Mitsubishi HVAC At My House - Full System Tour
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- Опубліковано 6 вер 2024
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Purchased: August 2023 - still works GREAT!I ua-cam.com/users/postUgkxxsUnXhGsSJLim_XnMHyQK0u3XVaW-CGn live in a studio and during the summer it gets scorching hot - really old building with no ac units. I can’t express how EASY it was to install. This unit has been a life savior during the summer and some days during other seasons where it can still be a bit warm at night. In this small place is my friend, a husky, poodle mix and myself. We need AC - lolI don’t use the dehumidifier option - I’m not sure if it will leak in my house, since I did not install the small draining hose that came with it. May look into it late but I don’t worry about much humidity in the apartment. I don’t understand why the negative reviews since all things mentioned, I personally did not find issues with. Definitely worth it!
All ac's condensate. If yours came with a drain designed to be exiting your house, you'll need to install it or, a leak will appear one day, sooner and not welcomed as no one desired to confirm my words. If it happens don't feel too bad though, the solution is known, allow it out. Then get ready or, make a way possible for it to be flushed/clean every 6-8 month, if possible install it a flow switch or two, in case one fails the other may work as a rescue, to avoid the unwelcomed drain overflown or drain failure or clogged due to the nature of the system. Again, don't get frustrated or mad. What I tell you is what many don't bother to do tell you because of all the reasons implied. Hope you get this. If not, you will! Any questions just ask. I'll try to help.
This is my profession but on the commercial scale. This nice lady knows her stuff. Good video, and very accurate HVAC information. No errors 👍
People, Engineers are at the hart of best practices. Matt’s home proves that we can’t “wing it” any more so please don’t ignore knowledge input in building systems. The costs have been going down and customers are more educated.
This woman is amazing. Thanks again for all the info.
As a HVAC technician, I don't recommend mini split from repairing aspects. Many of control board and connector are proprietary parts. Which it increases repairing time and costs. In ur case, it is okay since u have central AC to help if ur mini split got problem. (FYI, what I know as a technician in Houston that most of HVAC supplies to support central AC system. Think about mini split as Tesla and central ac as Toyota, u might not able access proper part for Tesla, but u can go any store to get Toyota parts.)
I agree here- definitely need a robust warranty where parts are available and/or manufacturer or distributor are quick to replace vs repair when parts are not available
That sucks man, what makes have you run into that didnt have parts readily available? In east TN between the few supply houses around I usually only have to wait on parts for older equipment. I've only really seen Mitsu's, Fujitsu's, and LG's minisplits though so there's a lot I have no experience with. Never had any issue getting parts though, they seem to be either on the shelf or trucked in within hours at the suppliers we buy the units from. Cost, meh, you're probably right that parts can be more expensive. That said, my opinion is that it's insignificant and maybe not even a fair comparison. Parts are only notably more expensive compared to cheaper(lowerSEER) and older equipment, comparing parts to other high efficiency equipment shows little difference.
@@paulmasoner8073 I am hardly running to mini split in Texas. As we know everything is big in Texas, so AC. I mean mini split is so unpopular even store sells the unit but they didn't stock the parts (such as control board, compressor or condenser motor) the store told me they hardly sold a mini split therefore they don't store those parts. if u need it, they will special order the replace parts. I mean I rather shop from amazon for those parts with 2days free shipping instead order from store. yes, u can replace some of parts with after market parts but not every parts.
@@jie1379 I’m in Texas and yes mini splits are not the majorly but VRF heat pumps are getting very popular, one outside unit and multiple indoor units is definitely the way to go.
@@TheJPPowell u might need to consider that multiple evaporator coils will increase chance of refrigerant leakage. I would not recommend my customers that. Instead of that, I would rather recommend one central ac with multiple zone, so there only has one evaporator coils. For long terms, you won't suffer to troubleshoot which coils is leaking refrigerant. (Since we adopted R410a, I noticed evaporator coil get leakage more often by comparing with R22 system.)
My goodness, so many systems for a residential setup. Just the electrical service alone would require an entire subpanel with breakers for the numerous compressors, hvac units, dehum and fresh air systems. It'd be nice to see some cost $ and projected years to recoup vs conventional 2-zone single compressor setup. Few people can go to town like this with a sponsored setup.
The electrical load is less than you think. Usually, you just home run everything from the main panel to a disconnect. His dehumidifier is on 120v. The ductless systems use less amps than traditional systems, 2 pole 20 amp or 2 pole 30 amp. You only have a breaker for the compressor. The head units are powered from the compressor by either 12/3 or 14/3 i think. I can't remember what I used for my (2) 3 zone systems.
@@believerscc incorrect with city multi
All city multi indoor units run there own single phase 230v line.
The amps are so small on VFD units like this.
to brake even with, that system close to 10 years guarantee, also depends what climate r u living in
Yeah HVAC is fun and all, but hold up... job site coffee machine?
I was really hoping he'd spend a good minute on that.
I see it on Homely Depot’s site. Also available in Special Ops Black. 😆
I have one. It’s great.
Pros:
Uses K cups so it’s easy to find pods for.
It’s fast as shit.
Cons:
It has to be plugged in. I keep it in the truck where I can plug it in anywhere.
It also only makes like 3 cups before needing to be refilled.
Jeremy, how tall of a container can you fit into the opening?
Right
My 20 y/o DFW house has 6k sq ft under HVAC coverage. Finally finished 2 yr project replacing 5 complete HVAC systems zones and 2 tankless hot h2o systems, $75k new roof and $30k in JW replacement windows.This year is backyard refresh time with pool and pool house renovations, privacy fence replacement and resoodding dogs side of yard.
Could have built a brand new 2500 sq. ft. home.
The showcasing of the mid static unit is what sold me on installing a multi zone mid static at my home. We have 540 sqft, and are going to be adding another 575 sqft. I chose a Pioneer brand because it’s diy friendly, and I can install it myself as well as the fact that I can install the air handler for the existing structure now and install the air handler for the addition in a few months to a year when we make it to that phase in the addition.
I know next to nothing about HVAC, but I taught myself just enough to be dangerous and install my own unit. Thanks for doing videos like this Matt, I’m always learning something.
Glad to see USA slowly moving into the 21st century in the residential HVAC deployments :). In continental Europe and Asia Mitsubishi and Daikin are deploying even more advanced equipment with multiple internet connected units and sensors, and even hybrid geothermal pump based multi-split systems.
Matt Risinger is doing a good work out there. He's not only lowering your costs, he's also lowering emissions and your carbon impact, no matter if you care about it, or not.
It's absolutely infuriating how slow we are to adopt new tech out here while all the regressive idiots scream how we're number one. There are people in the comments here whining about how they only recommend the tired old single zone ducted systems they're used to because [insert scary possibility about new thing here].
Brilliant channel. I'm from the UK where these units have been pretty standard for some time. What amazes me when I go to the USA is how powerful the air con is. Everything is full pelt. I go to Disney and the shops all have the doors open and the sidewalk is cold because of the cold air spill. Really loving this channel I am obsessed with air con and am always up in my loft as my home is air conditioned with the same units your using in your attic space.
Disney is in Flordia UK is cold and more north.
Here in north Georgia it would be really nice to have a whole house dehumidifier that just ran automatically as needed. Might be 75 out but 90% humidity and it feels sticky without the a/c.
Minisplits like the system he put in have variable speed compressors and fans. Beat the pants out of any dedicated dehumidifier since you can just put the system in dehumidification mode and as it does the cooling it also optimizes for maximum dehumidification. Very efficient! I was planning to put a minisplit in my master bedroom just for dehumidification but now I may be moving so I nixed that. But if I was staying in Virginia I would put a few strategic minisplits for alternate cooling/dehumidification vs. a dehumidifier any day.
Did your HVAC contractor adjusted the settings on your control board? If you still have your manual, you can adjust the fan speed to reduce the CFM and optimize dehumidification. Since I run a portable dehumidifier in the basement, I haven't asked to have that setting done on our air handler.
@@DocNo27 there is no doubt that Matt did install the whole house (or ducted zone) de-humidifier.). It will often run to dehumidify even when no cooling is needed.
You can see the ultraire right there
Would love to hear about the ductwork tradeoffs and how you came to the decision. I love the vibration isolation detail but would’ve liked that unistrut to be parallel to the ground, you can tell those springs could catch on the sides over time.
I was just thinking the same thing that screw with the spring cap is already touching the unistrut
Totally! I was having a hard time concentrating on what was being said because I was like, "What happened here? That iso is going to need to be changed out as soon as the system gets powered up the first time."
@McNea The inverter/zoning technology for central a/c systems has been out for quite a while now, but their proprietary controls for each manufacturer seem to still have issues from what people say. If they could get that under control or agree on a standard, I think there would be more adoption of it! Even the existing systems (Trane) can also have small zones since it can control the compressor speed like the mini splits, and even have zones that can "participate" if they're too small to run alone. Though I don't know how the system would be affected if you have a long duct run. Also, in other countries, do you think the cost of mini splits is a lot less since it's pretty much the norm there? They don't seem to care as much about having visible units on the wall like we do here in the U.S.
Episodes like this are honestly more valuable than the architectural engineering courses I took in college.
I found that most things in life are haha
There is an error. It's a minor one that can cause costly damage in the future. Where are the Secondary drain pans with flow switches. If those systems primary drain lines gets clogged, all of the water that is coming off the evaporator coil will overflow in the primary drain pan and leak through any cracks that water can find and will ruin his ceilings causing him to make costly repairs that could have been avoided had he put a secondary drain underneath those systems.
secondary drain pan underneath those systems.
Matt, I have a good Mitsubishi ductless system. I had to replace a 30 year old system, my roof at the same time. My electricity usage went from 500-600 a month here in California down to about 150-250 a month during the peak summer last year. one of the nice parts is the system has a dehumidifier built in
What part of CA? I am considering it in Sacramento, seems like the climate is mild enough for the heating of a standard mini-split.
@@grantrobarts Placerville
in a forced-air system we have one fan that pushes the conditioned air around the home. the air is circulated, pushed and pulled all around the home with just one piece of hardware. Now we want to install a fan and air handler in each room. All installed at the same time, so expect to have to replace all the units at the same time. But now you have the cost of replacing 8 units, not just one. And you will need to do that work in the homeowner's living area and not the equipment room.
It's like installing a small water heater under each sink?
You live in Austin TX - on avg, it’ll be 100 degrees daily, from July to Sept.
Just what i was thinking! Round rocks hot!
If you think about the actual time that it is 100 degrees, it is only that hot from like 10am to 6pm (and that is generous). That is still 1/3 of the day, 2/3 of the day would be under.
I agree though, the 1%-of-the-year is a low estimate but the actual % of time during the day is probably not as much as most imagine.
Use smart tiles that regulate moisture passively as decoration on some walls ... like that no issue with moisture. They absorb moisture from the air when it's too humid, and release moisture back into the air when it's too dry, passively without you needing to do anything else.
After a quick look, I'm not sure why you comparing "Smart Tiles" to HVAC/Dehumid/Air treatment system. This is not that you can compare, at least I don't understand. For me its like comparing a bike with an aeroplane, which is faster or can carry more passengers.
I installed a 3 ton Mitsubishi hyper heat system in my house- love it. I was going to use a ceiling cassette however the installer talked me out of it. The drain lines are a high maintenance item if you're not going purely gravity. The cassette units rely on a pump for the condensate, and you often end up with either leakage and/or mold in the lines. He said he'd install it but every time he does it he has to come back for those reasons.
Overall this is an amazing system and extremely efficient. Super quiet and I'm extremely happy with it over the last couple of years.
You’re installing contractor is absolutely unqualified on mini-split condensate pumps. If you can’t find the right pump, reply here and I will post the link to the right pump.
I thought the pump is Original Equipment, ie built in.
With a vertical loops in you're lineset can create a oil trap. If you don't want to cut the lineset shorter make the loop horizontal so the oil won't be trapped.
The lines weren’t connected yet
Kimberly should’ve mentioned that by ACCA manual J standards you’re not allowed to size your main AC system for specific events, hence the extra unit with sidewall grilles. Also not allowed is tying the garage system when it has ducts to the living space, not just because “it’s a big no-no”. I have clients and even worse, HVAC contractors that want to do this on a regular basis.
This being said, I don’t see why you’d need a separate condenser for the garage unit if it’s a different head.
Makes my 70's rancher with high effieciency natural gas down draft look like a Ford model A
Kimberly knows it and explain it clearly. I'm taking notes along the video, although just for general knowledge. Great detailed episode Matt.
17:22 Matt... I love how you are talking about system reliability and possible failure and what not. As you tug on the line sets.
Just saying. 😁
Ask Mitsubishi how long it takes to get the necessary replacement parts on these S series units... I am on week 11, for an inverter board on a unit. It's ok, customers don't mind waiting 3 months for repairs. Oh yeah, Trane cannot get the parts easily, because they are co-branded and part numbers are different.
It’s not even hooked up.
@@DaveVanWest Every Mitsubishi certified distributor has more than adequate replacement modules. Only work with them.
Having some humidity issues in my South Texas home, and boy, have I learned some things from this video. Thanks for everything you do @Matt Risinger
Check out rough in boxes for your ductless heads for new construction and titan airex boots on all systems, a little cleaner install. We use Ruud Inverter systems on all our high end custom homes with Ultra Aire dehumidifiers and Fantech whole house hepa filter systems. I also install ervs controlled with voltage sensing relays wired into exhaust fans and stand alone makeup air systems for kitchen hoods to keep a positive pressure on the house. Most people are surprised how much better air quality they can have in their home with a little extra time and planning. Educated builders are key to this, I have a select few custom builders I work for in central texas that are educated and don’t mess around. Good luck out there, stay safe and done sell yourself short.
thank you to all participants, Current, Past and FUTURE Videos
Its always Great to View Various Industry Experts in that Particular Business Sector as a Speaker
= FOR Sharing the knowledge
most helpful
wow. Kimberly is impressive! she made this clear and easy to understand. I wished you or she explained a little bit better how it works when you have more than one indoor unit hooked up the one compressor. Also, one advantage you both didn't mention a mini split has is, that you dont have to run ducts thru the upstairs rooms to cool the lower floors, specially now that the builders start building multi floor houses.
That's what the purpose of the variable refrigerant valve is they discussed early on in the video.
Most homes have terrible ductwork that is installed by people who don't care. It's slapped together by the lowest priced contractor. High end, high performance HVAC systems can easily cost $30,000+. I love Mitsubishi Ductless systems and this is a great setup.
The few hvac installs that I don’t pick apart bad practices. From one picky hvac guy, that is a beautiful install.
11:30 No mention of thermal mass in the house to regulate a more constant temperature.
I highly recommend the Saeco Xelsis. Plumbed with a fill hose and a suction vac to empty the drip tray. I did it, it is amazing.
Mitsubishi and Daikin both have really good VRV/VRF units.
Mitsubishi is the best. That system is what my company installs every day. The one flaw you have is the type of AHU you used. Those pefyp AHU ( pancake style) are complete unserviceable. Can’t get to the coil, can’t get to the fan motor. It’s actually easier and cheaper to just replace the entire AHU. I now refuse to install that AHU and only install the cased AHU which is the PVFY style in the Mitsubishi line.
Other than that great job by you mechanical contractor.
Matt, I live in mexico, it gets really hot here in summer. The standard way to do ac is to put a minisplit unit in your bedroom, and in your living room if you have the money. Living rooms usually have fans on the ceiling.
What's your opinion on that?
Mexico homes are built with brick and concrete. There is no room for ducting and central ventilation. Mini splits are your only choice.
@@JamesG1126 makes sense!
Thanks for sharing … Can you please have a video on the importance and how the drain pipes should be connected, and how the primary and secondary drain works.
@mattrisinger Can you share a diagram that shows the VRF systems and the Zenhder system together?
A real Risinger Passivhaus in Austin should never need more than the waste heat from the refrigerator compressor in your kitchen.
Nope, he's going to duct off the refrigerator and through a diverter valve it will go outside in summer or divert into the house in winter.
So exhaust the BTUs or use the BTUs.
Or maybe he'll pipe the discharge out of the refrigerator compressor and use the high temp refrigerant to preheat the water going into the water heater.
Or.....
Its all cooling and dehumidification in a well insulated house. Heat is still required, but not the size driver
@@bobjoatmon1993 He's in so much money already, why not get a commercial unit where the compressor outside? You know he is going to get (or be given) some super expensive high end appliances.
Speaking of refrigerators, Why don't they put an ac vent behind the fridge? It would move the hot air off the condenser away from the unit.
@@greggcollins4215 probably because you want the cold air closest to where the people are so they feel it?
Great job!!! Only thing i would change is the armour flex on the line sets. K flex Titan type insulation holds up with UV much better.Especially when penetrating thru the exterior. Eventually the insulation will get hard,crack and lose its insulation factor.There goes your tight seal penetration. K flex doesn't rip when installing. Its even hard to cut with a utility knife.
When you described VRF I heard simply the explanation of what variable speed drive (aka inverter drive) can do for any system including one outdoor unit matched to one head and having it operate at variable power levels. I thought VRF is the system of refrigerant junction boxes that would allow different heads connected to the same compressor to be providing simultaneous heating to one zone and cooling to another. e.g. The refrigerant could be evaporating in one head, returning to the compressor and then condensing in another head as well as in the outdoor coil.
City Multi has this feature, but not a "regular" multi zone condenser. City Multi uses a distributor box to accomplish the heat and cool at same time. This feature would be a rare need in a residential application. My personal unit on my house is a 3 ton with 4 evaporators all on separate line set connections at the condenser. I can not heat and cool at the same time.
Matt. On the hyper heats..they come with a base pan heater on the outdoor units... I live in Connecticut I unplugged mine on all 3 of my units.. if you have them on your system unplug them... I never had a problem and I’m way up north...they kick on at 40 degrees or in defrost mode which you may only see a couple times a year..my units I installed myself, and designed based on load calculations (I used to work for Johnson Controls) Electrician by trade.... I got 5 zones and 3 outdoor units. Also mine are mounted 2 ft off the ground..also make sure you add a surge protector at each outdoor unit at the disconnect. I’m not sure you need any of this information but I learn something on every of your videos.. THANKS!
I was waiting to see the heat recovery system. Also, not much was mentioned in the fresh air supply system. How is the fresh air supply distributed on the ground floor? How would the bathroom exhaust fan be controlled? How about the kitchen extractor hood? Perhaps to be seen in the next episode!
That was covered in a previous episode ua-cam.com/video/OrG7oG8Tvp8/v-deo.html
.6, I hope the return is large enough especially with the pressure drop in that filter. Remember you need to get the air before you can supply it. Also, let's look at the supply side, I see lots of turns on the round duct, do some of them total .6 ?
My architecture office has had a CitiMulti system since 2007, along with spray foam insulation throughout. It’s an expensive system and honestly the maintenance required on it has been a little ridiculous. We’ve also worked with a college campus who has used Mitsubishi in all their buildings for nearly 20 years now.
You make me want to build a new house so that I can do things like this right. Matt, 1% of the days above 100 would be 3.65 days. We have more 100 degrees days here in Plano. Pretty sure you do there in Austin.
Yeah more like 35 average and another 100 over 85% .
I think he meant 1% of time. Not days. Surely its not 100 for 24 hours a day. It’d be a few hours in the middle of the day / afternoon.
@@jackgibbons6013 Let me introduce you to Texas, where many locations will have summers consisting of weeks of temps that never drop below 89 at night and it is 100⁰+ for 12-16 hours a day. And just as an extra kick in the gut, a large portion of the state has humidity in the 85-99% range to go with those temps.
Matt some day I would like to see a budget house built with your knowledge. I bet you could pull of an amazing build.
I agree but the cognitive dissonance for Matt might cause his head to blow up. He tried something like that for this house and you can see how that worked out.
@@davefoc he would have to take into consideration not everyone takes perfect care of ac or can afford a repair asap.
I have a 12k mini split downstairs, one 18k upstairs. Super tiny electric bills here in the Pacific Northwest for the last 5 years. And my units are Pioneer and Gree eBay cheapos.
I have lived in Japan for 13 years with those types of system. From my experience mini split systems suck. My Japanese wife loves American HVAC systems lol.
I totally agree. They are nasty and don’t have good filtration, breed mold in Florida and don’t last for long.
Those types of systems are typically older technology. The newer systems are much better and assuming you don't need a furnace, the ducted minisplit heat pump is a great option.
You should sell. (or just give your fans) copies of your plans, including all the material you use - that way we can build out own Risinger!
Can you speak to the span or distance of line-sets on mini-split systems; my understanding is that there's a cap.
I am 99% certain that the line set on this system uses a Mitsubishi Branch Box to optimize the line set length. In a house this size, line set length is not a limitation.
.6 SP is not much but it's made for proper duct systems which I would say most homes don't have and they should because with any equipment bad SP will kill efficiency. High SP restrict CFM airflow, it's easy to get low SP, or fix, but it's amazing how most HVAC installs don't even measure it, shameful.
You said all you need is your refrigerant lines and some wiring for that split unit; aren't you forgetting about the condensate drain line?
He mentioned the condensate line
If he did then I missed it
@@kevinbarry71 2:49
@@nordlands8798 you are correct, I stand corrected
Another benefit of having a multi unite system is in a power outage you can run one system (usually the most central) off of a generator without needing to heat or cool your entire home. saving on fuel and the coast of a larger generator.
The penalty you get from the fresh air ventilation on the load calculation could be way worse. Imagine if he didn’t have an ERV on the fresh air intake. That would be constant blowing 100 degree air. I wish they had described that in better detail instead of making the “penalty” sound worse than it is.
The heat gain from the fresh air intake is a known number because it is mechanically controlled. If they performed a load calc on a leaky house, they have to make an assumption about how much air is leaking in. Once the house is built and the blower door test is done, the penalty from air leaks could be way worse than the previous assumption was during the design phase. But at that point you’d have to redesign the hvac system or just tolerate an uncomfortable house.
It’s not about controlling ventilation because it sure is far cheaper to just have seepage. But a heat/energy exchanger allows you to recuperate losses and save.
Talking up ductless while standing in front of duct work 😂😂. That’s a beautiful $100,000 system though
This hvac is ridiculously over built. Complicated setups like this inevitably lead to high maintenance. Mitsubishi is not know. for their big house ducted systems. Their simple ductless are the best in the world. Matt will not be happy with the ducted system he has there, in about 3 to 5 years when the maintenance time adds up.
@@gial8862 you are sadly mistaken. The reliability of this equipment is amazing and the mixture of ductless and ducted is very common on Mitsubishi system designs for 2000+ square foot
, multilevel homes.
Ductless systems have to be coupled with ducted ventilation units. Don't criticize what you don't understand.
@@CybekCusal you clearly do not understand how mini split systems can be configured. In this case, one of these multi zone systems is a (mid-static air handlers - driven by a heat pump condenser plus refrigerant line set plus control lines. You are the clueless one.
@@meyerjeff you're right. I'll go tomorrow to forfeit my PE 😂🤣
Great video.
(Funny aside: if you set the "Quality" of this video to 480p or lower, it looks exactly like a mid-90's CD-ROM computer game video cutscene.)
The last time I looked at Mitsubishi splits the efficiency of INDIVIDUAL condensers was MUCH HIGHER... into the 35 SEER range. The multiple units that run more than one air handler topped out at around 18 SEER. Wouldn't it be cost effective for INDIVIDUAL condensers for each handler?
this HVAC system will pay for itself in no less than 2500 years
HVAC systems don't pay for themselves. They provide heat and cooling.
Bad thing about the mini split systems is the lack of availability of parts in ten years. These are through away systems. Just like the condensing boilers. Best to use traditional high efficiency Hvac units. If you need to zone, use either electronic single dampeners or manual registers
the real problem is that installers charge WAY too much to put them in or replace them. I got quotes for replacing 2 single-zone compressors/heads (keeping the line-sets and control lines) totaling $8k. instead, I paid $700 each for the units and install them myself in 2 days. I borrowed a vacuum pump, but the MrCool DIY units don't even require that. installing these things really isn't the type of job that requires $500/hr expertise. anyone who can install a garbage disposal can install mini-splits. so, in 10 years, if you can't find a control board, just replace the units. the repair guy will likely charge more to repair a mitsubishi after 10 years than a whole new unit would cost from another brand. if you're not handy, then buy Mitsubishi so that you know they'll support their products for a long time. it would be awesome if mini-splits could be installed by folk other than HVAC pros. the guy who hooks up your cable is more highly trained than is necessary for a mini-split.
I like that you hard piped all of this so important in a system like that
Matt, for the upstairs, was it cheaper to go with the ducted system instead of individual ductless cassettes in each room on a multizone compressor? If so, please explain the compelling details.
i would expect it to be cheaper, the cost of the medium static unit is not that much different than the cost of a single cassette. Really comes down to how much labor wants to charge for ductwork, but my experience has been duct is cheaper.
@Hans Wu loss in efficiency im pretty sure if he went that route.
Oversizing my friends! Mitsubishi has released notes to not oversize their equipment just like any other. Bedrooms have low loads and the smallest ductless is 6k which is way too much for a simple bedroom plus closet and bathroom.
@Hans Wu Rooms im guessing. The downstairs has more open space instead of individual rooms so its easier to heat and cool but the upstairs has all the rooms that would require heating and cooling. Im only spitballing though. Its a different beast up here where its cold over half the year
@@peteaulit , it's on the upper end for sure, but 6k should be fine for a modern mini-split to cover bed/closet/bath without being over-sized.
How Mitsubishi HVAC overlaps with the Zehnder's ventilation system? What is the ducting and supply/return locations - HVAC vs vent?
What is your service amperage to this house?
Isn’t standard residential now days 200amps? I image for how efficient this house is it wouldn’t require anything more.
@@Whatwherewhy586 200A * 120V = 24kW .. 15+16+36=57kBTU/h = 16kW of heat / cool = ~5kW electrical load from the compressors and fans at peak ... Which is tiny for a house that size good job! ... it might need more amps for cars, ovens, hot water. Is there solar and/or big LG Chem/Tesla battery there?
@@Whatwherewhy586 Just wondering what new houses are being installed with since there is more demand for electric appliances/devices. I have 400 amp to my house, attached in-law suite and Pole Barn.
@@SrdjanRosic 200A service is 240v here. Split over 2 legs/lines.
@@waynedalearchery9621 typical new house in Pennsylvania is 200 amp, 100 amp for a trailer house unless heated with electric. Higher class places with pool pumps and such might need larger services. But most middle class homes are fine with 200 amp services. A farm often needs 400 amp service, sometimes bigger.
You kill it every time... still waiting on you to build me a home.....
I'm building this spring and I found this video extremely helpful. Many thanks!! Greetings from Newfoundland Canada
You should look into adding an Air Sniper to your Air system . It's a UV light system used a lot in indoor grows, but will kill anything and if you got the cash why not. Considering it looks like a forever home.
2800 square foot house with 5 tstats, 5 evaporators and 3 condensers with vrf controls. Dude there is gonna be a service technician that is gonna really hate that house in the next 5-10years and I feel for him. You might save some money on install and power with this stuff but maintenance will be a nightmare.
Hello from the great state of Michigan
I have to ask.. im a Dutch HVAC engineer, but i don't have any feeling with BTU's and tonage. (I'm familiar with m3/h and kW)
Is it possible if you'd add metric units in either the video, the subtitels or description? It would mean a ton!
You’re an engineer and you don’t know how to convert btuh into kw ??!! It’s not that hard 1kw = 3413btu or just download a unit converter app. They don’t talk in cubic feet and btu when I go to Europe...
Exactly. Leave it to Europe to think they know better! Just itching for the States to convert to metric standards.... so strange that they are just as lazy. But they try to get the US to change...
Lol. So insular. It’s only the rest of the world that has moved on to metric.
@@peteaulit they indeed do not talk in cubic feet and btu in europe. It isn't thaught and i've never even needed to use it in my work. Only on these video's do I come across it. Since the rest of the world uses metric I thought that it would be handy for everyone who watches these videos from outside of the USA.
@Marin3r well, since the USA is on the metric system since the 19th century i wouldn't call us lazy if I where you. But I do understand why you still use imperial. And i indeed have an itch for the states to convert to metric. It would make understanding your stuff a lot easier for me.
Curious what your blower door results will be? We just got ours done at .83 ACH at -50 which explained allot. While building I Installed our master Mitsubishi 6000 BTU unit with its standalone condenser which cooled the entire 1486 Sq ft home in central Florida summer to 72 degrees then ramped down to maintain. Granted it was a small ICF house with no sound proofing or interior insulation installed and we did install the HVAC ourselves but after the math any added cost between the two different systems is payed for after 1-2 years. I’m gonna imagine if more of the good versions of VRF technology are being purchased it will drive the cost down. Granted we also installed two ERVs which added cost but were now controlling the air in. Our electric bill Dec 2020 was 50 dollars and heat of the summer was 120 dollars but we were also cooling the 38 ft Camper which rarely turned off. We’re looking forward to seeing what our true bill for just the house will be this summer.
Orlando here. Typical late 80s 1200sq ft single story, brick/stucco finish home. 1’ overhang and two 30’ Camphor trees partially covering the East and South East part of the house.
I replaced my Windows from single pane aluminum horizontal sliders to double pane horizontal slider vinyls. 8 total.
Installed a Lennox two stage cooling/heating system Dec 2013. Separate dehumidifier and UV light installed as well.
Bill is 90-100 for Fall and Winter. Spring is about 100-120. Our typical summer bill is 120-130. No credits or rebates tacked on, just general usage (700-1k Kw). Duke Energy.
I’ve been home working full time from a desktop system since March 2020 and two kids at home. Most of my lighting is LED now. I have 1-2 50” LED TVs operating at once. Small appliances when cooking. Can’t think of anything else that draws power except the water heater.
@@seagel1000 Were hoping to see summer bills around 75-80. Our daughter is still in the camper since she works at the hospital. Once we unplug the camper we will get some true numbers.
I am not a builder (and generally not a UA-cam commenter :). But I cool lots of products from peaches to ice cream. Freon, ammonia, glycol... commercial systems. I very much enjoy your videos. My concern is this: When you make these zones without "mechanically" breaking these zones with heavy insulation or even minimal barriers like a door... shouldn't we implement a control system that would communicate with adjacent zones about target temperatures, turning on air handlers, delays, cycling etc. Its complicated enough to control multiple 1:1 systems touching the same air with multiple thermostats, but the idea of controlling a $25k HVAC with a mix of 2:1 and 1:1 systems that are all* inside the same R50 super air tight envelope with 4 Nest thermostats sounds inappropriate. Those smart thermostats have delays and pre-cools and all kinds of little "efficiency" features that conflict with the modern controls in inverter condensing units. For the past 10 years I've been fixing my commercial refrigeration systems and controls is half the battle. If you put independent "smart" controls on this high-end zoned system, I see units fighting one another. I see one of those systems becoming a "lead" unit unintended. I hope the next video shows how important it is not just to insulate or select a high efficiency system, but just as important, how you control that system. Your best results would be with an engineered control system that the manufacturer is going to stand behind. 90% of the issues I had with my commercial systems were not with unit sizing or insulation, it was with the installer deviating from the designed controls.
This may be my first UA-cam comment. If you go this far, hope you enjoyed the book :)
I thought he installed a zehnder recuperator system? Is this a separate system from the zehnder?
Mitsubishi and Trane together? An odd match but one that seems to be made in Heaven! Or Tokyo at least lol Good to have options since I'm sure that for some builds a "normal" Trane install would fit better.
Daikin and Goodman are also together to catch the higher end market segment. Although I don't know if they are integrated with their distributor and vendor network as Trane and Mistu did.
Matt, why insulate the ducts in the attic if they're inside the conditioned building envelope?
I think even thought it’s within the thermal envelope it’s not necessarily “conditioned” . They’re keeping in a semi conditioned condition. Ie. not directly heating or cooling (leaks) or supplementary to get it within a target and plus I think it cuts on sound transmission
Awesome build spec, agreed to using mini splits and cassettes downstairs. Def saves from cutting holes.
What about condensation from the ductless system in the kitchen? How are you handling that?
Drains to the laundry room washer box about 6 feet over
Most ductless units have condensate pumps built in.
I'm about to start designing the HVAC system in my 150 year old 4,000sqft farmhouse. I wonder if I could get some reps to come out. It would be a great showcase project.
look into MrCool DIY multi-zone systems. aside from the electrical, which I recommend having done by a pro, you can install 3-4 zones in about as long as it takes you to snake the cables/linesets through the walls/attic. there is really nothing to it. if you're handy enough to change a light fixture and a faucet, then you're handy enough to install a DIY Multi. I have an old drafty house and the energy savings are huge because I can have a nice comfortable temperature in the rooms I want while letting the others be 10 degrees closer to outside temp. no need to cool the whole house to have a comfortable sleeping temperature.
Search google for Mitsubishi residential Hvac plus your zipcode. You will get a list of certified designing contractors. If they don’t start with a heat load study, move onto the next contractor.
Love those Mitsubishi systems. Big fan of mini splits, introduced to me when I worked in Taiwan. Awesome content!
This whole rebuild series has been a blast, Matt. Super informative.
Question for you, as a new home owner, is there a legitimate product (hardware, or otherwise) that can disperse aroma/scent through the HVAC system? (Like you’d find in a nice resort.)
One of my favorite videos yet.
Nice video
I love this idea
But
#1 :Set cassette in the kitchen, not good you will be tired change the filter
#2 Attic, no emergency drain pan ?, I know so this all seal but safety first !
#3 personally I don't like it. 2" filters
Yes typically not a good idea to put return air or mini spits in kitchens but knowing Matt I’m sure he’ll have some kind of sweet exhaust ventilation for his kitchen lol
Matt, I am installing a Toshiba VRF system in my new 2850 sft apartment, guess what the cooling load is…about 19 Tons!!! Because here we don’t use any insulation :(
Here I am with my single stage heat pump in a below average insulated house with awful flex duct for most of my duct work. :(
You probably don't have a oil trap from the copper tubing loop...
Did you do a blower door test to determine the air changes per hour as an input to mechanical design?
Thanks for the in depth review. 3 years ago I wanted the unit you have in the attic, with similar loading (360 sq ft: a bedroom and 2 baths, zone 5) but was told, by my Mitsubishi diamond dealer, that it would not have enough static pressure (I have fewer runs than you have).
Could you include all of the inputs to your manual J? Things like hot/ cold temperature for the design load. Sq ft of walls, windows, etc.
This was a great video. I really appreciate the level of detail.
They make a high static unit but the amount of duct in this video is probably to much. He talked about the manual J needs to talk about the manual D. Seriously its a book.
@@TurkeyLeggings he usually uses a professional hvac designer who knows his stuff, and does both the J and D. I just wanted to see the numbers, as I’m quite sure the lower static pressure model would have been perfectly adequate in my case.
Can you explain a bit more about the filter and clean air system setup? It would be good to know for other families with asthma or allergy problems.
Great video.. one question.. I didn't hear any discussion of humidifiers? Don't you need one of these to humidify the air in the winter? In keeping with this apparent omission, I noticed the heating load chart was missing Latent Loss (which would be heat required to add humidity in the winter). If I'm reading correctly, the Sensible Heat and Latent Heat were the Cooling Loads; and then Sensible Loss and Latent Loss should produce the Net Heating Loads.
Hey Matt. Can you please let Kimberly know that the hvac installers on their website have absolutely no interest in the Mitsubishi system. I called four from their website and all of them pushed me towards other options.
I am a Houston based HVAC contractor who specializes in installing and servicing Mitsubishi VRF equipment. Depending on your project I may be able to assist you. I have several contacts at Mitsubishi and may be able to assist you in finding a reputable contractor in your area.
Feel free to message me if you are interested.
Hi Twiin Central, please send us a message or give us a call: 1-877-311-1425. Our hours are Mon. - Fri. (8am - 7pm) EST. We would be happy to connect you with an HVAC contractor in your area.
Trusted your videos for years... all until you put cream in your coffee... ;)
Hey man, not all of us like coffee you can use as pen ink. 😂
Oh, Dude! You are talking my talk! Trane would have been my thought for an American domestic partner, and lo and behold it has come to pass! Matt, I've been a Trane fan boi for a long time; if Trane will co brand and distribute this gear, share their well built training and support, I'm in. If only I hadn't retired nearly a decade ago. But that is OK- all the local companies will have great sources for advice and training for their staffs and be well able to assure customers of quality now and five, ten or more years down the road. Awesome! And they don't even pay me money; the percentage of warrantee work was always lowest with my Trane installations- ALWAYS. That was and still is money in the bank!
I believe Trane is partnered with Mitsubishi on their own VRF systems
Just as a heads up for people watching, The installation cost on this type of system generally is more because of the amount of equipment needed, indoor units can leak water and refrigerant which can be costly, and your have alot more copper linesets with flares which are known to leak if not done correctly or can leak if contorted to much. As a contractor I go out to houses and people ask all the time about putting "Mini Spilt Units In". They have a place like bonus rooms, basements and hard to get duct to areas. Also my wife is a realtor. If they see indoor units on the wall EVERYONE asks why is that there. Its ugly can it be moved. One more side note. Instead of having 2 items of equipment to take care of when it gets older you now have many more with all the indoor units. Again I am NOT against this but consider the cost up front. They do control temp very well, humidity and efficient. As a contractor honestly I make more money off you from installation, repairs and service. Im just spilling truths for serious thinkers.
I thought the ceiling mounted cassettes needed attic access for maintenance issues....? It looks like in Matt's home it was installed between joists, isn't this a mess if there are issues with that unit?
Matt, Don't you have an ERV? Does the thermal load due to ventilation account for heat/cooling/humidity recovery?
I now see you have a Broan ERV. The specific heat of air is 0.0184 Btu/SCF°F. If you ventilate at a rate of 100 CFM, a sensible ventilation load of 3014 Btu/hr is going to heat or cool that air by 27°F. That seems about right for a 0% efficient ERV in Austin. Is there a boo-boo in the Manual J calculation?
What is the capacity of the De-humidifier? Is the Mitsubishi fan coil not sized large enough to handle the latent load and sensible load of the homes second floor? I thought inverter driven fan coils can ramp down the blower rpm for better de-humidification when needed.
Okay she just said "load pie" with a straight face...
Please share details about the materials used to suspend the equipment from the rafters
Really interesting stuff! Wish my house was as advanced. I had my house built in 2018 but the builder was not a custom builder and offered no HVAC upgrades, so stuck with a standard 14 SEER single-stage AC + single stage 92% efficient furnace (Goodman equipment). I'm having some issues with humidity control (having to over run the AC which I hate). Also, they have the house ventilating with a bathroom fan that turns itself on intermittently. Not happy with any of that.
I like how the unit in the attic is suspended from the joists to control vibration but then I see that the return ductwork is sitting on the floor... doesn't that completely defeat the purpose?
I’m hoping it goes through* the floor?
The air handler has to be suspended with a hanging kit and the ductwork doesn’t sit on the floor, it’s the return coming from below through the ceiling or the attic floor.
Yea I’m not a tech but do Reno’s and have done a bunch of systems. I usually hang from all thread and put rubber blocks between the unistrut and the actual air handle
@@richralston1705 that’s a good way to do it but rubber deteriorates over time. You can also use springs like they did here in suspending the dehum. It’s done like that in commercial applications more than residential but it’s better and not very expensive.
@@peteaulit It's hard to tell if that is a return duct coming up through the floor or a box to transition from the round duct to a rectangular opening in the air handler. Either way, shouldn't there be some sort of flexible sleeve/attachement between the box and the handler to acoustically isolate the floating handler from the box?
Does the Man-J take into consideration factors like heat and humidity generated by cooking activity and heat from appliances? Wouldn't you want more fresh air exchange in the kitchen? Great stuff!
Yes - in every load calc that is ACCA or AHSRAE certified it will allow you to click on what the space is being used for- even multiple types of kitchens bc some have two fridges vs one, range with exhaust etc, even down to how many ppl usually occupy the space- all contribute to the heating /cooling load
@@TheJPPowell Excellent.
When PA built the cabin he did a study just like this to determine the size of fireplace he would need.
Looking at that attic I was wondering if you'll be talking about how to insulate up there. Will it be a "conditioned" space itself with foam on the roof deck or other method of insulating?
Insulation is on the outside of the decking you saw in the attic space. The whole house is sheathed in insulation. Look back on Matt's YT site about a half dozen episodes of his home "remodel build".
@@fredericrike5974 Got it. Missed that one. Thanks.
@@TSGEnt I spent 35 years doing subcontract work on houses, new and remodel and also commercial work like hospitals , hotels and commercial kitchens. I have been in love with TBS since I first saw it a couple of years ago. Matt is a very knowledgeable and thorough builder- this is his house and "overbuilt" is to say the least. Enjoy- I always see or learn something new- I'm retired but I still love to see what's up!