Thanks for this. I just ordered the 100mm Rattmmotor linear rail from Amazon, along with the 700w Sainsmart 65mm spindle. BTW, UGS has a setup wizard (under the Machine tab) that does all the calculations for calibrating the Z-axis with the new ball screw.
I upgraded to the 900W DeWalt router instead of the default 300W motor, but never considered stiffening the Z axis. You have done a very nice upgrade, and great video. Thank you for sharing. I think I will do the same. Liked and subscribed.
@MickHealey Thanks. A new spindle is next. I'll probably go for an 800W VFD. Rigidity really helped with clean cuts despite low power. I posted converter plate file on Thingiverse, see vid description. Good luck.
Finally i found a guy like me, who s never happy with how most products are designed. So we just make everything better 😂 i bought the same z axis on aliexpress and also upgrade my crappy chinese cnc machine. Nice!!
Pretty much my mantra - everything can be fixed and made better. I am in the process of upgrading the spindle now (new videos) to 1.5 kW VFD. Thanks for watching.
Great video! My only suggestion would be to abandon the backwards mounting solution that the OEM used. You are putting all the forces through a really small area. Check out the mounting solution I used on my 3030 system using 15mm blocks. Then only the spindle itself is on the moving Z axis and the rest of the system is more rigid. Basically instead of just the spindle weight on the moving carriage, you’ve got all the weight of the entire z axis transferred through the moving carriage. You also need to throw away the rigid compression coupler, it will cause damage overtime to your motor and ball screw bearings. The flexible coupler that the OEM supplied is there for a reason.
@Cybernetic_Systems I considered reversing the mount, but I took the simplest approach. Definitely some drawbacks there. I am not clear on what you mean about the rigid compression coupler. Can you describe what you mean? Thanks.
@@adventuresinenginerding fair enough. The silver and red coupler that came with the original z axis is a flexible coupler. They are frequently called a spider or jaw coupler due to their look. They are a 3 piece design and are very good at dealing with slight alignment issues. The other type that I like are double slit couplers.
@Cybernetic_Systems Ahhh, the shaft coupler. I see your point. Thanks. I will check if I can swap them. Seems like I remember some problem that caused me to use the new one, but will replace if I can't use the OEM.
Any particular reason why you did not allow UGC to calculate and adjust the Z axis perfectly? It comes with a setup wizard to do just that and works perfectly, I did mine with a DTI gauge as a measure, though not as precise it work well with just a ruler too, worth doing the X and Y axis too as they are not perfect from the factory, that's why there is often a slight difference in what you tell it to cut and what it actually cuts. Its posible to get it down to the though.
Oh so many questions.... What RPM are you running the cutter? 10k? Its all about getting a good chip. You'll get a better cut if you use a shorter cut length cutter and choke up on it. Try 1/4in. The helix on the cutter you're using looks pretty aggressive for aluminum. Also try a 3 flute cutter. If you spray the aluminum plate your were bending with WD40 its less likely to crack when you bend it. How about re drilling the crossmember holes in the vertical support in a lower position so the moment on the gantry is less. Air is good. Fogger system is better. I think you're one step closer to getting the ok out of this machine!! Keep up the good work! I follow your channel closer than I follow Jesus!!
12K RPM. I tried 3 flute bits before the upgrade and they did a bit better, but they are more expensive and were breaking. The 1 flute bits are very inexpensive so no problem going through them. Results were not drastically worse. I'll try the 3 flute again with the upgrade. A 1/4 bit will certainly add even more rigidity and I could probably go faster when clearing material. I need to get a new collet and bits. It is on the short list. I don't want to make any more geometry mods to the machine, especially if it will lose cutting area. Plus, the other 2 axes are more rigid than the Z was and so far the new Z axis assembly seems to have mostly resolved the machine rigidity issues. My air sprayer can do a fluid fog and I would love to use it, but I have an MDF spoilboard. Water or WD-40 will make a bloated mess of that pretty quick and my work area too. Maybe I should get an aluminum table... And a higher power router... NOOOO! I need to use this thing and stop modifying it. My hope was to use it for making prototype parts for testing and refining. I think I might be there now. I have never heard the WD-40 trick to avoid cracking aluminum. Next time (hopefully never). Thanks for the tips and Thanks for watching.
@DSchachinger Thanks, that is next, but given the movement between the Z axis mount and spindle mount point, I felt it could not be highly accurate even with more power. The rigidity was improved with this upgrade. Maybe I could have gotten good results with just a new spindle. There is probably some flex in the stock spindle. Glad to hear it worked for you. Makes me more interested in that next step. What spindle are you using and do you recommend it?
@DSchachinger Also, what speeds & feeds are you using w 1/8 bit? How many flutes? Again, Thanks for any input. This is a learning process for me and I am hoping I help others as others have helped me.
Nice video. The small Spindle is not made to cut aluminum, try a bigger faster one. but the results are grate. But your machine sounds as awful as mine. Something is vibrating itself to death, but I haven't figured out what it is so far.
The spindle on these units seems pretty weak. Even after the upgrade, it sounds like a bad cut. There's a girl who reviewed several Genmitsu prouters with the stock spindle and the mikita trim router. The difference is dramatic.
Agreed. I plan to upgrade the spindle. My feeling was that without rigidity, more power still would not make clean cuts. Or I might just get a new CNC with all linear rails...
The company name is RATTMMOTOR. These can be bought from several online sources. I have no affiliation with the company, but so far I am happy. Thanks for watching.
Wow I got it in 1 day. Now I have so many more questions. What type of alloy did you use? Do you have a .dxf of the pattern for the adapter plate? I have a friend with an industrial machine that will do the cutting for me. Can you share the pattern? I'm really looking forward to this project. TIA Derek
I was looking for a link in the description where most videos post. It wasn’t obvious from a quick scan of the comments either. I had to dig down into the replies to find your comment mentioning the item.
So the motor won't drive z assembly into its mechanical limit and lose position count. It can also limit the depth into the spoilboard. This system was already set up for it.
@@adventuresinenginerding Yeah but your Z- is limited by the work piece or the bit you're using? If you calibrate a bit and it snaps at the base it will drive into the work piece and brake the motor without even allowing the limit to activate!
Thanks for the knowledge you shared just upgraded to the same z axis on your vid. Did my own bracket .... the whole nine yards.... gonna test it tomorrow! Thanks again !
throw away that spindle, they honestly suck, get something like a Makita router or a 1.5kw spindle and I guarantee that you will get much better results
Agreed . The machine comes with the mount for a dewalt router witch i use the stock spindles will get you no where besides terrible cycle time and a headache
Thanks for this. I just ordered the 100mm Rattmmotor linear rail from Amazon, along with the 700w Sainsmart 65mm spindle. BTW, UGS has a setup wizard (under the Machine tab) that does all the calculations for calibrating the Z-axis with the new ball screw.
I am in the process of upgrading the spindle now (new videos) to 1.5 kW VFD. I'll check out UGS wizard, thanks.
I upgraded to the 900W DeWalt router instead of the default 300W motor, but never considered stiffening the Z axis. You have done a very nice upgrade, and great video. Thank you for sharing. I think I will do the same. Liked and subscribed.
@MickHealey Thanks. A new spindle is next. I'll probably go for an 800W VFD. Rigidity really helped with clean cuts despite low power. I posted converter plate file on Thingiverse, see vid description. Good luck.
Finally i found a guy like me, who s never happy with how most products are designed. So we just make everything better 😂 i bought the same z axis on aliexpress and also upgrade my crappy chinese cnc machine. Nice!!
Pretty much my mantra - everything can be fixed and made better. I am in the process of upgrading the spindle now (new videos) to 1.5 kW VFD. Thanks for watching.
Great video! My only suggestion would be to abandon the backwards mounting solution that the OEM used. You are putting all the forces through a really small area. Check out the mounting solution I used on my 3030 system using 15mm blocks. Then only the spindle itself is on the moving Z axis and the rest of the system is more rigid. Basically instead of just the spindle weight on the moving carriage, you’ve got all the weight of the entire z axis transferred through the moving carriage.
You also need to throw away the rigid compression coupler, it will cause damage overtime to your motor and ball screw bearings. The flexible coupler that the OEM supplied is there for a reason.
@Cybernetic_Systems I considered reversing the mount, but I took the simplest approach. Definitely some drawbacks there.
I am not clear on what you mean about the rigid compression coupler. Can you describe what you mean? Thanks.
@@adventuresinenginerding fair enough.
The silver and red coupler that came with the original z axis is a flexible coupler. They are frequently called a spider or jaw coupler due to their look. They are a 3 piece design and are very good at dealing with slight alignment issues. The other type that I like are double slit couplers.
@Cybernetic_Systems Ahhh, the shaft coupler. I see your point. Thanks. I will check if I can swap them. Seems like I remember some problem that caused me to use the new one, but will replace if I can't use the OEM.
Good job that’s funny thanks for sharing 👍🇺🇸
Any particular reason why you did not allow UGC to calculate and adjust the Z axis perfectly? It comes with a setup wizard to do just that and works perfectly, I did mine with a DTI gauge as a measure, though not as precise it work well with just a ruler too, worth doing the X and Y axis too as they are not perfect from the factory, that's why there is often a slight difference in what you tell it to cut and what it actually cuts. Its posible to get it down to the though.
Thanks for the suggestion. I did not know about that. My accuracy has been decent but I will check it that way.
Oh so many questions....
What RPM are you running the cutter? 10k? Its all about getting a good chip.
You'll get a better cut if you use a shorter cut length cutter and choke up on it. Try 1/4in.
The helix on the cutter you're using looks pretty aggressive for aluminum. Also try a 3 flute cutter.
If you spray the aluminum plate your were bending with WD40 its less likely to crack when you bend it.
How about re drilling the crossmember holes in the vertical support in a lower position so the moment on the gantry is less.
Air is good. Fogger system is better.
I think you're one step closer to getting the ok out of this machine!!
Keep up the good work! I follow your channel closer than I follow Jesus!!
12K RPM. I tried 3 flute bits before the upgrade and they did a bit better, but they are more expensive and were breaking. The 1 flute bits are very inexpensive so no problem going through them. Results were not drastically worse. I'll try the 3 flute again with the upgrade. A 1/4 bit will certainly add even more rigidity and I could probably go faster when clearing material. I need to get a new collet and bits. It is on the short list.
I don't want to make any more geometry mods to the machine, especially if it will lose cutting area. Plus, the other 2 axes are more rigid than the Z was and so far the new Z axis assembly seems to have mostly resolved the machine rigidity issues.
My air sprayer can do a fluid fog and I would love to use it, but I have an MDF spoilboard. Water or WD-40 will make a bloated mess of that pretty quick and my work area too. Maybe I should get an aluminum table... And a higher power router... NOOOO! I need to use this thing and stop modifying it. My hope was to use it for making prototype parts for testing and refining. I think I might be there now.
I have never heard the WD-40 trick to avoid cracking aluminum. Next time (hopefully never).
Thanks for the tips and Thanks for watching.
Just upgrade the spindle.
I never have any problems with the z axis.
With the weight of the 1,5kw spindle i have i can cut full speed with an 8mm bit
@DSchachinger Thanks, that is next, but given the movement between the Z axis mount and spindle mount point, I felt it could not be highly accurate even with more power. The rigidity was improved with this upgrade. Maybe I could have gotten good results with just a new spindle. There is probably some flex in the stock spindle. Glad to hear it worked for you. Makes me more interested in that next step.
What spindle are you using and do you recommend it?
@DSchachinger Also, what speeds & feeds are you using w 1/8 bit? How many flutes? Again, Thanks for any input. This is a learning process for me and I am hoping I help others as others have helped me.
Nice video. The small Spindle is not made to cut aluminum, try a bigger faster one. but the results are grate. But your machine sounds as awful as mine. Something is vibrating itself to death, but I haven't figured out what it is so far.
I think you are right about the spindle. The Z axis linear rail upgrade made it a lot quieter, though.
The spindle on these units seems pretty weak. Even after the upgrade, it sounds like a bad cut. There's a girl who reviewed several Genmitsu prouters with the stock spindle and the mikita trim router. The difference is dramatic.
Agreed. I plan to upgrade the spindle. My feeling was that without rigidity, more power still would not make clean cuts. Or I might just get a new CNC with all linear rails...
Cool! Can you tell me where did you get the linear rails?
The company name is RATTMMOTOR. These can be bought from several online sources. I have no affiliation with the company, but so far I am happy. Thanks for watching.
👌🏻
I'd like to upgrade the vertical brackets on each side of the x carriage. Best options for this?
@ydeardorff Have you measured flex there? You could add some angle stock to stiffen them up on the existing mount points if that is an issue.
Upgrade from that wonky cheap spindle to a Jainken spindle. Better and much more stable.
@slotcartires a more powerful spindle is on the todo list. Thanks.
Which rattmmotor z axis linear rail kit did you buy?
RATTMMOTOR ZBX80 100mm
Wow I got it in 1 day. Now I have so many more questions. What type of alloy did you use? Do you have a .dxf of the pattern for the adapter plate? I have a friend with an industrial machine that will do the cutting for me. Can you share the pattern? I'm really looking forward to this project.
TIA
Derek
@@Gemitaur I added the FreeCAD file to Thingiverse. Please see video comments for link. 6061 Aluminum, 1/8" x 4" x 12". Good luck with your upgrade.
Would you share a link to the new z axis assembly you used?
Dude I asked him that I even gave you the name of the item . I got it on amazon!
I was looking for a link in the description where most videos post. It wasn’t obvious from a quick scan of the comments either. I had to dig down into the replies to find your comment mentioning the item.
100mm linear z .... rattmotor is the name of the company . They sell it on amazon
Why do you have two end stops on the Z axis?
So the motor won't drive z assembly into its mechanical limit and lose position count. It can also limit the depth into the spoilboard. This system was already set up for it.
@@adventuresinenginerding Yeah but your Z- is limited by the work piece or the bit you're using? If you calibrate a bit and it snaps at the base it will drive into the work piece and brake the motor without even allowing the limit to activate!
Do you have a link to the upgraded z axis
Please see my response to sdgrayer. Thanks.
Is this the 100mm from rattmottor?
Yes, 100mm RATTMMOTOR. Original ProverXL is 110mm, but no functional loss for my use. So far, a good upgrade.
@adventuresinenginerding hey thanks for responding ! Cool!
Thanks for the knowledge you shared just upgraded to the same z axis on your vid. Did my own bracket .... the whole nine yards.... gonna test it tomorrow! Thanks again !
@@velcrodreams178 Great, thanks. Post back how it goes and what other mods you have.
@@adventuresinenginerding sounds good will do !
throw away that spindle, they honestly suck, get something like a Makita router or a 1.5kw spindle and I guarantee that you will get much better results
I replaced it with a Modell (Mafell) FM1000 with Quick Change System. Really nice when you have a program with 5 tool changes 😊
Agreed . The machine comes with the mount for a dewalt router witch i use the stock spindles will get you no where besides terrible cycle time and a headache