The only people who redefined the gospel and these terms were the reformers. So perhaps those who are not Catholic should revaluate the gospel they hold to as being in the Galatians 1 category.
Have you ever questioned yourself: would I be a christian without the Roman Catholic Church? If after the Apostles there was no authorative Church defending the Christian faith. Selecting books that formed also your Bible. Sending missionaries to Europe and America. Etc. If you are honest, if you are saved it is through this mediation of the Roman Catholic Church.
Rather than unfairly beating up on the catholics (in what I must say is a very Calvinist perspective) maybe try reaching the massive number of people in the west who tick the NO religion box. Rather than trying to canibalise another faithful denomination like a sheep thief.
I believe all Catholics are saved by grace through faith in Jesus Christ and our works are an expressionof our faith. In fact we need to draw more evangelicals to the beauty of Catholic faith so they can experience the fullness of God's presence. I see Catholics are attacked by Jews, Muslims, and Evangelicals. But that is expected in this age of deception. I urge all Catholics to stay in the presence of God and in His grace, and led by His Spirot to cooperate daily in His plan of salvation.
Jesus Christ instructed the Bread of Life is His flesh and blood in substance. Evangelicals eat bread and drink wine and still think it is the Eucharist.
The Reformers replaced altar with pulpit, replaced priests with preachers, and replaced sacrificed with (long) sermon. Are those scriptural? Heb. 13:10 says: “We have an altar (θυσιαστήριον, Strong G2379) from which those who serve the tent have no right to eat”. The word “we” is first person plural that includes even the person who wrote Hebrews - in other words it refers to believers - and they have altar. “Those who serve the tent” refers to Levitical priests of Judaism who served in the Jerusalem Temple or Tent of Meeting during Exodus. In the Old Testament priests have the right to eat some of offering or sacrifice (Lev. 6:26; 7:6; 24:9, Num. 18:10-11 etc.). “Having no right to eat” in Heb. 13:10 refers to having no right to eat sacrifice from the altar of believers of Christ - nobody eat meals from altar. In 1 Cor. 10:21 Paul used the term “the table of the Lord”, not altar, in referring to partaking the Eucharist (1 Cor. 10:16). In Scripture "Table of the Lord" is synonymous with altar. Mal. 1:6-8 says: “O priests, who despise my name. But you say, 'How have we despised your name?' By offering polluted food upon my altar. But you say, 'How have we polluted you?' By saying that the LORD's table may be despised. When you offer blind animals in sacrifice, is that not evil? And when you offer those that are lame or sick, is that not evil? Present that to your governor; will he accept you or show you favor? says the LORD of hosts”. in the Old Testament when God established Levitical priesthood, He declared it to be everlasting or perpetual priesthood (Exo. 40:15). Numbers 18:19 applies “covenant of salt” to this priesthood, which means it will last forever as salt is used to preserve food. “Covenant of salt” appears twice in the Old Testament and the second one (2 Chr. 13:15) is applied to kingship of David and his descendants through Solomon, which is based on God’s promise to David (2 Sam. 7:12-13) - God will establish his throne through Solomon forever. The perpetuity of both Davidic kingship and Levitical priesthood were later reaffirmed by prophet Jeremiah in dual prophecies in Jer. 33:17-18. Jer. 33:18 says Levitical priests will make sacrifice forever (the Hebrew word means daily). Without their Jerusalem Temple, destroyed in 70 AD, Levitical priests of Judaism can no longer offer any sacrifice. Thus, the prophecy in Jer. 33:18 is to be fulfilled in the New Covenant Levitical priests.
This is a wonderful transparent discussion. Gentle spirits and a blessing to those of us, (Bible believing Christians), that long for Roman Catholics to come home to Jesus. Grace is with you and of course, not with the RCs. Thank you.
Before you accuse the Catholic Church of having different Gospel, you should first examine the gospel you believe and compare it with what Scripture says. The gospel according to the Reformers: How do sinful men find acceptance (or are justified) in the judgment of the righteous God? The Reformers taught that Justification is by faith alone and through Justification an exchange took place between believers and Christ, known as double imputation. The believers got Christ’ righteousness imputed on them as if that righteousness were theirs, while they remain sinners. Christ got believers’ entire sins (past, present, future) imputed on Him as if those sins were His, while He remains sinless. There is no limit of either amount or type of believers' sins imputed on Him. Christ willingly offered Himself to take the punishment of those sins (that believers deserve) through dying on the cross. Let me know I made mistake or caricatured your gospel! Is the above scriptural?: 1. Are we justified by faith alone according to Scripture? The phrase "justified by faith" appears four times in New Testament (Rom. 3:28, 5:1, Gal. 2:16, 3:24). New Testament was written in Greek and the one in Rom. 3:28 is in Greek passive present tense while the rest are in Greek passive aorist tense . Both tenses do not indicate once for all justification. If Scripture teaches faith-alone justification, then the Holy Spirit would inspire Paul to write the phrase "justified by faith" in Greek passive perfect tense. Unlike that of English Greek perfect tense indicates the action described by the verb (to be justified) was completed in the past with continuing effect to the present. 2. Scripture denies double imputation in Eze. 18:20 (ESV): “The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself.” 3. Scripture says that we lose righteousness by sinning or we cannot be righteous and sinner at the same time. Eze. 33:12-13 (ESV) says: “The righteous shall not be able to live by his righteousness when he sins. Though I say to the righteous that he shall surely live, yet if he trusts in his righteousness and does injustice, none of his righteous deeds shall be remembered, but in his injustice that he has done he shall die." Death here refers to hell, not physical death. 4. Even in human courtroom it will be considered injustice when a criminal was declared not guilty because his crimes were imputed to an innocent person, who then was punished for the crimes he did not do. By declaring believers as righteous who remain sinners and punishing Christ for the sins He did not commit on the cross, God did not only i justice but also did abomination according to what Scripture says in Pro. 17:15 (ESV): “He who justifies the wicked and he who condemns the righteous are both alike an abomination to the LORD.”
Its the Scriptures according to the tastes of Luther, Zwingli and Calvin. Each disagreed with eachother...each made their personal likes and dislikes into sects.
I found that discussion incredibly insulting towards any Christians who don't hold to your views. Grace isxan important part of our journey outside the evangelical church. The fact that you consider Mary to have replaced the role of the Holy Spirit snd only evangelicals understand the immanence of God. Im not Roman Catholic myself but I have a great deal of respect for them and we work together in our parish. Maybe you should be concentrating on the unchurched rather than putting the Roman Catholics 'right'
I confess I found this a little tone deaf and insulting too. While there is much to love in other episodes of the podcast with regard to love for Jesus, the scriptures and moral teaching - there is a total blind spot on the great love for Christ Catholics reveal in adoring him as word made flesh in the holy meal -truly present and precious. And connection to the mysteries of the faith, kneeling in wonder in the holy presence of Jesus. And apprehension of eternal things in daily mass. Not to mention great swathes of scripture on offer year round. I am not catholic but share great overlaps with their practice of the faith. So I came back a few days later to see if others felt the same in the comments.
Oh you reached us! We’ve got personal relationships with Jesus - or rather union with God to use more long standing words. It’s just that ours aren’t delusional emotional nonsense but life long struggles and our half Christian’s have no delusions about their need for penance. The same cannot be said for your faithful and their appalling divorce rates with no broken repentance
I’m remaining Catholic. Unconvinced by these pastors.
We will be saved by grace (regardless of creed or none) after all we can do [2 Nephi 25:23]
The only people who redefined the gospel and these terms were the reformers. So perhaps those who are not Catholic should revaluate the gospel they hold to as being in the Galatians 1 category.
Have you ever questioned yourself: would I be a christian without the Roman Catholic Church? If after the Apostles there was no authorative Church defending the Christian faith. Selecting books that formed also your Bible. Sending missionaries to Europe and America. Etc.
If you are honest, if you are saved it is through this mediation of the Roman Catholic Church.
Rather than unfairly beating up on the catholics (in what I must say is a very Calvinist perspective) maybe try reaching the massive number of people in the west who tick the NO religion box. Rather than trying to canibalise another faithful denomination like a sheep thief.
I believe all Catholics are saved by grace through faith in Jesus Christ and our works are an expressionof our faith. In fact we need to draw more evangelicals to the beauty of Catholic faith so they can experience the fullness of God's presence.
I see Catholics are attacked by Jews, Muslims, and Evangelicals. But that is expected in this age of deception. I urge all Catholics to stay in the presence of God and in His grace, and led by His Spirot to cooperate daily in His plan of salvation.
This video seems quite pointless and ill-informed.
It must be wonderful to be so sure of yourself and what you believe in.
Jesus Christ instructed the Bread of Life is His flesh and blood in substance. Evangelicals eat bread and drink wine and still think it is the Eucharist.
The Reformers replaced altar with pulpit, replaced priests with preachers, and replaced sacrificed with (long) sermon. Are those scriptural?
Heb. 13:10 says: “We have an altar (θυσιαστήριον, Strong G2379) from which those who serve the tent have no right to eat”. The word “we” is first person plural that includes even the person who wrote Hebrews - in other words it refers to believers - and they have altar. “Those who serve the tent” refers to Levitical priests of Judaism who served in the Jerusalem Temple or Tent of Meeting during Exodus. In the Old Testament priests have the right to eat some of offering or sacrifice (Lev. 6:26; 7:6; 24:9, Num. 18:10-11 etc.). “Having no right to eat” in Heb. 13:10 refers to having no right to eat sacrifice from the altar of believers of Christ - nobody eat meals from altar.
In 1 Cor. 10:21 Paul used the term “the table of the Lord”, not altar, in referring to partaking the Eucharist (1 Cor. 10:16). In Scripture "Table of the Lord" is synonymous with altar. Mal. 1:6-8 says: “O priests, who despise my name. But you say, 'How have we despised your name?' By offering polluted food upon my altar. But you say, 'How have we polluted you?' By saying that the LORD's table may be despised. When you offer blind animals in sacrifice, is that not evil? And when you offer those that are lame or sick, is that not evil? Present that to your governor; will he accept you or show you favor? says the LORD of hosts”.
in the Old Testament when God established Levitical priesthood, He declared it to be everlasting or perpetual priesthood (Exo. 40:15). Numbers 18:19 applies “covenant of salt” to this priesthood, which means it will last forever as salt is used to preserve food. “Covenant of salt” appears twice in the Old Testament and the second one (2 Chr. 13:15) is applied to kingship of David and his descendants through Solomon, which is based on God’s promise to David (2 Sam. 7:12-13) - God will establish his throne through Solomon forever. The perpetuity of both Davidic kingship and Levitical priesthood were later reaffirmed by prophet Jeremiah in dual prophecies in Jer. 33:17-18. Jer. 33:18 says Levitical priests will make sacrifice forever (the Hebrew word means daily). Without their Jerusalem Temple, destroyed in 70 AD, Levitical priests of Judaism can no longer offer any sacrifice. Thus, the prophecy in Jer. 33:18 is to be fulfilled in the New Covenant Levitical priests.
Lord help us from boring long winded people like this bloke.
This is a wonderful transparent discussion. Gentle spirits and a blessing to those of us, (Bible believing Christians), that long for Roman Catholics to come home to Jesus. Grace is with you and of course, not with the RCs. Thank you.
We have been with Jesus even long before the Reformers were born!
Home ? Your home is all broken up into thousands of denominations with no theological homogeneity amongst them.
Before you accuse the Catholic Church of having different Gospel, you should first examine the gospel you believe and compare it with what Scripture says.
The gospel according to the Reformers:
How do sinful men find acceptance (or are justified) in the judgment of the righteous God? The Reformers taught that Justification is by faith alone and through Justification an exchange took place between believers and Christ, known as double imputation. The believers got Christ’ righteousness imputed on them as if that righteousness were theirs, while they remain sinners. Christ got believers’ entire sins (past, present, future) imputed on Him as if those sins were His, while He remains sinless. There is no limit of either amount or type of believers' sins imputed on Him. Christ willingly offered Himself to take the punishment of those sins (that believers deserve) through dying on the cross.
Let me know I made mistake or caricatured your gospel!
Is the above scriptural?:
1. Are we justified by faith alone according to Scripture? The phrase "justified by faith" appears four times in New Testament (Rom. 3:28, 5:1, Gal. 2:16, 3:24). New Testament was written in Greek and the one in Rom. 3:28 is in Greek passive present tense while the rest are in Greek passive aorist tense . Both tenses do not indicate once for all justification. If Scripture teaches faith-alone justification, then the Holy Spirit would inspire Paul to write the phrase "justified by faith" in Greek passive perfect tense. Unlike that of English Greek perfect tense indicates the action described by the verb (to be justified) was completed in the past with continuing effect to the present.
2. Scripture denies double imputation in Eze. 18:20 (ESV): “The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself.”
3. Scripture says that we lose righteousness by sinning or we cannot be righteous and sinner at the same time. Eze. 33:12-13 (ESV) says: “The righteous shall not be able to live by his righteousness when he sins. Though I say to the righteous that he shall surely live, yet if he trusts in his righteousness and does injustice, none of his righteous deeds shall be remembered, but in his injustice that he has done he shall die." Death here refers to hell, not physical death.
4. Even in human courtroom it will be considered injustice when a criminal was declared not guilty because his crimes were imputed to an innocent person, who then was punished for the crimes he did not do. By declaring believers as righteous who remain sinners and punishing Christ for the sins He did not commit on the cross, God did not only i justice but also did abomination according to what Scripture says in Pro. 17:15 (ESV): “He who justifies the wicked and he who condemns the righteous are both alike an abomination to the LORD.”
Its the Scriptures according to the tastes of Luther, Zwingli and Calvin. Each disagreed with eachother...each made their personal likes and dislikes into sects.
I found that discussion incredibly insulting towards any Christians who don't hold to your views. Grace isxan important part of our journey outside the evangelical church. The fact that you consider Mary to have replaced the role of the Holy Spirit snd only evangelicals understand the immanence of God. Im not Roman Catholic myself but I have a great deal of respect for them and we work together in our parish. Maybe you should be concentrating on the unchurched rather than putting the Roman Catholics 'right'
I confess I found this a little tone deaf and insulting too.
While there is much to love in other episodes of the podcast with regard to love for Jesus, the scriptures and moral teaching - there is a total blind spot on the great love for Christ Catholics reveal in adoring him as word made flesh in the holy meal -truly present and precious. And connection to the mysteries of the faith, kneeling in wonder in the holy presence of Jesus. And apprehension of eternal things in daily mass. Not to mention great swathes of scripture on offer year round.
I am not catholic but share great overlaps with their practice of the faith. So I came back a few days later to see if others felt the same in the comments.
Oh you reached us! We’ve got personal relationships with Jesus - or rather union with God to use more long standing words. It’s just that ours aren’t delusional emotional nonsense but life long struggles and our half Christian’s have no delusions about their need for penance. The same cannot be said for your faithful and their appalling divorce rates with no broken repentance