Is this even going to work…
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- Опубліковано 5 лип 2020
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Not to leave our viewers dissatisfied, we built a furnace of a PC, a wind tunnel with 7 radiators, and our own data logging system to find out once and for all the EXACT effects of stacking radiators on water temperature.
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Arduino code is in forum post!
Check out learn.adafruit.com/thermistor... for a good guide on how to use a thermistor-based sensor.
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Pretty sure Corsair just tricked LTT into doing their research for them.
Corsair has big brain!
Lol
Ltt is getting abused by Corsair
Corsair : I'm Gonna Do What's Called a Pro Gamer Move
And didn't pay a dime as well. Corsair high IQ yes.
Corsair employee 1: we can't afford research
Corsair employee 2: yes but I know who can
The rep: let's set the plan in motion guys, I'll make the claim
Lmao Corsair engineer and Pr team big brain for tricking linus to this stuff for free
Well, they did send pics of flow simulation data
@@WebbSM shit you had to exist
You just can't do the dishes. It's impossible!
Liam Nolan oops must have been my bad non ECC RAM😂😂
As one of my college professors said to me in Circuits 2, "When it comes to testing a system, especially an electrical one. You will almost always come to the conclusion of....it depends."
I'm married to an engineer. That is always her answer.
What you will find is what it depends on. That is also good information.
One of my professors (he used to teach electronic components and building circuitry), first class and he goes:
Prof:"Imagine you're defending your engineering theses and the comitee asks you a question. What's your response? If it starts with anything else than "it depends" then you probably got the question wrong, or didn't study that topic."
So in other words, it depends if the answer is it depends.
@@skywz Well....it depends.
Now I'm curious as to how many people actually interpreted "stacking radiators is bad" as "stacking radiators without adding any additional fans is bad" vs "stacking radiators (including additional fans) is bad"
Stacking radiators with fans AND spacing between radiators for fresh non recycled air is best. That way you nearly remove all preheated air.
I am still trying to figure out why corsair, a company that has a history of making good cooling gear, would consider a straight flow series stacked radiator system without sandwiched fans to be a legitimate case for making an argument against stacked radiator systems. the best I can figure is I have missed a point of context here in the argument between corsair and linus. It took me all of an hour back when I first heard of liquid cooling for PCs, despite not having a degree in theromodynamics, to figure out that a reverse flow series stack with sandwiched fans would have greater cooling for the form factor of a PC case even if the air is preheated by the non waterblocked components in the case, and even better if you can feed them fresh air and draw the preheated case air through a different fan group.
i got from it "stacking radiators where hot air from first one is cooling second one is bad"
Yeah i assumed people were sandwiching fan > rad > fan > rad etc.
This is the most effort I think I've ever seen anyone put into winning an argument in the comments section.
Over a million views and giving away an expensive smartphone? Linus is playing 3D chess in the UA-cam comments section.
@@ting this is nothing, really
And lose
I have seen a lawyer in one state become a lawyer in another state just because people were commenting "things are different in this state you don't know what you're talking about!!!!!" (said lawyer ended up being right in their original statement)
@@ting is nobody going to talk about the fact that the official Ting channel is commenting on LTT videos
We gotta thank the team who produced such a beautifully well explained video. The amount of effort put into this is amazing
This was the minimum effort required to try and publicly shame someone. The previous video is an embarrassment.
Preston I am not shaming them I mean it. The team who produces these videos is truly hardworking
Are they? I’d say that the distribution of manpower has made this kind of thing easy. I’d say that this video exceeds the regular LTT type video.
DinkySailor 2560 I think he might have possibly been talking about the video, in which case he was simply disagreeing with you
@@fatlessbacon2210 hmm 10 emeralds
These "engineering" focused videos are by far my favourit content on your channel. Stuff like this where you build your own meassuring system to gather and analyse data on some crazy test-setups is imho the most interesting and entertaining content!
Yeah this seems super cool! Did you find any other videos similar to this one? I'd love to binge em. Cheers.
Now it's time for Corsair to start a video series titled: "$H!T Linus Says"
That would be a long series
Isn't that all the videos on the channel 😂😜
or "Some of our $h!t that Linus dropped"
Linus says shit (LSS)
I love it when they go full Mythbusters.
Corsair: yo, your radiator setup is kinda inefficient
Linus: Give me like 2 weeks, I´m gonna check myself
They proved it the first time, they did this for the whiny commenters asking them to do tests in unrealistic circumstances
Damn, the “new” deepfake of Linus is soooooo lifelike.
LOL
@Don Mega i guess its very funny if youre on that stuff they are on
Don Mega r/woooosh
woswas denni r/woooosh
“Colin, never content to just take the easy path” Linus that means he learned well from you
No, linus takes the easy path
@@jzsxph7007 The drop path
@@jzsxph7007 linus tries to go the easy path first, then something goes wrong and it changes to the hard path
jzsxph mo
damn, i feel honored
As someone whose university degree included thermodynamics: second test is referred to as counterflow, and is *always* better, provided your heat exchanger doesn't get damaged by thermal stress due to temperature difference.
Can confirm that, chemical engineer with thermodynamics in one semester.
@@TobiasDettinger also can confirm, 10 mins of google research.
can confirm, no degrees or anything you guys just used big words so i know what you're talking about
Also can confirm degree in photography
7
You know, it's really nice when you see someone actually take notice of criticism and constructively react to it. Your ability to listen and engage with an audience that always keeps me watching.
me too
Yup
Well when Billet Labs wanted him to test their product with the GPU *it was made for* he didn't want to shell out the $ to do it.
The electrical engineer in me predicted these results. For better results, I hypothesize that radiators with the fluid flow in parallel will do better.
Agreed. Parallel radiators would be the same as having a bigger radiator, right?
Disagree. Radiators in line with the fluid flowing the opposite direction of the air should be optimal, that basically makes it a counter-flow heat exchanger (most efficient system). Putting the radiators in parallel would probably be similar to having one incredibly thick rad with a fan capable of driving air through it, and be similar to one cross-flow heat exchanger, which is better than a parallel heat exchanger (both fluids in the same direction), but less efficient than a counter-flow one, so it should in theory fall between the two different setups they tested here.
The 'heat exchanger' article on wikipedia is pretty much on point in explaining this (much prefer the German one on the off chance you speak it).
@@MrJ4ckie what about facing two radiators into each other? Maybe eventually the heat built up in such a system would open a portal to hoth and you pc would just be eternally cooled by the temperature of an ice planet.
@@MaxUgly
Nope.
Parallel or seriel does not matter at all for temps.
And if you only have one inlet and one outlet on your pump, it will not matter for pressure either, as there are no more restriction in a radiator, then in your loop tubes.
The cooling of your loop is determined by the cooling capacity of your radiators, and the heating of the loop is determined by the power output of your components.
If you split the loop and put the two radiators in parallel, the flow will fall to about half, and soak up more heat from the component on that loop, and the fluid will remain longer inside both of the radiators and get slightly more cooling, but because the fluid was warmer before in entered the radiators, and they mix together in the same reservoir anyway, before being pumped out again, it will not matter at all.
@@TheRealBaDaBingDK The restrcition works like resistance in a wire. More downstream restriction all adds up. The rest of what you said is correct though, I believe. If you still disagree, I will take the time to type out the math here for ya. I appreciate the conversation and unlike most other times I believe I am correct here.
When you get a Linus ad for pulseway on his video “We heard you like Linus so we put Linus before your Linus so you can Linus before you Linus”
Honestly this was very well done and I would love to see more content like this. It had great depth without dragging on for days, it focused in on a specific area, and had great custom testing. The custom testing method was really simple but well thought out and implemented. Linus, if you had this kind of stuff on floatplane I would surely pay to watch. Great video!
I mean, they upload the same content to floatplane, just earlier... so you could pay to watch :D
You're looking for Gamers Nexus if you want actual science
My mans made a whole review
Probably for dummies. I already knew the result before he even made this video.
@@rusinsr LMG literally makes millions off of UA-cam. I cannot believe they feel the need to charge for this content.
You're going to end up launching a new channel entirely dedicated to your engineering beefs with Corsair
Could call it Linus Tech Chips. As in chip on the shoulder.
LinusTechBeefs
Don’t give him ideas...
That channel won't be able to keep up linus would need more staff
i'd watch the *hit out of that channel!
When the radiators are stacked in sequence, indeed the warmed up air that goes out of the first radiator, has less ΔΤ compared to the hot water in the second radiator and heat load is not effectively removed. By the time the air reaches the 5th or 6th radiator, it's probably as hot as the cooled down water that goes through that radiator, so no real heat exchange is happening. Like you (correctly) stated, the stack of radiators just increases thermal capacity.
BUT, try to put the radiators in parallel, so that each radiator gets fresh, cool air. In such an arrangement, the heat removal will probably be almost doubled with two radiators. And because the second radiator will get cooler water with the same room temperature air to remove heat, the progressively lower difference between "hot" water and "cool" air will again create diminishing returns after 2 or 3 radiators in parallel.
Since you have made up the rig, it's worth to try this out. You don't need to work up to 6-7 radiators in sequence. Just try two and compare with one. And by the time you try a third one, I am guessing you will see significantly less than 3x the heat removal.
“Does a little bit of math”
Saw hart equation*
Cries in addition*
“Is this even going to work?”
If you don’t drop any part then yeah, probably.
Yeah if even the verges PC worked then it will
XD
flashback to when that pc build fell from the table
This joke never get’s old.
Linus just got vectored
"More rads definitely equals more better" - Ladies and Gentlemen I present to you Science by Linus.
Linus equivalent of "Just strap on more boosters!"
Me simple man prefer simple math
@@jetstreamlynn3156 damn ksp reference
It's like when Mr Krabs ran into the stack of 30 paintings Spongebob put there.
Not in fallout tho
This is a bit late, but I think something is up with your sensor calibration, it looks WAY too noisy.
Especially given that you need extreme accuracy to account for the slight temperature measurements between each sensor reading since a 1 degree difference would completely change the outcome of your conclusion. I know thermistors are typically +/- 0.2 degrees C but the process in converting a resistance -> voltage -> digital signal -> raw number -> temperature often leads to huge amounts of error to the point of +/- 2 degrees C and this shows up in your data especially with your last test.
For once I know a bit about this so here are some suggestions for if you guys decide to do something similar in the future (please do! I love this kind of content):
- The Arduino's ADC should be calibrated so that you get a better analogRead(). (I've never used the Due so I'm not too certain about the noise) but looking at the AT91SAM3X8E datasheet, an Integral non-linearity of 2LSB total actually doesn't seem that bad, assuming you guys are using 12 bits of resolution? I've done personal projects with various Arduinos and switching just the Nano to a Zero once changed my readings to +/- 0.1 C to +/- 0.5 C. For comparison the LSB difference between the ATSAMD21G18 and ATmega328P was 1.2 and 2.6 albeit with different resolutions.
- Not sure if the ADC is the main culprit here, but it's a possibility since not all ADCs are created equal. Upping the resolution from 10 bits to 12 doesn't always make the noise better due to offset and errors. I would link it if I could, but if you google "Precise voltage measurement with the Arduino board. skillbank", the first result is an amazing guide and a good read on how to properly calibrate the Arduino to read voltages properly. It gives a good explanation on analogReference as well. (Optimally using a reference diode would be best for this)
- Why use a 250ms delay with a moving average? The easiest way to get rid of the noise at this point would be to just deal with it on the software side and sample quickly and average a lot of values at once. Spitting out the average directly instead of a moving one would also reduce lag in the data.
Ok I'll stop since I've been way too technical with this already sorry, but anyways mad props to you guys for revisiting this, and for using Steinhart and ice bath + boiling water calibration and not using the thermistors directly! I was pleasantly surprised when I saw how far you guys went to get your get the best results out of your testing! Hopefully if you guys see this and do decide to try and improve your data for future projects this helps a bit. Unfortunately, when you want to get accurate readings down to a tenth of a degree, it just gets increasingly harder to do.
Edited to fix formatting.
Good to see another person saying this. All my hours spent in a lab with a datalogger and array of sensors, thermistors included - if I had data that noisy I'd swap all my wires, and be very worried aha
I honestly don't know why they didn't poll the sensors for their maximum polling rate. 4Hz is immensely low - and as I suggested elsewhere, they should link raw data graphs in the description, but absolutely smooth those curves (to a proper fit of course). Then pedants and cynics can check the description, everyone else sees the clear picture
@@skarrambo1 Glad to see that you agree too! And yep my first go to with noisy data is to double check if I wired something wrong and check for interference but their breadboard setup seems fine at a glance.
I know they do this mostly for entertainment and fun but yes! I'd love to see full documentation of this project, it'd be really cool if they uploaded everything from the code and schematic to the .stl files that they used (not that anyone with a sane budget could replicate this haha) along with their raw data. Something as cool as this deserves it
I question the value of the high sample rate with the "calibrated" thermistors. Just use DS18b20s and sample at 1Hz, you only need to sample at twice the frequency of the effect you are trying to measure. Higher sampling is making all the subsequent steps more difficult. It is not like the effect they measured had any useful information at the sub-second scale, the water temperature did not have meaningful fluctuations within 1s timescales. The noise introduced by their thermistors and calibration system really degraded the quality of the data.
It took 14 days to build that in part because they fiddled with the calibration and adjusting the potentiometers. With DS18b20s they could have used one digital pin with much simpler wiring, and higher accuracy and precision.
This was a very interesting read and I am not even interested in the video. Just appreciating the level of expertise here.
"Spitting out the average directly instead of a moving one would also reduce lag in the data."
ikr too bad they didnt have a dyno guy hanging around
Great work! This is very similar to 2nd or 3rd year mech eng lab experiments, so the outcome is known, although Corsair not specifying the fan increase is unfortunate. For even more fun, try the experiment again without rads at all, and observe the effect of just increased airflow from the extra fans.
11:22 really making good use of those 8K cameras I see
That zoom is the reason to shoot in 8K!
Thanks for the follow up, due diligence and listening to the feedback. As a mechanical engineer with some thermodynamics experience I am now satisfied.
True... not perfect, but it's nice to see the effort.
As a carpenter with some clamping experience I am now also satisfied...
you have 69 likes and thats nice, now you need 42 comments
Nice, this really did address the main issues with the previous testing.
“Ting wants to save you money, pay only for what you use” as I glance at my 30+ GB data usage last month
psh. before verizon changed their data policy, i easily used 300GB a month. of just mobile data. not even including my hotspot.
@@justabrokeredneck HOW IS THAT EVEN POSSIBLE
@@justyn6750 UA-cam
At this point after all the testing I would love to read an academic like paper with all the details and more in depth analysis
I'd like the read it too.
Noooo.. I'm already getting bored with the vid no more paper lol😂
1:57 imagine if they reached out to Corsair instead of Alphacool xD
Or noctua
@@loveelpierre5278 Noctua doesn't make radiators though?
The probably went with Alphacool to avoid a conflict of interest.
@T. Hane He said he reached out
Their main issue is their writer who keeps using "more better" *eye roll*
Great video series, looking forward to subsequent videos. Some related questions I have are: Is there any benefit to stacking fans, What's the best placement of fans on a radiator, What about a fan on both sides of a radiator?
Great video - low the deep dives that you invest in here!
One thing that I would love to see in the future is that you "clean" the data so that you first show the raw data, and then get rid of all the tiny spikes, as those I would assume are just reading fallouts and not actual temperature bumps (in the case of 1 vs 2 rows of radiators you have a delta of more than 2 degrees in the fallouts).
Overlay the two at first and then use the "cleaned" graphs :)
Keep up your great contend!
When I saw the thumbnail, I thought Linus was going to overclock an i9-10900K
intel on suicide watch
Even i
Intel CPU are not good for banchmarking.
INTEL 2020
The jailbaitesque look is quite flattering~
Roasted
Corsair: this doesn't work.
LTT: haha radiators go brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
LTT: oh wait, u were right!
You should have watched the video to the end, which I know you didn't because the conclusion happens about at the 10 minute mark, the video has been online for 14 minutes and you posted 7 minutes ago.
Comments that did not age well
Hey that's a dani reference.
@@Anankin12 That was a good one.
Can't believe that I discovered this channel just now. Never seen someone explain and test IT-Stuff as good as Linus.
Crazy good Content!
The production quality on this channel has just grown and grown over the last few years. Nice one
when a programmer makes a graph "sensor 0"
Which is the correct thing to do because you can increment through the sensors then use modulo arithmetic to easily get back to zero again.
@@brazeiar9672 YOU IS BIG SMART
Exactly why programmers do - and almost no one else.
When the data is input through a program. Its probaply on PinIn 0 so the Arduion Assigns it an index of 0.
Python starts with 0 instead of one sooo........
Linus: "Delta T"
Steve from Gamers Nexus: *heavy breathing*
Delta T is fine Steve doesnt like %t over t
as long as you use the same measurements and comparisons (Celsius does end up being constrained by granularity at less then 100)
though when you start doing Delta %T, or % difference between delta-T that is when you are playing with the Wrath of Gaming Jesus
Steve is boring to watch. Informative...yes....boring....hell yes
Delta T always in Kelvin.
@@noproki2838 uhm no
Man, Linus has matured a lot. I am glad that I have been seeing you since the last 5 years. You admit your mistakes when you are wrong, that's why I love your channel. You are doing awesome work.
Since when has he not done that?
Linus, did you try running the "2 rad system" with the fans pulling the air through one and pushing the air through the other, sort of like rad fan rad, I think the "static pressure optimization" is meant for air going through one thing, not 2. I think you'll find the results to be slightly different, although likely negligible at this scale
I feel like the actual answer to the question was glossed over in a single, easily missed, line of the video. as long as the air passing through each rad has enough thermal capacity to pull heat from that rad, it will cool the water inside. Sadly when using fans designed to move air through a single rad, it's moving far too slowly, the air getting "filled up" with heat before it ever gets to the next rad in the line. Use some loud AF, high speed, server fans in there and re run the tests. ( or do it dirty and use a furnace blower ducted in.)
Think of the air like a bunch of buckets on a conveyor belt, and each rad as a hose pouring water from above. If the buckets are moving slowly, the first hose has time to fill each bucket up before it gets to the next one, where as when moving faster, each bucket only gets partly filled before moving to the next hose in the line.
Best explanation for heat transfer so far!!!
We all know that if you have a huge amount of airflow, you will have better cooling, but that isn't the point of the video.
Nobody is putting 10000RPM fans in their PC, so it is irrelevant to the question.
@@alexvolute7454 the question in the video is if having the same air moving through 2 rads works any better than just one rad. the answer is, if you have enough air flow, ot cool enough air to be able to soak all the heat from the first rad and still have thermal capacity, then yes, if not, no. simply testing it with one set of fans designed to push air through a single rad does not give enough information. there are plenty of quality fans on the market that can push plenty of air, and if you actually care about cooling rather than silence you can run them at high volume to push plenty of air.
@@johngaltline9933 pushing air through it wont help, it's basic thermodynamics. the air that gets to the next rad will never be as cold as the air going through the second or third or ... air is a very bad heat conductor which is why is a very good isolator. if the rads are next to each other instead of on top of each other then you should see some better performance on the second one as the first rad takes out part of that heat and uses the same temp air as the first one. hope this makes sense - sorry if i misunderstood something
and who doesnt have a 2nd radiator without fans?
"So we were wrong... only at domestic environment."
"Suck, it Corsair! At Server environment, more than 2 radiator help a lot."
Nice tl;dr
true cause your not using fans in servers your using angry and stressed gremlins which cast wind magic ..... anyone close enough is cursed with permanent hearing damage.
In their defence, it didn't help that much
It doesn't help enough to justify the engineering and cost required. Not to mention the many added points of failure. It's cool in theory, and not in reality.
Just buy a thicker rad, you'll get the same effect.
This is one of the reasons I love watching Linus. He's not afraid to admit to being wrong. That's not a quality you see in a lot of people and endears him to me far more than any communicator who just gets everything right.
Mostly right but capable of admitting when you're wrong > Always right
Glad you did it the right way this time.
Usually, when an engineer corrects you, they more likely are right. They know their stuff after all.
Ya know... for once in a live time:
You guys did an exceedingly great job. This was amazing to watch.
I love that, albeit under great outside pressure, you guys are ready to spend time (and money) to seek the truth and correct your former mistakes.
Knowledge is important, and I rarely if ever hand out praise, or comment in general, but respect where respect is due.
Thank you.
I second this. Immense respect for this UA-cam channel 😃
Agree. And also it takes huge balls to accept that you were wrong, that too on UA-cam.
This channel always has quality content with excellent data. People severely underestimate Linus genius
Haha radiator go brr
Why did you have to add snark to that comment? L
First of all i need to thank Linus that hes still reading pretty much all the comments although this channel has over 11 million subs. Thanks Linus for listening to the community!
He's not the only one reading all the comments.
@@ting do you got some names?
The Trancestation lol, the actual company responded, theyre saying they read their comments too
@@ting hey hey its our sponsor!
The odd part, I would have expected the comment that described the basis of that test setup to be highlighted.
It kind of seems like more rads acts as a bit of a low pass filter for the temperature differential (less “noise” in temperature feedback). But would of course be much harder to cool after heat soak.
the data logging could also be implemented with an regular arduino teensy or a bluepill and if your mcu has to few analog inputs you add an analog to digital converter that works over ic or spi.
“And I learned something today...” just like how your gonna learn something about our sponsor, TING! - come on Linus! You’re off your game!
i even said this out loud expecting to say it with him hahah... so disappoint.
Lol just because you don't get sponsors.. lol
@@aluandcache7336 æ
“Laughs in Matlab”
Being an Indian and not watching the video yet I am very confused.
Same
*Laughs in Python 3*
@@Ilikepapyrus I find Matlab much more practical for matrix calculus than Python but the cost argument can't be overlooked. Although slightly less convenient, Python allows for most if not all of what Matlab does at no cost in performance and for free...
😂😂
Do more videos like this I like the science and math and the actual learning
Stack all rads in a long box. They should not be touching. Connect 2 vacuum cleaners to pull the air through. Run pumps in reverse.
Chuck the vacuum in another room if the sound bothers you.
Might aswell try as you already built the lab setup. 😀
PS. You cannot achive lower than ambient temp with a passive setup as shown in this video.
But you can add water spray to cool the rads and fluid even more.
shady guy in dark alley: wanna do some blow?
Me: yeah
Shady guy: *pulls 7 radiators and fans out of his trench coat, attaches to threadripper and exhausts 50°C air in my face*
#1 why would you be in the alley with the shady guy
#2 no one offers coke to random people on the street
@@Nik-ff3tu You´ve never been to Miami right?
@@leon81061 I haven't but I'm laughing my ass off right now.
@@Nik-ff3tu in a dark alley every guy is shady
tho in a bright alley...
@@Nik-ff3tu he wasnt offering coke he was offering cold air
4:03 The Linus Battle Cry©
Dude wow
gnarr
I love the wind tunnel, good data collection technique, but i think its better to use a 500-1000w water heater(resistance) so its a constant load, then redo tests with 1, 2, 3, 7 radiators
Stacking the radiators is akin to having a thicker radiator, though you will get some gains from the extra fans. If you could have the radiators side by side you would get more cooling duty as the airflow resistance would be lower and the air temperature hitting the radiator will be higher. Connect the radiators in parallel to the pump ensuring the pipe length is consistent for each radiator.
Also if you allow the system to come to a steady state you will be able to compare different setups more easily.
5:01 wait noname makes reservoirs? I thought they were only in the food industry
@@T. Hane I'm not going to r/woooosh you, because that's stupid. However, I will point out to you that both of them were joking about the 'example' and 'no-name' products and the joke was that all the example and no-name products were from the same manufacturer.
NC?
Noname as in not branded or a brand that's too obscure to have heard of it
@@Ikxi no name is a Canadian food and food-related products brand
@@_framedlife Ohh ok
From Germany so never heard of it
Just watched pulseway ad with Linus on it.
Got to say the man's gone a long way from his 1st few unboxing videos. Congratulations
I would like to see them all take in fresh air and see if that makes a significant difference. I know it would force everyone to have gargantuan cases but this is food for thought.
Please do test parallel radiators! Just seems logical and I do believe it'd work better
You have helped me so much when it comes to building, because of your videos I know how and what I need to do to build my first pc
Cool story bro
skieshimself lmao
You know how to make a pc? Ok, name all of them.
OK but isn't that basically 60% of people here
epic
"BOOM HEADSHOT, GOTCHA CORSAIR!" LOL
I think they should have brought in a Corsair rep to say "BOOM HEADSHOT, GOTCHA LINUS!"
Love the Pure Pwnage reference
My cat's name is Pwnage.. I died when he said that lol
well...if you stack radiators not one below another, but nearby or add spacing between them, so heat from previous would not be input air input for another, it would have greater effect.
otherwise it is just thermodynamic, you take the heat from the water to the radiator, heat the air and then blow the heated air to the next radiator and heating him, which will heat or cool the water depends what is more heated
From building race cars, in general you want the biggest single radiator you can fit "for your needs", but fluid volume and fluid flow have to be calculated as well. You only split into multiple rads for a single purpose if you're space limited.
Too much or too little flow means there isn't enough thermal transfer. Which stacking rads, adding a bunch of fittings, and generally reducing the fluid pathway efficiency is another issue.
For this experiment, assuming you have to stay in the wind tunnel effect: I'd reduce the number of rads to 5, then double stack fans at the entry, with another double stack before the 2nd to last rad.
7 radiators and 7 pair of blowemetrons 🔥 (for enough air flow)
I was expecting to see this test 😂
Please record with RTX Voice on, thanks
@@NitsuSaiNeko haven't heard this insult before lmao
I'm kinda disappointed that there weren't blowemetrons tbh
Scrapyard wars, but the only fan you are allowed is an electric leaf blower. Sponsored by (some lawn tool company).
I would expect creative cardboard case modifications and plenty of ducktape.
@@marsrover001 ahhh DuckTape ! Let the poor animals live instead of shoving them thru cardboards !
Linus: We did this for two frickin' weeks to make sure Its super accurate
Comment Section: tHe tESt wAs uNreliAblE
two*
@@Haitham0 congratulations you have achieved absolutely nothing
@@maurice7017 ok
Waiting to see how GN would roast the setup...
@@maurice7017 So did you, wait a minute...
These are the videos I subscribe for. Science with epic tech and memey presentation. Top notch fellas!
I have never seen tests using rads in the way I use them. In my last few builds I have been mounting my Rad sideways. It pulls air in from left side of case, and exhausts to right side of case. I have it mounted directly behind the front of the case(Silverstone SG-11). I use the Corsair H80i V2. The rad is partitioned so it does not pull or eject air into the rest of the case(MOBO, CPU, GPU). I also have PSU fan, GPU fans(RX 5700XT), and a single case fan. Temps great.
When you look at any radiator, 80% of the heat energy is removed in the first 50% of the heat exchanger. The applies to the first half of the thickness of the core or the first half of the length of the tube going from end tank to end tank. By making the tubes longer or the core thicker to you adding a lot of resistance to the system to extract that last little bit of heat. You are almost always better off adding more rows to the system if you have enough room to reduce pumping losses through the system. The may not be a huge issue with a pump that is supplied power from the wall, but in race cars it can help produce a few more horsepower.
Me: * looks at thumbnail *
"As long as those are LTT Noctua fans then yeah"
Linus going to the club
With beard: Sorry sir, you're too old for this, go home!
Without beard: Can I see your ID please, you need to be 21 to get in 😂😂😂
What? I think your the only one who found your own joke funny.
Mane a mega Boomer and a 12 yo
Mans*
0:23 seconds in and I'm seeing an Arduino Due and a BreadBoard?!?!?! Combine this with some of his recent SBC Based Projects such as Pi Hole, The Covert AllInOne, and the Biggest Bottleneck Videos, and I think Linus Tech Tips is evolving to TRUE Enthusiast content!!!! LTT has always been aimed at enthusiasts, but there are far more enthusiast areas that this channel has been ignoring, till recently! This is incredible!!! Out of all the channels LTT has, y not start a SBC/Maker channel! The possibilities for that type of content are ENDLESS!!!!
"kinda like our sponsor" was the least convincing segue that you have done, that I have seen at least. :D
@Tharealmb I've always imagined it as "segway"
Segway is a pun based on segue, as both are a means to get from one thing to another. Could also be due to the fact that people would see segue for the first time and pronounce it sea-goo, because it's not a very common word in the average person's vernacular. Perhaps it was both.
>>>Be right back hon, I'm taking the sea goo to the neighbor's
>>>You're going to WHAT
Yeah I was not prepared for this x))
I learned so much in this comment thread; this is great, very high quality comments
Gotta love how the ltt team learn while they teach us
Ikr it's like the blind leading the blind. Wcgw?
Y'all went full science on this one. Awesome video!
I wish this channel was around when I was doing my engineering degree. This would have been a lot more fun to apply learned lessons.
That looks just like my main rig's setup. MOAR RADIATORZ!
When I Canadian says bloody in a sentence and he’s irritated....
You know the vinyl record just scratched... and hard!
Have you tried using two rads not stacked but sharing the pipes for moving the collective heat flow with individual fresh air flows?
Will it help to put them side by side instead of stacking? each with a set of fans...? Sounds more effective to me!.
That's why I love this channel, always there is something to learn, as well as correcting the findings of the previous tests in a provable way. Great work LTT :D
Incoming attempt by Linus Media Group to acquire Gamers Nexus!
Linus? Owning gamers nexus? Nah...
@@andy56duky bruh
Wait a non member peasant can comment under members?
@@EastDallasKicks yes
@@KGalon yes yes
What if you take just 2 or 3 rads with flow direction like test2 and compare results to the setup, where all of them get fresh air? How big is the difference (if any). Also a thick rad push-pull vs 2 thinner, but air goes from one to another would be interesting
I'd be intrested to see if keeping the same setup but orientating the rad stack like a chimney (vertical instead of horizontal) would make any difference. Im probably wrong but think there may be a possibility of warm coolant being stuck in the loop between each rad. I have a funny feeling the temperatures (between each radiator at least) would probably lessen the range difference. Probably a complete and utter ball-ache to run the same setup again, but food for thought and all that!
Hey, thanks for redoing the testing. :) I appreciate all the hard work and time you guys invested in this.
Have a good week, and keep on with the great content. :D
"All liquid cooling is also air cooling, and all air cooling is also liquid cooling"
- A wise man
"All cooling is just heating backwards." - A wiser man
For those who did not understand, inside the copper tubes there is a liquid that helps to transfer heat quickly, and in the watercooler it is much more obvious, since air is forced into the fins
@@struanmurray2625 And both air and water are fluids, so all cooling is fluid cooling :-)
@@zeero4ever Not if you use radiative cooling
@@struanmurray2625 It's not "heating backwards"
Cooling is moving heat from one place to another. Nothing is done in backwards. Cooling is the act of heat (energy) moving from one object to another.
What is the point of stacking? Leaving them in series with fans for each would net you much more cooling. Parallel and separate fans with back flow prevention would work great too.
Try running the tests with the rads connected in parallel, it might be interesting.
Really interesting conclusion on this one, thanks Linus! I'll be sure to use enough fans and route my loop correctly from now on (or atleast try to).
I love this and want more of this sort of rigor and detail in testing (though maybe with more of the explaining on another channel because views n such)
Check out gamers nexus for less humour and more graphs and data
@@alexoherlihy4782 Was just about to give the exact same answer. Tech Jesus is always there to save the day with science.
Thomas McElroy
You should build a setup too, you have coding skills, need text files, or use some oracle database?
To clean up the noise, use some Savitzky-Golay filtering. It does wonders with larger windows and is easy to implement with SUMPRODUCT
Would love to see this done again but for loop order , like Jay did in apr 2018. youve already got the temp logging in place so should be easy
Dropping the fellow Canadian “pure pwnage” .... classic Linus. Classic. :)
"BOOM HEADSHAHHT CORSAIR"
~LINUS.
Would be interested in seeing this redone with a stack of rads where every rad was plumbed to a separate CPU/GPU system with each systems CPU/GPY temp being the relevant variable.
"I green lit a project to go full crazy on a test rig" hearing this just made me grin
*“Yeah we coo”* is the Intro Title of this video.
Guess who took the L
@xFS so did i
Fun fact:at 3:16 Linus says Arduino Due,as in the phrase "due to the fact"
In reality "due" in italian means two so it's basically arduino 2.0
its supost to sound like "dué"
MAINDBLOUING ISENT IT
It is called due because it has two micro usb ports, one for programming the board and another for HID control.
@@bjvx Possibly and because they called a board Uno and have a history of spelling out numbers in italian. There were boards before this with two USBs.
I'm curious how the thermal performance would change by having 2 fans on a single rad blowing opposite directions (meaning you have fresh air blowing on one of the 2 sides almost all the time).
Nicely done! Some ppl might think this is janky af, but if you ever saw a lab in some project you would be suprised at the level of jank present.