what COUNTS as reading? ⌛ forgetting plots, fake reading, a booktok chat, my favorite books
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- Опубліковано 14 лют 2024
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i thought we had a pretty interesting discussion on booktok about this so i decided to open it up to booktube and then also have you guys test my awful memory :''''')
mentioned:
m train
inkheart
sorcery of thorns
the thief lord
the memory police
the decagon house murders
mr poppins penguins
the doomspell
beauty
and then he at my boy entrancers
we hunt the flame
a curse so dark and lonely
six of crows
defy the night
the prison healer
a violet made of thorns
wind up bird chronicle
inkheart
enchantment of ravens
sky in the deep
deadly education
lightlark
the sunbearer trials
gilded wolves
the vanishing half
haroun and the sea of stories
the serpent and the wings of night
to kill a kingdom
weyward
conversations with friends
graceling
hail mary project
the likeness
dance of thieves
such a fun age
nine perfect strangers
throne of glass
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what COUNTS as reading? ⌛ forgetting plots, fake reading, a booktok chat, my favorite books
Here's a little behind the scenes of filming this :') and thank you always!
ua-cam.com/video/qSj00uWvmo4/v-deo.html
Love your videos!! Just was wondering what is your StoryGraph username?
Cari please more mortal instruments plot summaries!!
Valentine is the evil guy in the mortal instruments 😭
“I cannot remember the books I've read any more than the meals I have eaten; even so, they have made me.” ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson
I will be writing this on every surface I can get my hands near, thank you 👏🏼
Oh this is lovely- thanx for this
And yet I remember books I read years ago. Complex books like Malazan Book of the Fallen…
My boy Emerson never ceases to amaze me with his quotes
OMG, I love that quote because I literally read like this... After every book one of the first thoughts in my head is not about the plot or characters, but instead it's more like "This book was like a cup of really good tea" or "this one tasted like cheesecake with raisins... and I hate raisins"
Please tell me it's not just me...
if you consume the book and processed it, you’ve read it. doesn’t matter if it’s physical book, ebook, audiobook, if you forget or or remember it forever. i’ve found that most people that disagree have ableist views they need to challenge
this! i dont understand how this is a debate at all, reading is reading. you've consumed the book in whatever way you've read it. whatever medium, whatever speed, forgetting is normal. it happens when we don't revise info much, and when you read a lot of books and consume other media of course you're gonna forget. you still read it!
it's very classist too. it's giving "you cannot sit with us (on our high horse)"
Ok. Unpopular opinion perhaps.
Disclaimer - I do listen to a lot of Audiobooks.
But for me audiobooks have an additional layer of bias. It's not just author to reader anymore. There is a voice actor. And their interpretation and delivery of things impact how we view a book. Doesn't make it any less fun. Doesn't make it inferior. Definitely counts as reading. But it's not exactly same as the act of reading.
I forget books all the time. Same with movies. It’s just a part of who I am at this point. But it’s kinda nice cuz then I can rewatch things and be surprised by them again. (Obviously there’s some stuff I remember, but the majority I don’t.)
I forget the plot, I remember the vibes. If a book made me *feel* a memorable way, that's what sticks with me most!
Ohh yes this is so accurate, also for TV shows and movies!! Even for my favourite shows,movies,books,etc I can't recall all of the plot but I'll always know how it made me feel.
That's a nice spin on "no plot, just vibes" lol
One question though, do you still like to read books with a plot? Or does it make no difference?
@destituteanddecadent9106 I absolutely love books with a plot! I also love vibes-only books. But even for the books with solid plots, I tend to only remember a few points that really struck me (whether big events or small character moments), and mostly remember how much the story affected me
Yes!! This is me for everything. I know I enjoy stuff but my memory is terrible because of depression and anxiety so I mostly remember vibes and general plot beats. I remember enough to know which of my friends might enjoy it.
Just like that quote: people will never remember what you said, but they will always remember how you made them feel.
I'm team book closed, plot forgotten 😂😂😂
I read for entertainment 😂😂
lol exactly!!!
I read to let the time pass. Usually I don't even enjoy it that much. Is this a problem? I don't remember and I don't enjoy it. I'm still reading (or listening) to the book 🤷🏻♀️
Why people have so many problems with this hobby, I have no idea
@@chiarakikimatteazzi4840that's not a problem at all:) i personally don't understand why you'd choose to read if you don't like it instead of doing a hobby you enjoy, but there's nothing wrong with using it as a way to pass the time!!
Exactly. With half of the books I consider my favorites, I barely recall the plot. I read for the ✨vibes✨
For the longest time I thought I had some issue that I forget books (character names, plots etc.) so fast, even favorite books. I feel so at ease seeing that so many people are like me!
I love forgetting the plot, I get the joy of rereading and rediscovering the beautiful world of that book if I wish to. It’s like a beautiful sense of deja vu and nostalgia combined.
for me its just helpful cause i read thrillers and always forget who done it hahahah
@@caricanreadexactly, happened to me with Murder on the Orient Express once and it was a great time rediscovering the plot.
Yeeesss this is truly a beautiful experience
Same!! I love being surprised by books I’ve read before and rediscovering the things that I adored about it in the first place 🫶🏻
Same! I love rereading books and then having a random paragraph trigger the entire plot coming back to me. I get a kick out of rereading books a lot.
One of the pleasures of reading is appreciating the writing, the style, the art of the words, the beauty. It's not just about the plot, sometimes the plot is not essential. And even without remembering plots and characters names, books stay with you, ideas stay with you, grammar, words, styles. And I think that's essential for our inner life and our critical thinking. I always hated those movies where some character quotes a book and says chapter x page y. To me that kind of memorisation would be pointless if it is even possible.
absolutely!!!
This is such a good point!! Like when you read a passage that makes you just kind of put the book down for a second because it’s that good. Moments like those being ephemeral don’t make them less meaningful.
This was a view i adopted when i started taking my writing more seriously. I realized that even if i didn't necessarily remember a book's plot, what it offered me in terms of refining my style, expanding my vocab, and challenging me to develop my skill was what ultimately mattered. It also means rereading books is more enjoyable!
It's definitely possible, and it's not pointless; if two people are discussing a particular scene or such .. then they're both able to look that particular thing up and be on the same page or whatever about exactly what they're discussing-OR if only one person has read it, but wants to share a particular line/quote//scene or whatever which they thought was cool, then they are able to direct the other person to be able to pick the book up and read just that one particular thing, and maybe then they'd be inspired to read the whole thing for themself too. OR if you just want to reread some particular section, and not necessarily the whole entire book, knowing where to find that particular section without having to just flip through and hope you find it can be helpful too. If you make an essay or something and reference something from a book, being able to cite the page/paragraph/line//etc. also helps you prove that you really did pull that particular quote or concept from that specific book and did not simply make it up yourself or whatever and then pretend to have gotten it from somewhere else to give yourself false credibility or such.
But , apart from that, you're basically spot on!!!💖
I am an English major in college and can say that I have written 50+ page papers about books that I now don't remember the characters or plots of for the most part. For me, reading is either for entertainment or it is an attempt to uncover some new information or worldview. Those books profoundly changed my outlook on life and opened up a whole new way to think about the world, so even if I don't remember the details of them, they still affect me every single day. I would definitely count that as reading and I fully engaged with those books, so anybody who says that forgetting plots/characters means you didn't 'read' the book is just being irrational.
agreeeeee!
For the sake of students taking literature classes everywhere I think it is a good thing if we normalised "having read the book" doesnt have to equate to "remembering anything about its contents".
omg same! I was looking through old syllabi recently and was confused about a good 60% of the books mentioned 🥲
This really struck a chord with me because I remember finding a report I did and being like 'ooh, this was insightful... I have no memory of this book' LOL
My brain has circular filed the plots of all the "English class" books I have ever read.
Our brains are literally designed to forget things! Forgetting is a crucial aspect of memory. We simply can't hold all this random information about books (or the trip to the mall a year ago) indefinitely. Our brain's utilize so much energy and unless it's particularly salient or relevant it's gotta remove the excess.
Unless you’re autistic, which I think is another factor people aren’t considering
Hey, from what I’ve learned in Physiology that’s not actually true - once something enters long term memory, it stays there. The catch tho, is that some things in there are harder to “reach” (imagine like they’re buried really deep as opposed to things that are only on superficial level). I too believed that we just forget as we go and that made me sad, because what’s even the point in learning so many interesting things if we’re bound to forget them, but no - they stay with us if we’ve deemed them important enough for long term memory😊
Two things can be true at once! 😊 Memories maybe harder to recall if not deemed important or frequently unused but there are some thing we simply won’t be able to recall functionally meaning we have forgotten them. But I was referring to the process of neural pruning wherein the body removes unused pathways. It’s really interesting but don’t look into it if it’ll make you discouraged 😅
Also interestingly, we forget more easily if we have a backup way of remembering. Things that are written down are harder to remember than things that aren't. An experiment was done where participants had to type up information. Half were told that it would be saved, half that it wouldn't. The half who were told it would be saved had worse recall even though there was no real difference. This is also why widows and widowers may have trouble remembering certain things; they've literally outsourced part of their memory to the other person.
I was an English major. The days of absorbing and analyzing are long gone, and THANK GOODNESS FOR THAT because I finally enjoy books again.
Same!! I stopped reading afterwards but last year I finally discovered the endless joy of it again
I love this take
This was pretty nice to hear. I've been watching so many smart people review books and feeling like a daft bimbo that never make any effort into analysing a book and what elements there are that make it good or bad, I just... If I feel entertained, that's it, I'm happy. I react to obvious things, if things are very problematic or if the message is very written on the nose, but then I hear someone else's take and realise I've missed an entire viewpoint. It's gone so far that I've thought about taking a course just to feel less like a... I don't know, imposter? I read up towards 60 books last year, and I still don't feel like I belong with the "real readers". Maybe I should just throw those thoughts away.
Us: warn us about spoliers!
Cari: bold of you to assume I remember spoilers
I love this! I feel so silly when I say that I love a book and then someone asks what it’s about and I suddenly forget everything about it except that I loved it 😆
yes! i just love it okay?! ahahha
Haha yes, quickest way to forget is people asking you about it 😂
@@HerrFinsternis exactly! Works every time 😂
i love this discussion, i feel like there is a lot of gatekeeping around what counts as reading, like everyone's reading experience will be different and that doesn't make it any less valid just because it's different.
I'm super passionate about audiobooks because I get migraines really badly and really often and have to lie down in darkness with eyes closed or ill be sick, so audiobooks SAVED my reading year last year. When people say things like audiobooks aren't REALLY reading because you're not literally reading words on a page is so insane to me. You're still reading!!! (even if you forget it all the moment you finish, because book amnesia is so real 🥲)
yes!!
I agree. I used to just do audiobooks. I switched to reading along with audiobooks because I couldn't pay attention. As long as you experienced the book, whatever format it was, it counts as reading.
exactly!! i love listening while reading simultaneously (when i can) because I feel like I can fully focus and immersed without getting distracted@@TheEmeraldSword86
audiobooks for the win!!!
I don't get migraines but a big problem when I read is skipping words which leaves me confused or my mind gets stuck so listening to audiobooks is what allows me to read at all
When I was in high school, one of my friends claimed that unless you don't do anything else while listening to music (i.e. you just sit and listen, you're not walking anywhere, you're not on the train, you're not doing anything on your phone/computer etc.), you're not *really* listening to music. This reminded me of that. People who gatekeep clearly aren't okay with the fact that others may experience the world differently to them, I swear...
omg i had a friend just like that to!! i was like “okay if you wanna do that that’s fine, but know there’s other ways to enjoy music”
@@elishahdavisThe problem is that people who do one thing at a time generally get criticised or mocked for their 'inability'' to multitask, like it's somehow lazy to focus all your attention in one thing. Modern society is all about being able to do everything at once faster, and people who don't tend to get ostracized, so they feel they have to justify their choice to JUST listen to music.
And I think it's rather hypocritical to judge them as 'gatekeeping' for defending their own way of listening to music as legitimate, when you're doing the exact same thing to them? It's natural to feel defensive if people are going to call you names and look down their nose at you for disagreeing, and this thread is extremely condescending.
I almost always do other things while listening to music, but I would never insult someone for saying they get more out of it by focusing. They probably do, and having a different view isn't 'gatekeeping.' You do realise you don't have to listen to or accept others' opinions, right? They don't affect you unless you do. If your friend thinks their way of listening to music is better, they are entitled to their opinion and people really shouldn't be so sensitive to other people not liking the way they do things. No one is obligated to agree with other people all the time, and everyone should feel free to think the way they do things is the best way without fear of offending people! You clearly think your way is better than your friends', why don't they have the right to feel the same? Why should you have the right to criticize them whole denying their right to criticize you? If you can't take it, don't dish it out.
@@cmm5542 I never insulted them lmao. I honestly don’t care how they choose to listen to music. It was more their “holier than thou” attitude where they would criticize me and others for not “really listening to music as it was intended”.
It’s like any memory, i think. I don’t remember my seventh birthday party but I know I had one. Just because I don’t remember the details doesn’t mean I didn’t have one. It probably made a big impact at the time and is an experience I wouldn’t have wanted to miss just because I might not remember it. It is part of my life as any experience is and impacted me in ways I don’t see directly but all these tiny experienced add up to who you are now.
I believe, a thousand percent, that the ways people enjoy books should not matter to anyone but the person who reads or listens to them.
I've had people tell me "You listened to the audiobook? That's not reading! You didn't actually read the book; someone read it to you!" So the ever-loving hell what? I'm still absorbing the content of the book; I'm mentally picturing the events being depicted in the book; it's just a voice different than my own internal voice reading the words to my brain. My brain is doing everything with the audiobook that it would be doing with the printed work, other than making my eyes scan a page and comprehend the words printed on them. Audiobooks are still books, and the result of listening to them is exactly the same as the result of reading a printed version. Simple as; end of.
yes!!!!!
Well said. I one hundred percent agree with this.
I suppose there may be a difference in the way that your brain processes between listening to a book or literally reading so I suppose it COULD be a valuable distinction if it was like a study or smth. That said, it's no worse honestly! Listening to the audiobooks? It counts!!!
@@caricanread
No, your brain is not doing everything with the audiobook that it would be doing with the printed word.
Reading a story is the act of actively looking at words while listening to a story is the act of actively hearing words. So your brain is taking in the information differently. On top of that, your brain not only initially processes the information in different areas, it is processing the information differently.
This is a very important distinction when dealing with learning disabilities that effect reading like dyslexia and auditory comprehension like auditory processing disorder as it directly impacts diagnosis, treatment, long term strategies and outcomes.
If a person wants to count listening to an audiobook as the book being read for a book club or review or whatever reason, it makes no difference in the grand scheme of things and may even provide a way for people with reading disabilities to safely and more easily participate, but to endorse the idea that the brain function is the same for both is just supporting false information.
All that said, I am really enjoying your videos and am hoping for another whiteboard plot explanation at some time in the near future for House of Flame and Shadow as the other ones were outstanding.
@@bluebyyoufuthis discussion isnt about learning disabilities. In terms of learning from and enjoying the story within the pages of a book: listening to an audio book is no different from reading a book to yourself. Saying "thats not the case" breaches on abelist territory, if you ask me.
This isnt some reading comprehension exam. There is no difference.
Anyway there are people who cant even read books by listening to audio books, so even that takes a skill not everyone possesses.
Personally I would rather read myself, but am required to multitask a lot, so have to listen to audiobooks instead. I often struggle with books on audiobook, because the way some people's voices annoy me and ruin it for me. Out of this world.
I’m of the opposite - I usually remember all the plot points, all the characters and all the reveals after reading or watching something. And I don’t forget these details unless years have passed. So I envy very much those people who remember only the vibes of the story and a couple of details of the plot. Because I can’t have my “comfort book/movie”, as I remember everything so vividly so I quickly get bored when I rewatch/reread anything.
You and I are very similar. There are only a couple movies, books, and TV shows that I can reread/rewatch. Even though I know what happens, I still like to reengage with them but usually only alongside people who've not seen them before. I can only count a handful of times I'll rewatch or reread anything on my own.
as someone with adhd, a weird critcism i get a lot is that i read many books at one time. but the reason for that is because i love reading and always want to be reading but need to switch to different stories after short periods of time or my mind will wander! i actually do tend to remember details about the books that i read, but i think its honestly because i feel pressured to be able to discuss every book ive ever read at any given moment due to the exact type of discourse you're talking about
Saaame. I have an entire shelf dedicated to books I'm currently reading.
Same :D
No ADHD here, but it's rare I've got fewer than 5 books going at once. Books just seem to have natural stopping points, or I get tired of a book, but I still want to be reading.
Omg yes!!!! A few years ago, I was like “wow, I used to read so much as a kid, what happened?” And I began to try to read books but it was so hard to stick with one book! The day I let myself read multiple books at a time was when I was able to get back into reading again. At the moment I am reading 5 books and usually it can take me a couple months to finish one lol but I eventually do finish them! I also have adhd too btw!
Same, I've got 2 physical books and like 4-5 audiobooks going
I love this conversation because it's so important! Especially the bits about memory! (Sorry for the long comment. I'm a psychology student lol.)
Memory for narrative texts is modulated by different factors than recall of other types of information. Memory for word lists, for example, follows a forgetting curve called the Ebbinghaus curve. This means that there is rapid loss of information initially and then it slows over time until it stabilizes. This is shown in a paper by Meeter (2006) if you want to learn more 😄.
Memory for narrative texts is dependent on three other types of memory: surface form, text base, and event model. Also, when we encode the memories of narrative texts, we often use something called elaborative encoding. This means that we link the gist of what we read into a web of other things that we have read by relating aspects that are similar. This creates something called a schema. Schemas shape how we retrieve the memories that we have. However, schemas do not preserve episodic details so we don't remember specifics. We do remember what the kids call 'vibes' 😂. What's cool about schemas as well is that contextual details can help you recall more specifics.
I think it's super important that people understand that you are not 'forgetting' what you read necessarily. Your brain is just consolidating your knowledge into structures called schemas so that it can store knowledge more efficiently. Also, brains do something called 'pruning' where they eliminate neural connections that you don't really use anymore. This can make recalling particular memories difficult because that connection/schema hasn't been activated in a while.
De-lurking three days late to reply to this comment because I think it's very relevant and interesting. Surely memory changes as we age, too. When I was a child, I remembered books word-for-word. As I got older, I hit some kind of wall seemingly abruptly, when I could forget entire plots. Not every book I read is unique enough to get that ingrained into my mind, compared to when every book was a new experience. So, who's going to gatekeep people out of reading based on memory? I'm in my 40's now, and there have been decades of memories going into me. My file sorting system has a lot to sift and sometimes needs a trigger I can't locate to bring up the memory. Kind of makes sense when you think of memories not as collections of discrete objects, but reorganized neural pathways that may need regular use to remain active.
As a literature student, it is expected of me to "absorb" all the texts that we read. However, I do skip some compulsory readings because of how draining in-depth reading can be. For leisurely reading, I do not make an effort to remember everything about the book because I already have to use my brain a lot with my day-to-day. I read because I want to be entertained or I remember the emotional impact it had on me, sometimes my lit classes help, but reading is a hobby and subjective! Don't make it too serious and then it becomes a chore!
The Act of Reading is in the eye of the beholder. It doesn't matter if you cant remember, as long as you enjoyed (or hated) then you are still engaging with the Act of Reading.
1000000%!
I should be clear that I have a REALLY good memory and generally remember most of what happens in books I read for a long time after I've read them even if I'm not trying. The books where I don't remember what happens in them are the outliers. Part of the joy of reading for me is being able to remember the stories after I'm finished with them!
That being said, how much you remember from a book should not matter at ALL because the most important thing is the PROCESS of reading. Reading is about the experience and the text and how it makes you feel. It's about what happens between the moment you open that first page and the moment you close the last one (or the digital/audiobook equivalent). That experience is personal and will vary between every person and every book, and it's nobody's place to question someone else's experience. We all need to just let each other be.
I love that you talked about this, I’ve also seen it circulating around lately and I just want to say something, sometimes when I read a book it affects me so much and the experience itself changes something in me and so maybe I will forget the plot (most likely) but that something in me that changed or that feeling that I felt will never be forgotten, it will always be with me a month after or a year after, even 20 years after, and in my opinion I think that’s what matters
yes to this!
I'm nearly 60. I've written for online D&D-based games and worked in and around the traditionally published romance industry for decades. I've averaged reading three books a week since I was about 12 (if not more, and not counting what I read for work). If anyone expects me to remember them all, they can kiss my old wrinkled ass. I can recommend a great book by how it made me feel. That made me so angry. This made me cry like a baby. That one broke my heart and put it all back together. Do I remember names, plots, and specifics, even in my writing? Absolutely not. Guess what? Of all the authors I've worked with and for, I haven't met a single one who can remember every plot point and character. As a matter of fact, I've been paid to go back and create timelines for several authors after books have been picked up for longer series. Read what you want, enjoy yourself, and above all, don't judge others.
I love your energy!
As a freshman film studies major, I have the same issues with the movies I'm supposed to be analyzing. I often have to rewatch my favourite movies, bc I don't remember how this one shot looked. And yet I have seen them and I remember crying my eyes out in the end or going to the cinema with my parents or watching it during a sleepover.
I think that the joy of watching movies and reading books is that you can do it again, be suprised again and yet feel the love that you have felt when you have wathed/read it for the first time. And you know that these stories are still waiting for you if you need them. That's the primary point of art, to connect, to be loved. Not to be over analyzed and gatekept.
I’d like to add that I love listening to audiobooks while I’m doing my hobbies! That time contributes to a lot of my reading for the month. On 2x speed you can get through audiobooks so quickly. I can definitely understand how so many people go through a large amount of books this way.
I couldnt go 2x speed. Too distorted. Maybe 1.5 or max 1.75. But really its hard enough to listen to many people's voices even at regular speed, let alone 2x
@marenhumblebee2736 I never speed them up but on conferences & such I have. I think it depends on how slow they talk for me & most narrators aren't super slow to me. I wish sometimes it could speed up for me but I usually end up binging it so it doesn't make a difference😅
Same, I could never get through so many books otherwise. I read while sewing, crocheting, walking, cleaning, cooking, getting ready
people need to make everything into a competition 😭 just let people enjoy things the way they want. it doesn’t have to be that serious. at least they are reading something. most people don’t read anything nowadays.
I have taken entire courses in college that I remember almost nothing about, but I have a degree that says I passed all of them. So if that counts so does reading a book and not remembering what it was about 😂
Listen if my adhd ass needs to listen on 3x speed to stay engaged that’s what it’s going to do.
Also I remember very little of what I read regardless of how I’m reading. I don’t even read that much anymore, and I still don’t remember the plot of most books. I’m reading for entertainment in the moment, and it takes a really good book to be memorable. I used to take notes because it was important to me to remember, but now I don’t care as much. If it’s good, I’ll remember it’s good, and I might even come back to it later and be pleasantly surprised by the plot that I totally forgot about.
yes! and i feel like people dont get upset when others cant remember the plot of films they watched for entertainment but are so crabby about people remembering book plots :/
fellow ADHDer here and i listen in 2 to 2.3x speed, how can you listen to 3x? that's impressive
@@anisa2273 I have to work up to it. I'll start at 1.7x and when my brain adjusts I just nudge it upward a bit. 3x is the highest I have gone.
3x speed is impressive! I’m ADHD and if I’m listening to a new book then it has to be normal speed and only when I’m doing tasks where I can be on autopilot like laundry and dishes. For me, remembering a plot or characters is dependent upon two things; if the author wrote a memorable book or not and how much time has passed since the last read.
I do 1.75 speed, that's typically my sweet spot. Any slower and my brain starts hunting for something else to do lol.
I often forget plot details. Movies, books and TV-shows alike.
I loved this vidéo but Kurt calling you and being like, talk to your husband afternoon time is just every shade of heart warming. Cari, I love you. Thank you for being a safe space and igniting my love of korea through your vlog channel. Thank you for being yourself, true to you but still constantly learning and adding bits and pieces of knowledge to yourself and giving them to us. You are one of my few happy places. 감사합니다 가리 언니
as someone with adhd , i can absolutely agree with needing something to keep our thoughts at bay. its wild how people care so much about how we consume books :’)
reading should be for yourself and if you are coming to social media to share or discuss books , you should come here for fun & respect everyone else on this space
the joy from a caricanread notification is unmatched 👏❤️
:') thank you!
I immediately forget the entire plot of the book after reading it lmao (i have the memory of a goldfish) Reading for me is mainly about the feeling I get while reading its for entertainment and I Stan by than
yes!
Same here
this just made me realise i can remember the plot of A LOT of books i have read really well ... but ask me the name of characters from some of my favourite books or at least, most interacted books, and im like 😮 like i have been sat here watching this video trying to remember the female protagonist name from king of scars for example and NOTHING 😭 this was a great video i love having these discussions around reading!!
It's interesting to think of how much I remember stories. I've read so much fanfic in my teens and 20s but remember only a handful. I still feel appreciative that I read them. I feel the same way about audio books, comics and books I've read - even forgettable audiobooks have helped me focus while working.
CARI!!! If you loved Inkheart, you might love to know that it‘s a series and the fourth book in the series just came out a few months ago!!! I was obsessed with the series when i was a kid and it always makes me so happy to hear other people talk about it. It‘s so crazy that the author published the fourth book so many years after the third but it also makes me so happy :)
I can't help but feel like the argument "it doesn't count if you don't remember the plot" comes across as a bit ableist...I very much agree that we all read for different reasons and experience books in different ways. Isn't that actually just wonderful?? And cool?? Now I am very excited to watch you poorly describe book plots. Love this video concept!!
completely agree!
You're so right! That was the first thing I thought of honestly
Yes! And anyway, “count” towards what, exactly? Who is keeping score, and what do they think you get if you win??
I SO relate to this! I read a lot, but tend to forget almost everything once I've read 5-10 more books. What I DO remember is how the book made me feel! That's good enough, right?! 😉
i think so ❤️
I know this isn’t really the point of the video, but from my personal experience, audio books is the only was I can “read”. I don’t speed them up or anything like that, but due to my dyslexia whenever I pick up a physical book and try to read, it always takes so long and I have to struggle to reread a paragraph that it loses its entertainment value for me. I enjoyed books a lot as a kid, reading less complex books, but as I’ve grown and things became more difficult I fell out of love with them. Now as an adult, I listen to audiobook while I draw, and to my surprise the combination of audio and physical input makes me remember the books better than when I try to read them! It takes the frustration and struggle out of “reading” for me and lets me enjoy a piece of media I really love. My experience isn’t/wont be the same for everyone, but I think it’s just as much reading if I can retain things just as well or better than physically reading. And no, I don’t get through a ton of books or anything like that, just a casual reader with a love for fantasy. That’s just my two cents.
Edit: I doubted myself, it is the point of the video, whoops
glad you found what works for you! i have difficultly with audio because my mind wanders but i am currently listening to a memoir and i think i finally found the right book for my audiobook journey!!
The combination of reading an audiobook and doing something else with my hands is perfection.
Ur husband is sooo cute.
"It's talk to your husband afternoon time" that made me smile.
i can’t remember every meal i had last week, but i know i enjoyed a lot of them, i was nourished, and i picked the right meals for the moment. i might run across something in a year that makes me think of a specific meal i had last week, and ill remember it then, but i think it sucks the joy out of hobbies to act like we’re going to be quizzed on everything and how much we remember. i have books where i can recite the whole plot, i have books where i can vividly picture a few scenes, i have books where i can vaguely describe the vibes, and i have books that i entirely forget i read. it’s fine.
I 100% agree that it doesn't matter how someone consumes a book. It's very personal and if someone is lying about reading or speeds through books, honestly, who cares.
But, this was honestly so fun to watch you trying to remember these books. Makes me think back on some of my favorites realizing I have no idea what some of the plots even were. 10/10 challenge!
I just remember silver tongues or something like that. My mom loved Inkheart/Thief Lord. She passed away a few months ago, and this video made me think of her and smile. Thank you.
Gosh I never realized how many favorite books we have in common…no wonder I love your channel!!! Amazing book taste!!!
This is such a great discussion! I think at some point there will be someone who'll know the book more than you do, someone who's more of a avid fan than you are, someone who learned or got inspired from a random line in a book that you dismissed it as "just another sentence". So its okay to have forgotten because reading is an experience where you learn something, pick something, feel something that changes you and morphs you into 'new' you. Its not a school book that needs to be mugged up or a competition of who-knows-the-most.
This is my first time commenting here. I had to because the question really got me thinking. For me, I’ve read the book when I’ve taken out of it what I wanted. For light fiction that’s to be entertained. For literary fiction that’s to understand the author’s work of art, mull it over and determine what I think about what the author is trying to say. For nonfiction it’s to be informed, follow and think about the author’s pov. After some time the content leaves my conscious mind but the impact/experience remains. I, however, believe the content hangs around in my subconscious mind because it always comes to the surface when I’m experiencing a similar moment as a character in a book. I’m not really upset that my conscious mind forgets the content because that makes re-reading the story familiar yet fresh (allowing me to discover new layers).
I don’t think it’s fair to connect reading to memory. Because I (and I think many other people) don’t remember what I’m not actively using and working with everyday. Imagine carrying around hundreds of books everyday and going through them so you don’t forget the story and can therefore claim you read the book! 🤯
I think people who question others who read enormous quantities are actually wondering whether people take the time to savor what they read. But not everyone is alike. Some people just want a temporary escape from reality while others want something meaty to contemplate on. So you can’t hold another to your standards.
Perhaps we just need new vocabulary. Let’s just say that reading is the bare minimum of consuming the content, be it through reading or listening, and understanding it superficially. Let’s call going beyond that something else. I can’t come up with a new word.
Cari PLEASE reread Inkheart! I reread it about five years ago and ended up bawling my eyes out over Dustfinger. His arc is so sad and so romantic. This man will beg, borrow, steal, kill, die, because he is so desperate to get home to his wife. Everything he does is to get home to her 😭😭
Read the 2nd and 3rd book as well!!! All three are amazing!!
I love how while you discussed some very important things, you guessing the plot of books somehow turned this video also into a book recommendation video ❤
Just ordered a bunch of books to get back into reading so I'm very happy to be here!!! Lol. I find myself here from your other channel because I also live in South Korea right now and I want to do more reading in cafes and 100% part of the reason I wanted to get back into reading 😂 Judge me 🤣
hope you got some great ones!!
I really appreciate you making this. Thank you for being vulnerable and willing to share and experience we all do but don't often talk about (not remembering books).
That’s exactly how our brains are supposed to work-to only recall what we need and what matters to us. With what we learn in school… what we learn at work… a trip we take… a movie we watch… a conversation we had… our brains are not meant to remember every detail about every interaction we have with our environment.
I’m always surprised which books I remember and which I don’t and I usually don’t realize till someone asks me what ones about and I have to say “no idea” 😅
right?! even my favorites! and i've noticed that retelling a plot to someone is a learned skill - i've gotten SO much better now that i've been on booktube for a few years but prior to that, it was difficult :')
Great vlog. I've been keeping track of my books read since 1981. I only remember if I liked a book or hated it. And at my age I don't remember what I read last month🤣. That's why I can reread books and enjoy them. That's also why I keep a notebook of my reads. This was fun Cari!! 👍📚🤗💕
Since I'm working as a bookseller, it would be very good to remember at least some plot points of the books I read 😄so I kind of "trained" this ability for my job. And I'm proud to say that I think I am doing quite well😄
Loved this video! And I'm always so happy when you mention Cornelia Funke's books, they were my childhood 🥰
What I also loved is that you mention how you remember the environment/atmosphere you were in while reading, or the moment when you bought the book. Emotional connections to the book as an object, not necessarily to the story it tells. I know these feelings well, too. And I think they are wonderfully described in INKHEART - which, besides, is a book about the love of books 😉- for example when you open a book again, you remember the icecream you had while first reading it, or the bus you were in, etc. Please reread Inkheart if you find some time, would love to hear your thoughts on it 🖤📚
Cari you are lovely and your videos bring me so much joy ❤️
AHH THE LOML.
Idk what reading is but it's your fault that I like it again 😂
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this was one of my favorite videos ever ! I can never ever remember the plot of anything that I read and your words were so validating! I felt like I was a bad reader because I could never remember plots but now I know I'm not the only one who goes through this and it's perfectly normal! Thank you for putting out such a relatable video and giving people (including myself) the confidence to keep on reading no matter how much or how little we remember from reading! :)
I listen to audiobooks at work between patients because I lone work nights, and hospitals are creepy so audio makes it feel like someone is actually telling me a story and keeping the creepy away 😂
Can you remember every meal you've enjoyed, every holiday, every first date? I'm a writer and I can't even remember some of the things I've written. I have a writing partner that I sometimes write progressive stories with and I can't tell which part I've written. Who cares? It's the feeling that matters. Also, not remembering means you can read it again with a fresh mind.
Thank you so much for talking about this! At the end of the day, as long as you feel satisfied with what you’re reading regardless of the format that’s all that matters whether you remember it in detail or not. It’s interesting that this conversation is happening for books but not as much for TV shows and movies. That’s what re-reads/re-watching is for anyway :)
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That’s a really interesting point, about TV shows and how rewatching is generally acceptable!
I have adhd with an English degree (which was the hardest thing I could have done to myself) and I also have a hard time remember books, which I’m sure is not just adhd problem, however, I am either totally absorbed in the book or I’m reading without comprehension. I have a hard time remembering plots of some books and I think it’s because I tend to read the same genre so I mix them up. I still count those books I forget because sometimes I’ll pick it back up and then remember everything. I assume that I forget because after reading I left that world and it was just taking up space in my memory so I subconsciously archived it.
Reading for the moment ❤ the right book at the right time just lifts you up, even if I don’t remember it a year later word for word I remember the feelings it gave me.
And here I am listening to audiobooks at 1.2-1.7 speed cause I can still get the specific tone and moods the narrator acts and it’s the closest to the actual speed I read at 😂 while also remembering the entire plot but not 95% of character’s names. That’s my mix of ADHD and a wee bit of autism for y’all
My standard speed is 1,75. Otherwise my ADHD will makes me fall asleep
This debate has real, "Can you name three songs by the band on your t-shirt?" energy. Memory is weird. You aren't really remembering something directly, you're remembering the last time you remembered it. Whether or not someone remembers a book better via audio or print is going to vary greatly from person to person. For me, personally, I remember a book better the more I talk about it with someone else, or if I take notes. Which means my poor partner has to listen to me rant about Cash Wall's truck nuts in Against a Wall or Feyre's illiteracy in ACOTAR. It also means that I took a bunch of unhinged notes on ACOTAR while I was listening to the audiobook while taking a bubble bath. And it doesn't really matter. I'm reading books for my own personal entertainment or to expand my knowledge on a subject. There isn't going to be a pop quiz at the end.
I prefer audiobooks because I need to be doing something else with my hands. I have trouble sitting still and holding a book. You really have to sit down and dedicate more of your body and focus when reading something in print, and I find that I'm only able to do this if I'm on vacation and I am able to fully let myself relax. I don't think anyone should be shamed for listening to audiobooks vs reading printed materials, even if they are listening at 3x speed. Some narrators are so slow that it breaks the flow of a book and you almost *have* to increase the speed. (No hate to Jennifer Ikeda, but she slowed the pace of ACOTAR to the point where even exciting action scenes were a bit of a slog. I will listen to anything narrated by Kate Reading and Michael Kramer, and loved their readings of WOT, even if they struggled with pronunciation on some of Robert Jordan's weird names.)
I definitely agree that listening to an audiobook isn’t really reading. Whenever I listen to an audiobook I find my mind wanders and huge parts of the book just become background noise. But it’s even harder to remember physical books nowadays too. I remember when I was a kid I’d devour 300+ page novels and remember everything about them.
Great video, Cari!
Never in my life have I been this early
lol welcome!
I don’t remember what I did last week how am I supposed to remember the plot of a book I read months ago???
The way I just whipped my head so fast and grabbed my phone when I heard the title of my favorite book of all time 🤣 No one talks about Inkheart and it’s SUCH A GOOD BOOK 👏😩
SO GOOD!
I love this video so much!! I’m loving to see you trying to remember hahahah ( imo you’re doing really well)
Ok for the record I'm going to say this only because you brought up the conversation, I don't go around commenting on reviewers I don't like saying "you aren't a real reader!!!" I just scroll by and continue with my life. Here is the thing: extremes are bad. You're absolutely right that people read for different reasons and each experience is different. And EVERYONE forgets things after a while, it's dumb to judge people on how much they remember. That said! There's a discussion to be had about how we're currently consuming media (not just books). There's no denying people are binging to avoid spoilers and deal with FOMO while the thing is still trending on social media. As an oldie in fandom, it strikes me hard how fast fads come and go nowadays, unless the canon is a huge juggernaut (like for example the MCU up to Endgame). New season dropped? Gotta watch it fast, and we'll have fanart/discussion for a few weeks, and then everyone jumps on the next shiny and the tag of that fandom on tumblr/twitter gets only like 10% of posts. Add to that getting distracted by the phone, and yes, speeding things up on audio/videos... It's definitely affecting the way people process media, if they process it at all. This in return is affecting the media produced. I'm not a romance reader so I'm not fully informed on this but the other day I saw some comments that apparently romance books are getting "fanfictionized"? Meaning that the novels use fanfic format and the ship gets together too fast, not considering that an original novel doesn't have the background knowledge for the person already done like a fanfic. Something about slow burn dying, I believe. Similarly to this, seasons of tv are getting shorter and they don't get time to breathe and know characters better, it's just plot all the time. People are seeking instant instant gratification.
Again, this doesn't mean anyone should go around commenting on people's reviews accusing them of things, you never know what's happening in that person's life. But I do think the conversation must be had. It's like every time we fall down the consumerism rabbit hole: no, we shouldn't go around commenting "omg you're buying too much!" on people's videos, but the conversation should be had on videos dedicated to it to make us thing about it without pointing fingers.
eta: tiffanyverg just uploaded a video on "learned helplessness", a must watch.
This comment explained my thoughts so well! Props to you for coming up with such consiced phrasing, because I could never 😂
As someone who has now listened to audiobook, i don't count the act as reading the book. I didn't look at words on a page/screen i just listened to someone telling me a story. Reading books and listening to an audiobook are two very different experiences for me. In conversations I'll say "i listened to an audiobook" or "i read a book, well on audible" because it feels like deception to say otherwise. I forgive cringey writing more in audio form, my enjoyment is altered by the format.
That's my personal stance i guess
This video is about how we remember plots not about audio vs physical books. What in particular made you comment this?
genuine question- not meaning to sound harsh just curious!
I feel like these days there’s a debate or controversy on everything like whyyy do people care how someone is reading a book or if they remember the books they read i bet most people don’t remember the plots of the all movies they have watched but it doesn’t mean they never watched it .
there is such a thing called the curve of forgetting and this is applicable on everything, memories, books, the things you studied for your upcoming exam. Sometimes this can suck but sometimes this can be really cool cuz i can reread my favorite books like I'm reading them for the first time.
I cannot believe that, in the year of our lord 2024, people are still claiming that listening to audiobooks “doesn't count” as actually reading books. That’s saying that watching a movie awith subtitles “doesn’t count” as properly watching it because you didn’t “properly” hear the actor’s voices as they spoke. It’s insane.
I don't know about that. When I read a book all the characters get their own voice, the world becomes visually alive and if I'm really engaged Id sear there's a smell to the world as well. Not really of course, it's like listening to a song in your head. Apparently the parts of the brain that process sensory stimuli can be stimulated through imagination just the same (hence listening to a song inside your head) but audiobooks don't do that to me, so it's not the same for me at all.
@@HerrFinsternis Audiobooks might not work for you, and that’s perfectly valid. I don’t prefer subtitles over spoken dialogue either. But that’s not the point, the point is that some people claim that audiobooks “don’t count” because they expect everyone else to consume media the same way they do. I hope you understand why that would be bit problematic
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8:43 Cari COVERING herself with the quick ‘most of us’ absolute slay queen i love the acknowledgement! that’s all we need
It's so wild that some people seem to think they have the right to judge the experience of others. Soooo wild. I mean, no one can remember every second of their life. Does that mean we all have not lived theoughout all those moment just because we cant remember them?
Personally, when I was younger I could memorize everything I read and laughed at my mom for forgeting everything instantly (Rude!). Well, now I'm the same 😅
Only 8 minutes in and I just wanna say thank you for making this!! I used to be so proud of reading a ton and because of bookstagram, I feel sort of insecure about it due to being believed. I also jave memory problems in general, to the point Im a little concerned about ng health because of it.. but anyway, the thing you said about just being entertained in the moment, like reading on a train, and then not remembering or caring about the book after that train ride.. yes.. thank you so much for this video!! Really made me feel heard and seen and not judged. It means a lot!!
incredible video as always queen!!
As a person who’s really (like REALLY) bad with memory in general, this is very relatable, so thanks for this!
My husband is the same way! He says because I listen to audiobooks it’s not reading! With a house, a dog, and 2 kids, I can’t just pick up a book or everything will go into chaos! I will listen when doing house chores or driving, and then at night I will find where I am in my audiobook and where that lines up with my physical copy and read that way!
@@tananario23 to be fair I feel like he does more them most husbands, but he works night shift 6 pm-6 am so we only see him when we are getting home from work and school and in the am when we are going to work and school. He does what he can when he wakes up but he doesn’t have a whole lot of time! I absolutely do not fault him for the work that he does. After being a military spouse and now a LEO spouse I’m used to it!
I feel like when you say you read a book you should be able to remember something about, or in relation to, it. I don't mean you should remember intricate details, locations, side characters, or even the plot. What I mean is you should be able to say "I remember that book made me feel [Insert what you felt]," or alternatively "I read that book when I was [Insert memory about what was going on in your life at the time]." And saying a book was forgettable counts in that respect.
For example, I loved reading the Crazy Rich Asians series. I cannot for the life of me tell you what happened in those books, but I can tell you it was the first time I cried while reading a book. To me that's good enough.
my favourite quote about stories and their impact (whether you remember what you've read/heard or not) is from the Indigenous author Thomas King in The Truth About Stories:
" It's yours. Do with it what you will. Tell it to your friends. Turn it into a television movie. Forget it. But don't say in the years to come that you would have lived your life differently if only you had heard this story. You've heard it now."
Even if you forget the story itself, it still made its impact!
!! An hour video omg how lovely. Excited to hear your thoughts whilst I make dinner hehe and also just recently realized I was not subscribed!? I am now 😌 thank you always!
Recently I’ve listened to music while reading which allows me to memorize the book more, or at least it kick starts my brain. I have a hard time remembering what I read but I know in my heart that if I loved it, I loved it, and vise versa. like i can remember plot points generally but its hard to remember names. Great video!
I still remember the plot of almost all books I read as a kid and teen, and I read A LOT. Now as an adult I read very little but I barely remember anything. I think that's just... normal? The brain prioritises what is important and what is not, and in our adult life there is so much important stuff going on that book plots don't really matter. It's great when people can remember everything but books "count" as read no matter what, even if you don't remember anything other than a ~ vibe ~, idk.
Cari: here’s what I remember about Inkheart! … *proceeds to describe City of Bones by Cassie Clare instead, down to the villains name* 😂😂
Meggie's mom does go missing technically but its way before the story starts
Gentle reminder that those who had covid report big memory issues en masse! A lot of us suffer from the incapacity to retain names, plots, words. Many people say they feel aloof and forgetful all the time. If you had covid and started experiencing these symptoms, don’t blame yourself, it’s not you being less studious or focused. It’s your brain. Give it time to heal, don’t push yourself!
I love your thought about books being a time in your life. There are several books that I don't remember the *specifics* but I DO remember that I read that book during my first overseas flight, or that I was reading that book before my husband picked me up for our first date, or that my best friend and I buddy read it in college. THAT means more to me than the plot. I do always always always leave a brief review of every single book I read on Storygraph (I used to use Goodreads but don't now) and that has really helped me retain a lot of the memory/jogs my memory when I am trying to recommend something to someone.
LOL your botched retelling of Graceling had me howling! Its such a good series! I think the first book was actually one of the weaker ones in the series. Still snickering over here.
Such an interesting topic! My memory for detail is terrible in all of life, including books. And I'm one of those who doesn't see books in my brain at all, no movie or even images. What I typically remember is the feeling around something. So I wont remember many details about a book or event, even if it was very impactful for me, but I may never forget precisely how it made me feel. And yes - I still think my reading counts (at least for me, and who else matters on that point?).
Oh! But I do remember a villain named Valentine now that you mention it. I think it was from YA steampunkish SFF series called Mortal Engines (I think) that I read not too long ago. You said that name & I had a flash of memory!
yoooo Aphantasia gang
I started even counting textbooks in my yearly book count and there's no way I remember the "plot" of those. I've found that a lot of the books I get really engrossed in the world building are the ones I LOVE but have absolutely no memory of what happened. I LOVE LOVE LOVE the Ember in the Ashes series....no freaking idea what happened except the feeling I had while living in that world. And yes I have ADHD so I remember the entire plot of books I hated and forget the plot of most of my favorites unless I've done a reread.
14:36 the moment you said it takes place in Venice, the plot i have fogotten so many years ago came to my mind, sometimes all we need to remember is a little clue 😂
I think I kind of have a unique perspective on this. I did Battle of the Books (team of up to 12 kids get a list of 15-22 books depending on elem or middle school level, kids would read them and then answer questions about little details like setting, mannerisms, quotes, etc) and that basically trained my brain to remember plots and some very random details from any book I read. But it also trainee my brain to forget names after finishing the book. Now I don't remember books quite as well (especially since I was reading those books 2-3 times over 6 months), especially in long series (don't ask me a single thing except the beginning and ending of PJO) but I can still remember the plots and/or iconic scenes for most books I read. I have had many interactions over the years showing that this is not the most common 'ability'(?). Also, idk if it's FOMO or from doing BOB, but I personally can't do audio books because I feel like I miss half the stuff being said. I'm lowkey jealous of those who just put it on and don't rewind a million times. Read books however you want, whatever fits you and your life.
I love your channel! Also, I am impressed with how many plots you remember, considering some books seem to have very similar base stories. About what do one remembers about different books, I find that I remember the place or the time when I read it and the feeling it gave after I finished reading it. Love from 🇲🇽
i like to think of books as dreams i’ve had. the best dreams i can recall the general plot and maybe certain details and bad dreams i mostly forget
there's so many books I absolutely couldn't tell u all the details abt, but I always remember how a book made me feel, always always
I just started the video and omg! I am so glad! I was so worried that I was the only one who read to completion, closed the book, and completely forgot everything! Honestly, I thought I was losing my sanity a little. I have a Bachelor's in English so I read a lot of classics that influence works of art to this day. Yet, I cannot recall a single thing from them. And I always felt awful about it. To know that someone who has a BookTube channel goes through this too, wow. I really needed to hear it, thank you.
I need to reread the Inkheart series omggg. Idr anything about it but I remember the feelings I had (that I loved them).
The trilogy is so good!!