What You're Doing WRONG in Your Activities Section-With Examples! (Med School App: Extracurriculars)
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- Опубліковано 5 жов 2024
- Your activity descriptions play a KEY role in telling your story through the med school application. But most students are wasting this opportunity with very un-impactful writing. Today I'm breaking down the biggest mistakes made in the "work and activities" section of the application, and how to write more impactful EC descriptions!
Work experience: 7:32
Tutoring: 11:45
Hobby: 14:28
Research: 15:16
Research Assistant: 18:02
Work: 20:28
Research2: 22:28
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Shadowing: 26:45
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As an applicant to medical school, your extracurriculars matter. Not just which ones you do or how many hours you accumulate, but also how you write about them. What you want to convey is IMPACT-how you impacted people through the activity, and how the activity impacted you.
Some specific points I cover about your extracurricular essays in this video:
• How the activities section and extracurricular descriptions differ between AMCAS, AACOMAS, and TMDSAS.
• How the "most meaningful" activity essays work.
• Which application service allows you to include FUTURE activities on your application.
• Why you should AVOID bullet-point formats and writing like a resume or job description in your EC descriptions.
• What to focus on to show actual impact in your activity descriptions.
• What the real point of the med school application is.
• How to be more SUBTLE about showing the characteristics you built through your activity descriptions.
• How to tell a story that gives the reader an engaging mental movie in their head.
• Why you should NOT overtly sell yourself in your ECs.
• Why you should include hobbies in your extracurriculars.
• How to tell stories about the research you've done on your premed path.
• How a "take-home message" at the end of your activity descriptions can clarify and emphasize impact.
• How specific numbers can help you show impact without selling yourself or making unsupported claims.
• Why I would NOT mark shadowing as a "most meaning activity" on your application.
• Another way you can show impact and show who you are, even when you're NOT telling a story in your activity descriptions.
If you're working on your application now, another video to check out is my "8 Tips for the Med School Personal Statement": • 8 Tips for Writing You...
without these videos, i would literally make every single mistake that you discuss. Thank you so much
im sad i didnt find him sooner lol
"every single mistake" is funny🤣
💯💯
Pretty much become an author, writer, poet etc and then apply to medical school, (obviously after completing 4500+ hours of scribing, volunteering, research, internship, extracurriculars and extremely difficult coursework maintaining a 3.7-4.0 gpa and 515+ mcat)
It’s 700 characters 😭 like 5 sentences cmon bro
You forgot curing cancer and starting a non profit that has pulled 100 million people out of poverty
@@eknoorsandhu2349you in med school?
@@eknoorsandhu2349 Yeah, how the fuck am I supposed to write about 4 years worth of military experience in 700 characters? I'm debating splitting it into however many different "experiences" it takes to get it all down. Then, if I happen to get an interview and they ask why I have 50+ activities, I fantasize about saying something smart alecky about why they only allow 700 characters but want us to tell a fucking story.
Related tangent - AMCAS is an absolute trash application service. It seems like every single step I have to Google how to do it properly so I don't get my app kicked back. And you know what I see when I Google these things? People with the same questions on SDN and Reddit from years back to literally 2002 - present. The shit is not clear and has been minimally updated to fix their trash because they know we have to pay them and go through the process regardless. I cannot wait to finally be in so I can openly talk mad shit about everyone who is part of this scummy, scam process.
Another thing - Nobody in their right mind just LOVES volunteering from the goodness of their heart. That's a bunch of bullshit. If they did, you'd see a lot more doctors continuing this sort of activity later in life. Yes, some do - a tiny percentage of practicing physicians.
I've had this discussion with many others in the process, and alot of people agree with me. We're just not allowed to talk about it without being incognito. Just be a fake person until you get what you want. Maybe that's why "imposter syndrome" is so rampant, think about it.
chill out lmfao
I swear to you writing these sections like this NEVER occurred to me. This is actually the most helpful thing ever
lesson learned: tell stories in the description of activities listed. Don't sell yourself by explaining what you learned from those activities.
Would love to see a suggestion about how to talk about a corporate job/internship. I haven't found any suggestions online. Corporate jobs don't have cute, meaningful stories about helping Timmy with his homework. Right now I feel like "I helped a rich company get richer and worked 40 hours a week at a cube"
Talk about co workers or customers you resonated with?
Agree.
Lol a little late, but I felt like I learned a lot about problem solving, innovation, and working as a team in my non-clinical internships. I think all those things will translate nicely in any medical discipline.
Talk about working in a team environment to accomplish shared goals for the company
@@benjohnson6636 my friend isn't that exactly what he doesn't want us to say haha?
The video did come in at an opportune time :D
Right!! Guessing you're a fellow applicant?
Holy shit. I'm a re-applicant, 514 mcat, 3.97 gpa but I feel my writing is lackluster, as well as really writing out how I feel. I definitely needed this. Thanks! 👌
my shadowing is meaningful, because my surgeon who fixed my acl is who mentored me and guided me into medicine, very impactful in my life
Even as a pre-dental these videos are LIFE SAVERS
Thank you so much Dr. Gray. I got accepted to 1 MD and 3 DO schools despite a low MCAT because of all your videos. I was able to write a good apps without anybody but me and help of chatGPT lol. Your advices are gold. I hope every applicant knows and watches your videos to personage their own stories!
Thank you for these videos! They are getting me through this application.
My only question is about research. You say you need a story with them as well and not just list what you did. All the good examples were clinical research where you interact with a patient. What about bench work? Sometimes there isn't really story worthy that happens except you did your responsibilities and liked it. I have a lot of psychology research and I had to make everything as standardized as possible so I honestly couldn't tell you any stories if I wanted to because all the sessions were so similar.
Your channel is one of the most helpful I have ever seen on the internet. You have provided free mentoring for students that may not have any knowledge on how to create an application that will stand out.
Ahh Dr. Gray you will never know how much you have encouraged and helped me, this helped my writer's block SO much. Seriously, thank you!!!
We need a TMDSAS example!
Dr. Gray what’s your skin care routine?! Lolll
lol. Genetics?!
@@MedicalSchoolHQ Bruh, that's a question I bet you didn't think you'd get Dr. Gray lol.
Perfect timing for this video! You gave me the push of confidence I needed to get my activities section finished. Thank you Dr. Gray!
love this! the stories are infinitely more interesting than just the list of tasks.
Your channel is a gem! You talk about everything I was doubting about 😍
I have two options for ma any advice;
Due to a large staff, provider and patient turnover, in the midst of a pandemic. With no other options, I was to take the role of MA, front desk, and part time manager in my second week. I was nervous, but I knew it was an opportunity for growth and learning. Overtime I built trust that allowed me to manage meetings with Lab representatives as the main point of contact. I was not only interested in the medical side of labs, learning what each biomarker tested, but also in the management that went along with working the Dr. to create custom labs for patients. What I loved the most was the primary care aspect, seeing the progress patients were making over the course of each visit.
Second
While I loved working all the MA duties, doing injections, taking vitals, writing the subjective, and creating custom lab panels with the DR. and lab reps for patients. My favorite task was working with the little kids. Most of the patients were adults, so taking care of a newborn or a child was a treat. Being the only male and a 22-year-old college student at that, no one expected me to be the one warm and fuzzy person that played with the tiaras and princess dresses when three young girls came in. Growing up with two sisters this was my wheelhouse. I also knew not many kids love going to the doctor; my goal was to make it enjoyable and seeing a smile on their faces confirmed just that.
It would be great if there was a video on designating oneself "disadvantaged" on your application. How do I know if I should put disadvantaged status? (because it is always easy to point to someone else who is more disadvantaged). And, if so, what is the best way to use the space they provide you with to explain your disadvantage?
I believe he has a video on this topic. I watched it today and it was super helpful!
If some activities (esp. clinically related) begin our senior years, will your perception be that it was merely checkboxing? The reality for many of us is that we had planned things during this time which was canceled and ultimately had to be postponed until later on.
Stuff that was supposed to happen now but missed will be expected. I wouldn’t worry about it. There will be a COVID question for many secondaries and the AACOMAS primary
holy cow this is helpful, after watching this I wrote a paragraph on my research and it sounds so much better! Thanks Dr. Gray!
All I can say is THANK YOU!!!
Opening up my OTCAS application and rewriting my experience section from tasks completed (bullet form) into a story takeaway experience.
For the most meaningful experiences should we just tell 2 different stories for the initial 700 and the 1350 after?
I have the same question 🤔
I was wondering the same thing! Dr. Gray please help us!
Same. I was just working on that today.
following
Following
Thanks for your time and the breakdown of the activity section do’s and don’ts. In terms of the hobbies, if it is something you have been doing your entire life, and continue to do at the present moment, how do I go about the hrs? Do I put an estimate of overall hours or should I record the hours I dedicate to my hobby currently?
Guesstimate
How is this content free.... great stuff!
This is an amazing video. I was about to make a lot of these mistakes!
I think I'll name my son after you. I mean my husband's middle name is Ryan too but still. You rock.
One of the corrections I find myself making quite often is that there is a difference between telling a story and writing a work of fiction. Students appear to be confused by the word “story” and try to write their personal statement in the active voice ex: “As I looked out across the crowded ER…” it’s so incredibly jarring as an app reviewer to see that. I wonder if you’d be willing to use a few examples like that in your “bad” or “needs improvement” pile. They also try to use this strategy in their activities section and it takes the reader right out of the correct mind frame to review an application. I’d say about 60% try to use this approach when they hear “tell us a story.” You’re right on the money with your recommendations, but students are not interpreting the messaging correctly.
Would you mind looking over my personal statement? I'm not sure if I am doing what you stated and would love some advice!
If 60% of students are making mistakes, I am pretty sure it's not really their fault at that point...
@@biglaser711 - I’d agree which is why I asked Dr. Gray to clarify this approach. It’s not widely understood.
Doing my activities right now. Thank you for the tips!
Thank you so much for this, this is a great video to release during the midst of med school applications.
I have been waiting for this!!! So excited!
This video did come at the perfect time. I'm a senior in high school!
Dr. Gray your like a psychic! I’m spending all day today on these essays and just happened to see if you had a video on them during my break lol
This video is phenomenal! Where have you been all my life?! Lol just bought your book, phenomenal material!
Can't wait for that Premed book!! Also I am a Supplemental Instructor for my school which is basically a tutor, should I just assume that med school committees know what an SI is?
Thank you so much! Gotta go fix my whole application lol
How do you recommend going about activities in TMDSAS?
would it be the same way?
thank you Dr. Grey!!! I needed this!
Wow, thank you so much for this. I never thought or knew to write this section like this.
I wish I could just spend an hour with you and show you my application lol
I really wish you could destroy my activities section before I hit submit 😩
Me: going back and changing everything. 😂😂
You are truly THE best Dr. Gray!!
Hi Dr. Gray. My undergrad prehealth committee, including an adcom from my undergrad's MD admissions, suggests we do use this space to include everything we did in order to clarify our role. I understand it's usually basic and straightforward for something like shadowing or tutoring, but a lot of non-clinical or even clinical volunteering roles have many responsibilities/aspects that aren't intuitive to the reader. Unfortunately that space, especially when also applying to AACOMAS, doesn't give way to this kind of storytelling. Most of our spaces may end up being really describing the variety of tasks required for a certain role, or explaining organizations that are unique and specific. What do you make of this situation?
This is the general advice I have received as well from my pre-health committee. I feel like making a flowery story prevents you from explaining unique jobs or organizations/experiences you've been apart of. For me, it's a challenge to create an easy to read story depicting that I extracted data from 1000s of patient charts as a part of a retrospective study I did for a hospital. Much easier for me to describe the work that I did, which is hopefully impressive for an undergrad.
@@David-vu1xq Right. I understand this storytelling for the PS, most meaningful activities, or even giving basic snippets for super straightforward things like waitressing. It makes sense that readers want a real sense of who you are. But leaving out a lot of stuff that you did for the sake of a story when you have 600-700 characters seems counterintuitive.
The one in this video about the child with CP is a sweet story but I genuinely have no clue about this person's responsibilities after reading it. I presume this student wasn't a physical therapist, so what was their actual role there? I gain nothing about their competencies or reflection from their "intensity of emotions" or "joy of her body's buoyancy." It just seems vague and dramatic.
@@BonesBelieber1424 I think there is a balance and I wrestle with which is the best approach. Don't get me wrong some roles need to be explained more with less stories hands down! Let's take the story about the child with CP again, thinking of the entry as a whole which includes experience type, name, total hours, and org name would that application reviewer / adcomm, who is surrounded by the healthcare field and reads 1000s of applications, need the student to use the few alloted characters to explain what a physical therapy tech does and his/her commitment to their job ? I wouldn't think so because the reviewer sees your total hours and intuitively knows what PT techs do to an extent.
And as far as competencies when I read this entry I think regardless of if this student was doing volunteer or paid employment, implementing exercises/activities (probably under the direction of a PT at some clinic or facility) for children with disabilities such as CP shows: Service Orientation, Teamwork, Reliability and Dependability and by the definition maybe even Social skills without saying I am a team player. I have a heart for service. I am hard working. I enjoy my job etc.
@@corrie3161 If they wrote "PT tech" I agree with you there; I assumed they had just put volunteer. I still don't love the description of "rush of emotions" and joy of buoyancy thing. Therapy pools are common in PT, and maybe it's the English major in me but all I got out of the description was "one of the patients had CP."
Almost all volunteering demonstrates being service-oriented and reliability/dependability. Not sure where the teamwork was here either. In my opinion, the story needed more substance to show the student's role and responsibilities, even if through story. I do like the part about the patient fighting the rigidity and it being a specific example, but the reflection and the student's own role is really lacking. Being "struck" by intense emotions was very cliched and surface level here, and saying they want to provide this care makes me ask "why not be a PT?"
I would have made all those mistakes if I didn't see this. Thank you for the advice!!!!
As an older non-trad, with several research experiences, 10 years as a nursing assistant, etc. how should I approach the activities section? Condense each similar experience under one heading w/randomly chosen Job name/position/location? Multiple for each?
Hi I'm a nurse I've had a similar problem. What I have decided to do is highlight a different quality a job/or position brought brought out of me. Example: leadership- shift supervisor, pediatric nurse- compassion ect. If I lumped all my nursing stuff into one box I would be selling myself short.
Think about each of your jobs and if you are able to think of a situation that can demonstrate one of your great qualities (teamwork, communication, dedication ect.) Then write that job as a separate activity.
Good luck :)
You’re amazing! You have helped me so much.
Hi Dr. Gray, could you make a video of your advice to the international students who will apply to US medical schools?
Great video, Dr. Gray! I think a lot of the mindset behind the "sales pitchy" wording is because we want to make sure our point comes across clearly to the adcoms. I guess it just makes me nervous at times that like "what if they don't see how I grew from this experience without me telling them". Do you think it's a good rule of thumb to assume they will be able to extrapolate all this?
Also does the idea of not selling yourself apply to all parts of the app or only for this section?
So basically tell a story for everything?
How would you go about writing descriptions for TMDSAS since the storytelling method won't work due to the character limit?
my exact question
Lol my question as well
Has anyone found a response to this question? I would love to see an example.
Thanks so much for this video!
DO A TMDSAS APPLICATION
PLEASE
This is a very helpful video!
But As a Canadian premed, I have always been told to do these things such as say how you have filled the CanMeds roles and show how you are going to be a good physician using your activities. Now I’m confused
Are you applying to Canadian Med schools? I have seen more lessons learned and what you gained type language in those for sure
@@WriteYourAcceptance I’m applying to both Canadian and US med schools
@@1227mimosa tricky because you want to appease both. I would still side with the more descriptive language or personal take then lesson. But also my Canadian students tend to have less clinical exposure so you work with what you have too. I would stray from resume heavy language that anyone can say anotó doing that experience. Good luck!
@@WriteYourAcceptance thank you so much for the advice!
@@1227mimosa good luck!
Hey Dr. Gray, could you make a video about if we should send applications earlier without our MCAT score or to wait for mcat score and then send?
this is a more personal discretion type of thing. there are pros and cons to both options. it depends on if you have a previous score, if you are happy with that score, if you think there's a chance you might have to re-apply, and etc. i will say that a very common thing pre-meds do if they don't have a score in right away is to choose one school that is way out of their league or that they'd never attend just so their application is verified, and once their mcat score comes in, then they can choose if they'd like to apply to their schools or not. the benefit of this is that you won't be seen as a re-applicant if you do not send them your primary in the first place.
So basically throughout all of these activity descriptions no where ever do you need to state what you do in a job persae because it is always obvious and wastes space?
Med school admissions committee arent idiots. This is not the same as a resume or applying to a low entry level job.
in some examples they did briefly state what they did but the most important part is having an experience to talk about. If you volunteered at a hospital or worked at a hospital and had real clinical experience and not just desk work, include a time where a patient that you deeply remember the most and how it impacted you or how you impacted the patient.
excellent thank you Dr Gray
Please be a game-changer and address how applicants can highlight their military service
YES, YES, and YES!!! It is mind blowing how LITTLE information exists online so veterans can do this effectively.
Thank you for your insight! How would we quantify the number of hours for a long-held hobby (like 10+ years)?
how are we suppose to do any of this in 300 characters ughhh TMDSAS
10/10 video! thanks
Dr. Gray,
The AACOMAS description of a "Healthcare experience" says
"...work in a health or health-related field where you are not directly responsible for a patient's care, but may still have patient interaction"
and their description of "Non-healthcare employment" is "Paid work done outside of the health care field or a research lab; for example, a retail or restaurant job."
This leaves me a little confused as to where I would classify Research or Research work experience? What about research that isn't involved in healthcare at all --such as physics research?
Any suggestion, or if you have made a video about this already, would be helpful. Thank you
In the activities should you use as many stories as possible (if applicable of course)? How does one not go overboard with stories... will too many stories be corny?
I'm wondering the same thing. I am a non-traditional student with at least 12 jobs between high school and applying. Should I tell a story for each one?
Same question as well
When will your book on the med school application come out!?!?!
Don't know yet. It's with the editor now.
Thank you for the extremely helpful content!
Well timed video indeed
Ok so med school admission is based on how you sell yourself not the thing you actually did. Like telling a good story as a server worth more than working as a nurse but the story ain’t told as compelling? How does that filter the best physicians? Physicians aren’t storytellers
No one applying for medical school is the best physician, so it's not meant to filter for that. The application process is to explain who you are. Schools are filtering to determine if you match their values, are a good candidate for that specific class, and can complete the exhausting process of schooling.
thank you so much!
Hi Dr. Gray,
I have a question on how better to write about about your meaningful activities (extra characters explaining why) vs. when you mention these same significant experiences in your personal statement... How can I write them differently although they highlight a similar impact? Should I present them in a different light?
Can you list/bullet point poster presentations and publications, or should you tell a story about it?
I don’t think this is fully accurate. No one wants to read 15 stories one after the other, makes for an even worse attempt at a sales pitch except in this case you don’t even get to know what the applicant did. Think this is slightly too heavy on show not tell, it should be balanced
Super helpful!
Is it just me/my headphones or theres something a bit unsettling about the audio?
Could you discuss how to approach writing about volunteering during covid19 in the med school app.
Hi there! Now some school requires Casper test for students. Do you know any ideas how do well
On casper test?
Haha this is amazing... Kinda savage Dr. Gray, but 100% helpful! Thank you 🤩
Would you recommend this same style when doing apps for medical RESIDENCIES as well?
Quick question: how would a volunteering in a alternative medicine clinic look on application? We do have to do some vital signs work and close patient contact
That’s awesome. I would definitely capture an ex of that. Are you applying this cycle?
I am a non-trad and need to know how far back can my activities date back? I have current one's but I really like some of my older one's.
I took a class in undergrad that involved shadowing the professor who was a physician. Outside of shadowing we discussed complex cases and how we each thought it could be approached. Although this was a class can I still use it as an activity?
Hi! I want to make one of my shadowing experiences my most meaningful. I know that is not traditional or even recommended, but I feel like it genuinely made me feel more excited and interested in becoming a doctor. It was a week long, and I got to shadow multiple different medical professionals. It definitely impacted me. Do you think I can do this without wasting my time, or do you think even if it is my most meaningful I should still pick something else?
Thank you for this incredibly helpful video, Dr. Gray! I have a question that I hope you'll be able to help with.
I'm a non-traditional applicant that has spent the past 2.5+ years working in a small, family-owned ophthalmology clinic. The staff is very small and although I was initially hired on as a scribe I ended up taking on a lot of additional roles and "wore a lot of hats" in the clinic and was ultimately appointed the clinical supervisor.
My question is this: Can I/should I create separate entries for each role I filled within the office? I understand that it was a single experience at a single facility, but I had 5 different job titles at once (clinical supervisor, scribe/assistant, technician, Eylea specialist, and medical supply manager) and my concern is that I won't be able to adequately convey the impact of each role in a single work/activities entry due to the character limit.
He has said in previous videos that when you have multiple positions from one "title", you can break it up into multiple activities so that you have the space to describe the other experiences. Just break up the hours accordingly because you obviously can't state the same amount of hours for all the different activities. Hope this helps!
Hey! Thanks for the video. I have a question around min 21:45. When the student says she was offered a job, doesn't that show that she was likely trustworthy and diligent without her explicitly saying it?
Thank you for sharing these helpful tips. I am struggling with writing about my experiences working with patients (since I am fearful of violating HIPAA). Do you have any content that addresses this topic, as it specifically pertains to the AMCAS application? According to HIPAA, information can't be identifiable. However, this can be subjective, hence my dilemma.
how should we address activities that were cut short by COVID-19?
Hello. Do you think being a medical translator over the phone (language line) would be considered clinical experience?
How many stories should we include in our activity statements?
Hey Dr. Gray, great video and very helpful. I had a question regarding your view on shadowing being a most meaningful experience. When I shadowed at the ICU it was the first time I witnessed someone pass in front of me, and this had a huge effect on my view of the world and my decision to commit to the medical field. Would you still recommend not listing it as an MME or do you think rare cases such as this are applicable?
Well OMSAS (Ontario) is 150 char :(
All the more reason to make it count!
Same thoughts here. They also don't ask for a description, they ask for "responsibilities" which makes a lot of the tips found on youtube hard to apply there. Hopefully Dr. Gray can do a video about this (though I imagine there are far fewer OSMAS than AMCAS students on here)
Work experience: 7:32
Tutoring: 11:45
Hobby: 14:28
Research: 15:16
Research Assistant: 18:02
Work: 20:28
Research2: 22:28
Shadowing: 26:45
Dr. Gray I currently have a fourth year aspiring med school undergrad shadowing me right now for medical school and he had a question I don’t exactly have an answer for. I attended a semester school that ended in may so my transcripts were ready to send out with my application the very first date AMCAS opened, he however ends in the second week of June because he’s on a quarter system. So this is likely that he won’t receive his transcripts until 2 weeks after near the end of June to send in to amcas right away, and his question was how would that impact his application time slot and interview chances if he didn’t submit the first two weeks of applications opening. I feel like that’s a terrible situation for him to be in but I don’t know how to advise him properly
AMCAS is delaying medical school transmission for 2 weeks. So instead of sending apps on june 26, they will now be transmitted to med school july 10.
Shayma embaby ah thank you, I’ll let him know so he can have a peace of mind. I can only hope my younger brother can fare the same next year because right now he is in the same situation but will be a junior rising senior by 2021 for the 2022 cycle
What do we do as TMDSAS applicants?
Hi! I put three clinically unrelated activities for my most meaningful activities. (Research, study abroad/internship, and teaching). How will adcoms view this? Should I remove one and put a clinical activity instead?
Put what is most meaningful to you!
How would these insights/advice translate for Canadian Medical School Applicants, where we only have 150 characters?
What if shadowing for me was a long-term and impactful experience? Would it be acceptable to put it down as a meaningful experience then? I shadowed a physician for years and worked closely w him on procedures and w patients
Did the book come out yet?
thank you:)