Coulson Group prepares for the end of Martin Mars Water Bombers
Вставка
- Опубліковано 15 жов 2024
- The Coulson Group in the Alberni Valley is starting a new era as it bids farewell to the Martin Mars Water Bombers, beloved by aviation enthusiasts and others all over Vancouver Island.
In 1954 I flew with my sisters and parents from Pearl Harbor to NAS Alameda (California) in the Hawaii MARS. My dad was a Naval Aviator in the Marine Corps and was acquainted with some of the crew. He took me up to the flight deck and I got to sit in the co-pilot seat somewhere over the Pacific Ocean. In the early 2000s I traveled to the Colulson facility and they took me out in a boat for a tour of the plane. I have a photo of me sitting in that very same co-pilot seat! Hopefully we’ll get to see these beauties in museums.
Yes, there's no way they are getting scrapped!
The Philippine Mars is going to the Pima Air and Space Museum in Tucson Arizona later in the fall. It has been repainted in it's original U.S. Navy colors.
The Hawaii Mars is flying to Victoria Airport in B. C. next weekend and heade to the museum there. It has been flying the last two days in preparation forit's flight.
What a beautiful plane.
When I was visiting my family in Port Alberni ,46 years ago, I was allowed on this plane.
I was impressed by the size of it, everything is hugh.
I saw it in action when there were a lot of forest fires. I can only imagine that the people from British Columbia are very proud of it. It's fantastic to see that this piece of history will be saved.
VERY SAD that the Mars is being retired! Excellent that it will be able to be seen in the museum.
"High Speed Taxi Rides Around The Lake"
Now what an awesome "above & beyond" thing to do for the public!
Thanks for this Coulson Group. And for the many years of dedicated service provided.
A very impressive fire fighter is gone.
Thank you for over 1,000 hrs. of safe operating! God Speed from former USAF
Even though it’s old…it’s sad to see it go out if service.
I hate to see the Era that made planes that function
wave goodbye.should not be.need more of these Well made sturdy planes around.
We should be investing in Coulson, insanely valuable company that we take for granted.
Coulson is a privately owned family company…
There is also Conair out of Abbsoford; pull out some cash and invest in them if you are excited.
Built in Middle River, MD (Near Baltimore). The now-defunct Mars Supermarket chain, which started in Middle River was named after the aircraft.
I grew up on Catalina Island 1962-81. There were a couple airlines that flew Goose and Mallard amphibian aircraft. Was lucky enough to fly back and forth a number of times as a 'young' kid. As a high school kid I got a summer/after school job with the airlines as a ramper, loading baggage and passengers and then got to fly for free. There is nothing, nothing, like landing on the water in one of these classic aircraft. Sad to see it retired but much better to see it in a museum setting than to see it have an accident. To the crew, pilots, maintenance personal, logistic folks, great job keeping her flying so long and in some very out of the way places. It wasn't easy but I know you'll always cherish all the memories you have.
Beautiful airplane. I glad to hear it is going to a museum.
Such a beautiful aircraft! Sad to know that it is being "retired". Some things NEVER GO OUT OF STYLE OR SERVICE !
Sad to see it go but happy to see it will be preserved as it deserves to be
I hope they get preserved for ever, such cool planes!
I worked 3 fires where they called the Mars in. They were incredible.
Sad to see the end of an era but at least the Hawaii will still be in BC for all to see.
Had a bunch of Coulson Air Tractors, dash-8s and a Caravan bird-dog today and yesterday tackling a 7ha fire in close proximity to homes near Taghum, BC. Very grateful that this expertise exists. We had the Mars a couple of times over the past 10 years too, I hope its replacement is as good.
I dont think Coulson operates the air tractor, you are likely confusing them with Conair.
As much as I love seeing the Mars in the air, the reality is that a pair of CL-415 super-scoopers can put more water on a fire in a shorter amount of time, do so more cheaply, and in greater safety for the pilots and crew.
@@gerryrozema8338 oops - sorry
Sad. What a remarkable airplane. A whole different era of aviation.
It’s a shame but they must be getting expensive to maintain and the airframes and equipment would be end of life or close to it. Magnificent aircraft! 👍🏻
actually it's an unpressurized airplane so they don't have the same stress as a pressurized plane ,, what's getting expensive is flying it because the engines and most of their parts are not made anymore and haven't been for many years ,,nobody uses large piston engine planes anymore and these are almost 80 years old
At the other end of the aircraft spectrum, a crop duster in central Kansas has offered training for other crop dusters in fighting the fires that sweep across the plains. This is the same aircraft that the Air Force is acquiring in a weaponized version for ground attack.
Here in Northern California I sleep much better knowing there are two C1 30s, to bea 146s and a few 737s protecting us as they already have! pretty damn impressive! Thank you for being here❤🙋🏼♀️
We desperately need his fleet here in California, with the 310,000 acre (125,500 hectare) Park fire out of control. ironically, in the b-roll footage, a Coulson helo is dropping water somewhere in California.
I’ve had the pleasure of seeing both Martin Mars bombers n action when both were still flyable and let me tell you it’s a sight to behold watching these planes scoop and drop. I also understand why Coulson is retiring these planes as they are expensive to maintain(parts are scarce forWW2 planes), operate and fly and add to that they limited to bodies of water they can scoop from due to the long lead up and takeoff required. In some cases they had to fly close to an hour to a lake big enough to take the plane scooping water which limits their turn around rates making their impressive drops less effective due to the long turn around times.
I spent two summers, 1969 and '70 working at the pulp mill at Port Alberni and saw these water bombers fight a fire on the north side of Cameron Lake, on the side of the mountain. There were a bunch of cars stopped on the highway on the south side of the lake watching the action.
Amazing plane, sad to see it retire.
Thanks for your service mars we salute you
Great Farewell party! Thanks to David and Brenda who kindly lent us kayaks to get up close and to April for the stimulating conversation. Also thanks to John who sold me tickets for the Be a bomber VIP raffle.
Honestly i hope they make a modern version of it that way they can continue with them as firefighting aircrafts since these water scoopers are far better then helicopters
I sure hope these very unique aircraft are going to museums for future generations to appreciate. The wooden flying boat was all but extinct already when these aircraft were built. It's a rare glimpse back to the first decades of flight.
Hawaii Mars (the one painted in red and shown in this video) will be at the BC aviation museum in Saanich, and Philippine Mars (now painted in her original Navy grey) will be in the aviation museum in Pima Arizona.
@@nonenowherebye Nice. Thanks for that info!
Wooden? These are all-metal aircraft. But yes, they were the end of the era in which large flying boats were common.
if u dont have room for it ill take it
We're fortuanant that the fire seasons of Australia and Canada allow a specialist company to move hardware around, giving both countries access to an essential service of greater capacity then either could muster on their own. Sadly, we never saw the Mars journey DownUnder, but have greatly valued Coulson's services.
To be honest I thought this was from the onion about water on Mars
I'm so glad that it will remain in BC, even if it is in a Museum.
A piece of Canadian history. Glad to see this company continue to be of use!
I wish the media would do a lot more to hold the BC GOVT and BC WILDFIRE accountable instead of tragic goodbye stories...
1:11 did they deliberately paint the 7 the same shade as the background?
The dehavilland/viking 215/415 are far more agile and adaptable ....
"The need for firefighting aircraft is expected to double"... now, why would that be? And what when we start having overlap of "seasons"? I believe SoCal already had fires in their winter/our summer, or at least closer to our risk season. Cooperation ends really quickly when someone says "we have to contractually send our waterbombers north" while we're burning.
I honestly don't believe the government when it says the new jets do a better job. We've never had forest fires this bad since we ended contracts with this plane. Not to mention shutting down alberta rap attack. Even the military still uses prop planes due to the better performance.
Coulson is a private company, not the government. Also, I'm pretty sure there's a different reason for the worsening fires, and it's not a due to switching from props to jets...
They been talking about a thing called climate change which is believed to be a contributing factor in the increase in frequency and intensity of forest fires. But if you have issues with the government, not much chance in you accepting that. The (our) military uses both prop and jet engines but for air tankers it is largely a matter if what is old, cheap and most suitable for the task, so a series of compromises. The new CL515s are pretty wonderful though, but the money to pay for them has to come from somewhere, so are you going to step up and pay more money to get them?
@@darb4091 Around 70% of forest fires are human caused. The increase in frequency is due to an increase in stupidity and negligence, not climate change. There's only one natrual cause for a forest fire; thunder storms. Prop planes in military is not used because 'old and cheap.' It's the use-case. Greater efficiency, range, and control changes to throttle are instant unlike jets. Not to mention your arrogant argument of cost for new planes when they are already contracting new jet planes wherein I'm proposing they continue using the proven method that works. Not to mention the conservatives shutting down the organization that put out small fires before they became big ones (rap attack).
You're not very educated are you? Have you even bothered to look up the statistics on the official forestry websites for BC/AB rather than just repeating false talking points from the libs?
Even the notion of increase in frequency is basically a lie. BC had 2293 fires in 2023. 3064 in 2009.
There's a funny glitch where the website says in 2023 they spent 1,000 million dollars
The absolute end of an era for flying boats 😢😢
Its too bad the deal for the other one fell through and now Philippine Mars has to be dismantled to get to the museum in Arizona. Twelve years ago Coulson group had a deal in the works to fly it to the US Navy Aviation Museum in Pennsacola, FL but some meddling BC residents and politicians threw a wrench into the deal and stalled it long enough that by the time of the 2016 election the Navy had given up on acquiring the plane. As I recall it was going be a trade in exchange for some mothballed Navy C-130s (which Coulson has a conversion program for to turn them into air tankers for forest fire fighting). Coulson had already painted the plane in the old USN colors as part of preperations for the exchange when the BC government stuck their nose into the process. The same government that refused to give the company any contracts to actually fight forest fires using the Mars.
Going to be quite the procedure to get it out of Victoria harbour though to the museum adjacent to the VIctoria Airport given the lack of wide residential streets and the highway in the way, with an flying boat that has a 200 foot wingspan. Or is the intention to put it on static display along the shoreline in a city/provincially owned park ?
They’re flying it to Pat Bay, immediately adjacent to the Victoria Airport, and will haul it up at the Coast Guard station. From there it just has to cross one road, and then into the airfield proper.
It wont be any procedure at all after they land on the water in Pat bay, put on the beaching gear and haul it up on the ramp at the airport, then tow it over to the museum.
The BC Aviation Museum is at the Victoria International Airport, which is not in Victoria - the Victoria Harbour is not involved.
This plane belongs in the Glenn L. Martin Aviation Museum in Baltimore, MD.
Pima Air & Space Museum in Arizona is getting the other surviving Mars. It has been painted in U.S. Navy markings. There was deal made that that aircraft was to go to the Glenn L. Martin museum. Something fell through with that plan.
@@garfieldsmith332 The G.L.M. did negotiate with Coulson. Then, communication stopped and Coulson would not reply. They gave one to Pensacola. Now, Canada gets one and Arizona? I do not know what was said in the negotiations but IMHO from talking with the people involved, Coulson was the issue and GLM was not treated fairly. The plane was built and tested in Chase, MD, home of the Glenn L. Martin aircraft plant. Martin had bad luck throughout their history of aircraft manufacturing with the government and it has continued with Coulson.
@@4speed3pedals Thanks for the update. I agree, one should have gone to Martin. Do not know what Coulson did but they were the third Canadian owners.
@@garfieldsmith332 Not sure who the owners were during negotiations. I do know it was more than ten years ago. I saw the plans for displaying the Mars. It would have been in the lot in the front of the property with an island surrounded by water (from recollection) and would not have been sitting in water all the time. They had backing. Re-establishing the backing in most cases is futile. What is, is.
@@4speed3pedals It is to bad that the deal did not go thru. At least the two have been saved.
At least the plane isnt getting scrapped.
It really seems like the loss of capability to fuel up from a lake will have a significant impact on their operations. Having to fly, land, fill, take off, fly back with a 737 adds a significant amount of time between drops. It's a shame there haven't been any new flying boat designs in recent decades - if for nothing else there's a demand for aerial firefighting.
They actually skim and load with water from lakes. The turn around for air tankers can be pretty quick and also allows for the use of retardants. But is dependant on distance to the air port naturally, just like the distance to a suitable water source for a skimming tanker. The DHC-515 is due out pretty soon I think and there are still plenty of the previous versions still in service as well as the newer airtractor.
@@darb4091 I’m not clear what aircraft you’re referring to initially by “they actually skim and load with water from lakes.” As far as I know the 737 cannot do that because of the low slung engines.
The only aircraft that can do that are seaplanes. All the DC-10/MD-11, 747, 737, C-130 and etc fire bombers all have to fly to a commercial airport to reload water and retardant. This significantly reduces the number of sorties they can do in a day.
On the flip side seaplanes have an enormous advantage by being able to fill up by skimming the waters surface as well as refueling at a lake - Coulson for example has fuel tankers that can pump to their planes on the water. A lot of these fires are quite remote so the seaplanes may be capable of 4 to even 10x more drops a day than a commercial jet platform.
@@cruisinguy6024 Hopefully you don't think that they dump fuel on the fires? Canada actually has a very famous water bomber, the CL-X15 series and as mentioned Airtractors are commonly used.
@@darb4091 fuel? No, obviously I’m not saying fuel is dumped on the fire. They dump water or a water and chemical mix.
That being said, the planes need fuel themselves. Coulson has the ability to refuel their seaplane aircraft via tankers in a lake whereas the commercial jets have to refuel and reload water at a commercial airport.
The clear advantage is seaplanes as they can quickly refill the water tanks by skimming the water and when needed refuel by landing on the water and receiving fuel from 18 wheeler tankers on the shore.
Thank you for your conservation of this great plane!
Yes, it is sad they have darn near infinite cash for other endeavours, but nothing to build a few new versions of these powerful aircraft. Jasper would have liked to see them.
I asked my my MP Jenna Sudds about building more water bombers for the upcoming coming fire season and of course, told that her government were working very hard to solve the problem. Should I have expected otherwise.
De Havilland Canada is doing just that, in their new operation in Alberta.
After nothing but red tape from the Liberals ,,,
Had it been a Bombardier operation ,, whelll ,,,,,
rachhell snotley of the DerP party of Albertastan cancelled water bomber contracts not long before the infamous Ft. Mac fire, adding a mocking condescending cackle towards Wildrose leader who urgently warned her to DO SOMETHING soon or much will be lost.
His house was burnt to the foundations not even 24 hrs after the cackle and warning; even concrete basements powderized in the heat, in the disaster recovery areas I helped with.
Cancelling anything at this point, usually by the same denigrating power tripping positions that are supposed to SERVE US NOT THEMSELVES and who are pushing the doom agenda, sure seem to be helping force 'doom' with such contract undermining and the like.
Hope you folks dont have your protection services mangled like that certain socialistCommunist did to this province...
You asked the wrong person. Forest fires are a provincial responsibility, not federal. Ask your local MLA instead.
@@mrquirky3626 the federal government supplies the finance
@@DavidRussell-n8e No, they don't; forests and forest fire fighting is a provincial responsibility including financing. But hey, thanks for lending us your Canadair CL-415 waterbombers, we are putting them to good use in Sooke, it must be a quiet year in Ontario. Also, there is probably something like a 5 year lead time for buying something like the CL-515, you don't just go out and pick up a couple for the upcoming season.
Farewell ole lady.
🇦🇺🦘👍
Sad but needed. It's worn out, metal and other fatigue. Now, in the background during the interview, you see wind generators. Lets retire those blights on the landscape and build a decent medium for the old aircraft.
This plane should not be put in a museum - it should continue to fly - that's how it stays in good shape.
Better than being use for scrap. There is so much that an 80 year old aircraft can do and now Coulson has good fleet of newer aircraft.
It's extremely depressing to see this thing get retired we should be investing more into these planes!!!
What happened to the Philippine Mars?
One is going to Victoria, the other to a museum in Arizona I believe.
The end is near
How come Sandra is such a pretty woman?!…😢
Writing from France…
These planes were perfect for killing fires before they took off.. it's too bad no one thought about what it would cost to build new ones from scratch with the latest frame design, engines, and built from scratch for fire fighting.
The problem we have with the government, is they don't think.
How about thinking about why no one on the planet is interested in contracting them or buying them for forest fire fighting, it speaks volumes.
This plane should still be in the air. Politics and a 250 million dollar upgrade is in the way. 250 drops would pay for itself. People say its a relic but how long was it the king of the sky. And in my opinion they will never make a plane as well built and meant to last over a century. Many of the fires would just need the maryin to hit it once or twice then the small guys can mop up. Its a shame.
The fact that no one on the planet wanted to contract it it buy it speaks volumes, Canada isn't the only place there are forest fires.
Buitifull plane
Noooo float plane noooooo! 😢
Firefighting shouldn't be a business. It should be handled by the government. Canada should have its own fleet of water bombers.
Doesn't make a lot of sense having equipment and the associated people sitting around for 8 months of the year; contracting with a private company that can put them to use when it is our off season seems only logical (and cheaper). Each province does hire and contact it's own ground staff though, but not hundreds of millions of dollars of idle equipment for 8 out of 12 months.
@@darb4091 They wouldn't be idle. They would be sent to other countries to help fight fires there.
@@happilyham6769 Forestry and thus forest fire fighting is a provincial jurisdiction and as a far as I know some provinces do still have their own planes. Apparently this includes Ontario because the pair of CL-415s working the Sooke fire have the Ontario Government logo prominently displayed on the hulls. As you are already aware, BC uses the services of two contractors, Coulson and Conair both of which contract globally. So creating a new branch of government to contract out bombers is one thing, but to compete against two homegrown business wouldn't sit well with most.
Really, name one single successful government managed program? They even ruined the gas can!
Can we afford one less firefighting aircraft??
Hawaii Mars would be killer for the fire in denver right now. Perfect reservoir for it. Shame that we won't get to see it
They haven't flown on a fire for almost a decade, bigger isn't always better.
Where oh where are all the other planes to help fight forest fires instead of bags of water come peoples let’s get with it
it is sad B.C. thinks it cost to much when the whole of bc is on fire
Well, these planes were built in the 1940s and in few numbers when the age of the flying boat was coming to a close. As beautiful as they are, these planes are just beyond their service life it seems, wouldn't want them to end like that 80+ year-old DC-4 that crashed in Alaska this year.
Hate to see them retired.
Very short-sighted in view of the current wild fire situation in both Alberta and Canada.
On par with Avro
We can thank Christy Clark and the BC Liberals for cancelling the Mars contract; was that a smart move? The Mars wasn't used the last two years it was contracted.
That makes sense, if you're a bought and paid for traitor to the people you represent.
The fact that flying an 80 year old aircraft at it's capabilities is expensive and dangerous (to the crew) had nothing to do with that decision, I'm sure. 🙄 There are more modern, safer and less expensive options for aerial firefighting. I love the Mars, but as an operational fire fighting aircraft, it's well past it's best before date.
80 years old and still more safe then the utter garbage made today.
@@scabbythecrownvic OK boomer?
@@viperq wouldn’t a boomer say that Boeing is the best though?
what a shame. look at it this way, what puts a fire out faster a bucket brigade of shot glasses or a single dump with a 5 gallon bucket? god the Canadian government is a fucking JOKE!
Give Viking Air a contract to build 4 Mars Water Bombers, 2 for the Westcoast, and 2 for the Eastcoast, give Coulson the contract to run them, be proactive and not reactive Provincial and Federal Governments.
Viking air doesn't hold the tights for the MM and forestry/fire fighting is provincial jurisdiction, not federal. But stop for a minute and think about the fact that no one on the planet wanted to contract or buy the MM, Canada isn't the only place on the planet with forest fires and no one else wanted them either.
Junk