San Martin SN004-G Limited Edition: watchdives.com/products/pre-order-san-martin-6200-retro-men-watch-sn004-limited-edition-1?variant=43041146962138 Use "WR4K" 10 USD discount code on any watch over 150 USD.
It was great to see these pieces side-by-side. I appreciate the small but significant differences of the SM that make it it’s own watch, not just a carbon copy homage. The SM case profile with champfer looks more refined (and brushing is more practical for everyday). The gear bezel and ceramic do change the feeling to more modern and a bit aggressive, while I think the o-style bracelet also refines it. I’ve recently tried on the BB58 again, but I am ultimately much happier to have the SM on wrist. It’s a long term keeper. (and I don’t have to worry about long term service costs or durability).
Ordered a blue SN004 today for $234. Didn't have a Tudor BB58 homage in my collection. Will be a nice change from one of my Sub homages for daily wear. Good review as always.
Amazing review, thank you for the detail. I’ve been eyeing the San Martin for a while thinking it’ll help me curb my desire for the Tudor. After watching this video I now know that I would rather save up and get the Tudor.
I just bought this SM Blue last week. I have a Tudor BB S&G as well. Lets be clear folks SM in that price bracket is amazing. Tudor is a class apart and they charge for it accordingly. Tudor has started giving Rolex a run for its money. Back to SM - I got the Blue limited edition last week after watching WR4K's earlier video - it has the Hex logo on crown and I am using it as my daily casual watch. Its a beauty !! And yes don't forget to use the USD10 voucher - code WR4K..
The san Martin is incredible value for money. I have a tudor bb s and g. My Mrs recently bought a san Martin 38mm 50s style submariner and it looks amazing. the build quality is not far off the tudor. My clasp on the tudor is already showing signs of wear, but her san Martin is still looking new. Your basically paying for the name , by buying a tudor. But overall the tudor is a better looking watch. value for money the san Martin wins all day long. But the tudor is the better watch, but is it worth the premium , well that's subjective too. My seiko sla043 is similar priced to the the tudor, but is better made, although people will say 4k for a seiko is silly. I say buy what you love, because it will stand the test of time. if u want a good watch for hardly any money, the san Martin is as good as it gets .
The bracelet on the Tudor looks like a came from a different watch and the cases polished sides makes the watch look cheap to me. In my opinion the brushed finish of the San Martin looks more appropriate for a dive watch but Tudor knows their customers are not using these watches for work.
Thank you for this comparison. I truly enjoyed it. Your watch reviews go above and beyond all others. As for the comparison, clearly the Tudor is the higher quality watch - no surprise there. I've always admired the BB58. I particularly like the snowflake hands, which is one reason I was drawn to the SM homage. And given the SM's reviews and quality at its price point, I think it remains a fantastic alternative for those who us who love the 58 design, but are 1) either not in a financial position to spend the thousands of dollars to get it - and even more after, to maintain it, or 2) would like to try a less costly alternative - to see if they like it well enough to eventually make the leap to the Tudor, or 3) just want to save money, and future maintenance costs, while still wearing a nice homage. The SM 004 is not a Tudor. But, it is a very nice watch with great dimensions and specs. I currently have the 004 in the black/gilt dial, but you've convinced me to get the blue version with this comparison, as well. I just placed the order with watchdives, and have used your discount code. Thank you so much for such a great and thorough review. Kindest regards, -Glen P.S. I also have a SM SN051. It too is a fantastically finished watch, and wears beautifully. I would love to see your review of that model too, should you ever be inclined.
Blue tone is better on SM, ceramic bezel better also but the size of the numbers easier to read. I own a tudor pelagos but I'm definitely interested in getting a sm as a daily.
4:39 I go through a lot of crystal changes so I learned I don't like flat-bottom crystals (like you see here on the SM). But they use proper double-domed crystals in other models.
When it comes to Rolex and Tudor - these homages make the Emperor's Clothes fall away. You will pay 25 to 50 times more for an identical watch with only a (hidden) superior movement. The expensive movement error loses/gains 2 seconds a day instead of 10 seconds. Big deal.
I picked up the blue SN006 more than a year ago,the 2nd version w/the pt5000 mvm’t, and I think the 004 is visually much more appealing ,primarily due to it’s bezel,chapter ring , and the text on it’s dial being whiter and much easier to see,whereas the 006 uses a more silver hue and the bezel markers are equally as subdued , so much that one has to strain to see them. I think seeing this one is going to ruin my ability to enjoy this piece,but I paid 300 US for it and I would be lucky if I could get 200 with the competition being around $100 less brand new. I guess I am stuck with it 😮. I hope that the movement proves worth the price
Thanks for the video. I have said before - imagine is SM put another $250US into the watch. Most small problems like a NH38, better finishing, and bezel depths would disappear. Now a $500-600US watch goes against the $3,600US+ Tudor. It does come down to what value is put on country of build.
Thank you for watching Jim. Glad you enjoyed it. "It does come down to what value is put on country of build". Agreed "Swiss Made" on the dial has value, compared to "China Made". Also Tudor has brand heritage versus San Martin without brand heritage. For many collectors brand heritage is important, and something they are willing to pay a premium for. Regards, #WR4K
I came cross your channel a few days ago and Ive been watching your review of this watch since then. I love the Tudor black bay 58 but I really can't really afford one at the moment also I don't think anyone's going to buy me one any time soon! 😂 Sounds like this could be a really good alternative. I am now, looking at purchasing the San Martin SN004 G Limited edition on watchdives. Thank you this has been really helpful. 🤔🤣
@@watchreviews4k I recieved the San Martin SN004 Limited edition, blue version. It really wears like a watch worth much more and is definitely good value for the money. I really impressed with the lume, the dial and bezel. I am now looking at another of your recommendations. The Steeldive SD 1953 (Submariner date homage) 🤔 I'm going to stop typing for now😂 Thanks again.
Fantastic and thurough review!! I've been eyeing their BB homages and your feedback makes me think their newest SN0008 G-B is the one to get. Coin edge bezel, same excellent bracelet, 40mm, only 12mm thick as its rocking a flat sapphire.
Great review! I also own both models and I think I will keep the San Martin for daily use (i really do not fancy the ceramic bezel, but it is more scratch resistant!). By the way, the Tudor is another planet...😉
Aesthetically, I don't think the gear tooth edge of the San Martin bezel works quite as well as the coin edge. It's better suited to more ruggedly designed pieces like a Helm Vanuatu for instance. If they changed the bezel to a coin edge or something less tool-ish they'd have an unbeatable watch
Still, at say, 75 percent of the level of finish of the Tudor at less than 1/10 the price... It's kind of hard to argue that Tudor is worth what they're asking. Is it a high quality watch? Absolutely. Is it a better watch than San Martin? Yes, of course.. is it 10 times better? ..... 🤔 Not so much.
Very interesting what you get for your money with the San Martin. Don’t know if there is a mod for the ceramic bezel insert to a aluminium, probably get the coin edged bezel too
Great matchup! The only improvement(s) I wish San Martin would do is to use a beveled bezel like the BB58, which would reduce the thickness of the coin edge, thereby visually reducing the thickness of the head piece. That, and increase the layers of BGW9 lume on the hands, which obviously have less layers than what they applied to the indices. Do that, and they would have the perfect 'homage' of the BB58. I'm about to order this watch, so hopefully the lume on yours is an aberration. 😁
Wish the San Martin Bezel looked more like the 58 agree the aluminium bezel just looks better in colour and finishing as does the edge, non recessed numbers i prefer too. Almost makes it look like a different watch. I actually think the aquatico sea star looks nicer and closer to the 58 despite its larger size.
On another note, i'm pleased to report that my new Cronos Kermit/Starbucks with 2.5x magnification comes with a Bezel with no Backplay whatsoever. Depending on wether you prefer a harder action your Bezel, the Cronos might now be on the same level as the San Martin submariner homage. I'm curious which is closer to a real submariner, i will compare my Cronos with the original of a friend of mine just out of curiosity. Btw., i prefer the blue on the San Martin in this video.
I'd be interested in your assessment of the Steinhart Ocean 39 Tudor homage and the Tiger Concept version as well, the Steinhart will surely retain it's value better but the Tiger Concept is superior to the Pagani version , in terms of appearance in my opinion
See my review of the Ocean 39 Marine Black below Mike. I asked Tiger Concept to send me watches for review, unfortunately they didn't reply. Regards, #WR4K ua-cam.com/video/uExRZDuAjsc/v-deo.html
What do you think the movement of the Tudor sells for? Or do they guard them against sales from other entities ? I was told as much as 1200 for a servicing on my Tudor gmt, I hate to even put words to it but why not pay for a new movement every 5 years,vs the archaic process of steaming the little pieces and parts and reassembling the whole damn thing? I still don’t know what country they are doing it in
The Black Bay GMT is due for a service every 5 years. The standard service cost is 200-500 USD at a Tudor Service Centre in America. The 200 is based on just a movement service. The 500 includes movement servicing, and fully polishing the case, and bracelet to remove all scratches. The Kenissi movements are used by; Chanel, Tudor, Norqain, and Breitling. I don't know how much the movement costs in the Black Bay GMT. Regards, #WR4K
@@watchreviews4k I was told nearly 1200 at the place I bought mine. I get how it works because I had to send mine back and it was returned to me with a black suede pouch and a little cardboard sidecar,very collectible but not worth waiting almost 4 months to get the watch back.Granted the 5 year warranty covered my complaint but it’s a system that hasn’t changed since’53
It doesn't cost 1200 USD to service a Black Bay GMT, so you were misinformed. Did yours have the common problem of the date sticking? The early ones had this problem, and they were returned under warranty to Tudor to have the movements replaced. This would explain your 4 month wait. Usually Tudor watches are serviced at Tudor service centres within America, rather than being returned to Switzerland. I am sorry to hear of your problems. Regards, #WR4K
@@watchreviews4k no mine had a little bit of condensation on the inside of the sapphire crystal and the bezel was just not right.they said they had fixed the problem with the scratches on the crystal and it was good to go! I’m going to delete this thread because I don’t want to offend anyone at the local ad’s
Very nice comparison. Did not notice if you mentioned that the hands on the San Martin are whiter than the indices. That is a little disappointing. Also I have to mention that I bought the San Martin and it has a problem with the movement. If I take a longer walk in the forest for about 1 hour and 15 minutes the watch is suddenly 30 seconds fast. I have had this problem with a Pagani Design watch. The problem is that it is very much impossible to send watches back to China for repair on the warranty. Currently I have 2 San Martins with broken winding gears in the Chinese customs and it seems that they are not getting in to China. 2 months have passed now and no news. So I think it’s kind of a lottery if one receives good movements in watches bought in China and it’s very annoying and disappointing that one in reality can not use the so-called warranty on the watches…
Thanks for the great head to head review! I was gonna buy the blue Tudor couple of weeks ago but something had me to stop buying it front of the store and I bought the SM blue dial limited edition recently but still waiting for it. Is the case design of SM similar to submariner 16610?
Thank you for watching. No, the SN004-G case is similar to the Black Bay 58. The SN008-G is similar to the 16610 case which has crown guards. Regards, #WR4K
Great review!. I'm looking at purchasing one of these San Martin's soon. As W.D's don't include custom charges for UK shipments. Roughly what did you have to pay?
The next "crisis" for Swiss watches won't be a quartz crisis like in the 1970s. It will be crisis of cheap (and good) Chinese watches. Even Chinese mechanical movements are getting quite good.
No it will not be a crisis for the Swiss. People spend 10k+ on a watch because of branding, not because they cant get a cheaper watch elsewhere. Chinese watches are and will continue to impact "entry" Swiss watches below perhaps 3k mark, but 5k and higher the Swiss will continue to dominate because no one wants "China Made" on their dial when they spend car money on a watch, no matter how good the watch is.
Thank you for watching Mike. It depends on the movement. For example Seiko NH35A movements have a plastic movement holder ring which is easy to remove and press back into the case. PT5000 movements have 3 screws and tabs securing the movement inside a steel movement holder ring which is more tricky to replace. For reference see my modified Ironwatch RX8004-B video below; I upgraded the PT5000 to a LJP G-100. Fitting the hands to the canon pinion is the most difficult part. Regards, #WR4K ua-cam.com/video/B0ViRP9ruu0/v-deo.html
@@watchreviews4k thank you for the quick reply.I am not skilled enough to attempt a swap but if it can be done for less than a full service it might mean keeping an older Seiko or two,where it made no sense previously
NH35A movements are only 27 USD on AliExpress. See link below. It isn't viable to service a 7S26 or NH35A. A movement has to be broken down, parts ultrasonically cleaned, then rebuilt and regulated; which is 2 hours labour for a watchmaker. Replacing the movement is 1 hours labour thus cost effective. 7S26 movements can be upgraded to NH35A or NH35A to give them hacking. The hands, stem, dial, are compatible. For example on a Seiko 5, or SKX007, a popular upgrade is to change the 7S26 to a 4R36 (NH36A) to give it hacking. My advice is to buy the movement yourself, then give the watch and movement to a watchmaker to change. With SW200-1, and ETA 2824-2 powered watches its more cost effective to service the movement, as its less expensive than replacing it. However Seiko movements are often less expensive than the service cost thus replacing with new is more viable. Regards, #WR4K www.aliexpress.com/item/4000545303494.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.23a05038UfRWZS&algo_pvid=fe53384c-c26a-41e3-88d4-104b01fcbe97&algo_exp_id=fe53384c-c26a-41e3-88d4-104b01fcbe97-8&pdp_ext_f=%7B%22sku_id%22%3A%2210000002798977053%22%7D&pdp_npi=2%40dis%21USD%2149.45%2127.69%21%21%214.6%21%21%402103399116622140216842207eb156%2110000002798977053%21sea&curPageLogUid=9GL0xc8laDUY
The San Martin is a very good value piece, but it just cant compete with the class of the Tudor ,for me. I think if SM made this watch with an aluminium bezel and toned down the shiny look to appear much closer to the 58 then they would have a massive winner, for me. However, they have not done this and whilst the SM is a very nice and affordable watch , its not a Tudor. This is a debate about worth not the comparison in the details. What is something actually worth? The market sets this cost, supply and demand in action. In years to come these lovely and commendable chinese knock offs willl be slung in a draw , not used, as good as they actually are. The Tudor is deemed to be. (like Rolex) intrisically special and will always have an emotional and historical ,as well as a monetary value that the SM can never hope to mimic. I don't own a Tudor. I don't like them . For me its the Boxster choice when what was really wanted was the 911. (the Sub). Although I know the presenter has sold his sub too. I sold my sub years ago and dont regret it. Its ubiquitous and according to the metropolitan police the most recognisable watch attracting watch thieves in London recently. At least your probably safe with Tudor. If im going out im taking my SM or my Cronos, They are fab watches...for me. Again, a really good comparison video that makes us all think before we sink our hard earned dosh into the 58, as nice as it is.
Thanks for this comparison, both great watches but for me the fine teeth on the bezel, the polished sides and most of all the difference in blue make the Tudor much more classier! The blue on the San Martin looks cheap like the Ford logo 🙈 this is personally the biggest deal breaker. The size is on the other hand perfect for my smaller wrist (6,5) why oh why?!😅
Hi, in my humble opinion, the san martin looks way better than the Tudor. And saying that the Tudor is finished to Rolex level, is quite an ambitious statement! best regards!
I just wish San Martin would concentrate on creating its own designs, and then you could enjoy them for what they are - rather than feeling like you’re pretending you’re wearing a more expensive watch (and even if you’re not, that’s what people will think). But, Tudor’s lineup is full of homages to historical Rolex references as well, so they’re both really playing the same game, just at different price points…
@@arcaine101 Well, I guess people would buy original designs if they were any good. Copying designs that have already proven successful is obviously a safer bet.
I have a large collection of 84 watches with two on the way (I just ordered this one). I have several price points. In all of my 40+ years of collecting, I have had exactly ONE compliment on my watch...and it was my San Martin Water Ghost Sub homage Two Tone. LOL Truth be told, most people don't know much about watches. Most don't know the difference between automatic and quartz. Just buy and wear what you like and don't worry about what other people think. They didn't buy it for you. Have a good day!
The Tudor has to me maintained. Every 5 year a costly exercise of €300 to €500,-. The Tudor alu bezel will scratch. Wear these two watches side by side for a year and show me some macro shots. The SM will look just the same as new, the Tudor will be scratched up. Winding a 40 or 70 hour power reserve watch 40 to 70 times respectively is something nobody does, should do or has ever done. Instead just wind the watches 10 to 20 times and let the rotor do it's job. Why not sell the Tudor and buy 15 San Martin watches? No no, you keep the Tudor (because you now have it..) and sell the San Martin. It does not makes sense at all to me. Keeping the Tudor is the status feeling, nothing more, nothing less. Stating that your NH35A runs +5sec. per day has no meaning. It could be +20 or -20 and measuring the accuracy in different positions is different again and of course the Tudor is a far superior movement with much higher accuracy figures and far more stable all positions accuracy. The PT5000 will be far superior to the NH35A in terms of accuracy and stability in different positions. So yes I bought the San Martin 004 with the hex logo. Delivered in the next batch first week September. And yes I will wear my San Martin proud without lusting for a Tudor. I can spend the €3400,- on other more essential things this winter....How about setting my thermostat on 20 degrees instead of 16 degrees...!
If you click on the bell there are three notifications options: all, personalised, none. You need to click on "all". If this isn't possible on your phone, try another device such as a laptop. Regards, #WR4K
@@jotten3368 It is currently processed to 1080HD and processing to 4K. It is playing normally in 1080. Try changing the resolution to 1080 and then reloading the page. Regards, #WR4K
Tudor just because is Tudor and not a cheap copy is a piece you buy once and you use proudly for your entire life proud to leave it to your sons. If you cannot spend such money you can buy far better watches than a chinese brand for the money. If you buy THIS san martin os because you WANT the Tudor but you can't afford the real one and this is a very bad reason to buy watches. The chinese copy are grat the first month, then they age very bad. I mean, no one can be proud of a copy.. I also bought a steinhart in the past, that is still a copy and I regret it.
As someone with a couple of SM watches, the fact that this San Martin still has that awful S/dollar on the crown (rather than the 'hex' logo used elsewhere on the watch) For that reason alone, I'm not buying one Sorry San Martin
Thank you for watching Dave. The crown has now been updated to the hex crown. I stated this in my video. See link below which shows this. Regards, #WR4K watchdives.com/products/pre-order-san-martin-6200-retro-men-watch-sn004-limited-edition-1?variant=43041146962138
Well … you can own 15 San Martins for the Tudor’s price. They are inferior and don’t hold value but you can use them and throw them away when you damage them
thats true, when you buy a known brand you know you can get at least some money back (sometimes even make profit). San Martin, even though they become more known its not the same case.
Quite a big difference between the two really. In profile the San Martin is ugly and doesn't match the BB58 at all. Overly thick bezel, misplaced brushing to the sides and a nasty bulbous case back.
too short lug to lug? Female ends? There's a reason the real Sub, GMT etc have male endlinks....Rolex know what they're doing! Male endlinks cause a consistent curve at the start of the bracelet. Look at the above view on the Tudor and the San Martin on your (quite large) wrist, you get a weird kink, a male end link would stop that. You can even see it in the double shot of them both in your hands at 5.42. Unless you've got tiny girls wrists under 7", female endlinks on a 40ish mm wide case are just going to look wrong. Tudor presumably do it 'cause Rolex don't and to give dealers another option. I've got 8 1/2" wrists, I wouldn't buy any female end linked bracelet watch.
San Martin SN004-G Limited Edition:
watchdives.com/products/pre-order-san-martin-6200-retro-men-watch-sn004-limited-edition-1?variant=43041146962138
Use "WR4K" 10 USD discount code on any watch over 150 USD.
san martin have any on line shop in Europ ?
@@KINESKI-SINDIKAT Thank you for watching. No. Regards, #WR4K
@@watchreviews4k Thats a shame.
@@watchreviews4k have you reviewed the SN004 V2?
@@lancemitton9078 See link below. Regards, #WR4K
ua-cam.com/video/Whq_sM7DKUM/v-deo.html
It was great to see these pieces side-by-side.
I appreciate the small but significant differences of the SM that make it it’s own watch, not just a carbon copy homage. The SM case profile with champfer looks more refined (and brushing is more practical for everyday). The gear bezel and ceramic do change the feeling to more modern and a bit aggressive, while I think the o-style bracelet also refines it.
I’ve recently tried on the BB58 again, but I am ultimately much happier to have the SM on wrist. It’s a long term keeper. (and I don’t have to worry about long term service costs or durability).
Since I don’t look at watches as investments, I just use them. For that reason, the SM is an appealing option.
I actually favor the shade of BLUE on the SM.
Ordered a blue SN004 today for $234. Didn't have a Tudor BB58 homage in my collection. Will be a nice change from one of my Sub homages for daily wear. Good review as always.
Amazing review, thank you for the detail. I’ve been eyeing the San Martin for a while thinking it’ll help me curb my desire for the Tudor. After watching this video I now know that I would rather save up and get the Tudor.
Incredible timing, precisely the San Martin I'm planning to buy this week during the sale. Just wanna be sure that now they have the Hex crown.
Thank you for watching. The SN004-G Limited Edition's sold on watchdives.com now have the hex crown. Regards, #WR4K
I just bought this SM Blue last week. I have a Tudor BB S&G as well. Lets be clear folks SM in that price bracket is amazing. Tudor is a class apart and they charge for it accordingly. Tudor has started giving Rolex a run for its money. Back to SM - I got the Blue limited edition last week after watching WR4K's earlier video - it has the Hex logo on crown and I am using it as my daily casual watch. Its a beauty !! And yes don't forget to use the USD10 voucher - code WR4K..
Thank you for watching Shahid. Congratulations. Excellent choice. Wear yours in good health. Regards, #WR4K
The san Martin is incredible value for money. I have a tudor bb s and g. My Mrs recently bought a san Martin 38mm 50s style submariner and it looks amazing. the build quality is not far off the tudor. My clasp on the tudor is already showing signs of wear, but her san Martin is still looking new. Your basically paying for the name , by buying a tudor. But overall the tudor is a better looking watch. value for money the san Martin wins all day long. But the tudor is the better watch, but is it worth the premium , well that's subjective too. My seiko sla043 is similar priced to the the tudor, but is better made, although people will say 4k for a seiko is silly. I say buy what you love, because it will stand the test of time. if u want a good watch for hardly any money, the san Martin is as good as it gets .
Let your mrs. to see Lorier Neptune and Baltic watches.
Fantastic in depth review, many thanks
The bracelet on the Tudor looks like a came from a different watch and the cases polished sides makes the watch look cheap to me. In my opinion the brushed finish of the San Martin looks more appropriate for a dive watch but Tudor knows their customers are not using these watches for work.
Thank you for this comparison. I truly enjoyed it. Your watch reviews go above and beyond all others.
As for the comparison, clearly the Tudor is the higher quality watch - no surprise there. I've always admired the BB58. I particularly like the snowflake hands, which is one reason I was drawn to the SM homage. And given the SM's reviews and quality at its price point, I think it remains a fantastic alternative for those who us who love the 58 design, but are 1) either not in a financial position to spend the thousands of dollars to get it - and even more after, to maintain it, or 2) would like to try a less costly alternative - to see if they like it well enough to eventually make the leap to the Tudor, or 3) just want to save money, and future maintenance costs, while still wearing a nice homage. The SM 004 is not a Tudor. But, it is a very nice watch with great dimensions and specs.
I currently have the 004 in the black/gilt dial, but you've convinced me to get the blue version with this comparison, as well. I just placed the order with watchdives, and have used your discount code. Thank you so much for such a great and thorough review. Kindest regards,
-Glen
P.S. I also have a SM SN051. It too is a fantastically finished watch, and wears beautifully. I would love to see your review of that model too, should you ever be inclined.
Well done on a very in depth comparison.
Blue tone is better on SM, ceramic bezel better also but the size of the numbers easier to read.
I own a tudor pelagos but I'm definitely interested in getting a sm as a daily.
Check out my Pelagos review below. It may interest you. Regards, #WR4K
ua-cam.com/video/awWlp6QsO1M/v-deo.html
4:39
I go through a lot of crystal changes so
I learned I don't like flat-bottom crystals (like you see here on the SM).
But they use proper double-domed crystals in other models.
When it comes to Rolex and Tudor - these homages make the Emperor's Clothes fall away.
You will pay 25 to 50 times more for an identical watch with only a (hidden) superior movement.
The expensive movement error loses/gains 2 seconds a day instead of 10 seconds. Big deal.
I picked up the blue SN006 more than a year ago,the 2nd version w/the pt5000 mvm’t, and I think the 004 is visually much more appealing ,primarily due to it’s bezel,chapter ring , and the text on it’s dial being whiter and much easier to see,whereas the 006 uses a more silver hue and the bezel markers are equally as subdued , so much that one has to strain to see them. I think seeing this one is going to ruin my ability to enjoy this piece,but I paid 300 US for it and I would be lucky if I could get 200 with the competition being around $100 less brand new. I guess I am stuck with it 😮. I hope that the movement proves worth the price
Got this San Martin for Xmas it’s outstanding for the price.
Congratulations J. Excellent choice. Wear yours in good health. Regards, #WR4K
you sir, know how to review watches. detail is excellent
Thanks for the video. I have said before - imagine is SM put another $250US into the watch. Most small problems like a NH38, better finishing, and bezel depths would disappear. Now a $500-600US watch goes against the $3,600US+ Tudor. It does come down to what value is put on country of build.
Thank you for watching Jim. Glad you enjoyed it. "It does come down to what value is put on country of build". Agreed "Swiss Made" on the dial has value, compared to "China Made". Also Tudor has brand heritage versus San Martin without brand heritage. For many collectors brand heritage is important, and something they are willing to pay a premium for. Regards, #WR4K
I came cross your channel a few days ago and Ive been watching your review of this watch since then. I love the Tudor black bay 58 but I really can't really afford one at the moment also I don't think anyone's going to buy me one any time soon! 😂 Sounds like this could be a really good alternative. I am now, looking at purchasing the San Martin SN004 G Limited edition on watchdives. Thank you this has been really helpful. 🤔🤣
Congratulations. Excellent choice. Wear yours in good health Lee. Use the "WR4K" 10 USD discount code. Regards, #WR4K
@@watchreviews4k thank you. I will
@@watchreviews4k I will let you know my thoughts, when it arrives 🤔Thanks again for the review and the discount code 😊
@@watchreviews4k I recieved the San Martin SN004 Limited edition, blue version. It really wears like a watch worth much more and is definitely good value for the money. I really impressed with the lume, the dial and bezel. I am now looking at another of your recommendations. The Steeldive SD 1953 (Submariner date homage) 🤔 I'm going to stop typing for now😂 Thanks again.
If they upgraded the bezel then I the SM would be an instant buy for me
Each one in unbeatble on its respective field...
Fantastic and thurough review!!
I've been eyeing their BB homages and your feedback makes me think their newest SN0008 G-B is the one to get. Coin edge bezel, same excellent bracelet, 40mm, only 12mm thick as its rocking a flat sapphire.
See my review of the SN008-G V3 below Chris. The sapphire crystal is double domed (not flat). Regards, #WR4K
ua-cam.com/video/fwEqoLnPuo8/v-deo.html
Great review! I also own both models and I think I will keep the San Martin for daily use (i really do not fancy the ceramic bezel, but it is more scratch resistant!). By the way, the Tudor is another planet...😉
What a great comparison. Thank you
After this video it's clear one is paying for the Tudor name. Marginal higher quality at 15 times the price.
I agree.
It’s kinda tough to compare an apple to an orange. But…..it is what it is!! 😅Great comparo btw.👍🏼
Thank you for watching Bernard. Glad you enjoyed it. Regards, #WR4K
Aesthetically, I don't think the gear tooth edge of the San Martin bezel works quite as well as the coin edge. It's better suited to more ruggedly designed pieces like a Helm Vanuatu for instance. If they changed the bezel to a coin edge or something less tool-ish they'd have an unbeatable watch
Still, at say, 75 percent of the level of finish of the Tudor at less than 1/10 the price... It's kind of hard to argue that Tudor is worth what they're asking. Is it a high quality watch? Absolutely. Is it a better watch than San Martin? Yes, of course.. is it 10 times better? ..... 🤔 Not so much.
Completely agree on the ceramic insert! For once the aluminum looks better
The Tudor looks less blingy because of the ali bezel, but I'd still prefer the ceramic material. I think I'd get the SM in black though
Thank you for watching. Regards, #WR4K
Very interesting what you get for your money with the San Martin. Don’t know if there is a mod for the ceramic bezel insert to a aluminium, probably get the coin edged bezel too
Oh this is gonna be a good one!
Gonna watch it a bit later, like usually
Great matchup! The only improvement(s) I wish San Martin would do is to use a beveled bezel like the BB58, which would reduce the thickness of the coin edge, thereby visually reducing the thickness of the head piece. That, and increase the layers of BGW9 lume on the hands, which obviously have less layers than what they applied to the indices. Do that, and they would have the perfect 'homage' of the BB58. I'm about to order this watch, so hopefully the lume on yours is an aberration. 😁
Thank you for watching Dayne. Glad you enjoyed it. Congratulations. Excellent choice. Wear yours in good health. Regards, #WR4K
Good review and comparison!
Wish the San Martin Bezel looked more like the 58 agree the aluminium bezel just looks better in colour and finishing as does the edge, non recessed numbers i prefer too. Almost makes it look like a different watch. I actually think the aquatico sea star looks nicer and closer to the 58 despite its larger size.
Thank you for watching. Regards, #WR4K
On another note, i'm pleased to report that my new Cronos Kermit/Starbucks with 2.5x magnification comes with a Bezel with no Backplay whatsoever. Depending on wether you prefer a harder action your Bezel, the Cronos might now be on the same level as the San Martin submariner homage. I'm curious which is closer to a real submariner, i will compare my Cronos with the original of a friend of mine just out of curiosity.
Btw., i prefer the blue on the San Martin in this video.
Thank you for watching Phillip. Congratulations. Excellent choice. Wear yours in good health. Regards, #WR4K
It would be so nice to see this comparison between the black guilt version of both
Thank you for watching. Regards, #WR4K
After seeing how nicely done this hommage is I no longer want the Tudor or the hommage. 😂
AMAZING REVIEW
I'd be interested in your assessment of the Steinhart Ocean 39 Tudor homage and the Tiger Concept version as well, the Steinhart will surely retain it's value better but the Tiger Concept is superior to the Pagani version , in terms of appearance in my opinion
See my review of the Ocean 39 Marine Black below Mike. I asked Tiger Concept to send me watches for review, unfortunately they didn't reply. Regards, #WR4K
ua-cam.com/video/uExRZDuAjsc/v-deo.html
@@watchreviews4k thsnk you I will check it out
What do you think the movement of the Tudor sells for? Or do they guard them against sales from other entities ? I was told as much as 1200 for a servicing on my Tudor gmt, I hate to even put words to it but why not pay for a new movement every 5 years,vs the archaic process of steaming the little pieces and parts and reassembling the whole damn thing? I still don’t know what country they are doing it in
The Black Bay GMT is due for a service every 5 years. The standard service cost is 200-500 USD at a Tudor Service Centre in America. The 200 is based on just a movement service. The 500 includes movement servicing, and fully polishing the case, and bracelet to remove all scratches. The Kenissi movements are used by; Chanel, Tudor, Norqain, and Breitling. I don't know how much the movement costs in the Black Bay GMT. Regards, #WR4K
@@watchreviews4k I was told nearly 1200 at the place I bought mine. I get how it works because I had to send mine back and it was returned to me with a black suede pouch and a little cardboard sidecar,very collectible but not worth waiting almost 4 months to get the watch back.Granted the 5 year warranty covered my complaint but it’s a system that hasn’t changed since’53
It doesn't cost 1200 USD to service a Black Bay GMT, so you were misinformed. Did yours have the common problem of the date sticking? The early ones had this problem, and they were returned under warranty to Tudor to have the movements replaced. This would explain your 4 month wait. Usually Tudor watches are serviced at Tudor service centres within America, rather than being returned to Switzerland. I am sorry to hear of your problems. Regards, #WR4K
@@watchreviews4k no mine had a little bit of condensation on the inside of the sapphire crystal and the bezel was just not right.they said they had fixed the problem with the scratches on the crystal and it was good to go! I’m going to delete this thread because I don’t want to offend anyone at the local ad’s
Very nice comparison. Did not notice if you mentioned that the hands on the San Martin are whiter than the indices. That is a little disappointing. Also I have to mention that I bought the San Martin and it has a problem with the movement. If I take a longer walk in the forest for about 1 hour and 15 minutes the watch is suddenly 30 seconds fast. I have had this problem with a Pagani Design watch. The problem is that it is very much impossible to send watches back to China for repair on the warranty. Currently I have 2 San Martins with broken winding gears in the Chinese customs and it seems that they are not getting in to China. 2 months have passed now and no news. So I think it’s kind of a lottery if one receives good movements in watches bought in China and it’s very annoying and disappointing that one in reality can not use the so-called warranty on the watches…
Thank you for watching Lasse. Sorry to hear that. Regards, #WR4K
The fact that they are being compared says it all.
Thank you for watching. Regards, #WR4K
SanMartins second hand lume pip overlaps on the round markers where on tudor don't, great pieces though
Thank you for watching C G. Regards, #WR4K
Thanks for the great head to head review! I was gonna buy the blue Tudor couple of weeks ago but something had me to stop buying it front of the store and I bought the SM blue dial limited edition recently but still waiting for it.
Is the case design of SM similar to submariner 16610?
Thank you for watching. No, the SN004-G case is similar to the Black Bay 58. The SN008-G is similar to the 16610 case which has crown guards. Regards, #WR4K
@@watchreviews4k Thanks! I got the SN004-G today and its brilliant.
Congratulations. Excellent choice. Wear yours in good health. Regards, #WR4K
Hey, wondering if the chapter ring on the sn004 is actually blue? Could you let me know?
Thank you for watching Nick. Yes, its blue. Regards, #WR4K
Great review!.
I'm looking at purchasing one of these San Martin's soon. As W.D's don't include custom charges for UK shipments. Roughly what did you have to pay?
I am in Ireland. The UK VAT is 20%. Regards, #WR4K
@@watchreviews4k thank you.
The 004 is now available. Did they listen to you
The next "crisis" for Swiss watches won't be a quartz crisis like in the 1970s. It will be crisis of cheap (and good) Chinese watches. Even Chinese mechanical movements are getting quite good.
No it will not be a crisis for the Swiss. People spend 10k+ on a watch because of branding, not because they cant get a cheaper watch elsewhere. Chinese watches are and will continue to impact "entry" Swiss watches below perhaps 3k mark, but 5k and higher the Swiss will continue to dominate because no one wants "China Made" on their dial when they spend car money on a watch, no matter how good the watch is.
How hard is it to swap out the movement in an automatic watch?
Thank you for watching Mike. It depends on the movement. For example Seiko NH35A movements have a plastic movement holder ring which is easy to remove and press back into the case. PT5000 movements have 3 screws and tabs securing the movement inside a steel movement holder ring which is more tricky to replace. For reference see my modified Ironwatch RX8004-B video below; I upgraded the PT5000 to a LJP G-100. Fitting the hands to the canon pinion is the most difficult part. Regards, #WR4K
ua-cam.com/video/B0ViRP9ruu0/v-deo.html
@@watchreviews4k thank you for the quick reply.I am not skilled enough to attempt a swap but if it can be done for less than a full service it might mean keeping an older Seiko or two,where it made no sense previously
NH35A movements are only 27 USD on AliExpress. See link below. It isn't viable to service a 7S26 or NH35A. A movement has to be broken down, parts ultrasonically cleaned, then rebuilt and regulated; which is 2 hours labour for a watchmaker. Replacing the movement is 1 hours labour thus cost effective. 7S26 movements can be upgraded to NH35A or NH35A to give them hacking. The hands, stem, dial, are compatible. For example on a Seiko 5, or SKX007, a popular upgrade is to change the 7S26 to a 4R36 (NH36A) to give it hacking. My advice is to buy the movement yourself, then give the watch and movement to a watchmaker to change. With SW200-1, and ETA 2824-2 powered watches its more cost effective to service the movement, as its less expensive than replacing it. However Seiko movements are often less expensive than the service cost thus replacing with new is more viable. Regards, #WR4K
www.aliexpress.com/item/4000545303494.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.23a05038UfRWZS&algo_pvid=fe53384c-c26a-41e3-88d4-104b01fcbe97&algo_exp_id=fe53384c-c26a-41e3-88d4-104b01fcbe97-8&pdp_ext_f=%7B%22sku_id%22%3A%2210000002798977053%22%7D&pdp_npi=2%40dis%21USD%2149.45%2127.69%21%21%214.6%21%21%402103399116622140216842207eb156%2110000002798977053%21sea&curPageLogUid=9GL0xc8laDUY
@@watchreviews4k thank you for breaking that down for me, as I suspected. I have a seiko that will now live to tell time in the future. cheers
The San Martin is a very good value piece, but it just cant compete with the class of the Tudor ,for me. I think if SM made this watch with an aluminium bezel and toned down the shiny look to appear much closer to the 58 then they would have a massive winner, for me. However, they have not done this and whilst the SM is a very nice and affordable watch , its not a Tudor. This is a debate about worth not the comparison in the details. What is something actually worth? The market sets this cost, supply and demand in action. In years to come these lovely and commendable chinese knock offs willl be slung in a draw , not used, as good as they actually are. The Tudor is deemed to be. (like Rolex) intrisically special and will always have an emotional and historical ,as well as a monetary value that the SM can never hope to mimic. I don't own a Tudor. I don't like them . For me its the Boxster choice when what was really wanted was the 911. (the Sub). Although I know the presenter has sold his sub too. I sold my sub years ago and dont regret it. Its ubiquitous and according to the metropolitan police the most recognisable watch attracting watch thieves in London recently. At least your probably safe with Tudor. If im going out im taking my SM or my Cronos, They are fab watches...for me. Again, a really good comparison video that makes us all think before we sink our hard earned dosh into the 58, as nice as it is.
It's just a watch. Material things.
Thank you for watching. Regards, #WR4K
Thanks for this comparison, both great watches but for me the fine teeth on the bezel, the polished sides and most of all the difference in blue make the Tudor much more classier! The blue on the San Martin looks cheap like the Ford logo 🙈 this is personally the biggest deal breaker. The size is on the other hand perfect for my smaller wrist (6,5) why oh why?!😅
Hi, in my humble opinion, the san martin looks way better than the Tudor. And saying that the Tudor is finished to Rolex level, is quite an ambitious statement! best regards!
Thank you for watching. Regards, #WR4K
No aluminium for me. If you want something that looks dull; matt ceramic.
Thank you for watching. Regards, #WR4K
I just wish San Martin would concentrate on creating its own designs, and then you could enjoy them for what they are - rather than feeling like you’re pretending you’re wearing a more expensive watch (and even if you’re not, that’s what people will think). But, Tudor’s lineup is full of homages to historical Rolex references as well, so they’re both really playing the same game, just at different price points…
Thank you for watching David. Regards, #WR4K
Aaaaannddd no one buys their original designs. People say one thing yet do the opposite.
@@arcaine101 Well, I guess people would buy original designs if they were any good. Copying designs that have already proven successful is obviously a safer bet.
I have a large collection of 84 watches with two on the way (I just ordered this one). I have several price points. In all of my 40+ years of collecting, I have had exactly ONE compliment on my watch...and it was my San Martin Water Ghost Sub homage Two Tone. LOL Truth be told, most people don't know much about watches. Most don't know the difference between automatic and quartz. Just buy and wear what you like and don't worry about what other people think. They didn't buy it for you. Have a good day!
Thank you for watching Mark. Regards, #WR4K
The Tudor has to me maintained. Every 5 year a costly exercise of €300 to €500,-.
The Tudor alu bezel will scratch. Wear these two watches side by side for a year and show me some macro shots. The SM will look just the same as new, the Tudor will be scratched up.
Winding a 40 or 70 hour power reserve watch 40 to 70 times respectively is something nobody does, should do or has ever done. Instead just wind the watches 10 to 20 times and let the rotor do it's job.
Why not sell the Tudor and buy 15 San Martin watches?
No no, you keep the Tudor (because you now have it..) and sell the San Martin.
It does not makes sense at all to me.
Keeping the Tudor is the status feeling, nothing more, nothing less.
Stating that your NH35A runs +5sec. per day has no meaning. It could be +20 or -20 and measuring the accuracy in different positions is different again and of course the Tudor is a far superior movement with much higher accuracy figures and far more stable all positions accuracy. The PT5000 will be far superior to the NH35A in terms of accuracy and stability in different positions.
So yes I bought the San Martin 004 with the hex logo. Delivered in the next batch first week September. And yes I will wear my San Martin proud without lusting for a Tudor. I can spend the €3400,- on other more essential things this winter....How about setting my thermostat on 20 degrees instead of 16 degrees...!
Thank you for watching Rene. Regards, #WR4K
Why I cannot get notifications of your content???
Thank you for watching Nenad. Have you subscribed and clicked on the notification bell icon? Regards, #WR4K
@@watchreviews4k that is my question. I am subscribed but the bell icon has a slash top left bottom right ???
Notifications from this app are blocked is the message I get
If you click on the bell there are three notifications options: all, personalised, none. You need to click on "all". If this isn't possible on your phone, try another device such as a laptop. Regards, #WR4K
The San martin actually looks better
Thank you for watching. Regards, #WR4K
No sound
The video is still processing to 4K Mehedi. Refresh the page and you will hear the sound. Regards, #WR4K
Stream is not working 🤔😬🕵️♂️😞
The video is still processing to 4K. Refresh the page and it will play. Regards, #WR4K
Still not working here in Amsterdam
@@jotten3368 It is currently processed to 1080HD and processing to 4K. It is playing normally in 1080. Try changing the resolution to 1080 and then reloading the page. Regards, #WR4K
Strange 🤔🕵️♂️ i have iphone 12 mini
And the video can”t be changed on youtube in another quality
I don't like the new clasps on the new San Martin's and it's kinda a deal breaker for me
Thank you for watching Mark. Regards, #WR4K
The SM was just as expected, but BB was a surprise for me. Aluminium bezels and 60 click bezels are only used by the cheapest Chinese homages.
Thank you for watching Sam. Regards, #WR4K
Tudor just because is Tudor and not a cheap copy is a piece you buy once and you use proudly for your entire life proud to leave it to your sons. If you cannot spend such money you can buy far better watches than a chinese brand for the money. If you buy THIS san martin os because you WANT the Tudor but you can't afford the real one and this is a very bad reason to buy watches. The chinese copy are grat the first month, then they age very bad. I mean, no one can be proud of a copy.. I also bought a steinhart in the past, that is still a copy and I regret it.
Thank you for watching. Regards, #WR4K
@@watchreviews4k Well said mate
A very naive statement in my mind.
Well, the Tudor is a cheap copy of the Rolex. So why don’t you buy the original?
The Tudor looks streets ahead of the SM which looks chunky in comparison. Also prefer the bezel on the Tudor.
As someone with a couple of SM watches, the fact that this San Martin still has that awful S/dollar on the crown (rather than the 'hex' logo used elsewhere on the watch)
For that reason alone, I'm not buying one
Sorry San Martin
Thank you for watching Dave. The crown has now been updated to the hex crown. I stated this in my video. See link below which shows this. Regards, #WR4K
watchdives.com/products/pre-order-san-martin-6200-retro-men-watch-sn004-limited-edition-1?variant=43041146962138
New version use hexagon logo on the crown.
Who actually looks at the crown though?? 🤔
Well … you can own 15 San Martins for the Tudor’s price. They are inferior and don’t hold value but you can use them and throw them away when you damage them
thats true, when you buy a known brand you know you can get at least some money back (sometimes even make profit). San Martin, even though they become more known its not the same case.
San martin makes high quality watches for their price but the designs are trash.
Thank you for watching. Regards, #WR4K
Quite a big difference between the two really. In profile the San Martin is ugly and doesn't match the BB58 at all. Overly thick bezel, misplaced brushing to the sides and a nasty bulbous case back.
Thank you for watching Roy. Regards, #WR4K
too short lug to lug?
Female ends?
There's a reason the real Sub, GMT etc have male endlinks....Rolex know what they're doing!
Male endlinks cause a consistent curve at the start of the bracelet.
Look at the above view on the Tudor and the San Martin on your (quite large) wrist, you get a weird kink, a male end link would stop that. You can even see it in the double shot of them both in your hands at 5.42.
Unless you've got tiny girls wrists under 7", female endlinks on a 40ish mm wide case are just going to look wrong. Tudor presumably do it 'cause Rolex don't and to give dealers another option.
I've got 8 1/2" wrists, I wouldn't buy any female end linked bracelet watch.
Thank you for watching. Regards, #WR4K
I have a 6 inch wrist as the adult man and have bought a female link separately for the 6200 model. Male link is a huge no-no for most wrists.
Excellent review!