Is Stereo The Best Two Amp Setup? Maybe Not.
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- Опубліковано 5 лис 2020
- Stereo is praised as the god of the two amp setup - and for good reason! Wide sweeping effects taking up every corner of a room and drawing your ear in for more.
Is stereo always the best option when two amps are available though? Maybe not. First you need to consider a few things unique to your rig and environment.
If you need to have all the options - Mono, Dual Mono, Stereo and Wet Dry available at the flick of a switch, book a call with us and we will talk through a junction box suited to your needs - use the link below.
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Simply need the option of Mono, Dual Mono and Stereo? Checkout The TX Interfacer, TX Underfacer and Output
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Need Wet Dry with a built in mute? Check out TX Interfacer and TX Underfacer
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Guitarist and vocalist of an alt-rock/experimental rock trio.
Small board: overdrive, fuzz, chorus, delay, reverb with stereo out.
One lead goes to a Fender Deluxe Reverb Tone Master.
The other lead goes to a wah-wah, then to a Vox AC30.
Both amps are set at equal volume, the Vox is ofc more on edge, while the Fender is super clean.
The wah has a small volume boost, thus the wah-amp gets a bit louder than the unaffected Fender-amp when the wah is used.
I use a Fender and a Vox due to Fenders being mid scooped, and Voxes being mid humped. They fill each other out and let's the guitar sound way bigger.
Idk what I would call this setup - it's sort of a mashup of a stereo and wet/dry rig but not really wet/dry, just that one amp gets wah-wahed.
What I do know tho is that it sounds fucking amazing. Fuzz into wah sounds rad, having the mid humpy Vox get extra mid humped by a wah sounds dooope, having an un-wahed amp underneath the amp makes it sound like I'm playing rhythm and lead at the same time - the wah often carries solos, but you also hear just straight full notes under.
I love this setup and it works absolutely brilliantly!
sounds like it would be huge live! great idea.
These are great videos- I'm learning a lot; the "why" as much as the "how to" 👍
So glad to hear that.
Really nice video! I run my bass rig wet/dry to counter low end loss when using modulation. I'm gonna get me one of your 'Outputs', soon, so I can sum up the signal for when I only have one amp available. So glad I found out about your tools! :)
Thanks! Appreciate the feedback and you checking it out.
Just as great as the Wet Dry series! Love all of your videos
Thanks for checking them out!
The answer is the Bradley Stereo Guitar Amplifier. It is the best stereo hand-built tube guitar amplifier you can buy. By the way there is nothing better than playing in stereo.
I haven't actually had the pleasure yet... Will have to check it out.... Stereo is pretty amazing, I agree. Practically though, I think wet dry takes it for the 'better' live sound - whatever that means.
I really like your videos! Thank you. Mordi
Thanks!
Wet dry for me , Vox for dry , fender for wet, awesome 👍🎸🇬🇧
Nice! Love vox on dry. Chime all day.
You guys easily deserve more subscribers! Very detailed and useful information
Thanks Raj. Really appreciate it!
Just ordered an Underfacer.. I have several amps & nice effect pedals including an Iridium.. I also have a few buffered splitters; one split out of my pedalboard goes through a latching switch before hitting a looper which is routed to two amps.. another split goes to the Iridium that's on my desk, then the other buffered splits go to four amps.. I don't gig, but tweaking tone is actually my gig.. so the Underfacer should be a nice addition to my electronical quadraphonic studio lol..
Love this! Really enjoy when musicians take signal routing to the next level / take time to understand the power in it.
Great video again!
I've been playing stereo the last few months since getting the Iridium. It sounds incredible in my ears! I'll have to maybe try some of these other methods at some point as well.
Definitely do! If you want multiple options on the one board without re-patching, send me an email! info@goodwoodaudio.com
you guys are the best!!
Thanks Daniel!!
I run an AC30 and Twin in stereo. Sound guys love me. 😀
come on man. leave some tone for the rest of us😰
@@GoodwoodAudiowhat? Am I too loud? Haha
I thought, according to folks like Vertex Effects -and other professionals that true wet dry means just that. You separate your wet sound and then dry sound. Wet being your ambient atmospheric effects ie reverb and delay to one speaker or amp and the other amp with your gain etc to another amp. So in this instance you have your overdrive pedals going to both amps. And only splitting the reverb delay separately. Is this proper wet dry ?
It's not. His wet dry is closer to a dual mono setup. Wet dry is as you said: dry takes distortion (if applicable) and wet takes ambient effects. This avoids distorting the wet effects.
I think the performing venue has a lot to do with it if you’re playing with the band that’s loud and you might not be able to get in the ideal position or the stage is crowded and you have one monitor you’re not gonna benefit from stereo it’s going to be a frustration. if however you’re playing solo like I was playing in church or at a restaurant and I was playing mostly clean with nice reverb and stereo chorus and it can be a very satisfying sound.
good insight/perspective!
I've been running a wet/dry using an iridium for a few months now and i love how much more control i have when recording - highly recommend it for anyone whos thinking about it!
Awesome!! Are you using Iridium to split your wet / dry signals?
@@GoodwoodAudio Yep! My mix engineer loves how much more control he has over the mix now
I've been recording both in high end studios and my own studio for over 35 years now - since the age of digital recording from around 1993, you just need to record the dry amp, then you can mess around with the stereo field, copy the track to another track or several tracks if you want to get seriously creative. I recorded a full album in around '95 with a single guitar track, split to wet dry wet via the effects insert to my lexicon MP1 and a whole lot of other effects units I had on the recording unit at the time ... it sounded awesome. Now I have only a computer Logic Pro X and a whole bunch of plugins - so I have 100% control. Live, I use wet-dry-wet. Sounds wonderful, front of house has total control. Best way to record is to double track every rhythm guitar part, pan hard right and hard left and add a 2ms (he says 4ms - try your own preference) delay to the left or right which ever way you want the delay, then add individual compression, level, etc effects to the tracks as necessary, throw them all into a buss and put the modulation/delay on that and then the reverb. We have often got 6 to 8 guitar blends now (often using different guitars), running into a stereo buss and it sounds awesome
Super helpful........
Awesome!
Very good video. But I have one bone of contention. The 4m second delay that is referred to does not sound like 4m seconds. The example shown sounds much longer. 4m seconds is almost instantaneous. And to my ears, again, the 4m second example in this video sounds longer.
I'll have to go back and check to see if anything happened that shouldn't have!
Great video. One question....Why are the TIMELINE and BIG SKY Running in parallel WET/DRY rig? Seems that they just return to a mono out to FOH. Why not just feed the TIMELINE directly into the BIG SKY?
Good quesiton. You can still run parallel and mono out... it's a totally different sound doing it this way. The delay and verb aren't interacting in this scenario but you can still use kill dry on the two effects giving you more separation between wet and dry. Kind of hard to explain in a paragraph... but it's a different (not better) approach to a two amp rig.
Have you guys tried the DSM Simplifier yet? I'm running it wet/dry, but through the effects loop since it only has a mono input. Would love to hear your thoughts on how you think it sounds, and also how you would set it up (and how you might utilize your products with it)!
We've had it on a couple setups, but have to be honest, I haven't had too much time with it. Customers seem to really love it. I would probably start with running its pre in a loop (from memory you can't bypass the pre) and make sure I could easily bypass the amp/cab sim section on the unit itself (at the end of the chain).
@@GoodwoodAudio this is why you guys are the experts. Hadn’t thought about putting it in a loop. Thanks!
Been down this path so wanted to share some thoughts based on my experiences
-Splitting signal to two amps (either stereo or dual mono) is okay... but compare the split sound with one amp off to the sound of just into that same amp without splitting. You’ll notice unsplit sounds fuller. Splitting signal is usually a compromise.
-If you want to run two different amps at once I guess that’ll do, but keep in mind that they are effected differently by pedals as they have different headroom. Aka kick on an overdrive and now one’s louder.
-Get a dedicated second amp (or full range speaker/pa for effects. Trying to have one amp (or dual mono) play both your guitar sound and effects through the same speaker is a sound compromise. One speaker can’t do two things very well at once.
-why even run your effects through a guitar amp? It’s meant to create a relatively mid rangish guitar sound, not the detailed effects from a full range/pa speaker is intended to create. A guitar speaker is basically a filter or an eq. It filters out a lot of the sound so guitar sounds good, but I feel this is a compromise for effects.
I run from my pedalboard (es8) into guitar amp, out of speaker out (blug blubox), back to pedalboard and into effects then di to full range/pa speaker. It’s amazing.
I’ve tried all the other ways, and this is sounds the best to me. You do you but for the guys searching for their sound, hopefully the points above give you some things to check out :) enjoy!
Awesome thoughts / ideas. Love this!
Is there any harm using dirt pedals before an Underfacer? I’m wanting to run my dry signal from the tuner out to a dry amp, and then run my wet effects in the loop of the underfacer. Trying for a stereo rig with optional dry signal through the tuner out when desired.
Not at all! Definitely do that. Good idea! If you run the tuner out to the wet effects and the send to the amp you can change the muting option (internally) and use the mute switch for a dry amp mute instead of a master - My preferred way of doing it.
I bought a Roland Jazz Chorus amp, with an amp for each speaker, wet/dry. My plan is to run my ES355 in stereo through it.
I figured that would be the cleanest and best set up without having other boxes, etc. Also, i could run the effects inline through the back, and might be able to run the mono effects through the back, but the stereo effects (Electric Mistress Stereo Flanger, Stereo Chorus) could be in between the stereo out on the guitar and the stereo 2 jacks in on the front of the amp.
Not sure, but would like your advice.
Hey Alan. Not quite sure how to answer this. This is a huge question. I'd start by trying mono out of the guitar into mono dry effects. Split signal to amp 1 input and the other side of the split to stereo effects (but run these in mono). Then to amp 2 input (wet amp). That's a good starting point and then do more tests after this to see what you like best.
@@GoodwoodAudio Well, what to do with a stereo guitar?
@@TheRealThomasPaine1776 ya I hear you... I'm just saying it's good to start simle and work up from there. Even though you have the stereo option, start with mono first. For the stereo aspect, when you're ready, I'd look into either an AB switcher to switch between stereo inputs (as an option) or a line mixer to mix the two pickups down to a mono signal that you can then blend with the guitar or line mixer... Running two separate signal paths on the board from your guitar is also an option but depending on your preference - might not be the best one if we're talking about wet dry. Thats where the experimenting comes in to see what you like best.
What is meant by "Signal splitter"? ABY switch? Im looking to start a wet/dry rig for now, possibly wet/dry/wet in the future. Would the "Output" be ideal for both of these or wet/dry only? I see you guys have so many options and want to get what I need for both rigs. Thanks a lot!
good question. An ABY can do the trick - these are often passive splits though - not ideal, but some are great. A buffered split can do this as well. Output TX can do a buffered split with transformer isolated output OR stereo summing. We also make Isolator - this is designed for Wet dry / wet dry wet. It's a buffered split with a mute on the dry output. Also has transformer isolation. Lastly, we have the WDW box - It's all of your inputs and outputs needed for wet dry or wet dry wet, splits, transformers, mutes and optional XLR outputs if needed! Feel free to email me with any questions on these. happy to help. Info@goodwoodaudio.com
@@GoodwoodAudio You already did 😁 Grant helped me out with all my questions. Thanks Grant! Looking forward to my WDW box 👍
Hi there, I can't tell when your video was out because youtube does not put the date on your post but, if you are still out there I have a situation I would like to understand about my stereo rig. I have 2 Katana 50 I am using in my studio to play ambient guitar. I have a pedal board with stereo and mono pedals (strymon Big sky, neunaber immerse, Strymon Dig, El capistan and in front, boss tuner, small TC comp, soul food, sub n up, volume Morley, and finally out to amps Boomerang looper. Outpu left to amp out right to other amp. I am noticing the amp hooked up to the right output of the boomerang is losing a lot of signal (sound). Is there something I am not aware of that could be fixed? Both amps sound fine and equal when I switched the out line from one to the other, so it's not the amps. Thank you for your great videos and I hope this will reach you...
good question. Can I clarify one thing... you're running to the front end of both amps (not using FX Loops)? If you get rid of the looper and just run guitar - bigsky (mono in / stereo out) - Amp L and Amp R... Do you still get the same issue?
If yes - Swap instrument leads on the right and left outputs (you can just swap right to left, left to right) does the problem stick with the cable or the amp?
If the problem is the same amp even after swapping cables... Unplug the GOOD amp completely. Does the problem go away?
@@GoodwoodAudio I there thanks fpr respnding so fast. I will try what you suggest today and let you know. When you say "instrument leads" are you referring to the patch cables on the pedals and if yes which pedals should I swap? Boomerang or Big sky?
Great info!, but ... I just don't know what exactly the difference between 2 wet mono and 2 wet stereo? please explain further. Thank you.
Do you mean dual mono and stereo? If so... stereo will send different information down the Left and Right outputs... A ping ponging delay (one repeat goes out the left output and the next repeat goes out of the right output...back and forth. This is only possible in stereo. Dual mono still uses two amps but both lines always get the same info. A ping pong delay would now be summed and ALL repeats get sent out of BOTH outputs. Does that help at all?
@@GoodwoodAudio yes
Thank you kindly
@@thesaj1110 No problem!
Does a pedal-switcher (Musicom Efx) sort out the phasing problem. Like an a/b switch?
the EFX MK VI as example has an iso out and can correct phase / polarity issues, yes! Depends on the switcher you get. They refer to it as ISO Out on their site, so just check the switcher they make to confirm.
Do you have to have the same type of amps to run stereo or can you have different amps like running in dual mono?
Very good question. The answer is.... YES! You can 100% mix and match amps or keep them the same. This is a point of preference among guitar players. The only thing I'd be aware of when mixing and matching (this can be good or bad, depending on what sound you're after) is different amps react differently to effects / break up differently / will have different sustain etc. So one amp may 'trail off' / lower it's volume before the other just because of how it's designed. Again, this isn't bad or good... It's just something to experiment with and see what sound you prefer.
When you talk about delaying the signal to the second amp, how is that accomplished? Thanks.
you can use something like a double tracker Like the keeley 30ms, or if you're using a DAW you could put a 4ms (or wahtever you like) delay on one side as well!
I’m trying to set all of this up but I’m wondering how amps with effects loops would complicate this
true. YOu don't have to use FX loops, but if you wanted to (in wet dry) you could get a suhr iso box and use the dry amp in it's entirety (no FX loop), then send signal to the wet effects and wet amps power amp (FX Return) only OR a cab zeus (cab sim). You could also run your dry amp like this:
Dry amp input (after last dry effect) - FX Send to pedalboard (or do this at the amp) SPLIT this signal to two places:
Wet effect chain
FX Return of dry amp
After last wet effect, send signal to wet amps FX return.
you could get creative with this... a few different things to try here.
@@GoodwoodAudio Thanks! Am i wrong in thinking that stereo setups use both preamps or would they feed into each other?
what if you have a stereo output jack on your guitar....what do you plug the stereo signal to?
ooo fun. Now we're talking. Depends how you want to approach it. If it's from 2 different PUPs you can mix them down into a mono send and blend them, if you want to AB them you can do that as well or you can plug into a junction with a TRS input and continue into a stereo set of pedals. If you want to do all of the above easily... then you send us an e-mail ;)
I love stereo 8 parallel delay all day long but.....wet/dry sounds BIGGER at a gig.
1 cabinet dry only...effects in a separate amp/cab
If a person wanted to set up with one of these ways of set-ups just for the Home user. Could you please give me some information on which would be the best set-up?
For home use, I'd go with mono or stereo to be honest... Wet Dry is better when you can mix and pan in post production / at a sound desk.
I notice also when using two or more amps there can be hum and Phasing. I also saw from the videos I watched one can use splitters that eliminate the Hum and Phasing however I also noticed that pedals can make the amps revert back to Phasing.
it's a big and confusing world when it comes to multi-amp setups. That's why we do our junctions boxes to alleviate everything you're talking about! @@Kennethswoodcarvings
You have that correct the more I listen to these guys I see on here explain all the different ways of doing things along with pedals my head goes into a spin (LOL) THe most I see on here is confusing noise and guys performing finger exercises by running up and down the fretboard.@@GoodwoodAudio
Can you do 2 Amps dual both dirty and be able to switch them to dual clean?
Do you mean switching their channels at the same time? If so, yes! You just need the right switcher to do it. A lot of midi controllers can do this (check out RJM PBC10 / PBC6x and LT as an example). Or you can get a custom switch made just for your amp(s) that can do both at the same time or one at a time!
@@GoodwoodAudio any idea where to get a custom switch made?
@@negativeland5207 depending on what you want it to do, we build custom boxes / switchers / routing systems all the time. Happy to chat this through. Feel free to send through your idea to info@goodwoodaudio.com!
How is the MusicomLab Parallelizer for wet dry PARALLEL delay and reverb mixing?
Great question. I haven't used it myself, but the Musicom gear is solid, so I'd expect it to work really well.
@@GoodwoodAudio I agree as well. Just hope that there are no phase issues while using two amps. That would be the real problem as it seems there's no phase inversion switch.
@@shashankraman2512 you can easily correct phase between amps with an external piece of gear (we can help you there) the trick though now that you mention it is no phase correction between parallel loops. This is rare between stereo wet effects, but more common with mono dry effects (overdrives etc). Depending on how you used it, you'd want to consider that first.
@@GoodwoodAudio Sweet! I didn't really think about that. I will get in touch with your team soon. Really love your work man!
@@shashankraman2512 thanks!
Is it okay to plug a digital piano (Headphone out) with a Dual Mono setup to an audio interface?
I mean, doing that with a single Y cable. Is it a better way to do that? (pls do not say to buy a new keyboard lol). Forgot to tell you that your videos are awesome, ty so much.
@@TheMrdj33 Going to be totally honest...never had to try this one but theres no reason it shouldn't work assuming you're going from Piano (headphone) - TRS to Dual Mono Cable - Interface.
"The downside of a stereo setup is that if one of your amp dies, you lose half of your stereo field - to simulate this pull out one of your ear buds"
This was really annoying to me tbh. IF you're playing live, the amps will be rigged with their own mics, sent to two separate tracks, and panned each side. If the right side dies, the engineer can just pan the left side to middle to compensate. You will have a fully working and fine sound for the rest of the show.
The only thing that would be ruined by this, is ping pong delay. And yes that's a shame if you use it, but in 99.9% of cases you will be fine with the compromise for the rest of a live show where people hear jack shit anyways!
Nice. Very frustrating to have an amp die live though... But good to have a backup plan in case! This is why when our products sum a stereo signal they send to BOTH outputs... This way, regardless of which amp dies you can still get your Left and Right signals sent to the working amp.
But what if I wanna be Kevin Shields and run six amps in unison? Plus the PA.
That's when you come to us to build a custom output box to handle that craziness. And also buy a few six packs to give to your Sound Guy and band members as a peace offering before you start playing.
@@GoodwoodAudio lol.
I enjoy not having hearing loss. But I do plan on buying an interfacer from you guys in the not so distant future.
@@radshoesbro You're smarter than most guitarists in the 80s.
I think you might have forgotten wet-dry-wet
ha. Complicated to do wet dry wet with 2 amps though! Unless you have an amp that has 2 power amps built in... in which case you have to argue if you're back to 3 amps in 2 chassis. I agree though - wet dry wet sounds pretty huge.
change the fender for a two rock
I don't disagree
Any clue of why Hillsong UNITED guys use dual mono setups?
ya, Chislet prefers it. What Chislet says...goes.
@@GoodwoodAudio haha yeah I supposed he prefers it maybe when 1 amp fails? I don’t know I guess you’ll keep the secret 😉
@@isaachernandez3868 theres pros and cons to stereo... in a huge venue, often times unless you're in the middle (between both mains speakers) you won't hear a proper stereo field - some venues correct for this, but definitely not all. Dual mono can be a more reliable way to get the full experience of the guitar while also allowing you to mix amps / have redundancies built in to the rig. Stereo... obviously sounds HUGE, and when it's set up properly in a venue is amazing.
@@GoodwoodAudio makes a lot of sense for us mortals to go dual mono as well haha So could I achieve that buying a standard Tx Interfacer? Or do I need to go custom junction box?
@@isaachernandez3868 Dual mono is underrated! I love it. TX interfacer has a secondary summing option (via internal DIP switches) that allow you to split the left Input to both outputs (dual mono). So yes, Interfacer has you covered!
Didn't realize Macaulay Culkin grew up, grew a beard and become a signal chain guru
ha. thats a first. It's from missing out on all those family holidays. Had to do something with my time after I put the baddies in jail.
@@GoodwoodAudio lol, good to see you found gainful employment post-hollywood
@@copernicansun744 haha