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Dragon Ball FighterZ Says Super Saiyan 4 is STRONGER Than ULTRA INSTINCT?
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- Опубліковано 14 бер 2021
- According to Dragon Ball FighterZ, which is stronger? Super Saiyan 4 or Ultra Instinct?
Ever since Super Saiyan 4 Gogeta released for Dragon Ball FighterZ, the debate over whether SSJ4 is stronger than any of the god forms seen in Dragon Ball Super has ONCE AGAIN been revived. In today's video, I wanted to quickly cover some of my thoughts on SSJ4 and where it stands against the likes of forms such as Super Saiyan Blue and Ultra Instinct!
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#dragonballsuper #dragonballz #dragonball #dragonballdaima #daima #dragonballgt #dbsmanga #dbs #dbz #anime #manga #fighterz #dragonballfighterz #ultrainstinct #ssj4 #supersaiyan4 #videogames
Ssj4 looks the coolest outta all the transformations
I think SSJ4 can give UI a run for it's money. Especially since SSJ4 can learn a foreign attack and cannot be used twice as well as the stamina being through the roof. I'd say it'd be a very climatic battle 💯
I'm sure it'd be a visually interesting fight to say the least, lol
U on crack men🤣🤣🤣🤣ssj4 beats UI Goku keep dreaming
Or because it's after UI
@@lucan2491 goku and vegeta didn't get more than 10 years worth of training just by absorbing the god boost
The god boost only made goku and vegeta equal for ssj3 buu saga goku and evidence for this is that Super will eventually catch up and meet up with the end of dbz and it was stated that uub was equal to base goku at the end of z So Super goku is still gonna have to be relatively equal to uub in base form
@@mrdemiurge7680 You stupid
I love how everybody says “oh god ki is so much stronger than regular ki, mortals can’t even comprehend it…” yet super sayain god and super sayain god super sayain couldn’t even touch broly…A MORTAL lol they had to fuse to beat him. SSG should have been only used to fight immortals like angels and gods…yet they use it on every villain now and ruins it. Just my opinion, anyways will love DBZ but sometimes I thinks the writers ruin forms and their purpose.
What a God we have right here
Bro said "super saiyan god super Saiyan". Just say SSB my boi.
Loooooool 😂😂😂😂😂 god ki is weak as fuck. Dbs is dead nobody likes these weak ass beerus and whis
@@ayyliennyou mean blue weak ass gay ass?
This is just another thing that fuels the on going war between GT fans and Super fans. I just grab my popcorn and watch the fireworks
Sometimes it’s fun to dip your feet in the water and get involved but it usually always lands you in a bad situation
@@InnovativeJdawg what happens when a Saiyan is stuck in a war zone for a million years and is forced to survive what kind of form would the Saiyan achieve?
I am a gt fan but im not in the fight cause i make myself stuck in the gt/z era unless its games!
It’s obvious Gogeta SSJ4 is stronger because he’s a fusion of two SSJ4.
I will tell you why this is cap.
1. Gohan can perceive freiza's power. Frieza is equivalent to goku on a one to one basis pretty much the whole way through. Goku continues to sharpen his technique throughout the TOP, but he runs out of stamina pretty quickly at least in the anime. Anyway, Gohan has felt freiza's energy, and Jiren's energy and his dad fought on both their levels, so he can quickly approximate how strong goku is based solely on the fact that he is relative to a couple of non-deities.
2.God ki is not a non-interactive ki. Shin the kaioshin has god ki. Zamasu had god ki. It doesn't make you invincible. This is a non-argument. God Ki condences your ki onto a different frequency, and refines it, but it doesn't refine the body. Just the Ki. It's like making gasoline out of crude oil. It has more energy in the same amount of mass. It doesn't change one's stamina. And in fact, blue burns stamina Quite a bit. Goku and vegeta get to the point where they minimize the stamina drain, and can even manipulate blue [Perfected and evolved].
But all must be understood that god ki is ultimately 2 things. The first is limited in how much you can refine it. The second is limited by the stamina of the body.
We know that frieza surpassed blue COMPLETELY at the start of the tournament of power.
You think golden freiza is stronger than super saiyan 4? At the end of GT?
We know that 4 is a limit breaker, and even has the limit breaker form [AKA ultra full power ], so at the very least we know that it has at bare minimum, the multiplier of potential unleashed. It has been power scaled many times and 36k is the minimum multiplier for ss4.
Personally, I scale SSG at 4000. Ten times SS3. It CANNOT be absurdly above super saiyan 3, simply because gohan cought up and surpassed it. Because Kale and caulifla caught up to it.
So, Even if I were to make it a nice and pretty 10,000k multiplier [25 times stronger than ss3]. it would still be a lower casual scale than super saiyan 4.
Super saiyan 4 full power itself is basically using the full natural super saiyan multiplier on that [36k x 400= 14m]
If super saiyan blue is indeed a normal super saiyan multiplier then 10k x 50 = would be 500,000. 13 times stronger than super saiyan 4's BASE MULTIPLIER. It's pretty well scaled that SS4 gets around 4-600 times stronger within battle going to ultra full power and has an INSANE zenkai.
LOW balling full power, It has a 14 million multiplier
Super saiyan blue Kaioken x 20 , if decently scaled has a 10 million multiplier. Evolution is about equal to that, and perfected allows for them to waste nothing.
So, ultra instinct... Sign is more the technique, and mastered is the transformation into an angel. I'd guess mastered is actually probably another limit breaker. Sign just makes your more efficient, but mastered gives you the body for it. He's still not anywhere close to whis, but ultra instinct is probably more or less, the potential unleashed form multiplied by the god ki, which we will give a 10k multiplier. It's not about brute force, as we have seen. It's about T H E M A S T E R Y O F S E L F M O V E M E N T.
God Ki itself isn't even all that satisfying. Whis tells them pretty early in their training that it's not about anything making them stronger. God ki is a perfect fuel, but it has limits on the amount of mass it holds, which I am saying is 10k times regular ki. But whis is like, now any strength gains you get are going to be from making your base form stronger, because he knows that ki can only be refined so much.
That is why goku and vegeta transform and refine blue, a SUPER SAIYAN form using god ki. Because GOD KI ALONE ISN'T ENOUGH. It's INITIALLY the best multiplier they had ever experienced, until they experienced blue, and then everything else has been a refinement of that.
Ultra instinct isn't like a multiplier on top of blue, it's a completely divergent way of transforming.
Sign is a better application of super saiyan god. Mastered is the opposite direction of transforming than super saiyan. But instead of that 50x, it's probably using the potential unleashed modifier times god ki multiplier.
Also Gohan says this after *he* wins against Gogeta and Ultimate Gohan is not MUI level
This entire comment proved literally nothing. Your entire essay is based on how strong UI is even though none of what you said proved how weak SSJ4 is. You only proved how strong UI is. And the reason you didn't you put it absurdly higher than SSJ4 is because Gohan, Kale, and Caulifla caught up to it? That makes no fucking sense lmao
golden frieza is normal ki.
I feel like god forms seem stronger but ssj4 could be debatably on pair at least sense it's meant to be the peak of a saiyajin.
i would say ssj4 is stronger ssjg but not ssjb because ssjb is a stronger from the only reason gt goku in ssj4 could beat ssjb goku in dbs is because gt goku base from is so strong if gt goku got ssjb he would be a monster and if he even got mui he would be much stronger than the dbs goku because i think gt base goku is much stronger than base super goku so no ssj4 is a weaker from than ssjb but even tho ssj4 is weaker i think because gt goku base is so strong and ssj4 does not use to much ki to hold that transfromation i think gt goku would win in a 1v1 against super goku because ssjb is much more draining to the body and gt goku has much more experience than super goku so that what i think to ne clear this is my opionion on this maybe some of you wont understand what i meant by all of this but just to be clear okay
Jiren and Broly don´t Have God Ki and are Stronger than even SSJBlue , sooo... I Think that is not like that "can´t sanse .. so is stronger"" , even Kefla is stronger than SSJB, so is not a good argument. Ultra Instinct i can say is Stronger, because is above fusion and have power+tec.
Heck, golden frieza was stronger than ssj blue goku. It’s literally said that the reason he lost was because he didn’t train with golden
Broly is a brown ozaru. Ssj4 is a golden ozaru, which means ssj4 has FAR MORE potential than broly, and broly already has better potential than goku, vegeta, etc. Broly literally managed to go one on one with SSG red vegeta in like a couple min, something that both goku and vegeta trained for FAR more years since they even grew long beard from the training. Not to mention, Broly was only fighting creatures that he was able to beat as a kid for years, if he had been training the same way goku and vegeta does, broly would overcome them. Why is this about broly now? Ssj4 has far more potential than broly, if broly, ssj4, goku, vegeta all trained with the same training. Ssj4 comes in first, broly 2nd,goku 3rd,vegeta 4th.
Right now, maybe ssj4 cant beat mui, its 100% debatable but if ssj4 trains, 100% he claps mui.
You might have an argument like "what if mui has more potential" no. Example, Goku mastered ui, so hes now in mui form right? Mui fought Jiren somewhere around 10 minutes. And jiren doesnt have god ki, yet jiren is only losing slightly. Just slightly. Broly on the otherhand, was fighting someone billions time stronger, ssg red vegeta. Yet broly managed to overcome those difference in less than 10 minutes.
Sure you can argue the fact that for humans, saiyan fights are in reality actually longer, krillin said that before, though correct me if im wrong. So we truly dont know how long the fight was with broly and ssg vegeta for broly to surpass ssg vegeta. But even if wr dont know that, we know one thing, ssj4 has more potential than broly, which means he could surpass someone billions time stronger way way faster than broly.
In conclusion, alla this is confusing, sorry to confuse you, cqnt even blame ya, writing something like this was hella confusing for me as well. All in all, we dont have the exact knowledge of the difference between mui and ssj4's potential. So this shits a waste of time, power scaling is stupid, goodbye
Would be cool to see saiyan transformation again . Like how broly has primal transformation
Don’t like the hair color changes as a transformation. It’s like the writers forgot that their basic transformation was into giant apes. I like that GT built on the ape concept. Also Goku and Vegeta have been revived many times with all limbs intact except for their tails; why is that?
Toriyama forgot about saiyan tails
UI Goku Didn't fight any other fusion stronger than SSJ2 Kefla, even if he only was in Sign state. But, SSJ4 is above all mortal Saiyan transformations, and is prime form from which Saiyans gain power of SSJ transformations + Oozaru and endless limit-breaking potentials. SSJ4 is not just a transformation, but an ascended base form of Saiyans. The most natural peak they can get by training. So, for Goku and Vegeta to get the fusion dance into SSJ4 Gogeta, they need to be in SSJ4 forms, which means only one thing! The Multiplier skyrockets, at least x1.75 more than Full Power Jiren!!! Which also means that SSB, even SSBEVO, won't reach (as transformations added to Fusion Dance or Potara) to that height, cause SSB or SSBEVO are transformations (multipliers) added after Goku and Vegeta fused in their normal human base state (DBS series)! It's not important if Godly ki can or cannot be sensed, we already seen it's potential through series. Only Dragon Ball Heroes can present how deadly can Godly ki be, for example with various finishing moves like SSB God Kamehameha + God Final Flash which in combination can destroy the entire neighboring galaxy! Still, only Beerus and Whis knows the truth of who is stronger, cause they can sense anything, but think really carefully of what I stated here people! Jiren, Golden Frieza, Hit, Broly, Toppo and others don't need to sense God ki in order to whoop them Godly transformed arses*. Adding God ki (SSG, SSB, SSBEVO or UI) to SSJ4 form would benefit Saiyans more than regular base form, or at least adding Kaioken! Cause God ki is not their realm and is surprising to Higher Beings how mortals like Saiyans can, on their own, tap into/achieve such feats as Godly ki control starting from base transformation all the way to UI. By that feat, Saiyans introduce their dominance over any mortal in all the existence and that their potential alone, no matter which transformation is in question, can surpass everything seen and unseen. Maybe Goku one day transforms into Super Saiyan Zeno?!!! The whole series (canon or non canon) are one great sarcasm!
Sorry for bothering, nice day to all!
I literally had a theory about ssj4 being an ascended base form of the saiyans rather than just a compressed Super oozaru and that its goku and vegeta's version of Potential Unleashed that they use in gt
And you can find the post in the dragonball Fandom wiki if you like
It's cool someone else shared the same thoughts
I think it'd be awesome if goku continued training his mortal ki and reach ss4 and then combine that power with UI. It'd just look badass
It would definitely be powerful to say the least
Ultra Instinct SSJ4 and Kaioken stacked together would be top tier
A few things you said in the video.
1. Ultra Instinct and the God forms use a different form of Ki that is stronger than regular Ki.
While it is true God Ki is stronger than regular ki it has been proven many times that even people with normal ki such as Trunks, Frieza, Jiren, 17 and more can match up to people with God Ki, and even surpass them with normal ki. But even still in the case of UI that form or technique doesn't use God Ki atleast not in the anime, in the anime there are times where other characters are able to sense Goku's power while he is using UI. Episode 110 while Goku is fighting in Omen against Jiren, Roshi and Tien were able to sense Goku's energy. Piccolo did too because he made a remark that Goku was getting stronger during the fight. In 116 we see Kefla (another character who uses no God Ki yet is able to at the very least rival Goku in SSJG) able to sense Goku's energy as he powered up as she did the same and even Jiren did in the same episode when he woke up from his meditation. But even aside from that God ki usually has a "pressure" to it. God Ki isn't really much of a factor at this point, even if UI had it, it wouldn't really mean anything.
Yeah it’s true that beings with mortal ki have been able to fight on par with those who have god ki but that wasn’t my major focus of that argument. You make a fair point when you say that god ki has a “pressure” behind it which gives off the impression of immense power, but it still doesn’t allow those without god ki to accurately measure HOW HIGH that power goes, that was my major point.
That's just an oversight, Ultra Instinct does in fact use God Ki.
Base < Great ape < Hybrid Super Sayain < Super Sayain < Super Sayain 2 < Super Sayain 3 < Golden Great ape > < Super Sayain God < Super Sayain 4 Mystic Sayain > < Super Sayain Rage > < Super Sayain Blue < Super Sayain Blue Evolved < Perfected Ultra instinct < True Ultra Instinct < Ultra ego < Super Sayain Green < Super Sayain Green 2 < Mystic Beast
This will be a never ending debate because we really cannot see who will win with just datas alone. Same case in NBA where fans argues who's the goat, MJ or Lebron? Fans provide datas left and right but no one can really prove their claim because we will never ever see these 2 compete against other on their prime. Everything is just a speculation. The good thing is, I will enjoy reading stuffs here.
- Belmod and Toppo have God Ki and Jiren doesn't but Jiren is stronger than Belmod and Toppo.
- King Kai and Shin are Gods and are still weaker than Goku and Vegeta
- Zamasu is a god and lost to SSJ2 Goku
- Dende and King Kai can sense God Ki
Just idk
Can’t we all just say that each form is cool and could probably kick each others ass equally?
That’s exactly what we should be doing
Well Goku and Beerus nearly destroyed the universe from their fists clashing so I can't say that
@@simongutierrez4624 yeah SSG Goku at 100% full power who's fighting Beerus at 10% power. That isn't impressive at all.
At the very least. SSJ4 may be above God. I say that because there is a guide that compares SSJ4's multiplier to the Potora Fusion's multiplier. I know alot of you have seen it. "Merging With Vegeta!
After Goku and Vegeta use a merging item to merge, they become Vegetto! They can furthermore become a Super Saiyan, making them Super Vegetto! After the two strongest people merge, they become the greatest master in the universe! Perhaps even stronger than Super Saiyan 4!". Putting it about "SSJ4 >=< Potora Fusion with SSJ" or at the very least equal to Base Potora Fusion without any forms meaning that if Goku hypothetically went SSJ4 in the Buu Saga at the very most he would be equal to Super Vegito from that arc. SSJG was shown struggling against a base Potora Fusion in Kefla so I guess technically you could make an argument SSJ4 is above God and maybe Blue if you wanna go that far? That's being very generous though since Goku was tired (or....supposed to be anyway, this was the TOP.)
Comparing SSJ4 Gogeta to God Goku is a more legitimate debate in my eyes as opposed to comparing SSJ4 to UI.
You seriously don't think Z vegito or any potara multiplier can be anywhere near ssj4 realistically do you? Lol I have that same guide and it's most certainly taken outta context lol
You realize SSG Goku that fought Kefla was fatigued right? They even remarked that Goku was fatigued and couldn't utilize the true extent of SSG and SSB in his fight against Kefla. Omen that second time pushed his limits again and that was how he was able to keep up with Kefla.
Even IF Potara is a comparable multiplier to SSJ4, SSG is a higher multiplier considering Goku disregarded the option of fusion against Beerus. Considering his own remark about how he couldn't achieve this dimension of power on his own EVER, goes to show that the SSG boost >>>>>>> Potara. At most you could put SSJ4 on par with SSG, however, SSG showcases better feats. While SSJ4 seems to get rid of the stamina drain, SSG ( if we consider the Movie ) has feats such as energy absorption and passive healing ( though these feats were removed in Super). What did become canon in Super was Goku neutralizing energy that could have destroyed the Universe ( yes it was only half considering Beerus was the other half, however, it is still a remarkable feat in itself that SSG was capable of neutralizing half a Universe busting attack).
Once again, Kefla had a super-powered Kale fused with Caulifla. Kale is exceptional, considering she walked through an SSB Kamehameha. She's practically the Broly of Uni 6, except she's a female ( which naturally will make her weaker than Broly ) but I digress. It only makes sense Kefla would scale to be that insanely powerful. Once again, SSG Goku couldn't utilize most of his ability in that battle.
That guidebook is mistranslated (by fans not professional) and also that’s be a gt vegito,not z. Gt base goku is above z vegito.
@@Salciiiiii nope. SSG Goku solos GT. Omega Shenron couldn’t even destroy the Universe directly.
End of goku is ui in base and ss4 comes after
I wish.
End of z is Canon to super and gt is a continuation of it so technically they are stronger than anything uptil that point so yeah ssj4 is stronger
Nah god still stronger than 4 put UI Goku in the picture not even fair
I think SSJ4 is stronger than the God forms in raw power. If Broly, who never had proper training or God ki was able to match Goku and Vegeta in only base and LSSJ, then SSJ4 is probably too much.
Tru
@Johan The goat are you sure about that?
@Johan The goat then, that's sad... Ngl
@Johan The goat what's tru?
@Johan The goat aha, 💀👌
I Do Think UI Maximize Atk And Agility But Lacks In Stamina And Defense The KI Control And Toll On Body Is Intense Too
Whereas,
SSJ 4 Concentrates On Stamina ATK And DEF But Lacks Agility
The Ki Control Is Excellent and It Dosen't Restrain The Body At All Using It
Yep the tail of ssj4 restrain the stamina loss of the power of ssj4
Times 100 big bang kamehameha solos
Facts!😊
Also GOLDEN FRIEZA CAN FIGHT SSJ BLUE WHILE SSJ4 IS STRONGER THAN GOLDEN FRIEZA
Mortal ki and divine ki are equal in terms of power. But i like the regular transformations.
If Goku had practice in ssj4 he would have easily defeated ssjblue and god
I feel the same way.
As a form ssj4 is in between ssjgod and ssjblue. Don't overestimate God ki, all it does is allow the user access Sai forms and become a better fighter overall hence why everyone is able to catch up to those forms with little issue. The God forms are strong but not as strong as everyone says. Now GT characters shit on dbs characters but dbs forms are stronger. Ssj4 Gogeta tbh probably one shot dbs as a whole and is on dbh level of power. GT doesn't have flashy fights and animation that's why people have a disconnect with GT power. People will also bring up feats and statements from dbs and yet GT has statements and feats that scale way above anything dbs has ever done. Idk why people ignore one shows evidence when bringing up the others, makes no sense.
Ssj4 can be theoretically stronger than UI because it is from a different continuation, if it's god ki or not does not matter. But the thing I can say for sure is that Ssj4 has better hax and things that UI already has + greatest stamina
Ultra instinct is stronger cuz of the spirit bomb and remember the spirit bomb destroyed omega shenron
SSJ4 IS STRONGER THAN BLUE OR EVEN COMPARABLE TO MUI SSJ4 CLAPS BROLY. GOD KI IS NOT THAT STRONG SSJ4 GOGETA IS STRONGER THAN MUI FOR SURE CAUSE SSJ BLUE VEGITO IS STRONGER THAN MUI
Dragon Ball video games and shows say all kinds of things to get people hyped and excited.
I believe ssj4 is WAY stronger than God forms. God form was always getting beat up in super to the point those in God form powered down to base form when taking a strong hit. If God form is supposed to be this great power, why can't blue 1 hit KO Kale when she's only in ssj1? In super Android 17 was able to equal blue's power while in GT 2 Android 17s were needed to fight ssj4.
just because god ki blue isn‘t stronger.
just remember what it takes to get the ssj4 form.
ssj4 is the best
Its was originally supposed to be the strongest because its the actual primal form of a saiyan. Ssj4 jist never got its credit because ppl hated db gt so much. Maybe not as strong as UI BUT, UI ssj4 with a tail is probably the strongest
Ssj4 multiplier : 11 Trillion
Mui multiplier manga (top) : 2 sextillion
Mui manga (top) power comper to ssj3 goku vs Buu z anime : 25 Decillion
Ssj4 Goku vs nouva (Shadow dragon saga) power comper to ssj3 goku vs Buu z anime : 2 DUODECILLION
CAN YOU ALL SEE THE DIFERENT'S?
Saiyan schooler, go see for you're self
Saiyan Scholar is a great guy, nothing against him
But he’s a SSJ4 stan, so that’s why the form was favored by him lol
@@InnovativeJdawg idk man... I think't about it too... And he is kainda right.. Ngl, now idk 🤷🏻♂️ but what i do know, is that ssj4 is a legend
I would think master ultra instinct is stronger but i dont know and i would think maybe ssj4 is stronger than god and maybe ssj4 is as strong as ssjb.
Ehhh SSJ God vs SSJ4 is a lot closer of a debate than SSJ4 vs UI, but I still think the god forms are stronger
If you all asks toei about who is stronger between ssj4 and blue also ui...they also dont have the answer.
Super fans are so toxic to gt fans like how dub and dub purists shit on dub and sub as if opinions aren’t allowed.
I’m going to use in show facts rather then “blank is stronger” as a baseless arguement like many are doing here.
Omega shenrons aura was gonna destroy an infinite universe while supers universe e7 is small and only has 28 planets with life,and Zeno needed to charge up two hands so,yeah. Feats don’t lie.
Also the laughability of people saying “the fighterz translation is wrong,don’t believe professional translator trust random guy on Twitter” is funny.
I like super and gt. Like whatever you want but gt has better feats and god ki is overhyped. Frieza/gohan/17 and others all surpassed ssj god easily.
They learned to sense god ki by the way , and gohan alone is there in an official game for a reason. Even if gohan shouldn’t sense it logically it’s there for a reason. To tell us who’s stronger.
Imma just ignore all the people that’ll tell me to Kill myself (they say this so much) or that gt isn’t canon and I’m a fake fan. I’m done feeding trolls.
Title: “which is stronger”
Answer: “whoever can play the character really well.
Yeah true
Just because gogeta is the strongest any more does not mean he still the strongest he pretty strong and He can beat Ssjb goku and Ssjb vegeta and he can keep on par with the fusion I mean yea but I would say super sayain 4 gogeta is pretty strong he would keep up with the gods and even the god ki people even if his power level is not above god ki it still basically is op and is a match for god ki like goku gogeta vegito vegeta and Gohan and piccolo and etc
Ultra Instinct is definitely more powerful than SSJ4, who knows what they were thinking with this garbage, probably rushed it out for the game.
Im here to piss people off. GT came after Super story wise so ss4 is just better that’s the simple no research answer👍🏽
Toriyama has to confirm which is the strongest form. It would make sense that the God forms easily surpasses SSJ4 but me being a fan of SSJ4 I wish it was the opposite.
Super sayain 4 gogeta is still string though and also don’t forget he above Ssjb goku though and he can keep on par with black and other fusions and also zamasu Gohan and vegeta and also Ssjg goku top goku and ssj 2 ssj 3 and even god ki and ssj and Ssjb kk 10 although the ssj 4 is quite strong he mostly solos Ssjb goku so yea
gt did a lot right with character designs and attitudes but they did poorly with character development i personally love gt just not the ending it needs to be on trunks and hogan in the future
Are people taking a game where nappa can beat beerus seriously
They were back when this video was made, yeah.
It’s crazy what people think sometimes lol
(Some)Super dragon ball:Hard to swallow pills:Gt is good
I personally think that SSG is closer to SSB, in terms of power, than people think.
In the Broly movie, Broly (Ikari Form) was about as strong as SSB Goku. Since the Ikari Form was said to be 10x base, Broly’s base power shouldn’t be too far from SSG. However, SSG Vegeta destroyed base Broly.
This brings up the question of, “If Base Broly is only 10x weaker than SSB, but got destroyed by SSG, is SSG less than 50x weaker than SSB?
The answer is yes. In fact, it looks like SSB is only about < or =10x stronger than SSG.
Considering SSB was originally designed to be "going Super Saiyan on TOP of Super Saiyan God" I could see them being relatively close.
SSG is a lot weaker than SSB, Goku vs Jiren already proved that.
Jiren was literally only using On finger against SSG while Blue was able to actually fight and not just getting bitch slap by a finger.
I tick thet ui is stroger
Iam no GT fan boy but ssj4 gogeta destroyes mui
You are right Dragon Ball is supposed to be fun, I don't get why GT and Super fans always be in each others throats. We should all just enjoy Dragon Ball and keep it moving
Agreed 100%
Because Super started with people villainizing GT fans and talking trash about it, meanwhile Super having just as much flaws if not more which caused GT fans to retaliate. The Super fans even piss off Z fans only by stating how much "better" it is than old Dragon Ball.
@@M3rtyville Nah you couldn't be more wrong, GT was always getting bashed and hated on before Super even existed. This has nothing to with Super, Z fans were bashing GT fans from the jump. I ve been a fan of this franchise for over 20 years and I can confidently say GT gets bashed not because of Super but because it just didn't live up to Z.
As a whole most fans didn't like it which was a thing before, GT fans just need to accept that truth. Both Super and GT have serious issues which is why it makes more sense for GT and Super fans to get along
@@j.i.k2.044 Actually, GT was not nearly as hated as when BoG was announced.
Perhaps you weren't around when the AF Rumors were spreading like wildfire.
The so-called "most fans" weren't even a loud minority before that.
People jumped to Super with the hope it "retcons" unfavored content. At the end it delivered even less.
The word "canon" which most spell as cannon wasn't ever used especially not at this porpotion to the point you could believe these people even care.
The same applies to Broly. Broly wasn't nearly as hated before canonity topics came and the fanbase talking about how powerful he is, but when Super rehashed the character twice, they came drooling.
@@M3rtyville It really was hated, the internet wasn't what it is today back then. The online anime community wasn't big compared to right now, like I said the reason for the hype of AF and bog (which is Z movie along with RoF) is because of how unsatisfied people were with GT. Like I ve said I ve been a fan of DB for over 20 years, Super got announced the same year RoF (Z movie) dropped.
For me personally, I prefer the Super manga and Broly movie to GT. GT for me has more issues when I look at both with an unbias perspective but I still enjoy it from time to time as a DB fan. Its not the worst thing I ve seen in DB, GT fans now spend their time trying so hard to shit on Super in order to paint over the big cracks GT had. I see it a lot with Saiyan Scholar and his followers, they live to hate on Super because most fans didn't like GT which has literally nothing to do with Super or the Super fans. I can send you links to people bashing GT before Super existed
Mui goku way stronger because the god ki base form just puts goku on another level you could even say that ultimate gohan stomps
In my opinion ssj4 gogeta is about as strong as god goku from the berus arc
It’s the closest thing to a legitimate debate, but god goku still stomps imo
SSG is very far from Gogeta SS4. Literally Gogeta only used one move to deflect Omega Shenron's universal Negative Karma Ball move while SSG needs full power and a match with Beerus in order to shake the Universe. This ain't even a competition lol Gogeta SS4 slams Goku and Vegeta in divine forms. Gogeta Blue or Vegito Blue is the match for SS4 Gogeta
What? Gogeta is stong ssg ? Ahahaha
Just ssj4 goku beat blue
Bestttt
I believe that blue and 4 are equals, due to official material like heroes show them being able to fight equally. Plus the way ultra sjj4 Limit Breaker is presented, It is also an equal to ultra instinct.
Ps-I think base form is what really matters because multipliers are there to make the fight more exciting.
Heroes is non canon and a promotional anime
SSB and ssj4 aren't equal at all
SSB ranks far higher than ssj4
seen in the show of heroes though its non canon
The reason that ssj4 was shown on par with ssb on the show was because xeno goku is one of the strongest counterpart goku you may say then why were they equal? Yes thats true for the last part the goku xeno goku was fighting was capsule corporation goku (cc goku) hes the second strongest version of goku after db evolutions goku who is outerversal
(Xeno goku says in the games/manga that cc goku is superior to him)
Stop the cap
STOP THE CAP RN STOP DA CAP
@@Elite71 nobody on dragon ball is outerversal but I agree with everything else
@@starrja Heaven and hell in the afterlife is Outerversal and goku shook it.
Goku GT Base one shots that weak ass
SSJ 4 is Stronger than SSB👀
To Defeat SSJ 4 Goku Kaioken is needed For SSB Goku
I just like how SSJ4 looks over the dbs forms, and although in cannon, they haven’t gone head to head, in feats alone blue is simply stronger
It definitely has the more iconic design in comparison to DBS forms
mui wins.
Super Saiyan 4 Gogeta is stronger than ultra instinct because the age difference is huge.
Actually, God ki is not far stronger than ssj4,in my opinion that is, its my opinion that i think GT is stronger than super, thats just my opinion
And ur opinion is stupid but it is ur opinion a stupid one but it is urs
Ssj4 gogeta is the strongest.
God ki is weak
I don't know how many times the power scaling community has to debunk this but, no SSJ4 is weaker than God, and the JAPANESE version of Fighterz does not have Gohan say SSJ4 is stronger than MUI
Yes, you’re right, but the translation got screwed up in localization and that’s what got everyone thrown into a frenzy.
@@InnovativeJdawg thank you, sorry if I came off like an ass, but after 8 years of debating SSJ God vs SSJ4 to finally have GT fans just take an L, they had to throw this faulty line out there and back on that god damn hill
@@joeker5208 proof that SSGSS is stronger than SS4? We need facts not head canon.
@@JPrimeAnimation what “proof” did I use to say SSJGod > SSJ4? I said the Fighterz statement that’s says SSJ4 > MUI was a mistranslation. That only debunks the statement as viable for scaling SSJ4.
Not I can prove SSJGod > SSJ4 given the statements from Super and GT, and if you want me to provide evidence for why or even debate or have a discussion about it, then we’ll have to talk on Discord
Kgod ki is garbage
Go ss4
Ssj4 is stronger than u.i. because ssj4 has a special ability that nullifies other special abilities and it is called "it won't work twice!" Said by Goku in DBGT when fighting Nuova and Eis Shenron. So u.i. dodge would not work.
SSJ4 is The Mightiest Form in the franchise
nope.
@@TakeshiInazuma yes super fan
@@SamiVideo.Channel no GT fan. Why can't dudes just be real with themselves
@@TakeshiInazuma real about dragon ball ?
@@SamiVideo.Channel When SSG had universal feats. Dudes tried to say SSJ4 is stronger.
When Blue was introduced and has massive increases throughout the series, dudes still said SSJ4 was stronger.
When Ultra Instinct was revealed in the ToP, the omen version multiple times, and the completed version, each time Goku getting a massive increase in power than the last. Given how UI looked in the ToP, GT fans still say SSJ4 is stronger.
It seems no matter how much stronger DBS Goku gets, even if he gained like 5 new forms, or was able to destroy the entire multiverse, you dudes would still say "GT base Goku is still stronger."
No Ultra Instinct Goku is stronger than Super Saiyan 4 Gogeta.
Guys....I know you hate GT (for some odd reason) but here's the reasons why super (God form red, ssj blue, & ui) CANNOT be stronger than GT.
1. The feats. Argument is invalid due to supers prod. Having more time on animation ex (supers 131 episodes vs GT's 64 seeing that GT had to be rushed & canceled early). I don't see how ppl use this as an argument when it's common knowledge GT didn't have nowhere near the time super did with it having 3 movies and a manga based around the franchise. Speaking of manga:
2. DragonBall Z vol. 26 was the last volume of the Z series (which has uub, teen goten/trunks + everyone who's 10 years+ atleast older) supers manga/story takes place 3 years after kid buu died with spirit bomb. So if the Z manga even is still sold & we still see uub as a baby 4 year old in super volume 6 there is no fucking way any god form is stronger than a form that happens 15+ years later. Quit being stupid.
3. Therefore, no one cares if you hate GT /super or not. Like it or not, volume 6 of the super manga takes place before volume 26 of dbz. That's how the creators wrote the story. A bunch of virgins on quora/reddit does not get to decide what is fucking relevant/retconn (cAnOn) to anything. If you believe a retard on the internet rather than the developer team? You are the reason this fan base is toxic/ lost. Quit making GT/super a Democrat/ republican party group chat and stfu. Other Fandoms make fun of us bc we do stupid shit like this and ruin getting the scoops on our own lore bc you dorks made it more complicated than what it really is all while skipping over the shit you SHOULD be paying attention to. Like how there is more than one timeline in the db multiverse. But seeing as yall miss that over and over id be surprised if yall would catch onto that eventually 🤦🏾♂️
You know you’re just repeating yourself in each of those points right? Nobody is denying Super takes place before GT, I literally say that in the video and say “theoretically, every character is stronger than what they were in Super”
The same logic you’re getting at by saying “SSJ4 is stronger than the god forms just cause it takes place after UI”, does that mean Super Saiyan is stronger than Super Saiyan 3? If Goku uses Super Saiyan in GT, he’s stronger than what he was in the Buu Saga, so SSJ > SSJ3 right?
That’s not how that works, nobody hates GT. If you like SSJ4 that’s up to you but don’t beat down other people for liking god forms and thinking they’re better, THAT is what makes this community toxic.
@@InnovativeJdawg it seems you didn't get my point. I said GT/super...bc GT / super gets hate on both sides. There's a reason for me wording it the way I did.
Reason being the whole "canon" shit that no one decides to make it like ots not apart of the franchise when it is with no hard evidence to show as to why it isn't when there's irrefutable evidence everywhere that its valid in the franchise. If you truly payed attention to what I said, you wouldn't have to battle back with a deflection as to show why IM the toxic one when you didn't fully understand what I said.
1. I was referring to the people who hate God forms/super
2. The ppl who hate GT and everything about it even the ones who go sooo far as to say it isn't "cAnOn" when that term is echo chambered from reddit somewhere with no notes from akira, toyble, or anyone of that matter thus confusion/toxicity likes this endulges even further. 🤦🏾♂️ atleast try to understand me before u attack
@@InnovativeJdawg go reread # 3 where I said "no one cares if you hate GT/super or not".
So that was clearly for ppl who hate either just super, or GT regardless to what form is stronger by fact. True p can have whatever opinion they like but I see it on these comments/threads all the time how ppl get mislead with false info opinion or not also🤦🏾♂️ my job is to stop that any way I can. I bid u farewell and good luck on your channel
@@digimationentertainment9820 I didn’t attack you lol? Nobody in this comment section is hating on anything, I’m just pointing out that you’re the one who seems to have the most opinionated stance on the whole matter.
Regardless, thanks for the support, I appreciate it