Envy green, like it. Great vlog, yes ref Max Grant, in warmer workshops, ref >20°C, ISO 68 is fine, if I may add, maybe ISO 46 hydraulic for the head, I use ISO 32 , as recommended by my modern machine manufacturers. I changed to 46 for the head on my old Colchester lathe to reduce the clutch noise. My workshop here in the UK, is kept to minimum of 10°C. I've seen guys use ATF fluid in heads with no problems, another issue is using EP year oil in machines with bronze bushings, the additives attack these. Thanks for sharing and stay safe all.
You cant go too far wrong with 68 for everything ! You will never have to worry about changing the oil on that lathe , the most work it will see is your elbow grease polishing it .... Sorry Aaron couldn't resist it !!!! Cheers .
I have used the Sure Shot for many years and one problem that occurs when it doesn't spray properly is that a small piece of dirt of foreign object is stuck in the nozzle. removing the nozzle and blowing air back through it or using a welding tip cleaner of proper size will clean it out.
Agree, old congealed grease is like compacted ear wax,the hours you can waste & the fun you can have with auto grease lines/feeders & having to remove them for soaking to unblock/purge them.And old oil lines can give you hours of grief when they block with crud,or pipes rot out if steel.
Thank you for the great video ! One tip, you could use your Vactra 2 Way oil in the Apron and for the Bijur Pump, it is an perfect substitution for the Socony Way Oil mentioned in the Manual. Assumed the Bed Ways are oiled from the oil supply of the Apron
I may be wrong but this is what I do. ISO 68 DTE heavy medium in the headstock and vactra #2 way oil (also ISO 68 I believe) for the ways. The DTE oil is for circulation the Way oil is for sliding surfaces. FYI my series 61 is dated 1958 and my book is identical to yours. It also says 5 gal in the headstock. The 1st time I put oil in it with the top cover removed I dumped a gallon at a time in it. When I dumped the 4th gallon it basically ran out the headstock bearing into the chip pan. Seemed to level off at 3 gallons. That is the way I've ran it for 20 years. Some heavy production parts where the headstock gets really warm during the course of a day, but mostly med to lite duty. Always fires up and performs remarkably.
Did it go through the slot down at the bottom of the headstock? Or was it right under the main bearing? I have weeping out of that slot and I’m not sure where it’s coming from. My guess is from the quick change box but I’m not sure.
@@AlwaysSunnyintheShop It only did it once about 20 yrs ago because I haven't "overfilled" it since. But if I remember correctly it was out of the main bearing. Apparently there isn't any seal there just probably a shield. I never really investigated it further. Just filled it to its happy place and went on with life. The level in the sight glass looks fine too. I'm just about ready to change it again also.
There's normally a labyrinth seal on the front bearing that will drain off an overfill. The 10EE has an overflow line off the back of the headstock under the main pulley that drains to the pan on top of the gearbox, draining into the chip tray. I suspect that's because the 2 bearing dumps can drain into the headstock oil and it's easy to overfill.
Your bull-eyes/sight glasses have a white background and are so easy to read. Is this factory original or something you added? I'd love to be able to see the level in my 16CY without having to go all Sherlock Holmes on the bull-eyes. Thanks for the timely video! I just pulled my Monarch apart for a paint job and will be ordering all new lube in the next week or so.
This is my dream lathe! Yours is a beautiful :) We have one at work that I'm trying to reallocate to my division's shop....I would have tried the upper fitting first with the Sure Shot. That would be a reverse-blow cleaning since you already know the lower one is not blocked - by the evidence of the new grease slinging inside the housing. Maybe some safety wire as a auger followed by a blast with an air hose nozzle tip.
Sadly I tried the Sure Shot in the upper tube- I sprayed back in my face! I used some stainless TIG rod to try and swish around the grease, but it didn't work. Taking it all apart was the right call, now that I've seen what the inside looks like. New video coming very soon.
Aaron, I've just watched an Instagram series from Adam Booth (Abom79) who stripped the clutch on his Monarch Lathe. I don't think it's the same model as yours but it was instructive to see the clutch in its separate parts.
Do you have a vacuum pump. And something like a 2"x12" galvanized pipe nipple. Bell reducers for both ends perhaps some bushing reducers. A few feet of bulk behind the autozone counter 11/32"pcv hose and some hose barbs to fit the PC hose and the bushing reducers. Allowing you to create a vacuum purge tank to hook to the vacuum pump. This may allow you to evacuate stiff grease behind zirc fittings on other machines also. You will probably want some chore boy or scotch bright pad in the top to shield the suction port from a direct hit of goop. Changing the vacuum pump oil twice after you are done. . There are also tube deflators that use compressed air . Screw a valve stem in it as a suction tube and make a hella mess like an impressionist artist working in grease spatter.
Obviously I have no idea what’s going on here but I couldn’t help thinking how I’d wish to push the solvent through the upper port and catch it out of the lower port, maybe adding a pipe nipple and elbow on the bottom to hang a little can on. Undoubtedly, that would force gunk out the tailstock and into the chuck! ;-)
That would have been great, unfortunately the packed in grease was way too much for anything to help. After I took everything apart the grooves for grease were completely jammed up with hard grease. Disassembly was really the only option- I'm glad I didn't waste any more time on the flushing effort.
Not all "zerk" fitttings are for grease. It seems like yours probably are, but I thought it was worth mentioning. My milling machine has a number of zerk fittings for an oil gun. And, in common with many other machines that have these (including the venerable Myford lathe) the first job any new owner of an old machine has to do is strip the machine down to get the grease out of the oil ways. I don't know if there is any way to tell by inspection of the fitting is for oil or grease: www.myford.co.uk/acatalog/PACK-OF-10-2BA-OIL-NIPPLES--33-072-1870.html
That’s a good thing to point out, as a lot of Bridgeport mills have been wrecked by people grabbing a grease gun when oil was the proper lube. For the zerks on my compound, they feed the crown gears that make the power feed work, so grease it is.
I wouldn't dare to use oil without the sticky additives on the ways, but if you have constant lubrication and a bit more flow that doesn't probably hurt anything.
Yeah I'm guessing Monarch calls for circulating oil on the ways because the carriage pumps oil whenever it's moving. Without that happening then Vactra 2 would be the way to go.
Most on the Monarch lathes use a Bijur pump in the apron with meter units at the way points in the apron and the saddle. Normally I'd suggest staying with a way oil but it looks like someone's removed the connection to the saddle from the apron so the DTE oil might be the right one. I'd still use way oil (Vacuoline 1409 is the original spec to Vactra #2) in the one-shot on the back of the saddle if it is in fact feeding the ways. I'd also suggest using it with the tailstock.
@@AlwaysSunnyintheShop ah, you should show it, at least we'll know you did. I use pipe cleaners sometimes i add a piece of music wire to the pipe cleaner to be able to push it through... sometimes it works, and sometimes , well...
@@jsteifel Yeah I always have to cut a lot of footage to make the videos watchable. I worked it with TIG wire for a while, shot with Brakleen, worked it some more, then more Brakleen. After it took it apart it was clear the Brakleen would never have worked. Disassembly video coming out in a few hours!
Yeah they sell oil for machinery 💰💰💰 i asked my self that question and what's wrong with other oils like ATF for Automotive Automatic Transmissions 😨 So i put it to the Test years ago and there's been NO FAILURES EVER SO WHAT'S GOOD ENOUGH FOR AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSIONS IS GOOD ENOUGH FOR A LATHE , MILL ect. 🐤🐤😁
Except on some types of bronze bushing material on the older machines it's known to be incompatible with some high detergent oils. Since there's no real way to tell if it may or may not be a problem ahead of time your trusting to luck. I've spent over 40 years operating heavy mobile equipment where proper lubrication doesn't get done by using whatever oil is handy or cheap. I also learned a long time ago that machine tool manufactures and lubrication engineers are a whole lot smarter than I am. The proper recommended lubes aren't that hard to get nor are they that expensive. High detergent oils such as most of today's motor oils and that ATF are specifically designed to keep contamination in suspension until it reaches the filter so there meant to be used in a pressurized and filtered system. Gear box sumps in say a lathe use a very different oil so contamination drops out of suspension as quickly as possible and stays on the bottom so it then isn't being continuously circulated through the gearing and bearings. So I have to completely disagree, ATF just isn't good enough for a lathe or mill and for some very logical reasons. Then there's way oil, it has tacifiers added for vertical way surfaces, and it also has additives to prevent stick /slip that ATF simply doesn't have. I've tried lots of other oils and have yet to find anything better than the proper way oil because of how it's designed to work. Imo the more you understand about how different oils are formulated and how there designed to function in specific situations then the less likely it is to not use what the manufacturer recommends.
@@taunusmechanics3121 I make racecar parts specialist tool and. Die work and ATF DEXTRON is handy and it's used in machinery allso i started using it over 20 year's ago without problems .🐤 .
Machinists irrationally passionate about something....no way..lol..at the end of the day some lubricant is better then no lubricant.. Doe this machine use a friction clutch like a motorcycle or an automatic transmission? Multi disk?
Envy green, like it.
Great vlog, yes ref Max Grant, in warmer workshops, ref >20°C, ISO 68 is fine, if I may add, maybe ISO 46 hydraulic for the head, I use ISO 32 , as recommended by my modern machine manufacturers. I changed to 46 for the head on my old Colchester lathe to reduce the clutch noise.
My workshop here in the UK, is kept to minimum of 10°C. I've seen guys use ATF fluid in heads with no problems, another issue is using EP year oil in machines with bronze bushings, the additives attack these.
Thanks for sharing and stay safe all.
Always good to be able to get things fixed right even when it’s sometimes a lot of work.
Well, this next video or two should be very interesting! Thanks!
You cant go too far wrong with 68 for everything ! You will never have to worry about changing the oil on that lathe , the most work it will see is your elbow grease polishing it .... Sorry Aaron couldn't resist it !!!! Cheers .
I have used the Sure Shot for many years and one problem that occurs when it doesn't spray properly is that a small piece of dirt of foreign object is stuck in the nozzle. removing the nozzle and blowing air back through it or using a welding tip cleaner of proper size will clean it out.
Agree, old congealed grease is like compacted ear wax,the hours you can waste & the fun you can have with auto grease lines/feeders & having to remove them for soaking to unblock/purge them.And old oil lines can give you hours of grief when they block with crud,or pipes rot out if steel.
Thank you, Aaron. I hope you and yours are doing well.
Thank you for the great video !
One tip, you could use your Vactra 2 Way oil in the Apron and for the Bijur Pump, it is an perfect substitution for the Socony Way Oil mentioned in the Manual.
Assumed the Bed Ways are oiled from the oil supply of the Apron
Damn thats one PRETTY lathe!!!
I may be wrong but this is what I do. ISO 68 DTE heavy medium in the headstock and vactra #2 way oil (also ISO 68 I believe) for the ways. The DTE oil is for circulation the Way oil is for sliding surfaces. FYI my series 61 is dated 1958 and my book is identical to yours. It also says 5 gal in the headstock. The 1st time I put oil in it with the top cover removed I dumped a gallon at a time in it. When I dumped the 4th gallon it basically ran out the headstock bearing into the chip pan. Seemed to level off at 3 gallons. That is the way I've ran it for 20 years. Some heavy production parts where the headstock gets really warm during the course of a day, but mostly med to lite duty. Always fires up and performs remarkably.
Did it go through the slot down at the bottom of the headstock? Or was it right under the main bearing? I have weeping out of that slot and I’m not sure where it’s coming from. My guess is from the quick change box but I’m not sure.
@@AlwaysSunnyintheShop It only did it once about 20 yrs ago because I haven't "overfilled" it since. But if I remember correctly it was out of the main bearing. Apparently there isn't any seal there just probably a shield. I never really investigated it further. Just filled it to its happy place and went on with life. The level in the sight glass looks fine too. I'm just about ready to change it again also.
There's normally a labyrinth seal on the front bearing that will drain off an overfill. The 10EE has an overflow line off the back of the headstock under the main pulley that drains to the pan on top of the gearbox, draining into the chip tray. I suspect that's because the 2 bearing dumps can drain into the headstock oil and it's easy to overfill.
Your bull-eyes/sight glasses have a white background and are so easy to read. Is this factory original or something you added? I'd love to be able to see the level in my 16CY without having to go all Sherlock Holmes on the bull-eyes.
Thanks for the timely video! I just pulled my Monarch apart for a paint job and will be ordering all new lube in the next week or so.
Yes, they are factory. Monarch still sells new ones, though they aren't too cheap. Your glass may also need replacing.
This is my dream lathe! Yours is a beautiful :) We have one at work that I'm trying to reallocate to my division's shop....I would have tried the upper fitting first with the Sure Shot. That would be a reverse-blow cleaning since you already know the lower one is not blocked - by the evidence of the new grease slinging inside the housing. Maybe some safety wire as a auger followed by a blast with an air hose nozzle tip.
Sadly I tried the Sure Shot in the upper tube- I sprayed back in my face! I used some stainless TIG rod to try and swish around the grease, but it didn't work. Taking it all apart was the right call, now that I've seen what the inside looks like. New video coming very soon.
Right out of the box the sure shot for me had clogged nozzles, both of them
That's going to be a fun tear down.
Fun for you to watch, maybe. Not for me to do! 😂
Aaron, I've just watched an Instagram series from Adam Booth (Abom79) who stripped the clutch on his Monarch Lathe. I don't think it's the same model as yours but it was instructive to see the clutch in its separate parts.
Thanks- I actually shared how I did it with him before he took his apart 😁. Kinda funny that we were both working on this at the same time.
Do you have a vacuum pump. And something like a 2"x12" galvanized pipe nipple. Bell reducers for both ends perhaps some bushing reducers. A few feet of bulk behind the autozone counter 11/32"pcv hose and some hose barbs to fit the PC hose and the bushing reducers. Allowing you to create a vacuum purge tank to hook to the vacuum pump. This may allow you to evacuate stiff grease behind zirc fittings on other machines also. You will probably want some chore boy or scotch bright pad in the top to shield the suction port from a direct hit of goop. Changing the vacuum pump oil twice after you are done. . There are also tube deflators that use compressed air . Screw a valve stem in it as a suction tube and make a hella mess like an impressionist artist working in grease spatter.
I'm in Goodyear. What hardware store in Phoenix did you get your Sure Shot rebuild kit from?
McFadden Dale on 32nd Street south of Broadway
McFadden dale?
Obviously I have no idea what’s going on here but I couldn’t help thinking how I’d wish to push the solvent through the upper port and catch it out of the lower port, maybe adding a pipe nipple and elbow on the bottom to hang a little can on. Undoubtedly, that would force gunk out the tailstock and into the chuck! ;-)
That would have been great, unfortunately the packed in grease was way too much for anything to help. After I took everything apart the grooves for grease were completely jammed up with hard grease. Disassembly was really the only option- I'm glad I didn't waste any more time on the flushing effort.
Hi I just got a lablond lathe how did you convert the type of oil called for fromThe manufacture to the type of lubricants that are made today
Lots of google searching- there was a thread on Practical Machinist that helped me, but yeah, I just had to find it online.
@@AlwaysSunnyintheShop I just needed my sky hook today
Not all "zerk" fitttings are for grease. It seems like yours probably are, but I thought it was worth mentioning. My milling machine has a number of zerk fittings for an oil gun.
And, in common with many other machines that have these (including the venerable Myford lathe) the first job any new owner of an old machine has to do is strip the machine down to get the grease out of the oil ways.
I don't know if there is any way to tell by inspection of the fitting is for oil or grease: www.myford.co.uk/acatalog/PACK-OF-10-2BA-OIL-NIPPLES--33-072-1870.html
That’s a good thing to point out, as a lot of Bridgeport mills have been wrecked by people grabbing a grease gun when oil was the proper lube. For the zerks on my compound, they feed the crown gears that make the power feed work, so grease it is.
I wouldn't dare to use oil without the sticky additives on the ways, but if you have constant lubrication and a bit more flow that doesn't probably hurt anything.
Yeah I'm guessing Monarch calls for circulating oil on the ways because the carriage pumps oil whenever it's moving. Without that happening then Vactra 2 would be the way to go.
Most on the Monarch lathes use a Bijur pump in the apron with meter units at the way points in the apron and the saddle. Normally I'd suggest staying with a way oil but it looks like someone's removed the connection to the saddle from the apron so the DTE oil might be the right one. I'd still use way oil (Vacuoline 1409 is the original spec to Vactra #2) in the one-shot on the back of the saddle if it is in fact feeding the ways. I'd also suggest using it with the tailstock.
why didn't you try to work it from the other port, maybe loosen it on that side?
I did, just didn’t show it. The pressure built up a bit then sprayed me with brake cleaner.
@@AlwaysSunnyintheShop ah, you should show it, at least we'll know you did. I use pipe cleaners sometimes i add a piece of music wire to the pipe cleaner to be able to push it through... sometimes it works, and sometimes , well...
@@jsteifel Yeah I always have to cut a lot of footage to make the videos watchable. I worked it with TIG wire for a while, shot with Brakleen, worked it some more, then more Brakleen. After it took it apart it was clear the Brakleen would never have worked. Disassembly video coming out in a few hours!
I worked Maintainance I know where most of the industrial supply stores in my area are
That's not going to be a short job!
"Looks like earwax", but how does it smell???
Yeah they sell oil for machinery 💰💰💰 i asked my self that question and what's wrong with other oils like ATF for Automotive Automatic Transmissions 😨 So i put it to the Test years ago and there's been NO FAILURES EVER SO WHAT'S GOOD ENOUGH FOR AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSIONS IS GOOD ENOUGH FOR A LATHE , MILL ect. 🐤🐤😁
Except on some types of bronze bushing material on the older machines it's known to be incompatible with some high detergent oils. Since there's no real way to tell if it may or may not be a problem ahead of time your trusting to luck. I've spent over 40 years operating heavy mobile equipment where proper lubrication doesn't get done by using whatever oil is handy or cheap. I also learned a long time ago that machine tool manufactures and lubrication engineers are a whole lot smarter than I am. The proper recommended lubes aren't that hard to get nor are they that expensive. High detergent oils such as most of today's motor oils and that ATF are specifically designed to keep contamination in suspension until it reaches the filter so there meant to be used in a pressurized and filtered system. Gear box sumps in say a lathe use a very different oil so contamination drops out of suspension as quickly as possible and stays on the bottom so it then isn't being continuously circulated through the gearing and bearings. So I have to completely disagree, ATF just isn't good enough for a lathe or mill and for some very logical reasons. Then there's way oil, it has tacifiers added for vertical way surfaces, and it also has additives to prevent stick /slip that ATF simply doesn't have. I've tried lots of other oils and have yet to find anything better than the proper way oil because of how it's designed to work. Imo the more you understand about how different oils are formulated and how there designed to function in specific situations then the less likely it is to not use what the manufacturer recommends.
Don't know where you tried to buy machine oil, normally a simple circulating oil is way cheaper than any ATF
@@taunusmechanics3121 I make racecar parts specialist tool and. Die work and ATF DEXTRON is handy and it's used in machinery allso i started using it over 20 year's ago without problems .🐤 .
My theory is keep it clean, wet and slippery.
Machinists irrationally passionate about something....no way..lol..at the end of the day some lubricant is better then no lubricant..
Doe this machine use a friction clutch like a motorcycle or an automatic transmission? Multi disk?
Two steel discs with a friction plate in between. The friction material is about 1/2” thick which was surprising to me. Nice and beefy.
@@AlwaysSunnyintheShop very cool. The clutch on my hendey more closely resembles a metal drum brake assembly
1st time 1st !!!