Gotta remember using the registration pins no need to mark the domino locations and using the actual pieces to each other for a right angle. Kudos m8
Thanks! Very true. I've found that sometimes plunges can be off (user error), and it helps to mark plunges, that way you can tell if the bit is going to plunge in the wrong location. Just depends on the work piece!
Great Tip. What width mortise do you use? Narrow or medium and which holes use witch? Thanks, I have used this method before on shelving for a wall unit I did.
on this particular build I used narrow on each as the stock was only 100mm wide. On larger panels, like on my most recent video, I do one narrow and the rest are medium. Marking before joining is such a huge time and patience saver. Of all my mistakes, it usually revolves around me not paying attention - marking keeps me in check! Appreciate your time to watch the video!
The dominos seem pretty close together, when would you decide to use 1 larger domino versus the two that you went with? thanks so much for sharing, appreciate it
I used two in this instance because of the width of the material. No matter which domino sizes you use, they all have the same width. Typically you only need the domino to be a 1/3 the thickness of the material you're using, so in this case, I could afford to use two smaller dominos. The dominos can be close or further apart, this does not impact the strength of the joint. As long as I have enough material on the substrate, it will be strong - the distance of separation of the dominos has no effect on strength.
Superb, thanks
Most welcome 😊
This was very helpful
Awesome!
Nice job!
Thanks Mike!
Good video, thank you. I'd say that for the base of a cabinet where the actual strength of the glue joint is not an issue, since the cabinet probably will be screwed to the base and thereby holding the whole "package" together, this is adequate. However, if this was part of, let's say a piece of furniture, like a leg and a rail for a table, I'd strongly suggest that the grain direction would be taken into account when orienting the dominos. When possible, you should always glue long grain to long grain. You could chose to do so also here by marking the centres instead and used the center line on the machine, which would have increased the strength considerably. As I said initially, for this application I have no objection, but it is important to be aware of the different aspects of how wood works. Kind regards. / Peter
Peter, thanks for taking the time to watch AND give such a detailed comment. This project was the base/toekick for a modular bed build. Appreciate the tips! You seem quite knowledgable!
@@BenMarshallDesigns Thank you, Ben. I guess forty-five years in the trade does that to you. I contemplating buying a domino myself, but I can't decide which of the two to get; that's why I was watching your video. Keep up the good work... Cheers
@@whoisathome wow!! Maybe you should start a youtube channel! I'm sure you've got tons of knowledge! Yeah it's a hard to decide with the 500 or 700. I knew that I would mainly be working with 18mm sheet goods, so it was an easy decision. If you plan on doing thicker stock pieces (or heavy furniture/doors) then go with the 700. Thanks for the convo!
@@BenMarshallDesigns Good idea, Ben; I've thought about starting a UA-cam channel for a while - and I think I will do that some time. I've actually made an attempt already with a couple of videos about a saw sled for resawing on the band saw. Besides making furniture and other wooden objects, I mainly make guitars now and this sled is aimed at resawing backs and sides for guitars. These videos are shot with an iphone 5 and I realise that I need better gear for doing a proper job filming. Hopefully I will take the plunge in the future.
Here are a couple of links to these video clips:
ua-cam.com/video/pRAJRUNzDYM/v-deo.html
ua-cam.com/video/ZyXvvORhTkE/v-deo.html
Right now I'm about to make three doors on commission and just as you say, I know that the XL700 would be best suited for the job. Most of the time, though, I would prefer the smaller and lighter DF500 for making furniture and workshop equipment. The American company Seneca Woodworking is selling an adapter for using the DF500 router bits in the XL700. This would perhaps be a good option, but I would be stuck with the heavy machine always (unless I'd purchase both), and this is why i hesitate. - And I guess I could get by with a handheld router for making the doors. After all, we were making doors before the domino was invented... /Peter
@@whoisathome no no no, never think that you have to get special gear JUST to make youtube videos - content is king! If your video provides value in its subject matter, then quality always comes second. There are plenty of 4K woodworking videos out on the web that provide no value whatsoever. Sounds like you already have a niche subject in mind - guitars. There's certainly a community and an audience that would find that your insights quite helpful. I encourage you to get started on that journey and not let your decades of experience be lost! If you get a channel started, make sure you drop a link here in the comments, would love to check it out!
Around the 8 minute mark, you mention something that I was wondering about early on: maintaining the squareness of the cross-piece to the frame while plunging your Domino. Seems to me that with some tall dogs in your workbench would provide an edge that you could align both pieces to, negating the need for checking with a square. That assumes they are cut square in the first place, but I figure you already got that sorted.
I had a saying when I was in the military that “something that only takes a few seconds to check can save you hours of pain”. Granted, with this particular build, a domino being slightly out of alignment wouldn’t be that big of a hassle to correct, it’s still an additional step I would have to come back and correct. Having said all that, I’d still check for a square reference, no matter the system in place (dogs or butt of board). This video and technique is centered on preventing mistakes (because I made so many prior 😂) and having checks to ensure that. I think if anyone can figure out a way to have redundancies in their shop, that’s what I hope they gain from the video apart from the mentioned technique. I appreciate your insights!!
Does it matter that your mortises are offset?
What do you mean?
Yes it does as the joint will be stronger with the dominoes centered, but only near the breaking point. Mr. Marshal might have neglected to adjust the Domino for the thickness of his material. So the domino was likely set for 3/4" stock instead of whatever thickness he is actually using.
Did you buy those as S4S, or did you have to mill the studs yourself?
They were originally 2x6, I trimmed them down to 100mm (??) I believe. I used the parallel festool guides and track saw to do that.
@@BenMarshallDesigns NICE!!
Like your shop helper, stay calm.
I'm sure he thinks I'm the shop helper 😂🐈
Thank you for this tip.
You're welcome! Glad you found it helpful!
@@BenMarshallDesigns I own a Festool DF700 XL doing these types of joints a bit more difficult. I might have used through dominos for this.
@@dsdragoon Yeah, I can see how lugging the 700 would be more difficult. Time to pick up at 500?!?
Helpful and interesting video obviously a bit of extra camera movement
However, thank you
Thanks! Yes, no more head mounted cameras 😆 only video thankfully incorporated with that style
@@BenMarshallDesigns Improving your workshop one step at a time is a lifelong journey Ben, good luck with all your projects
@@JonDunnmusician absolutely!! Good luck in yours as well!
Yo thanks man
🤜🏻🤛🏻
Looked like it would be helpful but I got motion sick trying to watch it. Need a cameraman
Yep, I agree! This was the first upload. If you are on instagram, find me and send a DM - @benmarshalldesigns. I'd be more than happy to send you a video of the process - and with less head movement 😫!!!
If you're going to wear a head-cam, you should get a neck brace. All the sudden, jerky motion (which would be perfectly natural without the camera) tends to give your viewers motion sickness. Good content, but I just can't watch more than a couple of minutes.
I appreciate the feedback and hate that it gave you discomfort. Points noted!!
Good info and nice technique but this gives me motion sickness. I’d suggest a cameraman or at least a tripod.
thankfully it was the only video I recorded like this!
Get a saddle square.
Who makes that? What is it?
@@BenMarshallDesigns
I have a small Veritas that I usually keep in my apron. It's great for transferring a mark from one side to an adjacent side.
ua-cam.com/video/R4b1AaaCC-o/v-deo.html
UA-cam shows a black screen for 30-45 seconds. Check your options. If you set high lag options, you’re dead.
On substance, weak. Way weak. Anyone who owns this gear, is a light year ahead of you.
Try hard to find what you do differently. Check Bourbon Moth.
Sorry. I’m never a fanboy. I tell the truth. This video was not at all worth watching.
I have heeded your words, ye olde wise and kind sage. I have traveled to the lands of Oregon, and have spoken the Bailey bardsman known as 'Jason Hibbs'. At first glance, our beards became entangled in a vicious battle the region had not seen for eons - two sexual beasts in their prime, tearing and lashing at each other to the death. Legend has it that in an instant, every person became pregnant within a 25 mile radius of our deathmatch. As the dust settled in the arena battle - our blood, sweat, and man juice dribbled off our cobble stone abs and chiseled square jaws. A lemur named Dodson let from the stadium and declared that day - there would be no victor. It was in that moment, a man named Victor stood from the silent crowd, and said "But my name is Victor, can I still be Victor or do I have to change my name to something else?" Dodson gazed puzzling at Victor, their eyes locked in a grid of pure hatred and angst - Dodson hurled his furry yet potent body at Victor - slashing and clawing at Victors face. Victors hand rose to his face, he pulled at the skin on his forehead, underneath a zippered flesh hood were two other lemurs - one atop the other. They both leaped from the flappy carcass formerly known as Victor. Who were they you ask??!?!
Find out next time on "WORTHLESS COMMENTS FOUND ON YOUTUBBBEEEEEEE!!!!!!!"