Ep. 13 How to Tune a Tom Tom
Вставка
- Опубліковано 4 чер 2018
- Support Sounds Like a Drum on Patreon: / soundslikeadrum
In this episode, we take a step back and approach tuning tom toms as we did with the snare drum in episode 1. We start from scratch with brand new batter and reso heads on a Pearl Masters MMX Maple 9x12" tom.
While there are a multitude of methods available for tuning toms, we break down our go-to methods with a 2-ply batter and 1-ply reso on what would likely be considered a modern rock tom. This approach can be applied to other drums and with other heads. It's best to experiment with the methods shown here and make adjustments based on the sonic feedback from the drum.
Hosted by: Cody Rahn
Production: Ben O'Brien Smith @ Cadence Independent Media
Can't get enough of Sounds Like a Drum? Want to show your support for the series? Join us on Patreon for exclusive content and MUCH more:
/ soundslikeadrum
👂🏼👉🏼🥁
Leave your questions, comments, suggestions, requests down below!
--------------------------
Sounds Like a Drum is a CADENCE INDEPENDENT MEDIA production
For more information, visit www.cadenceindependent.com
Follow us on Instagram: / soundslikeadrum
Like us on Facebook: / soundslikeadrum
7:00 -medium range, rest Major 2nd above batter (A/B)
8:50 -reso 4th above batter (F#/B)
10:34 -reso minor 3rd above batter (F#/A)
"if it's been on there for six months I'll change it" *looks with horror at my resos that have been on there for 7 years*
Just imagine the surprise you're in for with fresh heads!
UPDATE: GOT NEW HEADS AND THEY'RE GOING ON THE KIT FRIDAY!!! I'm beyond excited!!
@@thetenthandahalfdoctor2154how did they sound
@@Prodby3128 just fine. Easily tunable
@@thetenthandahalfdoctor2154 ok honestly tho how big of a change was it? Like oh my god how did I not do this sooner or more so yea this sounds a little better? Cause I just got new hydraulic red batters and they sound good but I feel theres just a weird tone underneath
I am really digging this channel. While I am not an amazing drummer, I have always had a rep for being good at getting a good sound out of drums. This has refreshed a lot of things I had forgotten and given me some new ideas. Thanks for putting this all together. A lot of drummers struggle with getting a good sound from their drums. This channel will be invaluable for those players.
I’ve watched so many drum videos over the years looking for good clear tech info. These are by far the best. Thank you.
This is all "black magic" to me. I've been playing for 50 years and I still can't tune my drums to sound decent. I even thought it was my cheap Ludwig drums so I bought a set of classic maples. I could have saved my money, they sound the same after I tune them! My Rogers Dynasonic that I've been playing since it was new in 1968 also sounds like something you would buy at Sears.
Thanks for the "Happy Birthday" song reference. I have no idea what all the major 5th, etc. mean. Of course, by the time I get the head in tune with itself, they are no longer anyways near the birthday song notes.
I still enjoy the channel, though.
"this has tone... that USED to have tone.." legend! thanks for the info man. sub'd
Really liked the Nolly approach of tuning to a set pitch and doing a semitone down from the pitch on the reso and 3 semitones down from that for the batter. Sounds phenomenal when he does it. Tried it on my kit and sounded like hot buttered garbage. I was super frustrated about it. Today I realized it's because I hadn't changed the stock resos since I got the kit IN EFFIN' 2007! I had to find out the year by finding my unboxing photos in Photobucket because FB wasn't fully a thing yet!
I realized the fault was mine, and now I'm going to the drum shop and getting some resos to set this thing right. You have my undying thanks.
How did this end up?
Excellent video! Worth watching twice.
So glad I found your videos! They are absolutely terrific!
We're glad too! Thanks for the kind words. Help your fellow drummers by sharing this channel!
He's pretty much spot on. I tune my tom toms medium-low and the reso head slightly higher. It not only creates a good punchy tone, but a quicker decay. Especially being a metal drummer and lots of notes.
Thanks (again!). Your explanations are so helpful. Appreciate your series.
Glad to hear it!
Damn. Guess I need to go change ALL my resonant heads. Great channel, great videos. Keep up the good, valuable, non-pretentious work!
After buying a kit with die cast hoops ( I was playing triple flanged for 15 years) I found out that this affects the way you tune you could talk about that. With triple flanged I could go crazy with different character tunings like detuning one lug etc and the drum would still sound good and somehow tune itself. With die cast hoops you always have to double check if the head is in balance or else you will lose a lot of sound.
Yes! That's a great point. We've discussed a hoop comparison video here and It'll definitely happen in the future. Triple-flange hoops are much more forgiving to tune, particularly with vintage drums that don't have the most precise bearing edges. We also have some wood hoops and other odd things that will get included for sure. Cheers!
...very interesting! Thanks a lot, stay tuned!
Brilliant stuff dudes!
Thank you for the video
Fantastic content here
Great channel guys! Keep it up!
Thanks for the support!
If you are not a head denter, heads last a long time. Just like guitar strings, when they stretch, you tighten them. I have a couple of kits with very old heads on them but the drums sound so good, I don't want to mess it up! Heads have a break in period.
What a find!!!! just put a drum kit in my studio, looking for resources to learn how to tune and maintain a kit, and take Chanel is a Godsend
Hey man you're a great dude and I really like your channel 👊💥
Great series, guys, thanks! Would love to see a video about choosing intervals between the toms.
Great suggestion! Looking forward to tackling that once we've gone through the remaining parts of the kit and start to put it all together :)
Amazing, thx
Really help-full ! Again!
Glad to hear it! Thanks for watching.
Cody, I love the info you guys put out. but I had to comment after seeing your t-shirt. Got into the recording studio business 30 years ago in the Seattle area. Billy Stapleton was one of our first projects. But we hadn't gotten our first drum set. Billy played often with Greg Keplinger so Billy asked him to pick out a good kit for us and it is the kit still sitting in the main room. Pearl kit by the way. learning more about drums lately. Keep it up please !!
I can watch this dude video's all day
We've got enough videos for you to literally do just that! And once you're done, we've got a bunch more over on our Patreon. Cheers!
Just awesome stuff! I'd like to see one on tuning floor toms.
Don't worry, we're on it! :)
Holy shite, you have done a lot with the room (acoustically) since this! 😮
You bet! It’s been 6 years and quite a bit of help from our friends at GIK Acoustics.
This is wonderful.. These videos deserve an award for best educational drum videos.. Your personality is a huge plus here.. Keep 'em comin' .. Any thoughts on the Drum Dial? I use it and love it but I am curious about your thoughts.. thank you
Hey there and thanks so much for the kind words!!! It feels great to put all this random knowledge to good use, so stoked that it’s helping so many people! Regarding the drum dial, I have to confess that I’ve never used one in my life. I will say that anything that helps you get the sound you need is cool with me, and I imagine they can be super useful for recreating specific tunings where using your ear alone might be more challenging. Cheers!
good stuff!
Thanks!
I believe what you are saying about the relationship of the top and bottom of the heads. The modern sound for rock and such usually has people pitching the reso head higher for more projection etc... However after doing this method for years (playing regular classic rock and such) I have finally discovered I like the opposite much, much better for 2 primary reasons. The first is that I find the drum much more “playable” if the batter is pitched higher than the reso. I find you can get a strange effect (tonal & feeling) sometimes when playing fast figures with the reso tighter. If the batter is slightly higher everything seems cleaner. The second reason I’ve come to like pitching the Tom reso lower is because 99% of the time a higher pitched tom reso is the #1 cause for snare buzz; at least for where I like my snare drum to be. If you pitch your snare to the sky like many folks do this isn’t an issue though I suppose. For reference I play a 12 rack and 14 floor tom; 12 is at A# and 14 is at D#. I guess my point for writing this is don’t be afraid to go against conventional wisdom. I did that for years and finally discovered I like the direct opposite much better. May not work well on all drums but it sure has on my current setup.
I would love to see a split-screen and compare the different tunings at the end.
Great stuff guys, love your videos. Wondering if you've ever encountered that awful basketball bouncing type "ping" when dealing with a close miked tom? Particularly Floor Toms.. Always searching for a way to fix this quickly and easily. Love it if you have any suggestions or possibly a video :)
I have a 70s supraphonic with the original snare side head still on it. I’m thinking I should get it changed now
Great stuff as usual! I've recently acquired a 3-ply mahogany Slingerland kit, and I am experimenting with the tuning scheme for each drum. Any kick tuning vids coming soon?
Thanks! Yep- we’ll cover bass drums in the near future. There are so many topics to address. Cheers!
NuDrums one of my kits is a 62' slingerland kit, and what made ALL the difference was putting a Remo fiberskyn head on beater side !! Just an idea you might like.
I’ve gotten really good at tuning the bottom a 4th above the top with the floor tom reso head the same pitch as the batter on next higher tom and repeat going up. I recently changed to maybe a third lower reso than the batter and my drums like it WAY more. The batter heads needed to be tuned higher than I was used to but it really brought out the pitch of the shells. Got em ringing quite nicely and they’re not too high,Which is what I was afraid of with this tuning scheme. They cut thru nicely when recording and still have just enough sustain. They still need some dialing in but this tuning has made my mid level price Premiers sound closer to something in the Yamaha recording custom range. I’m quite pleased with the results. Just have to spend some time with this scheme to get totally familiar with it. I find it takes months to really train your ear to what a particular tuning scheme does with your particular drums. But that’s the fun of it!
Pen Umbra I feel like tuning a drum Is like getting a good guitar tone
Ari Kadribasic yup,drums are much more of a guide to get into the ballpark of what pitch sounds the best,tho. There’s not as much forgiveness in drum tuning. Every drum has a pretty small range that it can be tuned to. With a guitar you can just tune it to an exact note for pitch. With drums,an exact note may not be compatible with the shell.
something that i think MANY drummers want to know about it is the difference in sound you get when adjusting how close together those rubber tension rod holders are on a pearl optimount
This channel is super under rated. I'm very happy that I found it.
Thanks! Be sure to share it with your drummer friends to help get the word out. We rely on subscribers to help spread the word. Cheers! -Ben
This is a good video. Thanks! I'm moving my toms to Evans G2 batter heads. What res heads would you recommend for rock and metal drumming? I am currently working on Metallica, Rush, and Dorothy.
The problem i have is when there tuned low they dont cut through in a live un miked situation .I had to put G1 on top and bottom and tune them a lot higher and when i heard the recording you can hear the articulation with the tight drum fills ... Also the heads last longer
I know you probably get this question a lot, are the stock reso heads on a kit worth changing? I know the stock batter heads usually sound awful (especially on floor toms), but what about the reso heads? For some context, I play a lot of rock, metal, and sometimes ska. I am planning on putting smoke colortone Emperors on the batter heads, should I bother putting Ambassadors on the reso side? My kit is a 1 up 2 down config (12", 14", 16" toms).
What about the final note it should make after tuning the batter as this note and resonant to that note. How do I know what note I will be making???
I’ve tried several tunings on my yamaha maple custom absolute nouveau, also several types of heads. Whenever I play my snare drum the 12” will sing a note, no matter how I tune the snare drum or the tom, the tom always resonates in a awkward way not a good one. I also have a yamaha club custom and the 12” does the same. I’m going nuts idk how to solve it, they didn’t use to do that, I’ve tried everything; new heads, changing the tuning on the toms, changing the snare’s tuning, hell I even bought acoustic foam. It keeps happening, any advice? Anyone with a similar experience?
Thanks for reading
When I first started someone told me (can't remember who) to change my reso heads every 3rd time I changed the batters.
I've stuck with that
Minor 3rds is my choice as well. 👍
So I should probably change my reso heads soon. Been on the toms since I got the kit new 20 years ago! 😂
Never felt the need to before because I always got a sound I liked out of them but I have noticed lately I just can't get them to where I want them anymore!
They're stock pearl heads on a 90's export kit so they've definitely out done themselves!
Wouldn't have thought they'd need changing every 6 months tho!
How often would you recommend changing the batter head?
Hey there! That’s wild that those resos got you as far as they did :) I don’t have a strict timeframe for changing batters, really depends on the head type and music. I usually change one-ply heads every 3 or 4 months (on a jazz kit, so not bashed) and 2ply on my rock kit may be only twice a year. - Cody
I use a Drum Dial, which I like a lot, and start off by tuning both heads to the lowest possible even tension all around. That seems to be around 76 for most of my toms, give or take up to 4 points in either direction.
I started off with both heads the same but found that I liked the bottom head 2 points higher (brings it to life from dead-sounding).
Next listen to the pitches of the toms and tweak them, usually up as they’re already as low as they go, into complimentary intervals.
The best intervals are the 3 perfect ones: the perfect 4th, the perfect 5th, and the perfect octave. They are called “perfect” because unlike all of the other intervals (2-3-6-7), they are neither major nor minor. The “perfect” intervals will sound right with songs in major keys and in minor keys.
Between 14f-12 and/or 16f/13, I tune to a perfect 5th (Twinkle, Twinkle, Little Star).
My 16f and 12” tom tune to an octave.
If I use 3 toms:
14f-12-10 = 1-5-b7
16f-13-12 = 1-5-octave
16f-14f-12 = 5-1-5 (my fav.)
If I use 4 toms:
16f-14f-12-10 = 5-1-5-b7
16f-14f-13-12 = 5-1-b3-5
16f-13-12-10 = 1-5-1-b3
If I use all 5 toms:
16f-14f-13-13-10 = 5-1-b3-5-b7
All combinations of these intervals produce consonant/harmonious results.
The intervals to avoid are b9/b2 (the “avoid note” (Jaws) and the tritone/#4/b5 the “Devil in Music” (Euro Police Siren).
Nathan Cirillo how to you figure the original note to base the other drums off of? A guitar tuner?
McDoogle Games :
In my case, usually a bass guitar ... I also could use a guitar or keyboard, but anything would work.
There must must apps that generate pitches. I think I had one.
(* Now I’m tuning both heads (coated Ambassadors) the same (between 74 and 78 for toms).
Play your toms when you have tuned them and sing the intervals, the melody they make (and then I go find that melody on an instrument and then make necessary adjustments to the pitches of the toms. I now tune about a minor third higher than their lowest possible note; it makes the toms “sing” more. Also I tune 16f-14f-12 to the first three notes of a bass guitar E-A-D because those are common guitar keys. They are each a fourth apart so I just sing the first two notes of “Here Comes The Bride”.) - I hope all that helps.
Great channel guys, congrats. Having said that I feel that you should do your videos also with other brands of heads than Evans. I don´t know if the D'Addario company is sponsoring the project or not but using and displaying only Evans products (except the calf head) is devaluing the great info you offer.
Thanks for watching! At this time, we're open to demonstrating other products if those companies contact us. If there's a product/brand you'd like to see demonstrated on our channel, let them know.
Keplinger shirt. Cool.
We love Gregg!
Will you make a video covering higher Bop tunings? I’ve been experimenting with it a lot these past few months but find I get a lot of gnarly overtones
Definitely! Keep in mind that some of those overtones are a good thing- they help the drums cut through the horns and the rest of the band. -Ben
Sorry to comment twice, but I'm curious of your opinion. When tuning a whole set of toms (let's say 10, 12, 16) with which drum would you start? Personally I would start with the 16 so I do't run out of room to tune down, then work my way up from there. I have heard of people starting with the largest, then the smallest, and slotting the rest in between.
Hey there! I personally don't have a specific order or methodology with regards to this. With the prevalence of backline kits in NYC, a lot of the tuning I'm doing is more about getting a good sound quickly than about going for a certain tuning scheme. In a fresh-heads/starting-from-scratch situation, I think I'd probably go for the floor tom first (and if there's more than one, the smallest of them) because I think that drum probably sees the most playing time, and then adjust the rest of them around that. I usually only use two toms, one rack and one floor, in combinations of 12"/14" or 13"/16" depending on what the music calls for, so the order of tuning doesn't really come into play as much as if you were running 3 or 4 toms. FWIW I do think of my snare as a tom voice when the wires are off and I do take its pitch into account as far as how it fits with the range of the toms and kick drum. Hope that helps!
WOOMPHHH
These videos are great. But, could you hit the drum more when you're demonstrating the end result?
How do determine the individual note of each head. Do you just mute the other head with your hand, or set it on the carpet, or pillow?
Either of those options works just fine.
Cody, I've posted on your other ideos. Great work, thorough delivery of info. I seek your opinion for tom heads for my cheapo beginner Gammon kit. Do you recommend the use of the presented heads on this video: 2 ply coated batter and 1 ply clear reso heads for these drums. The kit includes 12 and 13 inch rack toms, and a 16 x 18 floor Tom. I have tried various combos. Currently, a Evans G2 clear batter, and G1 clear reso. The 12 inch tom is almost "there" (that dooooo, dooooo sound that Jared describes on Drumeo), the 13 inch is more difficult a d the 16 i cloor tom even worse. Appreciate your advice and / or the advice of others to avoid breaking the bank and keep ordering drum heads ...... Is it recommended to oil the wood on the interior of a drum? oh yes, I know that the better drums are one of the easiest ways to get to that Sound. Although, a pdp Concept Maple 10 x8 rack tom received as a Xmas gift doesnt match my current Gammon kit, it is rack mounted with pdpd's STM L arm without insertion into the drum, came with single ply Remo clear reso and batter heads, and plays wonderfully . There is a definite difference in the better drums. I'm a 69 yo recreactional home drummer, playing for enjoyment in retirement.
Hey there! Yes the setup in this video is what I’d recommend, either coated or clear 2 ply batter and single ply underneath. That will give you the most options for tuning range in terms of getting a warm modern sound :) -Cody
And don’t worry about oiling the wood inside, it’s optional but not necessary 👍🏻
What you thought dial setting
What are your thoughts about the apps and/or the tools (Tunebot, iDrum Tune Pro, Drum Dial, DrumTorque Key..) to help tune drums... Does it help? Thanks! This channel is awesome!!! Keep up the good work!
Hey there! I can’t say that I have much in the way of thoughts about them as I have pretty much zero experience using them :) I do know that lots of people have great success with the aid of those sorts of devices but I was always just an ear-oriented tuner I guess. Might have to check them out someday though!
It helps me a lot! I used to get confused with the fundamentals/overtones and I would mess up my tuning... I guess it helps if you’re tone deaf... ;-)
It's all about what works for you! I (Ben) have experimented with a bunch of these devices during my time working for Evans Drumheads and came to find that I was much happier developing my ear to allow me to hear the subtle nuances from lug to lug and between batter and reso heads without the assistance of an additional tool. If you truly are tone deaf (and not just in need of some ear training) then these tools are excellent options. Otherwise, I'd recommend at least balancing the use of the devices with some ear training.
You are right! I usually use One of these devices to get close to what I want to hear and then fine tune by ear.
So the larger the difference in tension between the two heads the more pitch bend there will be?
To a certain degree, yes. It's not a linear relationship though.
@@SoundsLikeADrum thanks for taking the time to answer!!! Love the videos.
Woulda been nice to hear it played, With a Drum-Set, Before and after it was altered. :T
man, I've got a tune bot and a drum dial and my toms just don't sound right. I have a 10 12 13 14 and 16 toms. EC reso heads and hydraulic on the batter side. they just sound wrong... it's driving me crazy. I hear all these toms on youtube and mine sound nothing like that.
do you have to use a tuner when you tune ? nice vids btw:)
Hey there! Nope, no tuner. I check pitches sometimes with a tuning app in my phone if I’m curious about what the pitch happens to be, but no bots or anything like that for the actual tuning process.
Hi there.. I recently descovered your channel and I find it very cool and helpful! While I'm watching, I had the next question! DRum manufucters, wel some of them, claim that the drum shell it self has a tone! Is this true? and does this effects the actual tuning? Do we have to find each drums tone and tun on it.. or.. this is just stupid and raw manufactures marketing/ lol thank u very much! I'm absorbing each one detail you share! Thank you
We actually made an episode a few weeks ago addressing this directly! Check it out :) -Cody
@@SoundsLikeADrum Thank u Thank u Thank u :)
Not sure if you endorse Evans or its your preference, but would you be interested/willing to tune the same kinda drum, the same way comparing Evans with Remo ?
The whole drumhead brand debate isn’t really something we’re interested in getting into at this time.
I have that drum key with the finger tighten end tip...I stopped using it...it gives me blisters on my fingerssss!!! 😂
Have you ever considered tuning a tom while wearing isolation headphones to help tune out some of the unwanted overtones?
An interesting idea but often those overtones will assist with tuning if you’re just taking about getting a head in tune with itself. -Ben
What do you think about Tune Bot?
We're generally not really into the bots and dials and whatnot as it's adding a form of abstract measurement for the sake of applying a numerical value to the tuning when what usually matters most is the qualitative value- does it sound good? Training your ear to recognize the overtones/fundamental pitches and then adjusting the tension as necessary tends to be our approach. As long as you're working in an environment where you can clearly hear your drums, your ear and a key is usually all you need.
I always try to make my Tom's sounds big and boomy for rock gigs, my sound guy always gets feedback from this when they are mic'd up so I then have to combat that. Is this the sound guys problem or mine?
Man, I’m sorry to say it’s both - they have ways of combating that issue and we as drummers have options too (tuning and muffling etc.) but in the end you have to work together. It’s not that anyone’s doing anything wrong, the nature of sound and vibration is just such that some sounds just won’t always work. If you can it’s worth having someone hit them for you when there mic’d up so you can hear them from the audiences perspective and see if there’s room to dial back the boom a bit and still achieve the sound you’re after 👍🏻 -Cody
@@SoundsLikeADrum Thanks Cody 😀
Do you tune with a drum dial?
Nope, never have. Definitely useful for certain situations but never felt the need. -Cody
Can drum shells effect the sound? I have a Ludwig accent with Philippine mahogany having tough time with sounds the toms . I know what a Ludwig sounds like 🤨
Drum shells absolutely affect the sound (ideally, you want to get the shell to resonate). Budget level kits may not necessarily resonate the same way some higher end drums do but these methods for tuning still apply. -Ben
Thank you for the advice
If you use two drum keys, there is no way that you would not be level with your head. Just good old evans or tama keys and some sensitivity in fingers.
Two keys is an excellent way to do it, though height isn't as important here with toms as it is with a snare side head, for example. Pitch balancing is the priority and it doesn't always equate to the number of turns, depending on the drum and even minor inconsistencies with the drumhead.
At 11.07 I heard too many overtones. Thus the reso should be slightly higher, but not too much. I would use maybe 1/8th of a tone difference then a whole 1/4th. Just my opinion. Overall, every tom tom has its own character and at this point a good set of ears should come into play.
My small tom and floor tom have always been easy for me to get a good sound out of-- the in between tom which is 13” has ALWAYS been a BITCH to get a good sound out of,,,, Organic damage perhaps???
How the Heck is everyone able to hear a minor third or fifth or whatever steps in tuning simply by ear? I can barely hear whether something is higher/lower.
It takes practice. The first step is being able to identify when one pitch is higher or lower than another so you've already checked that box- congrats! Here's an episode we did on how to practice tuning & ear training: ua-cam.com/video/Pevej3Fiupg/v-deo.html
@@SoundsLikeADrum Cool, thanks! I kind of figured after my astonishement of all those trained ears that you might have adressed that topic. I set myself three months goals which include detune and tune all of my drums anew. Thanks for the video! :_>
Did I miss the part about mounting v a snare stand? This video seemed to end abruptly - just stop.
Or is that a different episode?
Here you go: Ep. 19 How Tom Mounts Affect Sustain ua-cam.com/video/GnUz9LM--lQ/v-deo.html
6 months?? Yeah,,, no way,, I can NOT afford to change heads every 6 months-- I’m a failure.
This is when the this channel was great, now it's so biased
How so? Also, we absolutely have and share our opinions and clarify the subjective vs. objective nature of our coverage.
Too much talking