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Fodera Emperor Standard vs. Sire M5 - More Similar Than You'd Think - LowEndLobster Tone Shootout
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- Опубліковано 14 сер 2024
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Fodera Emperor Standard Review: • Fodera Emperor Standar...
Sire M5 Review: • Sire Marcus Miller M5 ...
Sire M5 Revisit: • Sire M5 Revisited - Ta...
Hey everyone! Today we have our most controversial tone shootout yet! We're going to compare the Fodera Emperor Standard 5 with our Sire M5. Their pricetags certainly differ, but these two basses have some striking similarities. Both basses are rocking dual coil humbuckers with selectable single coil options as well as 18v 3 band preamps. How will these basses sound back-to-back, and which one will sound better to your ears? Let's find out!
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The biggest advantage to the sire is not having an existential meltdown every time you put a ding in it.
Actually that is my Fodera in the video. It has it's share of dings! I got it to play......and it gets played allot!
Respect, i retired my PRS and one of my Warwicks from travel outside of the house. I’m not sure I’d let the emperor off the wall haha
😂😂😂
@@bassclef1962 I love that! If it's a case queen, then its true purpose is just wasted. I love Fender shaped parts basses because everything is modular and you can just route something to try and try something stupid. I just dropped off a P bass at a luthier to have him move the pickup to the MM position with a Dimarzio model P to see if I can get the SD Curlee tone out of it!
The same reason I drive a Honda.
Even if I had the dineros, I can't hear any reason to spend 3-5 times as much. The Sire is a fantastic sounding bass, with quality parts. Aside from the occasional quality control issues, Sire is a great buy. I love my M7. No regrets.
Totally agree with you:)
Love my M7 as well
Quality control issue 😂😂😂 I had to send my brand new M7 back since the active mode didn't worked at all right out of the box. Probably it was never even inspected prior to shipping it out. Other than that, the M7 Is a great sounding bass and it feels great in the hands.
MAAAAAN! what a comparison! from the rolls royce of basses to the budget friendly bass! bet the real difference of the two is the craftsmanship
Pshhh u must never played a sire
@@iamLexxKelsey on the contrary sir, i've owned a 1st gen V7 but due to QC issues i had it refunded. it had uneven frets and a faulty preamp when it came.
I've also tried M5, M7 and a V9 from my friend(they're all 2nd gen). They all sounded great but then again there are uneven frets on all basses (small matter). i think that this is the reason why those basses are called 'budget friendly', you need to set up it up properly first and hence my comment on the "craftsmanship" part.
@@iamLexxKelsey I have. They're okay. If you've played better you'll see and feel the differences. But hey, they work.
This was a great comparison. The only weakness of the M5 is the tone control capacitor (well documented by LEL). This can be remedied with the preamp. Not to mention humbucker mode and countless other tonal variations with individual pick-up control. I will take a couple M5s with different strings and pocket the rest. Sire rules!!
I hate to admit it (a $6000 instrument price tag is hard to imagine), but the Fodera sounds significantly better to my ear. The Sire is surprisingly good though.
Not sure what your ears are hearing? I just had mine cleaned & I don't hear a $6,300 dollar difference between them. I would buy the Sire & A bunch of accessories
Has more Puch fodera
In my opinion I like the sire better cuz it brings out more tone and clarity to what your playing
I was surprised at how much the same they sounded. I think the Sire has a brighter sound. I don't have the wealth for top instruments so I would go for the Sire.
I agree
That must be the right choice
Imagine in a mix, any unique nuances get lost you wouldn’t be able to tell which ones which
Yeah I kinda wish there was a comparison with the m7 as well
I just got an m7 a few weeks ago. Vids to come :)
LowEnd my brother. I would not spend the money for the Fodera, its insane. I would still take the Sire regardless of price. That is my two bob. Enjoyed, thanks.
It entirely depended on the setting which I preferred. Sometimes there was a small difference and others were a lot more noticeable. Sire seems cleaner. Fodera has some nice boom, but it makes it muffled at times and seems lacking in brightness or high. I'm kind of meh on it. I think, even excluding price, that I'd prefer the sire. I'd love a blind test.
When you roll the passive tone control off it reduces the treble and fattens the tone. That's how they are supposed to work. The Sire PTC didn't do that, which is not how that feature is supposed to work. That thin, brighter sound tends to not cut through in the mix as well. If you play alone, NBD.
@@Brad5161 I think it's because there is an issue with that control on the Sires. Lobster changed a capacitor on the p10 which helped if I'm not mistaken.
Yup, I didn't swap the cap on the m5
@@LowEndLobster Do you think it's necessary on the M5? I'm likely going to get an m5 soon and if it makes a good difference I might swap out capacitors if it's easy enough to do.
Yeah, it'd be worth experimenting with some different valued caps to see which sounds best
In general the Fodera sounded a little fuller but definitely not so much better to justify the massive price difference 😬
Does it seem to me that on Fodera you can't hear the treble at all?
At least in my headphones it sounds very clogged compared to sire, from marcus miller the sound is much more pleasing to the ear...
especially in parallel mode
Fodera sounds good only with 100% tone
Kudos to Ken for allowing his bass for review! 👏🏼 I would take the Fodera all day long. Having said that, the Sire is a fine instrument. What I have noticed over the years of comparisons like this, the challenger generally sounds very good. In many cases very close, even better on occasion! However that is only part of the equation. The feel, quality and pride of ownership of wanting a boutique (expensive) instrument is what it is. A Honda will get me from A > B but so will a Porsche. The rush and rev of stepping in the gas pedal of either will get you up and go…. but I would argue a vastly different “feel.” If you have the means and desire for a Fodera, go for it. If you don’t or want a more budget offering, you are gonna get a phenomenal bass 🖤 Good job, LEL. Keep on pinchin’ 🦞
As a fellow german car enthusiast (and current honda driver), I love your car analogy. Great comment BP!
Thanks. Was the second of my basses I sent Lobster. He does great reviews! The first bass of mine he did was that Crews Maniac Sound Fretless five string.
@@bassclef1962 I like your style and generosity, Ken. 👍🏼
@@LowEndLobster Thx Lobster! Keep on keepin’ on… Fahrvergnügen!
Both sound good (given the choice, I'd definitely take the Fodera, though). The Sire body shape reminds me of the old Tobias look. As usual with Sire... it's too bad about the totally wonky headstock shape. Someone at Sire has a thing for ugly headstock shapes. Makes me want to grab my wood rasp. :-(
Thanks Chris! I agree, there's some major Tobias/MTD influence with the Sire M series. I actually have an M5 vs MTD 535-24 comparison coming in the near future :)
Sire making a statement here!
Can't really compare the man-hours and quality of materials put into a Fodera, but i think the Sire did pretty good for the cost.
Nevertheless, what we can get out of this vid is a) you get what you pay for and b) Sire might be new to the game but only a matter of time till they establish themselves as more than just a budget brand
Great video as always, and I have that exact same shirt. Thanks for repping the Rush swag and making some of the best bass content on UA-cam.
Thank you Chris!
Thanks for the re-view. I saw a M7, from Sweetwater, marked down for a minor chip of the finish at the top of the headstock. After a simple ask I got it for less than the price of the M5. Just got t today. A great bass. This is my second Sire. The other being a V7 G2 jazz bass. Great tone but weighs a ton.
Which is your go to bass?
Thanks for the review 🦞, I ordered an M7 but when I got it, the Active mode was dead so i had to send it back but thanks to your M5 videos I'm going to get me a M5 instead since they sound and look the same and will save me a good chunk of money. This Fedora - M5 shootout sealed the deal for me.
Good review,very thorough and informative, and that bass riffs were funky cool
The Sire M5 and M7 are my favorite basses in the sire lineup.
The U5 would be my next.
Amazingly close in tone. Thanks for bringing the M series Sire back to people's awareness.
I’m often surprised by how well the inexpensive instruments do in these videos. But not this time. The Fodera sounded obviously better to me. I used a stopwatch to keep it honest and every time I checked, the clip with superior sound was the Fodera. Don’t get me wrong, the Sire is no slouch but was completely outclassed by the Fodera. Wish I could afford one. YMMV
The Fodera has everything you could ask for in a 5 string basd except the price.
Sire seemed a bit brighter, while fedora was clearer. I wonder how much of that is Alinco2 (fodera) vs sire's spicier alinco5/ceramic pickups
The Fodera is an undeniably incredible instrument but the MM in single coil mode with both pickups sounded plenty good to me. Good comparison video!
Thanks Lobster man.. I really do like the sound of the Sire..
The Sire M5 doesn't have as much bottom however seems to cut through more. I'm leaning towards Sire as per this review. Great job!!
I would love to see a video of a before and after plek job on a "good" bass like this Sire.
The Fodera stood out in single coil and series mode, having more clarity and fullness. Other than that they were quite even. You can play a Sire without worrying about dings. The Fodera not so much.
Fedora sounded more clean and slight better lows and highs. also the sire pickups were buzzing which was my biggest pet peave. But the site for the price is not bad but fedora was better. The fedora in my oppinion is very overpriced bass. I’ll go with a $2000 MTD bass over the $6000 fedora.
Law of diminishing returns methinks... just depends on preference and wallet-size!
To me this turned out to be a very apples to apples comparison based off pickups and electronics. I had to look at my phone to know which bass I was listening to. To me the Sire is the clear winner on this test as it has all the tone of the Fodera at a fraction of the cost. Do not get me wrong, the Fodera sounds amazing but I’m this comparison the Sire was not too different sounding from the Fodera. The Fodera had a little more vintage tone as it seemed a little warmer and smoother sounding. In a mix it would be harder to tell the difference but soloed or in the studio the Fodera I feel would shine more. So for me the Sire wins as overall best value but if $ was no issue then I would probably go Fodera. Great video and still hope you put it up against your MTD next.
Oh it's coming! I gotta drop the MTD review first, because I mention "check out my full review linked below!" ahahaha. LEL does not like plot holes ;P
Have you not done a full review of the MTD yet? I thought you did already. I know you did a comparison with it. I guess you better lock yourself in the dungeon and get to work, lol.
@@LowEndLobster Hey Roger.....
Or what your real name is...... 😀.
Maybe you can show the basses in the mix.
If money was no issue, you could simply get both 😎
@@francoissingcaster7509 the owner of the fodera also has an M5 that he loves. Dude has great taste in basses
Great video! I like the way you did one sound then the other as quickly as you did!
Surprisingly the Sire was not only up for the challenge but I preferred it!
I’m considering one and this is a big help!
I thought the Fodera pulled away from the Sire. Particularly in bridge only pick up. The Sire is up there for it’s price though.
little more heft in the low end and bridge p/u on the Fodera, more zing/bit of mid growl even tone rolled down on the Sire. Great reviews as usual dude
They do sound very similar but the fodera does sound a lot more full than the sire on the low end. This video probably convinced me to grab the sire. Fodera's price ranges are aligned akin with Warwick NT line's but man spending 5-7k on a fodera and not having it be neck thru seems like such a waste :
I have the Sire M7 and I love it… I did have to clean up some scratchy fret ends but now it plays like a dream. I’m assuming that you wouldn’t have fret issues on a $6000 Fodera , but I’ve never played one… that being said if you like the Fodera sound so much you can always swap your pickups and preamp and still save yourself thousands 🤷🏽♂️
until you switched to parallel mode I couldn’t hear a ton of difference in my truck stereo that sire looks like a good deal
Interesting apples to oranges video. In my opinion, I'd say the Fodera is a little more warm and even sounding. And the M5 is a little snappier.
You are exactly right. At least to my ears.
The thing that sets these basses apart must be craftsmanship and QC. The Sire stacks up on every level IMO, and tbh I prefer the bite/edge and definition of the Sire's tone, and while the Fedora is smooth, it's tone doesn't stand out to me as particularly better. Great show!
Thanks Dave!
I hope you dedicate a full episode to that awesome RUSH 2112 t shirt! Maybe a surprise Skype from Geddy Lee....👍😁.
The dream! haha
@@LowEndLobster Lol... "The Elusive Dream"......👍😁
I decided to get an 5-string M5...it's great, no complaints at all whatsoever...on a side note, I have a Tune TWX51 Casiopea that was my go-to forever, a really excellent, underestimated, rock-solid and versatile bass, but when I heard the M5 and saw what it could do, I had to get it...and I'm not disappointed at all, the M5 is definitely fine dining on a meat and potatoes budget...
Both sound great. I’m sure the build quality and feel are quite different.
The Fodera sounds so much better, especially in the lows. That's what I think is an important part of a bass. How is this in comparison to a Fender Jazzbass?
Nice video Doud
I noticed that not that much different with sounds but I just have to say that I found a little default with sire that there's no enough space to play slaps my hand always touch the volume parameter
But I like it it's amazing 🤩
The Fodera sounds so sweet.
This video got me thinking: the biggest difference between these two is that one has an extra string.
Have you considered (or already done?) a side to side comparison between "the same" bass in 4 vs. 5 string models? My bet is that they should sound pretty different...
The Sire sounds sharper and more crisp, on most of the settings and a lot more budget friendly🎸🔊
Sire sounds fantastic, and I bet it plays just as nice! It would be my pick here clearly
Great comparison. Aside from the esthetics Sire is a winner. But the looks, as we know it, is very important 😀
I always wonder why reviews do not mention the often annoying things about basses like dead spots, wobbly B- and E-strings (visible on tuners), accuracy of tuning gear in combination with the nut, the action close to the nut (which can influence the tone on the first frets).
Well - good comparison^^ - overall (if money is not the point) I would go for the Sire M5 in parallel with both humbucker and Single Coils - just for the neck/bridge single-humbucker parallel mode I would go for the Fodera 🤷♂ - "Slap Mode" both are great. But especially the single coil mode on the Sire M5 beats the Fodera imo 🤷♂.
I think tone-wise the sire holds its own…but the slight string buzz on the M5 was hurting its sound when the tone control was open. The Fodera tone was butter throughout. But not $10x better…
Totally impressed by this comparison and even more impressed that Sire could fare so well against such a pro level instrument.
I expected as much. They're both on the generic side, not like a Ric, Fender P or J, MusicMan Stingray. Alembic or other basses with stronger, more distinctive personalities
Great video but it would have been fairer to Sire to have a 5 string bass on both sides. I have a 5 strings Sire M5 and it sounds really good, with a great low B (35 inch though) ! But both basses in this test sound great to my ears, but with the Fodera costing 9 times more, you need deep pockets to get one.
5-string basses has more mass on neck and I say that 5-string basses has usually more resonant and bigger sound than 4-string basses. Fodera sounds bigger and has more low end but 5-string Sire M7 sounds probably as big and fat. Sires are great basses. Thanks Lobster. Great videos.
The Fodera had just a little bit more meat in certain settings, as far as tone, when the Fodera had 0 tone it sounded really dry. Both basses sounded really nice with humbucker/ single coil settings. Sound wise the Fodera didn’t prove that it was worth the extra $6000 in cost. For my money I would purchase the Sire bass.
The beginning the Sire 5 giving the buzzy fret sound the Fodera no extra sounds interference.
Fodera should provide a "Guard Dog" with the bass when you buy one. Lobster, Thx for the review.
Well Marcus Miller plays a fedora emp on joe samples ashes to ashes album, I kinda thought that the M series sire bass was a attempt to have a fedora sound cause Marcus plays one
It sounds like the Fodera has a hotter output and UA-cam has compressed the higher output of the Fodera so it sounds fuller with more low end.
Hi Lobster! may I ask U the action on that Fodera? the low B is at 2.5mm? 2? 3? thank you so much
Hey Michele! I don't really measure the action like that
Oh man. I wish I could afford a Fodera. Victor Wooten is the man.
can you review yamaha motion B (Humbucker)
Fodera sounds a bit fuller here, but there's more total variation between two sets of strings then there is between these two basses.
The fodera has a more shaped low end and the mtd has mid high range bite. But it may be that the wreck hope 5 is just roundly better for fingerstyle than everything out there. Less pronounced tone but better on both the high and low ends.
Am I losing it or is there a fair bit of compression happening?
Yeah it's built into the amp. It has its pros and cons but overall I've been satisfied with the sound quality.
In my low opinion, I perceive a much higher sound definition in Fodera. the Sire has a more "rough" sound and the Fodera more "velvety". And by the way... nice shirt, Mr.Lobster!
love the singles of the fodera but i like the parallel of sire better
The sire sounds hollow.
Are you putting a small amount of reverb on the bass now?
I had an M7 5 and a 6 string , actual series...Phantastic made basses, but I do not like the preamp , those from the V 7 Jazzbass series is way better in my opinion , the actual heritage is way to harsh , to much on the treble side ,bass is 0 or full without any nuances and these double blade pickups are a bit strange in the higher register, compared to my aguilar superdouble.eg...So a great bass to optimize with your favourite preamp and pickups , and you have to spend maybe 1000 up to 1500 for a lately pro bass ...Handcraftship is great anyway .
best bass channel!
This is one more reason to as Frank Zappa said: “shut up and play!” Either one of these basses will allow you to make music just fine. If you don’t a have Fodera budget, don’t sweat it!
💯
Great video as always amazing content but maybe even better is your shirt! RIP Neil Peart!
I see Tom Hamilton occasionally plays a Sire M7, as well as his G&L's.
I read in a Forum that the fodera is almost exactly in playing and sound to the ibanez prestige 5005. Do hoy think its true?
No
@@LowEndLobster i trust you lobster but what do you think of the ibanez sr 5005 ? Im thinking of buying that bass
I don't think its to surprising I prefer the Fodera 99% of the sound tests but the fact that sire can produce an instrument that can hold its own with such an expensive higher end instrument is more impressive to me. I could never afford a fodera but I would never think a sire bass would hold me back tonally looking at the difference in price and availability sire is an awesome bass!
Since I can't even afford the Fodera, getting the Sire is a no-brainer. Sire basses are NO JOKE!!! The Fodera sounds really good but I really like the Sire, which seems to have more presence and punch to my ears and a KILLER SLAP TONE!!!
I love Sire more on this comparison, but I think where Fodera really shine is on low B string.
Agree with LowEndLobster, the Fodera is definitely in a league of its own but the SIRE M5 sounds very well.
I liked the Sire bass more. I have something against an instrument in that price. The Fodera may be a better bass (I'm sure it is) but I could never justify paying that much for one. With 7000 I could buy several quality basses.
The Fodera sounds way better, no question. . But does it sound 10 times better then the M5? I think not. Design wise, the Form factor of the M5 looks much better.
I would assume that if you put great pickups on the sire, it would be no difference at all soundly speaking. The feel would be surely better on the Fodera but for the budget... Sire kills.
I did not really think they sounded the same at all, I love Sire but that Fodera sings - It has a mellow punch to it that the Sire could not get to - That said just like anything unless you hear them side by side you would not really comment on it.
I don't know if I could ever comfortably leave the house with a Fodera. If I had one I'd also get a Sire to take to gigs!
To me the Fodera is a little warmer and the Sire sounds a little more modern HiFi. If you can afford the Fodera, just get them both. If you can only afford the Sire, get that and play the hell out of it, as long as you are playing!
i could buy all 4 of my basses for the price of the fodera. my carvin lb76 ,carvn bb76 ,gibson eb5. ,gibson lpb-2 and have $$$$ left over to buy a killer ampeg
My specialty is finding good quality inexpensive basses and upgrading them. If you add up the cost of all eight of my current basses, you still don't reach the cost of the least expensive Fodera, well maybe a used one, which would be okay, but I have more of a tonal range with my choice of eight, than I would have if I only had one Fodera. BTW, contrary to the myth, even Fodera uses CNC on some of their basses, not all of them are completely hand made. I too have Carvins - a fretless 6 string LB76pf with a piezo bridge, a fretless LB75pf also with a piezo bridge, and an all Koa 4 string LB70 which I upgraded with an Audere preamp. Both Carvins have Tone Capsule preamps. The 5 string also has a GraphTech/Hipshot Ghost Saddle bridge. I also use SIT strings on just about everything, but I have La Bellas on the 5 and 6 string Carvins. Wonderful tone from all three - total cost under $3000 with mods.
sorry but... definitely Fodera man :) Well done, sire, but Fodera is on another level in its class. very very good and rich-sounding bass, sire is not even close, but I think some modifications can make it closer, but not much :)
If you can afford it and you like it then you buy it. Does everyone who has a Rolex Submariner have to be a professional diver? No. Every time someone buys a beautiful, boutique instrument built by master luthiers the world benefits - there's one more thing of beauty in the world and a great company makes some money. One thing I do know is that the more I love an instrument the more I want to play it, price doesn't come into it - the loveliest bass I ever played was a beaten up Ibanez Blazer from the early 80s.
Technically, the Fodera doesn't have a Parallel mode - it's a switch between Single Coil and Dual Coil, the other switch is Active/Passive. That's not a true comparison to the Series/Parallel/Split switch... a fair comparison would be to perform a test singe vs. single, dual vs. dual.
Dual coil is parallel.
@@LowEndLobster Series v. Parallel has to do with how the pickups are wired. Single Coil vs. Dual Coil on the Fodera is the number of coils engaged on the pickup. It would have been better to compare single vs. dual coil to do a proper comparison.
In a dual coil humbucker the coils can be wired in series or parallel (or you can isolate one for single coil). The fodera's dual coil mode is parallel.... Otherwise it'd be in series... And it's not.
I think in this case I might want to play the two basses before I made a choice.
I'm shocked to say this....but for about 75% of the tests, I preferred the Sire.....that was NOT expected.
Liked the Sire better
Like the sire better.
Clearer more modern sounding.
The price of an instrument do not make it better only pricier.
If someone like to play alone, in his home, that is one thing, especially for the bass. In the band, it's totally different situation. Sound of McCartney's "Beatle bass" is awful soloed, BUT, with the band - totally different story! My old begginer Yamaha rbx 200, sound better to me soloed, then my (Chinese) Warwick $$, but, with the band - totally different situation. $$ gives the big bottom, and open space for other instruments to shine.
Not just Sire there are many a much cheaper basses that sounds better than or just as good as a fodera. With fodera you’re paying for the brand and the ‘handmade-ness’
Great job..
sires definitely cool v7 sounded as good as if not better than my fender ultra.
I can’t justify the fodera
Dollar for dollar a 4-5-6k dollar Warwick smokes a 7-10k fodera
Just because they have high rent
And lack cnc equipment charge a fortune doesn’t make bass sound better. Pete Hilton bass nicer than all of them!!!!
M5 sounds like photos taken with a lo-fi filter. It still sounds good, but Fedora sounds more raw and open, I would call that "in-the-face".
What a jip from a Boutique Guitar Co. There's not a significant difference between them to me to justify the price gouging cost. I can see someone like Stanley Clarke paying what he pays for his Boutique Alembic Bass because when you hear it you definitely know its Stanley. I wouldn't be able to single out who would be playing either of these
My wife said the upper horn on the Sire looks like a banana, and now I can't unsee it. Sires are an awesome value but I find their aesthetic design...questionable at times.
Sire outperforms Fodera here on every level. Frankly I don’t think any Fodera sounds that great.
Sire is not better but you never though there is a $6.000 USD difference between them