Why New Bands Don't Play Gibson Guitars
Вставка
- Опубліковано 20 кві 2022
- Gibson is one of the most legendary guitar brands out there, and has been making guitars for over 100 years, but after some rocky years in the past decades, have they finally lost their appeal with young musicians?
Check out my brand new Chords and Rhythm video course here:
rhettshullguitarcourses.com/p...
------------
SIGN UP FOR THE INNER CIRCLE HERE:
rhettshullguitarcourses.com/p...
MY VIDEO COURSES:
Fretboard Fundamentals
rhettshullguitarcourses.com/p/ff
Fretboard Fundamentals: Chords and Rhythm
rhettshullguitarcourses.com/p...
The Complete Nashville Number System video course
rhettshullguitarcourses.com/p...
The Tone Course
rhettshullguitarcourses.com/p...
------------
GEAR USED IN TODAY'S VIDEO:
Two Notes Torpedo Captor X
imp.i114863.net/c/2330848/937...
Mogami Gold Guitar Cable
imp.i114863.net/c/2330848/937...
MY HOME STUDIO SETUP:
Universal Audio Apollo X4
imp.i114863.net/c/2330848/937...
Universal Audio 4-710D Mic Pre and Compressor
imp.i114863.net/2rW9L7
Yamaha HS7 Studio Monitors
imp.i114863.net/c/2330848/937...
Sennheiser MKH416 Shotgun Mic
imp.i114863.net/c/2330848/937...
------------
MY PRESETS & PROFILES:
Line 6 HX Stomp Presets
www.rhettshull.com/helix/hx-s...
Line 6 Helix & Helix LT Presets
www.rhettshull.com/helix
Kemper Profiles
www.rhettshull.com/kemperprof...
Impulse Responses (Helix, Kemper, Iridium & AxeFx)
www.rhettshull.com/helix/rhet...
------------
MY SECOND CHANNEL:
Rhett Shull Studio
/ @rhettshulltwo
MY DISCORD SERVER:
/ discord
DEACON KNIGHT (my band):
/ @deaconknight1939
------------
THE BACKSTAGE JOURNAL PODCAST:
(apple) podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast...
(spotify) open.spotify.com/show/1q8Rrv4...
------------
Business Enquiries
Support@RhettShull.com
SHIPPING ADDRESS:
5805 State Bridge Road
Suite G90
Johns Creek Ga
30097
------------
My Video Rig (affiliate links)
CAMERA:
-Sony A7III (affiliate link)
amzn.to/2NDqJW2
LENSES:
-Sony 24-105mm f4 (affiliate link)
amzn.to/3svZuLZ
-Sigma 35mm f1.4 (affiliate link)
amzn.to/37M01S6
-Sigma 50mm f1.4 (affiliate link)
amzn.to/3dM4FDm
LIGHTS:
-Neewer LED Panel Bi Color (affiliate link)
amzn.to/3kzkb73
SOUND:
-Sennheiser MKH 416 Shotgun Mic (affiliate link)
imp.i114863.net/c/2330848/937...
-Universal Audio Apollo X4 (affiliate link)
imp.i114863.net/c/2330848/937...
-Zoom H6 Handy Recorder (affiliate link)
imp.i114863.net/c/2330848/937...
For what it’s worth, fender gave free guitars to a ton of bands at this years Coachella as a targeted marketing push and it worked super well.
Smart marketing!
Fender gave guitars to people I know in moderately successful indie bands (that already played Fenders mind you) and it really surprised me, I think they have good artist reps and push their brand that way. Seems smart to me.
Gibson has terrible, out of touch ownership. They wouldn't even think of doing this.
@@SimoneProvencher Yeah even back in the day they would day this. They would offer 1 or 2 custom shop guitars to smaller bands that were up and coming (but signed).
Also, those bands if they didn't play Fender, likely will now. When a company gives you a guitar, ots rarely what's on the wall if you're a major artist. It's gonna have a little more there. Fender has always marketed better than any guitar manufacturer, just look back to the "You won't part with yours, either." shtick. It was a major point in how the brand ever became so popular.
I sold guitars for years and our company got into Fender because Gibson expected us to carry what they said we should carry and it had to be a certain amount and Fender just made it so much easier to get in business with them . We just sold more because of simply the price point and variety. Gibson has a history of getting in their own way
And this will be why Fender will continue to gain market share and Gibson will continue losing it. I love both brands, but I do tend to pick up Fender's when it is time to play. Gibson could make it easier for dealers and therefore make it easier for consumers to buy Gibsons. When Fender f*cks up, you do not notice it because of all the models and price points. Gibson, however... two words: Theo Dore.
My favorite shop here in Phoenix ran into the same situation as far as Gibson goes. They ended up not being an authorized Gibson dealer because of it, but then once the re-organization happened they signed another deal with them. They absolutely get in their own way, at least back in the day they used to. I don’t know what the future holds.
That less sentence ! Once I've got to know store owners in the past this always comes up.
@Magic They do it's called charvel & Jackson
Heard basically the same from all my music-store friends, back in the days before GC took over everything.
In the mid-nineties, I happened to be loitering in a small independent guitar store when I heard the owner slam his phone down and throw a minor fit. Gibson had just told him he had to buy 36 guitars within 30 days in order to keep his dealership. This was a small shop, and the demand was ridiculous. I responded by buying a HH Tele. Since then, I've picked up a second Tele, a Strat, a Jag, and a Jazzmaster. But not a single Gibson. While Gibson's hardball tactics I described happened decades ago, I've never forgotten it, and won't every buy a new Gibson. That said, my first guitar was an Ibanez law suit LP Jr with P90s, and I've sent 40 years wishing I still had that one... Speaking of heroes, it was Frank Black who inspired my Tele purchase, and Elvis Costello who got me into a Jazzmaster. Slash who? Oh, he's the guy I cursed daily when I used to work at a music store, where we desperately needed a 'No Sweet Child' sign... ;-)
Does anyone else remember when Gibson tried to go after Fender in the 90s with the Nighthawk? It was definitely a Steve Buscemi disguised as a youth moment. Meanwhile every other indie or grunge musician was playing a $100 Jaguar or Jazzmaster.
But I think that besides the lower cost of Fenders (and similar guitars, and especially Squier, which, hello, you're looking mighty nice these days) you've hit the nail on the head. Gibsons - specifically Les Pauls and SGs - look like your dad's or your grandpa's guitars, or the guitars of their rock gods. Fender started as a guitar company that quickly pivoted to the youth anyway, so between the two it's been a real battle that may have been drawn across generational lines. Definitely not for everyone, but enough so that it can matter. I think there are other considerations as well: Fenders are generally lighter (or perceived as such) than Gibsons; I think that the tonal characteristics of Fenders is perceived to be more "wide open," more of a blank slate for you to add your color to, whereas Gibson seems a little "locked in," even if that's not actually true; Fender draws on history and tradition where Gibson seems to use it like a crutch, almost bludgeoning you with "This is how it's always been done." Don't get me wrong, it's been done great, but...what's new?
And maybe I don't know what I'm really talking about. But I will say that I just got back into guitars after a 25 year hiatus, having originally read about and played them from roughly 1991 to 2000, and when I recently saw the state of Fender and Gibson I wasn't really surprised. It's the trajectory they've been on for decades now.
Lol my Epiphone Nighthawk was one of my favorite guitars. I've never liked the weight or thickness of the Gibson/Epiphone LP. The Nighthawk was perfect for the half-dozen people like me that just wanted the LP look but Strat ergonomics.
Most musicians think higher end guitars are somehow "handmade". Actually most are machine sculpted and mass produced on an assembly line. Luthiers have little to do with production these days. The only real differences are the types of wood and pickups. There are truly handmade guitars but you need deeper pockets.
I do think musical instruments have a fashion element, but but Gibsons are all out there in guitar centers for you to try. You gotta admit that when you play a Gibson, it’s hard to put down.
@@GoddamnAxlnot for me it isn't. Haha.
I don't think it's any of that. You're overthinking it hardcore. It's Fenders style. It appeals more to younger players. They look more modern and progressive.
It feels like every week I see a young indie / pop artist around my age (I’m 22) post their brand new guitar that Fender have given them for free no strings attached, and it definitely makes a world of difference in how the brand is perceived. Fender is showing themselves to be supportive of young artists and in turn young artists want to play Fender. I couldn’t tell you an artist I listen to regularly who plays Gibson (a couple play Epiphone tho)
You said "No strings attached"... kinda funny.... what's a guitar without strings.
@@kevinrinehart Beat me to it.
This, yes, I've noticed it. Take some young new band, look at what they play in their old videos vs. what they play on their 'first US tour' or whatever. One old interview with Flaming Lips talked about how the Fender rep came to their shows and was like "Oh, you have Squier? No, no - we're going to hook you up" Its nothing new for Fender.
To be fair though you really can pick up a mexican made fender and get an amazing guitar for like 500 bucks that'll serve you forever. They win in terms of both the cool factor AND the value factor.
I'm pretty sure the strings are attached to the guitars...
As a young musician, I can affirm that no one in my scene plays Gibson purely because of the cost. "Influence" has very little to do with why we play the instruments we play. In the Austin alt scene, people play Fenders, Gretsches, Epiphones, anything they can get their hands on. If Gibson released good Les Pauls and ES 335s for around $800, there's no doubt that people would be playing them. I don't want tot sound unappreciative of Gibson's designs; they are definitely priced currently for how much effort goes into making them. What I'm saying is that that point is moot. Guitarists will go with the instrument they can afford over the one they want any day; the music has to be played, and if you don't have an instrument because you can't afford your favorite one, that won't happen.
I mean…. You can get an ESP Eclipse or a Dean Thoroughbred with all the upgrades and accessories for a fraction of the price of a Les Paul and have something far superior and much more unique.
Not gonna lie, I’ve even considered getting a Dean Caddilac, a Les Paul on steroids! Hahaha :P
@@andysixxlett2632 I mean to each their own, I think (and this is just my opinion) there is a sort of reverence and mysticism to a Gibson (whether that be a good or bad thing) and like I said, Gibson puts a lot of effort into their expensive guitars; that's why they're expensive. I just know that me and most other young (and kinda broke) musicians aren't going to scrimp and save for a guitar that, like you said, can be done as well or better for much cheaper
Agree. I’m no longer completely broke and
I still won’t spend $3k+ on a guitar. I play my guitars on stage. They get scratched. They fall off stands.
My guitars are worn because they get played regularly and sometime hard.
My wallet won’t let me do that on an expensive show piece when I can play something 1/3 the price that sound/plays as good.
Spot on. Most musicians cannot afford a 2500.00 guitar. Not sure I'd want one. 500.00 to 800.00 you're gonna get a decent guitar you can gig with. Also over time and parts you can built it.
@@kevinmurphy65 That's a great point, maybe it has to do with image/pricepoint, but it seems much more realistic to mod a Fender to what you want than a Gibson.
For $2000+ you can't even get stainless steel frets, a locking tremolo, or a volute. Gibson makes guitars for wealthy collectors, not players.
Seriously, 2k+ is fkn crazy for no stainless steel frets
flying v
real players play a gibson V
don't you have to go to the fender strat ultra lux at $2600+ to get ss frets on an American made fender?
At rock & metal shows and festivals, Gibson and ESP seem to rule the day. Jackson, Charvel and Ibanez are also doing well. But you rarely spot a Fender at those shows.
John 5 is the exception
You also rarely see people younger than 40 years old on those kinds of boomer festivals.
@@prkp7248I wouldn’t really label all of rock and metal as “boomer” stuff. That’s just not accurate at all
@@prkp7248You are wrong, go to tech death metal shows and most people are under 40.
I work in a guitar store, I would say about 50% of the high end Gibsons we get in need to be returned for various defects. Their quality control and fit and finish just aren't up to scratch for the cash they're asking. Just my personal experience, but I think that's the issue again particularly for the absurd amounts of cash they're asking.
This is huge insight. Thanks for sharing.
I think it's also because when they relocated their factory, a lot of their best luthiers and artisans chose to stay behind and founded their own high end guitar company instead called Heritage Guitars.
Which store?
Exactly. If you're willing to drop Gibson money, just get a PRS
@@fartexplosion4480 or Ibanez, Yamaha, Charvel etc. etc.
When I was a kid in the early 90's, Gibson was the "really nice guitar" brand. A few years later and you've got Ibanez getting really good, along with up and coming Parkers, PRS, etc. Nowadays, just about everyone makes something fantastic.
Except Gibson, They really aren't worth the price. I have a £90 335 copy that looks and plays better than an actual 335.
Really good analysis of the role of the guitar in the music scene as it stands. I like that you've made this extrapolation to things like the Grammies and modern musicians outside the 'rock' genre. Fender noticed this shift in culture and is riding the wave.
I agree especially the part about having an artist to promote the brand such as the case of PRS bringing in John Mayer. Having a popular artist tied to using a brand really helps to promote the brand. This is also the case for Ibanez where currently Polyphia really helps to boost their brand. I guess Gibson really needs to find a new famous player to have him/her use their brand to market to the younger generations.
I volunteer myself as tribute LOL
Rhett nailed it at 3:55 -- Leo Fender was an *engineer* working on making affordable, repairable, practical tools for working musicians.
@Luther Blissett He started off as a Radio Repair man. And Electronics Wizard.
@Luther Blissett He never took a course but could fix a tube radio and build a guitar amp and design and build some of the best electric guitars and amps ever.Hmm sounds like a wizard to me!
70 years ago --- he left gibson behind and they have not figured that out yet....
Yep. And Fender being made in Mexico makes them even more affordable.
@@trevor-johnsen and the quality is still good, there's not much between an American made and Mexican made
Gibson is nice but fairly expensive and not the only thing going. Others make great instruments. Maybe better. Gibson is like Harley Davidson, cool looking and loud with good resale. That's cool but not the only answer to instruments.
Funny you mention that, I recently had a conversation with someone and we compared Gibson to harley Davidson.
Actually great analogy!
I love my Harley-Davidson guitars Germany sends them to me LOL
@@Reportageandart same. Gibson tried to be a lifestyle brand and missed the mark big time.
Gibson - Harley Davidson
Epiphone - Honda
Fender - Ford
Ibanez - Toyota
Jackson - Kawasaki
Dean - Indian
Yamaha - Yamaha
I was just remarking on the same thing to my jam buddy. I went to a small music festival recently and saw exactly one Gibson (a Les Paul) and like a dozen Telecasters (even a Jaguar appearance). Fenders play well, they're affordable, they're bomb-proof, and the company has all kinds of really well-designed educational material out there for people to learn from.
Went to a sweetwater store and was guided through the store to find the right guitar for me. after some playing around with some guitars that were aestetically interesting, i found a love for the PRS Custom SE 24 in a Turquiose finish. I am a gemstone collector and i listen to all kinds of music from southern gothic to djent, but i dont listen to much country. Versatility was a major focus that needed to be addressed and it was addressed properly with my needs as a beginner guitar player. I dont have it yet, but once i get my financial aid back, im going to pick it up at the location and get to work with it. I am really hyped and excited and i cant wait to delve deep into the world of guitars. I think my AD(H)D can appreciate it as well.
You got help from some at sweetwater ? Wow that’s crazy lol . I live in ft Wayne and hate going in there . Salespeople standing around computers . Gotta beg someone to buy something . In used area I get help .in the new area hardly ever . I ordered my last item from there . As I went In and couldn’t get help lol. So free shipping went home and ordered. Made me miss guitar center really .
Hey kev, yeah i did!
I called them up and told them about my experience and that what was said was not exactly met with the same action. I saw the same thing you say as well but i did get the help i needed. I ended up pulling the trigger on a different guitar though and it was the PRS SE Custom 24-08 in faded blue with a boss katana 100 mk2.
So far I have been having a blast learning and am looking forward to where else this takes me in my journey through learning this awesome instrument! :D@@kevinroulette
This vintage SG of yours you were holding almost throughout the video was a silent yet blatent hint about a simple-to-manufacture-and-iconic guitar that Gibson could market more to younger players. Does make a lot of sense.
Yup, they just need to add a volute onto the back of the headstock to strengthen that weak point.
@@ChrisJimenez2010 But a volute will remind the blues lawyer crowd about the dark ages of the Norlin era! Volute bad! Change bad!
I’ve always loved the SG, S-style guitars are really popular these days and with good marketing and artist endorsements, Gibson can be a more popular choice in the modern music landscape.
@@ChrisJimenez2010 I’ve spoken with some fairly reputable guys over at the Dean custom shop and volutes are pretty much just a placebo. The way those headstock breaks happen is due to the wood the guitars are being made out of being lower quality and the headstock angle. I know I appreciate a volute but it won’t save a Gibson’s headstock if it’s in conditions where a headstock break will happen like an airline or shipping.
While that's a cool and versatile guitar, SGs are largely associated with AC/DC, which is as boomer rock as it can get. So probably not what younger players really want.
I feel like the Epiphone brand is doing great things in the affordable space. With the new headstock design, the signature models... they're killing it.
Especially with people like Matt heafy being endorsed artists
For a variety of reasons, there are lots of people who are simply done with buying Chinese guitars. For them, MIC is a non-starter.
I'm mainly just a rhythm guitarist & I always found Gibsons kind of clunky and awkward, a real "dinosaur" gutar. I got an Epiphone Masterbilt DeLuxe a while back & it's awesome. Great quality. Kind of old school jazzy feel.
@@kentucky1519 totally agree!
@@UA-camHandlesAreMoronic that’s definitely true.
Im 23 years old, 24 on a couple months. I have been playing les pauls since my first Les Paul at age 10 (an Epiphone Les Paul 100) I now play one of two LPs, a Custom in Ebony, and a Slash Standard, both Epiphone’s as much as yes I would love a Gibson in general I love LP style guitars. For me I feel the LP feels like home, the overall layout and feel is both the most comfortable for me, and makes me feel in complete control over my sound having independent controls for each pickup. My custom has become my main but any LP style guitar feels more of a fit for me than any Strat ive owned
I agree with you. I'm a 60's culture etc. player/singer/performer for +3 decades with electric/acoustic guitars, but I jam at home with "solid body" guitars. I have one Gibson Super Jumbo 200, but usually play one of my Epiphone EJ 200's at gigs. I finally ordered a new Gibson SG Standard last summer and though I've had a USA Deluxe Strat for years, this SG surpasses it in my hands, not meaning it's any better, it just fits. Gibsons cost too much, no doubt about it, but I like them, love them, yes I do! Great vid on your part.
A lot of good points in this video. I also rarely see young artists playing Gibsons. SGs are the most common if anything, and they are often on the cheaper side of Gibson.
I have an epiphone SG I love, I do want to buy a Gibson though just to have the name in my collection haha that's all anyone cares for now
I think the Jr and the special is the two best sounding designs they have and I think they should tackle that market a bit more
@@jeebusyaweirdo3733 I think the junior double cutaway could have a model with 3 pickups, different wood ( not mahogany) say swamp ash and even made with a bolt on neck in maple and rosewood fingerboard. Ibanez Les Paul’s in the late 70’s had maple necks and sounded great. They just need to adopt a different approach to what they do to include a lot of todays younger generation. Fenders have always been preferable for clean tones. Mahogany guitars have less snap to them. Paul Reed Smith has branched over to fender territory, why can’t Gibson?
I'm about to pull the purchase trigger and buy a SG Junior
The only Gibson I’ve ever owned in 24 years of playing was an SG (had to sell it to afford an engagement ring, but that’s another story). Every guitar I’ve owned before or since has been Fender.
I’m glad that Squier has upped the quality so much. I’ve seen touring bands with Jazzmasters and Jags slightly modded and they sound amazing.
Never would have guessed ten, fifteen years ago.
I have a Squier Affinity Strat, definitely sounds a lot like the higher priced Fenders and it looks and feels good to play. Plus there's so much room for upgrading parts for not much money if I want to.
Yep! I have a Squier CV Jazzmaster with custom pickups, staytrem bridge and wiring and it is by far the best guitar I own! Squier guitars are awesome.
Steve Rothery (Marillion) have used Squier for many years
The CV's are really nice at €400.
Squire's are severely underrated. They are good basis for a beginning guitarist. Particularly after a luthier or hobbyist makes some adjustments
Gibson and ESP are my go to guitars for a variety of different tones. I have a Gibson Les Paul Standard 60's sunburst and the alnico 5 '61 PAF humbuckers sound great. I love the tone of those pickups and what Seymour Duncan is doing with like the SH-1, SH-16, SH-5, SH-14, and JB along with the Sentient, Pegeus, and even Nazgul. They pair well even we with the SH-1 '59 and SH-2 jazz neck humbuckers. The Fender because of the alder body tones had to have special pickups like the '78 custom for thicker higher gain tones. If single coils and fuzz is your thing Fenders are perfect! It really depends on what you're trying to do.
Hi. I own a few Fenders and Gibsons. I would say that I have modified all the Fenders to get the sounds I want and to play like I want them to. I have rarely had to do the same to the Gibsons.
Gibsons are heavy and sound like toot
@@psplayer1344 I assume by 'toot' you mean 'bad'. I have 7 Gibsons and all are awesome. Perhaps you can't appreciate quality?
@@psplayer1344 ...and SGs are not heavy
@@robw9994 they’re top heavy 😂😂😂
What is the average all in cost of your Fenders and Gibsons?
Fender pushing the Squire Affinity Series put some classics in the hands of a lot of kids and turned them onto the Fender brand in the process. Fender is kicking ass all over the place, not just with it's Guitars, but it's Amps, FX, and other accessories. Gibson's expensive guitars and late to the game retro pedals are stuck in the past, and I agree they need a kick in the ass if they're going to remain relevant.
My 1st guitar was the Squire Affinity & it was a fabulous beginner guitar & I just sold it to another beginner today!
i never liked Gibson but that's just my taste. i am now in love with my Jackson MJ SL2 that is basically a fender with 24 frets and a Floyd rose. I really prefer the neck profile over any other brand. Gibson guitars are too bulky, heavy, and expensive of course.
What a time to start guitar. New cheap guitars and amps are so much better than what I started out on.
That's a fact! And light years ahead of what I started on in the '70s.
Yup really is the golden age
My dad is blown away
@@216trixie Yea especially if you get a Modeling Amp that has all the different amps and effects all rolled into one. Not a great amp for live shows but for practicing its awesome. Got the Fender Mustang GT 100w was only $399 and they really pay tribute to other amps and effect pedals! It's also a good way to fine tune your tone for when u want to go with tube amps and actual pedals for live performance or if you're in a band.
Yep, my knockoff Strat and 335 cost me a total of $264.00 to my door. I'm 74 and have played since I was 14.
The quality of a squire is pretty amazing its so accessible
Saw Rick's video showing how guitar was getting more prevalent in music again. Very good video.
I have seen some cool guitars not from Fender or Gibson.
Miyako Watanabe plays her Dean Signature V among other Dean's she has. She's a multi-instrumentalist. She recently picked up a Gibson Flying V. She does have a Les Paul she uses for a couple songs.
Miku Kobato plays her Zemaitis Signature Flappy Pigeon guitar. She may be primarily a rhythm guitarist and back up/co lead vocalist, but she's the brains behind her band.
Dimebag Darrell Abbott (RIP) used Dean.
I also want to mention that the Guitar Slash was playing that sparked new life back into the dying company was actually a fake Gibson made by a Luthier in California. Look up the back story. It's crazy how lucky Gibson was to have that happen.
Yep. Then Gibson eventually made a replica of that copy.
Damn...what's that dude's name again...hes dead now, shit....I'll remember in a second...
Gosh, everyone knows that
It's not just Slash. There's various players that had knockoffs when they started, meaning it was never the Gibson "magic" but the players themselves!
@@maJastoL and priced it for 3x what the going rate for a Standard was at the time
I'd like to chime in as a bass player
I've been playing for over 45 years and could never find a Gibson bass that could beat a Fender. It seems that the Bass to Gibson was a "Throwaway Product." Their best sellers were muddy-sounding short-scale basses with necks with the cross-section of a telephone pole. The Thunderbird was a TOO HEAVY, Muddy-sounding long-scale bass with a neck like a telephone pole. The only bass that might have broken that mold was the Victory Bass, but that was only made for a couple years in the early '80s.
I really don't think Gibson cares about the bass market, especially when I see the release of a Signature model named for Gene Simmonds.
Geez, that guy is almost as old as I am (I'm 71.)
Oh, well...enough said....Rhett, you do a great job! Keep up the excellent work!
My Ripper is pretty cool.
I have a thunderbird. I agree it is too muddy. Musicman and P-Basses are better.
Yeah, Gibson basses kind of suck. With that said the Jack Cassidy Epihone bass is brilliant and it is affordable.
I play guitar, but in 1980-82, the bass player in my band player a Gibson Ripper ! , and always sounded great ! I'll admit that Fender Jazz & Precision are great instruments.
Not a pro bassist, I do prefer short scale since I’m a guitarist, but I sold my Fender MIM Mustang when I tried that Gibson Les Paul DC Junior Tribute bass, mostly because the Mustang was a boat anchor. Out of all the Gibson bass pickups, that LP Bass pickup is actually good, in both humbucker andsplit. But that bass is so off the radar, I don’t think anyone else plays it. (I kind of like that.)
Yes the name is WAY too long, especially since they don’t make a Special version with two pickups, so why even bother calling it a Junior??? (Tribute just denotes it has a maple neck (with lightweight Hipshot tuners it has no neck dive) and Les Paul DC is just the Les Paul double cut body shape.)
Just seeing this video. Great content.
I would like your take on Ibanez.
Nice analysis of the subject.
Gibson has a massive image problem. For a consumer demographic that's never been enamored with corporate culture, younger musicians today have even less patience with corporate nonsense than previous generations. And in the guitar industry, Gibson stands alone as the stereotypical fat-cat, bean-counter, out-of-touch, profit-only corporate suits.
Gibson is constantly reinforcing this image with its clueless branding fiascos. PR disasters like Mark Agnesi's cringe-inducing "play authentic" videos, their litigation with what seems like everyone in the industry, their cease and desist letter campaigns, and perhaps most importantly their LACK of quality control screams everything that’s wrong in the music industry.
The comparison group for Gibson is not their past corporate selves. It’s other guitar manufacturers. So, saying they’re better now than the previous corporate train wrecks is meaningless, and I’m not sure that’s even true.
You talk like if Gibson could give a fuck about you guys. They don't, live with it and get yourselves some nice MIM Teles and be happy.
The problem is that when they tried to be original it backfired too. And that also resulted in them destroying a bunch of perfectly good surplus guitars, which didn't help with their image either. I wish robot tuners caught on a bit more (because in 10/20 years they will be super rare and sought after) because they seem like an interesting creative tool.
Good points. I had Gibsons as far back as 1969 forward that were relatively affordable to me as a young musician (I bought an excellent condition late 1950s ES-335 w/OHSC for only $185 in WASH DC's Georgetown area and sold it the next week for the same, because I did not like the fat neck, and moved onto a brand new SG Std. for $250 at old man Veneman's Music first location in Rockville, MD). The problems arrived with the later "vintage market" and Wall Streeter Henry J. buying the company in the mid 1980s, for sure. He priced them right out of sight for the average or working musician, with no budget models. A very stupid and arrogant man IMHO. Fender and other brands jumped in, listening more to the average musician and Gibson's market share went way down, no doubt. They had a lot of good will working for them up until the mid 1980s.
They've become the luxury item with the luxury price tag that's assembled at closing time on a Friday. Until they fix their headstock/neck joint issues decisively, care at least as much about paint as the Chinese knockoffs with playability and setup that comes within a country mile of the PRS SE guitars, they're mining nostalgia, and a lot of us who lust after those vintage guitars are getting a fix from Squier in the sub-$500 market. It's way cheaper to pretend that you're Eric Johnson than it is to pretend you're Angus Young in both the foreign and domestic guitars. Fender doesn't make inherently worse quality and value guitars than Squier. The same cannot be said for Gibson and Epiphone.
Most is online propaganda that stems from Gibson fighting back against the Obama administration for needlessly seizing their wood. It was seen as an attack against a Republican donor by an over reaching left wing government. That’s when the anti-Gibson propaganda started, spread b6 those who can’t even afford them
The truth is you go to the guitar store and they have like 20 different Squire models of different styles and colors. They all look really great and sound fine! When it comes to Les Paul's or SGs, there are like 2-3 models max, and the finish on those guitars are usually pretty ugly at the entry level. So people learn to play guitar in Fender land from the start and the obvious upgrade is more accessible then jumping to a new type of guitar as we get better (now, that could be a reflection of the trend of course. Like, not the reason for it but the response to it). I'm saying this as someone who loves my Epiphone G-400 '65 Reissue and my J Mascis Jazzmaster.
Some of the better Gibson-inspired Epiphone models are amazing and seem very well priced.
Gibson is going to compete very hard I think. They also have to compete with Sire and other new brands. When you have an overseas competitor making a very nice semi hollow guitar for $700, look out…
@@j_freed The Korean made Epiphones are really nice but I wouldn't really call them well priced, they're like $700 in an era when $450 Ibanaz or Schecter guitars will walk all over them. Fender had the same problem in the early 1990s with Peavey guitars but they got their act together by the late 90s.
Yeah but they also only have two models lol
@@xaphan8581 nah they usually have a few types of teles, strats, JM, even some jaguars!! I've even seen thinline squiers!
@@davidmckean955 Ibanez makes insane guitars for the price. Unless you're a stickler for vintage designs most ibanez Wizard necked guitars destroy their competition when it comes to playability.
Well said. I played plain jane Strats through Fender amps for years in my journey starting in 2004. But I wanted to play music that frankly didn't get created that way. I wanted to cover GNR, Alice in Chains, the works. Hard rock that I grew up with. It took me too long to get the opportunity to get my hands on a Gibson Les Paul Standard. But I fell in love with it instantly. I bought my first and only Gibson LP from Vic Dapra here in Pittsburgh (he has his own Gibson signature models, look it up!) and after rewiring it, putting jumbo stainless steel frets on it, and countless other modifications to make it my own, it's my #1 today and it will stay with me forever. They do cost more, certainly. But I agree, I don't think they are overpriced. There is just a lot more that goes into them compared to the Fender construction. The set neck. The hand finished binding. It's a different beast. I still love my strats. But my LP talks to me in a way that no strat ever has. And it loves to talk through a thick high gain amp!
Just discovered your channel, so happy I did, great content…
PRS and Mesa boogie actually gave a lot of gear to a bunch of nu metal and pop punk bands back in the late 90s and early 2000s, and that def helped them gain a big following
Everyone in the late 90's-early 2000's pop rock nu metal scene had a prs with a mesa haha. That was back when Santana was the big PRS/MESA endorser.
Pretty sure silverchair was one of those bands
Rick from Goose used this setup too
How could you forget Primus?
@@Podcastforthewin The PRS Daniel Johns used the most was a gift from one of the guys in Helmet. He probably did eventually get some freebies, but I know the one that had all the stickers on it was from Helmet.
I think it's more than just Gibson's status as a "boomer" brand. It's also the general perception of Gibson not lining up with the trending youth aesthetic, which is more DIY, more "I found this at a flea market," more "I made this song in my bedroom," etc.
Price probably has something to do with it, especially for kids. Having a Gibson as a kid basically screams, "My parents can afford to buy me this," and even though there's nothing inherently wrong with being born to a more well-off family (it's not like it's the kid's fault), it's just not really the vibe that any of these young indie bands are going for.
Fender has that perception of being less precious, more utilitarian, more "working class." Whether that's actually true or not, I think they have that perception going for them and are capitalizing on it successfully, whereas Gibson has a perception more in line with like a Rolex watch or something. It's this precious heirloom piece which you must keep forever and pass on to your kids. 16 year olds simply don't give a shit about that.
If I were Gibson, I'd work on a cheaper line of bolt-ons painted in solid colors, and for body types maybe even look into some of the B- and C-tier designs, like Firebird, Corvus, Moderne, or Victory MVII. Offset bodies are insanely popular right now; models like the Jazzmaster, Jaguar, and even Ibanez's Talman are seeing huge resurgences in interest. Gibson could try to hop into the fray with an affordable line that gives off less of a "this guitar is my family's legacy" vibe, and more of a "look what I found at a yard sale" vibe.
A less-expensive Gibson line wouldn't even have to be bolt-ons. With modern machinery, building a set-neck (or any guitar) is just not as difficult as it used to be; Chinese and Indonesian factories have been making very good set-neck instruments at very affordable prices for many years. They're branded "Epiphone" and other names... and frankly in a blind Pepsi challenge they play every bit as well, and the fit and finish is generally just as good as "real" Gibsons. The pickups etc are typically pretty bad, but the instruments themselves are consistently very good to excellent. Drop a good bridge pickup in an Epihphone and honestly, you're ready to go on tour. And you saved hundreds of dollars up front. Why pay more for a "real" Gibson?
Or why doesn't Gibson just do that in America? I'm sure a big factor is lower labor costs overseas and using cheaper electronics, of course... but it really also seems that Gibson wants an extra large chunk of money tacked onto anything that bears their name. It's partly that ridiculous "lifestyle brand" nonsense they've been failing with for many years, partly raw greed, and partly just plain snobbery.
Don't hold your breath waiting for Gibson to embrace new designs. They are very adamantly stuck in the past. Which is a little weird because the LP was truly revolutionary. And two of their most successful and iconic models (Explorer and Flying V) were ages ahead of their time, but for decades now they've almost always only been issued with snooze-fest 1950s hardware and electronics in the same two boring colors - black with white pickguard or white with black pickguard. I mean, that's just lazy.
Other companies sell piles of LP and Ex and V style guitars with the features players actually want now... at price points both well below and well ABOVE what Gibson charges. So it's not the general designs that's the problem, those are still very popular.. it's not the price, both budget and high-end models from other companies do well... it's Gibson's arrogance that's the problem.
. Gibson just really doesn't seem to give a damn about the kid learning to play or the person working clubs 5 nights a week. They steadfastly INSIST on putting almost all their marketing behind signature models and "vintage" reissues that cost thousands of dollars and will mostly be sold to dentists and retirees who maybe play a couple hours a month, not hours a day and gig every weekend.
Gibson has indeed become The Boomer Brand. It's sort of sad. It's like watching a cranky grandpa who turned mean with old age and hubris, and just refuses to admit that it's a new century and nobody but other cranky old grandpas even cares about them anymore.
@@dogslobbergardens6606 I was going to say, Epiphone is their affordable line.
Sounds like grunge area
@@Scott__C IKR? This is not a big revelation, it's been a thing for several decades.. Gibson DOES make budget/intermediate guitars, they just won't put their name on them like other manufacturers do.
@@dogslobbergardens6606 And sadly, Epiphone seems to be doing things a bit better these days than Gibson.
I like both. It helps that fender has always made excellent instruments with great, diverse tone. LPs can do it all too, but they’re don’t feel as comfortable for the live performer imho and that’s important. With that said, the modern LP is an improvement.
Edit: many people mentioned Squier and all the options. I agree. I have a couple squier telecasters, one bullet and affinity. They’re my main guitars lol
That is true Fender guitars have a pick guard and a lot of routing for access . Les Paul himself had a bench guitar made of solid maple with a pick guard that could be removed with out releasing string tension so he could wind pick ups and test them out for tone . The shop where I worked actually made the guitar for him and I did the soldiering .
He just wanted 3 HB pick ups with a vol pot and kill switch for each
I ended up going to Fender after being a Gibson fanboy and a big factor in that was literally just the fact I could buy a Mexican Tele for $1000 and out of the box it played fabulous and in the same shop I saw a 5k Les Paul where the finish had melted on the hanger. Not to mention the finish quality on things like the fretboard. Fender is just the place to go.
I ended up buying 2 Mexican Fenders and subsequently modified both to my liking to make them unique for not a lot of money
The finish melting on the hanger was due to the type of finish, a lot of brands had that happen..
@@Tulsaghost1 then thats poor ass quality control for an expensive tool.
1000 dollars for a Mexican tele seems an awful lot. I have squires that cost under 300 bucks that play very well and I dont need to do a thing to them
Kids today are like: Good Fender: $600 Gibson les Paul $3000. Rent $1500. It's a no Brainer.
How could that possibly be figurative
My first electric guitar was a made-in-Mexico Strat. It looked cool, and was affordable for a high-school kid. I still have it and it's still awesome!
Some Mexican strats are as nice as American strats! I love mine too!
My first one was a m. Strat too
I have a Mexican Telecaster in sunburst, its my favourite guitar.
@@nickmitchell6443 My Strat is Sunburst too. Still one of the coolest guitars ever. I have other, more expensive guitars now too, but I still love my Strat!
Absolutely love my Mexican Strat!
I want an SG but this days I don't have any idea of what should I look for, many people told me to becareful with Gibson/Epiphone between 2010 and 2020... ideally I want an SG with good pickups. Any suggestion? Thanks!
Esp ltd viper
If you look on the new Epi models since 2020 has improved a lot. Got a new LP Custom Backblack and the quality/sound/price was excellent…
If I ran Gibson, I would focus less on the standard les paul and look more at the gibson LP special or their similar models with a focus on new colors both bold and pastels along with different shaped pickguards more like the les pauls against the body with p90/humbucker options. I think younger people would like this more for the same reason they like fender. It would be cheaper more customizable to make it more personal and you would have to care less about dings and nics on it since its just paint and not a nice pice of figured wood. Jist a thought though.
Can't forget about Ibanez, the most popular guitar players of the internet(Ichika Nito, Tim Henson, Manuel Gardner Fernández), all of them have their signature Ibanez guitars and they are the main reason my first electric guitar (bought a year ago) is an Ibanez
When I was growing up I literally thought that if you make it big as a guitar player Ibanez will make you a guitar. All because literally everyone played an Ibanez accross genres.
Idk who any of those guys are.. lol
Yvette Young as well, I’m tryna save up for her YY10. I think Scott LePage might have an Ibanez custom too.
Steve Vai⤴️
Ibanez has a low entry point for new players, and that builds a brand relationship. The cheapest Gibson is a professional-level price and they refuse to call anything cheaper 'Gibson' as a means to shame the player. That's why Ibanez stays strong... they build brand loyalty early.
in fairness - the Epiphone line is REALLY well made and have entry level models that are terrific - very competitive with Fender's terrific value guitars e.g. the Classic Vibe line
I know that for bass, Epiphone has far better reputation than Gibson. They definitely are a better value, and offer a wider variety of instruments. The Jack Casady in particular is one that I'm always surprised isn't a Gibson.
Yup...I was going to make the same comment. The increased quality of Epiphones has made them the best bang for the buck IMO. I'm currently on a waiting list for a P90 equipped TV yellow Epiphone Les Paul.
I’d go for an epiphone over a Gibson any day, I’ve hated the neck of every Gibson I’ve played but have no problems with their epiphone counterparts. Gibson should giveaway a load of epiphones to music schools and colleges to try and get younger people back
was gonna comment the same thing. Epiphone is seemingly more popular than gibsons nowadays. For someone like me especially it's nice to be able to have those guitars at surprisingly nice quality. I bought a brand new epiphone Es 335 this year and it[s killer and I would never have been able to know how much I love to play that kinda guitar had it been a $4000 Gibson
Gibson need a guitar to rival the MIM Fender and actually put Gibson on the headstock though. The name carries weight.
Another issue may be that fenders an in particular strats are super comfortable to play the body is so ergonomic the same can not be said for a Les Paul or SG.
I play bass and went to guitar store yesterday. The only bass i could find that sounded good was a Fender. I have a Squier CV P bass and love it. No other makers sounded good to me.
When I saw The Who in the late 70s Pete Townshend had 4 guitars on stage. They were all black Les Pauls, and they were numbered 1 - 4 with large white numerals (I guess so the sound crew could see which one he was playing?). That & the fact that Jimmy Page often played Les Pauls made them utterly iconic to me. Now I tend to see Strats as the most iconic, and that's partly thanks to Jimi Hendrix.
Fun fact: Fender was all set to retire the Stratocaster, then Jimi Hendrix played Woodstock and Fender decided to change their minds.
His Les Pauls were numbered for different tunings.
Page used Teles on the first Zeppelin album, and I'm pretty sure the solo on "Stairway to Heaven". All the stuff with "The Yardbirds".
@@peteywheatstraws4909but page live. Past 70, the tele was not on stage
Fun fact is that Leo was never too concerned about the quality, but luckily the musicians themselves established the standard and definition of a good guitar, otherwise he would have cooperated with IKEA and teles/strats would have been made it out of cardboard today.
Jimmy's Telecaster sold a lot of Les Poops.
One large piece of the puzzle is the sonic space that Gibson occupy. The music is shifting towards cleaner, single coil sounds. Gibson needs another model that could fit in that space
Agreed, they need more p90 models. They also have the Melody Maker models to bring back.
ive been begging for a marauder reissue for years
You can play humbuckers clean...distortion is a choice. I played clean for years with a LP->fender BK pro reverb. If I wanted overdrive I could add it if I wanted crystal clean I could have it...Humbucker don't automatically = distortion.
@@ront2457 No but the coil winding responsible for “bucking the hum” is what tapers high-end clarity and presence. This is why asymmetrically wound humbuckers have better top end clarity, it allows more to ‘“leak” through. But, they will never have the sonic detail that zero-noise-cancelling will afford.
The original post here is accurate.
You mentioned an interesting point regarding how more young players are aiming to cleaner / overdriven sounds instead of full distorted. I prefer single coils for cleans and mildly driven sounds and maybe a lot of people prefer that as well. I might be mistaken but usually Gibsons are associated with hambuckers (despite there are the P90 models but I see those less often). Could that play a role here as well? well,m
Thats exactly me. I had an epiphone sg standard but aimed for a cleaner/overdriven tone so i switched to a squier affinity stratocaster. Its just more versatile and i can play both hard rock and lighter indie rock.
Humbuckers can be played clean too. Often to great effect. Just need an amp with more headroom. Alex Chilton from Big Star was a Gibson player despite everyone thinking they were an all Fender band. And I’ve seen other bands live using Gibsons that I really didn’t expect from the record.
I never thought I’d get a Gibson but I did buy one earlier this year. I’m 25 and yeah I have a couple fender style things because all my favorites play mustangs and teles but there is one guy who made me want an SG and that is Gary Clark Jr. And I do love my SG as a zoomer lol
I think Gibson missed the boat on the LP Junior craze, all the young bands in that Green Day wave back in the early 2000s were using them, but when Gibson reissued the JR, it was practically quite expensive, it would have been a perfect opportunity to do a 500-800$ guitar and put it in the hands of young players
They tried a lower price point with the Melody Makers but everybody kept bitching about the look of the headstock ...
@@Pannemat the melody makers where a throwback to original 60s guitars.
The junior has stuck around a lot, because of all those who use them
@@qwertpoiuy430 I know. I actually like the MM headstock.
Honestly. If I could snag one up in the $600-700 price range, I'd do that in a heartbeat. But instead they insist on pricing their instruments where they do, so I keep my eyes peeled on Reverb instead. They don't want my money I guess.
I love my Gibsons. And I think they have done a lot of great improvement and development in the Epiphone space for the more entry level or younger player - I think the headstock change was a fantastic start.
But in that sub-$2000 USD bracket, I think there's more work to do for the 'working' musician who just wants a decent meat and potatoes Gibson version of their Mexican/Japanese Fenders. I really think it's time they opened a 'Gibson Mexico', starting with focusing on decent quality and fun P-90 Les Pauls and the like.
And actually OWN and LOVE the fact these would be made in Mexico - community initiatives for the workers, educational initiatives for underprivileged kids south of the border and to signify a Mexican Gibson, a subtle 'Eagle & Snake' watermark somewhere on the instrument. Create folklore, much like Fender Japan has done!
That is, like Fender with Mexico and higher end Squiers, you create a range of guitars customers just 'want' for something different with fairly negligible outlay, rather than 'need' via big spending.
A really great idea! 👻
Gibson's and great guitars 🎸 ,no doubt! But they are extremely overpriced? For anyone just trying to make ends meet?
fuck that, they could do it and A. PRS S2 series would crush them in value and quality, and B. they wouldn't be any better than the Chinese guitars epipohnes were seeing, which are really really good. Its a niche they cant do without either bumping their USA stuff up or cutting the quality standards of Epiphone.
Uhm Bro, American Strats start at $1200 new the ultra Luxe tops out at $2400 and that is fenders top of the line modern guitar, what is gibson? 3-4k almost double for the modern design....... and I am not talking about SG standard or LP studio..their actual top of the line modern guitar.
Gibson is a sham on this one, I'd rather buy an S2 PRS and swap the pickups and wiring and still be way cheaper and an American Made guitar with much better quality....by miles.
@@nocturnal101ravenous6 100%
Interesting video. Rhett. Thank you. For about 10 years, Fender has been creating a series of hybrids (Jazz/Tele hybrid, for example) that it appears are designed to appeal to experienced players, not new players. In other words, Fender is encouraging us to own 5 or 6 guitars (if not more) instead of 2 or 3. This strategy on Fender's part was certainly effective with *me*.
Being as big a fan of Gibson as Rhett is, I really appreciate him producing this video.
I'm not a Gibson fan, but I do hope they turn it around and get away from their current "gouge the customer" business model. It would be a shame to live in a world where there are no more Gibson 335's being made.
Great video Rhett!☑️ thanks 😊
What I think Gibson should do is to make very wacky guitars based on their current guitars, but at decent prices. Anything that would make young guitarists want to buy them and create or experiment with new sounds. I imagine a baritone SG with a single filtertron style pickup on a NYC cab yellow color. Maybe a 335 style guitar with 3 P90s, and a bright green color. Just weird stuff that is different enough to be interesting, but doesn't entirely alienate current customers.
2 many brands beat the quality for a lot less bucks. Thats a problem
You can get all of that with Reverend and have a guitar that is built extremely well and owned by someone who loves the up & coming musicians.
@@alech729 Right on, own a reverend sensei, great guitar for the value
That would defeat the whole purpose of having epiphone
I think if they pushed their thinner guitars more they’d have an easier time selling them. The jr. Les Paul’s have always been underrated
fucking this, the junior looks sick. people forget how obnoxious it is to play a guitar like that live.
I remember that until about 8 years ago Gibson SG's and LP classics, studios and juniors were great for the price, but now days a studio is the price that a LP standard used to be
@@varyingdegrees1130 what guitar is obnoxious to play?
@@elgallonegro7546 and a Jr is about there too...I remember when you could get a used Les Paul Jr for $500, but sadly that was when I was too young to afford a cool guitar like that.
I'd love me a Jr. or Melody Maker with a modern C neck, but I really prefer the Melody Maker headstock over the LP
Have you tried out a Strandberg guitar?
What’s more, alongside the current players using fenders, a lot of the indie scene beforehand (where many current artists get the influence) were using fenders as well. Think of Sonic Youth’s Thurston Moore and Lee Ranaldo, who both used Jazzmasters (Ranaldo sometimes used a thinline tele too), Dinosaur jr’s J Mascis uses a Jazzmaster as well. Pavement’s Stephen Malkmus has used Gibsons here and there, but I mainly think of him with a strat or again, a Jazzmaster. Radiohead’s Jonny Greenwood uses a Les Paul more nowadays, but his main axe is a 90s Tele Plus. I could go on, and this seems to be a trend happening for a while.
From my point of view, Gibson needs to start inventing and innovating again. Like they did with LP and SG and FB etc. Not replace, but extend the product range. I also would love to see more Epiphone originals, not "cheap gibson copies", as the brand is as strong as Gibson is, historically.
I really want that '66 reissue Wilshire. Epiphone make some great guitars.
Um, that attempt at "innovation" just about killed Gibson, and Fender frankly. 95% of guitars sold are older designs. Its ain't broke, no need to fix it, and innovation for the sake of innovation is a sure path to bankruptcy.
The new "Inspired By Gibson" Epiphones are excellent. Check out the videos on the Epiphone 1959 Les Paul. I just got one, and it's awesome!
Btw, I have a "More Paul" (an Epiphone DC PRO - basically a DC LP) and an "Inspired by Fender" (an Epiphone strat from 80s) and I love them both. One probably wants this kind of "almost classics" in the middle-age crisis...
Unfortunately they tried that back in 2015 and absolutely tanked. I feel like anyone who interested in paying for a Gibson wants the classic style setup. I will say this though, my number one player is my 2013 Gibson les Paul studio futura, after I took the etune off first….
Great video, though I feel you brushed over the 'overpriced' part a bit. Yes, they cost more to build than Fenders, but Gibbys routinely go for 3-5k..that Adam Jones model was what, £10k?..that amount of money is ultimately inaccessible for the vast majority of young artist, and frankly considering the alternative options on the market, is a bit nuts - or atleast, very out of touch with a long term plan for viability. Fender all the while releases great quality guitars for under 1000 and excellent quality guitars for just a little more.
Also it's hard for me to ignore the idea that Gibson price their guitars *relative* to the cost of their vintage models on the used market.
This!
Not to mention the Squier Classic Vibe series with about $50 in electronic upgrades is better than most MIM Fenders. They are shockingly great.
@@jezmez68 Depends on what era MIM I find the 90s and some early 2000's to be great guitars.
Good points. PRS has dipped into the Gibson market quite a bit I am sure. Fender def makes solid gig worthy guitars for much less and the fact that we have access to pretty much everything vs 20-30 years ago when you bought what was at the music store or pawn shop you could get to.
Agree. Yes, carved top and set neck make them more expensive than a bolt on with no comfort cuts. But while Fender's don't have carved tops, they do have a lot more in the way of comfort and access carving than does a Gibson. At $2300 you are at the top of the Fender production lineup. At that price with Gibson, you are about in the middle of the lineup. Plus, in 2017 a buddy bought a LP Studio for about $750. The guitar most comparable today is something like a LP Special Tribute, which is $999. That's a big price jump in 5 years. And it points to the bigger issue, which is that Gibson doesn't make affordably priced instruments with the Gibson name on them. Much like Apple laptops started at $1000 because Apple didn't make an entry level model, Gibsons start at a $1000 because they don't have an entry level model, exactly. They have a handful of models under $2k. Fender has like 500 models under about $1200.
Since im a left handy. In my student years I bought a Hagstrom. They have their version of LP that plays really well for around 500, 10 years ago.
I have a Hagstrom. I think they're underrated.
I own a Ernieball guitar now and love it BUT i'll never forget the 59' goldtop I played. The tone was fucking incredible.
See, Gibson shoulda stayed in 59 and kept making 59 guitars. They foolishly kept up with the times.
It’s also because Fender has soooo many different options and choices. I mean look at their parallel universe series. They are a modifier players guitar. So many colors, pickups, and options. I am so glad jazzmasters, Jaguars, and mustangs are popular. I remember when I was in high school over 10 years ago trying to find an affordable offset fender and couldn’t find any until my first year of college in 2011/2012. They are truly listening to the players
The new player series duo sonics sound really good
fender is a shitty ONE trick pony.......I remember my first beer too!
@@94SexyStang how
@@Grunger19
He doesn't know. Just a hater.
I'm a businessman from Brazil, long a time guitar player I would like to share a different approach, that may give another perspective. 1) Gibson after several years of falling with consumers, turn into an expensive label (probably to cover major financial loss) and many people notice that. In other words, you pay for Status, not the sound. 2) Fender has been marketing to younger musicians (as the video explained). 3) PRS always focuses on guitars for playability, better shape/ergonomics and outstanding quality. 4) China/Indonesia/Korea, have actually been making products for a long time (guitars are not the only product), So, quality last decade became quite nice and affordable. Resume, money is hard to make, and this generation does not see Gibson as 'a goal', that people will dream to buy when they get money. Thanks.
Gibson have never meant to be cheap, they've always been expensive. The difference these days is that some people expect everything to be affordable for everyone. That simply isn't how life is unfortunately.
I think you're right in that Gibson has positioned themselves as the more Luxury brand, guitars that not anybody can afford. The 2nd hand Gibson market is ridiculous at the moment, particularly Gibson Firebirds, the cheapest studio version is now like $ 500.00 more expensive in the span of just a year. In any case, Gibson guitars do seem to retain their value much better than any other brand.
Brasil porraaa é nóis
My new les paul sounds great tf you talking about
@@anthonycraig1458 LP JR:WAS I a joke to you?
I’ve been playing Les Pauls since 1997. Back then I was the rhythm guy and lead vocalist. About 5 years ago I became the only guitarist in the band and had start playing solos. That’s when my problems started😂. After every solo I’m basically screwed for the rest of the song. The tuning stability on a Les paul is simply terrible. About a month ago i bought a squire affinity just to see if I might like the Strat format. Immediately I loved the light weight of the affinity. Tuning stability even with the “cheap” tuners was way better than a less paul. I didn’t care much for some of the more spikey tones and I had trouble getting used to the tuners all being in one line. Then a saw a PRS at my local Music Store and tried it out. 3 a side tuners without the tuning problems of a LP. Strat tones without the spikey high frequencies. Light weight. Perfect. I Play every single night (2 days off per month) various genres and styles. For me it’s about having a practical instrument. And by the way there is no other guitar maker that puts so much passion into his guitars than PRS so I completely reject the opinion that PRS guitars have no soul. Go amd compare an interview with JC with an Interview with Paul. Who inspires you more?
PRS, Fender, Gibson I love the most of their models. You can see how juanes reiceved his guitar from fender and at the same time mana guitar player received his gibson. But if you see metal industry, people is picking up a Solar guitar, ESP and schecter. At the same time I agree with you opinion
I actually think gibsons are overpriced. I've tried some entry level gibsons which are kinda same priced to middle priced Gretsch (which I own) and the gretsch just felt like a much better quality guitar and was way comfortable and detailed than the Gibson. Also I think a good part of fender's success right now is that opposite to one guitarist singlehandelly geting attention to the brand (like your slash example) fender has gotten into artists of so so so many different music styles from today and yesterday (like the just released Nile Rodgers hitmaker)
Yea that point in the video doesn't make much sense. Value comes from how much something can sell for in a market, not how much time or money was spent on it.
I'll take lower end Les Pauls over standard Fenders. They're cheaper but better guitars. I guess this is an unpopular opinion though, so far as I can tell.
I’m in the Gretsch area, too; wanted a semi-hollow that could take whatever I dish out, tried everything from Oscar Schmidt and Firefly up to a Gibson 335 and a Silver Falcon, and found the best option for comfort, versatility, build quality, and value to be an Electromatic G5622. If I could’ve gotten any of them for the same price, I’d have still gone with that one.
I have this mid-2000s Gretsch ProJet retrofitted with TV Jones Classic and Classic+ pickups. Sounds as good as an ES-335 but for well under $1K.
When you price entry level American made Gibson’s vs Fender guitars the Gibson is cheaper by far!!!
I’m 59 years old and maybe I am a Gibson fan boy but check the prices for yourself.
I think if you make a guitar that is prone to headstock breaks, and has trouble staying in tune, then you're telling potential customers that you don't really care about them. These are easy fixes, but Gibson seems committed to preserving the past at all costs.
I think they need to develop a modern line of guitars that is committed to fixing ALL the design errors, make them forward looking instead of looking to the past. Contemporary musicians need to contemporary instruments. If you want to repeat the past, then use instruments/designs from the past. If you want to make something new, then new instrument designs will help you get their. The guitar is a fertile ground for improvement and innovation. One last thing, guitars that are uncomfortable to play (too heavy, no comfort cuts, etc.), usually don't get played.
Yes, my custom guitar builds always include a solid volute, which helps prevent headstock breaks.
You are describing something Gibson has already started when they separated into making the original and modern collection. With a brand as big as Gibson they are never gonna please everyone. Factoring the business side of things it’s not as easy as we players think. But it’s nice to see them take our suggestions into consideration and making changes as gradual as they may be for some.
Agree
They're a nostalgic company, it's just the way they roll.
I think Epiphone is the farm league for new and improved designs.
All valid points ! I also think that the majority of the fender players that you are adressing in the newer generation play indie music that is highly influenced by bands who played fenders for their ability to sound cleaner and stack up well with pedals. We’re in a pedal heavy era … Gibson’s are much more plug and play for the players with less pedals. Also … fender sound more polite. And the popular music genres are not heavy hitting and loud like the old school rock bands . Look at the overall standard for stage volumes … a lot of the young kids don’t really know what it is to see a real live rock & roll band. And the volume and agressivity that comes with it. Like led zeppelin ! Not super distorted but heavy , loud and agressive ! I feel that rock is not the leading genre of music now a day’s and Gibsons are rock’s main guitar. For me it will always be Gibson 🖤 Long live rock !!
i've had a les paul studio in the closet for about a year, finally broke it out and love the way it is cut for my physique. i found it second hand for about 60% retail cost but it is in perfect condition.
Once again, the genius of Leo Fenders designs comes through. On top of the accessibility, the modularity of those designs means that is really easy to mix and match to get what you want. Set-neck guitars are limited, mostly to pickups. For this boomer, since I got my first Strat (MIM) almost 25 years back, my Gibson “The Paul” has, largely, gathered dust.
I'll buy it off you 👀🤪
I have always been a Fender player. And I have to note that they have really been doing some impressive things with options and technology that covers a lot of ground. As a result I picked up some new Fenders in the last year and I am very pleased with both the quality and the price points they are offering.
Modular. That’s the whole point of Fender solidbodies.
As it should. I always maintained that no self-respecting player would go onstage with a guitar called "The Paul". It was a budget guitar aimed at the Ibanez players, but it failed because of the dorky name. I mean: after a lifetime in music I have *never* heard anyone call their Les Paul: "The Paul" . . never ever in my 50 years as a guitarist. So what was Gibson's motive in making The Paul? It seemed to me that they were thumbing their noses at players who wanted a Gibson but didn't wanna pay for one. So they made a cheapie and gave it that abominable name, as if to say: Here's your cheap Gibson, you skinflints. Take it and play it in good health, if you can stand the ridicule you're gonna get!
But was it Leo Fender's design or was it Paul Bigsby's design?
I've been playing for 35 years and think that it's easier to find a Fender/Squire that sounds and plays well. The sound and playability of Gibson products is to hit and miss for me. The boutique prices don't help either.
exactly.... I started with an SG & while it was very playable , it was also quite limited in sound. I've found WAY more sound options on a newer Squire Strat than I EVER had with the SG. Gibsons sound muddy under straight amplification while my Squire and Mustang have the unmistakable clean Fender sound. I can make the Strat sound like a Les Paul but you can't find a Les Paul that sounds like a Strat. Ever play a Gibson amp...?- I've yet to find one that didn't suck. They all needed pedals to sound workable........
As a bass player, I’ve never really been attracted to any Gibson or Epiphone basses. The iconic Ripper and Grabber don’t seem to be available now (I might have considered one of these) and the Gene Simons signature is a THUNDERBIRD which I never recall him playing. Off target? I think so.
I’ve got an SG and a Les Paul and I love them both. I also have a good strat. I don’t really like my fender I prefer the Gibsons. And my favorite band is AC/DC so the style is more “Rockish”
I really dig my Epiphone Les Paul. Swapped the pickups for Seymour Duncan's and pots for coilsplitting. It has not let me down
I don't see the point in spending more on a Gibson, Epiphones are just as good.
I didn't even change the pickups in mine, it's a beauty.
With a bit of fret dressing and a proper setup, That Epi plays just as nice as it's big brother.
Especially since doing a collaboration with Gibson's custom shop on their Epiphone 59' with Gibson Burstbuckers Switchcraft switch & jack.
Thing's a beast.
I play a 90s Korean made Epi Les Paul, swapped pickups for Seymour Dunkins. Love it, I have some other more expensive guitars, buy I play my Epi the most
I think another issue with Gibson and touring musicians is that they break more easily. Spending almost 3k on a guitar and you're worried about the headstock?? And if you're touring in just a van, it'll get stolen and that feels even worse...
The Headstock just looks scary.
A top of the line assembly line fender is half the price of the Gibson counterpart hence more fenders in use. But there's something about that Gibson sound!
Exactly why my unbroken 50 year old les paul stays home - damage and theft
Punters cant hear the difference, anyway
@@dragan4658 There is. But the new Yamaha Revstars will probably get you there too for a much lower cost. And the mid- and high-end versions also come with stainless steel frets.
@@syntaxlost9239 Exactly, ever since I bought a Revstar, I think this the only Humbucker guitar I want. I don't use my Epiphone Les Paul anymore and I might sell it.
I think part of it is the finishes. I love the standards but aren't a huge fan of the bursts. A silverburst, ebony or white in the standards I think would do well
I’ve never been a gibson fan. Growing up they were wayyy to expensive to justify to my parents while I was learning so I had fender/epiphone. Once I started getting my own guitars I leaned toward schecter/ibenaz because they’re mid range price and places like guitar center almost always have an extended range or two from those companies. Currently at 5 schecter and 3 Ibanez.
Same. Since they DCd the Tribute, to play the Gibson game (not Epiphone...which I own and love) I'm forced to pay $2500 new. So, I chose a Schecter solo custom 2. Gibson may learn, they may not. Not on my dime.
I bought my first real electric, a Telecaster, when I was 16 because I liked how they sounded, a lot of bands I liked used them. I bought a Gibson Les Paul when I was 18 because they seemed to be that "holy grail" guitar. I liked it but didn't connect with it and sold it a few years later. 10 years since I bought my Telecaster, it's the only electric I still own. Price or marketing wasn't what led me to a Fender, it was just the tone and the sound of music that I like to play.
I started with a Les Paul that got stolen in ‘86 and replaced that with a Strat. I played that Strat for 20 years before I bought my first Tele. I now still have that Strat and 4 Tele’s. ‘Nuf said
I recently got a Les Paul Standard from Wildwood, and it is amazing. It feels leagues above all my other guitars. It is heaven to play. And yes, it nails all those classic tones which makes it all the more fun.
Leo also designed the "Broadcaster" to be readily and affordably REPAIRABLE. Instead of having to heat or apply solvent and pressure to the neck/body joint as one has to do to remove a Gibson set neck, all one needs to remove and replace a Fender neck is a Phillips screwdriver. I repair ALL of my things myself, so the Fender design is preferred. ☺️
Death/Prog Metal/Tech Death fan here. Havent seen a fender or gibson used since much of the 80s.
I have a squire from when i was a kid and a gibson and epiphone and still love the tones. At this point its a unique sound for metal!
As a professional musician who just came up in the last decade with a band I can say this firmly: Fender has done a MUCH better job with outreach to young musicians in the industry. As soon as I was signed I was getting artists discounts with Fender. I don’t know any young artist’s sponsored by Gibson in any way. There was *one* guy but I wonder if nepotism played a part haha. I actually played Gibson sponsored events, with loaner Gibson’s…… yet no deals offered! 😂 If you want your brand to be cool, get it in the hands of emerging artists. Also Brett: the SG will always be cool. Always. That’s the forever hip Gibson in my book ;)
Gibson is greedy thats why I just buy Harley Bentons if i want a Gibson style guitar.
Honestly the lack of "new models" is one of the issues... its like LPs are vanilla ice cream and they only sell "vanilla + toppings". Fender has the strat,tele, jaguar, jazzmaster, mustangs, the weirdos like the cyclones, meteora,coronado,etc... also, Fenders are way easier to "customize" you just swap the pickguard and get a different beast.... also, some Gibbys have killer neck dive (i have been told to change to light tuners but that's not something they list generally)
Gibson may do better in the future, after they get bought out by fender.
Grace bower ?
@@richardlecomte6839 strong words
The faded cherry series that they produced in the late 90's for $600 was fantastic for young players. When I was see a kid playing an epiphone in a shop, I'd talk to them and then get them to try one of those that was only $50 more in some cases. A lot of times that would be the guitar they would walk out with. And I didn't even work at a guitar store!
Agreed - my first Gibson was an SG faded in worn brown I bought used for the price of a new Epiphone
Same. My first Gibson, cool brown SG with crescent moon inlays for $500. Wish I never sold it. And I didn't worry about scratching it.
Good video Rhett. Affordable is the key word used. Why doesn't Gibson make affordable "bolt on" necks?
Epiphone. That said Gibson does release cheaper models. I bought a brand new 2015 Gibson Les Paul CM in 2017 for about $450
Ritchie Blackmore sold me on the Fender Stratocaster and I’ve never looked back. I have a Les Paul and it sounds and plays great but my go to guitar is the Stratocaster with single coils
You nailed it. I played a Les Paul Custom ('76, Kalamazoo) as a kid. That guitar stays in a case now and I play cheap Fenders (Squiers, Mexican/Japanese Fenders) and Epiphones.
as a young guitar player and as someone that works with/sells guitars, there’s a few reasons i can think of (some might be repeats of what you said in the video).
1. price: nobody can afford a gibson unless they have disposable income, which is relegated to trust fund babies and people over 40. i haven’t seen a single person buy a brand new gibson that wasn’t part of one of those two groups. maybe you can save up, but you’d be saving for a damn long time.
2. the breaks: obviously if you take care of your guitar, this won’t happen. that being said, broken headstocks are much more common with gibson style guitars than any other. and going back to the money thing, if someone’s spending 2-3 thousand dollars on a guitar, that shouldn’t be something they need to worry about. plus, a lot of younger players are playing more aggressive shows in closed spaces like basements. the chance of destroying your $2500 les paul goes way up would only go up over multiple tours.
3. pickups and hardware: a lot of indie these days is based around the jangle of single coils and occasionally the use of a jazzmaster/jaguar trem system. sure they might have p90s or bigsby’s, but gibson just doesn’t have the features that a lot of younger players crave. they aren’t at the cutting edge anymore.
4. players and bands: a lot of us just don’t care about gibson players anymore. we aren’t listening to kiss or g&r or clapton, a lot of us are listening to bands like the smiths, radiohead, my bloody valentine, phoebe bridgers, etc. not a lot of younger artists want to play gibson and thus not a lot of players want to either.
i think the biggest issue with gibson is the price and quality. i don’t care if nothing sounds like a gibson, i don’t care if they’re made in the us, if they cost double, triple, quadruple of what a fender costs and the chance of damaging it is higher, it’s just not worth it.
the pickups and price = ⚰. nobody wants to pay $800-1000 more for a comparable quality instrument because Gibson spent 5-10 US labor hours spray painting a tasteless burst on their dull sounding instrument.
Gibson USA makes guitars at the almost exactly same price point as American made Fenders. Gibson uses Epiphone to compete with Fender's foreign-made guitars (though some of their USA Tribute guitars are pretty cheap and close to Fender's foreign-made lineup).
I don’t think Clapton plans a Gibson lol i
@@bojangles6444 He certainly does play Gibsons - he just prefers to tour with Strats (though he sometimes breaks out his Gibsons at shows).
+1 on the headstock problem.
It’s a terrible design that should have been updated long ago.
They’re a nostalgia brand.
Really like the analysis on this video. The point about younger players not using Gibson is something I hadn’t noticed until this video.
I remember over a ten years ago that most guitarists typically wanted one single coil guitar, typically a Strat, and one humbucker guitar, usually a Les Paul. That mindshift definitely has changed. I would rather spend the money on a PRS for a high quality humbucker guitar.
part of it to me (as a gen z person who chose to buy an american Ultra strat), is the numerous "quirks" of gibsons that also turn me off of buying one as well from others experiences. I dont want to worry about my expensive guitar going to waste because one single drop snapped the headstock. I want long sustain. i want to feel comfortable. I want my g string to stay in tune. I don't want neckdive. I paid for a guitar that is supposed to just work, not a luxury display item that doubles as a guitar. My point is, fender also is doing a better job in making guitar playing accessable thru the design of their guitars and similar that Gibson is not. Now, is Fender the leading pioneer in this? No, I think they could definitely do better. As it stands though, I feel they have a leg up in almost every departmentr
ooof the headstock comment hurt me.
I got a SG for my 16th bday back in 2008 after playing a strat a few years. Took it to it's first gig which was a sweet sixteen party. Somehow it slipped off the on stage stand and broke the headstock lol....
i cried but now i play a Ibanez THBB10 which is also an expensive custom guitar but its so much more solid.
Facts.
Growing up in the Bay Area in the 90s and early 2000s there was a local band called Wasting Time, and their guitar player had two gibson les Paul customs. Newer models at the time in black and alpine white, both with gold hardware.
Back then it was the 1st time I ever saw one in person. As a guy in his mid 30s now it always stuck with me how beautiful the guitars were to see in person.
Just purchased my first guitar last week. It was a Squier Mustang... It was purely because it was what I could afford. Prior to me starting to do any research on buying my first instrument, Gibson was really the only name I knew of in the industry, having been a much more casual music listener. I really think they would probably do better if they introduced a budget option, rather than focusing on the high end market.
Epiphone’s tend to fill that niche. Their recent models are as good (if not better!) than actual Gibsons.
@@magicaltour1 yeah but have you seen the price difference between entry level Squiers and Epiphone?, squier jag £350. Epiphone Flying V £800. No brainer
I play a strat with a wilkinson bridge but I might upgrade it for a les paul , a flying v or a sg guitar as I love gibsons
I think its also worth noting that fender has also opened itself up to some more modern metal focused versions of their guitars. The Jim Root signatures are great for basically any style of metal as well as endorsing Chris Garza of Suicide Silence, who has a custom 7 string strat. Conversely, gibson really hasnt done that at all. Fender also has more models with different features allowing more flexibility.
It bugs me to no end that Gibson has all of the "parts" to make a guitar that suits the tone of younger players, but they refuse to make anything but historic based combinations. Even their new 2022 guitar was a reject from the 50s. Off the top of my head most younger players I know want a lighter weight guitar without a huge body that isnt too dark or muddy and can stand up to gigging and stay in tune. Why not take the es339 since its smaller and lighter, maybe add firebird pickups since the are bright and clear compared to full humbuckers, and maybe something like the Midtown headstock since the string pull was better for staying in tune, or another design along similar lines. Just spitballing, they have so many combinations available in their catalog but only seem to make stuff that appeals for the blues/rock crowd overall. Cool discussion anyway!
Gibson really needs to push the Firebird pickups more, seems like an ideal pickup for a lot of popular guitar music these days.
Gibson should get the SG into the hands of more guitarists
@@awesome4330 100% agree, they only put them in guitars that are a little out there for most average players. Firebird pickups would be so good for modern/tighter tones that we hear in new music.
@@jett7530 would be great if Epiphone tried something like the Squier Paranormal line to test the market, I'm sure it would do well if they picked smart combinations.
Always love it when the “weight” argument comes out.
Do you people seriously have trouble holding a newborn child? Because that’s the average weight of a Les Paul (notwithstanding the Customs which are a little heavier).
8-9lbs is the average and if you use that as a criticism then I suggest less time playing guitar and a little more time in the gym.
What about the plethora of headless LPs and SGs? On the rare occasion that a fender (or similar constructed guitar) is damaged, you can easily buy a new -or used_ neck and fixed it in a few minutes. The concept of "parts-caster" is another point to fender (and that's without mentioning van Halen's frankenstrat, there's a whole DIY tradition there, abundant in the most alternative rock genres)
Scale length could also be a factor, particularly for modern rock players that use drop tunings. Fenders are 25.5" as opposed to Gibson 24.75". My Telecaster intonates perfectly in drop C but my 335 won't.
Huh, I never thought of a 335 being tuned to drop c. But I think an SG does well (I have mine tuned to drop C#, does pretty good)
@@megadouche a lot of queens of the Stone Age songs are in C standard, and they use a bunch of semi hollow and hollow body guitars. Doesn’t seem like a super common setup though.
It has to do with genre. Fender does not sound good for metal. Gibson isn't a good choice for soft rock unless it's bluesy stuff. Apples and oranges. Drop tuning stuff you want Gibson or a metal guitar not fender.
That being said rock and metal is not as popular so maybe fender is bigger with the young crowd.
@@raymondkidwell7135 that’s a huge generalisation. It’s not that those guitars can’t do those genres, it’s just not a commonly done. I’ve seen grindcore bands playing fenders and it was fine. Put enough gain on it and it’s fine. You can also get fenders from factory with humbuckers. One of the slipknot guitarists has a signature fender. Gibson are plenty versatile too.
When I had a fender it never sounded metal. They have a unique sound.