Jean UNIT GUIDE! Maddening
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- Опубліковано 15 лип 2024
- #fireemblem #fireemblemengage #feengage
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In this video I outline how to use Jean on Maddening in terms of classes, upgrades, passives, etc. - Ігри
This guy with the Tiki ring is beyond cracked
Well of course
Been looking forward to this one, awesome that you went very in-depth for such a versatile and unique unit
This went from Jean guide to dlc emblems first impressions 😇
Bro I just wanted to say I’m happy your channel is blowing up. I remember watching your fe warriors guides. It was crazy detailed. Now with FE engage you have more content to make man. Hope more games come out and you can grow your channel more
Thanks m8, I appreciate the kind words! There are a lot of games coming out this year so I may be in luck for things to cover :)
What upcoming games are you most interested in?
@@IcedCoffeeGaming Dunno if you plan on playing the new zelda but that'd be tight
Facts.
I would say for me, final fantasy 16 and final fantasy remake part 2.
Imagine if they released radiant dawn and path of radiance on the switch. Sheesh.
I'm doing good with Jean as a Royal Knight with a Killer Lance. He doubles things. He crits things. He can still use staffs. He can move around a lot. He has access to 1-2 range and even magic damage with a Flame Lance.
Second on that, Royal Knight is a really good class on him.
My head cannon is that this is his cannon intended class.
I saw a tier list that had Jean as “bad” and Anna “worse than Jean”. I was stunned. And to add insult to injury, they put Lapis in F tier.
That tier list was a wild ride.
Anyway. I did a low unit run and had Jean with Hector on Great Knight with starsphere (I was cheesing dlc). But damn did those stats get insane lol.
Proof?
Nearly an hour of content about the child *grabs the popcorn*
Never knew what to do with Jeanne. I knew he could fit any role thanks to his personal Skill so I kept him as a monk and waited to see if maybe I might need him as a different unit at some point throughout the game but the situation never showed up and so he stayed on staff support the whole time, which I feel like using Framme for would be better. Feels like you need to know which 11 units you're training throughout the game, look at what can compliment them, and then turn Jeanne into that as soon as you can, but he does have Anna to fight with for early heavy investment sadly. I wish his skill was just a flat 20% increase to all growths lol
A flat 20% increase as a personal skill is the same as not having a personal skill at all, he would just end up like Cyril from Three Houses, meaning they'd just nerf his growths even more to balance him. And Jean can't actually fit any class because his strength and speed growths aren't high enough for some of them to be viable, which unfortunately includes Martial Monk and the two classes it promotes into. As for how you should build Jean, there are two different ways of doing it. You either bench him at level 1 and wait until after chapter 8 to reclass him, or you promote him before reclassing him. When doing the former, it's best to make him an Axe Fighter, though Archer and the various armour classes are also worth considering. When doing the latter, general and all the classes with knight in their name except Wolf Knight are at least decent choices, but my opinion is that sword Griffin Knight with a Levin Sword is the best choice.
I put Tiki on him just cause they had the same accent and snowballed him completely on accident. Starsphere is great on anyone, but it really pairs well with his personal skill.
You can power level him in one chapter by using body block heal farm. If you reclass immediately to min max use Michah for staff.
Stat is you surround 1 enemy unit and let them hit units that can't hit back and use power level units on staves. get him to 10 then promote. Also you get more exp healing units higher level than healer
you can do it in his recruitment chapter. Just stock up on heal staves in the convoy, clear the map except for the cavalry unit by the fence, then place vander in melee without a weapon and heal spam him with Jean. Healing gets diminished exp if the target unit is lower level, but Vander has a super high internal level so Jean can easily get to 10 without too much time. In my "break the game" runs, I recruit anna and second seal her to mage right away, then deploy her to jean paralogue with micaiah and I get both Jean and Anna to lv 10 by heal spamming Vander.
The Divine Child got his unit guide 🙌🏻
I think the most special thing for Jean is he has great cross-class potential, or versatility. For example, he can be heavy armor with high res and spd, wyvern knight with high res and mag, thief with high str and def, or griffin knight with high str and def, meanwhile excelling those original class features.
Jean on High Priest with Soren can be pretty nuts for enemy phase. Flare drops enemy RES and with Qi Adept returns 100% of damage dealt back to you, so as long as you aren't getting doubled and you deal enough damage, you get hit and then heal to full.
It makes him a pretty wild enemy phase tank. Especially since he can also hit reflect staff to put a stop to mages in a hurry.
High Priest is a mythical class while Martial Master albeit being Qi Fighter (with 100% Flare) has no innate tome access
All you need to do is give him Mercurius and have him use Lodestar Rush every so often. Yeah, Alear loves using Marth but because I generally get Dire Thunder for Citrinne, Celica is free to slot in for Alear. Jean can also inherit Celica's Favorite Food which allows him to engage with Marth at least twice every map afterwards. He will easily catch up in terms of leveling with that, what I consider small, investment. By chapter 11 you can then master seal him to Berserker and give him Lucina.
Yes Lucina bonded shield is really good, but imo Parthia is too underrated. You can easily play around not using bonded shield, furthermore once Jean outlevels your team it hardly matters if he gets hit in the bonded shield because he will be to tanky. Use pure water to help resist mages. If you want to avoid tank, give him Micaiah's engraving since no one else really wants it. The might reduction doesn't matter since Parthia is the main weapon you'll be using.
Just my 2 cents.
Jean>Anna imo, Jean is exceptional in everything whilst Anna is exceptional in magic
Anna pops off quicker imo. Jean is a long-term investment with high payoffs. I have yet to dedicate enough resources to him to make him worth it for my run.
Anna generate gold, Jean doesn't.
@Dwi Atmika Which means absolutely nothing post-well. Anna basically just doesn't have a personal now if you utilize the well.
Same. 1-10 Jean feels way better than 5-10 Anna. I never understand people saying different as in my experience leveling Anna feels like an absolute slog and I always question myself whether sinking the energy into her is worth it. Jean on the other hand is useful the second you talk to him in his paralogue and afterward- and he can fill basically any gap your team has while Anna competes for a very very narrow niche on your deploys.
@@FormerRuling ?? you still need gold anyway
It requires more investment early on, but if you put him on Axe Fighter before he's able to level up in Martial Monk, he becomes useful much faster. Early game is really easy, so even if you have to go out of your way to feed him kills or set up a few great sacrifices, it's worth it down the line. Of course, there's also the option of boxing in an enemy unit and healing until he hits level 10, but that's not necessary, especially if you upgrade Noatun early. Once his level starts to catch up to the rest of your team, he naturally snowballs and becomes your strongest unit.
I know the ancient well kinda solves this, but grinding on his paralogue robs him of SP since he had no ring equipped. Especially if you do it for immediate master seal
reprisal is amazing when paired with vantage on a high hp unit, for example take jean to 20 on berserker and second seal him as berserker to keep the huge hp growths, then give him vantage and reprisal with roy for hold out, and he'll 1 shot practically anything enemy phase
I'm glad someone else appreciates Warrior Jean. I gave him Ike, and he's turned out to be my second-best physical unit (behind Kagetsu) without even going through Axe Fighter--I just promoted him from Martial Monk and reclassed to Warrior. He has plenty of Strength even though I didn't run him through Berserker, and his biggest flaws were low Luck for a unit who wants to Enemy Phase (which I fixed with Lck+6 from Byleth), shaky accuracy (which I fixed with engravings) and hitting the Speed cap of 32 in Chapter 21 (which caused me to move him to Axe Paladin so he can gain a little more).
There is a saying of a certain carp that swore vengeance upon those who deemed it weak and reward those who have faith in its potential.
Jean (or any qi adept) + Soren's Flare + hold out +++.
Means your unit doesn't die as long as they counter attack.
Great video, I like the suggestion of berserker initially, but often not needed in my experience!
After levelling up 9 times as the base axe fighter he often has many stats “fixed” already. Even just this base class gives: 100% HP, 60% str, 45% dex, 60% spd, 15% build. But with bad RNG berserker is a great fix!
Had jean as a wolf knight and he was one of the best damage unit especially with Levin sword
75,75,15,25,35,25,15,15,35 Class growths on Berserker + starsphere gonna say this should be illegal
Also a quick peek at the dlc class growths they seem like interesting options for him
On the topic of the emblem section, I found that Camilla and Chrom are actually very good on mixed attacking classes! Camilla has pretty much never left my Celine since getting the DLC and it turned her into a mixed attacking Ivy and the + 5 speed she gives is very nice. And I slapped Chrom on my Griffin Knight Chloe, he gives her more Str and that +10 Mag when engaged makes her flame lance hit like a truck!
I totally agree with a griffin knight Chloe + Chrom ! 😂
@benjaminfelisaz2317 This for sure; also consider chrom on Ivy due natural speed increase, access to dex/speed skill and whenever engaged, a PLUS 10 to her highest dmg stat. It's nuts.
@@NaughtyBlog Thank you for the advice, I didn't think of that. I'll try for sure
Camilla’s not necessarily good for mixed. She makes magical units into mixed even if you initially weren’t. She makes magical units into mixed attackers since even citrinne can one round enemy mages with cammila’s axe. Likewise lightning is an exceptionally strong magical engage weapon quadding go brrrrrr just have a magic stat and watch the low res enemies fall. And unlike normal mixed attackers who can struggle vs enemies with mid res and mid defense a full on magic unit can still do well vs them but also do well vs high res low defense foes because of Camilla’s axe so it’s kinda even better. You get the value of a mixed attacker without its primary drawback if you just stick her on a dedicated mage.
I made my Jean a Griffin Knight Levin Sword user and he was amazing with it on my very first playthrough
He can be a very nasty Magic Knight as well, but he will be needing Speed+5 or speedtaker
What stats transfer with Second Seal? When I look at the options for reclass, the stats go down to the new Class Base. Does increasing stats on a class reduce the loss amount? Like is it a flat reduction like 30 speed goes to 26 speed relative to a 22 reducing to 18. A flat loss of 4. Am I understanding that right?
One thing about comparing Anna to Jean on magic classes. While Anna has slightly better growths, she also spends the first ten levels as an axe fighter (technically 5 since she starts at 5), while Jean starts as a Monk, which has the same magic growth as mage. I think Axe gets better speed growth though. This is just to say that if they both go the magic route, Jean ends up with slightly higher magic early on.
Or you could just make Anna a mage before leveling her up same as how Jean wants to be reclassed to whatever class before leveling
Make Jean an Axe Fighter at level 1, and he'll have insane growths, with already high HP, Str, Def, and Build, with good Dex and speed.
Then go into Berserker until your Dex cap, and transition into any other physical unit. He will have incredible HP, Strength, Defense, and Build, and have good Speed and dex for his level.
Second seal Jean at level 1. Make him an Axe fighter. You make his stats go from:
Jean: hp:50 str:20 mag:20 dex:35 spd:40 def:25 res:20 lck:25 bld:5 bst:240
To
AxeF: hp:100 str:60 mag:20 dex:45 spd:60 def:35 res:20 lck:25 bld:15bst:380
Making Jean an Axe fighter at level 1, and promoting him into a Berserker at level 10, and leveling him until his dex caps at 22, is the absolute most beneficial build path for him due to his personal doubling class growths. And making use of the Axe classes already high HP, Str, and Build, making just Jean in an Axe fighter class already stronger than Alear could be.
I plan to run Jean on the brave axe build you posted for Panette and put her on her crit build just to see how broken it is (base game no DLC for me yet)
Got enough hours in me now that I decided that General (or at least armored, specifically axes) is the way to grow with this unit before switfly switching into another physical class after you hit the build threshold you set out for. His natural speed growth is still passable enough that he'll catch up if you decide you want him to double later on -- depending on how long you leave him in armored.
Also armored Micaiah spam makes catching him up quite fast, if you're into doing that for a map or two for convenience.
I actually second sealed Jean into axe fighter as soon as I could and then master sealed him into berserker lol, because I saw the growths would be insane and I figured might as well get a head start right away with axe fighter. I'm barely midgame buts he already kinda insane
Divine pulse+ you would put on Hortesia or Celine if you like using the offensive staves a lot. On those 2 units you rarely ever miss.
Weapon Sync is usually based on the emblem's last weapon.
So, Sigurd uses Sword. In fact, most of them are swords. Dimitri (but he's only there a third of the time) and Ephraim (you have to use Night and Day) uses lances. Hector, Edelgard (same problem as Dimitri), Camila syncs with axes. Lyn and Claude (again same problem with the other 2, but it does come for free) syncs with bows. No one syncs with Knives or arts.
It does always give the attack boost while engaged though, regardless of weapon.
Jean will only get 51% STR growth with base 20% + 10% from monk (not 60%). Starsphere puts him at 69.75% in the same class--which is goddamn bananas for a base class.
I stand behind Jean on griffin knight with levin sword, in my male only run he was my only magic flier
Great Knight Jean is super fun, especially as his Res remains quite high
I love emblem Camilla on a dark mage Jean. On my current maddening run, he has become an incredible mage killer. While engaged, he gets Camilla's Axe and does extra damage equal to the enemy's res minus def. With a physical atk weapon, he also gains increased speed with Chaos Style. Also, bond 20 Camilla gives extra speed and res, further boosting his mage killing capability.
Something of note is that SP conversion works in the arena. It's worth having at least one of your strongest units inherit it early on.
idk that skill seems like a trap, i didnt see to much of a difference when I was lvling units in the arena.
@@freshness2569 It's only a trap if you give it to a unit that isn't overleveled. The SP from the arena is just a bonus. The main point of the skill is to offset the reduced SP gained when an overleveled unit gets a kill. Overleveled units also happen to benefit the most from arena battles, so you're not losing anything by funneling all the arena exp into one unit. As long as you don't already have two inherited skills taking up slots, it's pure upside.
@@MyBanannasso what you are saying is give it to vander
@@ultimaterecoil1136 Unironically, yes. With enough investment in the right skills, it's possible to make him useful as a devoted staff unit assuming you're using DLC.
Edit: Never mind. I forgot the details, turns out you have to win the battle.
@@MyBanannas 🤷♂️ rather do the mage knight vander thing and have him one round with seraphim
I think the ai in madenning tends to target whoever has lower defense or lower avoid, so lets say anna has less avoid than your bonded shield user so the ai will target anna , i don’t necessarily think you need to have high avoid, but just higher avoid than your bonded dps class. I might be wrong but that is just my experience cause the ai cannot differentiate who is the lucina user, i think they just run off of defense and avoid numbers.
My Jean is a Swordmaster with a Brave Sword with the Lyn Ring. He has so much speed that, thanks to alacrity fron Lyn, he can attack 4 timeswith the Brave Sword before the enemy can attack once.
For sp conversion I had it on the chapter before the final boss and as I was getting swarmed by the infinite reinforcements I had a Veronica user just sit back and kill them all for some stupid gains they got nearly 2k sp without me waiting turns on it
Made him an Axe wielding wyvern knight right when he turned level 10. He quickly became my strongest unit. When I gave him Lyn, it was game over for everyone else.
Pretty much he dives an archer or mage and instagibs with a Killer Axe, canters out, gets danced and repeats.
Edelgard's Weapon sync. gives tomes attack boost. It's almost like a pseudo tome power.
Tome emblems are Celica, sorren, micaiah, and Veronica. The only lance emblem (outside of Dimitri which is attached to Edelgard and is random) isn't even in the game! It's Ephraim lol. Everyone else is sword. Hector, Camilla, and Edelgard (who switches) are axes. Lyn is bow and Tiki is dragonstones.
I ran Jean on my maddening run as a berserker, and he outgrew pannete in the Str department, I used him mainly with Ike. But I would probably recommend warrior more, since berserker has really bad caps. But it was certainly fun to get +Str almost every level. Also major thing about Jean I would advice to anyone who want to run him. Dont lvl him up as a martial monk, this class has one of the worst growths, wait till you have second seals, reclass him into a base class that promotes into a class you intend to run him and then lvl him up through mecaiah ring. Its quite a bit of investment but its usually worth it. He works with almost every class but I have a soft spot for a berserker Jean mainly how insane his HP and Str growths become. :D
So which class do I put him in to turn him into a berserker… help please
My Jean promoted to MartialMaster at ~Ch11, then sat on the bench till now in Ch15. I just didn't know what to do with him. There were enough potential WyvernKnights and I didn't want a slow, mostly worthless physical tank ala General or GreatKnight. I learned my lesson(s) from previous titles.
Those were the only "holes" my roster really had. Not keen on Engage's Paladin because its mono-weapon nature hinders the adaptability provided by their high movement and balanced stats.
I’ve been running him as a royal knight problem is his defense is too high no one attacks him. What do I do
He got too much xp from healing, he’s now a heal bot back liner lol
Jean's bases aren't that bad if you reclass him immediately into something better like a Sword Fighter or Axe Fighter. He has 6 Str 11 Dex 10 Spd as a Sword Fighter, and 10 Str 9 Dex 7 Spd as an Axe Fighter, which is the exact same bases as Anna with more room to grow.
Made him a Warrior on my DLC Maddening run and just power leveled him on Tiki's map with Micaiah. He turned out to be a hard carry till late game where his accuracy started to fall off. Ran the Ike crit build. He's a fun unit if you want to put the time in him
I did this but first ran him as berserker until hitting dex cap. After warrior, I switched him to paladin for the higher stat caps. It's been working really well so far. Berserker gives him so much build, so it makes him one of the few units actually good at running axes. A +2 engraved tomahawk makes him one-round anything outside of armored units.
Something to keep in mind is that Jean starts at level 1, meaning there's no downside from a growth perspective l to second sealing him immediately, letting him get his first 10 levels tailored to his intended roll.
Also, as was alluded to here, because his growths change so much its possible to patch his stats by running him as something else for a few levels.
This is true, you could second seal him, you don't get second seals until after CH 7 or 8 though, which makes running him as a level 1 anything somewhat rough.
@IcedCoffeeGaming it is kinda rough, but it's not impossible. You do have to be willing to go slow and baby him to make it work though.
It's also fine if you plan to run him on Swordmaster to just shoot him into Sword Fighter at whatever level he is when you get a Second Seal. The only growth difference is 5 points of Luck
Veronica is easy early game, you just need Louis and healer one side tank them. Then you can master seal Main character into Fly Unit. With two Fly unit you can just left them there and fly help order side. Louis and Healer (Best is Jean in Axe Fighting with Micaiah Emblem) will just there tanking and farm EXP, your Louis should remove Weapon. If your Louis ever have too much def, dont worry because enemy backup unit will come to you and wont leave for enemy bow unit shot to backup attack you
Mage Knight seems decent at first but Mage Knight has poor class cap, which you will hit if you had Starsphere. I manage to hit Mage Knight Stats cap with Merrin on 4 stats with out Starshpere.
I am talking about random growth tho so take that as you will.
Does sword power improve levin sword damage ? From the game's description, it says you get +x strength/-10 avoid when using a sword, not +x might. Can you confirm ? I haven't had the opportunity to test it just yet so I'm a bit confused.
It seems to based on my most recent 5 man DLC run where I ran it on a sword power 5 alear.
@@IcedCoffeeGaming Just to correct my statement, the text is +x Atk/-10 avoid so Atk probably means might. When checking unit's status, you see Ph Atk or Mag Atk. Probably Atk means Might in this game. That's awesome info, thanks a lot
I use Jean with Soren and Rexcaliber spam for for enemy phase.
jean paladin is fucking ridiculous with 50% in most stats and 70% speed
Hey can you please tell me how to grow him to berserker please
You've mentioned it a lot over the course of your videos but I don't really agree with your perspective on halberdier. It's a really common thing across games in general to look at an abilty like that which lets you break rules but requires some condition and to immediately theory craft ignoring the rules and just focusing on the possible synergy, to the point where you overfixate on this possibility and disregard any other relevant aspects to the choice. More specifically here, I mean it's easy to say halberdier is just for forcing doubles on high damage classes that don't have/want speed, but doing so completely ignores everything else they bring to the table.
Halberdiers are basically just a solid bruiser class. They have high durability and fairly balanced growths above the board, with the likewise balanced weapon type that never really is a bad choice. And pincer attack is still good because you don't just ignore it, you just expect your unit to have solid speed enough to double slow/average enemies, or at least avoid being doubled by the latter, and then you have the option to set up doubles on durable enemies. In particular you can set up doubles specifically on fast enemies that your units can struggle to double at all with or without the ability, which means these are also units that probably would survive a round of combat anyways. This is even further reinforced by the fact that most of the fastest enemy types use swords, which lances can break, so not only will you double the enemy in question, but you don't suffer a counterattack, while maintaining the bulk that can let you tank afterwards. Halberdiers end up being a lot like lance paladins that trade mobility for a better skill and backup tag, they work well as general combat classes. They also have the highest growth rate among non archer classes which means they can be good for fixing units with accuracy issues, especially since they use lances instead of axes. It's easy to compare them to wyverns, growth wise, being only 5% behind in strength and defense while having more speed and dex, so generally any unit that can do well on wyvern can perform pretty close to the same on halberdier.
Really even like a lot of what timerra does (other than sandstorm) is quite similar to what halbardiers can do in general. Now sandstorm is a big deal because it just lets you kill while tanking, but as a secondary tank or off tank halberdier can still put in a lot of work. Depending on what character you put in halberdier they can potentially exceed Timerra in stats, while having the option to just blow up fast units, in particular sword users.
Now I'm not trying to say that like halberdier is some amazing class that's massively underutilized, it's not really in the end a super impressive class and a lot of the time warrior and hero prove to be more impressive, but having A rank lances is good early for the well lance, which is light enough to be used early on too, and having a flexible unit that can frontline and potentially do lots of damage on player phase is useful. The kind of end up being a jack of all trades that can do whatever you need them to fairly well, but I'd say the fact they don't specialize means you can't just slap anyone on it and it's instantly good, which means it will be kind of niche. But I think there are going to be plenty of setups that will benefit the team as a whole to have a durable bruiser who can sometimes burst high damage on player phase that also has a backup tag.
I agree you can still run it on fast units but aren't you throwing away better things by doing so?
@@IcedCoffeeGaming Before I adress the question directly I'd point out that I think halberdier is better for units that are pretty fast, rather than units that are really fast. Units like Chloe and Lapis, depending on the class you put them in, basically can potentially double just about anything with no assistance, but there are plenty of units that can outspeed most things, but need help against faster enemies. Generally you can solve this issue with skill inheritance like speedtaker or speed/build+x, but alternatively you can just take what you've got against most enemies and use pincer attack against the rest. This frees up your inheritable skill slots for other things while still basically being able to do the same things. You're just trading the occassional setup (against enemies that often are too fast to one round anyways so it was already going to take multiple units to take them down), in exchange for extra skills. A halberdier who is fairly quick can run some combo like lance power and canter or gentility or hold out, or lunar brace or any number of other skills that would normally be taken up by speedtaker. So units like chloe aren't exactly the best example because they can potentially get by doubling the world without needing much help, but halberdier can face those in the middle ground and can use what they saved on improving other strengths.
As an example, I think Diamant is a reasonable unit that could take advantage of what Halberdier offers. For one, it gives him boosts to hit rate between using lances and the increased dex, which can be a problem he faces, but besides that, in general the class increases his bulk, which lets him tank/off tank more effectively, and it gives him a route to double fast units, which he otherwise would need skill help in doing. Therefore, he can, run, for instance, lance power and gentility, whereas had you classed him into something like warrior, you'd still need to at least give him speedtaker to get more consistent doubles, and potentially still need to fix his accuracy issue either with skills or some other way. Instead, between lance power and whatever else you gave him, you could have a halberdier who both hits harder and takes less damage, that can still double, just with a different kind of setup (nearby ally instead of kills to get speedtaker stacks).
But more directly, how much are you giving up, really? Using instead Kagetsu as an example, since he can basically run any physical class he wants, what kind of differences do we see if we compare what he looks like in one of his best options, wyvern, compared to halberdier? Well, statistically, by around level 14 on fixed mode, halberdier will have the same strength magic and luck, 2 more dex, and strength, 1 less speed defense and build, and 3 less res and hp. now across the board those stats aren't quite as good as what the wyvern has in a vaccuum, but the difference overall is pretty negligible. They have the same strength and both are going to be able to survive basically the same number of attacks. Other than stats you lose some weapon triangle control from not being able to pick swords or axes, and being locked to one weapon (aside from engage weapons), and 1 move and the flier tag. In exchange you get S lances (really A is what is important), regardless of your innate proficiency, you get the backup tag and pincer attack. So you can use the extra skill from not having to run speedtaker (in my experience wyvern kagetsu still isn't quite fast enough to get by without speed help) which can either mean more damage, durability, or utility like canter in the opened skill slot.. It's a tradeoff but what you get is at least comparable to what you give up.
Basically though I think that overall halberdier is probably the most balanced class in the game. Not really overpowered nor particularly underpowered, it has a good niche and that's what it works well in. Rarely is the class going to be a given units *best* class, but there are going to be circumstances where you don't want to take the best option. Like warrior might be better but do you want to add a warrior to a team that's already running 6 or 7 axe users? Or do you want to run a wyvern when you already have 5 fliers? Basically it's an option you pick around what the team needs, not around what that unit needs, but like I said, there's going to be some places where a backup tank/off tank that can contribute on player phase and uses lances is going to be something that can prove an asset to the team as a whole more than other options. I just think it's pretty shortsided to, for instance, recommend paladin as a possible option for a unit as you have in some of the basic unit guides since they have solid growths, but then look at halberdier and just skip it because it's not a high damage low speed unit, without considering anything but pincer attack synergy at the most gimmicky end.
As for the lucina thing, you probably shouldnt leave Jean MM or martial master or whatever. He really wants to go into more "hardcarry" classes, like warrior and wyvern. Lucinas more of a strictly support type unit, similar to like you said, with Framme on MM. But if you do that, youre kinda wasting Jean's potential. Jean starting as a Monk is kinda meh, since it makes peeps think hes just another staff bot. Jean isnt a staff bot or support unit. The staff thing helps him level outside of getting kills, but he's not meant to remain that for long. Otherwise, good vid, there was stuff in this I didnt know or yeah, haha, since I dont have dlc.
I made him a sword master with Chrom for that five extra speed.
Reprisal+ Speedtaker Soren was soooo trolly my last maddening Playthrough
Nice
30:55 - DLC bracelet only runs lets you use it without it being broken. Feels like a completely different game. 5 less paralogues for exp, 5 less emblems. No dire Thunder. You just get 7 bracelets and 3 bond rings.
So many crutches gone. No more warp skip for ch25. No cantering out of your risky plays.
But wouldn't you be power leveled from DLC ? Aren't there similar DLC combos/functionality that breaks the game like things like Bonded Shield?
@@IcedCoffeeGaming There are strong things in the DLC, but you often find a piece missing from the regular emblems that you want.
Like, reprisal really loves stuff like hold out and vantage. Without it, now you are trying to optimize getting hit by the correct enemy for your reprisal. You find yourself missing 1 piece of the busted combo that you want. Their stat skills are space efficient but expensive, even with 5k SP free. Anything with +str/mag is 8.4k to get to +5. For comparison +10 for swords is 5k SP
You get less exp by exclusively sticking to DLC. Instead of 12 ring paralogues, you get 7 bracelet paralogues. And if you do them all immediately you only gain like 1 - 2 exp per kill from main maps anyways until the game catches up. It's like how Mentorship reads "gain 20% exp" but does not translate to 20% more levels because exp is heavily tied to level difference.
I think you're doing Jean a disservice by leveling him on his own paralogue. If you delay him until chapter 9, reclass him at level 1, and put Micajah on him, lock down the last armor knight and farm heals, he will pop off way sooner because you're not wasting 10 levelups in a bad class. Leveling him in Axe Fighter rather than Martial Monk nets him 5HP, 1BLD, 2STR, 1DEX, and 2SPD, at the cost of 1 Def, 4 Res, and 2 Luck. That's not negligible, and will help him get online a lot sooner.
And you're not missing out on SP either. Just from powerleveling he'll have enough for Canter and then some. Just use Jeans Paralogue to powerlevel Anna instead, also with Micajah on top. I think thats the optimal (but also most time consuming) way to get both units online before chapter 10.
I mean arguably any XP farming is exploiting the game but you can do the armor knight XP farm if you want to.
34:10 something like lv boost could be ok my understanding of these lv increase abilities is total lv increase × your total growths rounded up into stat increases excuding build but take that with a grain of salt
So if you have +3 lv and have a spd growth of 50% you should have a +2 to speed
*excluding swear I fixed that lol
I never really had a problem with him, I play on hard and I don't really grind him or anything
Wow 49 minutes! Is this a record for guides?
Yes lol, he can be so many things : )
General Jean is a consistant must on most of my Maddening runs. His higher Res base also helos. He is the only tank I've found that doesn't crumple against more than 2 mid-late game Maddening enemies.
My warrior Jean is hard carry my maddening run. Axe +long bow 1 shot everything.
I have to bench him since he takes too many kills.
I ran him as a warrior with ike on my first run and he kinda fell off late game cause enemies started to avoid him. I'm currently running him a sage with soren on my second run, and he's honestly still a little underwhelming. He's defo not among the best aptitude/expertise character in the series.
Second seal, axe armour, micaiah ring, Jean immediately strong before 1 chapter is finished.
If I understand correctly, Jean's skill doesn't exactly double his growth rates. Mechanically speaking, if a stat has 40% growth, then he gets up to two RNG "rolls" that each have 40% probability to increase that stat at level-up. This doesn't add up to 80% overall probability for stat increase. It would actually have an average probability of 64% overall because he will succeed 40% of the time on the first attempt, and then 40% of only the failed attempts, so 0.4 + (0.4 * 0.6) = 64% overall success rate.
Which is still REALLY strong, just not as strong as it might intuitively seem
It's proportionally more effective for lower base rates than for higher ones. For example, two tries at 1% yields almost double overall odds at 1.99%, but two at 50% only gets you up to 75% overall.
Starsphere adds 15.75% overall to Jean at 40% base growth. Adds 24.75% at 10% base.
Is this proven that it rolls the stats individually though? If it adds them at a % it would produce the result I mention and on Fixed Mode it would work as described in the video.
Jeans biggest issue is suffering 10lvs at 40% str from lv 1 trying to convert into a melee class before he can promote/2nd seal. Hes almost exclusively better to stay as magic.
Jean's passive doubles ALL class stats, so if a class has 10% build, now Jean has 25% build total
Jean was a beast as an Axe General and i reclassed him later when he speed capped into Wyvern knight axe/lance and he was beast on that too, and all the defense and build from general made him double everything and was a def capped wyvern knight, it was disgusting. By the time he was level 3-5 axe armour (not axe general, axe armour) he started snowballing himself pretty hard
who is he? he’s jean val jean
the problem with jean is he is a high investment late game unit.
if you want magic pandreo exists. if you want strength you got panette.
i just take him from qi to sage staffbot. until he picks up.
Jean i disagree needs investment, he just needs to be second seal immediately and spam sacrifice for 1 chapter and now he is caught up to your army in levels.
Usually the expertise units suck and are never worth considering, but in Engage they did a fantastic job to make Jean actually a great unit even if you just used him as a healer for the first 10 levels means he is getting exp without taking away exp.
Jean was great for me but the level of investment and time was not worth it for me. There are enough other options where other units cover for his role. Panette handles warrior jsut as effectively and Anna covers magic jsut as well and can be online much quicker than him. He just snow balls too slow for me
Jean hits all ranges of how a character feels. Awful, amazing, and even middling. What stood out to me in my run with Jean (Sage route) was that his resistance put any other mage slayer I had to shame, even Jade. I have to run him again to test this, but he went completely toe-to-toe with Light Brand Leif in his paralogue. Then again, this also cost me Byleth's mentorship and a good deal of favoritism. Between him and Jade, I still prefer the latter.
You're like the only UA-camr that pronounces Jean's name correctly, and yet you call Timerra, Tie-merra.
How are you supposed to pronounce Timerra? Don't tell me it's Tim-erra
I just give him Tiki, reclass him into Warrior and let him become an unkillable murder God in dragon mode, and a way to self heal on wait then slay on enemy phase. 😂 Not mentioning that his good speed and strength makes him an excellent hybrid archer for deleting flying units.
Meh had him on griffin w levin sword and sure, I’m sure if i fed him all the kills eventually he would get good…but why bother? Rather just use units that are good out of the box like pandreo and kagetsu
He's absolutely going on enchanter once it's available. Don't even care what the growths are.
Honestly, the one way Jean can be a bad unit is when you intentionally try to do him bad.
General Jean S tier
No I will not be providing any explanation
He's a fun toy, but if you're looking for good units to use he's not gonna be a viable option without the rest of your units lagging behind.
Mostly he lacks bulk and has weaker attack than the rest of the high tier units
I stopped using Jean right around the point when he was probably about to pop off. Those early levels are a real slog
With the DLC: Starsphere is more useful than Jean's passive because it's a solid + to growths across the board. And with the well making SP much easier to come by, any unit with a decent passive can be better than Jean.
Counter argument - Jean with starsphere can still scale better than other units with starsphere alone
@@Akinon93 counter counter argument: Jean's passive is only additive with Starsphere and not multiplicative, so he gets the same benefit from it as anyone else does. And stats alone aren't everything. Just being a blank slate with really good stats is okay, but it's not game breaking.
@@lethargicwizard of course it's the same for Jean as everyone else. But the original argument was that starsphere was better than jeans passive. Which, I do agree, but saying a unit with starsphere is better than Jean without is a bad argument because his passive isn't meant to compete with starsphere.
So yeah, a unit with a decent passive and starsphere can be better than Jean. But it doesn't make them better than Jean also with starsphere, he can still be a top tier unit in whatever you invest him into, as is his role.
I’m a very old Fire Emblem player so forgive me when I say growth units should automatically be counted as bad. The best way I can explain this is with the trainees in FE8-sure they’re strong when they get off the ground but the babying you have to do get them there is what makes that type of unit bad.
This is partly mitigated by Jean starting in a healing class giving him staff exp, and Emblem Micaiah being able to be put on literally anyone when Great Sacrifice gives such ridiculous chunks of exp at early levels.
It does take a bit of favouritism that you can argue could also be given to other characters who don't start as weak, but it's nowhere near as rough to level them as some characters in past games are (*cough* Nino).
I went Monk Lvl 1-10 then master seal into berserker, at this point is my Jean botched?
He shouldn't be, could still power level him to build up BLD/STR and then put him on whatever when he hits 20 dex or so
@Iced Coffee Gaming great so its not to late, I appreciate the feedback and reply! Enjoying your content 👍
My Martial Master Jean is one of my best units. He went Martial Monk to Griffin until he got enough speed, which coincided nicely with the Flashing Fist drop on Ch17 I think. Then he went Martial Master with Speedtaker and Advance with Eirika for damage. Alternatively you could run Lucina for Bonded Shield but as said in the video, he doesn’t have a lot of supports. I mainly want him to punch things. It was a bit of investment but I don’t have the DLC and I didn’t grind healing staves. He levels up fairly easily with Great Sacrifice and other utility staves. If you’re not using Framme, someone needs to heal and use staves. He was less of a pain than levelling Anna which I also did on the same run. Martial Master is definitely a slept on class. He’s definitely not the easiest one to get. Probably Chloe, Veyle, or Mauvier would be lower investment picks but I don’t regret taking this path with Jean. (I am playing on Maddening as well.) It’s worth noting that his speed cap in MM is 27 so Speedtaker and a speed giving Emblem is necessary to quad even if he gets a bunch of speed from Griffin. That’s a bit unfortunate but I haven’t had an issue with Flashing Fist because of its innate speed boost.
I don't agree with the sentiment that Jean's build is low. His base is low but he's on the class with the lowest base build and also is at internal level 1. With a few level ups, he easily catches up to and potentially surpasses most characters. His build growth is alright on most physical classes. For comparison, Alear starts with the same base build (after accounting for class) and has the same build growth, but without Expertise - so strictly worse on any class that gives build.
To maximize the power of Expertise, second sealing into Axe Fighter and going into Berserker in the mid game is good. However, I disagree with Warrior/Wyvern after that. Royal Knight and Paladin have better growth totals. After 10 levels in Axe Fighter and maybe 15 levels in Berserker, more health is kind of pointless, and you'd be much better off with Def and Res to get tankier. So while the 20 Str growth is very tempting on Warrior/Wyvern, Paladin not only provides more stat gains overall, but more useful ones as well.
Sure you can build up his build using a second seal, though this would occur after CH8 so he starts off either low level or low BLD and needs a lot of XP farming or help to get to a point where he is relevant let alone a hard carry.
@@IcedCoffeeGaming For physical Jean, the difference between second sealing to Axe Fighter at level 1 and second sealing after promoting is 4.5 HP, 1.8 Str, 0.9 Dex, 1.8 Spd, -0.9 Def, -3.6 Res, -1.8 Lck, 0.9 Bld. It's substantial enough for me to always go for, even if it makes my life a lot harder in chapters 8 ~ 10.
Your point is definitely valid that it takes time for him to catch up to the team. IMO it's doable because early levels require very little exp and you can always just spam heals (someone has to, anyhow) + obstruct on Micaiah and be relevant by chapter 10. Jean can also inherit Anna's Compact Axe +3. He escapes the "literally a liability" category with just a few levels because he gains so much HP so quickly.
I wonder if Berserker as a unit can be fixed by having hit +30 as the max STR / strength growth could be counted as a weapon +10 theoretically.
It's a question I need to answer by pratice I guess.
Jean is extremely little to zero investment, doing nothing special at all for him, he is immediately good as a healer which is what he starts as.
Jean's best class will probably end up being Enchanter since Enchanter gets growths for every stat.
The problem with Jean and Anna is that their paralogues are good for other units to catch up, not for training them; other units can easily outclass them and add something to an already good team. Generally, I recommend passing on both; they need to change classes to get going. They’re high investment and low returns.
Jean is only bad on fists and tomes, but Enchanter will make him viable on fists and potentially his best class and he is fist proficient, so he can use flashing fist on enchanter. I'm excited to use punching and kicking Jean this week when the DLC is out!
@@Mikey-xj6cz If you make him as a Sage and go Thoron only route with 4 staves, then he can work as a Sage.
This would give him 80% magic growth which is the highest growth you can get.